pvp

[vocal surge]

3 Head Coins during Lucky Coin means +27% all damage

[sharp sierra]

is sub really strong just in prepatch or is it looking good at 90 too so far

obviously that can change with tuning, but im wondering with all the stats we have is why were good. once we hit 90, are we shit?

so close...

[dark kernel]

Sub is the only spec doing actually okay at 90 so our eggs are kind of in that basket

[sharp sierra]

does assass just scale good which is why its bad in prepatch?

[potent pivot]

scaling is kind of a meme these days

[sharp sierra]

ah then how did asass go from amazing in tww s3 to bad

[potent pivot]

rework

tuning also just nonexistent for prepatches

[sharp sierra]

gotcha

ty sir

[wanton breach]

probably best time to do it right now, winds of fortune + DMF reputation buffs

[sharp sierra]

Yup done 9 hrs so far

Should be done tomorrow

[exotic dove]

So after a few hours of beta I still dont see a point in playing assa. I dont mind the energy pooling play style but damage is not at the point I would play it over Sub.

They still havent fixed Deathstalker

And on prepatch not that prepatch balance matters but Assa is even worse there lol

Sub is really fun on prepatch though

I might have been too spoiled in TWW because I really liked being able to play assa and sub together with them being equally strong in their own way

[potent pivot]

as long as they tune the damage i think it will be alright

personally i'm kinda excited for the energy managment envenom playstyle to make a comeback

i think the only thing they need to address is the amount of cc they took away from assa/outlaw with the reworks

[gusty hedge]

BBframes and BBplates work for me but plates dnt work on enemy, using platynator for enemy plates, it does affect friendly nameplates too but mainly fonts and name sizes

[spring bough]

Ready for the season to start

[indigo hill]

I've been reading that assa is mostly just waiting for energy to regenerate. Is it really that slow now?

[wanton breach]

https://tenor.com/view/always-has-been-among-us-astronaut-space-betrayal-gif-23836476

Honestly, apm feels equal to before the prepatch

Less aoe energy farming is different

[gusty hedge]

wtb shot in the dark, wtb damage buff

[spring bough]

outlaw there?

[gusty hedge]

outlaw only wont touch other specs

[spring bough]

swap that dagger MH and spec sub for a couple games lol

[gusty hedge]

i have this disdain for sub that i just cannot

[spring bough]

its some ez stuff rn. hit your CD, shadow strike once then finisher and rinse repeat lol

aent nothing to it lol

[gusty hedge]

facts and that's another reason i dont play meta or ez on go classes now if we're talking pre killing spree rogue id play sub hemo all day

if its rogue its outlaw 1000% nothing else ima true rogue hater to anyone thats not outlaw

[gleaming sentinel]

I played 2 sub games and fell asleep

[spring bough]

it dumps dmg rn tho lol

fun times to pass the time till season 1

Death and Taxes guild is still around? crazy lol

[gusty hedge]

think blizzard damage meter is busted lol

[outer sky]

Yes

Shot in the Dark needs to be moved to the class tree IMO

[spring bough]

bro found a wound poison bug XD

[exotic dove]

Yeah that is the issue I have been having I will check out platynator thanks

[sharp sierra]

You get your cloak?

[spring bough]

ive got like 4 hours left

[sharp sierra]

I still have like 4 hrs left

Hahaha same

Stopped at 4k last night

[outer sky]

Lmfao wtf is Outlaw rogue why am I spawning tumbleweeds

I thought outlaw was supposed to be a pirate. Now we're wild west cowboys?

[stoic spruce]

It hasn't been a pirate since bfa

[wanton breach]

https://tenor.com/view/loki-loki-series-bit-of-both-loki-clip-tom-hiddleston-gif-21748514

[exotic dove]

I did my beta duties and put my feedback for both Sub and Assa in the beta forums Rogue thread. If the Devs read it hopefully the fix Deathstalker and either buff energy regen or damage for Assa.

[wanton breach]

oh sweet summer child

[keen canopy]

real video of the devs reading it

[spring bough]

Outlaw is an outlaw lol

[sharp sierra]

Well technically the term outlaw would be for a cowboy…

[exotic dove]

Yeah they wont be reading it and I will be playing only Sub this expac lol

[sharp sierra]

I can’t get over this 16 second blind it’s so fun

[outer sky]

Yeah plus you can kidney>blind>sap every kidney and you get crazy uptime on blackjack

[gusty hedge]

An outlaw is a person deprived of the protection of the law, historically often banished or declared "outside" legal protection, allowing them to be killed without consequence

Cant even log into wow anymore lol only game that just endless loading and if i do get int 9kms home world rip done for

[molten hedge]

There’s a bug rn where you can dance 3 times in starting gates and supercharge 6 points

[drowsy bear]

heyho, I quit after shadowlands and coming back now for PvP

waht are current good ressources for Rotations / playstyle / talents?

[spring bough]

finally upgrading my wifi router to wifi 7 and setting up a mesh network with this starlink im setting up lol

[abstract stratus]

Anyone find a way to show cooldown count with a decimal kinda like omnicc did?

[drowsy bear]

my CC (Kidney, CS, Sap etc...) isnt showing in PvP, I have big debuffs on enemy nameplates on

somebody know what im missing?

[potent pivot]

This has been around forever

[potent pivot]

Wowhead pve guides can show you the basic rotations, you just have to mix in CC where applicable

[drowsy bear]

ty

[potent pivot]

There’s some basic talents in the pins here, can also check murlok.io after the season actually starts

[molten hedge]

Oh I thought it went away good to know

[potent pivot]

Idk if it does now or not

You used to be able to do it with symbols a while back

[molten hedge]

Yeah it works with dance now

Have you ever played sub destro trickz

[potent pivot]

not recently that i can remember

been mostly sub/assa aff in recent times when it comes to lock

[molten hedge]

Ahh ok. I’m going to play with one of my friends this ssn and he’s considering destro. I understand there’s no like guarantees or specific way to play it. But on avg is it better for me to cc the healer or the dps? I only ask bc sometimes locks have a hard time ccing healers bc they can’t always be out of range of their port

[potent pivot]

Typically both

Like blind/sap/cheap healers, kidney/cheap kill targets, gouge can kinda be used for whatever if we’re playing it. Shirt blind seems very strong rn though so I doubt we play gouge if it stays this way.

[livid grove]

Anyone use the new nameplates? I cant get the name plate to display defuffs and CC in WPvP. Am I missing something? All the settings seem like I have them set correctly.

