pvp

[potent pivot]

Some small rules and optimizations are different in pvp

But just to learn how to use your abilities wowhead is great

Outlaws opener is very simple for the most part

[rare iris]

Alright, ill check that out.. Guess ill try outlaw first then

[lone anvil]

Feral is the best rogue spec rn

😉

[rain beacon]

im so tempted to level my druid

outlaw bugs are driving me nuts

outlaw nerfs dont help

im so upset killingspree cancels in pvp as well

_>

I wonder if decurse cancels killingspree lol

decurse classes are immune it seems

[potent pivot]

I actually like Feral more than I thought I would

[rain beacon]

its also because they can switch to tank mode

that seems to help a lot in pvp

[potent pivot]

Ehh

Bear form isn’t that strong tbh

And they can’t do very many things while in Bear

[rain beacon]

this feral just 1v2 in this match

i was cc trained hard

[potent pivot]

You manage to get geared up a bit yet?

[rain beacon]

should i replace tier sets or just keep them

[potent pivot]

Replace them yes

It’s not strong enough to justify 16ilvl difference on 4 items

[rain beacon]

alright sure

i kept them last didnt know

[potent pivot]

Ye I mean replacing them last was a fine plan

[rain beacon]

im on defence in wintergrasp

we run around and get all the towers

I forget that we a re defence

Try to attack walls, do no damage.

[rain beacon]

another match im just cc'd the whole time

no dmg

just fought a tank war, stunlock. seems they have no DR.

crazy

[earnest forge]

yesterday I did a very fun bg blitz vs 3 ferals and 2 boomkins <.<

and friday I enjoyed for the first time the legendary russian 10 boomkin asrhan

[rain beacon]

lol

just face hunter/pal

trying to run for my life

hunter every season - Machine gun your whole life bar

xD

[earnest forge]

I dont know, mm doesnt feel that strong rn

for what its been on the past

[rain beacon]

i wjust won

wooo

[rain beacon]

is there a hidden debuff in pvp

sometimes i cant use my skills

and im not stunned

[potent pivot]

O.o

[stoic spruce]

Mr. Mastery is in the pvp channel

Is nothing sacred?

[rain beacon]

woooooooooooooo

just won another match

[potent pivot]

Wot

[rain beacon]

climbing oh shit

[potent pivot]

Do you have energy?

Or can you describe it more

[rain beacon]

even cloak wont use

its ready

my skills are locked

but im not stunned

[stoic spruce]

Probably in a soft cc

[potent pivot]

Are you CC’d by something other than a stun?

[rain beacon]

im not sure lol

[potent pivot]

Do you not have CC pop ups enabled

In the settings

You should enable that if not

You kinda need to know when you’re CC’d

[rain beacon]

also

I have energy

just fought a war/sham

cant use skills even though energy and not stunned

[potent pivot]

Did you check the setting

[rain beacon]

need to get omnicc back on to track seconds of skills also

might look ready but its not

ill have to test it

i know for sure i have ss either though

when its ready

[potent pivot]

Did you check

Your game settings

[rain beacon]

im getting omnicc just to check cd timers

[potent pivot]

I’m talking about CC pop ups

[rain beacon]

no cc popup, i just cant use skills

[potent pivot]

Do you have a pop up on your screen normally

[rain beacon]

im thinking another pvp restriction

[potent pivot]

When you get CCd

Like Feared

Or Blind

[rain beacon]

no i can move and all

[potent pivot]

or Incapicated

Nothing should stop you from pressing abilities

Except being in Crowd Control

[rain beacon]

maybe its outlaw new shit hit boxes

[potent pivot]

Ah you can move

Hmm

[rain beacon]

but its not just attacks

[stoic spruce]

Silenced?

[rain beacon]

silenced will make cloak not work?

[stoic spruce]

Yeah

[rain beacon]

but then a notice will be on if i was silenced

[stoic spruce]

Yeah

Hmmm

Maybe you're just imagining this

[potent pivot]

He says the spells aren’t on cooldown or anything so idk

[rain beacon]

ye

[potent pivot]

The only thing I can think of is your UI is breaking

[rain beacon]

during pvp thats anoyying

[potent pivot]

Are all your addons updated

[rain beacon]

ye

[potent pivot]

For how long does it happen

[rain beacon]

maybe its a haste debuff

causes slow skill pressing

[potent pivot]

A what

[rain beacon]

i donno

some stupid pvp debuff

[potent pivot]

Can rogues attack speed even get lowered?

We don’t have a hasted GCD

I’ve never even had to think about that

[rain beacon]

oh new info

[potent pivot]

Because generally those abilities are used against casters

[rain beacon]

spriest ad can shoot you through pillars

becareful guys

[potent pivot]

Ye you need to kill it

[rain beacon]

just died to spriest duo

[potent pivot]

If you mean Psyfiend

Kill it asap

[rain beacon]

k

yooooo

[stoic spruce]

Mr. Mastery is growing up so fast :')

[azure rapids]

is that Between the eyes you cant use?

if so use another finisher to unlock it 😛

[rain beacon]

no

any skill

sinisterstrike, cloak

usually when im being focused

[azure rapids]

maybe you are disarmed or something

[rain beacon]

theres no alert on

[azure rapids]

the ammount of CC 😄

hard to tell

[rain beacon]

ye

[stoic spruce]

Sometimes when I get multiple forms of CC overlapping on me, I can't press trinket.

Been happening since SL

[rain beacon]

hmm

full set in 2 nights lol

doing dmg now

god damn

this haste cap is like most of your pvp gears

very little other gears without haste

no crit

no mastery

mostly haste cap

and vers

lost haste cap so have to find another slot for haste gear

[sharp comet]

any lads swapped to drac since the change?

increased mastery

glide

[rain beacon]

ye

[sharp comet]

2 racial stuns

seems broke as

[rain beacon]

nah

nerfed

[sharp comet]

oh for real?

[rain beacon]

1 stun and it only knocksback PVE

PVP no effect

[sharp comet]

bullllshit

[rain beacon]

also the Drac flight is longer than regular mount.

I dont use it

waste of time

[sharp comet]

noted, and is it only 1% mastery increase?

