it actually makes me so sad
#outlaw
quaint wharf
heavy shadow
What’s cto
quaint wharf
because the more i think about this ability the more i wish it was good, but its so fucking awful
rotund zodiac
What’s cto
Count the odds
heavy shadow
Ah ye
Are we not always using KS max combo points? Does it work to use it in less in some situations?
vivid vessel
yes
I use low cp ks when
- too risky to high cp ks
- I need a fast one like on last boss flood during beams phase
- I would lose ADR by the time I build to max then ks, so sometimes you can just 1 cp ks into vanish (or coup vanish), stuffs like that
- I need to vanish quick but ks is ready, like for add phases and shit, for example on bandit I often will force it on the bomb adds, like it would be too long to build to max then ks then build again then vanish, so I just low cp ks then I can go do my vanish window
heavy shadow
So I guess downside is less damage but really playing trickster you’re just pushing for unseen blade proc
I saw in the faq it mentions being aware of when this will proc, I’m not doing this, so assume another weakaura here
lofty pike
!log
cedar kernel
Have a nice day others
vivid vessel
Bac!
fading hatch
Very new to rogue, sorry for basic silly questions. What exactly does slice and dice do? Does it reduce gcd like AR does or is it just melee speed?
trail star
Very new to rogue, sorry for basic silly questions. What exactly does slice and ...
Just melee speed
rustic lotus
Bro I have a friend who’s like “Yo let’s fill vaults” but he only chooses brewery and I’m like “man that dungeon sucks for outlaw…”
And he just replies “I know. >:)” it really be your own ppl man
reef forge
I use low cp ks when
- too risky to high cp ks
- I need a fast one like on last...
Does doing a low CP KS spread the debuff to other mobs?
vivid vessel
not sure how the spreading works exacly
i think its just mobs hit by ks bf
cause it seems capped from what i noticed
debuff doesnt matter tho it doesnt do anything
reef forge
So is there a chance it goes on mobs that you aren't even flurrying in big packs?
I thought it made them take additional damage
Maybe I just made that up to make myself feel better
vivid vessel
I thought it made them take additional damage
no cuase its bugged
another one to the long list you know
gaunt phoenix
its bugged they don't take increased dmg from flurry
reef forge
Expect nothing less, good job
gaunt phoenix
So fazed only matters for target swapping
vivid vessel
Which is kinda mind blowing when you realize they made ks spread the debuff in AOE, while ks is a st only ability
All of this to not work at all
wary wind
I love how the bug of ours they do fix is a beneficial one
vivid vessel
:)
reef forge
So how much damage would we gain from that bug being fixed? I feel like it's a lot
white mantle
I was wondering btw, how the hell do you killing spree on mythic sprocket
reef forge
You dont
vivid vessel
So how much damage would we gain from that bug being fixed? I feel like it's a l...
+5% on bf basically
white mantle
Figured
vivid vessel
!fuu
ornate heathBOT
Rogue Spreadsheet - Light Version / Dark Version
wary wind
Play fatebound
wary wind
It’s cool that a hero talent tree can’t be played on bosses without wiping the raid 😃😃
white mantle
They should make us immune on killing spree
vivid vessel
how do you read this
white mantle
or visual only
torpid fiber
i'd assume it goes from 50 -> 62.5%
vivid vessel
@white mantle you answer
torpid fiber
ah fuck i was too fast sorry
white mantle
what
vivid vessel
how do you read this
^
white mantle
I cannot read
vivid vessel
If bf cleave at 50%, what would you assume it would cleave at after This talent
vivid vessel
i'd assume it goes from 50 -> 62.5%
are you only saying this because you know tho
vivid vessel
its not obvious to me its multiplicative instead of aditional
vivid vessel
Ok nvm this guy is just cooked
torpid fiber
idle game experience
vivid vessel
this one reads the same tho no?
torpid fiber
yeah idk i think it's just a vibes thing
vivid vessel
ye its mult
torpid fiber
makes sense
vivid vessel
I just always wondered if it was actually intentional or not
torpid fiber
i think the other thing that procced it was that 25% felt like too much to be add
vivid vessel
Both ones that are additional does say additional
torpid fiber
i guess yeah
idk i was operating off of pure vibes
vibes are like using an llm except they don't need me to go to chatgpt.com
vivid vessel
how do you read this
reads the same as htis one
torpid fiber
yeah i'm not defending blizzard here lmao
vivid vessel
Ye so I'm just wondering
If it's intended honestly lol
Or if they just rolled with it
Cause I don't think mult is good for clarity
You could have achieved the same tuning with additional
And it would be clearer
silk stirrup
Hey guys, is Eye good for M+ in your experience? Or it drops super fast out of combat if tank is not chain pulling like a madman
gaunt phoenix
It should be good outside of like workshop theater
Also don't die
i would rather just use magnet and geargrinder tho
silk stirrup
i would rather just use magnet and geargrinder tho
Even in AoE?
Thought they were mostly ST
I have myth pacemaker so that one is locked in for me
gaunt phoenix
Thought they were mostly ST
ST is good in keys
And they both have fine aoe scaling
M pacemaker is also good ye
silk stirrup
All right. I usually follow the sims but I heard not to trust them when it comes to eye
So asking here just in case
gaunt phoenix
yeah the eye is ramping so like 6 minute slice is too short
I think it's good but up to you if it's worth the effort/risk
leaden folio
quick reminder all of this still true
jolly geyser
wicked acorn
!wa
ornate heathBOT
Class packs:
Guy's - Afenar's Edit 
Luxthos Edit
Zac's Group 
Devlin
Utilities:
Combo Point Standalone
Last GCD in Crackshot window / Subterfuge timer
Ace refund sound trigger
RtB buffs tracker (shows normal, CTO, and KIR'd buffs)
Unseen Blade tracker
Fun:
Ace max combo counter and Ace current combo counter
KS Ticking damage taken
zealous plinth
I use low cp ks when
- too risky to high cp ks
- I need a fast one like on last...
