pvp

[lone jasper]

🙌

[severe helm]

Well you have to change back

Won't catch me staying earthen

[potent pivot]

You can buy the big packs of race changes

[severe helm]

How much does that drop the cost though

[potent pivot]

I think it goes down to 13 per

[severe helm]

Oh nice that's not bad

How many do you have to buy

Like 6?

[potent pivot]

8 I think

They should make it so that you can get chauffeured around for it

That would be the funniest shit

[severe helm]

LOL two person mount

Doesn't that work?

Could sell carries

Just flying people around

[potent pivot]

Don’t think so no

[severe helm]

Why not

You dont get exploration XP when on someone else's mount?

[potent pivot]

Think it gets reduced or something

I think archvaldor tried it in his vid

[lime oar]

there’s also a 48 or 72 hour restriction on race change once you’ve done one

[severe helm]

Oh weeeird

[potent pivot]

He also teased a faster lvling method

A quest that hyper spawns rats somewhere

If that’s faster than 1hr15 it’s kinda nuts

[severe helm]

I've heard of that one

But it requires some setup

And some secret stuff to get it to work

[potent pivot]

The one level boosters are using rn is wild too

Even though it’s like 3-3.5hr

They use 6 accounts at once

[unique garnet]

I saw Whazz during the AWC I believe running warglaives as mogs, I thought it was transmogable (well only for DH with BT achieve)

[harsh kiln]

trickster still better than fatebound for outlaw?

[fathom crag]

its only on tournament servers

you can t mog anything there

everything is available

[potent pivot]

Not enough to be worth playing I think

You have to play KS for it to be better

And even then it’s like 1-2%

[harsh kiln]

too bad KS sucks

to play*

[potent pivot]

Numerically it’s fine

[harsh kiln]

it's just a shit button to press imo

[unique garnet]

Poking Spree

[outer sky]

What a take

[ocean thunder]

fuck me warrior hurt

adn they dont die

[quick temple]

Feels like they rando gave specs the burst sub was nerfed for

[gleaming sentinel]

I didn’t know BM hunters had trap tbh

They never use it on my team

[potent pivot]

It’s time to grind warriors guys

[molten hedge]

I mean there’s always sandstone. Holy shit you just put me on something bc I have more than 1 acct

What do I have to do? Slow flying not DF mount and click the screen in each zone?

And just follow the route with the addon?

[potent pivot]

Dragon flying

[molten hedge]

Oh I see what you said about riding on a mount

With 2+

[potent pivot]

You just have to go slow if you’d pass straight through a zone to fast

[ocean thunder]

warrior or lock?

[potent pivot]

Warrior for sure

[gleaming sentinel]

Assa dream

Pkrah inc

[outer sky]

Its a nightmare

[molten hedge]

I’m surprised there’s not more trolls. Supposedly gnome still BiS

[outer sky]

It is. I asked Skyhold about that last night and they all said gnome is still BiS

[molten hedge]

Yeah having that on demand root break will prob win you more games on avg

[outer sky]

My friend Kydrav fucks on warrior playing Drainei though

[molten hedge]

Arms is cool bc u can bladestorm a root bc it does shit damage LOL

For colossus

[potent pivot]

Troll is only good for arms

[molten hedge]

Arms is the only warrior spec for men is what skyhold told me

Now I need to go inject 100ccs of steroids

[outer sky]

Just to get globaled by some dude cosplaying as Legolas

[potent pivot]

But they are cowards

[molten hedge]

Warr is p good into hunters

Now that they don’t have peels

[potent pivot]

Playing the “tankier” spec

Pfft

[outer sky]

Fury lacks self control and impulse regulation which is a feminine trait

[potent pivot]

Real men are not afraid to die

[molten hedge]

U have to go balls to the wall on fury

I blame it on

CDR

[outer sky]

I just like the spec fantasy of arms more than fury tbh

I picture the arms warrior like someone with a fine collection of weapons

Carefully choosing which one to use

Only for me to pick Gorehowl 100% of the time

[molten hedge]

I need some sick mogs and weps on warr

[outer sky]

You need to farm Gorehowl if you don't have it already

[potent pivot]

Farm Dragonflight raids

And shadowlands

[molten hedge]

The acct my warr is on is not the one that I farmed on smh

That’s why the earthen thing interested me

[potent pivot]

I want warr t3 and those blue axes

I forget what they’re called

But they’re one of those iconic weps

[severe helm]

its a requirement as a warrior player to turn off stun drs

[molten hedge]

The sad part is no matter how sick the mog is, you’re a gnome lol

[severe helm]

you should simply press storm bolt on cd whenever the enemy steps more than 5 yards away from you and you dont have a gap closer up

[molten hedge]

Hahahaha mewo

[severe helm]

watch any r1 war

im dead serious

[molten hedge]

As a rog I cannot accept that for me

[potent pivot]

Which is why I just won’t play gnome. That is the coward’s way.

[molten hedge]

Are you going human, orc or troll

[potent pivot]

Orc

[severe helm]

any war whos playing gnome is no man to me

Orc is correct af

[molten hedge]

Nice that’s a vibe

[severe helm]

notrickz def has hair on his chest

[potent pivot]

I think troll is probably really good for shuffle

Where you can’t depend on dispels 90% of the time

[molten hedge]

Truee

What’s troll racial

Oh berserk nvm

[outer sky]

Haste buff good for arms too

[ocean thunder]

what's a good team mate/comp for assa? for 3s?

[potent pivot]

Shortens roots and snares

[molten hedge]

I meant the on use

But yeah

[potent pivot]

Or did you mean dps racial

Ah

Ye mini lust

[fathom crag]

some guy i know lvld troll fury warrior but the slow reduction is not working as fury

[molten hedge]

Trickz said only arms

That’s funny though

[fathom crag]

ye it’s only arms

[potent pivot]

Ye it only stacks with arms’ shortening thing

Fury doesn’t have a base shortening ability I think?

Like didn’t they only add it to arms battle stance or something

[quick temple]

this is a Broxigar line

[molten hedge]

I googled Broxigar, and it asked me if I was a bot

So I’m gonna ignore your comment

[potent pivot]

Ye idk bro fury holds 1 2h in each hand

Arms warriors need both hands

[outer sky]

Hes my warrior mascot

[potent pivot]

To me this implies weakness

[severe helm]

I think of someone grabbing whatever is biggest and sharpest and just swinging it around

Ooga booga

[potent pivot]

[outer sky]

Its spelled Broxikor

[quick temple]

oh you kno who im talkin about lol

[outer sky]

Yeah ofc lol

[quick temple]

yea he has some bangers fs

[outer sky]

He's a meme but sometimes hes 10000% on point

Like people just write him off based on reputation

[hybrid sapphire]

Good afternoon rogues what’s the good news

[outer sky]

But sometimes he posts a banger like this

https://us.forums.blizzard.com/en/wow/t/lay-on-hands-has-to-go/2274832

Masterpiece

[potent pivot]

We all play warrior now

[molten hedge]

how do u unlock earthen

i dont see it in stormwind embassy

[potent pivot]

TWW quest line

You should just have it already

If you did TWW campaign

Similar to how we got haranir now

[molten hedge]

shit man idt i played this acct much in tww

fuqqq me

[potent pivot]

Are you really thinking about double race changing just to level a little faster? xdd

[outer sky]

Imagine gameplay so bad people would consider doing this

[molten hedge]

well i have no warrior on this acct

and ive bought a lot of wow coins lately for my alt army

[potent pivot]

Oof

[hybrid sapphire]

Pog

[outer sky]

You need to get yourself a glad so you'll never have to spend money on those stupid tokens ever again

[potent pivot]

Yep

Or advertise the boosts yourself

[molten hedge]

lmaoo how often are yall doing boosts

[outer sky]

True but man these communities make it so much easier

[outer sky]

I did 2 last night

[potent pivot]

Technically they are tos

[outer sky]

Oh well

[potent pivot]

I haven’t done any yet this ssn but usually a gold cap or more per ssn I play

[outer sky]

I do like maybe 5 or 6 per week but its slow right now.

