pvp

[hidden moth]

If it’s a kill window don’t feel bad about blinding off ur dots from the enemy healer as well

Much more than just carnage

Assa has 2 vanishes like the other 2 specs but where sub has dance to access stealth abilities and outlaw has cdr on vanish assa gets nothing

Stealth gives assa,
Triple target garrote and ruptures,
50% more garrote damage,
Garrote has 0 cd,
Garrote gives 3 combo points instead of 1,
Garrote silences for 3 seconds and while silenced the target does 15% less damage,
20% Increased crit chance(this last one isn’t always taken)

All those benefits are only available to assa during and for 12 seconds after leaving stealth, and assa only gets cheap shot/ ambush for deathstalker mark applications for 6 seconds after leaving stealth, this is why nelf is a must for assa bc having a pseudo 3rd vanish is huge

[surreal kestrel]

ah I understand! good to know how other specs work as well

is nelf also the best for sub?

[hidden moth]

Nah

Sub u can play w/e

[glass hazel]

when it works lol

[hidden moth]

Works 95% of the time for me

[glass hazel]

if it was guaranteed then maybe, but i dont like how nelf looks like haha so i play human

[surreal kestrel]

Oh really? So no races (alliance) that give a boost then

Should've gone for mecha or void elf then ffs

[hidden moth]

Orc is good for sub for racial and stun duration reduction, gnome is great for root removal, human is good bc human 1.5 minute stun trinket, undead also good for a 2nd trinket effect kultirin for knock back effects

[hidden moth]

There are races that stand out but your not locked to 1

[pastel burrow]

Gnome is bis cause ur so small when u fight the one guy in the world who doesn't use WA's he won't know ur using shadow dance

[surreal kestrel]

Exactly what I was thinking hahaha

Also.. WA is WeakAura I think right?

[pastel burrow]

yea

[surreal kestrel]

I'm that one guy in the world then lol

[hidden moth]

.

[surreal kestrel]

WowUp + Wago is the best for add ons I've read or do you suggest something else?

I play on a macbook

[hidden moth]

Sub rogue races 2400+ in shuffle according to check pvp

I just use curse forge and wago

Assa rogue races shuffle 2400+

[surreal kestrel]

Yeah clearly a favourite haahha

[orchid plinth]

People playing Nelf on sub are probably just used to playing it. Seems to be more Orcs this season than previously.

[hidden moth]

That or are only playing 1 rogue for assa and sub

[orchid plinth]

Shadowmeld is never bad though

Orc is just very consistent

[hidden moth]

Smeld storm bolts chaos bolts it’s so fucking big

[orchid plinth]

5 Mil aimed shot cya

[surreal kestrel]

What does WA do?

[pastel burrow]

it'd honestly be shorter to explain what weakaura's can't do tbh

they're extremely customizable, but generally in pvp most people have one that just screams at them when something they dont like is happening

for ex; when a sub rogue uses shadow dance and shadow blades

[gleaming sentinel]

Is there a particular bleed that keeps you in combat longer? I feel like sometimes I get caught in combat longer than others

[dark kernel]

Does anyone know if you smoke bomb a priest in angel form of it obscures vision because I've been doing it anyway 😐

[spring bough]

So how is PvP today

[spring bough]

It should

[dark kernel]

I remain rating untouched. I blew a 40 MMR inflation game

[stoic spruce]

Killing Floor 3 before 11.2!

[pastel burrow]

wouldnt you rather play a good game

like KF2

or a better game

KF1

[stoic spruce]

I played them

why would I not play kf3?

now screw off, im gooning to sally whitemane

[dark kernel]

Excellent choice

https://tenor.com/view/whitemane-gif-20019498

[spring bough]

🤦‍♂️

Popo has the VR headset ripping this morning 😂

[hidden moth]

No

Bc they are immune to spells effects etc

But u can bomb their teammate and or ice wall it lol

[hard compass]

That’s the fastest way to make a priest cancelaura

[hidden moth]

Yarp

So many free wins on the mage going to 1800 by walling off spirit

[hard compass]

If I hit 2400 in time on sub I’ll do mage next & that method

[hidden moth]

Also wall big tree form etc

Or wall off urself with their heals and let ur heal dps 2v2

[dark kernel]

Wait they are immune to spell effects, so can they heal over ice wall in angel?

[hidden moth]

While u fuck on their heals solo

[hidden moth]

No

They themselves wouldn’t be affected

[dark kernel]

It just makes little sense that bomb obscures their target but NOT work on priest thenselves

[hidden moth]

So their vision in bomb wouldn’t be obscured but

[dark kernel]

Weird

[hidden moth]

If the target is in bomb the targets vision is obscured from everything outside

So bomb won’t directly affect spirit

But will affect allys as normal

It’s bc of the wording on spirit

@outer sky do I just run dfa into mages or like just send hemo

[outer sky]

You can try that if you want to. I personally don't because the problem isnt really connecting, its sticking. And DFA doesnt help with that

[hidden moth]

That’s fair

[abstract stratus]

@jaunty osprey how do I not be bad (I’m 2400 but don’t feel 2400)

[orchid plinth]

Deathstalkers "Singular Focus" keeps you in combat I believe

Try going to the PvP dummies and ambush one of them and bleed another one you'll see

[safe pelican]

Uh ohhhhh I’m going vacation next week fuckers don’t let me see you in them blitz queues #resubmafia

https://tenor.com/view/pirates-des-caraïbes2-pirates-of-the-caribbean2-pirates-menace-threat-gif-19754159

[spring bough]

Don’t worry we will pass u on the R1 chase then 😂

[vocal surge]

Watching paint dry rn lol

[dark kernel]

Outlaw suffering support group is now in session July 22nd 2025

Let's start by introducing ourselves

My name is Slit, outlaw enjoyer as of 11/14/23.

[harsh kiln]

Ill join the support group aswell. I'm Newt, Outlaw connoisseur since the beginning.

[hearty hatch]

How the f do u guys counter or manage to lower monks

Early this morning i was farming honor for last to melees for pvp gear to complete but somehow got stuck against monk in random battlegrounds mf tanked 5 of us dk mm hunter retribution and dh tankd dh

He would tattoo ground and heal and dmg and literally kept us on our positions

Whats the deal with them or is there a way at least or avoid them completely?

[potent pivot]

a lot of weird stuff is usable in random bgs

sounds like you're talking about a mw monk

maybe they were just full geared and using consumables

[hearty hatch]

Could be but 5 guys at once?