You‘d rather low cp KS then hold Till after mechanic?
hollow temple
You‘d rather low cp KS then hold Till after mechanic?
Ye
zealous plinth
Let‘s say mechanic is lasting for only 2sec
old gull
quick reminder all of this still true
😦
vivid vessel
Let‘s say mechanic is lasting for only 2sec
Any finisher you do is wasted cdr so idk
Depends how much you are losing
Usually I try to not use finishers with ks ready ye
Id I can I will send a low cp ks
zealous plinth
Any finisher you do is wasted cdr so idk
Mhm true
brisk meadow
Who is JPC? Isn't he kinda irrelevant here i mean his Name stands for "Just playing Caster", no?
🪤
hollow temple
zealous plinth
Would you hold vanish Till After ks even if you would lose like 2 cleave targets within that time?
Those Are some situations where I’m unsure if I wait for KSCd or just send vanish ^^
hollow temple
Would you hold vanish Till After ks even if you would lose like 2 cleave targets...
As long as you won’t drop ADR I think it’s irrelevant
You want to KS on CD as much as possible
desert tendon
muh dude jpc tagging billgates
brisk meadow
Bill Gates-> Microsoft -> Blizzard -> WoW
Clearly the right Person to @
desert tendon
it was a trend at the moment to @ him
he received a looooooot of @ by delete aug requests
mighty pivot
what if bill gates got ganked by a rogue and that's why he personally makes sure BF remains capped and KS miserable
wintry solar
got priory trinket 
rotund haven
Returning to outlaw (best spec in the game) after trying some other stuff out in TWW…personally a KiR fan but without 4pc will I be able to run that build or am I better playing HO until I get set?
hasty warren
did they buff loot in raid ?
last night HM reclear we got hoc + 2 miniature wheel + kezan
jolly geyser
luck
vivid vessel
waht you passing on ?
untold yarrow
W shammy
vivid vessel
14 top
leaden folio
zac have you done any new content ?
leaden folio
there is some simbait to try
vivid vessel
zac have you done any new content ?
we got new content ?
desert tendon
new content?
in my wow?
i cant trust
it s a low ilvl one
and the effect looks bad
leaden folio
y sure but
desert tendon
unless it procs like every single auto maybe ?
Maybe a good dark brew sub offhand?
glass mortar
whats the actual name of the trinket
glass mortar
Maybe a good dark brew sub offhand?
why does this matter, these talent stuff dont impact damage procs from items
untold yarrow
whats the actual name of the trinket
bro imagine playing wow in your language
but you join discord and speak english
???
desert tendon
why does this matter, these talent stuff dont impact damage procs from items
sometimes it does
glass mortar
no its fine i was just gunna look it up on wowhead for them to see
glass mortar
sometimes it does
only by accident
desert tendon
like lingering from assa on the stix trinket
glass mortar
and 99% of the time it dont
vivid vessel
whats the actual name of the trinket
thats a dagger noob
late swallow
there is some simbait to try
Score de crit 
untold yarrow
Dagu
desert tendon
stop mocking french
glass mortar
thats a dagger noob
ok whats it called
desert tendon
remember
leaden folio
Dague d'arpente-ombre noctechute 🍷
glass mortar
in english if u can
late swallow
you guys are noobs!!!!!
desert tendon
this channel is 99% of frenchs
vivid vessel
ok whats it called
Dague d'arpente-ombre noctechute 🍷
leaden folio
french channel
late swallow
parisians are cringe though
glass mortar
???? i said gl
desert tendon
idk
late swallow
zac just wants to pic a fight that he'll surrender immediately
desert tendon
it s not even in wowhead
late swallow
classic french
leaden folio
I equip my Dague d'arpente-ombre noctechute as my Main gauche and it didnt proc, so its not 100% per hit so I feelcraft its garbage
glass mortar
hmm
is the effect budgeted
i need to find a 636 dagger
it should be 100% proc rate tho idk why it wouldnt be proccin
other then that offhand attacks can miss (idk if u factored that in)
glass mortar
well it could be including the damage in the "melee" section of ur details i have no idea how details is gunna treat this
look at ur spell log...
LAME INVISIBLE
french names more accurate for all our hero talents frfr
both our trees are lame invisible
desert tendon
unseen blades
pearl trout
Lame invisible...
glass mortar
nah fatebound is also lame invisible
desert tendon
what
glass mortar
glass mortar
tried on a rare, dont see anything on details
check ur combat log not details
glass mortar
see if u see a damage hit while autoing
i mean we have cantrips this season and this dagger caps at what, 658? so like, i doubt its anything
maybe strong for alts
leaden folio
if its the same as drogbar rock or pirate trinket
you know
i like these shit ilvl that broken
off_hand=,id=237781,bonus_id=11970/11215/6652/1488/10255
but i am zogzog, cant find any information of it on details/log actually
probably not working like everything of this patch
frank finch
where u drop that dagger
leaden folio
in a chest from a daily quest related to the new patch
glass mortar
itd on the vendor of catchup gear it looks like as well
so its probably just the new world gear
heavy shadow
When you look at your details on warcraft logs, what are you actually looking at? is it your parse vs all rogues, or spec specific? or even does it count your hero class too?
