pvp

[nova viper]

I gear up my rogue and mage

Priest waiting

[jolly sierra]

nice im lvl 78, decided to go outside and play the cards

[potent pivot]

I do think DK really needs gear to do any dmg but once you have it, it’s great lol

[nova viper]

U mean this yougioh-pokemon shiny magic the gathering?

[jolly sierra]

yeye lol

[nova viper]

Nice

U win?

[topaz bobcat]

nahj really played rogue 20 years straight? bruh

[jolly sierra]

didnt played yet

im w the guys

lended some cards so im getting the dinner today

[spring bough]

I been on rogue since 04 beta lol

[topaz bobcat]

how u do this lol

I've done 10-12 but diff class every xpac

and didn't play MOP draenor and legion

[spring bough]

Wrath I swapped to dk main to tank but still played rogue and tanked for a couple xpacks till it got to be too much lol

[jolly sierra]

for me was

cata rdrood
mop ret
wod monk
legion monk
bfa rog
sl rog
df rog
tww rog

got bored w monk very fast

[spring bough]

So the enhancing embellish doesn’t inc the tooltip for the weapon grip

It says it doubles nerubian embellishes. Guess not the wep grip lol

[acoustic junco]

I've played rogue since Dec 2004

[spring bough]

OG undead rogue from back then lol

Oh no… pshero making rogue tww videos and tagging it “ridiculous damage” oh boy lol

He playing sub too. Bout to get everyone nerfed the way he plays 😂

[topaz bobcat]

💩

don't even have set yet

[potent pivot]

regular BGs vs people with no gear

[spring bough]

Hey it’s filling out we got nahj premades out here 😂

Pshero legendary. Dude pulls off the craziest moves I ever seen lol

[austere thorn]

Only the OGs remember the actual best rogue ever
Marm

[wary moss]

@potent pivot what do your envenoms hit for playing deathstalker

[spring bough]

Grimm

Grimm videos when he got towards Naxx 🔥

When he got that death sting in pvp omg lol

[potent pivot]

average like 750k?
1.5m with Darkest Night

there's ways too make them hit even harder if you drop aoe spec

but envenom damage in general does not matter for assassination

you're kinda going about the spec in the wrong way

your aoe bleeds are what do major damage

[potent pivot]

premades?

they weren't in a premade earlier lol

[jolly sierra]

thought was reckful the best one

[spring bough]

Him and hyper a premade itself lol

😁

[potent pivot]

no

hyper is a 1500 player that we know

[spring bough]

I know who hyper is lol

[potent pivot]

he just happened to queue into you at the same time as nahj

ohhhhh

[jolly sierra]

maybe can be a possibility

if he hired nahj

XD

[topaz bobcat]

inb4 blizz buffed living bomb for fire

forgot to not do it for frost

[jolly sierra]

remember hyper was about to buy a boost here

[potent pivot]

what

i don't remember

[jolly sierra]

ye, he was asking

[wary moss]

I know, was just curious

[jolly sierra]

"how much does cost a boost?"

raz said
"your dignity"

[potent pivot]

omfg

[jolly sierra]

sec

[potent pivot]

lmfao

[spring bough]

Bro that a brutal response 💀

[spring bough]

I remember hyper was in here for a minute tryna rank on that rogue when did he go become pally lol

[jolly sierra]

i never joke w shit ive read lol

[potent pivot]

months ago now

[spring bough]

Bros got the screenshots ready to fire lmao

[jolly sierra]

guy vanished fast

[spring bough]

Couldn’t tell if trolling or serious lol

[jolly sierra]

if is hyper is deadly serious

when he asks for stuff

[north acorn]

stat prios ?

[potent pivot]

!stats

[lethal roost]

These are the recommended stat priorities for each spec in PvP. Please keep in mind that having suboptimal stats on some pieces such as tier set pieces is not the end of the world.

Subtlety: Vers>Mastery>Crit>Haste
Assassination: Vers>Mastery>Crit=/=Haste
Outlaw: Vers>Haste=/=Crit>Mastery
You likely want to stack at least 20% Haste on Outlaw for an extra GCD during ADR/Crackshot windows. Take 'em by Surprise gives you 10% during CS windows, so you only need 10-15% from gear.