[outer sky]

Oh yeah easy

Shit picks up towards the end of the season

[potent pivot]

Just letting you know

The advertisers are technically supposed to take part in the boosting afaik

Or some shit

[potent pivot]

A lot yeah

[molten hedge]

can u buy shit with a visa gift card on wow store

i forgot i have a $100 giftcard from my bday

[potent pivot]

Idk

[outer sky]

Married man getting gift cards for his birthday bro ya know what my wife gets me for my birthday? A list of chores to do

[potent pivot]

[molten hedge]

i got treated heavily for my last bday it was nice

i chilled

[lime oar]

same lmfao

[molten hedge]

we ate out like 3 times, and she let me just degen wow whenever i wanted didnt say anything

[outer sky]

Peak wife behavior

[molten hedge]

and she cleaned the house

jesus

laros is sandbagging so hard

saying warrior is good its not op but sp is broken lol

[lime oar]

my wife and my birthday are a day apart so i’m cooked

[outer sky]

Sometimes I tell my wife im having guests over so she will clean this place the fuck up and after shes done I tell her everyone canceled

[molten hedge]

lmfaooo

they get nervous when you say guests are coming

[outer sky]

Ye

[potent pivot]

[analog tapir]

´how would the "Perfect burst" as sub look like ?

[outer sky]

Your target is dead at the end of it

[potent pivot]

Trying to learn it “global for global” likely just going to lead to suboptimal play/mistakes

Gotta learn how to play around the apex talents and shadow technique stacks

[outer sky]

It became a lot easier for me to get the dance rotations down when I was first learning it when I stopped thinking global to global and instead started thinking of it as

Build combo points with X>spend them on Y

But press cheap shot at any point to avoid gapping your stuns

But thats just me idk

[severe helm]

use builder to build

use finisher to finish

[potent pivot]

Sometimes you use another builder at max combo points

[severe helm]

ew

is that for dance macabre?

[potent pivot]

No

It’s to proc the apex

[severe helm]

why not proc it after the finisher

[potent pivot]

Because you could proc your clones on a strike instead of evis

They do this in pve too btw

For supercharged evis clones

[severe helm]

yeah I just read it

its just to get the apex active for your SC non sec tech finisher

[potent pivot]

Ye

[severe helm]

1%

[potent pivot]

And evis is stronger in pvp

So it’s more burst

To just do it on every evis you can

[severe helm]

yeah was gona ask why not sec tech

I figure its just weaker than evisc rn?

[potent pivot]

Naw

I forget the reason

[severe helm]

maybe some bug

[potent pivot]

I think the clones only proc off the initial hit or something

[severe helm]

cuz the apex reads as it creates a shadow to echo the ability

[potent pivot]

Yeah

[severe helm]

but sec tech is already a shadow

so it probaly ony replicates the non shadow part

which is less value than just echoing a whole evisc

great job blizz

[outer sky]

The initial hit is physical

[severe helm]

yes that was my point

new outlaw bug

just dropped

have blizz devs ever heard of a unit test?

[spring bough]

It’s “fine” lmao

[spring bough]

Prob won’t be fixed till .07

[potent pivot]

Kek

[severe helm]

they dont fix bugs that cause damage loss

only ones that increase our damage

like cloud cover

[halcyon timber]

Rogue aversion risk assessment protocol

[main agate]

Hey guys. I'm new
To rogue, and confused a bit. I have 4 ComboPoints. Can i ask what I do next?

[potent pivot]

Sinister strike

You want to try not to overcap on combo points and not overcap on Opportunity stacks

So when you have 6 Opp stacks, you can pistol shot at a little higher combo points

But if you have 3 Opp stacks, you only pistol shot if you are at 3 or less combo points

[main agate]

Okay, but it litterally writes "pistol shots are higher Priority than sinister
?

[alpine tinsel]

Does rogue mobility feel bad rn or is just because so many specs feel kinda slippery?

I stg step and blind feel like I have to be way closer to lol

[quick temple]

but not overcapping is higher

which Notrickz kindly elaborated

[alpine tinsel]

Also cheap not benefitting from subterfuge is frieeeddd

[potent pivot]

Everything has rules. Pistol shot being higher priority does not mean that there are not rules and limitations around that. Where is that screenshot even from?

I don’t see that in the faq

Ah it’s from the mistakes section

[potent pivot]

You cropped out the most important part …

“At 6 stacks of Opportunity pistol shot is always higher priority”

Which is why I was saying you don’t want to overcap Opportunity stacks

[solid gulch]

do u leave queue for a split second when u get a loading svreen?

[potent pivot]

Naw

[main agate]

Oki. I get it now when reading it again. Thx for clearing it out.
I waswatching Pikaboos latest outlaw video and he just say spamit when ready (pistol stacks) 😆

[potent pivot]

No worries

Pikas an amazing player/content creator etc

Problem with video guides is they tend to leave out a lot of important optimizations

Outlaw especially has so many little things you can do better to maximize damage, I couldn’t imagine trying to put everything in the faq into a video

[molten hedge]

Just AR immediately before your first AR is even 1/3 done

And collect rating

[quick temple]

im just getting destroyed by devour/wars

[potent pivot]

[quick temple]

and sometimes enhace/takedown globals

like i just cant survive sigh

[potent pivot]

Outlaws deadge

We go next

[quick temple]

i dont feel feint getting crit by 100k voidblades and healer spamming heals die anyway. cant really learn much from it

ah this doesnt help i guess

[neat canopy]

seeing some of the tops play fatebound? idk how do yall experienced rogues judge murlok.io

[hybrid sapphire]

new stereotype just dropped

[potent pivot]

Murlok is giga cooked this season

With how the tuning has been all over the place and big shifts between builds

Just from murlok you can’t tell which of the top people hit their rating weeks ago and haven’t even logged back into the character

But ye we prob go back fatebound now

[main agate]

Are you serious? So overlappimg AR is perfect assuming we have premediatation?