glass mortar
i think most of the effects of the current stuff are meant to only work in the open world so wouldnt surprise me if this is just broken
its spec specific parse
leaden folio
where u drop that dagger
heavy shadow
So inclusive of different hero class choice
glass mortar
yes
heavy shadow
cool ty
so then how can I see the top parses I'm being compared to? If I want to check them
glass mortar
go to wcl, go to the boss, change the from all classes to outlaw rogue
under rankings
u can see it compared to ur class as well but the parse % u see is spec based
heavy shadow
yes but is it then possible to see a ranking of who is number 1 2 3 etc and check them out
glass mortar
what do u mean
glass mortar
the people at the top of the list are the people with the top rankings
oh did u just mean in general for all fights over the whole raid?
heavy shadow
Ah I see now, I was looking at it from a person pov
Got to go via the raid in general, found it now, thaaanks
I've just managed 2600ish rating pretty casually doing 1 or 2 a week, but I think 3k is just hard mode going as outlaw
heavy shadow
Am I right in thinking sin is just the easiest spec to play?
frank finch
beta is over time for the real .5 patch
latent oak
sin lowest skill floor prolly
heavy shadow
outlaw I am finding requires high skill level and pretty nuanced decisions to make, quickly... and doing it badly means poor dps
glass mortar
yea
outlaws mostly about quick reactions and choices, especially with making killing spree work in higher keys
that choice being "will kspree kill me right now or do i need to delay it and give up dps"
heavy shadow
and even if you are perfect, ultimately you are losing the battle vs sin anyway if someone with equal skill played that spec
heavy shadow
yeah ir makes me sweat
glass mortar
sin is quite abit stronger
glass mortar
its not super relevant at the level of keys u need to do to hit 3k but u may get easier invites as well
glass mortar
idk dont most of the new patch item effects directly state they only work in the open world?
i assumed they would but who knows wtf is intended
heavy shadow
can outlaw really compete if you're doing the 13s/14s needed for 3k though? I can't see it
frank finch
yea just needs some testing
glass mortar
sure of course it can, every dps does enough damage to do 13s/14s
frank finch
outlaw is very good for that key range
glass mortar
you wont necessarily do as much dps as the strongest specs, especially if ur pulling around them
but u shouldnt get left super behind until ur doing very high range keys
heavy shadow
so when you pull a pack and see a shaman doing 17m dmg, compared to your 4m, it's normal
glass mortar
well outlaw shouldnt be doing 4m dps on a pack that someone is doing 17m on
if ur on 8 targets u should be doing 6m-11m dps depending on ur procs and rolls generally
but also ilvl is a factor
and i dont say 11m casually, thats close to the maximum ceiling of what outlaw can do with perfect rng and rolls
im just giving the damage range i see
u wont see it often
heavy shadow
I'm 667 I think so yes, I could be competing with some M geared peeps
glass mortar
or maybe they realized the game was broken in ways they needed more then hotfixes to fix idk
im sure wowhead will have some info eventually
frank finch
more likely yea
leaden folio
got a trinket from same source
heavy shadow
Is it possible to see the detailed log of a run so you can see where I might be going wrong? in m+ that is
glass mortar
u can log them, m+ is a bit of a nightmare to log review tho
heavy shadow
I'm not logging myself mind
glass mortar
i mean u can, its pretty easy to do
its possible other people have uploaded logs iwth u in them, u can check on wcl
heavy shadow
Are the m+ parses just based on time then? not dps itself
glass mortar
most people do not log m+ tho
if u click into the parse there is another parse based on dps
the default one it shows u is based on io gained tho
you will find most m+ "logs" you see dont have any actual log data they are just logs of your time value
not many people bother logging m+
leaden folio
a trinket that you can change for what you want to do : trinket1=,id=237495,bonus_id=11970/11215/6652/1488/10255/12220
heavy shadow
ah okay, so not that then 😛 I am wondering why my dmg vs 8+ is not really 6m+ though
glass mortar
well thats with like perfect play ive certainly had 4-5m periods when i was making mistakes with meh rng
heavy shadow
one thing I did consider is if my plates and positioning means I am not actually hitting them all
glass mortar
yea making sure ur cleaving everything is pretty important
what build are you playing
heavy shadow
HO trickster
glass mortar
pretty standard then. how well mechanics let u kspree on cd will be another factor
how often u drop AR and whatnot
!commonerrors
ornate heathBOT
Common errors for Outlaw -> see this answer in the FAQ.
glass mortar
honestly its hard to ever find just one thing to improve on as outlaw
heavy shadow
It's just spinning plates and getting it right with practice I guess
I have bad habits like over using pistol shot
wintry solar
Mine is using vanish when the last mob is at like 3% health
I'm just gonna let adr run out. It'll usually be back in like 12 seconds anyway.
heavy shadow
I also think I have a tendency to hug the tank (like behind him) rather than being behind the mobs facing him, so I am missing cleave on stuff at the back
wintry solar
honestly its hard to ever find just one thing to improve on as outlaw
Does details track adr uptime throughout the whole key or just in combat?
heavy shadow
Just because it's safer there usually 😛
glass mortar
the whole key
wintry solar
Interesting
heavy shadow
So those dungeons with RP or flights, bees, etc, all detracts from it
glass mortar
actually wait hold that thought i misread
i thot u asked about logs
i have no idea for details
i just assume its the whole key but it could just be combat times
the dps u see is only for combat times so itd make sense of the AR uptime also was
wintry solar
That's what I'm thinking
viral bison
how toactualy deal dmg with outlaw
i kms
but cant reach 3m overall
667 ilvl
its tottaly skill issue
heavy shadow
did you try faceroll
subtle sequoia
My highest so far was in a 7 priory lol, 4.6m
I think I’m gonna try going back to KIR this week for keys
viral bison
did you try faceroll
what is it 😄
viral bison
If you break 3 mil in a top that's pretty good
im always 3rd dps
no matter what i do
im alwaays bottom
viral bison
My highest so far was in a 7 priory lol, 4.6m
priory 2.6
i dont even know what im doing wrong
my AR up time is always 75%
at least in most dungeons
and im pretty sure its not RNG
subtle sequoia
AR should be closer to 100 than 75 I think?