[rain beacon]

just another race for aesthetics with the nerfs

[sharp comet]

negligible if so

[rain beacon]

and glide

mainly glide and aoe knockback in pve

nothing else

other than that is dragon form or human form for aethetics

sin+sub might like the mastery 1%

lol

atleast youll never die from falling again

basically the biggest racial

[sharp comet]

lol true

but just use glider kit

ez

macro to spacebar

[rain beacon]

or double spacebar with drac

[sharp comet]

XD

[rain beacon]

not bad 50% win rate lol

and thats all for tonight

[sharp comet]

fuck yeah

[rain beacon]

Rogue/Mage

[sharp comet]

solo bg's where its at

[potent pivot]

The extra glide speed is also nerfed

So double jumping in arena provides no extra speed

It just helps deal with knock backs if you time it well

[potent pivot]

It’s like 2 or 2.5% mastery

[rain beacon]

yo

[potent pivot]

@rain beacon pvp has a completely different set of items

[rain beacon]

so we have to double craft for pve and pvp?

lame

[potent pivot]

Yeah but for pvp you don’t use the same mats

Like the shards you get are for PvE only

[rain beacon]

hmm

[potent pivot]

You shouldn’t buy or craft any weapon yet

Once you earn 2500 conquest you get tokens for free weapons

From an achievement

Then you can use the tokens to buy 2 conquest weapons

For PvP you use mats called Heraldries to for crafted gear

It’s called Algari

There’s green(613), blue(626), and purple(639) Heraldries

You get 9 free purple Heraldries from your first few pvp match wins

[shadow epoch]

Where do you get the quest for 9 purple heraldries when your fresh 80, I swear I’ve done it 5 times and can’t find it now

[rain beacon]

yeah got those

[shadow epoch]

Or am I imaging it’s a quest

And it’s part of the feat

[potent pivot]

Just win some games

No quest

[shadow epoch]

Ohh running around like a loser

[vestal marten]

One BG win or 4 arena wins and the quest will pop up

[rain beacon]

will be awhile until i hit 2500 conq

[potent pivot]

shouldn't take very long

[rain beacon]

tempted to just buy MH now

[potent pivot]

you get a lot from winning games

[rain beacon]

its cheap to make it now

compared to PvE

[potent pivot]

but you use your Heraldries

buying more Heraldries costs conquest

[rain beacon]

i see

i guess ill wait then

[potent pivot]

we're pretty much to the point where we're fully geared

[rain beacon]

I know i was facing 8mil hp players in bg's

[potent pivot]

so you can kinda do whatever, but the free weapons will let u use the Heraldries in other slots

thus making your gearing process faster

[rain beacon]

got it

[potent pivot]

basically what i do on every alt i make

honor gear -> use Heraldies on something bis like ring etc -> 2500 conquest for weapons -> buy conquest slots for tier set in Catalyst -> buy more Heraldries to craft any other bis items

[rain beacon]

i could make a ring now then

for the embelishment

in pvp

[potent pivot]

ye haste/vers ring

can also craft crit/vers neck

[rain beacon]

just got a conq neck to use for pve

ring it is\

[potent pivot]

some ppl use conq haste/vers neck

[potent pivot]

make sure u farm some bloody tokens too

you can buy 636 pvp ilvl off pieces with them

[rain beacon]

hmmm

[potent pivot]

belt, cloak, bracers

you'll replace them later, but they help you get started

[rain beacon]

where do you get bloody token

[potent pivot]

from world pvp and the wpvp crates that drop

also from weekly pvp quests

[potent pivot]

like this weekly gives 1k

[rain beacon]

do ppl actually go there to world pvp now

blizzard killed world pvp a long time ago

[potent pivot]

world pvp is very much alive

[earnest forge]

you can get bloody tokens from all world quests with pvp on actually

not just the crates and pvp quests

and you can get quite a few pieces from bloody tokens right now

[rain beacon]

interesting

[earnest forge]

Im positive the best gearing strategy right now is

[potent pivot]

aaaaand you killed it

your one singular comment is the reason he thinks world pvp is deadge
-# jk

[earnest forge]

cap bloody tokens -> win a bg for the 3 crafted pvp items -> spam wathever you can to get conquest until u get the free weapons (in the process u'll get enough conquest for 2-3 pieces that u can turn into tier)

use honor for trinkets and such

[earnest forge]

nothing avoids him from going to pvp areas

[potent pivot]

i put a little jk at the bottom

[earnest forge]

ye ye

but worldpvp is never really that fun for me

its usually a group of people demolishing randoms, rarely "even" fights

and on my realm the chests are very one sided :/

[rain beacon]

basically its not worth to spend conq on gears then. Need to spend conq on the heraldry to craft pvp gears.

[potent pivot]

you spend conq on items to Catalyst into tier

[earnest forge]

^

chest, legs, hands, etc

[potent pivot]

because tier HAS to come from conq vendor items

[rain beacon]

oh just for tier tho

[potent pivot]

naw

we use some conquest pieces

[rain beacon]

wut

[earnest forge]

you also use the trinkets afaik?

[potent pivot]

ofc

like outlaw uses 1 crafted ring, 1 conq ring

sub/assa use 2 vers/mast crafted rings as an example

but outlaw doesn't

[earnest forge]

Im using the two rings yep

[potent pivot]

outlaw likes vers

[earnest forge]

and not sure if I'll just craft the neck too with the 3 heraldries

[rain beacon]

i got conq neck

[earnest forge]

the gearing part of pvp is a bit obscure for me

[potent pivot]

conq items have more vers than crafted, so it uses conquest in a couple spots

[rain beacon]

im gonna make a heraldry ring

what should i buy next with my 900 conq

[potent pivot]

keep conq to buy and create tier items

did you spend Catalyst charges on pve?

[rain beacon]

ok so ill get my ffirst tier conq

[potent pivot]

don't you already have pve 4set

[rain beacon]

ye but one is coming this reset right

[earnest forge]

if he started late he might not have it

[rain beacon]

i can catalyst after reset

[potent pivot]

ye but just 1 item

but yeah just use conquest on the items you'll turn into tier later

[rain beacon]

well no other way to get pvp tier item

[potent pivot]

2nd rogue

[earnest forge]

tbh that's probably the best way around it

[potent pivot]

best way to pve AND pvp is to have 2 characters

[earnest forge]

yeah sadly

[rain beacon]

i will have 4 set pvp in 4 weeks gg

[earnest forge]

or never using catalyst in pve

[potent pivot]

catalyst is 1 charge every 2 weeks isn't it?