[potent pivot]

Trickster is barely ahead and you have to take KS to see that extra damage

[potent pivot]

No

He’s trolling

[solid gulch]

whazz was kinda cooking on fb

[potent pivot]

He also didn’t take KS when he played trickster

Which in 2s especially is kinda weird

[molten hedge]

pika said to do this in his last video on outlaw

[potent pivot]

KS can kinda truck in 2s

[potent pivot]

Wait what lmao

[molten hedge]

but then he didnt do it which is good ofc lol

sec

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hve3FePH-L8

1:30

[main agate]

Pika is not about the details. He just know what to taret and where to go, which is better than a perfect rotation. His raring taæks it self i guess. Never played rogue so hard for me to judge😃

[hybrid sapphire]

never played rogue but in the rogue discord 🤔

[main agate]

I started in midnight

[molten hedge]

yea i mean i knew not to overlap AR that would be such a waste. but it just was funny that he said that. maybe i misunderstood but he even does it in his rotation Premeds in opener like his 6th global lol

[potent pivot]

Premed in opener is good

But sending the second ADR before the first is even over is definitely not lol

[main agate]

I dont know how to build thd rotagion out of that. It sounds wah to easy and my dmg will prob suck ballz if following his peptalk

[molten hedge]

i thought he said to send 2nd AR immediately but im listening to it again and i think i was fried

silver im sorry for ruining your blossoming pvvp career

its joever for you already bud

[main agate]

1. Opener (MOST IMPORTANT SEQUENCE)
   Do this in order:
   1.Cheap Shot (save Kidney Shot)
   2.Adrenaline Rush
   3.Roll the Bones (ALWAYS after Adrenaline Rush)
   4.Blade Rush
   5.Between the Eyes (with max combo points if possible)
   6.Preparation (use immediately in opener)
   7.Blade Rush again (from Prep reset)
   8.Resume normal priority
   ⚠️ Why this matters
   •Adrenaline Rush gives max combo points
   •It guarantees strong Roll the Bones
   •Prep resets AR, BTE, Blade Rush → massive opener pressure

[molten hedge]

youll find pvp never has a set rotation

youll have to do other globals

you can have a priority list for sure

[main agate]

What i took. But also BtE he states 5-7 cp

Main Damage Priority (During Fight)
Always press these when available (in order):
1.Between the Eyes (prefer 5–7 combo points)
 •Higher CP = higher reset chance
 •Resets stack damage (huge)
2.Blade Rush (on cooldown)
3.Pistol Shot (ONLY when it procs / lights up)
✅ Keep globals rolling — Outlaw dies if you stop attacking.

[solid gulch]

medallion to 298 first surely ?

[molten hedge]

main hand > insignia > off hand > medallion

[solid gulch]

bc of the passive i assume u go insig first ?

[potent pivot]

You should BtE on 6 or more always basically

Unless a 5 combo point refund happens and your target is about to die right that second

Also learn how to play around your Opportunity stacks and how RtB changes the rotation etc

If you study the outlaw faq you will become a pro in no time

[molten hedge]

also recommend using the cooldown manager. i dont use it for other classes but its like mandatory for outlaw or youll always be staring at your bars

[molten hedge]

no i gave u prio right there bro

[solid gulch]

ya and im asking why u go insig first bro

before the other trinket

is what i mean by first

[molten hedge]

thats above my paygrade

@potent pivot

[solid gulch]

u really just saying shit to say it smh

lucky im short 5 voidslivers

[molten hedge]

no that really is the prio

[solid gulch]

i believe u

[potent pivot]

Because of the main stat proc ya

MH > insig > OH > medallion

[solid gulch]

16 min queue at 8cst is just so criminal

back to m+ i guess sigh

[molten hedge]

yea anywhere from 5-20 is normal rn

later in season or higher mmr it can be 20 mins to like 2 hours for really high rated ppl lol

[severe helm]

dead game bruv

[solid gulch]

this is my first szn but just seems like the rating disparity is like -+50mmr

[molten hedge]

@solid gulch 3s pops fast

insta to 2 mins at most

[solid gulch]

yea :/

i just love shuffle format but ya if i wanna play a lot illusually try to find someone for 2s or 3s

[severe helm]

or heal p much

[molten hedge]

true heal is insta

[severe helm]

actually healer queues have gotten slow

ngl

longest ive ever experienced

[molten hedge]

whats the highest q youve sat

[severe helm]

like 5 minns

[molten hedge]

yea thts interesting

bc yk theres dps waiting

probably an mmr issue

[severe helm]

this was at like 2k a month ish ago so nothing crazy

[main agate]

I set up roll the bones so i can see the dice easily for a start💪

[severe helm]

theres ~650 people in all of NA over 2200 in shuffle rn

thats legit depressing

[molten hedge]

yea its all g

supa made a video

[stiff cedar]

oh it's fixed then

hype W supa

[hybrid sapphire]

they need to get rid of thistle tea and just give it as energy regen this shit blows

[solid gulch]

u dont have to bind it

[hybrid sapphire]

yes

correct

[hybrid sapphire]

oh brother y'all are right

[solid gulch]

ya i got 3k in m+ bc i was so tired of sitting in shuff q 😛

[hidden moth]

how much longer on season?

did they make leveling faster

oh nvm conq is still caped got like 3 months left

[potent pivot]

.7 comes out in like a little over a month I think

Then we likely have 8-9 more weeks after that

So a bit over 3 yeah

[potent pivot]

No but there’s fast ways

[hidden moth]

if u say delves im gonna kms

did they make honor and bloody token gear the same ilvl?

[potent pivot]

There’s a new addon that has a fast route to follow, it’s linked in #1478034741302399250

[hybrid sapphire]

wtf do i do vs aff

[potent pivot]

And yes they’re the same ilvl now

[hybrid sapphire]

they seem to just attrition me forever

and i have no recourse

[hidden moth]

weird

why?

[potent pivot]

Made bt gear completely useless

[severe helm]

Good

[grave basin]

Getting to elite rn requires beating world champions lol

I think lontar is at 2200

[stiff cedar]

clicks ranking and scrolls to 2300
sees this
ya fair enough

[severe helm]

Or beating drooling idiots if you do blitz

At least in comparison

The contrast is just absurd

[stiff cedar]

it is

[hybrid sapphire]

i think trading all my haste for mast as assa was a mistake

im starving constantly

[potent pivot]

thats just how assa plays now

[hybrid sapphire]

when i was full haste i didnt have this prob...

[potent pivot]

if you're not envenoming at all, you should be

[hybrid sapphire]

every haste piece i trade for mast i add like a second of downtown i feel idk

[potent pivot]

you don't need to be spamming globals

especially outside of burst

just upkeep bleeds, envenom when you can, etc

[molten hedge]

@spring bough they shitting on you even in trade chat

[severe helm]

Go play outlaw bro lol

Assa gameplay isn't having something to press every gcd

[main agate]

Where is the secret device under silvermoon city, that converra your Galactic dagger intoa galactic sword, and writes the message, thx the lord now you do not need to play with your trash blue sword?

[maiden gull]

whwat we running on outlöaw now?