What build are you doing and what haste are you
hybrid crown
Sounds like an activity problem like not hitting a button every .8 seconds
fallen knot
maybe wrong spending prio and low apm
hybrid crown
You could log a key and post it here
desert tendon
!commonmistakes
ornate heathBOT
Common errors for Outlaw -> see this answer in the FAQ.
subtle sequoia
One thing I wasn’t doing early on with the HO build was pressing RTB enough, you really gotta press it every time it’s up if you have 4 or less buffs, it’s a lot of cp generation
desert tendon
can be other things, but 75% means a lot of mistakes are done, so your first look should be in there
viral bison
AR should be closer to 100 than 75 I think?
HO SC
late swallow
!raremistakes
viral bison
Sounds like an activity problem like not hitting a button every .8 seconds
can it be ping problem??
fallen knot
maybe spellqueue problem aswell
viral bison
maybe spellqueue problem aswell
what is it?
fallen knot
if you dont know how to play with spellqueue
fallen knot
censi help me here i know what it is but i have no idea how to explain it properly
viral bison
fallen knot
it's basically a window based on ping where your clicks of spells are stored and "queued up" so you dont have to actually click buttons every .8secs and you dont lose globals
if you really mash the keyboard though you should set it low
viral bison
it's basically a window based on ping where your clicks of spells are stored and...
OHHHH
fallen knot
baseline is 400
fallen knot
but for example for me it feels like i'm lagging when pressing buttons, so i set it 50+ping
no
glass mortar
spellqueue is for everyone
glass mortar
u can try changing it, some people complain 400 makes their game feel laggy
never put it under ~100 above ur ping and as long as u spam ur buttons fast ur probably fine
viral bison
u can try changing it, some people complain 400 makes their game feel laggy
how do i change it?
subtle sequoia
21%
31 while invis
Killing spree is also VERY high value button to press and and not pressing it enough could result in a lot lower dps
glass mortar
u can either google search to find the macro command to do it, or download the advancedinterfaceoptions addon
which lets u change it within the addon
desert tendon
censi help me here i know what it is but i have no idea how to explain it proper...
the best answer u can have is
fallen knot
never put it under ~100 above ur ping and as long as u spam ur buttons fast ur p...
i legit have it as 50+ping
viral bison
Killing spree is also VERY high value button to press and and not pressing it en...
its on Cd when im not subt
desert tendon
if you dont know what spellqueue is, dont bother with it it doesnt impact u
fallen knot
otherwise i feel like i'm lagging
desert tendon
fallen knot
30
glass mortar
if u have it within 50 of ur ping ur probably just not queuing spells alot
fallen knot
but i play enha
glass mortar
and having micro gaps
which can be less bad then having the wrong button go off so
80ms is a very very small window to hit a button in
fallen knot
and i mash buttons
glass mortar
unless ur spamming ur keys 10+ times every gcd
viral bison
idk what ur ping is tho
120
glass mortar
u likely arent hitting it always
fallen knot
yes
viral bison
120 / 130
viral bison
i'm just used to not having that lag feeling
i have the lag feeling too
fallen knot
buttons
viral bison
as you mention it
glass mortar
i wouldnt put it under 200 personally but change it to that and try it
subtle sequoia
its on Cd when im not subt
How I generally play the rotation is, stealth window, ks, stealth window, ks, mixing in coup procs when available. If you aren’t dropping AR and don’t have big downtime, you should be owning
viral bison
i was always thinking its my ping
fallen knot
well for me 120 is giga high
glass mortar
@viral bison
viral bison
i wouldnt put it under 200 personally but change it to that and try it
i will try
nothing under 200
gotcha
glass mortar
the thing most people dont realize is anytime they feel like their spellqueue made a bad button go off
the game would not have launched the correct button
on the gcd, if their spellqueue was lower
🤷
ive personally always felt its a bit of a placebo but some people swear by it
glass mortar
well what other lag feeling could u hav e
if buttons arent going off on the gcd then spellqueue isnt being used at all
fallen knot
i've always been used to low ping
i mean
i know it's a nice tool to use
if used properly
i just cant use it for the life of me
viral bison
search for spellqueue command on google
got the addon -> put on 300 -> +1mil dps on dummy
idk
maybe better rng
or its really working
fallen knot
do a key
glass mortar
wouldnt trust dummy stuff there is zero chance it made that much of a difference
just go play the game yea
fallen knot
and log it
glass mortar
ur dps variance on a short dummy test could easily be over 1m dps
just from natural variance of the spec
fallen knot
whatever key level you're doing
viral bison
or low
viral bison
whatever key level you're doing
imma try 10
im trying to make all of them 11 so im basicly a 10
fallen knot
ok
do a 10
low is how much can you pad better than the others
high is how comfortable are you with your spec
so do whatever feels comfortable enough to focus on your rotation
potent latch
i played with 200 (20ms ping) for years and recently changed it to 400, which felt impossible to react to procs so i changed it back to 200
glass mortar
doesnt really make sense imo but its possible spellqueue is just broken and not working properly which is why lower feels good for people
potent latch
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LmogdGgp2Po
this guy describes it really well, especially when playing with low global cooldowns (at 4 mins or so)
leaden folio
these only work in harathi right?
i think it work everywhere, there is also https://www.wowhead.com/item=225693/shadowed-essence and an another trinket at vendor ; If i remember correctly, shadowed essence was broken et and better that hight ilvl trinket ; do you have some sim ?
glass mortar
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LmogdGgp2Po
this guy describes it really well, e...