[north acorn]

thx

i notice on a guide it says this, but there are clearly items in vendor to craft pvp scaling gear. am i misunderstanding or is guide just out of date

[potent pivot]

yeah as far as i can tell you will be able to craft pvp ilvl gear/embellishments

[north acorn]

kk so icy veins just out of date

[potent pivot]

yeah they prolly thought when the old items got removed

that they weren't coming back or something

[potent pivot]

can you link me that page?

[north acorn]

https://www.icy-veins.com/wow/subtlety-rogue-pvp-stat-priority-gear-and-trinkets

[runic trench]

How long does it take to grind honor for a full set? In the bg

[north acorn]

3-5 hours for me

just playing comp stomp for free wins

[potent pivot]

took me a lot longer than that with comp stomp

[north acorn]

u used honor flask?

[potent pivot]

but i wasn't full on grinding

nah i didn't

i afk before requeuing sometimes

[potent pivot]

yeah i'd also hold off on crafting anything

until everyone has figured out what the best embellishments are/any embellishment tuning happens

[north acorn]

indeed

[chrome schooner]

haven't updated it with these items

no rush though because we can't get the purple items to craft high ilvl stuff anyway

I'll update before ssn starts

[runic trench]

What’s the honor flask?

[potent pivot]

it gives +15% honor gains

[wintry dew]

Thanks Shade

[spring bough]

Lmaoooo I just looked at my bars saw 2 on vanish and first through was “damn I gotta by vanishing powder” 🤦‍♂️

Can’t imagine if that was still a thing 😂

[worthy crag]

That tooltip is so misleading, I'm pretty sure entering a skirmish clears that flask buff

I had to drink another one

[dark panther]

can someone explain to me why I'm standing still not touching anything and my stealth just randomly breaks

[outer sky]

find a good teammate and spam skirms. I did that with an MM hunter friend. We played 55 skirms and only lost 4

[proud vortex]

yo

what are good comps with sub rogue in 3s

[waxen meteor]

Am I crazy of is it frost mage actually face casting on sin and kills you

[outer sky]

not sure I understand what youre asking

[waxen meteor]

Was dueling a frost mage in arena 1on1. I am with sin/deathstalker

I actually throw all my offensive CDs on him

he literally did not try to kite me of ice block

[wintry dew]

Blizzard.
We've seen various bugs, one of them being warlocks being able to take us out of stealth with one of their ability randomly

[waxen meteor]

just casted on my face and i died before him...

[outer sky]

winning a 1v1 with a frost mage is insanely difficult

[spring bough]

I wish I played SL season one. Missed that elite mog

The honor one still pretty good

[worthy crag]

Nothing beats legion season 1~2 elite gear

[spring bough]

Missed that too 😭

[steep kiln]

I thought the shadowlands one was real nice. think its season 1. The warhammer inquisitor looking set was pretty hot

[spring bough]

Yeah I’m rocking the season 1 set now just wishing I had the shoulder smoke lol

[outer sky]

@potent pivot did the frost mage nerfs already hit?

[proud vortex]

could some1 enlighten me

c:

[outer sky]

problem is we arent really even sure yet

Sub RMP will never be bad

[dull bridge]

i mean the season literally hasnt started yet. historically good sub comps have been rmp, sub boomy and to a lesser extent sub destro. some really good players have been able to make sub ww and sub enh work. (enh might have been specific to that patch)

[outer sky]

sub WW is better for the WW than it is for the rogue

[waxen meteor]

for sure, but they don't even bother to kite me is crazy

[proud vortex]

i see

thanks for the info:D

[proud vortex]

tho what woudl the healer be in those comps , in rmp is a priest but in a sub boomy?

[surreal barn]

Personally imma 2s with a shadow priest

Always fun

[stoic spruce]

[waxen meteor]

I can be taht sp

[spring bough]

How goes KIR

[stoic spruce]

it goes

[spring bough]

I been doing heroics lol. Just went 200 mil overall over this mage 😂

[stoic spruce]

I wish when I looked up a video on vehicle maintenance they actually show you where stuff is

like

where tf is the shift level on the transmission? I know its on the outside but where?

