outlaw

[proven ocean]

i hope whoever uses it gets perma banned

what is it called btw

[desert tendon]

idk apparently noggie tweeted about it

gotta find it

[proven ocean]

has to be this or?

oh

even konaz got silenced lmao

well

the replies are actually full of people who got banned

because of this abuse system

[eager radish]

Thats insane

[desert tendon]

dude

konaz

maddie

snowmixy

like

[proven ocean]

noogggiee

and sjele i heard too

[desert tendon]

yea pretty crazy

[proven ocean]

many top players

got silenced

for 7 days

some for longer

(depending if u got silenced before or not)

asmongold talked about it in the past

many times

when he used to play wow that is

now that theres an addon for it

its legit gg

[desert tendon]

yea but i dont think asmongold was because of an addon

[proven ocean]

no

[desert tendon]

there were jsut many dickhead paying a wow sub just to spam report him lmao

[proven ocean]

he explained the system

[desert tendon]

i remember this story

[proven ocean]

that its dogshit

nah

he made a 40 man raid

[desert tendon]

people using this kind of stuff

[proven ocean]

and he let everyone report him

just to show

[desert tendon]

deserve to be perma insta

[proven ocean]

how fked up it is

[desert tendon]

yea mass report is always fucked up

[proven ocean]

ye

perma ban

forever

get those fuckers out of wow

cba

[desert tendon]

it works well for it s purpose if a real human then work on the report case

like u mass report someone showing his dick somehow in game yea u mass report and he s gettting banned or w/e, then someone needs to actually investigate the case

mass report isnt bad, but mass reporting people just because they re famous is bad

you know what i mean

[astral glen]

It used to be the case, then Blizzard closed most of their customer support / game master centers across the world because "AI will make it better". 🥲

[proven ocean]

i wont support any kind of mass reports

no matter the case

even if u send a dick

or an asshole

idc*

[desert tendon]

i mean

if i see 40 bots griefing like idk

darkfuse farm

yea mass report is fine and does its job well

if i see a streamer getting mass report just because it s a streamer, that sucks real hard

[honest sparrow]

the problem isnt the mass report itself its that mass reports in wow lead to a punishment without someone actually looking into it

[desert tendon]

that s the issue indeed

mass report is fine, but gotta investigate the case later

in league they kinda good at it, many pro / streamer get banned from mass report, they open a ticket and after 2h they already unbanned

[latent oak]

na if u require mass reports to action an account the system is already cooked

[proven ocean]

i wouldn't mass report any person

even if i hated them alot

[honest sparrow]

Mass reporting without a reason should led to no punishment at all. But sadly thats not the case in most games i know

[proven ocean]

thats just a fucked up way of ruining someone's game

for 7 days

[proven ocean]

we knew blizzard's been fucked up for the past few years

theres barely anything u can do

they just have 90% of their team be an AI bot replying to tickets

so u always have to re open tickets

to get ur issue resolved

[honest sparrow]

Their ticket system is really cooked for sure

[sullen narwhal]

Im doing pretty bad damage on outlaw

[desert tendon]

i mean you shouldnt be able to mass report yourself first of all

[sullen narwhal]

At least worse than i do on other specs

[desert tendon]

mass report means lot of people encounter the dude behaviour being bad

[sullen narwhal]

Aoe is pretty dogshit

Capped at 8 but i legit do significantly less damage at 8 than other soft capped or uncapped specs

Generally i can at least match it, or deal slightly more at the target cap, like fury warr, but not outlaw

[desert tendon]

and yea that s an issue, last time i had to open a ticket i had to send 1 > ai reply > send 2 > ai replied > send 3 > get a real person who doesnt care > send 4 to actually get someone to work on my issue

like i had to force all that way

[honest sparrow]

No and also it should have a "rating" on your acc if you abuse report funktion unneccessary. In some games if you falsly report to often your reports have less value then others which in my opinion is a good thing and should be in all games

[desert tendon]

rememebr that was the spark issue in DF that many people encountered

[desert tendon]

actually in league u can get ban easily for report abusing

i used to report everyone in my games just "in case" on an account few years ago

after like 10 games i got 14 days banned for that reason

and i opened a ticket and they litteraly told me to fuck off

[covert kestrel]

just in case of what lmao

[desert tendon]

in case ya know

[honest sparrow]

Thats pretty damn good tbh and should be like that

[desert tendon]

scripting was a big thing and since i was one of the few master yi known in "high elo" people liked to grief me

[covert kestrel]

they cant report you if you report them first

[desert tendon]

i know sinerias and cowsep got the issue a lot also, gladly i wasnt a big streamer so i didnt really get the same hate as them

[honest sparrow]

Also in wow isnt silancing a way bigger punishment then a mute in different games? Im pretty sure you cannt open lfgs or even join a lfg if your silanced

[fluid meadow]

yea, and imagine how good is the griefer report in wow rn, u can't report players out of range with that reason

just hs and gg

[desert tendon]

top17, outlaw really good in low target cleave

[long barn]

Running HO with ghost?

[honest sparrow]

We are not even good at our target cap why should we be good at less

[desert tendon]

idk ask unfortunate

that s not me

i retired from outlaw

looks like no kir in bars

[rotund zodiac]

at least we timed xd

[gaunt phoenix]

hm

[desert tendon]

Flush bullying other outlaw in NA wtf wtf

toxic behaviour

mass reporting you rn

[rotund zodiac]

I only want to play with outlaw bros

[desert tendon]

triple outlaw keys was my favorite thing in df, i can feel you

[rotund zodiac]

other one is up if u guys wanna join me

[bright crane]

Doing the lords work

[covert kestrel]

do this after work hours

[vivid vessel]

i like outlaw

good spec

[median herald]

How can I do more st raid boss dmg

[covert kestrel]

play better

[median herald]

[covert kestrel]

[desert tendon]

try blade rush in brew

new tech

dwdw

[vivid vessel]

okko

ty

[desert tendon]

ywyw

what was it already?

br start winning at 30 targets or something?