[potent pivot]

World PvP a bit scuffed

Everything works in instanced pvp

[livid grove]

AH

[spring bough]

i need like 1600 more market research i have been slacking for this black trenchcoat lol

[molten hedge]

Yeah the short blind is absolutely amazing. I love it

[potent pivot]

Yeah if they leave it that way it’ll be a big help with the amount of cc lost

I have a feeling that it isn’t working as intended tho

The 80% duration reduction is nerfed by 50% in pvp

So it’s a 40% duration reduction

[molten hedge]

Yeah we were talking about that the other day. It is kinda odd

[spring bough]

AOE blind with blackjack where it’s at

Hope it doesn’t get the nerf stick for the whole xpack lol

But I’ve already had people be like “how many GD blinds do rogues have now?” So I can already hear the forum posts

[sharp sierra]

so...fucking...close

[spring bough]

Don’t forget the DMF buff

U might already have enough lol

[sharp sierra]

nah i need 5.3 with dmf

[spring bough]

How?

It’s 4200 without dmf

[sharp sierra]

what

are you sure?

for the cloak?

also got this

[spring bough]

4200 research for exalted without DMF should be like 3780 with DMF

[sharp sierra]

wtf all the groups have been saying 5.3k

[spring bough]

Go get that buff. Buy them boxes and start clicking. U prob got it

If u don’t just go back to farming for like 30 min lol

[spring bough]

Cloak is like 3750 resonance crystals too

[rare vector]

what is this

[sharp sierra]

i got the crystals

[sharp sierra]

darkfuse cloak farm

darkfuse lowdown cloak

[rare vector]

oh nice, thought its something from pre xpac event

[outer sky]

Losing gouge sucks though

We should get Disarm Trap back

[potent pivot]

LOLLL

[potent pivot]

Short blind low key op

[spring bough]

AOE blinding in shuffle every 16 seconds as trickster outlaw is pretty funny

it wins games ngl lol

[outer sky]

Oh yeah I agree. Even if you dont get the sap off of it, you still get 8s of CC every 30s with kidney+blind and also giga uptime on Blackjack

I always felt like blackjack was such an underwhelming talent but short blind makes it feel really good

[rare vector]

will there be honor and conq reset before Midnight?

[exotic dove]

Yeah with what Zicore and NoTrickz have said the trade of not having gouge is worth it

with blackjack

as sub its insane

[potent pivot]

Ye

[potent pivot]

Ye

[rare vector]

@potent pivotdamn...thanks

[gleaming sentinel]

any happen to know why my personal resource display is off to the left?

[potent pivot]

Because

I remember seeing somewhere that some addon fixes it but I can’t remember if it was BBF/BBP or

[outer sky]

BBP makes my PRD completely invisible

[spring bough]

Maybe it’ll be fixed by launch lol

[potent pivot]

There are some custom ui elements floating around also that replace it @gleaming sentinel

I think awang from #outlul made one

Basically just looks almost like a WeakAura for hp/energy/combo points iirc

[vocal surge]

How every class handles Devourer's 1 shot burst

https://tenor.com/view/cringe-gif-24107071

Outlaw:

https://tenor.com/view/metal-gear-rising-raiden-senator-armstrong-punching-indomitable-gif-14166479420035208375

Feint + Crimson Vial go brrr

or could just pop Evasion + Cloak of Shadow

[gleaming sentinel]

Think I got it figured out. Now just need my roll the bones and bladeflurry to be next to combo pts….

[sharp sierra]

IM FREEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE

[sharp sierra]

mfers on my server charging 60k for the tux pants xD

looks so much better on dh xD

[spring bough]

DH stealing rogue swag 😭

[gilded gulch]

just use the bracers

[sharp sierra]

whats the name?

[gilded gulch]

astral glad

for bracers

works better if using coat imo

[grave basin]

Wait tux pants are boe?

[spring bough]

You can AH them yeah

[grave basin]

Sheeeeeeeet

[sharp sierra]

theres one server i saw on undermine that has them for 16k i think

im too lazy

[grave basin]

Switching from cow to orc dk made my enjoyment skyrocket

Fuck cows

[sharp sierra]

ahhh i see thank you

[gilded gulch]

or just wait till april/get the necrolord pants

[sharp sierra]

is the head peice youre wearing the engi goggles?

[gilded gulch]

vision

might use the pringles bowtie for shits

honestly people who force engi goggles into mogs that dont suit them are so cringe....

[sharp sierra]

i kinda want something like this for head piece

im gonna search around cause the googles look a bit goody on undead

on second thought....

[gilded gulch]

might as well go no gloves

[potent pivot]

why cow catchin strays damn

[sharp sierra]

what is causing blind to be aoe? I had it happen without even having blade fury up

[outer sky]

@hazy monolith your addon resets to arena frames and also resets the size and positioning of the nameplate DRs every time I log out and in

[sharp sierra]

is the tool tip not saying it im confused

[outer sky]

ya

it also makes it AOE

[sharp sierra]

oh gotcha

seems pallys are still rough to fight but i slammed a sub/dk

so much fucking healing

[outer sky]

MW is the most broken healer on live

[sharp sierra]

havent fought one yet

are they back to doing fistweaving?

[outer sky]

some but not all

theyre immune to death

[hazy monolith]

already working on a fix,thx for noting

[soft siren]

that glow in hands?

[potent pivot]

its crazy people just can't play the game without this shit

dogshit

Apparently someone was making a new omnicd and had to stop developing it because it was considered an exploit

Hopefully we see more of that

[jolly sierra]

i need to know when tf guys are using their cds tbh

the animations are silly in some defensives

[potent pivot]

There’s multiple places these things show already though right

I’m specifically talking about the “WeakAura” in the middle of the screen not the other stuff

[jolly sierra]

ye i used WA like that lol

[potent pivot]

ye i think thats one of the main things they should keep out of the game

[lime oar]

more playing game

less playing UI

[jolly sierra]

i just wonder if my stuff still exist tbh

like the
gladiatorlosa
gladius
weakauras tracking both my auras, dots and enemy stuff
toptarget
bigdebuff

there is some shit like that still?

[lime oar]

i don’t think tracking enemy cd’s and blasting it over ur screen is necessary. just press wall 🤯

the other teams won’t have it either so it’s to your advantage anyway if u can play well without it

[potent pivot]

weakauras and the omni addons are the only main things that are gone

for gladius you just use "sArena updated by sammers"

it has the a gladius layout and a bicmex/gladius layout etc

i think gladiatorlosa is gone

not sure

[wanton breach]

100%

[jolly sierra]

ye, gotta get used tho

do you think does it worth to practise the spec in prepatch or just wait until week 0 to start?

[wanton breach]

it's not worth waiting imo, some things and tunings will change but if you can get practice now you might have an edge on expansion launch

[potent pivot]

the overall designs will stay the same, the only problem is balance is rly bad rn

u can still kinda practice to get used to the rotations n stuff

certain things will just be diff like sub won't be blowing people up, assa won't feel as bad, etc

as always just play if u wanna play rly

[gusty hedge]

wtb outlaw talent changes

[vocal surge]

For what?

