maybe just have to proc it at a perfect time lol
#pvp
potent pivot
severe helm
etc
potent pivot
and crit
balmy shuttle
Opinions on Flickerstrike vs Thousand Cuts (Trickster)? Flickerstrike seems situational but has anyone actually bothered testing it?
potent pivot
Opinions on Flickerstrike vs Thousand Cuts (Trickster)? Flickerstrike seems situ...
if you're going to play something as bad as trickster, you play thousand cuts
wet crown
About to give fatebound a go to kill time before classic tomorrow. Any not obvious ways to game it and obliterate people?
potent pivot
just play as usual really
gusty hedge
outlaw trickster mastery slaps. Go ham with it
lone anvil
He also had the most damage output. Definition of a glass cannon, poor guy
harsh kiln
Where the hell did i get the idea of 15% haste from?
dark stump
since when pala tank is a heal ?
steel scarab
if you're going to play something as bad as trickster, you play thousand cuts
Doesn't the coin get progressively stronger if you keep flipping matches?
So it was probably just crazy rng
Flip a Fatebound Coin each time a finishing move consumes 5 or more combo points. Heads increases the damage of your attacks by 10%, lasting 15 sec or until you flip Tails. Tails deals (180% of Attack power) Cosmic damage to your target.
For each time the same face is flipped in a row, Heads increases damage by an additional 2% and Tails increases its damage by 10%.
dark stump
Flip a Fatebound Coin each time a finishing move consumes 5 or more combo points...
no limit cap?
jaunty osprey
Yeah coin is good if you RNG flips
steel scarab
I have no idea, good question, but it would seem kinda dumb to put a cap on a spec that is completely luck based
jaunty osprey
I was hitting 1m coins during 1st week of szn
If you hit 7 of the same face in a row, the 15% agi from lucky coin
is insane
in addition to the benefits for flipping same coin
dark stump
I have no idea, good question, but it would seem kinda dumb to put a cap on a sp...
let's 1/2 for each
and we want to get 200% from head so it's gonna be 7.8886091e-31
steel scarab
0.5 x 0.5 x 0.5 x 0.5 = 0.0625
So you have a 6% chance to get 4 Tails flips in a row
3% for 5
1.5% for 6
So
It certainly isn't happening frequently lol
dark stump
hmmm should i respec to sub or outlaw from assa hmmm
steel scarab
Granted, you can tip the scale in your favor with Edge Case, which guarantees one flip
But, the gameplay is too fast, especially in pvp, and the UI does a terrible job tracking the flips with no obvious clear visual indicator (like Blindside provides, for example)
So I'm pretty sure it's just pure luck
dark stump
how do i get rid of this ?
halcyon timber
relax that is in cata classic <:OMEGAKEKW:829051106361344021>
Sure. The classics don’t matter. The shit in the sky has been going on cosmically nonstop regardless. Theres nothing to relax about.
severe egret
how do i get rid of this ?
Personal resource bar in the preferences
I don't have the game on hand, but it's a menu like "resource bar" or something like that (also my game is not in english 🤣)
dark stump
found it thx
vocal isle
Hello guys. I haven't played since DF season 2 and now i see dracthyr available for rogues. Can anyone tell me if their racials are worth swapping race for. Health regen out of combat, knockback and glide look delicious for all content, but PvP especially. Is there anyone who already tried dracthyr and has some experience on actual usage of their racials?
P.S. Previously I always played orc for PvP and felt okay with it.
candid tide
people say nelf still bis
i kinda like the drakthyr racials but havent test it yet myself
glass hazel
nelf\dwarf pve\pvp the same
vocal isle
As a BG/RBG/Blitz enjoyer I already consider swapping for 2 days, but want some feedback from those who already played them, if possible 😄
Alliance races are not an option for me, because i play with my bros, including outdoor stuff😅
candid tide
the thing with nelf is that u can meld into stealth which is massive ofc
a third vanish basically
glass hazel
there is few top players who switch to dragon, might worth it if you can stand their look, but 90% is nelf anyway :x
vocal isle
I guess visage rom works all the time, unless i use soar racial?
earnest forge
you can be always on visage mode with non evokers yep
vocal isle
That is nice though
earnest forge
and females at least have decent animations, males I'd assume are a clone of belf male
hidden moth
there is few top players who switch to dragon, might worth it if you can stand t...
luckily u can just stay in human form
candid tide
Dragon Warriors looks rad man
earnest forge
nah, dragons look bad overall
vocal isle
And I tested out of combat health regeneration. It is 3 times higher, than without a racial. Seems good for BG.
hidden moth
i just wish i could play the evoker class cool class fun healing mechs etc
earnest forge
yeah the combat regen is really cool
candid tide
maybe if can make them bit more buff would be insane
hidden moth
without being a scaly
earnest forge
the knockback is pretty meh
candid tide
yeah would def be good in blade edge but havent seen that map in a while
earnest forge
but the passive mastery racial aint bad either
candid tide
theres no map with any real elevation rn ingame
vocal isle
Knockback looks like good for solo def some bases on BG.
earnest forge
yeah would def be good in blade edge but havent seen that map in a while
Im comparing it to kul'tiran dickpunch so its not fair knockback power wise
I really enjoy dickpunching people off cliffs tho
vocal isle
I really enjoy dickpunching people off cliffs tho
Same
earnest forge
sap -> /train + dickpunch macro
vocal isle
Love this kind of PvP bullying 😂
hidden moth
Knockback looks like good for solo def some bases on BG.
yeah but same time kultirin knock just better for blitz
indigo hill
Knockback can be used to get enemies in cleave, interrupt a caster or get some distance for kiting in arena.
hidden moth
so many clips of sap kultirin fcs off the side of twin peaks and they cant counter it bc the knock also stuns
also nelf letting u extra vanish with all the combat bugs in blitz
vocal isle
And glide looks okay for resisting knockbacks, and not wasting shadowstep maybe?
earnest forge
if nelf wasnt overpowered most of my chars would be kul'tiran for the fun
hidden moth
if nelf wasnt overpowered most of my chars would be kul'tiran for the fun
meh
i would prob still be elf only good looking race on ally
maybe humans
earnest forge
And glide looks okay for resisting knockbacks, and not wasting shadowstep maybe?
glide is turbonerfed as a movespeed increase to non evokers so I dont know, its decentish in worldpvp
hidden moth
but even then all the allied races suck outside voidelf
earnest forge
void elfs are almost belfs with no void tendrils checked
and the teleport and random dmg buff are getting buffed
dark stump
Hello guys. I haven't played since DF season 2 and now i see dracthyr available ...
so their racial include speed/slow falling/ knock back
and passive mastery
vocal isle
glide is turbonerfed as a movespeed increase to non evokers so I dont know, its ...