[vivid vessel]

20 i think ?

i sent the sims last time

[desert tendon]

20

[vivid vessel]

nv

m

[desert tendon]

also 20 must be the softcap of br

[vivid vessel]

30 targets then

[desert tendon]

since everything is softcapped at 20

[vivid vessel]

oh wow

thats true

[gaunt phoenix]

true

[vivid vessel]

is that not in sims ?

cause isnt it an actual hard cap soft cap after 20

[desert tendon]

but also

[vivid vessel]

like legit no gains

[desert tendon]

let s count how many 20 targets pull you do in high keys currently?

with 20 targets that matters obviously

hmmm

0

[gaunt phoenix]

i assume it is in sims, but the main gauche thing still works

[vivid vessel]

ah true

[frail veldt]

ye

like the spell will technically hit 21 targets

but it will do the same total damage as if it hit 20

thats my understanding

[glass mortar]

the mass aoe scaling of BR was always its mastery interaction anyway

[halcyon elm]

no warrior no monk buffs

plays outlaw

[glass mortar]

its direct damage is dapoop

[halcyon elm]

[frail veldt]

so youre saying

BR mastery build

[glass mortar]

maybe it would be less then 10% behind sure

xd

as long as ur pulling 30 targets

TRUUU zac imagine trying to play outlaw and not building a custom raid buff group around the fact that ur 99.99% physical damage

smh my head

[olive flax]

please don't bring this into reality. I can't retool for a third stat on outlaw

[glass mortar]

its not

even remotely close to a reality

[olive flax]

[vivid vessel]

mb cuh, forgot i need to build a comp around the worse spec in the game to be able to play the worse spec in the game

[runic bough]

New mastery affix for outlaw rogue secondary stat. Trickster hero tree has been reworked to not include aoe/bladeflurry damage talents. Gsw is no longtler a selected talent and now a passive

Mastery now gives a xx% of damage back to blade flurry and increases the number of targets beyond 8. Additionally, increase the amount of Main Gauche and GSW Damage by xx%.

[vivid vessel]

ryuk is a master at cooking boring shit

takes talent fr

[runic bough]

Omg

Go bed zac

[vivid vessel]

guys what if

gsw was baseline

banger banger

[frail veldt]

what if mastery increased our odds of rolling 2/5 buff

[vivid vessel]

guys what if

[olive flax]

Im voting for Ryu for rogue dev

[runic bough]

Yeah see that was my idea

[vivid vessel]

main gauche did 50% more damage

guys guys

listen

what if

[runic bough]

Gsw passive

[vivid vessel]

ps did 10% more damage

no but guyssss

[covert kestrel]

https://tenor.com/view/fire-writing-gif-24533171

[vivid vessel]

you arent listening guys

[frail veldt]

what if our mastery increased SS proc chance

[desert tendon]

zac

[runic bough]

[desert tendon]

imagine if instead of bte

crackshot reset ks

u go here and spam ks for 12s

[covert kestrel]

what if every point of mastery was a new bullet in PS

[olive flax]

imagine if we could store KS combo points for a 30 second spree

[glass mortar]

what if, and hear me out

[runic bough]

Why not just be a whirlwind ability from diablo

[glass mortar]

this is gunna be a bit out there

what if mastery... did damage

what if it wasnt super undertuned

by like 60%

[frail veldt]

New mastery: Blunderbussy

[glass mortar]

!!

[runic bough]

Now were talkin

[olive flax]

cant wait to hit em with that big ole B bussy

[glass mortar]

what if blizzard just went "mastery scaling buffed by 160%" and suddenly it wasnt a worthless stat

wow fixing mastery so hard

[runic bough]

We have have shit mastery for how long now guys

[olive flax]

just scrap outlaw and copy paste fury warrior with outlaw flavor ez pz

[glass mortar]

they want it to be shit

[honest sparrow]

what if blizzard nerfs our gcd again and makes mastery scale it back down?

[glass mortar]

at some point we gotta assume they want us to stack vers forever

[desert tendon]

and now

you have haste and mastery tax

the goal is to make stats good

not taxes

[dense bolt]

https://imgur.com/JwoE3m2 found an old screenshot when we played BR

[runic bough]

The goal is to stop letting blizzard tune outlaw. We need to revolution!

[vivid vessel]

thius guy was blasting no cap

[dense bolt]

45%

btw

mastery

[vivid vessel]

full bis

[glass mortar]

stop letting blizzard tune outlaw... so u wanna never get buffed?

[olive flax]

need a full redesign.

Outlaw ---> scoundrel

[glass mortar]

just gunna fall behind over the rest of the expac

[vivid vessel]

good old times bro

i remember

[dense bolt]

wait

no haste cap

[desert tendon]

wdym 1%

zac

[vivid vessel]

only haste was on dagger i think

[desert tendon]

uy dont remember the -4% in df

we had

[vivid vessel]

ye i do

banger

[covert kestrel]

yeah nick had a wee bit

[late swallow]

Nicker of time was sick

[runic bough]

Blizzard now gives tuning authority to outlaw rogue to a private third party

Problem fixed, we need to be this third party.

[glass mortar]

LMAO

yea ok

[frail veldt]

this is dumb

lol

[runic bough]

[covert kestrel]

its not dumb you're just playing checkers while Ryu is playing 4d chess. Expand your mind

[vivid vessel]

https://tenor.com/view/cat-meow-silly-cat-cat-explode-yellow-cat-gif-12654556298327310612

[runic bough]

[covert kestrel]

[runic bough]

Imagine that classes were actually tuned by the best of each class.

Instead of devs that don't play the game.

[late swallow]

https://tenor.com/view/edict-edictguild-gif-25900451

[desert tendon]

somnius stp

stop

i havent give u right

[runic bough]

Ohhh more censi gifs plz

She cutie pie

[glass mortar]

wait wtf is that censi irl?

censi u never told me u were

too poor to buy ur own vantus runes

[frail veldt]

that would probably be worse for you

[desert tendon]

i never paid a vantus

bro

[runic bough]

Girls in wow get free shit that's why

[desert tendon]

i dont even know how much it would cost

[runic bough]

Okay I go for walk now.

Ttyl

Cooking on hold.