[jolly sierra]

gotta practise in skirmishes then

[spring bough]

Groundhog saw his shadow. Six more weeks of winter 😭

[gusty hedge]

talents are shit but thats my opinion

[glad zinc]

Question for outlaw, should I save kidney shot for kill target or to cc healer? When should I be using BTE and Killing spree?

[vocal surge]

BTE for damage stacks, Killing Spree to trade CCs from enemy team or if the target is solo, drop their health bar

[outer sky]

Top target is gone 😞

[molten hedge]

Ik there’s addons that show who is on what target but it’s on ur enemy unit frames. Sarena does it and ik theres other addons. It’s not the same but works. Also idk how ppl play with top target that shit is an eyesore 🤣

[spring bough]

Top target and Don’tCast GG to some of the best 🪦

[jolly sierra]

noooooooo

[jolly sierra]

fuck, toptarget had a lot of potential for a brand new addon

[outer sky]

I mostly used it in BGs to see who everyone is on in team fight

[molten hedge]

Valid

[grave basin]

wait so is this what i think it is

how is this possible

holy faq

there;s no shot this survives till start of s1 right

literally this is one of the reasons why our addons had to be nuked in thefirst place

would be unseen levels of incompetance if it does

[dark kernel]

You love to see it

[grave basin]

we are only ONE

o n e

more addition to get back to tww status

teammates cds

im sure some sweatlord like mvq is gonna find a way

id be embarassed as fuck if i were blizzard

[dark kernel]

Its happening!

[potent pivot]

Who do you think did that

[stoic spruce]

Yo mama

Oooooooooo

[spring bough]

Bro why u selling it out already 😭

[grave basin]

streamers are already showing it off

[spring bough]

Can this addon tell me when BOP is active yet

Need DontCast back

[grave basin]

dont think so

[spring bough]

Spy addon for PvP is updated

Wonder if it works the same

[marsh blaze]

Hello, noob outlaw question. Is there any reason to not have a dagger in the offhand?

[spring bough]

https://www.curseforge.com/wow/addons/sweepyboops-pvp-helper
“omni bar like” 👀

[potent pivot]

Nope, doesn’t matter for outlaw really

[spring bough]

Running sword/dag as outlaw this season for the easy swap to sub 😎

[potent pivot]

That shouldn’t be working rn

That feature I mean

[spring bough]

Gonna try it out later see what it’s about

[potent pivot]

At this point I don’t think it does anything your other 15 addons aren’t already doing

[grave basin]

Sweepyboops not very relevant now yea

[gusty hedge]

updated! with limitations of course

[spring bough]

Saw something that said all the ram that’s gonna be produced in 2026 is already sold to AI companies 😭

[potent pivot]

some companies ye

other companies are beginning to step into more of the pc part market to make up for the shortage tho

hopefully prices return to normal later this year

[marsh blaze]

anyone got a decent outlaw pvp spec for BGs/WPVP?

[vocal surge]

POV: You're a Devourer Demon Hunter fighting an Outlaw Rogue

[static holly]

It's an deal between OpenAI and Samsung if I'm not wrong, where they have an exclusive deal and get 40% of the ram stock they produce

[dark moon]

how do you guys farm darkfuse rep? i went to the mob farming spot with the prototype auto advertiser and goblin fuel and nothing drops?

[molten hedge]

For the lowdown coat? U gotta pick up trash lmao

I heard there was a bug where you loot one thing from each pile but not the thing that gives you rep or whatever it is (it’s been a while since I’ve done it). And once you loot all the piles but leave that item, they don’t disappear and they reset every 2-3 mins after that for you to endlessly farm faster. But idk they may have patched it

[empty copper]

is there a build for outlaw that hits hard

like i feel like i do 0 damage

[sharp sierra]

took me about 16 hrs

[spring bough]

Trash pile farming. All day. Everyday

[sharp sierra]

only trash farming works now

[spring bough]

Trash pile farming is the fastest

[sharp sierra]

i feel bad for anyone next expac and in the future that tries to solo that shit

[spring bough]

12-15 research a pile and it’s like what 3-4 min each pile?

[empty copper]

this is the build im playing but i feel like im doing 0 damage

[sharp sierra]

get rid of gouge

[spring bough]

Wait till legacy then just buy the rep tokens with timewalk badges lol

[sharp sierra]

embrace the blind meta

[spring bough]

For fatebound outlaw I would drop KS and put that point into summarily dispatched so you have 2/2

I’d also flip verse into the other node for the extra builder dmg

[spring bough]

Then you don’t have to worry about KS being CCd and mst of ur dmg is in builders/dispatch and BTE

[empty copper]

my friend said he got 1 tapped by outlaw as mw monk in blitz

so im trying to find that build

[spring bough]

Flip the verse node to the sinister one too

And then for trickster all you change is 2/2 summarily dispatched to 1/2 and pickup KS

[sharp sierra]

i oddly feel like i get way more BTE procs with trickster

but FB more fun

[spring bough]

He could have been trickster and lined up full KS with a 2nd KS and back to back adrenaline

[empty copper]

yeah he got KS

thats what he said

[spring bough]

Trickster is a lil ahead but if KS gets CCd u stuck till it’s back lol

I’m liking FB with the more passive

FB also only 3% behind or so not by much

[empty copper]

sorry can you be more specific i dont know outlaw so much compare to sub

get rid of node that gives versatility

[spring bough]

The node all the way to the right is versatility. Flip it to the sinister builder one

[empty copper]

if i understood

[spring bough]

It’s a choice node

[empty copper]

done

[spring bough]

Now you get a ton more sinister/pistol damage

Opp procs from that too

[sharp sierra]

im new to outlaw and honestly iuve gotten used to the idea that im not here for big burst

im here to make sure you are always taking damage and getting cc'd

[empty copper]

apperantly outlaw can hit as hard as sub if played right so

i like that kind of gameplay

[spring bough]

AOE blind with outlaw every time its up on kill target

Just spam that shit lol

Try to line it with an interrupt

[sharp sierra]

yeah aoe blind is so fucking fun

[spring bough]

And a stun

And you cooking

[sharp sierra]

its seperate dr right?

[spring bough]

Like interrupt into a blind into a kidney

[spring bough]

From stun? Yeah

[sharp sierra]

if you get super lucky with bte procs sure but i wouldnt expect it

its nowhere near sub

sub is in a league of its own

[spring bough]

Try to prep when adrenaline falling off and BTE is on CD

Then rip prep, adrenaline, into a hopeful BTE spam

[sharp sierra]

are the two talents on the far left better than the right for FB?

where SS generates 1 more point

cause i do this

[spring bough]

Don’t do that for now I believe mint is still bugged with prepatch won’t be fixed till midnight patch

[sharp sierra]

[spring bough]

Best bet for prepatch with FB

[sharp sierra]

i cant wait for gravedigger

[spring bough]

Mint makes AA numbers decrease with a bug lol

[sharp sierra]

gravedigger with supercharge

[spring bough]

Auto attack*

[sharp sierra]

is gonna be fun

bet thanks

[empty copper]

what stats should i run to hit hard

haste?

wait

trickster for KS build?