I mean not the glide speed, but resisting the knockback itself, so enemy wont get a big gap with you.
hidden moth
we know its a fanstasy game and u dunno why u can be a normal human but to fix this issue we have added a new race to the game "LIZZO" er i mean KULTIRIN
hidden moth
and the teleport and random dmg buff are getting buffed
yeah but teleport buffs coming
gonna be sick i can change my nelf lock back to void elf
earnest forge
we know its a fanstasy game and u dunno why u can be a normal human but to fix t...
being fat is a race now, suck it nerds
dark stump
I mean not the glide speed, but resisting the knockback itself, so enemy wont ge...
yeah like time ur shadow step when u get knock back
oh btw can someone who play outlaw show me his keybind (where he put his spell) plz?
vocal isle
yeah like time ur shadow step when u get knock back
Yeah, saving a charge of shadowstep for more overall uptime on the kiting enemy.
hidden moth
being fat is a race now, suck it nerds
for the record i have no issue with fat people, im a bit overweight myself but, the only difference between human and kultirin is racials and that kultirin is just wider
earnest forge
for the record i have no issue with fat people, im a bit overweight myself but, ...
meh models for male are very different, but limited
dark stump
for the record i have no issue with fat people, im a bit overweight myself but, ...
i'm still trying to figure out why kultiras is a different race
nothing change from reality
earnest forge
its what I was looking for my fat bald pirate mog, so i'll take it
hidden moth
i'm still trying to figure out why kultiras is a different race
this tbh
just add a fat slider to character customization or sum
earnest forge
also humans and kultirans are getting elf ears soon now apparently
hidden moth
put it next to the imfamous boob slider xD
dark stump
also humans and kultirans are getting elf ears soon now apparently
arathi
that's weird cause arathi are semi-elf semi human they should be a different race not kultiras
earnest forge
I want a scrawny old body type for male human too, the fucking powerlifter build they have dont fit mage/lock at all
vocal isle
I guess there is some sense in going dracthyr, if I want to stay on the Horde side after all.
hidden moth
I want a scrawny old body type for male human too, the fucking powerlifter build...
let me make asmonbald in game
hidden moth
I guess there is some sense in going dracthyr, if I want to stay on the Horde si...
no point once 11.0.7 drops
earnest forge
let me make asmonbald in game
that with a hunched (like orcs) walking stance with long beard, boi
vocal isle
no point once 11.0.7 drops
What changes there?
hidden moth
What changes there?
horde and ally can que normal bgs and dungeons etc now
basically everything in game is cross faction
earnest forge
or give me gul'dan stance for an orc warlock pls
I kinda miss world pvp being almost fair
dark stump
horde and ally can que normal bgs and dungeons etc now
nop tried with my brother didn't work for premade
hidden moth
nop tried with my brother didn't work for premade
on the ptr?
earnest forge
nah not right now but its coming
btw I cant be the only one that hates the earthen being horde too
hidden moth
earnest forge
luckily race looks like shit and racials are terrible to pair up with it and barely anyone uses it
dark stump
luckily race looks like shit and racials are terrible to pair up with it and bar...
brooo xD
hidden moth
tought u were talking with the current one
we are in 11.0.5 this change is in 11.0.7
dark stump
that's the mentality of if i can't have it no one should have it xD
hidden moth
luckily race looks like shit and racials are terrible to pair up with it and bar...
no no he has a point
earnest forge
I have it, but holy shit they are fugly
dark stump
is there any nerf coming for feral?
earnest forge
also... third dwarven race already
hidden moth
only thing this race is good for is women with beards and racing to max level in sub 2 hours by just flying through zones
(yes someone has done this)
earnest forge
we had god damn serpent dudes in bfa, why we getting another wonky ass looking dwarf instead of those
hidden moth
is there any nerf coming for feral?
no class tuning announced
dark stump
also... third dwarven race already
well technically there gonna another troll race
earnest forge
well technically there gonna another troll race
you mean the almost elf looking trolls?
hidden moth
WTB ETHEREAL ALLY RACE
dark stump
no class tuning announced
queued with a feral that hit 2m with bite when he was against me
but this bastard when he was with me he instantly forgot how to play
hidden moth
horde could have hozen and ogres at this point
blizz doesnt want to make a female ogre model
vocal isle
So summing it up, if you guys would have a chance to swap to dracthyr for free...dope or nope?😁
upbeat bear
No
hidden moth
for looks and racial
upbeat bear
Is there s big diff between sub,assa and outlaw in blitz? All good?
earnest forge
I dont hate the visage form, soar is better than normal dragonriding and racials arent op but arent terrible
hidden moth
\
earnest forge
would I preffer an orc (playing demo)? probably, but who cares tbh
hidden moth
looks too damn good
earnest forge
im not hitting glad anyway
hidden moth
also 7% movement speed for being a nelf
hidden moth
Is there s big diff between sub,assa and outlaw in blitz? All good?
all good i play assa but outlaw can do some techs with grapple
earnest forge
grapple is broken in blitz
lightspeed first caps, lightspeed to enemy area in eye of the storm when the game starts before they can cap
hidden moth
fucking mage icewalls bridge in eots, im in a smoke caping dr at start. outlaw rogue gets past wall, and into my smoke bomb hits me .5 seconds before i cap
gusty hedge
is this live now?
vocal isle
I love their racials in terms of the toolkit they give me. Still i feel okay with orc. Maybe I should wait for a while to let this wish be clear.
hidden moth
is this live now?
11.0.7
earnest forge
I love their racials in terms of the toolkit they give me. Still i feel okay wit...
ur looking at that ass for a long time, you better like how it looks over meta
gusty hedge
hidden moth
ur looking at that ass for a long time, you better like how it looks over meta
nelf is bis for this reason
vocal isle
I'm not a meta fan, but a tmog and fun enjoyer in terms what the race provides
hidden moth
the only elf issue is ears with some helms but outside of that
"tall women with a fat ass" - yuji itadori
proven field
"I'm gonna give the BRD raid a try, see if anything good drops"
cue Curb your Enthusiasm theme song
earnest forge
like, my perfectly meta nelf rogue isnt as played as kul'tiran one, probably cause Im enjoying outlaw more, or because punching people is funnier than a restealth, I'm simple minded
I like the blad guy with a moustache, what can I say
proven field
I agree, but seeing as our burst is tied to stealth windows, it's a kick in the pants to lose one because racials 😦
vocal isle
BTW i would just go nelf when i play Alliance. My all time favorite. Even when humans had a free PvP trinket for all kinds of CC back in time.
hidden moth
I like the blad guy with a moustache, what can I say
chad
but hear me out
play assa in mythic plus where tanks chain pull 1 mob with 20% hp into the next 2 packs and u need to get a restealth for half of ur aoe kit to work
earnest forge
Im not really fond of subterfuge windows as a dmg window either ngl
proven field
I am Christmas Dwarf pirate so I get it:
earnest forge
feels like every rogue spec plays shadow dance without shadow dance
tribal badger
fucking mage icewalls bridge in eots, im in a smoke caping dr at start. outlaw r...