[rain beacon]

fuck

2 months until 4 set tier gg

[potent pivot]

or does it go to 1 per week after the first few weeks are over

[earnest forge]

its the same shit with playing hybrids

may aswell have a shadow priest and a disc pries

[potent pivot]

ye i have 3 rogues

[earnest forge]

cant play the same char

in my head the best way to solve it

once you buy a piece, you can buy it again with honor

if you already converted some piece to tier, same or lower item level dont use the token to change

[rain beacon]

ewwwwwwwww

conq legs have no crit

its either haste or mastery

[potent pivot]

you need haste anyway

[rain beacon]

lemee check

nah i got 8% haste

[earnest forge]

ngl the gearing progression is decent, but still confusing and penalizes

[rain beacon]

I get mastery for more MG dmg

JK ill get haste

[potent pivot]

having more haste is fine

!stats

[lethal roost]

These are the recommended stat priorities for each spec in PvP. Please keep in mind that having suboptimal stats on some pieces such as tier set pieces is not the end of the world.

Subtlety: Vers>Mastery>Crit>Haste
Assassination: Vers>Mastery>Crit=/=Haste
Outlaw: Vers>Haste=/=Crit>Mastery
You likely want to stack at least 20% Haste on Outlaw for an extra GCD during ADR/Crackshot windows. Take 'em by Surprise gives you 10% during CS windows, so you only need 10-15% from gear.

[potent pivot]

10-15%

[rain beacon]

ok haste

[potent pivot]

yeah the amount of ppl i see with absolutely terrible gear is crazy

most of the more casual players that don't check anything

[earnest forge]

the sheer amount of people I ran into with fully upgraded honor gear

0 crafted, 0 bloody

[potent pivot]

will run the wrong stats and just have very poor optimization of the currencies

well upgrading the honor gear pre season was fine if you only pvp

just for more dmg on mobs for WQs and such

because you just overcap on valorstones anyway as a pvper

[earnest forge]

yeah but not on people that's capping conquest now on random squirmishes

which I assume are alts

[rain beacon]

got it

[potent pivot]

capping conquest in skirmishes?

[earnest forge]

like, if im doing pvp for a couple weeks, I shouldnt have more pvp ilvl than you

[potent pivot]

that sounds miserable

[earnest forge]

I mean, doing the quest

[potent pivot]

aw shit

don't turn those into tier

[earnest forge]

literally find the highest rated outlaw rogue and copy his shit

[potent pivot]

outlaw uses helm/gloves/chest/shoulders for tier

well some people went legs not helm

[rain beacon]

pvp 627 ilvl in 2 nights

[potent pivot]

should be fine

[potent pivot]

are you familiar with murlok.io

[rain beacon]

no

[potent pivot]

https://murlok.io/rogue/outlaw/solo#gear

this will show you what people use

for gear, embellishments, enchants, all that good stuff

[rain beacon]

i see

ill have to check it later

[earnest forge]

@rain beacon u probably want to get all the offpieces you can from bloody tokens right now

[rain beacon]

im going to craft the ring now and then farm tokens next i guess

[earnest forge]

yesterday in eu there were two quests for 500 each, that was fun.

[potent pivot]

yeah in NA we have 2 up rn

[rain beacon]

i have to start using the equip manager again

fuck all this gear

[spring bough]

Outlaw >>>

[safe pelican]

Assa>>> , sincerely the newest member of the outlaw rogue bg community

Outlaw rogue has me in a little chokehold right now ngl will probably push assa in shuffle today maybe any less than 3-3 first game getting on outlaw

[lone anvil]

Has anyone seen glitches with rated pvp wins/losses/rating

I was starting to gear and play my warlock this week. And I was doing BG blitz everyday for the daily conquest reward.

And I didn't do many. I think I was like 5 wins out of 7 played with 900 rating or something

But I log in today and it's showing 4 played 0 won 0 rating

[hidden moth]

are u lookijng at "this week" or "season"

2nd disc priest im gearing slow as fuck rn

but u see how it says weekly and season

[lone anvil]

I think it was displaying as 0 because I was on my destruction spec (I PvE as Destro)

And I pvp as affliction

[waxen meteor]

it's by spec

[hidden moth]

timewlaking sucks now

hit lvl 70 at like 337 ilvl with maxed heirlooms and ur stats fall off a cliff

[spring bough]

Gotta find a level 50s tank to Que with 😂

[hidden moth]

bro ik

[surreal barn]

Heirlooms are kinda shit

[spring bough]

They’ll do a quick 200 mil dps and delete the place in 5 seconds

[hidden moth]

as a dps my damage just droped off the cliff, and even with buyign the time walking gear its not even 450 ilvl

[spring bough]

Ilvl scaling sucks from 70 to 80 lol

[hidden moth]

wish we scaled down

like we used to vs scaling up

such a bad change

[brisk perch]

what enchants are you guys using on daggers for pvp? I can't find a clear "winner" online

[hidden moth]

double radiant

[brisk perch]

Cool, will give that a try, ty 🙂

[tranquil jay]

anyone has a clue how to make a WA like this for the new supercharged CPs?

[rain beacon]

How do I get pvp sockets?

[tranquil jay]

my brain is lagging if i play with new style combo points , i cant get used to it since legion

[rain beacon]

I didnt see any sockets in the pvp vendor or AH.

[tranquil jay]

u need 3 Vicious Bloodstone + 5k honor

and the vendor on the left sells it

[rain beacon]

Okay ill look ty

[tranquil jay]

ill send you a pic in a sec

[rain beacon]

Vicious bloodstone, is that the 7000g item lol?

[tranquil jay]

yes or 2500h onor each

[rain beacon]

Ok so 13500 honor per socket. Ewwwww

Ty for info

I know that npc I'll check it out when I get home.

[tranquil jay]

do mining + herb during ques

u buy 1 from honor then 1 from the mats u sell

[rain beacon]

I'm chant/alch

[tranquil jay]

you can get bloodstone from pvp chests

but low drop%

[rain beacon]

Oh we get those on arena wins

I'll have to see what is the fastest way to get honor

Epic bg gives 1k per win. But don't always win.

[tranquil jay]

doing 2s/3s/ss is the fastest

no way its bg

[rain beacon]

I'm just starting to arena

So im not familiar with arena honor

My embellishment on ring won't work until I get this socket lol

It was no wonder my dmg was shit while undergeared

All these new enchants and gems and special gears.

[waxen meteor]

socket/embellishment don't help that much on dmg..