[spring bough]

Yeah you need KS for trickster

So I just use the same FB build but take 1 point from summarily dispatched to KS

[spring bough]

Prob want around 30% haste for outlaw lol

[stoic spruce]

25% for fatebound

trickster wants more to make up for energy lost playing trickster

[spring bough]

Just went from a WiFi 5 router to a WiFi 7 and it’s like a whole new world

[keen canopy]

just logged onto the mw monk im leveling and what the hell is going on

[tulip thunder]

is the DS cdr on sectech still bugged? thought it was hotfixed

[dark kernel]

I legit think that was fixed in the last hotfix update

For live servers

[spring bough]

That’s good they did something lol

[molten hedge]

W DH changes

https://www.wowhead.com/news/pvp-class-tuning-coming-on-the-weekly-reset-devourer-dh-tuning-380243

[keen canopy]

but does this apply to void-scarred as well for dev dh or just fel-scarred

[molten hedge]

They nerfed the one shot

thats all u needa know pop

[keen canopy]

like the dev note makes it seem like it does but the actual change doesnt

[molten hedge]

https://klipy.com/gifs/mcjuggernuggets-chillout

[keen canopy]

and it seems like they also kinda nerfed collapsing star, and correct me if im wrong but wasnt that spell already super garbage in pvp

ive never even seen a dev dh manage to successfully cast that spell before

in a real game

[spring bough]

Another day closer to early release

[potent pivot]

The trickster talent should be fixed

[tulip thunder]

swapping between it & flashing steel my cdr stays static @ 20 sec idk

[potent pivot]

Not sure, but even without the CDR that talent is better iirc

The ds one gives more procs

[tulip thunder]

yea steel is kinda gamba anyway

i just dont get why the tooltip doesnt reflect the ds hotfix

[potent pivot]

Tooltips can be very funky when it comes to CDR

Maybe the hotfix for it wasn’t pushed though idk, I’ll try to check

[grave basin]

that's because theyre all fel scarred

no one is playing ahniliator and they dont even have it talented

but post hotfixes a few days ago you can for sure cast stars

[sharp sierra]

I have tried and tried to cast starts but I swear if I can barely do it on dummies I couldn’t even imagine having to do it in a arena

The spec is fun as hell id consider playing it more if it had like 2 more buttons

[grave basin]

on dummies i can get around 2 per void meta

and i have really low haste

like 15%

[keen canopy]

even if they used it i dont think its good at all

damage is kinda whatever for the amount of effort

and they're nerfing the damage of it next patch? i mean surely it wont be good

[tulip thunder]

@outer sky god damn

[outer sky]

sorry lol

[vocal surge]

Outlaw Rogue healing go brrr

[vocal surge]

I managed to DC a hunter

by hitting him with the blind speecial

after he tried to boomstick me

and disengage

[sharp sierra]

being able to blind hunters during aim shot is so fucking fun 😭

[outer sky]

This comp is fun

https://youtu.be/T45yUuuXStQ

[potent pivot]

ye hopefully its a good comp when season goes lives

would be nice having another comp that goes well with rogue

[outer sky]

I think it'll be really good but the question will be how good of a comp will it be for the DH

Like last season I swear MM thug was good

But why would any hunter play that

When they could play cupid

Or hunt/DK

This shit was so much fun though

Sending the 1st DH go with a dance to get a trinket

Then bombing to kill with the next DH go and blades

[grave basin]

[outer sky]

Mini CC looks buggy to me

[grave basin]

how so

anyway it's in its infancy

[exotic dove]

I really really despise the new DR tracker icons

ALso the chances Deathstalker won't get fixed by the time Midnight releases is high

[outer sky]

The CD tracker at the top of the screen shows a CD then the icon for it disappears and sometimes reappears randomly while the CD is still up

[outer sky]

You can change them

[potent pivot]

i'm reporting all weakaura users for cheating, RMT, treason and war crimes

[outer sky]

Id be so embarrassed if I was a blizzard dev rn

[grave basin]

thing is everything minicc is doing

is within blizzard's intended api

so it's hard to say if blizzard wants this to even happen

it's just taking w/e "important buffs" api blizzard has and blowing it up on the screen

[exotic dove]

what how?

[grave basin]

hacks

gameshark

[potent pivot]

https://x.com/sammers_wow/status/2016193488686088460

Sammers (@sammers_wow)

Just released the DR changer program allowing to do that without touching the files. The used icons are upscaled `Clean-Icons-Mechagnome-Edition` icons

You can download it from: https://t.co/wBushe3BJA

The project is open source.

X · Jan 27, 2026, 4:56 PM

[exotic dove]

Thank God the stun DR basically being the Concussive shot slow icon was getting old fast lol

[outer sky]

We're going to end up right back where we started and its going to happen very fast. Its been basically no time since the patch hit and we're already more than half way there. I dont even think blizzard can stop it

[potent pivot]

either you manually change the icon .tga files (which changes that icon for everything across the entire game) or you get this outside program ig

[exotic dove]

oh its not on curseforge?

[potent pivot]

they literally said they would do this btw

[outer sky]

Do what?

[potent pivot]

that they would loosen the restrictions as time goes on based on feedback

[potent pivot]

idts

[outer sky]

Have they loosened them? I thought this was the exact same API that hit with pre patch

[potent pivot]

yes, they have

[outer sky]

Is that in writing anywhere? I was arguing with a friend of mine about that and he was saying theyre too stubborn to loosen the restrictions

[potent pivot]

the tweet got posted here

[exotic dove]

Won't be long until we see addons saying Deathmark is on your target BOP him now or Sub Rogue pressed Blades do something LUL

[outer sky]

Thats already a thing

[potent pivot]

https://x.com/luckyone961/status/2016231456977154134?s=46&t=YKaisWqFkCTf8y-DfuEaHw

Luckyone (@Luckyone961)

Blizzard announced improvements to the aura filter API for tomorrows beta build!
Filter for CROWD_CONTROL
Filter for BIG_DEFENSIVE
Filter to just show dispellable auras
Filter for "raid flagged" auras in combat (this one means mostly just Hots and Shields, no more bloat)

X · Jan 27, 2026, 7:26 PM

[exotic dove]

Ah see was out before official release

[outer sky]

^

[potent pivot]

i think these things go too far

wouldn't be surprised if they are renuked

[exotic dove]