if u think its bad now
with worgen racial buff next patch
imma be sapping horde players in their spawn as soon as the game starts
proven field
yeah they should have made it tied to like Feint, where you "Pressed the Odds" and it unlocked modified versions of spells just like subt but more piratey
tribal badger
with 4X grapple and nitro boots sprint
darkflight stacking with sprint is gunna be sooooooo good
earnest forge
will darkflight stack with nitro boost too?
proven field
Wait what's wrong with Christmas Dwarf Pirate
earnest forge
time to go fucking fast
earnest forge
Wait what's wrong with Christmas Dwarf Pirate
rapey jones looking dwarf
tribal badger
ur gunna be moving at flight mount speed with sprint + worgen racial
its gunna be dope af
proven field
I thought I looked jolly 😦
earnest forge
downside: ur a furry
hidden moth
if u think its bad now
TRUE
hidden moth
with 4X grapple and nitro boots sprint
can u nitro boot in blitz
tribal badger
no im talking about sprint + darkflight
earnest forge
werewolves are meant to look cool, worgen are scrawny
hidden moth
ur gunna be moving at flight mount speed with sprint + worgen racial
dont forget the 20% talents while stealth also stacks
tribal badger
mhm
hidden moth
100%+100%+20% +40%
earnest forge
dont forget the 20% talents while stealth also stacks
lol, that's maybe an oversight
incoming: you fcking dogs had your fun, max movespeed capped to X%
hidden moth
lol, that's maybe an oversight
i makes sense
earnest forge
meanwhile 90% of playerbase being a goth looking nelf for the racial:
dark stump
so i did a ss and got with a monk that told my talent are bad <_<
earnest forge
was he right tho
dark stump
it was this discord talent tho
dark stump
all 7 worgen players when they get nerfed
how?
tribal badger
nah just responding to the person saying they should cap the move speed
they wont nerf it
earnest forge
how?
they are buffing their sprint to be a massive speed stack, if it gets out of hand, prepare to get a hotfix for fun
earnest forge
out of hand = someone at blizzard playing mage didnt like a doggy running fast
dark stump
out of hand = someone at blizzard playing mage didnt like a doggy running fast
mage ? i would've said feral
proven field
Outlaw is pirate, sin is ninja
- to pirates, Johnny Depp. + to ninjas, easy halloween costume
hidden moth
+ to pirates, Johnny Depp. + to ninjas, easy halloween costume
bro never watched hells paradise
outlaw - carpel tunnel, - gg if u have no uptime, assa - paladins evokers, dwarves
tribal badger
how can u say sin is a ninja when sub exists and is literally a naruto spec
glass hazel
every time paladin use bop i want to cry yeah
as assa
like imagine you spent time putting dots and with 1 button palla tells you gj go do smth else 
dark stump
the funniest thing i saw was a sub rogue using shadow cloak against my sin
glass hazel
why funny?:) if talented removes dots as well
dark stump
why funny?:) if talented removes dots as well
well it didn't cause he nearly died (with the dots)
until a fcking mage stunned me and osed me
glass hazel
weird suppose to, maybe he wasnt talented into it
just panic clicking anything available 🙂 in order to survive
dark stump
btw is it normal a mage dealing 2m dots with frost fire bolt?
gray dune
its really nice eating a full hex into a full lightning lasso back to back
safe pelican
Multibox Rougie is 80 now time to gear today after work and hit the shuffle lobbies hype to get back 
Cloak bugs sometimes btw doesn’t remove things it should or it removes the dots and they can for you right after through the cloak
hidden moth
how can u say sin is a ninja when sub exists and is literally a naruto spec
sub isnt naruto spec
if u wanna play naruto spec
go play ff14
hidden moth
like imagine you spent time putting dots and with 1 button palla tells you gj go...
hpals having 2x bop on a 20 second cd is
reeeeeeeeee
tribal badger
sub is absolutely a naruto spec
u have an ability called shuriken toss
u use magic symbols to make ur abilities crit
u summon shadowclones with ur strongest finisher
the defacto fantasy is ninja
safe pelican
Maybe last xpac sub booty rn
tribal badger
sub players try to cope but they made it a weeb spec
hidden moth
the defacto fantasy is ninja
yeah but final fantasy ninja just does it better
tribal badger
sure i didnt say sub was the best naruto spec
hidden moth
u have to use hand signs to set up ur jutsu
tribal badger
i just said its clear naruto fantasy compared to assassination
im not comparing it to final fantasy
u cant queue arena as ninja in wow
hidden moth
my only argument was ninja ff14 was the true naruto spec xD
hidden moth
ff14 ninja u have 4 abilities for ur jutsu. ten chi jin and jutsu
where the order u use ten chi jin changes what jutsu u will use when using the jutsu ability. the amount of hand signs and order matters
tribal badger
i dont disagree with u that ff14 is more of a naruto spec then sub
that doesnt change that sub is a naruto spec
and the defacto fantasy blizzard has sold is ninja
i was just disagreeing that assassination is a ninja spec
hidden moth
i was explaining the hand sign ninja has in ff for anyone who didnt know
tribal badger
arent the hand signs like half gcds in ff14
hidden moth
i really like it and took the opportunity to nerd out a bit
glass hazel
assa more like spy i dunno
hidden moth
a gcd is 2.5 second a hand sign is .5
hand signs are .5 second gcd and jutsu is 1 or 1.5 idr i think its 1.5 though
glass hazel
imagine you need to play mini game with hand signs
hidden moth
hidden moth
imagine you need to play mini game with hand signs <:kekdog:907207037757296710>
if u fuck it up by pressing the same hand sign 2x or doing a wrong order it uses the ninjutsu charge and doesnt let u cast any meaningful ability with justus and if u cast it anyways when u fucked it up a rabbit spawns on ur head and dances letting everyone know u fucked up and ur dog shit
lime oar
Ff pve is wild.
Those mf take parsing so crazy serious and breaking down every single gcd throughout a fight
dark stump
i was going trough a guide to see each spec burst rotation
can someone tell me if this one is the burst for sub ?
i meant confirm it
hidden moth
@lime oar this is the new opener for ninja pve
keep in mind there is 3-4 of those abilitys on that chart that is 4 button presses each lol
had to go look for alninos vid but i forgot new expac and mans already has a 1hour 6 min guide on ninja pve
lime oar
i was going trough a guide to see each spec burst rotation
can someone tell me ...