[surreal barn]

Sockets are like wearing another pc of gear once you get them all

[waxen meteor]

1400 secondary stats

[topaz bobcat]

I'm in full troll mode today

gonna bait afew people or the urges will consume me

[lone anvil]

https://www.instagram.com/reel/DBojevNOVN2/?igsh=NW9lNXZlbjZ6bHhu

insta.single

Take away his dinner if he loses 😭😂😂😂 Movie: The Break-Up

Likes

5185

Instagram

[molten hedge]

Have any of you tried the Supercharged shivs on Assa? I usually play deeper strat but did play a ST kingsbane poison build with supercharge that did feel kinda nice with Deathstalker trying to line up the burst

Idk if I’m just convincing myself it’s nice tho and deeper strat > coldblood and supercharge

Just searched it in here and saw @potent pivot and ivanrah discussing it. But saw some say it’s good and bad lol. What situations is it good in

[jaunty osprey]

In a 3v3 setting, bleed spec is way better imo

You play your role by spreading pressure and keeping everyone rotted and your teammate

is able to do their thing and hit whoever they can

In a 2v2 setting, that envenom build can definitely work

[molten hedge]

What about shuffs

[jaunty osprey]

Especially if it’s vs healer + range where you can’t multi dot

Bleed spec for shuffle

[molten hedge]

What about in a 3s or shuffle into double wizards where you can only have uptime on one like say it’s devoker and frost mage

[jaunty osprey]

Teammates will sometimes not hit the same target as you, having spread pressure is good and can potential kill them with sudden demise if your teammate is focusing someone you aren’t

Will if you have no uptime wouldn’t you want stronger bleeds to rot

while you can’t melee?

[molten hedge]

Yeah so basically don’t play supercharger if all you do is shuffs and 3s like me

[jaunty osprey]

what makes you think you can maintain bleeds AND have conbo points to kidney AND build up a supercharged envenom if you have 0 uptime

If I’m going to be honest, I can see it working vs Demo warlock and BM hunter where you can fan once and fill out your entire CP

cause if you get then to around 4m HP with everything lined up

they’ll die to sudden demise + DFA/envenom

[molten hedge]

I’m playing 3s with a devoker. I guess playing bleeds is better anyway since they pump hard

[jaunty osprey]

Ya with Dev, just spread bleeds

and tab often

the devoker will kill someone

with your sudden demise

i send a lot of kidneys on the healer with a Dev

Since Dev likes to deep breath

DPS

[molten hedge]

In shuffle I usually kidney the KT or other DPS. If I’m 3s with dev and disc, would it be better to kidney healer

Lol wow. Answered my question

[jaunty osprey]

Since you have 12 seconds of empowered garrote now

open with cheap shot and ambush

[topaz bobcat]

took me 8 mins as outlaw to kill disc 1v1 in arena with dampening

[jaunty osprey]

then apply ur garrotes

[topaz bobcat]

outlaw is poooooo

[jaunty osprey]

and then sending first kidney on the healer

[molten hedge]

For sure. Love that

[jaunty osprey]

after sap

[molten hedge]

Do u blind after that

On healer

Or save I

It

[jaunty osprey]

ya u can

[topaz bobcat]

feint off gcd was big imo

now actually gonna press

[jaunty osprey]

I like doing sap -> kidney -> blind

to maximize blackjack timing

[molten hedge]

So with bleed build master assassin doesn’t rly make sense does it since ur not envenoming a lot during subt or after

[jaunty osprey]

Or you can tell ur dev or disc to sleep off of sap

master assa is so good

Mutilates or fan of knives having more crit

makes u fill CP

It’s not worth taking doomblade if you aren’t grabbing SBS

U have nowhere else to put the points

[molten hedge]

Remind me what SBS I’m newer to rogue

[jaunty osprey]

bone spike

that applies from rupture, should be on the right side somewhere above sudden demise

[molten hedge]

Yeah is bone spike even worth? Seems not for the damage. But maybe the CP or something else I’m unaware of?

[jaunty osprey]

So big, I just started taking the talent that makes it cost less energy

since I’m pressing it more

[jaunty osprey]

If you don’t like playing Kingsbane, SBS is good

It’s all preference

but MA is good imo

[molten hedge]

I like kingsbane. Have had it crit 1.5 millie vanillies

[jaunty osprey]

Yeeeee

Kingsbane is fun using it below 35% as an execute

Using it completely diff than the PVE style of sending it during death mark

[molten hedge]

I think when I was playin ST poison I hit a 1.5 kingsbane into a 2.8 envenom DFA lol. Thats fun. I wish I could do that with bleed build but alas

I just check pvpd you @jaunty osprey. you play coldblood>deeper strat?

[jaunty osprey]

ye

Both are good, I just play to use KB as a big execute

[molten hedge]

Do you feel like you lose a lot of dam by dropping deeper strat? Is it comp dependent? If so what kinda classes are you playing coldblood into?

[jaunty osprey]

5% on rupture vs

20% crit dam w kb and fan

[molten hedge]

Also, with coldblood, it only effects the initial Kingsbane hit and not anything after right?

[jaunty osprey]

Ya

[molten hedge]

Ahh ok. I wonder if there’s anyone playing the fatebound ST kingsbane/poison build with the coldblood x2 envenoms lmao

I tried Fatebound and didn’t like any of it besides the extra steps and random tails flips that crit

[jaunty osprey]

With CB KB

you can always send it below 35%

And they will always die

[molten hedge]

So you kinda save it in opener and wait to see if anyone drops rly low

Or just send it and see where they’re at when KB comes back

[jaunty osprey]

I always hold for sub 35%

cause game is so unpredictable, you never know if ur teammate will mega pump a random target and u wish u had it up

[molten hedge]

This was my partner last night. Death log was dumb lol he did this like 10 times in a row

That’s great advice and something I’m not doing. I bet that’ll help us land kills

I rarely have time to burst right away anyway since I’m cheaping and garroting the opener

[jaunty osprey]

😄

you can definitely send it early and just play around early pressure and kingsbane dot ticking for 200k, I just don’t because I play cold blood

If I ran deeper, I’d just send it

[molten hedge]

I’ll try it out for sure. So if you play coldblood there’s not rly a point to play sanguine strat right?

[jaunty osprey]

Sanguine strat wot

Oh

Assa tree

I mean you can

I just like fan of knives

Way more efficient in 3s vs mutilate

And hits harder

And longer range for when I’m being kited

to build CP

Both work though

[molten hedge]

Yeah that’s a good point. I’ve been poison knifing when getting kited lol. I need to try poison knifing totems I can’t reach. Idk how many it would take

Depends on totem I presume

[jaunty osprey]

totem of wrath and grounding is 1 shot

I think earthgrab too

everything else is 99 mutilates and 6 envenoms

[molten hedge]

Dope. Thanks for taking time to explain all this. It’s v much appreciated

[hardy tinsel]

does hit and run a viable tactic for outlaw?