[potent pivot]

sure

some healers are already hard to kill in general

if you add better gear and consumables i could see it

[hearty hatch]

True true

But im only lacking

2 gear at this point as subt

Witch are prized daggers

Thats it

[potent pivot]

well you said you were farming honor

are you conq geared or honor geared

[hearty hatch]

Damn whats diff u mean actually bis gear

Death pirate gear or green?

Or u ment somtin else?

[potent pivot]

there's honor gear, but then there's actual bis gear like conquest gear

honor gear is lower ilvl

hardly worth grinding for these days

so many ways to just skip it

[hearty hatch]

So i should be aiming at conq

But how

Most of the battlegroudn I participate alliance player literally clear us on spawn

At this point it’s unberable should i consider farming points on alliance?

[potent pivot]

you farm conquest from rated pvp

[hearty hatch]

Since its all warbamdshare?

[potent pivot]

not from regular bg

[hearty hatch]

Oh

[potent pivot]

you can also farm it from war supply crates

which is what most ppl are doing on fresh toons these days

[hearty hatch]

Um then it’s coming ro my last question is there video about that stuff or should i ask someone in this discord challen gor guidness?

[potent pivot]

you can just look in custom lfg for a supply crate group

then fly around with the raid group to each zone looting the crates

[hearty hatch]

Since i play about 12 hours on weekens i dont want to spent that time on useless stuff

[hearty hatch]

Oh okey

[potent pivot]

if you don't see a group up in lfg just keep trying throughout the day

if there's none up or if they are full you won't see em posted

[hearty hatch]

Okey ill do that thanks a bunch appreciate u

[potent pivot]

npnp

[hidden moth]

Dawg it takes 4 people in bgb 2400+ rating to kill a mw with 10 stacks of flag debuff XD

[hearty hatch]

Man he messed us up insede

😂

[hidden moth]

Like he will die everntually but it’s rough when they have cds

[hearty hatch]

Im gonna learn subt rogue so much imma make evry single one of them cry its just too f funny n balanced

[hidden moth]

Lmfaooo

Glhf

[hearty hatch]

😂

Dreams right?

[stoic spruce]

How "since the beginning"?

Because I like to brag

[harsh kiln]

well since the beginning, when outlaw first came to be

combat and then outlaw

[safe pelican]

Lolololol you right i don’t want no smoke im rusty fr

[hidden moth]

Can I join the outlaw support group? I’m schtabby I play assa I am abused by mages ret palas and evokers and get farmed 1v1 by sub rogues

[safe pelican]

I might play sub though should have enough time to get sum pirate in too

[gusty hedge]

this pally boosting himself messing up everyones games 😭

[hidden moth]

Thank god that shits gone next season

[gusty hedge]

prot

[stoic spruce]

Okay but

When combat?

Yes this is a contest

[harsh kiln]

I would like to say vanilla but i can't, i started in BC

[hidden moth]

I played a combat rogue in 2005

[harsh kiln]

😉

[hidden moth]

Then decided it was shit bc I hated waiting for an energy bar

[dark kernel]

21/3/27

[stoic spruce]

2004

[dark kernel]

H E M O R O G U E

[hidden moth]

Wym I get to watch these guys press buttons and I’m sitting here

[stoic spruce]

You're all noobs to me

[hidden moth]

Out of energy

[stoic spruce]

I have seniority over all of you

[hidden moth]

I was 4 but still

[harsh kiln]

-07

:<

[dark kernel]

I am a day one player myself

[stoic spruce]

Okay well this is news to me

My dad played beta

Top that

[dark kernel]

Can't cause my dad died that year Lmao

Let me find my boy

[winter echo]

@hidden moth you the dwarf what’s always out side SW?

[dark kernel]

Here is old slit, 2009

Vanquisher title from the first arena tournament realm

[stoic spruce]

Actually

I moved out in 2019

And made my own account

[harsh kiln]

but do you have this!? #pvp message

[stoic spruce]

The rating in solo?

[harsh kiln]

i'll flex iit

for the rest of my life

god help you

[stoic spruce]

Id rather sell my account than have 1 rating in any solo queue

[vocal surge]

Imma flex my position on 2v2 over SS rating anyday

[harsh kiln]

fuck yeah that's true

2v2 is on another level

playing rogue/mage i assume?

[harsh kiln]

ah no i forgot, you can't play double dps anymore

[vocal surge]

Nope

[dark kernel]

I was an exclusive mage Rogue enjoyer

[harsh kiln]

iit's the most enjoyable 2v2 comp, too bad it doesn't work anymore:

[vocal surge]

I climbed up to 1700 as Double Outlaw

[dark kernel]

Yeah it does not.

[vocal surge]

At the start of the season

[harsh kiln]

there's something to flex

[vocal surge]

Before swapping to Outlaw + Disc for the rest

And then staying post AWC nerf

[winter echo]

Getting back in pvp after getting bored doing mythic + anyone got a nice edit mode for me

[stoic spruce]

There's a cure for that?

[dark kernel]

For me it was just playing with a healer

[stoic spruce]

Amazing

God is good!

https://tenor.com/view/2omb-pray-prayge-gif-24836268

[dark kernel]

I honestly did not realize how behind double dps was until I tried playing with just a meta healer

This was in like dragonflight season 3

[vocal surge]

Healers rn are giga op

Test

There we go

[exotic dove]

Good ol 4-2 to 2400

Oddly enough my main which is a Night elf wasn't the first my orc Rogue Devtar was

for this season

Orc Rogue Q popped first 😄

[jaunty osprey]

KILL THEM BEFORE THEY KILL U

[abstract stratus]

TOO HARD

[winter echo]

Anyone have any useless macros for sub if so can you dm me please, just coming back to pvp since legion so gonna be weird

[hard compass]

too many nerds playing mop, not enough shuffle pops

[potent pivot]

@surreal kestrel can't use the server for LFG my friendo

[potent pivot]

ill send you my basic list that covers all 3 specs really

[winter echo]

Brilliant thank you

[exotic dove]

Shuffle Q popped in 10 min for me the one I 4-2 to 2400. Maybe requeue it could be bugged. I have had the bugged Queue a lot this season

[spring bough]

That’s fire

[vocal surge]

Aye

[spring bough]

I need to get this dark fuse cape. Join all these rogues rocking it

Gotta go an all black outfit

[exotic dove]