That first one is essentially it but u wanna send flagellation and preferably have a rupture up in there too before burst
dark stump
That first one is essentially it but u wanna send flagellation and preferably ha...
so flagellation + rupture then this rotation
ah the build they are proposing is not using flagellation
hidden moth
flag is important bc it does damage per combo point u spend so throwing it up before starting ur rotation is crisp
lime oar
<@415364361406644224> this is the new opener for ninja pve
Shits crazy, all I played was dark knight/warrior
hidden moth
er starting burst bc more cps spent is more dam
proven field
how can u say sin is a ninja when sub exists and is literally a naruto spec
What would you say Sin is? You literally poison people and make them bleed out. Sub is... also ninja spec tbh
tribal badger
wait is it ninja fantasy to make people bleed out?
hidden moth
Shits crazy, all I played was dark knight/warrior
i loved ninja, but i stoped playing, i wanted to hit max and raid n stuff but having to do every single story quest from all patches and end game patches
tribal badger
ive never connected those tropes
to me sin is fairly unique to wow rogue fantasy tbh, the normal fantasy tropes dont really have a concept of "dot" classes that arent like
warlocks that curse people
hidden moth
go play main campaign of vanilla, all the stories from the patches of say dire maul aq naxx etc, then u can start in tbc do all that do all the patch campaign stuff for sunwell, then wotlk so on to get to max to start playign the game
tribal badger
the only ninja like thing sin has in my eyes is shadowstep
hidden moth
to me sin is fairly unique to wow rogue fantasy tbh, the normal fantasy tropes d...
assassins have used garote wire and other things in russia and persia historically
proven field
WIkipedia makes ninjas seem like navy seals so I dont know anymore
tribal badger
assassins yes
assassin is a very broad catagory compared to ninja to me tho
ninja connotates a very specific set of pictures in my head
hidden moth
ninjas are a type of assassin but yeah
tribal badger
which ff14 captures very well
oh absolutely they are
but not every assassin would be a ninja
proven field
Really real-life Ninja were used to disrupt politics and mess with physical assets
hidden moth
A ninja is a specialized warrior in feudal Japan who excelled in infiltration, espionage, sabotage, and assassination
tribal badger
yea when i picture ninjas i picture heavily stealth themed, shurkens and ninja stars, secret techniques and hidden attacks
hidden moth
Ninjas were highly trained in martial arts, especially ninjutsu2. They moved and acted without being seen, often carrying short swords4. Their tactics included deception and surprise attacks
tribal badger
i honestly couldnt tell you a fantasy trope that matches 1:1 with assassination
similar to outlaw it seems like more of a umbrella design to fit many tropes under its belt
but again classic fantasy tropes dont really do dot style specs imo
subs always had the most defined fantasy to me (well ever since they made outlaw not a pirate spec)
proven field
I mean an assassin is just a job, lots of tropes have been assassins
tribal badger
yea same with outlaw
outlaw is just like a general term you could fit a ton of different rogue types under
hidden moth
u focus on bleeds but assa is also about poisons
throwing kunai daggers shuriken blow darts with poison on it was also common
sliping in unseen poisoning food water other things
tribal badger
sure i mean the whole rogue class uses poisons :p
assassinations core focus is poisons and bleeds which are usually side features of more specific "thief/sneak/assassin" archtypes
so id say assassination is a pretty unique fantasy to wow
proven field
so we cant call assa ninjas
tribal badger
u can, i just dont picture that at all in my head
maybe its just because sub is so specifically meant to be a ninja
it seems silly to me to call sin a ninja also
proven field
sub prolly visually more closely resembles it
but they both use daggers, both murder in unfair ways, both use ninja skills, tools, weapons etc
tribal badger
well id say ninjas use assassination tools, just generally more themed around the region that the term ninja came from
not that assassins use ninja tools
proven field
So we riot until Assas become.... SAMURAI
tribal badger
but i guess at that point we are just splitting hairs
tall sleet
Hey guys, is subtetly decent ?
proven field
they aren't ninjas I can tell you that much
severe helm
maybe its just because sub is so specifically meant to be a ninja
yeah sub is very much more ninja than assa
assa is just an assassin
halcyon timber
Ninja is both singular and plural.
tribal badger
they literally took two rogue abilities and renamed them/reskinned them to have shurikens when they basically do the same thing
idk how anyone could imagine sub isnt a ninja spec defacto
halcyon timber
We aren’t ninja but people can be what they want to be. Up to them.
tribal badger
severe helm
none lol
halcyon timber
Always been in the game
severe helm
belongs to ninjas and cringy teenagers pretending to be ninjas
tribal badger
the abilities shurken toss and shuriken storm have certainly not always been in the game
proven field
"Shurikenjutsu (手裏剣術) is a general term describing the traditional Japanese martial arts of throwing shuriken, which are small, hand-held weapons used primarily by the Samurai in feudal Japan, such as metal spikes bō shuriken, circular plates of metal known as hira shuriken, and knives (tantō).[1]" oh snap
halcyon timber
Throwing stars were smarty pants
severe helm
the abilities shurken toss and shuriken storm have certainly not always been in ...
yeah all 3 rogue specs used to be very rogue oriented first
no sub genres
tribal badger
if u mean throwing star weapons sure, back before they went heavy into spec fantasy id say all of the rogue class could flex into a more ninja or assassin or outlaw fantasy
anything before legion was much much more watered down
we exist in a post legion world tho
severe helm
throwing weapon isnt necessarily a throwing star
tribal badger
in legion they decided to make each spec "unique" and more specific in a lane of fantasy
subs fantasy was ninjas
thats pretty clear and inarguable
proven field
apparently shuriken are samurai tools not ninja
severe helm
proven field
(this is news to me, im not anti or pro-ninja)
severe helm
whats your source?
proven field
tribal badger
id agree samurai is another trope for them but blizzard has not attempted to make any spec in wow a samurai, or they didnt in legion anyway
severe helm
primarily doesnt meaen originally or exclusively
so not sure that interpretation is accurate
tribal badger
a samurai spec would certainly have been cool
tribal badger
or robes (i dont think they wore robes in actual history but i feel like in most current fantasy tropes they wear robes n shit"
clothy melee
tribal badger
yea in terms of historical accuracy absolutely
tribal badger
ok but it do be lookin kinda cool
i think if they ever were gunna add samurai it woulda been mop tho so
that ship has probably sailed
bit surprised monk didnt get another dps spec for samurai
long shore
Anyone still play sub in shuffle here ?
tribal badger
maybe because leather didnt feel right for them
long shore
Feels like torture playing sub these days
proven field
I think too much of samurai has been taken into pieces of other specs - would be hard to carve one out on their own
tribal badger
yea thats also possible
honestly the only trope i think wouldnt really steal from many other specs in the game or overlap too heavily that they havent done is bard
blizzards resistence to the idea of a bard is kinda strange but i think it comes down to they didnt want to do a support spec (at the time) and they dont think players would be happy if they made a bard in the wow trinity style
there are some npcs that use magical music in the game but theres no class that really uses sound or music magic at all
instead they released evokers which heavily steal flavor from druids and shamans and mages all at the same time
multitrack drifting
proven field
Aug though.. Aug made people angry
still does
(and I loved Aug, cheesed my way to 2300 with it lol)
tribal badger
aug is also just weird support spec
i assume it was planned from the beginning but like
why does evoker get to be the support
and why the black dragonflight? was the black dragonflight ever sold prior to legion or even dflight as being focused on support magic?