i dont think this video is accurate but im finding a very mixed bag of info on spellqueue
my understanding of it was you can always replace a spell in your spellqueue window and it takes the most recent spell that was placed in it when the gcd ends
google is giving me both sides and i see no official blue post responses about it even decades ago tho
cinder relic
Spell queue is a lag compensation system. Just go change the number and test if you like how it feels on a training dummy
That's all there is to it
glass mortar
well this video is saying you need to set it lower if you are a spammy class because once a spell is queued into spellqueue, it cannot be replaced
that is not my understanding of how it works
glass mortar
that would be a very very dumb way to implement a spellqueue
cinder relic
That's all there is to it
wintry solar
That's all there is to it
Does details track adr uptime only in combat or throughout the whole dungeon?
frank finch
i think it work everywhere, there is also https://www.wowhead.com/item=225693/sh...
i do
weapons seem good if u dont have anything
aka realy good for alts
fallen knot
You just test it on a dummy and see if u like it
i mean it's mostly about how used to spellqueue are you isnt it
glass mortar
a little bit but some values are simply too low
cinder relic
No?
glass mortar
i dont think people realize how small a window 60 ms is
cinder relic
It's just what feels good
fallen knot
yes i mean that
glass mortar
if u have ur spellqueue window under 60 ur honestly probably not even queuing spells 90% of the time
glass mortar
i stand by what i said, if spellqueue makes u feel like ur lagging then either how theyve implemented spellqueue is broken, or your button wouldnt have gone off correctly anyway
but i wont act like i havent set mine back to the old default (250) across all my toons so
🤷
fallen knot
yes
mighty pivot
yes unless they broke something, all spell queue does is allow you to press a button earlier and have it still go off immediately when your GCD/cast is over. That doesn't make things "laggy" unless you meant to change your input too late (after your GCD) and with a lower spell queue you wouldn't have casted at all
glass mortar
^ thats what i meant
glass mortar
the question is why does it feel laggy for some people
vivid vessel
Spell queue is weird
glass mortar
like if the system worked as they describe it theres no way it should ever be able to feel laggy
vivid vessel
I can tell you when I try 400 or more it feels laggy
And I don't necessarily have gaps In my gcds rn
glass mortar
i think 400 is the upper ceiling on it so if u set it higher i dont think it changes anything?
vivid vessel
So how is that possible
glass mortar
i read that somewhere anyway
vivid vessel
i think 400 is the upper ceiling on it so if u set it higher i dont think it cha...
No idea
I think 400 is default
glass mortar
it is yes
old default was 250 before they took the setting out of the main settings
cinder relic
I just play default and it feels fine
mighty pivot
either 400 or 250 should work fine with low ping assuming you're mashing the button a bit
I assume they chose 400 to accustom everyone's ping and some people might play with 200+
fallen knot
no
frank finch
another hour maintance
glass mortar
people have always changed spellqueue
fallen knot
i remember having this conversation in shadowlands
glass mortar
it used to be an actual setting in the game settings
fallen knot
or early dragonflight
glass mortar
before they hid it
slate plaza
Default is fine
vivid vessel
Was really as they say
glass mortar
ye i mean i learned to change it for the same reasonas others (being told it made things feel laggy) back when i played legion shadow priest
slate plaza
It feels fine
vivid vessel
Why can you even customize it
Right ?
Like there is no reason to have a lower spell queue
glass mortar
well u "Cant" anymore
they left it customizable but took away the ease of customization
vivid vessel
If anything you should have a 1000ms spell queue
slate plaza
^^^
vivid vessel
they left it customizable but took away the ease of customization
Ye but you still can
Idk there is something about spell queue
glass mortar
it does feel like theres some factor to it they have not explained
vivid vessel
It's not what they tell you guys
Don't listen to the propaganda
The medias are hiding something
Looking into it
glass mortar
yea ok bozo
maybe i change it back to 400 and try out some keys tonight
see if i can even notice a difference
i should not be able to
its been 250 for like 10 years for me so
i will say this i guess, for a spec like outlaw its possible that occasionaly delaying a gcd by 20-30ms is better then misfiring a bad gcd
so maybe thats where the "latency" feeling comes into play for bozos like zac
occasionally ur too slow on a gcd, with spellqueue u woulda misfired but without it u just delay and send the proper spell
its not like ur ever gunna "feel" that u delayed ur gcd by 20ms, nobody can feel that period of time
vivid vessel
nah not talking about feeling it
i checkd my logs back in df to make sure i wasnt trolling
cause i play with 150
and i couldnt really find delays
glass mortar
ok but whats ur ping
vivid vessel
Idk 20 or something
fallen knot
no it's really
vivid vessel
France ping
glass mortar
what i learned in legion (probably fake news propaganda) was as long as u had it set to ur ping +100
fallen knot
fucked for me
fallen knot
i just tried 200
fallen knot
threw a eb and it did not go off
and stormstrike went off
i'll stick to my 50+ping
glass mortar
then u didnt replace the stormstrike fast enough meaning the EB wouldnt have gone off on the gcd anyway
fallen knot
that is usually 85 so i dont have to think about this
glass mortar
at least with the way spellqueue is supposed to work
but like i said, maybe its a case that for some specs you'd rather have that micro gcd gap and send the right spell off
glass mortar
ye
glass mortar
That sounds like the biggest fake news ever weran
like everything about spellqueue window and surrounding it is this tho
glass mortar
if u google it u will find 5000 posts of "guides" saying this same thingy
fallen knot
you have
glass mortar
that u cant replace a spell in ur spellqueue window
wintry solar
I dropped adr in my last key and the tank asked why I was auto attacking
glass mortar
and thats so easily provably fake news
set it to 400 and go and spam dispatch for half ur gcd then hit bte
fallen knot
windfury proc and maelstrom goes giga up
glass mortar
nobody knows how this thing works 100% probably
only blizzard
and it was coded 15 years ago so
who knows if they even know how it works anymore
wintry solar
I wouldn't mind a content drought if it meant they rebuilt the game
Hypothetically speaking
glass mortar
maybe make it so the game uses more then 1 core of ur CPU at a time while they are at it
who knows
wintry solar
Just an idea
glass mortar
idk if the mmorpg market has the support for a full rebuild of the game tho
would probably be pricy
someone better ask... the shareholders 😎
glass mortar
xd
fallen knot
but why would i care
glass mortar
i dont know if u would i assumed this setting since its hidden and not relevant to 99% of playerbase is being used by blizzard to gather metrics on how much addons are effecting the performance of their game
what they want that metric for who knows
fallen knot
but i dont want you to track my addons
glass mortar
well unfortunatly thats a case of
tough luck, its their game not urs
u just rent access to it
fps taxed
glass mortar
thats every raid brother
mighty pivot
they didn't think of that
fiery timber
First week they lagged because of Pala Wings
But i have also a very good pc usually raid with 100+ fps
glass mortar
theres so much jank in this game on the backend
theyve said they are taking steps to make performance better behind the scenes which is why s1 had so much jank
until i see actual results idk how much i believe them tho
its often silly things like in castle nathria, paladins devo auros refreshing itself on every unholy dk AoD pet every 0.1s
causing major performance issues
fiery timber
But when we're at Bandit my pc freezes complety like 5 fps.Abd its only this Boss
Cant Even do a good parse there because of this shit
vivid vessel
its often silly things like in castle nathria, paladins devo auros refreshing it...