[vocal surge]

I feel old lol

[indigo tiger]

Is the PvP experience better on Classic? I queued for a few Solo Shuffles and Rated Battlegrounds, and it feels so dead it makes me cry.

[gusty hedge]

if you're in NA and queing now its longer wait times. 12:30 am and for others 2:30 3:30am etc. better times around noon and evenings. sometimes the mornings ques pop back to back

[maiden gull]

dropped 200 rating already

outlaw just tickles now

feels so bad unbelievable

and thats on fatebound, didnt even play trickster on this char

[rough rock]

I’ve honestly had like no desire to even play

Ngl I might just give pve a shot next season

[maiden gull]

haha this maybe fine for pve, but for pvp its super bad lmao

hiw is this not hotfixed immediately?

[quick temple]

they'll fix that bug then -5% to BTE

[marble socket]

So sub is the spec to go for pvp? Even though its meh?

[maiden gull]

They need to completly revert the bte nerf

And the 10% Nerf on ar

Outlaw hits like a wet noodle

[gleaming sentinel]

they want their mmost played classes to be represented in awc finals... aka: hunter, paladin druid and warrior

[maiden gull]

We should Close the discord aswell

Yeah dont even start on ret Pala, If there is one with brain in your shuffle its Auto lose for outlaw

Just stop awc already, its a Joke anyways 3k viewers lmao

[stoic spruce]

Which is dumb because like

Hunter is not a good AWC class

But in ladder...

[rough rock]

im ngl i feel like its only the one tricks that cry online

kass, mvq, bicmex, etc

[gleaming sentinel]

there's just no other explanation lol

classic rogue and mage kit just too op and they keep slowly turning the game into aoe mythic +

everywhere

[rough rock]

i mean i can kinda understand where they are coming from when complaining about rogue/mage always beeing good....but like thats every single competitive game lmao

id rather them just buff shit instead of this one day youre good and "op" and the next gg back to the shadow realm

[fathom crag]

outlaw is fucking useless

no

[proven kayak]

Is that bad ?

[maiden gull]

yes

and bugged

[outer sky]

I had one in a lobby i did yesterday and granted the guy wasnt anyone recognizable but it was a 2200 lobby so he had to have some vague idea how to play his spec. His damage was completely negligible like at no point was anyone afraid of his "go"

[maiden gull]

unpalyable

i play at 2,2k

and its absolte dogshit

[outer sky]

Yeah agree

[maiden gull]

you have no pressure at all

people just ignore you

[outer sky]

When conq is uncapped im going to regear my outlaw as sub or assa

[maiden gull]

the bug may play a role

but who had guessed 20% nerf on the main dps ability isn´t to much

blizz is fucking clueless

the trickste rnerf would have been enough

[outer sky]

Doesnt matter because it wont get fixed anyway

[maiden gull]

its gamebreaking 😄

like for pve its 2% but for pvp thats your main burst window whioch just doesnt work

i was wondering the whole time

[outer sky]

Which bug are you referencing?

Theres a couple

[maiden gull]

why does my message get deleted lol

[outer sky]

Does it contain a naughty word

[maiden gull]

#pvp message

[maiden gull]

this one

[outer sky]

Are you trying to use the scary R word that actually used to be the polite way to say "imbecile" after everyone got offended by that only for people to then decide they were also offended by the new word?

[maiden gull]

no naughty words 😄

[fathom crag]

found the way to enjoy the game every ssn

[maiden gull]

did someone report the bug in the forums

[outer sky]

Theres also the improved BTE bug where its just not doing as much as it should be

[maiden gull]

yeah feels like it

i was wondering the whole time, why my goes did nothing

but nerf bte by 20%

[outer sky]

If they fixed all the bugs it may actually be fine

But thats a big "if"

[gusty hedge]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/226359213427916800/1491817613544652883/aornae.gif

Not for the Faint of Heart

[outer sky]

We literally just want it to not be bugged or at least not be balanced as if it weren't bugged when it is

Like

I dont even play that shit

And its pissing me off

[gusty hedge]

its a vicious cycle, this happens every season/xpac

[gleaming sentinel]

Blitz main

[outer sky]

Its just annoying because this seems like such a rogue issue. @potent pivot DMd me last night that they fixed two major bugs with warlocks that weren't even in the game nearly as long as some bugs rogues are dealing with. Namely the Improved BTE bug

Like it cant be that hard to fix this shit

At some point its hard to deny that they just dont give a fuck

[maiden gull]

they don´t

[outer sky]

I played the beta for both this xpac and the last one and there were bugs i reported on the TWW beta that I still had to report on the Midnight beta

Like

Its discouraging

Im sitting there playing beta

Reporting bugs

Pretty much knowing it wont matter

They did finally fix the one I was reporting

But it literally took them almost 2 years to do it

There used to be a bug where if you had the Fire Breath DoT from an Evoker on you, combat would never drop

That just got fixed at the start of this season

And even though nobody is playing Deathstalker, the bug where Singular Focus puts you in combat every time it does damage is still a thing. I tested it a couple weeks ago. Still bugged like that

So if DS ever becomes meta again, good luck getting restealths or even utilizing meld

Oh but if theres a zone that can be used to speed level people theyre on fucking top of hot fixing that

[maiden gull]

:D:D:D

dropped 250 rating now

every game has a dh

why do they even heave stealth detection

DH and warri

you can do NOTHING as rogue

nothing

sub is canceled

fuck this

i do 10 mio damage less

than dh, warri and ret

[outer sky]

Always thought they should have a reduced movement speed debuff while this is active

[maiden gull]

they should just delete it

it fucks over a whole class

where is my "i delete dh´s" button

makes no sense that this skill is even in the game as bad as stealth is anyways

[outer sky]

Paladin stealth detect in blitz pisses me off

[outer sky]

I know its a long shot but MM hunter was over-nerfed a couple weeks ago and they rebuffed it last reset. They may do the same for outlaw.

Im not holding my breath

[maiden gull]

yeah but no

everyone is happy now expect outlaw players

[outer sky]

Im not

But one big issue is that when MM got nerfed, everyone who played it was adamant that it was unplayably bad post nerf

Because it basically was

However

The yellow names in here keep on insisting its fine

When its obviously not

[maiden gull]

it is not fine

at least in shuffle its unpalayable

C tier

Squishy af, no dps and bugged

[outer sky]

Yeah I agree

[maiden gull]

u dont even do 100k BTE with 20 Zero in stacks

and AR up

not even 100k

Crit

its a fucking joke

[outer sky]

I know. Ive played it a bit post nerf

It feels awful

[maiden gull]

if you dont run supercharger you dont need AR anyways

class feels awful now

[outer sky]

All the people who main sub or assa think outlaw is garbage right now but all the actual outlaw mains are coping hard that its still fine

Which is really bad

[maiden gull]

they just need to play a few shuffle matches

[grave basin]

Uniron the smartest decision

[outer sky]

Because it'll never get rebuffed

[maiden gull]

warlock just stands there and ignores my dmg

[grave basin]

Next smartest is to roll ret

[outer sky]

If the people maining it keep saying its fine

[maiden gull]

yeah but where should i voice my opinion

the outlaw bugs are not even posted in the forums 😄

just checked it

[outer sky]

Post em lol

[grave basin]

Sub will never be good in shuffle as long as 3s exists

Thats just how it is

[outer sky]

Hes talking about outlaw

[grave basin]

My brainrot read this as sub rogue

Outlaw has no tools its just a reskinned warrior at this point

[maiden gull]

cant post in us forums sadly

[grave basin]

Just roll whatever brawler does the most dam

We went through ww then outlaw now fury

Whats next

[fathom crag]

i dont like warrior ngl

at least in shuffle

[grave basin]

Back to ww?