wet crown
remember when they nerfed specs because of aug instead of nerfing aug
proven field
Well the alternative was removing Aug because the nerfs needed would make it useless... not a lot of fun for your new marque class to suck in the expansion they are based on
tribal badger
yea i mean i prefer ff14 style supports personally
where they do like 80-90% of a dps dps and 10% support other dps
easier to get accuratly on logs
easier to balance
its w/e
proven field
I think support should be baked into healers instead of DPS
Disc for example could/should be one
halcyon timber
Prob some under the hood reasons why they decided not to
tribal badger
well i think if the goal is to make a support that has a fully support rotation like aug thats hard to do on a healer
severe helm
I think support should be baked into healers instead of DPS
support is baked into all specs
thast why making support is so hard in wow
halcyon timber
Other healers have more agency now too contributing to X
tribal badger
since healers already have a dedicated heal rotation toolkit
tribal badger
healer dps rotations are generally pretty simplified
severe helm
movement stuff
etc
all specs are hybrid supports in wow
so when wow added a support they really juust added a zdps
which tbh is kinda boring
imo
halcyon timber
Anyone still play sub in shuffle here ?
Always man
proven field
Outlaw I think was more supporty in previous expansions than now
Rogue tree has homogenized things too much now
severe helm
wow just has so much support baked into every spec
so making a dedicated "support" isnt really possible
halcyon timber
Mah utility kids screech is why
proven field
It's because Blizz's historical response has been additive in nature vs reductive
"X DPS dies too easily" "Here are some self-heals", "X DPS is mandatory because they get stun" "ok everyone get stun", etc
halcyon timber
Well they are damned no matter what decision they make
severe helm
the mobility creep after inventing monks is one of my biggest complaints in modern wow
halcyon timber
Someone will always be upset
proven field
It's to the point where when I make an alt, I just slide the abilities into my comfort spaces "ok this spec has this stun, it goes to Q button. Their root is this, it goes to F"
severe helm
people fly around the screen like fucking dragonball z characters nowadays
its fucking absurd
halcyon timber
That was good heh
severe helm
I hate DH/Monk for what they did to mobility
proven field
its not the mobility
it's the fact that they didn't get counteracting drawbacks
additive.. they do everything rogue does plus they fly 2x speed, can jump up on X axis environments etc
it used to be if you were a hybrid - Feral for example - you could heal, but your dps was like 85% of say a rogue - because it had to have a drawback
halcyon timber
They moved away from rook vs knight
tribal badger
i mean
halcyon timber
For sure
tribal badger
what are we saying when we say dedicated support here
for players wanting to play support, support means a majority of ur power coming from increasing what other players do general
wow has always had raid buffs. i dont think anyone has ever considered these to be true support
support is more then 50% of augs contribution to killing something being other players being empowered
i dont think i really agree we have that much support in the game right now
the highest support non aug would probably be priests where you could say they contribute like 8-12% to another player from PI
proven field
I think you would have to strip half of every spec's unique contribution to make a wide enough space for a true support
halcyon timber
Agreed to aug
tribal badger
I think you would have to strip half of every spec's unique contribution to make...
well no, but u are getting at a core issue here
all that matters is that the support specs "power" is stripped to the degree that their contribution to others makes them do "true dps"
the problem is... the profiles of damage and how specs in the game do damage is very wide with a lot of differences across so many specs in the game
making a true style support balanced can be tough because of this
remember when aug first came out, the 2 unholy dk 20 aug raids killing herioc bosses in bloodlust
halcyon timber
Shit was nuts for sure
tribal badger
id say its very hard to do the style of support in game that support "players" want
and also aug was a mistake (ive always thought this)
but id still love for bard to come to wow
to me bard would be like a dps/dps/healer tho
maybe with some things like PI equivalents
but, i think most people who want to play bard would hate it if it wasnt an aug style support
which is probably why blizzard hasnt bothered with it
halcyon timber
Red mage type stuff
tribal badger
also, bard would probably be a leather wearer if we are being realistic, and we already have 5000 of those bozos so
we need more mail classes if anything
severe helm
also, bard would probably be a leather wearer if we are being realistic, and we ...
why leather?
Id figure a bard would be cloth
just regular clothes
tribal badger
could be cloth
if they made it a melee/ranged/healer id say leather fits more
but cloth could definitly fit
halcyon timber
Prob likely to get an engineer gw2 style via goblin stuff rather than bard
tribal badger
the problem with engineer is thats a class that overlaps heavily with a proffession
(same way i feel about alchemist)
halcyon timber
Yep
tribal badger
bard truly overlaps with almost nothing in modern wow
the only overlap u could sell me is holy priest has like 2 abilities called hymns
severe helm
thematically sure
halcyon timber
Depends how far back the devs want to go into dnd
severe helm
but wow has pretty much all mechanics covered haha
tribal badger
yea i meant fantasy wise
severe helm
yeah
tribal badger
fantasy overlaps are what blizzard likes to say are the reason they dont add specs or classes
even tho i dont believe them because evoker exists
halcyon timber
At this time prob not adding another class for a while
tribal badger
and basically just ripped the flavor from 3 existing classes
severe helm
tinker could come in the 0.1 patch
tribal badger
not a class sure
proven field
There is a ton of fantasy overlap - for like 5 expansions the most firey fire mage was a destro lock
severe helm
maybe?
proven field
Tinker I think you'd be hard-pressed to keep it away from Shaman and Surv
tribal badger
surv is pretty close to tinker fantasy yea, its missing the engineering stuff but its got the bombs and explosives on lock
proven field
Or you just end up with the usual "Eviscerate is now called dispatch because pirates"
tribal badger
its maybe 25% of the way there
severe helm
Tinker I think you'd be hard-pressed to keep it away from Shaman and Surv
shaman idk
surv maybe
but I think its fine
shaman has nothing to do with tinker I dont think
tribal badger
to be clear, i dont think its veen a problem when some fantasies overlap
this is just what blizzard claims to be the reason
proven field
if a tinker is dropping tote... bots to support then it's a shama... tinker
tribal badger
for not adding new things
halcyon timber
Totem overloading was just gw2 engineer
severe helm
tinker bots probably wouldnt be aura buffs like shaman
theyd probably be pets that detonate or something
tribal badger
u know a fantasy almost no mmo ever does which i actually love to bits
proven field
like a magma totem
severe helm
more like implosion from demo
tribal badger
anyone played mesmer in gw2
severe helm
nah not really
proven field
or they could shoot like a searing totem
proven field
its in hero tree!