Its worth

Great mog

[potent pivot]

they fixed the method for getting it in a couple hours didn't they

[hard compass]

grats on 2.4 im avg wait 25mins at 2.2

[exotic dove]

Thanks and that is odd I would think it would be faster at 2.2

They whole Q thing is confusing though

[hard compass]

its 2.2 but im still getting WW leg sweeping my go, and priest gripping me out of my own bomb

screaming inside

[exotic dove]

I would yell at my monitor if I was priest gripped out of my own bomb on a killing blow. Its why I save a shadowstep charge in case they do that

[hard compass]

exactly my reaction

[hidden moth]

Lmfao u think I would belittle myself to play a race shorter than myself irl

If I wanted to Rp as someone that couldn’t reach the cookie jar I would just larp as my fiancé

[hidden moth]

Lfm to join the “NoTrickz fan club llc”

[winter echo]

Bahahahahaha

You’ve made my day

[surreal kestrel]

I'm sorry

[potent pivot]

np

[stoic spruce]

If it wasn't a problem you wouldn't have said anything

[hidden moth]

It’s more so him saying there isn’t a problem anymore and that it’s taken care of

[stoic spruce]

Shhh

I'm trying to start something

[potent pivot]

[hidden moth]

Well I finished it

[stoic spruce]

Nerd

[hidden moth]

Just Like blizzard finished outlaw

Sub human spec

[stoic spruce]

Dude

Imma be honest

Next season may be the worst outlaw has ever been in pvp

But

We won't know for sure

Until later in the season

[hidden moth]

Honestly Aug players have more aura than outlaw players

[stoic spruce]

Okay assa player

[hidden moth]

(U wanted to start sum im js )

Look bro don’t be mad at me u gotta do a 20 gcd combo to do the damage of 1 crimson tempest tick

[jolly sierra]

i am getting fun leveling up as ranged lol

[gleaming sentinel]

💀

I have no defense I’m a male NE

[spring bough]

aug players have 0 aura

[dark kernel]

Evoker players are gutter tier.

In general

[vocal surge]

Nah

Monk players for me

I still keenly remember this duo

Disc Priest + WW Monk

They would try their best to setup a CC chain on me to MC my friend

And DC him out of the game

For a guaranteed win

It was this season for 2v2s

The WW Monk would stop their dps rotation to ensure I could not interrupt that Mind Control

[spring bough]

that 2s team DCing people should be banned for life

id have video'd that hopefully and sent it right to blizz with the report of them lmao

[vocal surge]

Yeee

There was also an evoker (not sure if he's in the top for his spec still)

That had funny business going on the entire time we fought him

Essentially our characters would be turned a complete 180* away from the Dracthyr constantly

The whole game and only when fighting this specific player

[spring bough]

could be some evo ability he just uses well they get weird stuff lol

[vocal surge]

But having it happen every 5s?

[stoic spruce]

You're so lucky I'm in mourning rn

[potent pivot]

you mean they were lag switching or

[stoic spruce]

Because that bait would've worked on me

[hidden moth]

what are u mourning

[vocal surge]

Probably considering every other game me n my friend had were fine except when fighting this dracthyr player

[stoic spruce]

Ozzy Osbourne died

[hidden moth]

oh yeah

ripo

was supposed to see him in 2019 but he had to cancel

sadge

[hidden moth]

carry on my wayward son

[stoic spruce]

He was just a dreamer who dreamed of better days

[hidden moth]

no rage at my bait i see

ah well

[stoic spruce]

Sad popo hours

[hidden moth]

whats everyones honor level?

[spring bough]

Anyone play MOP for the launch today?

[stoic spruce]

Cheese

[stoic spruce]

I would if there were a fun spec to play

[hidden moth]

meh

too many changes

[stoic spruce]

https://tenor.com/view/burn-kelso-that-70s-show-gif-26311276

[hidden moth]

couldnt bother to keep up with patch notes and shit

they nerfed rsham and priesti nto the dirst just so mw feels decent kekw

[spring bough]

I was leveling a char but I guess it’s too late now. It’s only level 12 screw that grind lol

[hidden moth]

just buy a 50 boost

lololololol

our ret

jkust lost

a 1v1 to an assa rogue at miens

at the very start of the game

of gilneas

HOW TF DOES RET PAL LOSE 1V1 TO ASSA WITH BOP TRINKET AND BUBBLE ALL OFF CD

THIS PALA IS ALSO A FUCKING DWARF

HOLY SHIT

[dark kernel]

By sucking?

[hidden moth]

what is this lobby

kick the mm hunter put me in coach

[hidden moth]

bgb is cooked rn

[hidden moth]

so tired of warriors spam dr stuns

like

what is ur .5 second stun going to do really on 1 target

[hard compass]

gotta hit that late shockwave to keep that 18sec dr rolling

[hidden moth]

u mean gotta hit shockwave .000000001 second after their stun dr resets?

[hard compass]

well sure, the cd is less than 2mins so you have to use it on CD for maximum efficiency

then flame the rogues dam

[hidden moth]

wasnt even flaming my dam

he was pissed i didnt keep the spriest stun locked

[hard compass]

hahaha

[hidden moth]

[hard compass]

ret in my lobby is pvp level 1824

im cooked

spectral tige

[hidden moth]

tells hpriest

dont spam stun disc

fear off or stun fear off of my kidney

"u stun dps ill do healer"

kekw

do rets or hpriests have something

that makes it so i cannot vanish

it was like i was in a hunter flare

bregh

stole a round off the pvp season 1 glad

[hard compass]

i think you should be able to vanish, they'll immediately break but you should still be able to cast

[vocal surge]

Yeah

I want sent into the Pandaria Cinematic Character Grinder

[hidden moth]

ya but it wouldnt let me press it at all

unless its the new pala pvp talent that wont let u vanish

[runic laurel]

Did u run over eyes?