[fathom crag]

its too squishy in shuffle

in 3s could be fun w real team

[outer sky]

Need to buff assa

And give it another button

Certainly assa buffs inc

[molten hedge]

What spec you playing

[fathom crag]

fury

[molten hedge]

lol

Yeah man fury is a marshmellow

Slayer arms is rly fun

[outer sky]

Colossus>Slayer

[molten hedge]

Slayers better now I think

Even in melee lobs

It cranks that hog

[jaunty terrace]

what the hell is fury damage now

[outer sky]

I like colossus because it allows you to save bladestorm for a root break

[molten hedge]

Yeah that’s nice but as slayer ur bladestorm cranks

Which is nice to not get shut down on your damage

[outer sky]

It got buffed even though it was already doing a ton of damage just because of low rep

But is more rep'd than assa

Which means assa needs to be buffed ASAP

[molten hedge]

Yeah i was doing like 40k dps as fury before the buffs

Was wondering why tf they were buffing it

Fury’s paper tho man I guess you can’t have it all

[outer sky]

It was low rep because arms was good and fury is also pretty squish. The problem with blizzard is that very often a spec is minimally played for reasons that have nothing to do with damage. But all blizzard ever does tuning wise to try and raise rep is throw damage at underperformers. Even when theyre already doing a shit ton of damage

Thats what just happened to fury

[outer sky]

Ain't gunna happen

[gleaming sentinel]

🙁

[molten hedge]

Yeah meanwhile ddh is hopping all over the map with 37 immunities one tapping ppl being unkillable

Ik you can counter them but they’re stilll aggravating

[outer sky]

Idk what everyone is talking about with this whole "dev DH is unkillable" thing

They die so easily

[molten hedge]

Yeah in short bursts of damage

À la kidney kingsbane

[outer sky]

As long as they dont glimpse my kidney

Feels like they can't win

I know its not crazy high rating or anythinh but still

[molten hedge]

Yeah but it is 2s also damp is crazy high

And it’s 2s

[outer sky]

Many of these are sub 2 minute games

They flop in 3s and shuffle too

[molten hedge]

It still starts at 40

Anyone I watch lately thinks they’re immortal but it’s mostly melees

[outer sky]

I dont think dampening is really relevant because they just die in a kidney

They couldnt heal anyway

[molten hedge]

Yeah they can die in a short burst of damage that’s about it

I haven’t played a lot of classes into them though so my opinion is slightly biased

I did find them to be more killable before they got buffed to be tankier

[outer sky]

Idk I just know I legitimately have no issue with them. The only time I lose to dev dh is if they outplay my kidney and glimpse it at the right moment

[molten hedge]

Yeah I mean kidney kingsbane goes hard

[outer sky]

Like i played this one shuffle

Dev dh, BM hunter, ret lobby

And every time the hunter and I were about to get a kill on the DH the ret had a save

And the hunter goes

"Man dev DH just doesnt die"

Like

Bro thats the ret being broken

Not the dh

[molten hedge]

Maybe I’ve been watching too much Whaazz but I’ve seen him kill one dev dh the last month and I watch him every day lmao

And they’re in every eu lobby at 2300+

[outer sky]

Idk how thats possible. I dont not believe it though

Just my experience is if you catch em in a kidney without blur up they just die

And its not like the DHs hes playing against can do anything while stunned that the DHs im playing against cant do

So that should be the same

[molten hedge]

Yeah agree. I just strongly feel like this is mostly due to kidney kingsbane being stronger than any burst sub or outlaw has

[outer sky]

Im also playing my own sort of one bang build. Multiple mastery engi pieces plus badge trinket macrod to kingsbane

[molten hedge]

But I could be wrong I’ll take the L 🙂

Havoc DH usually has pretty low death rates when I see stats, and ddh is a tankier, more mobile version of havoc

So I could see it being hard to kill based off stats

[outer sky]

Today im going to try dropping double vanish and taking supercharger/forced induction and playing DTB for amp poison

[molten hedge]

Trueeeee

Your build cranks I bet lmao

Dang no 2nd vanish sounds rough

Interested to hear results

[outer sky]

Im like 90% sure its gunna be troll

But the kingsbane go sounds like it'll be unlivable

[molten hedge]

Lmaoo

Speaking of troll I made a 2nd warr named Dancestancer

That’s a troll

I have 0 trolls so that was my first

[outer sky]

The idea is you dont need sudden demise since the envenom after kingsbane should pretty much always be the killing blow. Ill probably also play system shock and poison bomb

[molten hedge]

That’s sum cheese my boy 🧀

I actually liked system shock bc of the slow it felt like a mini shiv lol

[outer sky]

Supercharger+forced induction envenom is a 10 combo point envenom which means it has a 50% chance to proc poison bomb

[spring bough]

wtf everyone rerolling warrior?

[outer sky]

Yeah. Theres just no point in resisting anymore

We do damage for like 2 weeks

Nerfed into oblivion

Just make things easier

Play the class that can actually kill shit

[molten hedge]

https://tenor.com/view/arnold-schwarzenegger-sword-destroyer-barbarian-gif-19123444

[lime oar]

i’m fighting for my life not to reroll

i got my warr to 82 and came to my senses

[outer sky]

As long as smoke bomb is in the game i doubt i will ever reroll. Its too much fun.

[maiden gull]

warrior feels so much better

you actually do dmg

on every single skill

[molten hedge]

I came to wow in DF s4 and just lvled everything and alted whatever to learn all the classes bc I was coming to a 20+ year old game with 0 knowledge. I think a lot of ppl are OGs and not into rerolling. But to me that’s how to have fun on wow

And I think that’s become increasingly more popular these days

It’s pretty easy to lvl and gear stuff. I’m sure if they made it harder, I wouldn’t do that

[outer sky]

My problem is every time I try something else I just get frustrated and think how much easier whatever it is im trying to do would be if I were on my main. Like on rogue I dont even have to think about how to do damage. Thats all totally on autopilot and is second nature. That lets me focus entirely on whats going on in the game. But on any other class I actually have to think at least somewhat about how to actually do damage and thats frustrating for me

[maiden gull]

same, just played 2 rounds as warrior

[molten hedge]

That’s a big true tbh bro

[maiden gull]

i just dont feel it

outlaw is the only spec which is fun for me sadly

[molten hedge]

The only way I have fun on warr is looking to fuck ppl’s goes and vene shit

If I just tunnel damage it does get boring after you play rogue

[maiden gull]

yeah

[molten hedge]

Outlaws super fun

[maiden gull]

man i just want my outlaw back from before 12.5

[outer sky]

Outlaw used to be way more fun

[maiden gull]

yeah crackshot on my chest

or the big pistol shots in shadowlands

[outer sky]

Restless blades used to affect way more shit. And it was unnerfed in pvp

Outlaw could vanish every go lol

[molten hedge]

I did play it when you had crackshot!but I was new to rogue and outlaw was very hard

[maiden gull]

the games goes more and more to shit

[outer sky]

With all thr CDR

[molten hedge]

Yeah it was a fkn tank

[maiden gull]

no one likes the class pruning

outlaw is supposed to be a tnak

now it a worse warrior in leather

mages have more ivnis

everyone deals more dmg

fucking sad what this game has become

[molten hedge]

Rogues kit makes it tankier than fury but yea I get it

[outer sky]

I really liked that one pvp talent outlaw had that they pruned. Enduring Brawler. I thought that was really well designed for a spec like outlaw and it felt great

[maiden gull]

yes!