"its above the transmission"

how about I above my foot in your ass

[wintry dew]

Yo mister rogues, I didn't knew about this until now:
https://x.com/SugiliteVE/status/1829310888886649093?s=19

Sugi (@SugiliteVE) on X

The New Rogue Hangout Spot in Dornogal
#warcraft

Twitter · Aug 30, 2024, 12:11 AM

It's our spot!

[outer sky]

lmfao fuck this

[outer sky]

Love my outlaw mog

On my PvE rogue I even have the "Farmer" title

[worthy crag]

I wish there were some other ways of applying DSM aside from shadowstrike

and another way of reaching darkest night than spending a finisher on the same target 3 times in a row

gonna be real awkward if my team wants to hard swap to another target when i'm 1 finisher away from proccing darkest night on the original one

[outer sky]

black powder

[worthy crag]

either that or rupture yeah, but like

the fact that I need to hit that target for one more finisher to gain darkest night can feel pretty delayed

but at the same time I understand thats the whole concept of the spec, like bringing back the "old" combo system with a tweak

maybe give us a mini redirect for DSM stacks :o

[waxen meteor]

you ain't rogue, you gardener :)))))

[spring bough]

i cant wait for sunday

going to go so ham in bgs as plunderlord

[outer sky]

I just kidney'd a sub rogue the instant he pressed shadow dance and he had no trinket. I felt the frustration all the way over here

[spring bough]

could you feel the keyboard smash lol

[outer sky]

yep lmfao

[rain crown]

Is there any faster way to get though your death mark stacks as assa

Can be hard to get to the buffed envenom sometimes

[outer sky]

not really, you consume stacks by using finishers that cost at least 5 combo points

so you get through them as fast as you build up 5 combo points

[rain crown]

It has to be on the target right

And I notice it doesn’t work with ks

Which I think is dumb

Would be smooth if it was like rupture kidney and one envenom

[outer sky]

yeah that is stupid. I'm going to make a forum post about that. there's no reason it shouldn't work with kidney shot. It says "attacks". If someone punches me in my kidney I sure as hell would feel like I've just been attacked

[spring bough]

we get 1000 tender each month right

sets 750 swords 150 just get enough lol

[potent pivot]

i don't think so but i'm not sure

[potent pivot]

Oh I think the blue post says none of the changes are in until reset

[waxen meteor]

@potent pivot How do you open now with sin (especially on a physical class)

I feel cs + garrot + shiv + rupture + cs seems good (either halved on target, or side dps)

but missing ambush seems not right in tww... maybe ambush instead of shiv?

[outer sky]

If you want my opinion, it would be Cheap>Garrote>Garrote>Rupture>cheap>Shiv/Tea>Cheap

thats like, my go to opener for a single target in pvp

probably the only time I wouldnt open like that is against a mage where I'd garrote first and then cheap so he cant blink the stun

[steep kiln]

are you playing fatebound then?

[outer sky]

You could ambush instead of shiv for sure and then shiv/tea after your stuns are up

No, DS

But I would definitely make sure to double garrote

that's important

Cheap>Garrote>Garrote>Rupture>cheap>Ambush>Cheap>Shiv/Tea

Deathstalker optimized opener

[light phoenix]

WSG woyer

[outer sky]

And now theyre gunna go whining on the forums that assa rogue is broken

[tawny quest]

!stats

[lethal roost]

These are the recommended stat priorities for each spec in PvP. Please keep in mind that having suboptimal stats on some pieces such as tier set pieces is not the end of the world.

Subtlety: Vers>Mastery>Crit>Haste
Assassination: Vers>Mastery>Crit=/=Haste
Outlaw: Vers>Haste=/=Crit>Mastery
You likely want to stack at least 20% Haste on Outlaw for an extra GCD during ADR/Crackshot windows. Take 'em by Surprise gives you 10% during CS windows, so you only need 10-15% from gear.

[queen grail]

anyone got agood sin build

[outer sky]

yeah one sec

[outer sky]

You play this in almost every match up

Except in the small number of matches where you dont think you'll be able to cleave pretty much at all, you play this

[queen grail]

ty boss gonna try it out!