tribal badger
illusionist is a pretty rare trope
tribal badger
i agree
severe helm
but they should have had a melee spec
proven field
but you get my point - you take shaman, you take surv, you put them in a silo and make them kiss and out pops a tinker spec
severe helm
and the fucking body 1 type for dragon should have been like the guards in valdrakken
proven field
throw in some engineering and boom
severe helm
not this wimpy dragon shit
tribal badger
dev and aug really dont do anything for me fantasy wise, just feels like im stealing other classes fantasy and gimped to a 25 yard range
severe helm
same
tribal badger
for pres at least half the toolkit is arcane healing
which is interesting and fairly unique
severe helm
evoker is one of the least popular classes
tribal badger
but the other half is just rdruid + rshaman
proven field
Dev is super awesome fun to play but how many specs are going to launch fire at people
severe helm
normally when they make a new class that shit pops off
severe helm
Dev is super awesome fun to play but how many specs are going to launch fire at ...
dev is probably the least engaging spec in all of wow
proven field
then you have not dev'd
tribal badger
the engaging part of dev is just the utility
proven field
it's hilariously fun
tribal badger
the damage toolkit is meh
severe helm
then you have not dev'd
nah lol
tribal badger
feels like its missing something
severe helm
dev is hilariously bland
tribal badger
i mean in pvp u just beam people to death
severe helm
its so boring
severe helm
it feels like youre a level 20 character
tribal badger
yea
tribal badger
the kit feels like its missing 2-3 abilities and 1-2 interplays
proven field
the utility though, if you're good at it, you can do almost anything
tribal badger
of a modern dps
severe helm
theres no nuance to the spec like at all
severe helm
the utility though, if you're good at it, you can do almost anything
yeah everything good that dev has is baseline class stuff haha
dev itself is the most boiled down spec
halcyon timber
Well it is evergreen so they will add to it and stuff
proven field
the problem is they should have made Aug be talent choices in the Dev tree
we got two half-cooked pizzas
but I get it too... like what do you do "we are dragons" "how do dragons attack?" "we shoot fire from our mouths" "ok what else" "we have wings"
tribal badger
i mean they r like "their magic represents the dragonflights" which ok but the dragonflights magic already exists in like 3-4 classes in the game
so ur literally just directly stealing that flavor from them
it was an odd choice
proven field
feral has like... 350,000 angry kitten moves - we could ahve reskinned 1-2
tribal badger
it was also like half delivered
remember blizzcon
we were promised multiple dracthyr body models
they had a buff dracthyr and a skinny twink one
halcyon timber
Wip
proven field
no we got middle one
there is a true twink one we didnt get either, same with Kul Tiran
severe helm
theres literally one dragon body type
tribal badger
that sounds terrifying
tribal badger
also hilarious they went an entire expansion, arguably their expansion without adding a single model of armor to the dracthy form
like u couldnt make transmog work remotely (which u said u would for their tier sets at least)
u could at least continue to add armor models to the barber
so they have more then 3 options
proven field
I like using toys so I just swim through the air as a gnome the entire time
severe helm
it lets u make one bigger
it lets you make one 5% bigger
you cant even tell which body type an evoker is
proven field
it lets u make one bigger
It's a slider like KMMOs
severe helm
when just looking at one
tribal badger
dragonchads were stolen from us
proven field
this what ppl wanted - esp if you roll a plate wearer
halcyon timber
Those are drakonids though no
proven field
but these dudes would be fun for rogues etc
These are just all the skins of NPCs in Valdrakken
and this is KT Twink skin:
halcyon timber
Its the animators going with what they have got at a base . Real hard to get brand new everything and rig and then put in the engine . Real time consuming stuff. I might do stuff for the student art contest but really pressed for time.
old dome
As a average Andy trying to get 1.8k in blitz. Sub or out?
proven field
Prolly map-dependent at this point - you can roll either but sub on certain maps prolly has the edge
I would just roll assa if the goal was run it up though
old dome
Assa is the on spec im most bad with and just cant seem to grip.
proven field
What are you best with and what do you enjoy the most?
old dome
PvP sub. PvE Out.
proven field
HRM interesting - if you're best with sub and looking to climb, stay there - but there is fun to be had as a pirate too
steel ferry
what poisons should I be using for just general bg pvp?
lavish gorge
what poisons should I be using for just general bg pvp?
Crippling, wounding.
Numbing has use cases vs wounding however.
Albeit niche-ish
lime oar
and this is KT Twink skin:
The Malnourished crackhead fits the rogue vibe pretty good ngl
severe helm
this what ppl wanted - esp if you roll a plate wearer
this would have been infinitely better than our shitty 2 wimp bodies
severe helm
Numbing has use cases vs wounding however.
numbing doesnt replace wound
it replaces crippling
lavish gorge
Didn't say it did. Just said niche use cases 🙂
severe helm
in bgs its probably best to just always run crippling
and wound
your only other option for a lethal poison as sub/outlaw is instant poison
which isnt much more damage so its not worth it over the MS effect
numbing can be good in arena but theyve nerfed it quite a few times
so its not very strong anymore
proven field
Honestly as outlaw you dont even see poisons on details
it's way way way way down next to 2P proc lol
dark stump
can someone explain to me how to play outlaw ? i'm always last in damage
severe helm
check out the wowhead guide
it covers all the rotation rules
its written by one of the community figures here its very thorough
proven field
can someone explain to me how to play outlaw ? i'm always last in damage
Run some LFR raids and watch details - it's a nice long-form practice tool for rotation and still has you watching some mechanics etc
lapis sapphire
Is outlaw as good as sub say in 1v1?
Assasination seems like the worst since it gets hard countered by anything with a bleed purge.
But still very good vs most things
Anyone with dueling exp care to comment ?
dark stump
check out the wowhead guide
there's a wowhead guide for pvp ? i can't find it
hidden moth
@dark stump
double evoker heals is so fucking cringe for wsg
also is kings bane not a poison but a physical effect?
severe helm
there's a wowhead guide for pvp ? i can't find it
All of the damage rules apply in pvp and pve
Outlaw rotation isn't really changed for pvp
If anything more outlaws need to read the pve guide cuz their DPS is beans
severe helm
also is kings bane not a poison but a physical effect?
It does nature damage
And is considered a poison in terms of damage increases that reference poison I believe
Don't think it's reduced by armor though
steel scarab
In rated BGs with sin, is it worth dropping either Scent of Blood or Zoldyck to pick up Dragon Tempered Blades for utility?
lapis sapphire
Is outlaw any good 1v1?
potent pivot
In rated BGs with sin, is it worth dropping either Scent of Blood or Zoldyck to ...
nop
long shore
What rogue spec would you guys suggest for BG Blitz ?
potent pivot
any of them
long shore
If you had to choose one?
potent pivot
the one you are the best at playing
long shore
Sub and outlaw damage feels so low. Can't kill a ret 1 v 1 argh
I played sub today. And it sucks that you can pull the enemy team healers to nodes, but my own team can't win a team fight for nuts
And any ret / decent lock guarding a node and it's not winnable 1 v 1
stoic spruce
lapis sapphire
No way to restealth though
Like sub has the vanish shield
Since every dot in the game is 18272662 seconds
Unless you blow cloak ofc
hidden moth
And is considered a poison in terms of damage increases that reference poison I ...
but if its poison why does bop remove is Cries
severe helm
Blizz is bad at coding idk lol
severe helm
Is outlaw any good 1v1?