[hidden moth]

where even are the eyes in maldraxus arena lol

[runic laurel]

Somewhere around the edges idr

[hidden moth]

ah

holy bgb games are so fucking shit rn

lost a gilneas due to ret losing a 1v1 to an assa rouge

lost ab to healers not sitting lm and bs and losing every single time it was avail to cap bc they wanted to go stables lol

lose deephaul bc hunter doesnt take hero pet wait 2 min for shaman to finally lust and then we decide to let them 2 cap carts bc we wanted to wait to turn crystal in

then eots we lose bc a bm hunter we told to double sit our base with our sub rogue decided bm is best used in mid and then

shocker our sub lost the 1v2 and we got 2 caped at the start of the match

[grave basin]

brah i cannot imagine being a bgb main

how do people do it

[hidden moth]

lmfaooo

[hidden moth]

shits ass

i just

want my fuckin stratigist

and then be done

19/25

if i lose 1 more game im knocked out of elite then bgb matches have been abysmal

[grave basin]

how does omnivores do it

[hidden moth]

idk

omni is funny af though

he also plays war so

half of it is

mind off mortal strike spam

[grave basin]

half of it is just rp walking while wizards perma slow you

how do warriors even contribute

should have played dk or somethn

[hidden moth]

thye have mortal striek

also

ohhh their pres evoker is running off with flag

[grave basin]

literally nothing you can do

[hidden moth]

be a shame if he is speared and cant leave this 3 yrd radiuysfor 10 seconds

lol

[grave basin]

you can spear an evoker with shroud?

[hidden moth]

prob

p sure silence goes through shrouyd

but thats also bc when i gar silence it doesnt use a charge

[grave basin]

i love having casters with spammable cc on my team and no1 bothers to get shroud

legit it sits all 30 seconds

on my hunter

[hidden moth]

dispel it kekw

tranq shot that hoe

[grave basin]

it only gets rid of 1 stack if it even gets rid of it

so i usually try and get 2 and prayge some1 gets the last one

if not it's sitting all 30 seconds

truer words have not been spoken

@dark kernel

[hidden moth]

lmfaooo this mans tweeting about it

look at least if someone doesnt belong

that means ez 4-2

[dark kernel]

who said its always a DPS?

[hidden moth]

3-3 means u dont lose rating though so poiggies

[dark kernel]

Nah I've realized that 2100-2200 is like the worst RNG of all time

It's not cut and dry how bad it's going to be, because there's STILL the opportunity of the losing player to be decent, or have a highly meta team comp mixed in the shuffle

[hidden moth]

bed time update gn

[dark kernel]

Like I see Cupid Cleaves all the time

in shuffle

and that's flat out a hard comp for unorganized teams to beat because its straight forward

[outer sky]

I usually feel pretty good into Cupid

now when I played fire mage RMP

cupid was impossible

i dont think there even is a win condition

[dark kernel]

im talking about shuffle classes

very rarely do you queue rogue into good team comps

I always get shit like....BM/War/Ret/Healers

so Im playing War/Rogue vs Cupid, then THug into ret/War

none of these are good rogue comps, but you're facing highly meta, easy to pilot viable team comps

and it's just because those classes are better in general into matchups and played regularly on the ladder

so it goes to show why pushing on rogue is very tedious is what im getting at

[outer sky]

Invert your thinking

I prefer to judge a lobby based on whats easy for me to play into

rather than play with

since there's no comms anyway its all kind of a crapshoot

warr and BM assa does quite well into

ret is meh

not terrible

oh well you're playing outlaw so its a little different

as outlaw (and sin too but esp outlaw)

just play the game not to lose

dont play to win

play not to lose

just aids the enemy team as much as possible

on their CDs shut them down

thats how to win as outlaw

your offense is always second to that

[vocal surge]

Be the mosquito we're nerfed to be

[dark kernel]

playing to not lose makes no sense because you're ally is the kill target

and you cant trade their defensives for them

[waxen meteor]

I feel non NE sin rogue is unplayable

swap back to main undead rogue, feels like just hard mode

[gleaming pawn]

I really should not wait till the last minute again next season

[hidden moth]

Also doesn’t help mop just droped

[grave basin]

to do what

2.4?

[grave basin]

releasing mop and s3 so close together is dumb

[gleaming pawn]

nah couldn't be bothered to do rated this season. Just not feeling it at all, but I will be annoyed if I miss out on the elite appearence

and was just hoping I could coast to an easy 1800 with my meme build

but that wont fly in 2200 lobbies

[hybrid sapphire]

how come whenever a voker dies its always from like 60% to 0% immediately

[waxen meteor]

I think it's surely you..

[dark kernel]

Yeah I dont really want to talk right now

I get to play 2 shuffles a night and that just shoved me back to 2250

im effectively out of range of being able to get elite now by end of season

[waxen meteor]

don't worry you are good you will surely get elite

[dark kernel]

Yeah, no Im not. I lose every single match with Rshams and assassination rogue

[waxen meteor]

Well you are doing everything right, that's honestly one of the reasons we lost together

... first of all double rogue is weak suace...

then we did all cc chain together

kinda after sap, i went for garrote you went for blind..

[dark kernel]

I noticed

[waxen meteor]

and i am playing with my non arena rogue in arena, and i got two double rogues lobbies today lol

[hybrid sapphire]

its been nothing but double evoker lobbies all night

ive never been closer to ***

[dark kernel]

Okay.

[stoic spruce]

Double rogue is literally the best comp in 2s

Double sub rogue

Oh gosh Double dwarf sub rogue

[waxen meteor]

well, apparently there's no solo shuffle 2s yet

tbh i seriously think ret is not worse than rogue now in 2s without healer

[stoic spruce]

Why are you doing that to yourself?

[grave basin]

Yea you just auto lose to anything with hpal/frost mage/literally any bleed/any DK spec/any hunter spec/demo lock

Maybe if shroud will worked in pvp

Still*

Like in mop

https://youtu.be/A3HD6QtydBU?si=40ZrbF-7oK66uuHa

[waxen meteor]

Back then undead rogue was still a thing

and that's why my main rogue is still undead

[grave basin]

Undead had the old model too..

Wotf I'm p sure didn't proc your trinket

[agile kite]

Is DH even easier than frost dk

[grave basin]

kinda, yea

dont really all in on one clean setup

[stoic spruce]

Was also a duration

[outer sky]

Obviously you can still get trolled. Im saying play the game to prioritize disruption and peeling enemy CDs above your own offense. Which is true for all rogue specs but 10x more true for outlaw. If your teammate doesn't trade properly youre fucked but thats true no matter what class or spec youre playing. But you have a lot more tools for disruption than other specs so you can often save them a CD

[vocal surge]

It works up until ~1700

[grave basin]

Hardly " the best 2s comp" then

[safe pelican]

Got 1800 with double sub, highest me and my bro could get. After that people know you’re just waiting for burst windows but it is the best double dps comp regardless , not going to see anything else that high

[grave basin]

Erm

Feral Ret or mage Rog could get way higher than 1800

[safe pelican]

I’m biased fuck them kittens, two GOOD double sub rogues are smoking mage rogue I’m ngl to you that shit gets eaten for breakfast once the mage uses ice block ( in the first go ) he’s dead on the next

[grave basin]

I'm not talking about that

I'm saying who's better at climbing the ladder

[safe pelican]

I’ll give you that

It’s early my comprehension skills are still subpar the coffee ain’t hitting like it’s supposed to 😂

[grave basin]

Happens to the very best

[royal portal]

outlaw needs nerf on dmg, its basicly one-shot

[vocal surge]

Your not serious about that right?