[outer sky]

if you queue a skirm and it's a 2v2 (so no healer) play the 2nd one

[outer sky]

oh and I was playing with the Thick as Thieves PvP talent when I linked these. if you aren't playing that then swaps Tricks of the Trade to Blackjack. Left tree, 3rd row down, all the way to the right

[tawny quest]

Damn Pistol Shot is hitting hard. Took Greenskin Watcher to test a bit as trickster outlaw. Pistol Shot critting for 500K is not bad

[sick wasp]

u sub DB/double vanish aight?

also forums

[forest compass]

is sub better than asa for burst?

[outer sky]

Yes

[forest compass]

is it harder?

[outer sky]

Yes

[sick wasp]

yes

[sick wasp]

and yes

sub is 🚬 ppl

its a dream coming alive

[topaz bobcat]

forgot how good meld is for rogue

made orc this xpac

rekt

[candid tide]

meld is the shit

takes skill tho

[topaz bobcat]

maybe horde EU worth it?

or is alliance now the faction for pvp cuz of racials? every good pvper left

[candid tide]

idk depends on the classes i guess

top rogs are often nelfs fs

[indigo hill]

Think 99% of the rogue players are nelves.

Lucky for me it's one of my favorite races.

[proven kayak]

Wdym man in the worst case scenarios is an extra vanish

[candid tide]

like to meld a kidney takes quite the skill imo

[proven kayak]

It also takes insane internet connection

[candid tide]

lmao true

[proven kayak]

But yeah nelves has the best racials by far from the second race

[candid tide]

yeah well if u meld their entire burst thats just massive

[proven kayak]

Also quickness and night of elune are pretty neat

[topaz bobcat]

outlaw tho orc better?

[indigo hill]

Think orc is fine. Racial is nice but not as strong as a nelf.

[proven kayak]

Welll to the level I play barely matter I never push for glad I just take the cosmetics and have fun but nelf is my favourite anyway

[indigo hill]

According to smarter people here, the race doesn't matter till you hit high rating.

[topaz bobcat]

What's high rating?

1.8k next months? 3k+ later from inflation?

I'm def not planning for world competitive 2.1k I'm happy

[indigo hill]

2.4 and up.

[outer sky]

It definitely matters, maybe im not smart

Especially for assass

Whatever rating you're at

Nelf assa rogue over any other race is an instant 100-200 additional rating

I'd wager it's the single strongest class/spec+racial interaction in the game

And that's solely using meld as a vanish, not even to gimp damage

It's powerful for outlaw too but for assass it's just gross

[unreal hollow]

Are you using the same keybinds for pvp and pve spec? or is there a way to have different skill placement on same spec but different talent template?

[outer sky]

I use the same binds I actually quit using arena 123 macros and switched to a focus macro so that I could keep my binds consistent for arena, RBGs, and PvE

[unreal hollow]

Oh, so i guess i need to figure out my binds to work on both

[outer sky]

Idk if I'd say you have to

It's how I do it and how a lot of people do it

I think it's easier

[unreal hollow]

sounds convenient

tbh

[outer sky]

But whatever works

It is

But I'm a bitch for consistency. Even on my alts I try and make my binds as consistent as possible

Big defensive is always shift+C

Small defensive is always shift+G

Stun is always 2

Longest CC is always R

Mobility is always T

Just how my brain works

[topaz bobcat]

We trust this person? I remember him from playing in BFA

[orchid plinth]

Having Sap and Focus a1/2/3 at the same time is kinda neat and doesnt really overlap

other than that the only arena binding I think is nice is Step+CS arena1/2/3 for peeling stealth openers if its some yolo comp

[outer sky]

Ummmmm..........for sub he's absolutely right. I think fir outlaw it's debatable. It's definitely not as strong as it is for assass but especially with the dispatch nerfs now, having an extra crackshot window outside of your 2 vanishes is pretty valuable.

[orchid plinth]

Ask them why every streaming 5k rated rogue is playing Nelf

[outer sky]

I can answer that. Assass was broken during the most recent season. So everyone wanted to maximize it and play nelf. If sub was the broken spec you wouldn't see as many nelfs. Right now its still up in the air which rogue spec will be best, if there will even be a clear favorite at all. So nobody has bothered race changing yet

I didn't play DF S3 when outlaw was the go to spec so I'm not sure what race was favored

Nelf def seems best if you're going to play all 3 specs. Not so good if you only play sub. I still prefer it for outlaw but I can see the argument for other races. But I really think nelf got a huge bump in power for outlaw since they nerfed dispatch and unnerfed ace in pvp

Because now you're doing less damage outside of crackshot and more damage inside of crackshot

So common sense should say that more crackshots=better now than before

Nelf gives you another crackshot.