I hope so I remember making a non deathmark build and succeeding wiht it against pallies in shuffle up to 2200 because they refused to bop unless deathmark was present and let their teamate die

or not making using

[outer sky]

I didnt play deathmark until assa swapped fatebound

Dragons never pressing caut lol

[exotic dove]

yeah Dragons too

[outer sky]

People are such trash lol

[exotic dove]

If there was no dragons or pallies though I did press it

but it was lackluster in Deathstalker only fatebound made it really something

[outer sky]

I think pressing into pallies is fine

Deathmark for bop

You got the better end of that deal

[grave basin]

holy fucking based

[exotic dove]

This is true but I had a unhealthy addiction to seeing a pally let his partner die with BoP still available

after 2200 though they got smarter and I did use DM for bop

[outer sky]

Big L on blizzards part for not making them customizable from the get go

[grave basin]

yea i love having my hunter's concussive shot showing cheap shot

or kidney

[exotic dove]

Yeah what in the world made them say "oh hey lets use concussive shot icon for the Stun DR" like people would like it

[outer sky]

I think most people like to have a single "universal" icon to represent each DR school even if the class theyre currently playing doesnt have a CC with that icon

Like on my rogue, stun is kidney but I still use sheep for poly, not sap

And fear for disorient, not blind

That way every class you play you can associate the same icon with the same set of DRs

[outer sky]

Its hard to strike the proper middle ground between not displaying enough information and this kind of thing

Because like, people should know when CDs are being used right

I think most people agree with that

But at what point is it too much handholding

I think anything audible is too far and also anything that tells you what to do in response to something is also too far like "X is used. Use Y now"

[potent pivot]

ye but at this point they're already on the screen like twice for most people, this is adding a 3rd and ridiculous display so that the addon can just play the game for you

i'm not opposed to BigDebuffs or highlighting buffs on target frames, but the 'weakaura' style shit is just too far imo

if that exists, anyone can go in and change the text to say "use defensive" or w/e they want

or if its something you want to respond to with BOP for example, "bop X target"

it just becomes too much of a slippery slope when you start adding these mid-screen pop ups

[outer sky]

Yeah I dont really disagree with any of that

One problem im having right now is I dont even know what's being done by an addon and what's being done by the base UI

[grave basin]

next update just pushed

[potent pivot]

almost everything you NEED to play the game rn is done by the base UI

[outer sky]

Like theres this buff that priests get sometimes thats like a null shroud and I cant fucking see it and I waste CC into it all the time

[grave basin]

the 2nd plane has his the towers

so now enemy cd on nameplates

[potent pivot]

is that when they get used, or an actual countdown tho

[outer sky]

Send us a SS

[grave basin]

enemy cd flashing big on the screen

[potent pivot]

they already had to stop making a new omniCD because it was an "exploit"

so i'm thinking that this isn't an actual timer

just the icon when it gets used

[outer sky]

Idk about you but I dont think seeing your own teams CDs was a problem

I think that should come back

[grave basin]

when they get ysed

used

[outer sky]

Especially when shuffle is thr most played bracket

I should be able to see what my healer has

[potent pivot]

i think its better for 3s/2s that they don't show

shuffle makes it a weird topic

[potent pivot]

and it doesn't start counting down it's cooldown, correct?

[grave basin]

nope

[potent pivot]

[outer sky]

Not yet*

[grave basin]

waiting for the 3rd plane

[outer sky]

My prediction is blizzard will cave to the casters and allow a kick tracker. Then that will slowly get expanded to include more and more shit

[potent pivot]

i don't think that will ever happen

[outer sky]

I mean i hope you're right but the casters are PMSing over not being able to track kicks

So I can see that coming

And once that happens

Theres your slippery slope

[potent pivot]

you know what they need to do?

[grave basin]

keep in mind all this is gonna come with 12.0.1

[outer sky]

Count?

[potent pivot]

git

gud

[outer sky]

Yeah but idk if blizzard will see it that way

[outer sky]

Not a fan of the healer in cc sound effects

We dont need anymore air horns going off

The only sound alerts should be the ones that are built into the game

Like when someone gets sheeped they go "Baaaaa"

Thats your audio alert that your healer is in CC

[sharp sierra]

The 1 shot build for ddh is getting nerfed tomorrow

[outer sky]

Theres tuning?

https://www.bluetracker.gg/wow/topic/us-en/2244188-pvp-tuning-incoming-february-3/

Yep

[sharp sierra]

https://eu.forums.blizzard.com/en/wow/t/pvp-tuning-incoming-4-february/605031

[outer sky]

Wow that posted late

[grave basin]

@outer sky @potent pivot

im pretty sure it looks like this

the priest has DA popped

[outer sky]

I dont even see the DA icon

[grave basin]

actually it's void form

da got pruned

but you get what i mean

[outer sky]

That looks kind of confusing

Its mixed up with the ferals own stuff

[grave basin]

i mean if i can find a clip against a warrior popping avatar it will look really obvious

huh

it;s the icon to the left

the icon with 6 ticking down

the purple dot is moonfire

[outer sky]

Oh I thought it was tje middle one lol

Ok thats better

[grave basin]

rogue with blades up

[outer sky]

I think blizzards base UI already shows this.

I know i can see blades

Next to the nameplate

[grave basin]

really?

[outer sky]

Ye

[grave basin]

interesting

i saw him against a warrior with a big avatar symbol

and a sv with takedown

[outer sky]

heres an SS from me fighting another rogue. I don't have an addon for it but you can see the blades icon with a timer to the left of his nameplate

[grave basin]

yea so minicc isnt exploiting anything

it's just showing what blizzard already lets you see anyway

[outer sky]

DK has IBF popped

But the miniCC ones are definitely better visually

Wtf has this game turned into

https://worldofwarcraft.blizzard.com/en-us/news/24246295/introducing-azeroth-interiors

Fucking

Housing World Championships

Winners featured on Zillow lol

[potent pivot]

ye this isn't what i was talking about

they tried to make a new omnicd and had to stop because it was an 'exploit'

[outer sky]

For you guys that have been playing pvp longer than me, has there ever been a season where sub was the strongest rogue spec throughout the entire season? From legion onward

[potent pivot]

I think in legion

Shadowlands

Hmm

Idr anything about bfa meta I think rogue was just bad

All I remember is pika/whaazz were playing warrior then or something

Oh TWW as well

Ofc

[dark moon]

I don't remember sub being ret/mm levels of strong without getting nerfed next week (sometimes next day)

Cause whenever its broken it gets demolished to the ground. Took them ret paladins in df 3-4 nefs in a span of a few weeks and was still strong afterwards

With rogue specs its always been demolished to the state of rerolling

I wonder why they let assa being that one-shotty last season. Maybe cause the meta was like that, but can't be certain

[potent pivot]

There’s almost always people that stick to sub and make it work

[dark moon]

Of course

Avidance is the goat

[potent pivot]

I think the diff pvp brackets cause some bias when having this kind of conversation as well

Like sub might be the best in 3s but people won’t touch it especially in shuffle

[dark moon]

Yeah

But generally if a spec is op its used everywhere

[potent pivot]

Like when echo stomped through awc with sub aff

[dark moon]

Sub is kinda not like that cause the niche stun requirements

But that might have changed with midnight

Echo played outlaw, no?