[royal portal]

they can 1v2 easily with no cd on AR

BtE hits like a truck

that 10% dmg buff its too much for a class that dominates pvp

[vocal surge]

Skill issue

The 10% damage buff is long overdue for Outlaw ever since the S2 nerfs

[royal portal]

why buff 10% to a class that competes with MM at dmg

[vocal surge]

Outlaw dps peanuts compared to MM

I had an MM Hunter show me the new 1 shot combo that takes 1s to down someone 100 to 0

From 20M hp and 21% DR from Vers

Outlaw at best takes 7s to 100 to 0

[grave basin]

Rage bait used to be good, 5/10

[vocal surge]

I honestly thought he was joking

XD

[royal portal]

If u look at streamers u see outlaw #1 on dmg

[grave basin]

No they aren't

[vocal surge]

If the Blade Flurry damage isn't directly hitting players

Its 1000% pet padding

Which is meaningless damage

This is something that can be checked with Detail's damage breakdown at the bottom where it'll list all the targets hit

Just a simple mouse over can show if Blade Flurry was padding or not

[grave basin]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/226359213427916800/1396011031339466802/image.png?ex=6881ce16&is=68807c96&hm=67188150ae35a55b4f5e490330f848a89359abfaa7a3021a6c4e70a9236424cb&

Neva 4get

Bestworld in the rogue btw

[stoic spruce]

if you play it like a regular 2s comp then yeah obv its gonna be ass

[stoic spruce]

post the sauce

[royal portal]

then what class u think can beat outlaw in 1v1?

theres none, too much stun, dmg like hell, defensives....

[vocal surge]

Ret Paladin, Warlocks w. Succubus Pet, Hunters (w. efficient defensive trades), Arms Warrior (good procs = Outlaw shutdowns), Sub Rogue, Frost Mage, and Arcane Mage (Outlaw needs Pillars to fight Arcane Mage)

There's a few other classes but it starts to get more situational as we go down the list like Evokers requiring Pillars and certain talent setups

[vocal surge]

Based on this mentality, I'd estimate you're ~1200 rated

[stoic spruce]

all you gotta do is CC chain outlaw a bit and you denied him dmg for a little bit

because no vanish and no adr makes outlaw do below tank dps

[royal portal]

it can stealth middle of fight then open with BtE that hits for 2M, doesent seem OP for you?

[stoic spruce]

no

because its never 2m

and

using vanish offensively is a detriment

bte is literally too nerfed for 2m

[royal portal]

they would have not make this mechanic if it was detriment

[stoic spruce]

via imp bte nerf and crit nerf in pvp

well its not in pve

which is what we're built around which we all know

I dont wanna do it either

but here we are

[vocal surge]

BTE doesn't hit for 2M, it can get close in S3

But thats only vs Clothies

[stoic spruce]

and tanks

[vocal surge]

Leather+ wearers will take far less damage from BTE spam

[stoic spruce]

im not sure we even have an ability that hits for 2m atm

[royal portal]

everybody does, outlaw surely has

[vocal surge]

Nope

[royal portal]

more than 1

[stoic spruce]

no

[royal portal]

seems odd

[vocal surge]

In order for Outlaw to hit for 2M, we have to beat out RNG

[stoic spruce]

Outlaw doesnt have dmg CDs

[vocal surge]

and thats only on Fatebound

[stoic spruce]

so what you see is what you get

it doesnt hit a lot because its the fastest hitting spec in the game

cant have both

that would be insane

[grave basin]

Ok now I can't tell if you're ragebaiting

[grave basin]

Numbers straight from the ass

[hidden moth]

Lmfaoo

Bro assa ends outlaws existence

Sub wins as well

1v1 outlaw losses vs the other 2 specs 9times out of 10

[outer sky]

yeah outlaw doesnt really do enough damage to win 1v1s

[hidden moth]

It’s not going to kill during its cc window

Sub will bang outlaw out so fast during its go

Assa just dots up outlaw and kites it/ stealths and watches it bleed out

[hidden moth]

lol only time envenoms land at 1 mil+ is during darkest night proc and even then I’ve only seen it hit 2 mil once

[gusty hedge]

sub should easily beat outlaw 1v1, pally should beat outlaw 1v1, a good outlaw player will beat any of these classes. But let a good sub,pally/ good player law loses 1v1. u gotta play dam near perfect as law and even then its all rng

[royal portal]

u make it sound like outlaw is low, but no one is complaining, every time theres a new patch it gets buffed until it dominates pvp

its top 5 burst, not support as i saw people talking

i still support at least 20% nerf on dmg

or mby increased cd on BtE

[orchid plinth]

Statistics says it's the most dogshit spec in the game currently but it's certainly viable up to a point above most people's experience. Like everything in WoW is.

It's also the kind of spec that has some real fans that makes it work no matter what.

Which skews the winrate a bit

[dark kernel]

I wish it would skew a bit more rn

My damage has been mega low and I dropped to 2250 again.

I keep moving between trying to mega pump hard or trying to play CC peel bot

Neither is really working.

[grave basin]

what in the ever living fuck are you talking about

outlaw top 5 burst?

please go troll somewhere else

i hear dh discord is good

[harsh kiln]

vs melee you kidney the healer on every go, send your bte window during kidney, after kidney you controll healer while your mate finishes the game. vs triple caster you try to pve as much as possible instead of ccing. generally that worked for me.

[dark kernel]

This seems to simplistic.