[late swallow]

Based outdoors appreciator

[runic bough]

More cooking later

[olive flax]

bro touches grass and blesses us with genious level introscpective class design

[covert kestrel]

Ryukage strolling away from #outlaw after blessing us with an e=mc^2 level cook

[glass mortar]

i just hope ryu realizes u guys r all yaslighting him and being sarcastic

sometimes i wonder

[vivid vessel]

im not

[covert kestrel]

yaaaaslighting

[olive flax]

I genuinely enjoy the the takes, need more creativity and less dooming

[glass mortar]

ok his takes all come from a place of dooming tho

guy just stated unironically we need to riot for the removal of blizzards ability to tune outlaw so we ourselves can tune outlaw

is that creative and non dooming

[potent gyro]

Bro stop hating on ryu the chef

[olive flax]

yea it aint that serious

its all fun and games

[glass mortar]

sure u guys dont take it seriously

idk if he does tho

[covert kestrel]

"Those who make peaceful revolution imposible will make violent revolution inevitable"

-Ryukage 2025

[glass mortar]

hes in here an awful lot angry at blizzard

[desert tendon]

that s just

the most cooked ever thing

i ve ever heard

let us tune outlaw

i ve never heard

something so burnt

[timber knoll]

Outlaw buffs when

[olive flax]

I mean, letting the players decide on something has totally never gone wrong, right?

[glass mortar]

truly the most adjusted least biased group of individuals to possibly tune a spec

the playerbase of that spec

[cinder relic]

Can you stop coming to the channel to do this shit

Just because you are a regular, doesn't give you a pass

[mighty pivot]

what if they gave KS a chance to instantly kill a target and the chance went up with mastery, but you were also an eligible target for the instakill

[cinder relic]

You've been coming here for like. 2 weeks straight just here to just shit stir about how terrible the spec is and how the Devs are morons

Enough

Ty

[left forge]

trying outlaw, how cooked am i with those stats coming from sub? (dont have other rings lying around for haste)

[glass mortar]

uh

pretty cooked

that haste is pretty painful

[olive flax]

yea need giga haste for sure

[surreal flower]

Those MG hits gonna be nukes

[left forge]

up to 520k crits

[astral wind]

Play sub for a week more and do a heroic guild alt clear and some m+ and you'll have fine gear with recrafts

[vivid vessel]

https://youtube.com/clip/Ugkxp6lx_0jZ9fTxjj11HEuyDWwUVk2Hpx4W?si=rBA7YRMv__QMeVCa HAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHA @glass mortar @fathom bramble

can this spec be more shit

challenge

impossible

(im pulling with killing spree)

[left forge]

im at 670, but no haste gear laying around or in item recovery

[astral wind]

Yeah a week of m+ will sort that

[cinder relic]

Spend a craft on rings imo

Ring craft is p good in general

[astral wind]

Yeah ring or neck

[covert kestrel]

lmao outlaw prepull nerf

[astral wind]

Is such a good pivot point for rogue

[cinder relic]

Esp if u don't have a ring made already

[vivid vessel]

I mean doesnt change anything

just funny

[covert kestrel]

hey that means were not forgotten

[late swallow]

the hate on ryukage is really fucked up

he dooms a little here and there, but he's got a sincere passion for the art of outlaw (artlaw)

[covert kestrel]

lets get on our knees and thank blizz the only way all of us know how

[late swallow]

he's the heart and soul of this channel

don't extinguish his light

[pearl trout]

https://tenor.com/view/huh-cat-huh-m4rtin-huh-huh-meme-what-cat-gif-27377993

[cinder relic]

I can compile all the shit he stirs if u want

[sacred rune]

no more pre pull shananigans, wonder if you still want 2 supercharger points

[cinder relic]

It's too much

[late swallow]

don't worry I have all the pastas saved

[covert kestrel]

i mean most of it is just buncha nerds getting angry at silly takes, idk if that goes on ryu

[red zinc]

Nah its not true thats why they posted it

[fierce sinew]

Late April fools obv

[sour jay]

wtf

[fathom bramble]

What a weird thing to change

[vivid vessel]

pre pull shenanigans > pressing adr 1 sec before pull

im glad our current opener is to adr after

[fathom bramble]

If they want to go the direction of no prepulling stuff then all this needs to also have the cd reset

[silver mica]

agreed

[sacred rune]

rtb pre pull too?

[glass mortar]

ok but does any spec in the game prepull cds

[cinder relic]

Yes?

[late swallow]

i mean, we were ADRing after pull as FB

[cinder relic]

Go read the article

[silver mica]

esp after decades of prepull shit being main stream

[cinder relic]

Multiple specs would do it

[vivid vessel]

rtb 1 sec before pull ye gg unlucky

[gilded karma]

pope dead

pre pull removes

it's so over man

[sacred rune]

rtb seems like the only change thats potentially annoying

[vivid vessel]

doesnt impact me because im exploiting

im glad

[quiet swallow]

Wasant this already like this since NP?

[sacred rune]

exploiting?

[vivid vessel]

no

[glass mortar]

all i see is multiple specs could accidently do it if they arent careful

[vivid vessel]

just cps are gone

[glass mortar]

because they use cds as their first or second gcd

not prepull

but ig et why thats annoying

why even fix this if no class is using its cds before pull

like nobody is cheesing anything

what is the point

[vivid vessel]

me when i accidentally press adr before boss is pulled and i lose 200 million dps

[late swallow]

Supercharging prepull still in game though?

[quiet swallow]

wtf I’ve been wasting a global all this time

[vivid vessel]

stfu

[late swallow]

[sacred rune]

yes

i mean

what is supercharger? (just joking)

[fierce sinew]

Shhhhhhhhhhhh

[silver mica]

idk, seems like a really odd change

esp because no CD reset if you accidentally do it

[glass mortar]

yea

[silver mica]

so what if a destro lock prepulls with infernal?

does the infernal disappear?

[glass mortar]

to be clear im not defending it, this just seems like one of those changes exactly like the change to second boss of mechagon last weekend

[late swallow]

ADR should remain on CD perma if you prepress

punish exploiters!!!!

[glass mortar]

like ok ur list of people this effects is people who are trying to press their cd as the second or third gcd of the fight

they arent pulling the boss with cds active (on purpose)

[harsh forge]

blizzard removing AR on pull but you still have to press killing spree

[glass mortar]

who tf are these changes for?

just making the game worse for everyone

[vivid vessel]

[desert tendon]

delete prepulls stuff

[vivid vessel]

i bet there is a dev at blizz

[desert tendon]

means

[vivid vessel]

his job

is just to make the game worse

[desert tendon]

they ll tune according to no prepull

[vivid vessel]

he has a list he goes down

[desert tendon]

right guys?