And with ace not nerfed anymore you're spamming BtE more often than before

Which will get your vanishes back faster than before

[orchid plinth]

Another fun selling point is that Nelf is the only race that has some kind of skill expression in arena, no?

Reminds people of the good old vanish days

[topaz bobcat]

usually in S1 Dark iron is the shit

cuz the main stat scaling is yuge

like for every class

[outer sky]

So personally I don't weigh that very heavily because I'm using my melds for crackshot windows, cheap shots, and silences when I need them. If that happens to line up with when I'm about to take major damage, then great I got lucky. But I'm basically never going to meld a kidney or a chaos bolt when I wouldn't have otherwise melded to do something else unless I think I need to in order to not die which is pretty rare. That's just me though so take it with a grain of salt.

It's like vanishing defensively I guess

I try and avoid it as much as possible

[orchid plinth]

Yeah relying on inconsistent things is dangerous

[indigo hill]

I always try to setup the same as well. I might be one of the few that uses the f1 to f5 buttons. Never seen anyone use those.

[proven kayak]

He is one of the best

[outer sky]

I'd be curious to see if he says the same about outlaw given the most recent changes

[outer sky]

I will say it's at least nice to have the option. Like using smoke bomb defensively. We all hope we'll never have to but it comes in handy when we're at 10%, our healer is trapped without a trinket, and that aimed shot cast is about to finish

[inner tartan]

tauren and drawlf i think are better for outlaw

[outer sky]

I'm still philosophically against the existence of Tauren rogues

[inner tartan]

same lmfaoooo

[stoic spruce]

Undead or bust

[inner tartan]

however playing a gnome warrior and getting ganked by a tauren is soooooo funyyy

[inner tartan]

undead da og open word greifers

[stoic spruce]

B)

[inner tartan]

mine only exists for that

but i yank more on a vulpera

cuz imagne getting killed by a fox

[outer sky]

Back in BFA I was really hoping they'd make Sethrak a playable race

But we got the foxes instead

[inner tartan]

i hate snakes so that would be so sick

ngl i want those panda ooka dooka creatures

lmfaooo

[stoic spruce]

Mine was risen to hunt down the silly tree people

[vital socket]

Hozen ?

Gnolls or kobolds would be dope

Imagine dying to a kobold

[narrow tangle]

are conquest available next week

[outer sky]

No, week after

[proven kayak]

After a lot of thinking if I play dk or warrior alt I chooses survival hunter

[chrome schooner]

this was way before the current expansion, tsk tsk tsk

[topaz bobcat]

Hello friend. Plz say something to make me feel better about playing orc in EU for my rogue this xpac

[chrome schooner]

well orc is second best

[outer sky]

So you think Nelf is best for both assa and outlaw now?

[narrow tangle]

nelf is always the best

[chrome schooner]

imo nelf is always best now

6s subterfuge too good

[quaint cedar]

I hope some day blizz lets us pick a racial
I don't play nelf and it sucks knowing I'm at a bit of a disadvantage because of it

[outer sky]

Even for sub?

[outer sky]

What spec do you mostly play?

[quaint cedar]

I only play outlaw

[forest compass]

anyone have good as points layout to share plz?

[potent pivot]

huh?

[forest compass]

could you plz past scr shot of your talents for asa plz

[warped oriole]

jo why am i getting destealthed every few sec in bg? its pretty much always the case

[potent pivot]

there's a load out in the pins

you just have to copy it and import it in game

[potent pivot]

[forest compass]

In Pin build there is no Kingsbane i tho thats strong skill?

[potent pivot]

not as strong as it was in DF no

[forest compass]

what would be tipical burst combo?