[harsh kiln]

there's no need to make it harder

you controll the game and let your partner kill shit, make good swaps and you're there

[dark kernel]

Last night my big loss was 1-5 in Assa/outlaw/sp/DH lobby with Hpal rsham healers

[harsh kiln]

yeah well vs assa you're probably always gonna go negative

esp with a dh

since your healers can't outlast their damage enough for you to controll them within higher damp

[dark kernel]

That makes little sense, my logic tells me I should destroy that lobby as long as I don't stun into feint or we kill dh

But it went as you said

I realize I lose a lot of rsham lobbies

They work terribly with me, they cap totem my DR but they also peel me on the enemy team

[harsh kiln]

yeah, roots are the bane of our existence

i try to communicate if i want stuns on other or not by teammates, they dont always listen but atleast you've made an effort at that point

[dark kernel]

I'll try that

I don't know if I have the data on it yet, I've lost the majority of my recent lobbies

I only seem to really do well Into cleave lobbies with warriors, or lobbies with an SP or Afflock which are rare

Also I do well both against and with r druid

[orchid plinth]

https://wowarenalogs.com/stats?tab=spec-stats&bracket=Rated Solo Shuffle&sortKey=burst&minRating=0&maxRating=4999&trendChartSpecs=&trendChartStat=representation

assa lower though

[hidden moth]

Don’t fucking send him to my 2nd home

I here the warlocks are taking in discord trolls rn

[hidden moth]

Lmfaooo

Assa has 100 people 2400+ while outlaw has 10

I’m dying

[orchid plinth]

Yeah hence the skewed statistics for Outlaw

If argue the people "still" playing outlaw at very high rating are good and love the spec

They you check Average DPS and notice that 3 tanks has higher than both Outlaw and Sub

[potent pivot]

you sound like you're saying the opposite of reality just to ragebait, and it isn't welcome here

[vocal surge]

Wanna 1v1?

and see if its true 😉

[vocal surge]

This is why I say I estimate he's around 1200 xD

He's never seen Outlaw fighting 1 on 1s

I've fought hundreds of people from various skill levels from absolute newbies to PvP to Gladiators and from experience can draw upon classes I know can straight counter Outlaw

[blissful wraith]

Is there a macro to spawn stealth but not perform a double click to exit stealth immediately?

[abstract stratus]

Do you mean a macro that puts you in stealth but not out? If that’s what you want put this
#showtooltip stealth
/cast !stealth

[blissful wraith]

exactly what i was looking for. Thx!

[exotic dove]

My Other Rogue Undev-Tichondrius hit 2400. This one had a rough start from the gulag wild west of the super low mmr a few months ago to where he is now.

Also near top 100 for the spec 😄

[gleaming sentinel]

Legend grind done… see you in 2 weeks

[exotic dove]

Grats on Legend

[hidden moth]

Sure but I’m at work for a good min

[hidden moth]

Screenshots or it didn’t happen

[hearty hatch]

Hy is there a better in game tool or addon for targeting mf gnomes make me wanna quit pvp

[vocal surge]

Aye, PTR or Live?

[hearty hatch]

And demonology or ph hunter with pet names popping on screen

[potent pivot]

use nameplates?

[hearty hatch]

Sholdn it be set up correctly? Or it does it job automatically

[potent pivot]

if you've never touched the settings no

get a nameplate addon too

[hearty hatch]

Okey i will thanks a bunch

[harsh kiln]

👋

[gusty hedge]

what a pos am i right?😂

[dark kernel]

Damn that's a rough lobby

Good job

Who's dying each round? The assa?

[upbeat plover]

Hi all! Was wondering if honor points roll-over into season 3? was thinking it may be time to start stockpiling on alts if it does.

[gleaming sentinel]

🤣

[potent pivot]

ye honor doesn't reset

just conq/bloody tokens reset

[upbeat plover]

perfect ty

[hidden moth]

Don’t got anything set up on ptr so prob live

[vocal surge]

Alrighty

[hidden moth]

If playing shuffle or 2v2 3v3

Just use keybinds for arena target 1,2,3

Can also use tab or click nameplates

Or click arena frame

169% recommend keybinds for arena 1,2,3 as your best option

[vocal surge]

lemme know when R

I can also wait for you to setup in the PTR if you wanna try out PTR Assa rogue stuff

[hidden moth]

Ik some use platter, I personally use kui for nameplates

[hidden moth]

Ight bet, I just clocked out so gotta drive home

[vocal surge]

Aye

[hidden moth]

Hunter went 0-6?

[hidden moth]

If you have alts that you arnt pvping on currently, I recommend xfering honor to them for s3

Currently have 6 honor caps waiting for either new honor gear or the vast amount of bloodstones to be purchased at season start. (Bloodstones should see a price surge)

[spring bough]

LMAO

[blissful wraith]

whats our third option could be if disarm is not required?

for pvp talent

[harsh kiln]

depends on what spec you're playing and what kind of pvp you're doing

turn the tables or thick as thieves for me

[hidden moth]

premtive manuver, smoke bomb are p much locked

for assa u then either take hemotoxic for aoe 30% ms, disarm, or dfa

creeping venom is dog shit, control is king needs a rework, dagger in the dark needs to be changed to a buff and not a debuff bc enemys will see the debuff and know there is a rogue nearby

[vocal surge]

Dagger in the Dark is a double edge blade

[hidden moth]

thick as thieves is great in 2v2/3v3 where u can coordinate goes but not really in shuffle or bgb

manuverability WOULD be great if it also made sprint remove roots/snares but it doesnt so mid tier pvp talent, other options blow it out of the water but it isnt the worst pick

system shock would be good if it did 8x the damage, and debuff lasted 5 seconds and not 2

[hidden moth]

ya but

12 yrd application range and most classes having 10-12 yrd aoes that will just pull u from stealth so its borderline unplayable

[vocal surge]

I rarely have trouble applying all 6 stacks of Dagger in the Dark when running it

Gotta edge it, in n out with the radius

or just sap the target you wanna apply all 6 stacks without repercussion

[blissful wraith]

is premtive manuver still worth if there is little to no stun in the enemy team?