[late swallow]

outlaw copers literally can't stop taking Ls

[desert tendon]

[vivid vessel]

every week he make a shit change

[late swallow]

Realz is still reeling from Clush's jorking accusation

[vivid vessel]

its all so that they can fix these changes a few tiers later

[late swallow]

we're feeling the after shocks

[craggy quiver]

I can't wait for 11.1.7 ptr

[vivid vessel]

he slowly add shit into the game

just for later fixes

[craggy quiver]

Best part of 11.1.5 launch

[vivid vessel]

based

so the game can continuisly get better

no cap no cap fr

on

god

[cinder relic]

This is like the biggest non change of all time

[covert kestrel]

https://tenor.com/view/table-hit-yakuza-hitting-table-walk-out-gif-15307369

realz when he got asked if he jorked it

[vivid vessel]

blizzard opp

I will not talk to you

[silver mica]

it is, but it's also a weird change overall

[vivid vessel]

[silver mica]

idk what problem this even solves

[late swallow]

Foreverguy putting his contrarian cap on

[vivid vessel]

[covert kestrel]

[glass mortar]

no hes right

like this wowhead post

readying thru it

this basically changes nothing... except for a few peoples openers

[cinder relic]

If we lived in a different reality where prepulling didn't exist, and then they did the exact opposite in this patch of enabling weird prepulling shit, you guys would also be upset

[vivid vessel]

"guys actually the box change in workshop was good because my tanks in 5s couldnt do it "

[glass mortar]

might get fucked by rng

[cinder relic]

This is literally a non change and you guys are just being upset

[glass mortar]

its a nonchange that makes the game slightly worse sometimes but u wont notice 99% of the time

[olive flax]

all I know is that first raid night is going to be a whole lot of openers of mine with no RTB or ADR lmao

[glass mortar]

why make the change tho

[cinder relic]

Like feel free to be upset but like

[sacred rune]

It adds failure potential

[cinder relic]

This is such a non change

[silver mica]

I guess my issue with it, is if you accidentally slam a CD early (which happens as a caster a lot of times), you just brick your CD for the opener

[desert tendon]

yea being upset cuz all the changes we got so far this season are non asked changes

and that s all they doing

[vivid vessel]

i will always be upset when they spend dev time to make the game worse

[glass mortar]

ya i said, makes the game slightly worse sometimes

[silver mica]

that's fine that it removes it, but at least reset the CD on pull lmao

[fathom bramble]

What does this change even fix

[desert tendon]

so yea, we upset

[fathom bramble]

It can only be negative

[glass mortar]

🙂

i felt the same way about mechagon boss 2 change

its ok new week no crashouts

[desert tendon]

yea exactly like that

[sharp sand]

Pull boss, RTB, AR.. proceed as normal

[glass mortar]

stand strong

[sharp sand]

You lose a few seconds

[glass mortar]

diamond hands holding for 11.1.7 kspree fix

[desert tendon]

noone asked for it, and if they ve done maths correctly, they would have reduced the boss hp by 30%, not 10

[glass mortar]

i just cant even fathom why, wowhead couldnt give 1 example of a spec abusing prepull cds

we are fixing nothing to make the game worse in some cases for players

[silver mica]

the prepull abuse shenanigans died in SL iirc

[late swallow]

i think they just wanted to reign outlaw in a bit

[vivid vessel]

y

[silver mica]

surely that was it

[late swallow]

it was over performing because of these prepull shenanigans

[vivid vessel]

outlaw was blasting in workshop

(worse rogue spec in workshop)

[glass mortar]

maybe its just future proofing w/e

[fluid meadow]

interesting changes, think they would do this in m+, but the info wasn't correct so it's implemented into raid

[vivid vessel]

can they future proof outlaw by softcapping it

[late swallow]

this would be legendary cope

setting foundation for upcoming rework

[vivid vessel]

its already like this in m+ tho

[glass mortar]

im a bit surprised how much prem+ shit they still allow thru ngl

[cinder relic]

Again if we lived in the reality of the game having no prepull stuff and they started adding it, people would also be saying "why are they adding things to the game to just make it worse it just adds a failure case of what if you miss the prepull stuff idk"

[silver mica]

they should've done this in shadowlands w/ deathly shadows prepull garbage

[tulip quarry]

This non change shows that they are doing some things in the end, i'm just sad they do not do something for KS

[glass mortar]

that failure state already exists tho

[silver mica]

kinda weird to wait 3 expacs to finally fix it instead of bandaid fixing it back then

[cinder relic]

They did in sepulchur

[glass mortar]

when ur boomkin pulls at 4s on the timer

[fathom bramble]

A half fix just aint it

[lusty sparrow]

Did this non change involve charged combo points

[glass mortar]

this is just them adding more that never existed

[gaunt phoenix]

I'm trying to find out

[late swallow]

inb4 there's a boss where KS is literally unplayable, and blizz turns the prepull knobs

[vivid vessel]

so

[silver mica]

kinda, they mostly bandaid fixed it in sepulcher

[vivid vessel]

is mm target capped

[covert kestrel]

thos lil yellow piss balls flying at the boss makes me so

[fathom bramble]

If they want a design where encounter start can’t be bypassed by using things early then everything needs to reset cd as well

[vivid vessel]

can someone answer me

[silver mica]

and I guess now they just finished the fix 3 expacs later lmao

[olive flax]

wonder if this change woukd reset ADR if pulled with it on fatebound

[cinder relic]

They have been curbing random prepull shit for years

[fathom bramble]

It’s also not future proofing it is just adding more things to an ancient mechanic

[glass mortar]

is that a legendary dark ranger mm hunter

[cinder relic]

This isn't a new development

[fathom bramble]

They can easily forget things at any time in the future

[glass mortar]

the answer zac, is no it is not

[hollow portal]

When I played Enhancement Shaman I realized that this dev deserves a promotion, how good this class feels, all different from the outlaw

[vivid vessel]

ye

i noticed

[cinder relic]

And again, in sepulcur we didn't do the deathly shadows swap on sub anymore because they made a change to it to not provide the damage buff when you swap legendaries