I'm new to pvp

[molten hedge]

I doubt it. They don’t do enough dam. If you were a feral maybe but no uptime no pressure really

[hardy tinsel]

fake your commit and let them waste their cd, then you grapple away to hide

btw is there an opener for pvp?

[brave tangle]

when playing sub with thistle tea and no subterfuge...when do you ST if you have 4 set? Straight away or after an evis?

if sb and flaggelation is up

asking about the opener

any suggestions?

[molten hedge]

Do you always take Follow the Blood over Momentum of Despair in shuff/3s? @jaunty osprey

[rain beacon]

I'm also new but I just open same as pve and get them low, hook away to restealth when they pop survivals.

Was climbing last night doing this.

Also hook away if your getting low.

I'm playing with mage so I have food when I restealth.

Once I'm good, I go back in.

Or bubbles drop I go back in.

Mage can 1v2 while I'm eating lol

When I go back in after their survival are done, we usually get a kill.

If you are not killed and restealth successfully that is.

I guess you could say adr is outlaws source of burst, since we have unlimited energy during it. In pvp.

I'm also becoming more aware of when to use stuns and blind. Blind is our key to get a lot of kills to lower healing or cc healers and get a kill.

[hardy tinsel]

my first match this season

not bad ig

still lose

all I did is spam bte and finish them with KS

[jaunty osprey]

Recently yes, with only needing 2 ruptures out, it makes more sense

Since it’s increase damage on ALL fan and CT

whereas momentum is only on the crits

2 ruptures out is always guaranteed

When it was 3 ruptures required, it definitely wasn’t better

[rain beacon]

BGs are hit and miss on win/lose dont think of your performance as a deciding factor for bg, you cant solo a raid. We can still enjoy our kills and dmg tho, win or lose. Everyone always gangbangs me in bgs haha

[jaunty osprey]

30% damage on Fan and CT at all times vs 32% only on Crits

The additional crit chance is good on Momentum, but meh

It still only increases crit damage vs all damage

[molten hedge]

Yeah you’re right. I do use fan a lot so I can see it being nice especially in cleaves

I had UHDK/BM last night lol I loved it

[jaunty osprey]

CT does more damage to players than rupture for me vs demo, BM, and UHDK

i love it

[molten hedge]

Oh ya it’s a blast

Do u try to fill up CPs before CT always in those scenarios or just FOK/CT spam

[jaunty osprey]

Don’t mind my Jsnlol rogue being logged off in Envenom spec talents btw lol

[molten hedge]

I saw that lmaooo

[hardy tinsel]

Are we supposed to interrupt their backline?

[rain beacon]

Generally all stealth should go for healers yeah. Usually in back.

[jaunty osprey]

Uhh I just cheap shot, ambush, garrote x2, rupture, fan, CT

[hardy tinsel]

I see

[jaunty osprey]

most of the time in aoe openers

throw a shiv and tea somewhere in there

[hardy tinsel]

I also is sapping reinforcements a good play?

[jaunty osprey]

And blind/kidney on healer after sap

[molten hedge]

Ya but after ur bleeds and marks are up do you FOK then CT or use Fan until full CP

bc I thought CT does same dmg per tick it’s just more time not dmg

[jaunty osprey]

Always use finishers with

5+ cp

Never use it with less

[molten hedge]

🫡

[rain beacon]

Yeah sure.

Spec out of tricks and get that sap/blind talent. They will do less dmg and healing when you sap/blind.

[hardy tinsel]

Nice

[jaunty osprey]

Blackjack!

[hardy tinsel]

Gotta try more BG

[rain beacon]

I got full pvp gear in 2 days

Won't take long

[hardy tinsel]

I play with my pve gears

[rain beacon]

I have 3 gears 639 already

Rest are greens that go 626

[hardy tinsel]

Hmm

[rain beacon]

Roughly 2 bgs for 1 626 pvp gear.

Epic bg wins give 1500 honor, you can get 2 gears with that.

[hardy tinsel]

a green pvp gear is equal to my heroic pve gear…

[rain beacon]

Well don't worry then

Save your honor for pvp sockets then

[hardy tinsel]

Alright

[rain beacon]

1 pvp socket is 13k honor

[molten hedge]

Not if you buy the vicious bloodstones 😏

[rain beacon]

You can also buy the gem to make pvp crafted gears for 639

[rain beacon]

Actually you could just save for high end pvp crafted gear. Save conq for tier sets and trinkets. Sockets last.

I got green gears first to get 626. Now I'm working on conq tier set and trinkets.

I crafted a 639 pvp ring also, since my pve ring sucked.

[molten hedge]

@jaunty osprey is Shadowrunner rly that necessary? I’d like to drop it so I can have more of the nodes on the 4th and 5th row

[jaunty osprey]

No

Neither is featherfoot

Or rushed setup

swap all of those around as you please

Iron stomach + nimble + unbreakable stride all good

[rain beacon]

Guys

What's your take on fighting a prot war

They don't have stun DR.

This prot war stunlock me last night

And they take no damage really lol

[jolly sierra]

hit and run

they heals when they hits u

[rain beacon]

I see

[stoic spruce]

They do, you're just bad

[jolly sierra]

big meanie

[stoic spruce]

Teehee

[rain beacon]

True but im learning fast

[stoic spruce]

Uh oh

Here comes trouble

[stoic spruce]

Mr. Mastery is my friend

[rain beacon]

Also

Pvp gears had to drop mastery

[stoic spruce]

Yeahhhh

So sad really

[rain beacon]

Haste stack for req

So treat blood dk and prot war same

[stoic spruce]

Yeah

[rain beacon]

Just run away

[spring bough]

Mr haste is my friend

[rain beacon]

What about evokers

They kite me all night in bgs

They are immune to crippling poison

[brisk perch]

Now that's a broken comp 😅

[rain beacon]

Imagine 3 evokers

Same thing prob

[jolly sierra]

BTW got the 1k8 yesterday after not playing rated for weeks

seems like i just have no time

[atomic vault]

Anyone got a sin roque pvp build i could copy? :o

[devout bear]

Check pins

[atomic vault]

ty

c:

[dapper chasm]

yeah, not many of us skilled players left at that low rating now

should be easier now

[fallow rune]

Any idea what people do that makes them able to "bug out" and disappear when they're about to die in world-pvp?