[hidden moth]

i fukcing

hate boomies

"im the only damage we have for lava" then refuses to go off carts and trolls game and we lose

btw i did 200 mil more dam than he did

5 loss streak in bgb

[gleaming sentinel]

I love the hashtag

[harsh kiln]

if there's no stuns, it's not worth. if there are little to some stuns it's worth

[hidden moth]

tbh almost every class has a stun

its worth

[harsh kiln]

yup

[exotic dove]

I do swap Preemptive maneuver out if I know I wont be a target

which is basically every time an aff lock is my partner lol

or spriest

[hidden moth]

ur always a target to be swaped to

[spring bough]

saw a win trader live in blitz

my team called all to lava for last cap and our teammate pally switched it so it went top

luckily i went to the top cart before that and secured it or that pally would have lost us the game

[dark kernel]

How do I make a tricks of the trade macro I can edit each arena

[exotic dove]

This is true why I step healer when I see them coming. Its a risky play swapping it out but it ended up being worth it

[hidden moth]

just make a macro of /cast @ name

[dark kernel]

Is it /cast @party1 tricks of the trade

[hidden moth]

and change name manually

or make a @focus macro

and set ur teammate as focus

[hidden moth]

tbh i just like the energy cost redux

[dark kernel]

I may need to try it

[exotic dove]

Yeah that is good

[potent pivot]

there's an addon you can use

[dark kernel]

I feel like blackjack and not using tricks is a mistake now

[potent pivot]

to always cast tricks on the other dps

[dark kernel]

Mmm

[spring bough]

can u report someone for turning the lava cart to the top when the games tied and lava woulda been last cap lmao

[hidden moth]

nah i like black jack

30% healing done reduc on a healer coming out of a sap kidney blind etc

[dark kernel]

I do too, but the heal reducing effect apparently doesn't stack with wound

[exotic dove]

See I dont know with that cause i had a game today as Assa where I bilnd healer he dropped combat then Sapped healer and that is where blackjack proved effective cause I do still believe it won the game

[dark kernel]

So unless you're DRing other dps at start it's meh

[hidden moth]

wound is only 20% but

it should be healing done and not recieved no?

[dark kernel]

I said the same thing, but that's not the case apparently

It would be kind of broken if they stacked

[exotic dove]

You can't stack it all the time though and I heard they could but never confirmed it

[dark kernel]

Right but I feel not utilizing the 15% party damage is just a missed opportunity

[exotic dove]

cause wound or Hemotoxin (Assa) is healing recieved why blackjack is damage and healing done and people were telling me it stacked

[dark kernel]

So I want to use it more

[exotic dove]

I use it as sub a lot

but the thing is there are a lot of games I use it but then my partner panics and does nothing with it if they are trained

and it irritates me

[hidden moth]

dev mm ww disc rdruid shuffle ewww

[exotic dove]

that is eww

but MM struggles against ww

so could work out

[hidden moth]

lol

dev mm killed us

so hard

[exotic dove]

WW die without cds?

[potent pivot]

what

wound and blackjack?

[hidden moth]

the fact

i cant kick disentegrate

bc of their defensive

is so dumbn

[dark kernel]

Yeah wound and blackjack. They way they are described you would think they stack, but I've been informed by some players they don't

Which is why nobody at high rating runs blackjack

[potent pivot]

one is healing done and the other is healing received no?

like if you blackjack a healer and have wound on a dps then it should

if they were both healing received they would not stack, that much is for sure

like wound and hemo

[hidden moth]

i love

black rook

and the amount of 0 restealths u can get in it

[dark kernel]

That is the logic, but what I am saying is I have been informed it's not true

I don't know if there's a Way to verify absolutely

[potent pivot]

sounds like cap to me but i've never checked

[dark kernel]

Might just have to duel

[potent pivot]

like if you're solely fighting a healer

and you apply blackjack and wound to them

then it wouldn't stack as they heal themselves i'd assume

2 effects on 1 player

but if it's 1 effect on each player i don't see how that'd be the case

[hidden moth]

dev juist 6-0

bc i cant keep on him

evern when i do gtet a step on him with no hover charges left he gets fucknig griped

[hidden moth]

no bc dev just p diddys everything

[exotic dove]

I was told its a stack if you have blackjack effect on healer while wound ms is on a dps target and you are going that dps target. @potent pivot last game I played today felt like that was the case. I do see how it wont work on the same target

[hidden moth]

devs damage is just so fuckjing stupid

esp bc they can just immune all fucking cc period

[exotic dove]

Yeah Dev Evoke ris just dumb

[hidden moth]

not even mentioning shroud

thank god thats getrting reworked

arcane magefrost dk havok rdruid disc leggoooo

nvm

2-4 noty happening

0-6 bc dh and dk just shut down myu mage so hard

dk just

doesnt icebound trheir opener

well went 3-3 almost /afked out holy fuck @outer sky give me les stoxic lobbies please

[dark kernel]

I mean, at least you at legend wins

[hidden moth]

true

[exotic dove]

Ive been watching some replays of my games and every game that had a BM Hunter when they were against me their pets died cause of my dot cleave as assa LOL

I actually wonder if they actually press mend pet

you an probably just dot them up and they wont notice

unless you hard go it

[potent tiger]

so should i cheap shot opener on healer or garrote for silence?

[hidden moth]

Pvp talents

[hidden moth]

should be opening on kill target to apply mark etc

[potent tiger]

WELL i mean after that

like when im spreading cheap shots or garrotes

don't i wanna do that

lol

[hidden moth]

heal should be sapped-->> cheap ambush gar rupt cheap gar---> (ur team shouldve followed up the sap already though if they didnt) step healer kidney ---> dot up 2nd dps blind healer before kidney ends
(if they did dot 2nd dps and then follow kidney onto heals

when cheap is avail u wanna cheap shot but

dont just dr healer for 1 4 second cheap and dr it

if ur gonna sit on the healer and are able to cheap 4 sec into a 2 sec cheap gofor it

if ur just looking to cc and kidney is off cd

ur looking to kidney and leave the healer back to pressure dps

its situational tbh

[hidden moth]

u get 6 seconds to cheap 12 to gar silence

so cheap>gar

unless stun is dr'd

[worthy crag]

Its hard to notice and react to without some sort of pet health tracker

Sin is pmuch the only spec in the class that can kill pets with aoe because their aoe is still a dot effect and not mitigated by "anti-aoe" mechanisms that pets have

So they passively take full dot dmg even if noone is directly looking at the pet (which is easier to notice)

[dark kernel]

Wew

only a few short shours to some suffering

[hidden moth]

gg

lost another bgb

war decided to rush mines and not stay ww with me and a healer

they 5 charged ww and we lose it and war is saying its our fault we lost it bc we didnt push mines

we have 2/3 bases and he wants us to push a 3rd lmfaooo

[hidden moth]

is there a pvp lfg that actually works bc

check pvps lfg is fucking dog water

[hearty hatch]

Ll definitely check it out

[lucid nimbus]

what's the strat to CC someone and cap a flag in blitz?