[potent pivot]

Not in the season I’m talking about

This was TWW s1 iirc?

I’m rly bad at remembering these things

[dark moon]

Can't remember that far back, but echo isn't like the standard i feel like... You have the literal gods in there

Its not achievable by average joe

[potent pivot]

Ye ofc

[dark moon]

Same 😄

[potent pivot]

But it shows the true capability

[dark moon]

It shows the synergy yeah

Even when rogue is meh they play around it and that's the beauty of it

[potent pivot]

I think people are going to get way too comfortable with this bad prepatch scaling

The second midnight launches we will have 10 people in here saying “why is sub dog shit now????”

[dark moon]

Yeah, but I was referring to the cc changes.

I winder what would mean for sub

[potent pivot]

Ahh

[dark moon]

Is it going ti be even more cc dependant or less

I can't tell

[potent pivot]

It’s about the same overall “time in cc” per match

[grave basin]

Sub was "good" for one week in SL

When echoing rep was good

[potent pivot]

?no

[grave basin]

Yes?

[potent pivot]

It was OP for a week

It was still the best rogue spec that entire season

[dark moon]

You think? I really want to see avidance get comfortable at level 90 to get an understanding of how the game plays out for sub

[potent pivot]

Which is what the question was

[grave basin]

Yea then it became a stun bitch for your fire mage

By itself it was meh

Fire mage was literal god mode for all of SL

[potent pivot]

Ye. Shorter DR duration and shorter Dance CD

You lose triple cheap but the overall CC you put out is very similar

[grave basin]

Sub was also good for a while in DF

Iirc

Then it got modifiers nerfed and backstab buffed

Then it lost one its win cons (duel) and its been RIP ever since

[dark moon]

Yeah it was so good whaazz played boomkin

Rip duel

[grave basin]

Once people figured out outlaw tech in SL sub went out of fashion quick

Cause it was just carried by fire mage

It sorta was good in 2s cause of resonator though

But outlaw priest could do the same thing and was immortal anyway

[dark moon]

I cant remember SL unfortunately. Like i played double sub rogue 2s 1st season and then i played outlaw last 2 seasons

And i think i got elitr set with assa in 1 play session s2

Pvp didn't feel that great

[grave basin]

S2 was assa sepsis one shots

Ala palumor videos galore

Hey pals

[dark moon]

Oh so i played that to 2.2k double rogur

It was the most fun i ever had

[grave basin]

Yea ofc it was broken as shit

[dark moon]

Also getting whispers from multi glad/r1 people for playing a dog soec after arena was priceless

[grave basin]

Vanish with MA leggo sepsis could 80-0 easily

[dark moon]

Yeah

We had a tactic

One of us opens with that to force their trinkets

Waited some time - second one opened and win

Then it was some kiting and running away from the guy trying to 1v2 us with us not having6any cds left

If there's SL classic i will play this shit again. Everything else in SL was crap

[grave basin]

Sl windwalker was peak

Alpha tiger 30% lust

Keefers dash

Bone dust brew

bring me back

[dark moon]

Actually now I remember why i didn't play outlaw in df and tww

Last 2 seasons of SL were outlaw both in pve and pvp (pvp100%) so i got so burned out on the spec i was good for next 2 expacks. I played some outlaw in prepatch now and it feels chill, might play

[potent pivot]

we must've played 2 diff expansions

nvm i misread

[grave basin]

Wdym outlaw was insane in SL

[dark moon]

I didn't say it wasnt

[grave basin]

Replying to trickZ

[potent pivot]

in pve it wasn't anything crazy

[dark moon]

I said i played it both in pve and pvp and got sick if it

[grave basin]

No clue about pve

[dark moon]

Ops sorry then

[grave basin]

I remember 2x outlaw awc

Kek

[potent pivot]

ye most ladder rogues couldn't play it well though

[dark moon]

Lel

[potent pivot]

lets be real

[dark moon]

This applies to almost everything in life

[grave basin]

Vanish cdr lego with resonator and infinity float

Kyrian too with even more cdr

[dark moon]

I remember end of legion turned out that outlaw was the most op spec of all, but nobody played it and understood it

And we learned this at the awc

Blind into blind

Kekw

[grave basin]

Kyrian boomy dh was also not found out till end of s2

Then it got nerfed

Man i cant wait till i get my sl meta mount

Gated by weeklies

[dark moon]

What's gating you?

I think i did mine fairly quickly

Is it the necrolords or venth?

[grave basin]

Necro

Abom factory

Just need to build all the bois and do their quests

Ive done the 100 cloths and fashion accessories

Then im done

Never going into the maw again

[dark moon]

Check if progress can't be done on alts too

Cause i used some alts for the meta achiev but can't remember where

[grave basin]

Im sure you can but im not gonna spend 100k anima to rebuild a r5 factory on an alt

Plus go into the maw and do the souls again

I did my alts to do one of each covenant though

[grave basin]

fuck this one man

DF meta almost done

taivan WILL be mine

get me outa this island 😭

[molten hedge]

Think I figured it was 12% more cc in a 5 min game of ccing off DR

Ty AI

[potent pivot]

yea don't doubt it at all tbh

[molten hedge]

And that was just with 1 DR

What do we think the best way to use our cheaps is now? It feels kinda bad to like kidney healer and cheap both dps now that sub only has 2 cheaps per dance @potent pivot

[violet halo]

how is assa for someone that didnt play pvp at all? i always liked pvp but never got into it xD

[vale steppe]

what hero talents is the best as sub?

[pastel burrow]

Trickster

[dark moon]

Fuck this one indeed. Was pain in the behind

[grave basin]

@dark moon do you alrdy have df meta?

[dark moon]

Yeah did it last 2 months of DF

[grave basin]

😭 i need to summon the legendary soup guy

[outer sky]

Right now assa may be the worst spec in the game for pvp that isnt a tank spec

[violet halo]

[wanton breach]

Pog we‘re tanks now

[quick crypt]

What about outlaw? Is it better?

[outer sky]

Yes but nowhere near as good as sub

Not really. You're just a squishy warrior. 0 reason to play assa or outlaw over a warrior right now unless their damage is tuned way higher

They NEED to move Shot in the Dark from the sub tree to the rogue tree

Vanishing and not being able to cheap shouldn't be a thing

[exotic dove]

Pretty much if things go live as they are right now the only spec I will be playing is Sub which is sad because I really enjoyed playing both Assa and Sub in TWW

[outer sky]

https://www.wowhead.com/news/midnight-beta-patch-12-0-1-development-notes-more-class-tuning-for-all-380254?utm_source=discord-webhook

beta tuning

rogue changes

[dark kernel]

Subtlety: 8% reduction. Yeah sounds about right.