[vivid vessel]

when they were doing

30 mil dps

[glass mortar]

thats the less aoe build to

[vivid vessel]

on big pulls

and im not

[lusty sparrow]

have any of you tried survival hunter

that stuff is gas

[vivid vessel]

i wish i was off meta like mm is

they always complain about being non meta

[glass mortar]

i was a survival main last season brother

[vivid vessel]

but they always blast damage

[covert kestrel]

weran is surv hunter fan number 1 except he hates it now

[glass mortar]

and yea it was gas

[vivid vessel]

which i was mm no cap

[late swallow]

surv in season 1 was so fucking good bro

[glass mortar]

yea they killed it

[lusty sparrow]

🤝

[glass mortar]

took it out back behind the shed

[late swallow]

blizz overcooked the shit out of surv

[glass mortar]

shot it in the knees

[silver mica]

yea for sure, I kinda hope they end up patching it to reset the actual CDs on pull if they just wipe the buff

[late swallow]

pulled surv's pants down and did some uncle shit

[glass mortar]

the new PL stuff is less bad then sentinel but holy fuk

[late swallow]

no good man

[lusty sparrow]

I hit a fat 25million mongoose bite earlier that was cool

[fathom bramble]

The is isn’t really comparable to prepull stuff of the past. This is taking a resource you can easily get with no swapping or other abuse and just taking it away

[gilded karma]

I remember when they changed prepull pots in EN

people lost their minds

[stiff isle]

Mm is capped on a lot of stuff

[gilded karma]

[covert kestrel]

https://tenor.com/view/mongoose-snake-champion-fight-gif-3536739

[fluid meadow]

i mean not like otl prepull, but others "This does not seem to impact any pre-pull clever-use-of-game-mechanics for Mythic+, and seems to be Raid specific." just really don't know why they do that in raid and not m+?

[cinder relic]

Yeah prepot lol

[vivid vessel]

ye and you know what is more capped

[silver mica]

was that change in EN?

[covert kestrel]

furry warr

[stiff isle]

Fury?

[gilded karma]

yeah

[vivid vessel]

outlaw buddy

[gilded karma]

pretty sure it was

[late swallow]

fury cap is fake

[silver mica]

wasn't it in BFA?

[glass mortar]

every cap in the game is fake

[late swallow]

fury is softcapped on most of their important shit

[glass mortar]

WW is probably the closest to as capped as us honestly

[vivid vessel]

so im going to check fury

and ww

and im not going to see

softcapped abilities

right

cause max was complaining about ww being tartget capped

[stiff isle]

Is blade rush capped?

[glass mortar]

the only cap thats real in this game is us capping when zac says he wont doom anymore

[gaunt phoenix]

No

[vivid vessel]

[glass mortar]

blade rush is not capped

[vivid vessel]

this guy is back

[glass mortar]

shame it doesnt do any damage

can be dps neutral to press at 30 targets tho

big uncapped scaling

!

[stiff isle]

Well if ur gonna go find random uncapped abilities on capped specs im gonna find blade rush

[vivid vessel]

ye see

i knew

[gilded karma]

was definitely legion because I didn't play bfa

[stiff isle]

Cuz the real question u care about is

[vivid vessel]

he was going to be like that

i remember this guy

[stiff isle]

How does their overall scale

[glass mortar]

is an ability thats 20% of ur overall in an uncapped pull a random ability

[astral wind]

I had this argument in guild a while ago, other arguing that outlaw is hurt by target cap as much as any other class but they all have soft caps and damage drop off and we have hard caps smh

[stiff isle]

With targrt count

[late swallow]

you need your tank to pull around blade rush

[vivid vessel]

was stupid 5 months ago

still is

[glass mortar]

no i mean the point is fair

but zac is right

[silver mica]

you might be right, all of that was so long ago holy shit

[glass mortar]

all the "Capped" specs are fake af

u look at their breakdown in a dungeon

30-50% of it is uncapped shit

they r doing 20m dps on 15 target pulls

[regal saffron]

Dragons roar

[vivid vessel]

ah so this is soft capped i was lied to

ah i see

[mild vigil]

don't forget bladestorm

[late swallow]

"hardcapped" classes be like ^

[vivid vessel]

let me check ww

[astral wind]

Also softcapped on everything

[regal saffron]

Ww is dosoftcapped on everything

[late swallow]

i think a lot of people misunderstand hard vs soft cap

[lusty sparrow]

im softcapped whenever adrenaline rush falls off

hardcapped when its up

[late swallow]

i'm hardcapped when I watch palmbee

[vivid vessel]

im just gonna defend them in one thing

[covert kestrel]

ill show you a hardcap

fuck you beat me to it

[vivid vessel]

soft cap at 5 is mega shit

[fathom bramble]

It’s probably because they have never seen a hardcapped spec

[vivid vessel]

but

[covert kestrel]

goon king

[vivid vessel]

i will not lose my target capped status

to random soft capped specs

[late swallow]

wdym? because no one plays outlaw?

[regal saffron]

Only ol is fully capped

[olive flax]

real talk though - does this prepull thing change our opener at all? Or we just do the same thing after pull right?

[fathom bramble]

Because outlaw isn’t a spec on their class

[covert kestrel]

whats a palmbee

[fathom bramble]

People can barely be bothered to understand how BF even works

[warped peak]

If I want Ghostly Strike is dropping Count the Odds the best play for M+ (Trickster)? Seems like some non-KiR top rogues drop HO, some precise cuts, and some Count the Odds.

[cinder relic]

If supercharger still works u would still do supercharger stuff

[vivid vessel]

i would never do that

[cinder relic]

But otherwise doesn't really change anything. You just wait until pull to do the exact same opener

[late swallow]

you just press BF, and it does all your damage!!! look at details!!!

[vivid vessel]

nice try exploiting tho guy

imma report you rn actually

[olive flax]

bet thats what I was thinking thanks

[runic bough]

I told solo I was going to stop as well. I slipped again. My bad.