It's aite
Above average but not the best
Will lose to a lot of things that have off healing cuz you don't have enough damage to kill
Like ret, feral, spriest are all hard
safe pelican
I think outlaw is really good at dueling but i can’t reveal the secret or yall gunna start winning those 1v1s in blitz & we can’t have that 🦦
I miss sub 😔
Might have to just get beat on in the name of sublety
hidden moth
also side note
why tf did they change the server names for anniversary classic
meme funny world buff names that made sense with the server type to Kekwlulz tier 1 set for rogue, some dragon boss from sunken temple and a ogre boss from lbrs
severe helm
I think outlaw is really good at dueling but i can’t reveal the secret or yall g...
Uh hu lol
I have yet to hear a secret that isn't extremely underwhelming haha
safe pelican
Nothing crazy that YOU don’t know its def bad into the classes you mentioned but i like outlaw into feral if i catch them in cat form
severe helm
Assa feels close
hidden moth
u just gotta play ur cards right and outplay their cds
bait their big cloak with a deathmark and then hit em with kb if they cloak it or vice versa
severe helm
Rogue v rogue is whoever can get the full kidney off first
Usually wins
Or triple cheap in subs case
Sad thing is outlaw is the only of the 3 that can't really kill you in one clean stun
potent pivot
@spring bough are you Slavghter?
severe helm
It just doesnt have the burst of the other specs
hidden moth
i usually just use the triple cheap for assa lol
hidden moth
get the dots rolling vanish and ur chillin
severe helm
Ah yeah
severe helm
Outlaw doesn't have any dots to keep other rogues
So it's really easy to get stalled out
spring bough
<@913956782961995796> are you Slavghter?
Idk what that means lol
spring bough
What’d you just school someone named that lol
potent pivot
i ran into them a couple times yesterday
they weren't even putting up their deathstalker's mark lol
spring bough
Ooof not good
I blinded someone’s deathmark off in a blitz as we killed the EFC and this dude was lighting me up
Was like chill out bro we killed him
hazy monolith
!stats
lethal roostBOT
These are the recommended stat priorities for each spec in PvP. Please keep in mind that having suboptimal stats on some pieces such as tier set pieces is not the end of the world.
Subtlety: Vers>Mastery>Crit>Haste
Assassination: Vers>Mastery>Crit=/=Haste
Outlaw: Vers>Haste=/=Crit>Mastery
You likely want to stack at least 20% Haste on Outlaw for an extra GCD during ADR/Crackshot windows. Take 'em by Surprise gives you 10% during CS windows, so you only need 10-15% from gear.
hazy monolith
why does it say 10-15
potent pivot
I blinded someone’s deathmark off in a blitz as we killed the EFC and this dude ...
yeh that's like the worst feeling lol
potent pivot
why does it say 10-15
10% is the 'mandatory' amount
spring bough
yeh that's like the worst feeling lol
I got the KB too 😂
potent pivot
15% isn't really worth
hazy monolith
icic
thx
is there a vers max for outlaw or do we just optimize for vers after 10% haste?
potent pivot
is there a vers max for outlaw or do we just optimize for vers after 10% haste?
and crit
hazy monolith
so why optimizing for critt then
severe helm
oh for sure you do
severe helm
so why optimizing for critt then
cuz you cant get gear iwth only vers
crit is our second best stat
but even without the pvp crit nerf, its still worse than vers even up to 40% vers
outlaw secondaries just suck
hazy monolith
atleast wrist you can
potent pivot
i don't think anyone has gone out of their way for more than 30% vers
severe helm
but crit is way better than mastery and haste
severe helm
atleast wrist you can
yeah the engineering items with all vers are def better usually
potent pivot
nah
potent pivot
they aren't multi specing with haste/vers or crit/vers bracers
severe helm
youd need to make mythic track
potent pivot
can you make pvp engi bracers?
yes..
hazy monolith
there are pvp engi
severe helm
I thought they changed how that works
potent pivot
...yes...
severe helm
oh nice imma def be doin that
whats funny @potent pivot is if you play SC as HO, haste is actually better than crit even up to like 16%
potent pivot
i don't see anyone pushing vers past 30%
potent pivot
whats funny <@629463378250956810> is if you play SC as HO, haste is actually bet...
if that's true in pve it doesn't make it true in pvp
severe helm
I mean in terms of overall damage
bte crits are just so heavily nerfed I feel like crit chance is way less value in pvp than pve
and even in pve its less value than vers
so not sure how it would be more value in pvp than vers
hazy monolith
what about the hero crit interactions
severe helm
which ones
hazy monolith
potent pivot
so not sure how it would be more value in pvp than vers
just telling you that no1 stacks it past 30%
can't find a single person past like 31%
severe helm
Yeah I think its possible the gear just doesnt allow you to
I'm fully geared right now leme see how much I have
this is as much as I've got
I would love to have more tbh haha
but were just too low ilvl still since its s1
potent pivot
also running more haste for energy regen
you should know exactly how dumb that sounds
severe helm
I thought the same thing
but I played with both and simmed both
when I play vigor I drop all my haste back to 9%
potent pivot
sims
severe helm
sims <:dead:932888396316155934>
its better than arbitrary anecdotes or theories haha
gotta use all the tools you got
severe helm
theyre still useful
the alternative is just to use nothing?
and to guess what stats are better?
potent pivot
the alternative is to test
potent pivot
also dummy testing for energy regen is fine
severe helm
pvp dummies do have most modifiers
they have no instance modifiers
potent pivot
js
hazy monolith
me, who just switch from haste to crit neck and put 2 sockets on it
and play sc ho
severe helm
youll be fine either way
potent pivot
they have no instance modifiers
?
potent pivot
and play sc ho
you're fine
ignore this
he's talking about what comes out ahead in pve
severe helm
So what results were showing you that crit is more or similar value to vers in pvp?
potent pivot
i never said those words
i was merely replying to you talking about running up to 40% vers
severe helm
ah I thought you were saying vers isnt the best stat to stack
severe helm
Yeah I mean we did it in previous seasons and its not like we gained much crit value this season vs DF
potent pivot
i'm saying no1 stacks it past 30% rn
severe helm
well you cant haha
severe helm
what does this scale to in pvp mode I wonder
thats top outlaw stat distribution from murlok
potent pivot
what does this scale to in pvp mode I wonder
around 25-26 i think
that 20% seems off
if it's 15.7k
potent pivot
my feral has 19.94% at 13.5k ish rating
which scales up to just under 24 or 25 iirc
steel scarab
Nice
hazy monolith
I have 29% vers in pvp rn without the bracers
and without 639 pants
and without main vers gems
but discussions based on >simulated dmg only< for arena is yeah
how good is tempted fate actually? is it doing a lot or is it better going vers for the defensive value?