[spring bough]

Love me some prepatch tuning that’ll fuck us in patch lol

[dark kernel]

Yeah exactly what I was thinking. All the changes are already slated to do the ol'traditional

[marble oasis]

'beta' tuning not prepatch

[static holly]

Gimme assa back. Sub sucks

[quick crypt]

What bug hampered outlaw damage?

[vale steppe]

Secret Technique’s Shadow Clone strikes now correctly have damage reduced by 23% in PvP combat, matching the reduction applied to the initial strike.

Sub is dead

8% nerf plus 23% on Secret Tech?

[dark kernel]

That would be a pretty substantial nerf

[vale steppe]

Big enough to go Assa i believe

[dark kernel]

If Assa is meta I'm rerolling.

No messing around this season

[molten hedge]

Sub has too much more cc atm for those nerfs to matter in 3s imo

[gleaming sentinel]

lol

[outer sky]

its not even close to big enough to reroll assa. It just means all 3 specs suck. Idk if people understand just how little damage assa does on beta. Its legit healer damage. Every CD and nobodys HP moves hardly at all.

at least sub can still CC people

[vale steppe]

yeah ive not played beta so i cant tell really, is it that bad

[outer sky]

yes

[vale steppe]

also great, then rogues have 3 bad specs 😄

[lime oar]

[dark kernel]

It's going to be okay

https://tenor.com/view/homer-simpson-homer-simpsons-the-simpsons-crazy-gif-19094789

[molten hedge]

Sometimes this discord sounds like the ret cord ngl 😂 at least they get shit done

[potent pivot]

Some people love to complain

[outer sky]

New MiniCC

[outer sky]

If you miss that the ret has avenging wrath up youre just too dumb to play the game. Its on my screen in 5 different places lol

[molten hedge]

I feel like one or more rog specs are always insane. I do get assa and outlaw cheap really hurting though

My friends testing assa on beta and says ambush kinda cranks rn. I think he took blindside

[potent pivot]

Ye we love glazing over the fact that 2 specs got buffed tho

As long as they don’t abandon tuning 2 weeks in things will be fine

[spring bough]

its amazing

[severe helm]

oh nice what are you using to display avenging wrath? Didnt know we could track enemy buffs like that still

[outer sky]

Its just mini CC

[severe helm]

interesting

thats the addon? kinda wild I wonder how theyre doing it

[spring bough]

has when your healer is CCd alerts too

[severe helm]

lol if you think any of ret discords temper tantrums accomplished anything you might be a lil delulu

[molten hedge]

Brother

[severe helm]

LOL we really just went full circle

[spring bough]

its pretty sick ngl

[severe helm]

aint no way were back to cooldown and cc alerts

[molten hedge]

They got an entire tuning reversed

Overnight

[spring bough]

DRs still on nameplates too

[molten hedge]

For hpal

[severe helm]

HAHAHAHAHA

[spring bough]

only thing we dont have is DontCast right now lol

[grave basin]

Can someone screenshot the changes, i cant access wowhead

[molten hedge]

They did

[severe helm]

would that be for like tracking enemy kicks?

[spring bough]

that one showed when BOP and stuff was up and flashed red

not sure if we can track kicks

[severe helm]

hmmm

yeah im super curious how theyre getting wings info

kind of a big deal

thats one step away from triggering an enemy cd tracker

[spring bough]

hope it lasts lol

[severe helm]

im struggling to see what the point of the addon changes were

seems like a lot of work to end up exactly where we started

I dont really get it

[grave basin]

[tulip thunder]

have u queued into devourer yet? how do the nerfs feel

[vale steppe]

Also the 27% nerf to Secret tech

[shy vortex]

assa getting big buffs and sub is in the gutter

it was already quite strong in bg's

take sudden demise for ez ks to look good lol

[gusty hedge]

See you next xpac

[molten hedge]

Sub isn’t in the gutter man what is this copium

[shy vortex]

its not gonna be S+ like it is now along with DH

i play sub too, its one advan over assa is double cheap shot. That might get nerfed later

[outer sky]

Guys I snagged a mythic Dimensius carry for 1m gold thats fucking crazy. Legit 1m gold for the mythic mount im so hype

[outer sky]

What big buffs?

You mean 3% flat and 10% auto attack damage?

[outer sky]

I actually havent in arena. Ive seen them in blitz though but thats hard to judge by

[dark kernel]

It's a sick mount that's for sure.

[outer sky]

This is what ive been saying for the last couple of weeks too

[potent pivot]

how do

[outer sky]

?

[potent pivot]

like share who you got it from

i want it too

the lowest price guild ik rn is still like 1.5 i think

500k ea for s1/s2 raid mounts as well

[outer sky]

Sent you a friend request

[potent pivot]

Imagine if we got different colors of that mount for glad

[stoic lava]

Where are titles

[grave basin]

wanna bet it's gonna be lower than that in 1 week

im waiting for the last week to snag a boost

[outer sky]

Already is

[grave basin]

gonna be like 500k

ez claps

what discord is that

also i joined the achievements discord and organised a raid to get this shit done

taivan secured

the goodest of bois

[potent pivot]

thats just from wow marketplace

[grave basin]

ooo gonna join that

[potent pivot]

ye you just go to the pve boosts channel thats where everyone posts their 'ads'

and find what you want

[grave basin]

wtf people sell keystone legend for 700k?

[potent pivot]

is that good or bad

[grave basin]

is that 3k io

sounds pretty bad considering it gets split between 4 other people lol

holy moly @dark moon shadowlands rep bonus + winds bonus

1k rep per quest from mushroom man. then 1.3k then 700 from the other dailies

[potent pivot]

ye

[grave basin]

which channel is this in

[potent pivot]

sec

(i sent the ss to him)

[grave basin]

[potent pivot]

there's other channels you can find similar stuff in as well

some guilds pay for their own channels lol

[grave basin]

the premium pvp channel is wild

0 -1500 for 1.2mil?

what in the fuck

[potent pivot]

and thats the cheapest btw

cuz you can't get rewards anymore right

0-1.8k can be like 4-5m+ early in the season

[outer sky]

Pvp boosting is a gold mine

[potent pivot]

it really is

[grave basin]

im so fucking lazy i should really get in on that

ww looking turbo busted next season so i can just pve to 1800

[outer sky]

That wont last

[potent pivot]

just sucks sometimes cuz u are dependant on the boosted person playing ok enough

[grave basin]

carry any backpeddalling egirl

[outer sky]