[hidden moth]

sap cap

sap is 6 second c

cc

cap is 4 second

[lucid nimbus]

1st sap is enough if they're close enough?

ok sweet

ty

[hidden moth]

5 cp non dr kidney and full non dr blind work21

[lucid nimbus]

ahhhh thats waht i was thinking of but couldn't remember

think i read SAP into Cap

if they trinket then blind and cap

and if they're close to the flag you're good

[hidden moth]

u can also

just

sprint back to flag

and bomb then cap

they usually have to close distance to interupt bc bomb'

[safe pelican]

Lmao this was funny af

But true 😂

[hidden moth]

sad shouldve been 6-0

[dense thorn]

yh but can you boost me in 2s for the transmog 😛

[hidden moth]

new record

[hidden moth]

dont do boosts sorry

[dense thorn]

its not a boost, its a fun time

[potent pivot]

[hidden moth]

@potent pivot https://tiermaker.com/create/rogue-pvp-talents-112-15991467

https://tenor.com/view/yes-gif-18412682

[dense thorn]

ez

[stoic spruce]

Holy grammar

[hidden moth]

breh

disc dies with 2x sup and ult pene

shadow dies without pressing dispers

but they press theiur cds for enemy team like

wtaf is that lobby

@outer sky tf am i supposed to do in this one

[exotic dove]

I would move creeping poison to trolling. The amount of people I have trolled with this season has made me laugh. Like a DH trying to go to a pillar to LOS but was walking speed and died.

I stopped using it once I left low ratings though

[hidden moth]

broooo

los another bgb

look at damage meeter

im 300 mil dam and 2nd on my team is 100

in a team fight on flag in eots

[grave basin]

How many more wins to strategist

Are you even still in elite cr

[spring bough]

Sheesh bro got cooked

[hidden moth]

doesnt it only gain stacks when u envenom lol

[hidden moth]

nope

2280

6 more wins

[grave basin]

Rip in pepperonis

[hidden moth]

its cooked lads

[exotic dove]

You envenom once and it gains stacks as the target moves or yeah I guess envenom can stack it up too

[grave basin]

I salute your mental sir

[grave basin]

How many games total you logged in bgb so far

P good lob for you

[hidden moth]

bgb

[grave basin]

[hidden moth]

8 loss streak rn

[grave basin]

I dipped out after 50 rounds

[hidden moth]

almost 6-0

fucking rip

status update

ima hit legend before strat istg

tbh i think subs talent sillohette should be in the class tree

and make it do something for grappling hook

like steping an ally is 67% cdr and grapling hook gets an extra .25 second cdr per cp spent

okay

arms war spearing an ele shaman and me bombing the spear

is so fucking dirty

getting a

kidney ---> blind---> sap combo in shuff

is

mmm

[grave basin]

unhappyclown ):

[hidden moth]

i got

0 rating

off a bgb win

wtaf

[dim oriole]

Your mmv is way lower than your rating

[hidden moth]

ik why i didnt get cr

[dim oriole]

Have to win a bunch more and still get no rating, great system

[hidden moth]

its just

still making me suicidal

[dim oriole]

I just can't with bgb, far too depressing

[hidden moth]

im 6 short of stratigest for s2

otherwiser i would just c all it

[dim oriole]

That's rough, especially as you'll have to slowly climb back up to elite

[hidden moth]

yarp

unfort slew of Ls

sure i could play better some games but

[dim oriole]

Thoughts and prayers with you my friend

[hidden moth]

half of them have been trolled

[gleaming sentinel]

idk bro going back to outlaw aftr assa grind, outlaw is just so shitty bro

in shuffle

[hidden moth]

arms war mm hunter havok dh double hpal

leggoo

[grave basin]

why do this to yourself

you alrdy got legend, just chill and farm mounts or something lol

season only has 2 more weeks

KEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEK

[jolly sierra]

XD

[stoic spruce]

Oof

Didn't know

Prolly won't play outlaw then

I'll just hangout here for the vibes

[outer sky]

why are we pretending theres consistency in what disarm stops?

for WW monk it stops Fists of Fury

So if you dont have your staff you cant punch people really fast

Ret pallys CAN still use Wake of Ashes while disarmed

which is obviously stupid

[gleaming sentinel]

killing spree is gonna be so counterable, lol

[outer sky]

yet rogues can't kidney shot

[hidden moth]

nvm this

lobvby is ass

cant stay on hunter

hpal peels so hard for him

war just kills me throuhg fucking evasion

[stoic spruce]

Needs to be more consistent and have the amount of disarms in the game culled a bit

Like

Why does WW have an MS, disarm, and offheals?

In no world does it need all 3

[hidden moth]

cant fucknig

stay on mm hunter at all

@outer sky tf d oi do here man

bc the other meat head i had wanted to chase to narnia

told dh to sit in starting room and nope blood went to find some god damn milk]

left his healer los and never came back

honestly why do i even play rogue rn

every other fucking class is just better

more damage more util easier to play

[grave basin]

why does conduit make them unccable

tbf they give up an honor talent but still that shit is so obnoxious

in SL ww was the budget outlaw rogue

how the tables have turned

[stoic spruce]

Man

This is payback for countering hunters in SL lol

[grave basin]

The virgin outlaw rogue spam cc'ing doing rdruid treant damage and still losing

Vs Chad "the real deal" brawler spec pressing W and winning in the opener through wall and spam heals

Check out this LMAO

https://www.twitch.tv/videos/2520313926?t=1h38m54s

Meant to link this part

In B4 people cope that it was all the dev

[dark kernel]

low low key, kinda considering running disarm into this just because it pisses me off

[grave basin]

If you disarm the monk while hes fisting won't it just get parried

Need to predisarm I think ?

[vocal surge]

My biggest pet peeve of Monk?

[stiff cedar]

same as disarming evasion. get behind

disarm stops strike and fof from ww

[vocal surge]

They can parry while debuffed by Trickster's passive

Which should not allow parry

[grave basin]

Burning a step to disarm fists is diabolical

[gleaming pawn]

I've been in lobbies ~2200 4 times tonight with all the same DPS every game 😑

[grave basin]

Can you attack warriors with dbts?

Maybe cannot parry just from natural parry chance (5%?)

It's like chaos bolt always crits even into hunter ROS