[lime oar]

Follower dungeon que

[fallow rune]

Ah, so its on purpose then. Massive L-move.

[waxen meteor]

pfff i didn't realize there's a such bitchy way lol

[stoic spruce]

Yes you did

You're a sub rogue

You know all this stuff

YOU CANT TRICK ME

[native pagoda]

starting at 0 rating in blitz is actually so horrible. Legit 6/8 of my team went mid to get flag in eots, brought it to an inactive base and stood there the entire game.

[spring bough]

$20 that’s all one player multi boxing 😂

I remember in classic some dude multi boxed 10 elemental shamans in battlegrounds and he would one cast lightning bolt people to death

[spring bough]

Tricksters gonna trick

[waxen meteor]

Man, can't believe it, you are the only one I found out doing the same as i have been lol -.-

[jolly sierra]

is still tough tho, r1 are at like 2k4 in assa at least for SS

imagine u try to push to 2k1 and u find the regular glads

[dapper chasm]

Yeah, that's the mid game

[lyric onyx]

Damnn way to shoot em down

[lime oar]

Yeah it’s always ppl who just wpvp for their fun. These people don’t que or push rating. Just use every gameplay/item gimmick in the game to rage bait ppl

[jolly sierra]

they are just legit trolling to grief ppl in outdoor

[gleaming pawn]

More tuning for tomorrow, for Sub

[jolly sierra]

F

[wicked tide]

lol all the top rogues hate new sub and they killing it even further

[worthy crag]

Im glad to have less reason to play flag but yeah we kinda had to do it

[wicked tide]

Surely they give us something in return

[worthy crag]

Not dooming but sub looking p dead

[wicked tide]

They should be ashamed of this rendition of sub

[worthy crag]

nah all pvp community freaks out if sub is given anything

Ive been pretty inactive on rogue for a while now and they honestly give less and less reason to come back

[bleak dagger]

Mmm… yeah that’s a rip for sub, gna try sin ig

[wicked tide]

Just lame they do this, hopefully they give us something

[worthy crag]

The feral treatment = 3% nerf

the sub treatment meme

[gleaming pawn]

They won’t, the general pvp community abhors when Sub does actual damage

[worthy crag]

Rephrase that to "the whole community abhors sub"

You could post some gibberish like sub needs a 28 seconds cd on cheap shot and blind reduced to 1.5 seconds and itll get 60 upvotes

[wicked tide]

They just over nerf us every single time I mean they gutted the spec and made it a meme one shot and now we don’t even have the 1 shot which is lame to begin with

I wish they communicated with the rogue community

[gleaming pawn]

Just remember, the new darling of Feral still has a 20sec CD stun while Kidney is 30sec

[bleak dagger]

Yeah someone explain where the devs are taking the sub design philosophy. I don’t understand

[worthy crag]

The funny part is it will still one shot pretty well in mid mmr range and people will still complain about it

Cuz they trinket gouge or smth

[wicked tide]

Ya I mean it was definitely overkill when u could get it off

But the fucking spec is boring now and this makes it even less exciting

Pruning another ability from us in pvp

[gleaming pawn]

Well if you don’t play Flag now, at least what burst Sub has will be slightly less telegraphed

[worthy crag]

Flag being pruned or not being a part of our kit in the first place is fine but we are already shoehorned into playing no subterfuge 1 vanish build

[wicked tide]

They just see blades

[worthy crag]

Because all utility is dead and only thing we got is burst

[wicked tide]

Yea that’s what I just said in nahj chat it makes the subterfuge builds even more trash now

[worthy crag]

Lmao I can imagine the pessimism in his stream rn

Though it is for good reason

[wicked tide]

He’s not that upset because he’s been playing non flag builds

It’s so hard to play sub in shuffle

[worthy crag]

Fair enough, I hate flag myself too but I can see why why it was being taken

[wicked tide]

Between everyone fucking up drs

Weak auras telling people when to hit their buttons

Yeah I always hated it

[worthy crag]

Lmao its hilarious when I see subs in my lobby as sv hunter like

[wicked tide]

Yeah u just laugh and wait for them to hit dance

[worthy crag]

I dont even need to trap the healer, I just run diamond ice and disarm

and do undispellable trap on the rogue

[wicked tide]

And even if they cross u for 1 cheap u just peel the burst off it

Yep

They are so fucking clueless

[worthy crag]

dude does 8 times less dmg than everyone else and healer loses to pve pressure

with 0 cc

Disarm diamond trap tar trap

repeat x15

Not to mention current meta is hpal

1 vanish no shadowdust sub trying to go against 2 bops 1 min sac forebearance-free bubble

xd

[livid hollow]

Just starting to get back into PvP.. sub rogue is crazy strong FC with the shadow step to allies. But which is generally better assassin or sub?

[jolly sierra]

for wow community rog = sub so u always will get the worst part

w nerfs

[wicked tide]

I mean they take away sepsis and give us nothing

Bunch of lazy ass devs

This game ring of titans looks pretty cool for arena

[solar glacier]

L Nerfs

[jolly sierra]

look at this fucker

[solar glacier]

Lets drop flag again and just Play regular build again but without sepsis and dust lmao

[worthy crag]

Dust isnt coming back and neither is sepsis, so the best i can imagine for sub will be reverting kidney to 20 sec cd and buffing dance CDR per combo points back to old values

But I dont see either one coming

[solar glacier]

Without flag i wonder what the build will look like

[worthy crag]

Dmg is still okay without flag, the problem is not having subterfuge and 2nd vanish

[solar glacier]

Just the 8% dmg node next to it or something completely different

[worthy crag]

Or could literally go back to pre nerf build with double vanish and be worse at what you used to do

[solar glacier]

Im Not sure about running without subt. The whole Point was to build up insane burst which you Kind of dont do without flag

Yeah thats what im Kind of guessing

Back to cc bot but worse

[spring bough]

I need to mog that lol

That is so troll I love it

[wintry dew]

look at this one

[spring bough]

Jealous. I’m only at 40 bronze 😭

[wintry dew]

If you have the time you can easily get to 59 this week... more if you have bugged weeklies on alts

[jolly sierra]

how tf have u got the t2 so fast

[spring bough]

Yeah I’ve done a few on alts and transferred the bronze over. That one progression quest Good Celebration or whatever resets everyday for one of my characters too

[wintry dew]

https://www.wowhead.com/news/bronze-celebration-token-sources-wow-20th-anniversary-event-week-1-348689
https://www.wowhead.com/news/guest-relations-secret-event-day-1-progress-tutorial-questline-and-2-crates-349274

I did all that

[jolly sierra]

i see

i barely have 41 rn

so ill just wait for reset i think

[mortal jay]

48 mastery 25 vers in PvP form. Did I over mastery?