its always something tho ..
glass mortar
yes
i agree, i think the game is probably suffering greatly from still using the same engine and needs a full rebuild, i think that process is way more expensive and involved then any of us bozos wishing for it think tho
polar niche
!wa
ornate heathBOT
Class packs:
- Guy's - Afenar's Edit Luxthos Edit
- Zac's Group Devlin
Utilities: - Combo Point Standalone
- Last GCD in Crackshot window / Subterfuge timer
- Ace refund sound trigger
- RtB buffs tracker (shows normal, CTO, and KIR'd buffs)
- Unseen Blade tracker
Fun: - Ace max combo counter and Ace current combo counter
- KS Ticking damage taken
hybrid crown
Playing the oblivion remaster has reminded me that a ryzen 5800x3d/rtx 3080 is still a beast of a PC and wow just runs like crap
olive flax
Playing the oblivion remaster has reminded me that a ryzen 5800x3d/rtx 3080 is s...
truth tbh.
I play more and more games as we get closer to season end and its always so jarring
but it is a 20 year old game so
still matrix
When do you think we get next class tuning .5 patch?
olive flax
who knows, we didn't even get a real .5 patch for the .5 patch that just came out
golden citrus
Hey guys, i have 2 questions
Do we need a cap hast for the spec HO/supercharger ? for mono or multi ?
And, is the sim raidbot for dungeon slice is good ?
glass mortar
sim and dslice is good
if u have this seasons 4set bonus then ho supercharger is good
if u dont then u cant play that till u do
we have a minimum haste threshold depending on ur build (kir vs ho)
!haste
ornate heathBOT
Total stat volume will look like Vers > Haste* > Crit > Mastery.
*But Haste has a **requirement ** because 
Adrenaline Rush lowers your GCD based on it, down to 0.8s at 25% haste.
The 
KIR build wants 18-20% haste from rating, because its only haste buff is from 
Alacrity.
The 
HO build meets this requirement with 8-10% haste from rating because of 
Take 'em by Surprise, but the new HO + Supercharger build continues to like Haste just because of energy, so you will have to sim. Your sim may settle for KIR-levels of haste (~18%) or slightly lower.
You need to use 
Raidbots Top Gear to determine what haste pieces to use.
You can also get ~4.2% haste from a flask. This can be equal or better than Vers flask if you need it for either build.
glass mortar
the HO supercharger builds also want a little extra haste on top of this
generally in the 15-20% area (total), so basically as much as kir builds
but u can just trust sims for that
golden citrus
So sim raidbot from dungeon slice give us a good info ?
I have 12% (7800 hast) actually, but i see a lot rog even in HO having like 12-13k hast, and less crit than me (when crit sim always more than hast, and having 10600 crit).
Is maybe for something ? confort i guess ?
glass mortar
well idk itll depend on what build u are simming and what gear u have available
the hard minimums for both builds are ~9% for HO and ~19% for kir (the exact value in the command). like I said for supercharger HO builds, haste has value past 9% but not the super insane value it has before it, so better ilvl lower haste items can win
also if u sim no ghostly builds they are happy to drop more haste
but yea dslice is fine
stable kindle
is cyrce's circlet good for outlaw?
covert kestrel
is cyrce's circlet good for outlaw?