potent pivot
how good is tempted fate actually? is it doing a lot or is it better going vers ...
huh
tempted fate has no real bearing on what stats you pick
severe helm
but discussions based on >simulated dmg only< for arena is yeah
its just a combination
its one tool to use its silly to ignore it
ofc your goal isnt to just do as much overall damage as possible
you haev to consider gcds spent on cc and defensives etc
hazy monolith
yeah thats exactly why i liked more haste
severe helm
Yeah vers is undeniably our best stat but tbh the gearing as outlaw is pretty minimal impact
I see outlaws running mastery as their second priority
you lose some damage but outlaws not winning on raw damage anyway
proven field
I am full mastery on an alt and it's a bit feast/famine but the pump sections are more fun
I meant to do the vancleef bladeflurry spec but just forgot to actually change talents and am having fun anyway
potent pivot
its one tool to use its silly to ignore it
i wish there was a way to make it a decent tool for pvp
i really do
have tried asking a few people that do different stuff with simc but everyone's said it isn't possible to make it a decent tool for pvp without a lot of changes
if possible at all
severe helm
I just wanted to be able to add in the pvp modifiers
but the modifier values and stuff are all in the backend of simcraft so unless you run a sim locally its hard to change those
potent pivot
you'd have to adjust the armor and add vers values to the target as well i think
but yeah even to just sim an opener (like no stuns in the gameplay), just an optimized 5-10 GCDs it just isn't possible without changing a shit load of stuff
severe helm
vers I thnk is okay cuz it impacts everything the same
so it shouldnt necessarily matter
severe helm
but yeah even to just sim an opener (like no stuns in the gameplay), just an opt...
yeah that would be nice
to sim a 10s window
and see which talents increase that damage th emost
severe helm
Yeah I mean those would be nice but not necessary just for being able to see what improves your burst more
like the ability to "replay" a burst window would be great
potent pivot
maybe one day we'll be able to use combat logs from the game to code a backend somehow
severe helm
problem is the logs would change right?
if you had less energy/crits that cause procs for cps
potent pivot
but the pvp community just doesn't have enough people dedicated enough to do all this work every season
hazy monolith
well it wouldnt be that bad if we had a nice overview of all the pvp modifiers for spells and effects
or a fully reliable dummy
gear is easy vers on enemy you can ignore
potent pivot
most pvp mods apply when hitting a pvp dummy
there's usually only a a few things per spec that don't
severe helm
The global crit nerf in pvp doesnt apply on dummies does it?
nor does the bte crit nerf
the shadow priest nerfs dont apply either
Ive never had a spec where any of the modifiers apply haha but maybe Im just unlucky with the specs I play
potent pivot
most modifiers apply
severe helm
Its also hard that blizzard doesnt maintain a running list of pvp modifiers that should be active at any given time
potent pivot
most sub pvp mods, most sin pvp mods
i haven't paid attention to if the crit damage nerf applies
you'd have to sit there and test specifically for that
severe helm
Yeah you can just look at average crit damage vs average normal hit damage
25% is pretty obvious enough esp if you look at something that has a lot of damage instances
potent pivot
when i test stuff on dummies it's very specific tests - not just for damage numbers in general
like when testing supercharger and big envenom/evis hits when 11.0.5 dropped, all of that was done on players
severe helm
crackshot modifier also doesnt work on dummies
I think none of the outlaw modifiers do
potent pivot
any ability modifiers should
severe helm
yeah they dont for some reason
potent pivot
like base ambush/bte
severe helm
2set 4set doesnt either
potent pivot
you sure that isn't just the tooltip
severe helm
Yeah the damage hits are the same on a regular dummy vs pvp dummy
I do this testing with pve gear on cuz obv the pvp gear scaling fucks with the numbers
nothing changes at all when hitting the pvp dummy as outlaw last time I tested which was like a month ago haha
potent pivot
well they also removed most of outlaw's base ability modifiers doing into this season
idr what all was left modified
severe helm
nah crackshot dispatch should still be nerfed and bte crit damage
severe helm
Oh I didnt know outlaw even had any base ability modifiers in pvp
afaik those were removed in S3 DF
when they did the rework
potent pivot
it had a lot even in s4
severe helm
only to talents I htink
which abilities were nerfed in S4?
Ace proc chance was nerfed, crackshot, improved bte, but I dont know of any base ability damage
potent pivot
i don't have the tuning post bookmarked anymore
severe helm
wonder if this is accurate
potent pivot
it happened during beta iirc
tall sleet
u guys use flagellation in subt?
potent pivot
most base abilities had some sort of modifier on them
severe helm
oh looks like PS is nerfed in pvp?
potent pivot
strike/ambush etc
severe helm
but thats it
potent pivot
u guys use flagellation in subt?
yes
potent pivot
what talents are u using?
one of the builds in the pins, or no double vanish/subterfuge
potent pivot
oh looks like PS is nerfed in pvp?
that's only for one of it's side effects
severe helm
side effects?
severe helm
yeah thats confusing
ps doesnt do damage to the caster
OOOH
the damage reduction
talent
potent pivot
ya
but when you look up the talent itself on wowhead it says it isn't modified
but it does modify from hitting a dummy
tall sleet
one of the builds in the pins, or no double vanish/subterfuge
seems good yeh!
hazy monolith
for DH the dummy is fucked, too
spring bough
Anyone have this weird thing where your action bars are slightly shifting left and right continuously and don’t stop
tall sleet
is it normal to crit 6.7k on pvp dummie?
potent pivot
is it normal to crit 6.7k on pvp dummie?
do you mean 6.7mil? pretty much yeah you won't hit that high on a player
severe helm
Anyone have this weird thing where your action bars are slightly shifting left a...
whoa what like wiggling??? that would be so annoying
languid ravine
I remember in Dragonflight when I said Demon Hunter guys are 300 rating too high, for BMs its 600 the amount of DRed scatter ice trap is exhiliratiaong
thorn basalt
if you hop on the other teams zepplin in seething shore, in this case alliances zepplin, and kill tremblade, does it do anything? I'm guessing it doesnt and you just get to say you solod tremblade
spring bough
So with almost 50% mastery and some MG talents can get MG almost consistently as top dmg. Just need flurry up for that extra 5% 😂
3 people in temple at 2400 with 0 orb possessions…….
severe helm
if you hop on the other teams zepplin in seething shore, in this case alliances ...
Wait how do you get on the other zeplin lol
thorn basalt
i just fly over there
severe helm
So with almost 50% mastery and some MG talents can get MG almost consistently as...
Couldn't that also mean you just lowered the damage of your other abilities hahaha
thorn basalt
get up high on your zepplin and fly over