[molten hedge]

That was a super good talent

[maiden gull]

started playing outlaw when they introduced it

[molten hedge]

Rip

Combat right?

I’ve seen old clips of it

[outer sky]

?

What're you asking

[molten hedge]

Didn’t it used to be called Combat

The spec

[outer sky]

Yeah before Legion

[molten hedge]

Yeah I’ve watched old vids of it

[outer sky]

Yeah they've changed a lot of shit over the years

There used to be no guardian druid

It was just feral druid

And depending on your talent you could spec into taking damage or doing damage

Then blizzard eventually formalized that and made guardian its own spec

Thats why druids have 4 specs

[molten hedge]

So weird that it’s the only class with 4

[maiden gull]

shadowlands s3 outlaw was goted

so much fun

[outer sky]

They originally had 3 like everyone else but blizzard split feral into 2 specs

[outer sky]

I didnt play that season. I quit from SL S2 > DF S3 because of ret paladin

[maiden gull]

i sadly didnt play tww

missed the last good xpac as it seems

[outer sky]

People say this every xpac

"Games dead"
"Worst the games ever been"

Playerbase is never positive during current content

Then years later they look back on it favorably

Thats just how wow players are. Im numb to it

They definitely need to add some stuff back to classes though

[maiden gull]

nah

[outer sky]

They've pruned like this before

[maiden gull]

i think the pruning was to much

yeah in legion

and it was shit 😄

[outer sky]

Yeah but they added stuff back

[maiden gull]

mark may words: next xpac bortrowed powers come back

[outer sky]

And it got better

[gusty hedge]

[outer sky]

Idk if i have a problem with this tbh. I know a lot of players hate it and I understand that. But my experience is that the game gets much more interesting with borrowed power. Shit like triple maladict trinkets from BFA, or Breath of the Dying for 40% of someones hp. Or OP corruptions. Covenant abilities, etc

Triple maladict trinket in a smoke bomb was

Amazing gameplay

[maiden gull]

idk 😄

tbh

btw can some us guy report the outlaw bug in the forums?

[copper maple]

Hello everyone, haven't played retail since DF S1. Is there any relevant resource with CC categories and PvP durations?

[spring bough]

Is it timewalk this week

Do I level my orc warrior

And fury or arms

[molten hedge]

Not sure. Overall consensus is arms is better

[outer sky]

Actually yeah, check GladPush.gg. They have a Midnight Season 1 PvP toolkit, and the addon/guide shows CC abilities by DR category with durations and cooldowns. The CurseForge page says it covers Stun, Incapacitate, Disorient, Root, Silence, and Interrupt, and that spell IDs are checked against the live game client so stale/removed spells disappear. Blizzard’s official Midnight notes also confirm the current DR rule is 16 sec reset and immune after 2 casts in PvP.

https://www.gladpush.gg/dr-calculator

[outer sky]

Theyre both cracked

Arms is better thematically though

[spring bough]

Double 2H weps is more fun tho

For mogs at least lol

[outer sky]

Need 2 weapons to do what arms can do with 1

[outer sky]

@copper maple ignore this. It has outdated information

[copper maple]

Some things look out of date to me. Blind and Sap aren't 8 sec anymore and Between the Eyes hasn't been a stun for many expansions now I think.

[outer sky]

Yeah it is

For Midnight S1 the DR rule changed: same CC category goes full duration -> half duration -> immune, and DR resets after 16 sec. Categories are still basically roots, incaps, disorients, stuns, silences, knockbacks, and disarms.

Wowhead/Maxroll are probably the best public references for categories, but I wouldn’t trust them 100% for exact PvP durations right now. Some of the static tables are outdated. For exact durations I’d trust current in-game tooltips / spell data / Drustvar / Wago over a guide table.

@copper maple

[copper maple]

I tried looking for PvP durations on wowhead, never had any success. Don't see anything on the spell page of Blind for example.

[outer sky]

Yeah i dont think theres a clean, current resource for it unfortunately

[copper maple]

I think there was a whole website with everything about DRs, kinda weird nobody bothered keeping this stuff up-to-date.

[molten hedge]

There’s also only 2 DRs now. Full then half

There’s also universal DRs and they’re kinda cooked. Like stun is concussive shot

But you can change it if you want

[outer sky]

He means universal DR icons

[molten hedge]

Yeah

[outer sky]

Not actual universal DRs

[copper maple]

That's good cause fuck triple dr cheap shots (especially on orcs, when they're shorter than the GCD)

[molten hedge]

Yeah its funny

Bc they did it to reduce cc

And it’s actually more cc

Bc it resets after 16 seconds

[outer sky]

Leave it to blizzard to fuck up like that

[molten hedge]

Instead of 18

[copper maple]

Well last time I played was before the global cc purge, so I shouldn't be surprised 😆

[molten hedge]

[copper maple]

For the longest time I thought I'm not gonna play rogue with 5 seconds blind, but here I am, leveling my rogue as the first char in midnight.

[molten hedge]

It’s rough rn for rogues but maybe it gets better

Outlaw was fucking cranking but they nerfed it

[outer sky]

Kidney shot is now a 30 second cooldown btw

[deep dove]

!stats

[lethal roost]

These are the recommended stat priorities for each spec in PvP. Please keep in mind that having suboptimal stats on some pieces such as tier set pieces is not the end of the world.

• Assassination: Vers>Mastery>Haste>Crit
• Outlaw: Vers>Haste=/=Crit>Mastery
  You want to stack at least 20% Haste on Outlaw to lower the GCD during Adrenaline Rush. (25% for Trickster for energy)
• Subtlety: Vers>Haste to 200 OR 600-700>Mastery>Crit
  Sub now uses a haste threshold to extend Dance and shorten Secret Technique's CD.
  Sub haste rating chart:
  https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/316923898501529600/1483399511836725378/image.png?ex=69bc6d33&is=69bb1bb3&hm=21db8524f3add252a5f7556c91a39c6d076b5cbf29926a0ff3de6f1dad996660&

[copper maple]

I think that change with blind did nothing against proper setup comps with rogues, hurt BGs and world PvP rogue a lot more.