loses to high vers rings eventually
hybrid crown
17 for me put haste right below crit and vers in value
golden citrus
also if u sim no ghostly builds they are happy to drop more haste
Oh yeah maybe, actually, i play the HO/supercharger without ghotly, will try to sim with it
hybrid crown
On stat weight sims
fading hatch
!mastery
vivid vessel
Bad
fading hatch
Thanks
desert tendon
!zac
vivid vessel
Bad
desert tendon
Thanks
covert kestrel
Can we pin this @gaunt phoenix
fallen knot
why are fotm class easy and fun
ocean lodge
Unholy be fun
fallen knot
it is indeed
hasty warren
Yo pirates
vivid vessel
why are fotm class easy and fun
Most people have fun when they do damage
latent oak
i've been fucking around with totemic enhance
and that spec goes kinda hard
hot hand is sorta like ace procs/subt window
glass mortar
also every spec in the game is easy if ur good at outlaw
so its just confirmation bias
💅
vivid vessel
You know
I still can't believe they removed double coup bug
And now we just here
Doing half dk damage
And that's fine
glass mortar
banger last minute rushed in before devs logoff for the weekend friday night change
vivid vessel
Very hard to understand
vivid vessel
Usually a Ilvl is around 1%
glass mortar
all ilvl isnt created equal but yea roughly 5-10 ilvl
vivid vessel
Well maybe more actually idk
glass mortar
ilvl doesnt scale linearly obviously
latent oak
for outlaw prolly less xd
glass mortar
since different slots have different value
vivid vessel
But ye
glass mortar
nah the worst specs in the game still gain more then 1% per ilvl generally
glass mortar
the high scaling specs just trend towards 2%
i think the highest i seent was like 1.8% dps per ilvl for devoker and shadow priest in df
going into s3 or something
might have been s4
slate plaza
After double Cdg bug was fixed I honestly went to sin for m+
normal aurora
Hey guys, i'm new here and just trying to get better at outlaw. Something i've been having a hard time understanding, is the dynamic between refreshing AR, Vanish, KS and Coupe.
Here is a scenario -
AR is off cooldown with 7 seconds left. I have 1.25 Vanish CDs. I just used KS and Coupe a couple globals prior.
By my understanding, i'd want to farm CDR with the 7 seconds of AR so i can get closer to that 2nd vanish CD, then pop AR into vanish window. Netting longer AR uptime.
Does that sound right? I'm having a hard time finding an in dept explanation for all the different conditions outlaw finds themselves in for when to pop what.
slate plaza
Don’t overthink it
Your prio is adr>ks>coup>vanish
But vanish is reliant on adr that’s it
If you have adr up and one vanish charge send the vanish
Don’t wait till u get one back
Also how do u have 1.25 vanish cd’s
normal aurora
2 charges of vanish, 1 charge and 25% of the 2nd
glass mortar
in the situation u just mentioned ud vanish immediatly
trickster does not have any conditions to hold vanish aside from AR not being up/kspree being ready in under 20s/coup being ready
if you just kspreed into a coup, and vanish is available, you vanish
after building to ready a bte of course
normal aurora
my thought on holding it was that AR was off CD. So the vanish window would do nothing to get you closer to another AR.. would i want to refresh AR then vanish?
slate plaza
my thought on holding it was that AR was off CD. So the vanish window would do n...
You use ar
glass mortar
so you would KS > coup > AR to full cp > vanish > start crackshotting
glass mortar
u only delay AR if you know a mechanic will happen shortly that would make the AR wasted (it falls off) or something like that
otherwise you AR on cd to build combo points if you are at 1/2 cp
normal aurora
aaaah okay. That's what i was wondering. To use AR off CD like that or to hold it to net longer AR uptime
slate plaza
You also never want to vanish without ar active
glass mortar
well you are supposed to have 95-100% ar uptime casting it on cd
delaying it should only increase uptime if you are delaying it purposefully for a phase mechanic/downtime
like rik reverb intermission or something
gaunt phoenix
the CPs from casting AR does net you more uptime than holding it
you would only delay for some raid mechs ye
proven ocean
today eat cheeseburger double 今天吃双层芝士汉堡 want experience america dish cuisine 想体验美国菜美食 @vivid vessel
glass mortar
i dont believe there is any actual apl conditions to ever delay ar other then being at low cp to not waste its CP gen, any delaying you do to AR is for mechanics ingame that would force u to drop it
craggy quiver
Lmao
vivid vessel
wintry solar
Good stuff
normal aurora
Thanks for the info. i'll have to incorporate this 🙂
Earlier it was mentioned KS>Coupe.. i thought it was the other way around? Also, do y'all use KS on low AP when there is only a small window of safety to use it?
slate plaza
Thanks for the info. i'll have to incorporate this 🙂
Earlier it was mentioned K...
Yes
It’s ks>coup because coup gives cdr to ks
inland acorn
You want to KS before coup, so you can use coup to get cdr for next KS
glass mortar
And if you would need to waste unseen blades building with ss or ambush after that kspree, you can coup at 1/2 cp to avoid wasting any
inland acorn
Question, in scenario of going into pack (in stealth obvs), with coup + 2UB stacks up, is it better to send coup as 1st cd in subterfuge window ?
Or do we ignore coup + UB stacks, in favor of just doing normal BtE stuff
vivid vessel
It won't even be buffed cause you don't have fazed on your target
inland acorn
Thanks 
normal aurora
And if you would need to waste unseen blades building with ss or ambush after th...
So you're saying to just send a Coupe if you got it after a KS so as to not waste unseen blades?
covert kestrel
So you're saying to just send a Coupe if you got it after a KS so as to not wast...
you should anyway based on priority
glass mortar
if its already ready yea
the only time you dont is if PS is ready so u can build with PS
or in the case of kir, you have BF ready and can build with it in aoe etc
unfortunatly unlike many other hero talents, any unseen blades u send with coup ready are wasted and dont build towards a new coup
so not wasting them even if ur sending a 1 cp coup is still ok
not sure why coup cant just store up to 8 blades/2 charges of coup. would feel way better
kspree 2 charges also
twilit nest
HAHAAHAHAHHA
normal aurora
Man.. this is all very insightfull lol. I'm just started to get to the point that i can think about unseen blades a bit more and understand how Trickster is supposed to play. Ya'll are great
wintry solar
I knew it
glass mortar
turbo boost?
glass mortar
do they like. have a vendor or limiting resource or
civic void
Probably base ilvl +6 no ?