[late swallow]

reporting guy

[hidden bay]

hello guys hope yall had a nice Easter

[covert kestrel]

Ryukage for green name 2025

[late swallow]

acknowledges his mistakes
commits to doing better in the future
Yeah I'm thinking based

[vivid vessel]

Ryukage for green name 2025

[astral wind]

My Easter was egg capped at 5 eggs was dogshit

All my friends had softcapped Easters (diabetes)

[hearty flare]

Where’s the report guy nowadays

[glass mortar]

it makes our opener more annoying since the first gcd of many fights is RtB + AR

[late swallow]

!mute Foreverguy 69h for excessive contrarianism

[glass mortar]

and u need to make 100% sure u never cast it before boss "combat" now

but yes, it changes nothing really

just makes playing the game more annoying

we love these kinds of changes

[vivid vessel]

thats the noob opener

i do the correct one instead

dm for the best opener

[glass mortar]

no

[vivid vessel]

(blocking anyone that dm s me )

[late swallow]

bad outlaw changes are honestly fun because of all the fun yap in here

keep em coming blizz

[runic bough]

While playing dh I didn't really notice any bugs

Its just outlaw

I didnt notice any bugs playing druid also

[hearty flare]

But fun because blade dance doesn’t kill you

[runic bough]

Yeah blade dance was cool

[vivid vessel]

https://youtube.com/clip/UgkxoloMqDZUGzNUC_BGgh5HUL5anZMBpSuE?si=S-9-_CJ2wyGSLWCE @glass mortar thoughts ?

[loud hazel]

gAys

2 swords

or 1 sword & 1 dagger?

[craggy barn]

skill issue zac

[glass mortar]

whatever sims tell u to run

!oh

[ornate heath]

A dagger offhand is technically like 0.2% better than a slow weapon because it generates more Instant Poison procs. That is the only difference, Fatal Flourish proc rate is normalized to be unaffected by the change in attack speed. Note that item level or stats will matter more than this quirk, or you can simply use a slow weapon anyway for transmog.

[agile orchid]

https://www.wowhead.com/news/some-major-cooldown-buffs-removed-on-raid-boss-combat-start-in-patch-11-1-5-376436

[loud hazel]

[agile orchid]

They sure do have their priorities right

[vivid vessel]

ty for information

taking note of this

interesting

[covert kestrel]

thats just cause ur fat

[agile orchid]

Blizzard devs deserve the hate they get

[vivid vessel]

i had so much momentum grapple broke

[glass mortar]

u actually managed to fizzle ur grapple

[hidden bay]

huh?

[glass mortar]

all that open terrain it woulda been fine on

[covert kestrel]

[vivid vessel]

[glass mortar]

and u picked the 1 pixel right against that house

[fluid meadow]

at least it's not a dc and a death like before

[hidden bay]

do they not know adr and rtb is alrd lost on pull

[glass mortar]

that would kill u

thats on u bozo

[hidden bay]

am i missing something here?

[runic bough]

Guys after I press kir, I cast rtb but sometimes it takes a buff away so when do I know I should hold it?

[glass mortar]

RtB isnt lost on pull

[vivid vessel]

its not

[glass mortar]

neither is AR

[stiff isle]

Is this an intended change? Seems like a bug given it didnt even hit m+

[hidden bay]

im cooked then

[sullen wyvern]

BROI

another nerf

[glass mortar]

it doesnt rlly matter since we generally cast both those spells after pull

to be clear

but if u forgot to pre supercharger

u could RtB while running to boss

since it didnt matter

now u cant

[hidden bay]

so they left in supercharger

[glass mortar]

[runic bough]

Guys kir question

[fathom bramble]

M+ does not have encounter start events at bosses. A change like this wouldn’t effect M+ bosses ever

[runic bough]

After I press kir, I will either have cto proc remaining buffs but if not I press rtb right?

I been doing this

[fluid meadow]

yeah, but should happen when bubble drops and gg

[gaunt phoenix]

Cool it

[agile orchid]

I am cool

What I said is my opinion

[runic bough]

Am I muted nobody answering

[potent gyro]

We should start at 0 energy when the bosses are pulled too

To be fair

[fathom bramble]

It would happen on bubble drop, but there’s no reason to cast ar that early anyway

[agile orchid]

Their priorities are completely fucked

[cinder relic]

This is probably a change that takes 5 minutes to make

You think they were having 3 board room meetings to discuss this bro

[glass mortar]

u press RtB immediatly if ur missing a buff, otherwise u wait for the longer buffs to be at ~41s remaining to RtB

iirc

[proven ocean]

@vivid vessel did u see the outlaw raid changes

[glass mortar]

this is in the FaQ tho

[proven ocean]

lmao

outlaw's about to be cancer

in raid

[agile orchid]

Fixing killing spree would take 5 minute to fix too

[stiff isle]

On key start

[proven ocean]

or

?

[agile orchid]

But they prioritize this shit

[glass mortar]

the key start stuff is different from raid boss pullin tho

[cinder relic]

Okay

[glass mortar]

but yea it is inconsistent across the game

i wish theyd just... universalized all this

so we had obvious lines

for which buffs and debuffs u can carry thru the gate in m+ start but reset on raid boss pull

etc

[agile orchid]

You know what would also take 5 minutes? Making 1.5m cds reset properly when you reset a boss

[stiff isle]

Should just be "all buffs under 5 min are cleared on pull. All cds longer than 1 min are reset on pull"

[agile orchid]

But we can’t be bothered to do that

[fathom bramble]

When you put the key in it also does an encounter end event which is why the lists feel different

[runic bough]

You know kir on a fast to press bind really makes a huge difference

[craggy barn]

fixing killing spree would not take 5 minutes. if any new art/animation is expected then that can take a while since u need to rope in the art department

[glass mortar]

yea gotta make sure all ur ogcds are accesibly easy to press

[runic bough]

Before I had kir on a bad bind maybe that's why I didn't like it

[fathom bramble]

If this new change doesn’t make ar fall off when the bubble drops then it’s a new 3rd list for some reason

[craggy barn]

and the art department has their own priorities

[agile orchid]

You don’t have to add a new animation, just make it not randomly teleport you? Or make higher combo points dramatically decrease the duration

[runic bough]

What kind of visual effects would you like to see on outlaw? Since we don't really have any.

[covert kestrel]

Except changing the teleport line of code from a 1 to 0 does take 5 minutes

As shown by wox on his legendary thread

[vivid vessel]

like ks fix

[runic bough]

Smoke bomb is probably our best visual ability. Unable to use in pve.

[glass mortar]

ZAC

[craggy barn]

except making that decision likely will take weeks. theres still reviews and stuff needed for changes like that

[glass mortar]

i figured it out

this is to fix people who were trash abusing

by fighting trash while some bozo ran and reset bosses

to reset lust and cds

!