[copper maple]

Cheap shot on CD is diabolical tbh

[molten hedge]

They nerfed kidney before feral maim lol

But they also nerfed main

[outer sky]

Its horrendous

Worst change ever

[copper maple]

How does anyone play anything but sub with this change?

[molten hedge]

It was rly weird. They removed some cc like scatter and stuff. But other classes retained everything like Druid, lock, etc

Outlaw was doing ungodly dam so you didn’t even need all the stuns

Rip

[outer sky]

Long post inc

@copper maple

Best i could do

Midnight S1 PvP DR rule:
Same CC category = full duration -> half duration -> immune.
DR reset = 16 sec.

Not included here: slows, normal kicks, PvE-only CC, and cosmetic spell variants. Also, Between the Eyes is not a stun in current retail.

DISORIENT DR:
Blinding Sleet 4s
Sigil of Misery 3s
Cyclone 6s
Sleep Walk: disorient DR, check tooltip/current PvP value
Scare Beast: disorient DR, beast-only
Dragon’s Breath 4s
Blinding Light / Searing Glare 4s
Turn Evil 6s
Mind Control / Dominate Mind 6s
Psychic Scream 6s
Blind 5s
Fear / Howl of Terror 6s
Seduction 6s
Intimidating Shout 5s

INCAP DR:
Imprison 3s
Song of Chi-Ji: incap DR, check current tooltip
Hibernate 6s
Incapacitating Roar 3s
Time Stop: incap DR
Freezing Trap 6s
Scatter Shot 3s
Polymorph / Mass Polymorph / Ring of Frost 6s
Paralysis 3s
Repentance 6s if available
Shackle Undead 6s
Holy Word: Chastise 3s
Gouge 4s
Sap 6s
Hex 6s
Sundering: incap DR, short duration
Banish 6s
Mortal Coil 3s
Quaking Palm 4s

STUN DR:
Zombie Explosion / Reanimation 3s
Asphyxiate 3s
Gnaw / Monstrous Blow: stun DR
Chaos Nova 3s baseline, some DH talents can add +1s
Fel Eruption 3s
Illidan’s Grasp: stun DR
Maim 1–5s by combo points
Rake from stealth 4s
Mighty Bash 4s
Overrun / Wild Hunt’s Charge / Seismic Slam: stun DR
Binding Shot / Intimidation 3s
Leg Sweep 4s
Hammer of Justice 5s
Cheap Shot 4s, now has a 12s CD
Kidney Shot 1–5s by combo points
Capacitor Totem 3s
Lightning Lasso 5s channeled
Axe Toss / Grimoire Felguard 3s
Shadowfury 3s
Shockwave 3s
Storm Bolt 3s
War Stomp / Bull Rush / Haymaker share stun DR

ROOT DR:
Deathchill roots
Ice Prison
Entangling Roots 6s
Mass Entanglement 6s
Landslide 6s
Tracker’s Net
Frost Nova / Freeze
Freezing Cold / Frostbite
Void Tendrils
Disable
Earthgrab Totem 6s
Thunderstruck / Warbringer
Short roots of 2s or less often don’t DR, so check the exact spell.

SILENCE DR:
Strangulate
Sigil of Silence
Reactive Resin
Spider Sting / Spider Venom 3s
Wailing Arrow
Shield of Virtue
Priest Silence 4s in PvP
Garrote silence 3s
Unstable Affliction dispel silence 4s
Solar Beam is weird because DRList marks it as no DR, so I would not lump it in with normal silence DR without testing.

DISARM DR:
Dismantle 5s
Grapple Weapon 5s
Warrior Disarm 5s
Sticky Tar Bomb 4s
Faerie Swarm 5s

KNOCKBACK DR:
Gorefiend’s Grasp
Typhoon
Ursol’s Vortex
Upheaval
Bursting Shot
Hi-Explosive Trap / Implosive Trap
Blast Wave
Thunderstorm
Tail Swipe
Wing Buffet

[grave basin]

ithink there's a distinction between broken and OP

fury warrior might be OP but dev dh is broken

[outer sky]

I agree, buff assa

[grave basin]

akin to arcane mage pre prune where your only win con against them is to one bang them or they are completely untouchable as melee

[outer sky]

If assa is buffed then these dev DHs will be under control

[gusty hedge]

gonna need my cheap shot spam back asap.
Let me control the fight again

[outer sky]

Cheap shot spam + vanish back on restless blades + no PvP nerf on restless blades

[grave basin]

just join the party imo

scaryguyTM

[gusty hedge]

this would do nicely
but it would make me want more

give me crackshot or give me death

[outer sky]

Bro we didnt know how good we had it lmao

[gusty hedge]

Fr now that it's gone all you can do is reminisce

[grave basin]

shadowlands will enver come back

that level of "no one is OP if everyone is OP" gameplay is gone

[quick temple]

why is imp wound poison a thing

[gusty hedge]

already gave up on Dev Dh lvld got honor gear+ crafts, wasn't feeling it

[dark kernel]

Me next.

The blade master commeth

[potent pivot]

The bug does not matter that much whatsoever

[potent pivot]

? Yes you can

[spring bough]

lol

[spring bough]

So what’s ur warrior looking like so far

[potent pivot]

he is a fully geared champion

ready to smash noobs this morning

[outer sky]

Are you queueing 2s? Maybe you can end my streak

[potent pivot]

Idk what ima do yet

[dark moon]

Who you killing vs devourer preservation

[outer sky]

Depends

I bleed them both and eventually one of them has to trinket

Then I go whichever one trinkets

If they both dont have trinket

I go evoker to make him commune

Then i kill whichever one doesnt have trinket still for the next go

Vs dev dh/disc I just train the disc

[potent pivot]

you know how we were talking about pvp talents

like you thought arms had mostly good ones etc

[outer sky]

Ye

[potent pivot]

u kno what spec actually has good ones

fking pres

[outer sky]

Disc priest

Oh pres

Yeah

Commune is a crazy good pvp talent

[potent pivot]

i just read through them

[outer sky]

Plus kick/silence immune

[potent pivot]

like holy fk

[outer sky]

Big purge

[potent pivot]

i'm surprised no1 runs this

its like reverse of mage's shit

[halcyon timber]

Asking again for additional logs if people have them , doesn’t have to be “right now” but please DM me if interested- as a reminder

[outer sky]

Last xpac a lot of evokers complained that it would bug out a lot

Idk if it still does

[potent pivot]

ah

it sounds broken ngl

every 45sec you can return someone to low hp

[halcyon timber]

Considered an incapacitation right?