Best part about pvp boosting though is

[grave basin]

i heard the clients get sorta clingy

lol

[outer sky]

The content never gets nerfed

Like in pve the content gets nerfed and prices crash

[potent pivot]

i've never experienced that idk

[grave basin]

saw some reddit thread of some booster saying his clients would just dm him random stuff to talk about

[potent pivot]

rating inflates though

[grave basin]

cause no friends

[outer sky]

Yeah true

But thats somewhat predictable

Like we dont get patch notes that randomly cut our prices by 20%

[potent pivot]

ye but thats just part of the reason prices go down

but ye true

demand also just naturally goes down as the season goes on

the worst part about pvp boosting imo

when doing zero to X rating boosts

[grave basin]

you sound very experienced

[potent pivot]

sometimes it can take you 30 minutes for 2m, sometimes it can take 4 hours

[sharp sierra]

thats insane when most people do like 300k - 500k for 0-1800

[potent pivot]

meh

[sharp sierra]

they usually just do a time cap and do by hour

[potent pivot]

can be done both ways

0-X just guarantees you get X for a set price

[sharp sierra]

by hour would be best imo so you dont get stuck with someone like me

[potent pivot]

[exotic dove]

So I am predicting Assa is probably going to be strong after the first Midnight tuning pass or the second. Sub is strong it got nerfed on the latest notes but its not dead I think it will still be good. Blizzard has always done this looking at their history of tuning. The exceptions to this is DKs they hate them a lot and possibly outlaw rogues. I see Assa being the strong pick and Sub being the pick for 3s and still played in shuffle by those like me that like it despite it being made easier

I am putting that here now so in March or April I can see if I am right or wrong

[grave basin]

really hoping sub isnt a stunlock bot with zero dam

but it seems it's going in that direction

[exotic dove]

I will have to test sub again when I can play on Friday

I hope not but as you said it looks like it

[outer sky]

Most people who buy pvp boosts pay by the hour instead of for a flat rating goal and just gamble that they'll meet their goal, because hourly is way cheaper than paying for guaranteed rating

[exotic dove]

I didnt know that but makes sense

[grave basin]

i swear im gonna start doing this in midnight

especially with elite being 2300

gonna knock that out insta

[exotic dove]

oh yeah I forgot they made elite 2300

[grave basin]

gonna go for first time legend

[exotic dove]

I just go to 2400 and say gg and relax probably do the same for Midnight but if I happen to get it on the way for 2400 then cheers

Or if I am not enjoying the game get elite at 2300 and just say gg haha

I just never cared enough that is the problem

[gleaming sentinel]

[grave basin]

[stoic lava]

anyone been playing law on beta

[vocal surge]

Aye

[true warren]

i'm out of the loop

did sub get nerfed hard and assa buffed hard?

sorry i alway have troubles finding recent patch notes

[hexed blaze]

they got a little nerfed but not hard neither did assa get buffed hard

[true warren]

so premature calls that sub is dead are just doom posting?

[potent pivot]

Ye

[hexed blaze]

lol yea i bet if you went into any class or spec discord youd see anyone who got nerfed saying it's "dead"

[true warren]

at least something that reminds me of the old days lmao

[potent pivot]

Hang on I’ll post notes

[hexed blaze]

lol yea tale as old as time

[outer sky]

23% to sectec and 8% overall isn't minor

[potent pivot]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/226359213427916800/1468391821578338485/image.png?ex=6983d9f3&is=69828873&hm=71dbab70e71aa263dc2ab541f9029ab51afe51da94a1c3b2366bb13f6446ab6a&

This + 23% pvp sec tech nerf

[true warren]

lol ok that seems indeed a bit drastic

but i never played beta so idk how it would feel at lvl 90

[hexed blaze]

It may seem that way but it was pretty unanimous that sub rogue was extremely strong

[potent pivot]

On beta it wasn’t that good

[outer sky]

The assa buffs are such a meme

They buffed the worst shit

[true warren]

yeah pre patch sub felt unhealthy strong

[hexed blaze]

really i had heard it was really strong in beta. I still dont think the specs dead though

might just be bias though from high rated players 🤷

[potent pivot]

idk about pve

but in pvp it wasn't "op"

[true warren]

sub pvp was "dead" in tww too and i still had more fun with it than with any other spec i played

[outer sky]

The general consensus of the pvp community is that if sub can stun you AND do meaningful damage to you then its busted

[dark moon]

That's actually true. People going mad every single time

[outer sky]

I think its going to be worse now. Because even though we cant stun people for as long (missing the 3rd DR), we can stun people more frequently because they shortened the time between DR resets

So people will feel like theyre "always stunned" way more

And I think thats more tilting to people than the actual stun duration

[grave basin]

@potent pivot actually i just remembered

Were you around for friendship moose?

[true warren]

Yeah i saw WW monk on reddit in r/worldofpvp ranting about Sub saying it's giga OP bc of the CS charge and that the current version is the most OP spec the game has ever seen.

i mean not that i think anyone sane is actually commenting on reddit, but people already losing their minds even tho it's pre patch lmao

[grave basin]

I mean other non rog r1s who are actually play beta are also saying sub is giga

Sub + caster as usual

[potent pivot]

the wut

[grave basin]

In wod people would organise raids to give out aotc for free

[potent pivot]

nah didn't play wod

[grave basin]

It was the grove warden

So the concept of friendship moose was born

[potent pivot]

trimaz and someone else was saying otherwise

[grave basin]

Ye just saying sub being giga isnt some random dad redditor opinion

[potent pivot]

i see. i was around for that 1 guy who started a discord server to do AOTC denathrius/sylvanas carries if you remember them

[grave basin]

I quit in sl s1 over ret palas

[potent pivot]

lol

[grave basin]

Got kwoked

Also convoke pre pre pre nerf

[potent pivot]

he ended up doing like 2k+ heroic denathrius

if not more idr

[grave basin]

What mount does denathrius even drop

[potent pivot]

tanked and raid led em all

[potent pivot]

heroic didn't drop a mount

it was just aotc

[grave basin]

Ah

Does he drop any mount at all?

Like the 1% ones

[potent pivot]

no

[grave basin]

How wierd

[potent pivot]

SL s1 didn't have a CE mount yea

[grave basin]

Is he the only end raid boss that doesnt have a mount

[potent pivot]

one of the only ones of recent years yea

[grave basin]

Im hoping we're gonna get friendship star eater

Lol

If not ill snag it last week of prepatch with tokens

[potent pivot]

a what

[potent pivot]

wouldn't it be too late for that

by now

[grave basin]

Wait why

Is it not guaranteed drop?

Until midnight official launch

Like at march

[potent pivot]

it is but thats 1 month away

[grave basin]

Yea plenty of time for some saints to pop up

Prayge

[potent pivot]

idk