[fathom bramble]

All of our spelldata bugs are as easy to fix as adding this stuff to the encounter start list

[fervent nest]

Is Outlaw good yet?

[fathom bramble]

But it doesn’t matter if this change is easy or not

[fervent nest]

RIP my AR

[agile orchid]

Thank god they instead focus on making that change instead

[fathom bramble]

It has no describable upsides

It’s pointless and only serves to be annoying

[covert kestrel]

Well yeah but that's why blizz is a small indie company

[agile orchid]

they are going to release a patch with timegated content

which basically has no content on release

[glass mortar]

this screams restless dev syndrome to me

ever since someone explained the term

w/e

[covert kestrel]

Meanwhile realz:

He's so rested

[gaunt phoenix]

The change does not affect supercharger @lusty sparrow

[surreal flower]

They should make raid buffs clear on combat enter so everyone can spend their first global on those

[runic bough]

You guys know it's probably also not the devs that finalize changes.

[craggy barn]

u joke but a small indie team would have less red tape to make some of these changes people want

[covert kestrel]

https://tenor.com/view/thats-the-joke-ranier-wolfcastle-mc-bain-the-simpsons-stand-up-comedy-gif-4372917

[agile orchid]

well yeah you also need to have these useless middle managers that have to justify their salary somehow

[runic bough]

It could also be shareholders that decide class tuning, that's how corporations work. The devs are just implementing stuff.

[craggy barn]

i literally said thats the joke

[sullen wyvern]

now that the outlaw cheese will be gone for raid, how did you guys pull that cheese off before a fight?

[cinder relic]

Supercharger still exists, this is just a non change for us

[bright crane]

lol I can’t tell if you’re being serious

[covert kestrel]

https://tenor.com/view/13-карт-gif-14026559412000478194

[glass mortar]

im sorry shareholders deciding class tuning is comedic gold

[cinder relic]

This is your brain on, not understanding how game development works at all

[craggy barn]

joke on this

[lusty sparrow]

thanks big guy

[cinder relic]

You think some dude who owns stock in blizzard is going to meetings to get Mage buffed?

[fervent nest]

does it

[covert kestrel]

[fervent nest]

Yes

[glass mortar]

as a 20% shareholder in blizzard, why was my sons main, ret paladin just nerfed??

[shy flame]

this is absolutely insane to think lol

[agile orchid]

we should buy some stock to get some rogue changes

[glass mortar]

very dissapointed in the direction of this company

[craggy barn]

im doing my best by buying stocks but man the market sucks rn

[glass mortar]

[jolly geyser]

tinfoils

[runic bough]

You guys don't know how corporations work I see

[shy flame]

LOL

[cinder relic]

You literally don't understand how game development works

[covert kestrel]

My dad is Joe Blizzard-Activition and I think that outlaw cap should be 40

[glass mortar]

i think many people here have a better handle on how game dev companys work then u ryu

[potent gyro]

Dude ryu is spitting rn holy

[cinder relic]

This is the dumbest thing I've ever heard in my life

[covert kestrel]

https://tenor.com/view/homer-homer-simpson-simpsons-worst-day-of-your-life-so-far-bart-gif-11689059539835963602

[shy flame]

bro thinking a shareholder even knows what a class is in WoW is fucking wild

[late swallow]

https://tenor.com/view/hop-on-among-us-among-us-kiss-gif-18740554

[olive flax]

If this was true, all the outlaw discord would need to do is band together and by up a bunch of blizz stock to influence an outlaw rework

[sullen wyvern]

I still maintain my theory, some player here fucked a dev's wife and now the entire outlaw community is getting it

[covert kestrel]

You think the lurkers in ravenholdt have sex with women??

[cinder relic]

that's a very weird thing to think about

But if you want to have cuck fantasies be my guest ig

[sullen wyvern]

I used to

[potent gyro]

Have any of you ever seen a shareholder and a class balancer in the same room?

[sullen wyvern]

[gaunt phoenix]

the change was several weeks ago btw

[patent lion]

https://tenor.com/view/the-simpsons-enter-leave-bye-gif-16118048

[gaunt phoenix]

just wasn't caught

[glass mortar]

wait what

oh u mean the change on ptr

i thought u meant on LIVE lmao

[potent gyro]

Don’t be afraid whispyr

[olive flax]

https://tenor.com/view/sml-jeffy-hey-get-back-here-get-back-here-come-back-gif-25471491

@patent lion

[icy cedar]

Umm wtf did blizzard just kill outlaw in raid

[glass mortar]

what did u guys do to make them do this to deathmark

were u guys prepull deathmarking

legendary assassination tech

[covert kestrel]

[potent gyro]

No, the shareholders did

[surreal flower]

Some absolute monsters in the logs

[patent lion]

I'm pretty sure they just grabbed a bunch of main cds

[glass mortar]

yea... ok so heres another question

why is it only like a quarter of the major cds in the game

i promise u DR does not have this behavior on live (evoker)

[gaunt phoenix]

No they removed AR and RTB prepull

Which we didnt do anyway

We prepulled Supercharger which still exists

[glass mortar]

why didnt this get applied to DR

or just every single specs major cd

[still matrix]

Was there patch notes or something?

[random stirrup]

maybe at the same time they can make 90s reset on wipe

that would be cool

[patent lion]

be like that idk

[runic bough]

What did they do to raid that's bad for us?

[glass mortar]

obviously the main character

have u seen their sims

everyone knows evokers eating too good

[fervent nest]

Hi

[covert kestrel]

https://tenor.com/view/jd-vance-vance-curly-hair-rotating-gif-1155831357133379

[glass mortar]

[runic bough]

I saw the notes said something about removing buffs from raid

[sonic gust]

how do we get supercharger if AR goes on cd? sorry, im dumb

[late swallow]

yeah outlaw can't press ADR or RTB in raids anymore

[runic bough]

What

Out of all the things

[glass mortar]

supercharger is related to RtB not AR

and u just get it from pressing the button

it has nothing to do with the buffs

[sonic gust]

ahh, so just rtb way before?