On DRs*

[potent pivot]

though i guess if u use it in a bad way it can be bad

[outer sky]

Nah its not CC

[potent pivot]

not listed as cc in the spelldata

[outer sky]

Its basically an alter time but on your terms

[halcyon timber]

Yeah , ive been meaning to run an aura scan to see what prints in 12.0.5

Ty for the additional intel

[molten hedge]

yea its like time stop can rly fuck u

but its funny in some com ps

swoop up can also be a meme

[halcyon timber]

Do we have a comprehensive list of spell IDs laying around here by any chance regarding CC lists - odd but important question

[molten hedge]

like swoop someone into a smoke bomb or fdk go

[potent pivot]

there are some older lists of CC linked in the pins i think

the very bottom pin

[halcyon timber]

Tracking, so I will have to compile a new data set and ill use that as reference

[potent pivot]

ill see if i can find something updated but i usually check every season and don't find any

[halcyon timber]

What ive been tracking so far is prints of multi IDs have changed client side (TWW to MN)

Doesn’t help a lot of things are turned off in bgs as that made retrieving easy to see from logs too

“Mass aggregates” , if you will

[potent pivot]

https://maxroll.gg/wow/resources/crowd-control-diminishing-returns

here

[halcyon timber]

Also, do we have a change log data set of tuning tracked all of Midnight so far or am I going to have to make a list (especially rogue stuff)

[potent pivot]

i think this is updated for midnight but you may have to double check

going to put it in the pins as well

[halcyon timber]

Yeah I will have to verify again just to be sure as this is being built from ground up

[potent pivot]

we have SOME

some stuff is shadow changed

especially bugs

[halcyon timber]

Anything to help expedite the process would be appreciated

[potent pivot]

https://drustvar.com/pvp-spells/rogue

it isn't updated i'm pretty positive

with the most recent changes

like

this is actually 60% now

as of this week

i think the site will likely update it on the .7 patch

since it was changed after .5

[halcyon timber]

Tracking and thank you, do we have an exhaustive list regarding other classes as ID changes / aura tuning in a compiled list as well? - if not, it is ok. Just have to start from ground up here.

[gusty hedge]

[spring bough]

I’m gonna rock the updated BWL asscandy 2hs when I level mine

[potent pivot]

don't think so

[spring bough]

Ooo the legion remix scytches would look cool on warrior too

[gusty hedge]

i've got like no 2 handers really

[halcyon timber]

Have a txt file of these available- or is this just from observations so far not documented by us yet?

[halcyon timber]

That’s ok, no sweat

[potent pivot]

the latter

the main one being improved bte

[halcyon timber]

Tracking, ill have to compile notes when i get a moment.

[potent pivot]

its supposed to inc bte crit dmg by 2.8, didn't work all season until this week, and now only inc by .5

RH has a list of base pve bugs

[spring bough]

[potent pivot]

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1e2w0iHBCVp8K7hdSk1T8RKtUK9lr4FsRqFWd68FCQnk/pubhtml?gid=579089422

sub bugs

i think the outlaw list is outdated

and i'm not sure where the assa list is atm

[halcyon timber]

That suggests that is desired expectation so bte isnt doing large amounts of damage I assume. Likely set around bte stacking for when “you do” have a large set amount of stacks I guess

[potent pivot]

yeah its just kinda unprofessional

[halcyon timber]

Little sneaky stuff like earthen shield for resto shaman giving a dr (i think is 3%) and if a druid is using improved Mark of the Wild for 6% versatility etc is important too. Ill have to dig into all of that too

[potent pivot]

the way they don't announce any of it

or change the pvp modifier on the tooltip/spelldata

etc

[outer sky]

The fact that we dont even know whats intended and whats bugged is ridiculous

[halcyon timber]

Yeah, hard to constantly track

Kinda like the memes when notes say “doesnt apply in pvp” and then people go “we will see about that”

Like Rets in DF heh

[potent pivot]

i would love to keep compiled lists of everything

just really don't have the time

[halcyon timber]

Yeah, ill have to build this slowly but I will try to keep an archive updated for us to reference.

Lots of notes so far and not a lot of time.

The positive thing about getting logs from you all who have is shuffle is getting me 6 sets of data from different classes and specs, it also removes bias around “perfect conditions”. Allows for a big timeline of data analysis

[potent pivot]

the only thing that stands out from something like this to me

how will you determine what is bugged/shadow changed etc

[gleaming sentinel]

[potent pivot]

like

say X talent effects X ability, but another bugged interaction entirely is causing that to be effected unintentionally etc

[halcyon timber]

Lots of deltas , comparing data sets, then off of what that data suggests form what I am calling an expected damage outcome model for pacing.

[quick temple]

lol new record

brains all over the floor

[potent pivot]

plz tell me ur not q'ing 3s with a tank bro

[quick temple]

shuff

[potent pivot]

ah

[spring bough]

Report that tank thanks

[maiden gull]

the bug does not matter when your first bte with all the zero in stacks doesn't go off with 3 additional cp? what? 😄 This is our whole "burst" which is left

does anyone even report the bugs in the us forum? 😄

[potent pivot]

do you really expect that to do anything

[spring bough]

This guy got jokes 😭

[maiden gull]

I mean, it makes Outlaw with super charger literally unplayable

But yeah

[potent pivot]

no, it doesn't

lmao

[maiden gull]

When at 45% your first bte with super charger does Not Work?

Or do understand it wrong?

[potent pivot]

correct

[maiden gull]

And you don't think that is big of a deal?

[potent pivot]

nope

[maiden gull]

Sus

[potent pivot]

i think you are a bit misinformed

you see where it says its only a 2% dps loss, yes?

[maiden gull]

Eli5 then pls

Yeah, in total

[potent pivot]

you see that, right?

ok

[maiden gull]

But i want my burst

[potent pivot]

now

[maiden gull]

Working

[potent pivot]

i have something to tell you

[gusty hedge]

[potent pivot]

BtE is nerfed by 40 fucking percent

compared to pve

[maiden gull]

Yeah 😄 need to revert the nerf but i think they will let it be for the Rest of the xpac as usual

[potent pivot]

this is an overall dps loss of less than 1% for us

i also don't see this bug lasting very long at all

but reporting bugs on the forums

is kind of a joke

[maiden gull]

So we Just need to pray they (or the AI) finds it by themselves?

[potent pivot]

just because you don't see it or know about it, does not mean nothing is happening

[maiden gull]

That sounds like religion

[halcyon timber]

Honest question: Are you fatebound or Trickster and are you using that BTE dry (no stacks of bte / flawless form / coin stacks etc)

[maiden gull]

fatebound, i pull AR when i have 6 bullet up the sleeve for double BTE most of the time

trickster before nerf just 5 stacks of flawless and lets go

[halcyon timber]

Tracking and thank you, happen to know what coin stacks you are generally at, stacks of bte pre built as well? Non inflammatory questions- just asking.

[spring bough]

https://x.com/snupytv/status/2052408625558151457?s=46&t=YKaisWqFkCTf8y-DfuEaHw

Snupy (@snupytv)

Midnight season 1 PvP tier list with a focus on solo shuffle ⚔️

X · May 7, 2026, 3:22 PM

This gotta be a rage bait tier list

[potent pivot]

rdru in B so yes

arms not in S

[wanton breach]

i have no clue whats the meta healer atm

but rdruid feels insanely strong

[potent pivot]

for shuffle they all work fine tbh

but for 3s its basically all pres/rdru

[wanton breach]

druids scare me in shuffle