As assa

[lucid citrus]

you can never be over mastery

[mortal jay]

If I can ever line up that third whatcha ma thingy with a shiv, I have popped a 2.5 mil envenom with envenom already rolling.

My problem is. I get cced so much and trying to do too much cross cc. I blow my buffs on the wrong person

[brisk perch]

is it worth dropping 12,500 honor on a socket or just sell the stones for cash

[lucid citrus]

depends on what you wnat, do you want to focus more on PVP then socket or do you want to focus on getting gold then sell it

[jolly sierra]

imo would worth get more than 2 sockets later for comp stomp

else would focus in gold

[lucid citrus]

what weeklies is bugged?

[wintry dew]

some people had alts which could do weeklie quests (that you did on your main) that still awarded tokens

while it shouldent

[safe pelican]

Ran 3 shuffs on assa pushed up at 1.6 rq push 1.8 before week is over time for outlaw rogue gear grinding

Assa is literally pumping i can’t wait till im out of this bracket to play with players that understand rogue goes

[lucid citrus]

damn thats crazy

[wintry dew]

actually

new maths have been done

20+18+13+10=61

you can actually non abuse anything

and get it before reset

https://www.wowhead.com/news/bronze-celebration-token-sources-wow-20th-anniversary-event-week-1-348689
https://www.wowhead.com/news/guest-relations-secret-event-day-1-progress-tutorial-questline-and-2-crates-349274

[safe pelican]

I lost this round somehow, someway, if youre in here Cali ggs

low rated lobbies but still i was just baffled that I lost

[worthy crag]

if only dmg meter determined the winner

[safe pelican]

#Pain 😔 had to focus on Cc more but i love pumping as assa feels good to be on top for once lol coming from sub

[rain beacon]

Hmm

[brisk perch]

I've got plenty of gold at the moment, just seems a minor upgrade for essentially.. what 25k+ to selll

[brisk perch]

I'm getting same in shuffle atm, top damage every time but losing rounds.. tempted to go for something more bursty and just try smack people so fast they don't know what's happened

playing assass bleed atm, considering a sub burst spec

[spring bough]

Always hurts losing to someone that did less damage cause that means they probably CCd way better lol

[wintry dew]

TOP DMG = / = Playing to win

Padding doest mean winning

[fervent cobalt]

Game is poopoo nerf to sub again.. wtf like why

[torpid swan]

thats dead tomorrow

[brisk perch]

Kinda hard in shuffle where there's limited communication though, you can ask at the start of each game, "what are we going for", then get no reply

or even call the targets and cc, and get completely ignored 😄

[wintry dew]

Yes, absolutely

But being TOP dps doesn't mean you're doing everything right

[candid tide]

when they dont reply they are clueless or tilted

[brisk perch]

Oh yeah I know that for sure

[wintry dew]

i hate skilled sub rogues on my shuffles while i play assa

they might do like 4th in dps

[brisk perch]

but when the team you're on isn't do anything or following a plan, best case is just dot everything and hope

[wintry dew]

but they just BLOW ME

[candid tide]

but will catch u in a stun and blows u up

especially in high dampening

[stoic spruce]

is there a queue or do we just get to it?

[wintry dew]

LOL

[jolly sierra]

sub is the natural counter to assa, that is normal

[candid tide]

stun you dance blind healer

healer trinket

cheap shot healer

another cheap gg

[jolly sierra]

if is not enought then shadowy duel then gg

[brisk perch]

damn I just started sub again, the rupture damage is brutal!

you can burst so hard they don't know what hit them

[lone anvil]

I agree, as assassination rogue it's not uncommon for me to top damage, but also I'm likely to LoS my healer or not save my defensive CDs for when my healer is crowd controlled and I still may end up being the first one dead alot lol

[brisk perch]

if you've got the right comp and communication, assass should be on top for 3s compared to sub.. I think

I'm trying sub for the nasty single target nuke

[tranquil jay]

Why they cant let a setup class exist?

Like legit every spec doing 500-800k sustain, sub did a big dam every 1.5 minute, now its guttered, while feral legit kills a cloth class from 1 rip and a moonfire 80-0, lets not talk about the BM hunter pressure, affli and SP rot

[brisk perch]

I get lost in games with demon lock and UH dk, so many pets

can barely tell who I'm supposed to be attacking

[spring bough]

So game starts. I fly to ruins. Smoke the flag. Cap it. Enemy Hunter was too far away on defense and couldn’t get to me

Third flag cap. Hunter gets it. I bait him and he chases me to shrine. Me and a feral kill. Sprint back. Get ruins again 😂

Last cap of game. Me and Hunter at ruins. My mist weaver runs in. I smoke flag but Hunter hits me. Monk starts to cap and enemy rest sham runs in. Coulda hit my monk but goes ?? In say at his hunter and they lose the cap and game 😂

[lime oar]

Sub nerf?

[rain beacon]

Hey what's world pvp like and how long does it take to farm bloody tokens?

[potent pivot]

Apparently so

[potent pivot]

Get the Sparks of War weekly quest it gives 1k

Then just do the world quests while in war mode

[lime oar]

I don’t seen any notes on it

[rain beacon]

Yeah but how long to get the world pvp kills

[potent pivot]

https://www.wowhead.com/news/update-to-class-tuning-elemental-shaman-less-nerfed-and-ascendance-bug-update-349285

[potent pivot]

You don’t have to

[rain beacon]

Wut

Bg/arena counts?

[potent pivot]

Get the Sparks of War quest and go do world quests in the zone it specifies

[potent pivot]

No

[lime oar]

Oh fuck

They literally wanted us to start using flag…to nerf it by a whopping 50% 😂

[potent pivot]

Idk we prolly don’t even take it now

I think our max evis without it is like 2m

[hidden dome]

Nothing more enjoyable than waiting 20 mins for a blitz game only to end up in a game you have exactly 0% chance of winning.
Not that it matters considering Blitz is free MMR, but it is just such a waste of time

[rain beacon]

What I thought it said to go world pvp and get kills

If its just world quest that should be quick

[potent pivot]

The world quests give like 10 Sparks per

[rain beacon]

I will grab the quest and read it again

When I get home

[potent pivot]

You can also loot the purple glowing dirt piles in the zone

[rain beacon]

Oh ok

[potent pivot]

They give like 5 per

[tacit crane]

sub was playing flag?