[glass mortar]

yes which u were already supposed to be doing

if u dont pre RtB cheese u need to make sure u dont cast ur first one until combat starts tho

or u'll lose it

[sonic gust]

Gotcha

[dense bolt]

how do we know for certain they didnt do anything aboout sc btw

[runic bough]

Test it

[still matrix]

@runic bough how's ur fatebound build going

[runic bough]

I need more gear to test it again later but I'm doing kir for now

[glass mortar]

go on ptr and test it

[fervent nest]

apology for bad english

where were u wen outlaw die

I was at house eating dorito when phone ring

“Outlaw is kil”

“no”

[still matrix]

Fatebiund kir?

[glass mortar]

but they didnt do anything to anyone elses pre raid buff shit so i cant imagine them remembering specifically to do SC

SC isnt even a trackable buff

[runic bough]

Yes

[still matrix]

Did you have someone geared sim difference between it and trickster?

How big was it

[gaunt phoenix]

the change was weeks ago and already on PTR spell data. Supercharger stacks 1 and 2 are still not removed on encounter start

[runic bough]

My build vs trickster was 1.3% difference last time I compared them

But the dmg was terrible when played

[dense bolt]

aight

[still matrix]

Hmmm link build

[frail veldt]

Holup I'm confused I thought we already were using adr after boss combat starts so we don't lose the cps? @vivid vessel so this changes nothing right?

[runic bough]

I dont even want to play ks to get an overall so I can't directly compare

[gaunt phoenix]

Yes it changes nothing

[agile orchid]

if you somehow use adr before the pull

[frail veldt]

Whys everyone so tilted then

[agile orchid]

you're fucked

[gaunt phoenix]

Cause people are fucking braindead

[agile orchid]

because they focus on this crap

instead of fixing killing spree killing you

that's why

[fervent nest]

https://tenor.com/view/hang-first-time-smiles-gif-14991372

[cinder relic]

!mute @agile orchid 1h you are pissing me off, come back later

[frail veldt]

Prob different departments

This is more of a global design paradigm thing

[cinder relic]

He is just an idiot

cba

Come back in an hour

[runic bough]

Its a 20% haste build, no kir no ho. Taking gsw pc.

[still matrix]

I can

[frail veldt]

It makes sense though I can see an adjustment period of people being trolled by this change

[runic bough]

They also nerfed prepull for m+ last season

[frail veldt]

Good tbh

[cinder relic]

Some Major Cooldown Buffs Removed on Raid Boss Combat Start

This change doesn't affect Outlaw at all. Supercharger still works on prepull. You didn't want to prepull AR > RTB anyway.
There is literally nothing to complain about.

[frail veldt]

Pre key shit is toxic

[random stirrup]

make 90s cds and trinkets reset on boss wipe

[silver mica]

honestly, based

[frail veldt]

I don't want to have to do a fucking dance routine and sacrifice a pig to get an extra 5% DPS on first pull

[random stirrup]

me, the fury warr, the uh dk, all asking for another 30s before pull because our cds are on cd

[silver mica]

I actually wonder how much time is wasted waiting for 1min/90s cds to reset during prog

I'd imagine not a small amount

[runic bough]

Why does prepull matter at all though

[frail veldt]

Exactly

It shouldn't matter

[runic bough]

Why force actives until combat begins?

[glass mortar]

if u didnt have time/forgot to do prepull supercharger u need to not press ur first RtB until u pull

thats about the only thing it changes

[gaunt phoenix]

yer

[glass mortar]

but it is a pretty important change

pressing that RtB then going into the fight with no buffs and RtB on full cd

☠️

[late swallow]

I don't like how encouraging/positive the pin is

i want more doom

[fathom bramble]

it's a significant change to a longstanding gamewide system idk

[frail veldt]

Oh so whoever wrote the wowhead post doesn't know how to outlaw it seems

[fathom bramble]

it's fine rn since we already got our prepull ruined for various reasons

[glass mortar]

with no reason given

[cinder relic]

Nobody does

[frail veldt]

Lol fair

[cinder relic]

Outlaw used to do pull stuff

[fathom bramble]

this is the first time they have ever adjusted prepull stuff that isn't being done in an abusive way

[cinder relic]

I mean they have randomly curbed random prepull shit for years

[runic bough]

That was the swsh swsh swsh thing

[fathom bramble]

this didn't rely on a target dummy, resetting the boss to get extra casts, or gear swapping

[cinder relic]

Yeah theres no like

extreme abuse case in this instance

[fathom bramble]

this kind of prepull is what they use to change systems specifically to support

[cinder relic]

But they just don't want there to be anything

[glass mortar]

its just a weird case of usually with these changes u see a bug posted for why they made the change, and in this case there is no discernable reason

[civic void]

Kinda wild they forgot about sc in that case lol

[glass mortar]

also for some reason the list is only like half the major cds in the game?

[fathom bramble]

like Realz made us keep 2 supercharger specifically so we could precast RTB before the encounter starts

[glass mortar]

thes rest of the specs just dont have their stuff clear or

[bright crane]

God I can’t believe MSFT stock owners would just do this

I’m shooketh

[fathom bramble]

MFD increased combo points kept on pull to 5 while talented

[runic bough]

I dont think they ever put descriptions on changes. It's just changes shown.

[fathom bramble]

it's normal to be able to cast your spells before pull and changing this is very new

[cinder relic]

THe rothschilds buying blizzard stock to get outlaw nerfed again

[icy cedar]

Bill Gates himself called whoever is in charge at Blizz these days

[frail veldt]

Yeah that take definitely comes from someone who's never worked at a real sized company

[fluid iron]

ill transfer all of my assets into blizz stock

to make outlaw unplayable until forever

trust

[fathom bramble]

I am curious if there is even a good example of a prepull shenanigan that was nerfed that didn't require you to do something outside the pull timer. The only thing close is new mechanics like coins that broke the norm

[olive flax]

private equity ruins everything smh

[bright crane]

I heard Melinda Gates’s mains sin and so that’s why OL has been ignored

[runic bough]

I would bet Blackrock owns a majority of blizzard stock. They are the reason many companies are no longer friendly to consumers.

[bright crane]

lol

[runic bough]

Its possible

[bright crane]

You know Blizz is owned by MSFT right

[icy cedar]

no it isn't

[frail veldt]

I mean private equity can cause some unwanted changes in previously small/locally owned companies

[icy cedar]

to Ryukage not to yungman

[frail veldt]

but I dont think thats necessarily the case here