glass mortar
they r just giving crafted items +6 item levels
vivid vessel
like do you just have to craft every slot kekw
vivid vessel
the cartel
glass mortar
THE CARTEL ALWAYS WINS
frank finch
wait a min
wintry solar
when can i play the game
About 2 weeks before season 3
frank finch
isnt that longer then renown 23?
vivid vessel
nvm thats all items @glass mortar
civic void
Ah but myth track will go to 684
frank finch
didnt they remove it from renown cuz it was going to take to long
and now it takes longer?????????
blizzzzzzzzzzz
helllooooooo
vivid vessel
1 month and 1 week from now you can buy your first item
why even put it in the game ???
they are always so cringe with this shit man
frank finch
oh they doing this because they extending current mythic track to 8
or am i reading this wrong
vivid vessel
yes
they realized they forgot to release mid patch content
so they just were like
dawn talon
like do you just have to craft every slot kekw
no
vivid vessel
alright guys
dawn talon
myth items go up to 8 upgrades
vivid vessel
you get +2 upgrade level
covert kestrel
wow summer break still in effect, thank you blizz for making it ez and not tempting us with actual mythic upgrades
Is S3 in Sept? and next xpac in like Feb/Mar next year?
glass mortar
......
the delve improvements are just xp and resource buffs
wheres my higher ilvl blozzard
vivid vessel
the 4th june you can get your first dinar item 
glass mortar
my brann has been 80 for a month now
glass mortar
ive been capped on valorstones and every crest for a month
vivid vessel
thats like when s3 release
can we stop being cringe
why is valorstone still a currency btw
glass mortar
give me delve trinkets at 678 ilvl COWARDS
surreal flower
684 ilvl gotta be the real news in that post
glass mortar
to punish u for playing alts
getting gear on alts is too quick
they need a way to gatekeep u
surreal flower
This raid is gonna be a huge joke on farm
keen belfry
What the fuck am I reading
surreal flower
Who ready for their sub 5 min mugzee kill 💀
glass mortar
wait this seasons CE is going to be
so free
it was already free but another 6 ilvl across the board
covert kestrel
the 4th june you can get your first dinar item <:peeposmile:1187917262280216729>
wowhead saying may 27?
wintry solar
By that time I'll be done with the season
glass mortar
hopefully we've killed it by then
frank finch
oooooooooo
vivid vessel
who tellign the truth you or wowhead
i was one week off whatever
frank finch
u have to kill the bossssssssssssssssss
vivid vessel
still in s3 basically
glass mortar
yes u need to kill the boss on the difficulty to get the item
this was how dinars were in shadowlands no?
df were kinda wild
vivid vessel
I Mean thats obvious imo?
glass mortar
im not surprised
carmine ferry
u have to kill the bossssssssssssssssss
A harsh blow for Heroic Players
vivid vessel
or ?
surreal flower
this was how dinars were in shadowlands no?
Nah
frank finch
i dont tremember
glass mortar
they definitly were
u needed the upgrade currency from the difficulty u wanted to upgrade it to
ok maybe not to kill the specific boss tho or hmm
carmine ferry
In Shadowlands you could just buy Myth track item with Dinars, without doing Mythic
surreal flower
Oh for the upgrade ya
glass mortar
i dont fully remember
frank finch
for alot of ppl this way is worsew then b4
surreal flower
But you could just do first 4 or whatever
glass mortar
yea ig it is a bit worse
if u want a mythic mugzee offhand u need to kill him
in the old system u could just buy it then upgrade to myth by clearing first 4 mythic like a month in a row
and using the upgrade currency
frank finch
yea
surreal flower
Gonna make bank selling mythic carry’s for the whales who want mythic dinar items
shut lichen
now the real question is if this is accountbounded?
frank finch
surely
covert kestrel
Gonna make bank selling mythic carry’s for the whales who want mythic dinar item...
i have a 2 for 1 coupon for a burger can i get mythic 8/8 carry wimdy pls
shut lichen
i mean the real hype is making crafted gear better and 8/8 myth track
surreal flower
We have a carry next week but idk how much it costs
surreal flower
i have a 2 for 1 coupon for a burger can i get mythic 8/8 carry wimdy pls
40m for 8/8 with mount 
golden citrus
!wa
ornate heathBOT
Class packs:
- Guy's - Afenar's Edit Luxthos Edit
- Zac's Group Devlin
Utilities: - Combo Point Standalone
- Last GCD in Crackshot window / Subterfuge timer
- Ace refund sound trigger
- RtB buffs tracker (shows normal, CTO, and KIR'd buffs)
- Unseen Blade tracker
Fun: - Ace max combo counter and Ace current combo counter
- KS Ticking damage taken
covert kestrel
40m for 8/8 with mount <:KEKW:618803152904519691>
$160, chump change
my borger coupon is totally worth that
trail star
1 month for dinars lol
frank finch
dont worry guys we didnt forget !!!!
vivid vessel
its nice that they uncap the crests after they uncap the upgrades
so you willl have 0 crests
frank finch
1 month and u have to kill the boss on that diffuclity
vivid vessel
and have to farm 50 dungeons in one day
just to get the ilvl missing
and then its over again
why even
trail star
Are crests warband too?
glass mortar
wow zac way to complain about getting everything u asked for smh
frank finch
yes
glass mortar
vivid vessel
actually
glass mortar
classic outlaw player
frank finch
true
vivid vessel
i can finally dump the 700 weathered crests
been doing that lately since we raid day 1
shut lichen
$160, chump change
40m is $160???
glass mortar
well dont do it anymore
trail star
So crests are warband but valorstones arent or both are
vivid vessel
ye
shut lichen
that math doesn't sound right
trail star
Can we get dinars for m+ items so i dont have to raid
glass mortar
shut lichen
40m / 250k (current NA price)
yeah but wow token is 20 bucks right?
bright crane
I have to kill the boss on M?
bright crane
wtf