[potent pivot]

The fastest way to do it is to find a Sparks group in the custom tab of group finder and kill players, but those are the other ways to do it solo

[potent pivot]

Yes

[tacit crane]

huh, neither of the builds I saw was using flag

[potent pivot]

Iirc both builds in the pins take flag

[tacit crane]

Oh, they were changed

[potent pivot]

Ye I tried to get them up like the day after the new patch dropped

[rain beacon]

Trickz your very helpful ty for your work.

[tacit crane]

Would we still use flag after tomorrow?

Or we drop it?

[potent pivot]

Prolly dropping it

[jaunty osprey]

well COULD still take it cause it lines up w blades regardless

only other thing you'd take is deeper daggers

[potent pivot]

I try man

[potent pivot]

Yeah it’s just so easy to get peeled

Like with no nerf you did so much damage it almost didn’t matter

[jaunty osprey]

ya but

[potent pivot]

But I’m betting with this nerf it’s going to feel a lot worse

[jaunty osprey]

you'd still get

10-15 stacks even if u get peeled hard

[surreal barn]

Could just use and not try to buff it

Still come out better

[jaunty osprey]

and that's completely lowballing

the stacks

[surreal barn]

I liked sepsis 😂

[jaunty osprey]

same 😦

[potent pivot]

Yep

[surreal barn]

They took the wrong skill

[jaunty osprey]

they're just so out of touch with the actual game

they just follow reddit and forums

and see people complain

and nerf based off of that

[potent pivot]

After they fixed the supercharger flag didn’t even seem to be giving us that much more damage

[jaunty osprey]

everyone/venruki pushed agenda and complained about kidney shot CD

so they nerfed it

and not maim

[potent pivot]

Compared to before the patch

[surreal barn]

I mean, that’s why hunter has been bumpin so hard

[jaunty osprey]

and no1 complains about maim cd so they kept it

[tacit crane]

what skill were they supposed to take?

[surreal barn]

They bitch so quick

[surreal barn]

I’d have rather them taken flag than sepsis

[fervent cobalt]

Squiky wheel gets the oil as they say

[surreal barn]

I like this one haha

[fervent cobalt]

Just super lame af they nerf us

[jaunty osprey]

they just dont want sub to be good anymore

[tacit crane]

that's 100% a pve driven decision

Sepsis was only used on pvp, so they took it out

[jaunty osprey]

they nerfed echoing reprimand goremaw perforated veins build at the start of the season

[fervent cobalt]

The amount of disarms and cc's I take in Blades is lame af

[jaunty osprey]

they nerfed every potential build

[fervent cobalt]

so makes gos nigh impossible

[surreal barn]

I have so many videos of myself

Just destroying with that build

[potent pivot]

That shit was a little cracked let’s be real

[jaunty osprey]

i mean

it was no different than it was in slands

i mean

DF*

[surreal barn]

You still had to line up shit perfectly

[jaunty osprey]

yeah

you had to backstab 4 times

[surreal barn]

Not everyone could do it

[jaunty osprey]

and legit cant

do anything

else

and wait for stun dr

[fervent cobalt]

I watched nahj use the rotten build earlier today was hilarious

[jaunty osprey]

then press it

[surreal barn]

You can still do it with goremaw right now

Just not the same

[jaunty osprey]

ya but it was good because u could echoing and goremaw

[surreal barn]

Yup

[jaunty osprey]

at least goremaw goes through bop

[surreal barn]

Goremaw is hitting for 2 mill if lined up after patch

Idk if they buffed

[spring bough]

Time for yall to go outlaw

[surreal barn]

Or I just got better gear

[spring bough]

RIP flag

[jaunty osprey]

well with warrior being good tmrw

outlaw might be the move

[fervent cobalt]

Bro I am almost contemplating going outlaw

[spring bough]

Supercharger outlaw the most fun I’ve had in a minute

[fervent cobalt]

And I hate it

[spring bough]

Not gonna lie it’s fun as fuck

So many big crits as outlaw like I never seen in my life lol

[potent pivot]

You doing no Vigor and playing Forced Ind?

[spring bough]

Yup

[potent pivot]

Had a feeling

[spring bough]

Sometimes energy feels rough but it goes right away once u get a good roll or adrenaline back

[jaunty osprey]

just roll better

smh

[potent pivot]

I think that way prolly better than pinned build

[spring bough]

I’m playing loaded dice and sleight of hand

It’s so much fun

[surreal barn]

I’m playing hunter

lol

[spring bough]

I don’t think I’m going back to vigor unless they nerf supercharger lol

[surreal barn]

Shit is cracked

[spring bough]

9 combo point finishers wicked

[potent pivot]

[safe pelican]

Exactly lmao had to stomach that & go back to cc focus

[spring bough]

Oh it’s 10 with forced induction isn’t it??

[potent pivot]

Yes

[spring bough]

Yeah no wonder the crits so big lol

[rain beacon]

Wut

[spring bough]

KS average is over 2.5 million a press

[rain beacon]

Drop vigor for supercharger h u h

[spring bough]

Yeah trust

It is better lol

It’s so fun

[rain beacon]

I'll try

[potent pivot]

Ye you can take Deeper Strat

[safe pelican]

Can still run assa just gotta focus on healer cc more games are a cake walk when you do that , but it’s way more fun to cleave the dps and rott one and kidney the healer while they die lol

[potent pivot]

Nahj thinks rogue is already dead before the nerf

[rain beacon]

Ye I imagined that

[potent pivot]

[jaunty osprey]

ya

[safe pelican]

Ima try this later after i shower

[jaunty osprey]

rogue is definitely fucked

lol

assa does decent damage, awful survivability

outlaw is outlaw

[safe pelican]

Rogue is fucked only the one that love the class aesthetic are left standing

[jaunty osprey]

sub is nerfed any time it's any decent

[potent pivot]

Sub feels bugged

[safe pelican]

Not so many fotm rogues out anymore everyone’s feral

[potent pivot]

No one can do the 5m evis we were doing day 1

[safe pelican]

I think THAT was a bug tbh

[potent pivot]

Yeah or that

[safe pelican]

5M in one global is dummy tbh

[fervent cobalt]

lol

Yeah that shit is over

[potent pivot]

I mean you had to line everything up properly