[potent pivot]

assa isn't really about burst

[forest compass]

sorry i asking so much queston but my goal is to be good in rogue pvp

[potent pivot]

you just spread bleeds and maintain them

[rain crown]

Burst is getting a fat envenom off

With deathstalker buff

[proud vortex]

is it me or are warriors super strong

in pvp

[rain crown]

Yes

[waxen meteor]

Bug, very frustrating

[warped oriole]

yeah, i realised theres a lot of stuff like frostshards or so that hit everyone, even the stealthed ones and they got one hell of a range

[waxen meteor]

And it’s kinda funny, had some battle in world map, sometimes I revive and nobody near me, I am still in combat cannot enter stealth lol

Because there was some bleed I added before I died lol

[rain crown]

I’ve noticed what I think are mages sniping me out of stealth with some random ability from far away

Idk what it is but it looks like they are throwing like a knife or shard at me

[spring bough]

Does this trading post swap over at midnight server? Or like server WQ reset time?

Bout to play till it does today 😂

[wintry dew]

its on server reset, if you're EU its tomorrow at around 6?7 am

[turbid dawn]

Same here bro

[spring bough]

Then right after plunderlording BGs 😂

[potent pivot]

that bug is happening to a lot of classes too

happened to me on my DK and couldn't mount in a BG

[halcyon timber]

Splinters from spellslinger frost mage is one that and some new stuff warlocks are doing with certain summons.

Malific rapture also reveals us, the new shadowbolt volley might as well. Also something from herald of the sun for paladins pops us, even when we are 30y+ away. (I tailed a lot of people around last night as they fought others for context)

[vocal surge]

If Dawnlight targets ya

it doesn't let go till the duration wears off

[spring bough]

So what’s the bets on the next remix? Legion would be cool get mage tower wep mogs again

[potent pivot]

i don't think that's doing to happen bro

unfortunately

they didn't make a way to get the challenge mode stuff

highly doubt they would make a way to get old MT stuff

[spring bough]

One can dream on missed opportunities 😂

[potent pivot]

same

[spring bough]

That panda dk set was sick

Wish they brought it back too lol

[candid tide]

think is WQ piece is better than the one we can get from honor vendor

[swift smelt]

lower ilvl

[spring bough]

There isn’t a mastery chest from honor tho

[potent pivot]

even if it is, it's by a tiny margin

go get it if you want but i wouldn't feel required to

[wintry axle]

Is sub very gear heavy? Im at 606 ilevel and I feel very underwhelmed by the burst and damage it has

[potent pivot]

i feel like everything is pretty gear dependent, but sub really requires the right set up to burst in general

it can be very build and rotation dependent

[wintry axle]

im pretty used to sub, but im getting shat on in 1v1s this exp, not sure what im missing.

[potent pivot]

are you using the build in the pins?

[wintry axle]

Not sure

[potent pivot]

the only thing that's changed really since dragonflight is you want to sepsis->sectech early in dance

then strike->evis after

you use the Macabre stacks to amp evis instead of tech

[wintry axle]

aha

[potent pivot]

you also get the sepsis and tech damage ticks rolling

so more of that dmg goes off during the stun

you also kinda want rupture on your KT either before your go, or you can use the First Dance combo points to rupture first global of the stun

[wintry axle]

i usually do that

insta rup in the opener for kt

[potent pivot]

try the build in the pins if you aren't already using the same thing

[rain crown]

I’m pretty new to rogue but sub felt really strong with blades up but not that insane outside of it

[potent pivot]

but maybe you just need more gear

[cosmic blaze]

bro wtf is going on with warriors

[rain crown]

Assa feels really strong overall

[cosmic blaze]

like HUH

[wintry axle]

thanks, it'll help atleast

[wintry axle]

45m healing, hahaha

[wintry axle]

i agree, it feels nice. I just like the sub playstyle more, but i play both

[brazen gazelle]

New to rogue this round...seems like sub is the high burst window spec and sin is the sustained spread dmg spec

[wintry axle]

Yeah idd, thats the basic of it. I was just not feeling the burst window better on sub than assa, which it usually is. But im undergeared and running somewhat scuffed talents it seems.

[brazen gazelle]

so in pvp scenerios sub for ninja bases and playing with other high burst arena partners and sin for team fights and playing with more rot and higher heals arena teams?

oh yeah? so sin still, currently, can have a high burst window too?

[spring bough]

Is that healing lol

[wintry axle]

Sin burst is not bad at all. Im doing pretty much the same on full stacked CDS on dummies, but pvp is different, ya know. hehe.

[brazen gazelle]

yeah, they have pvp dummies i can test on

[wintry axle]

But sub has better window burst, but the setup is "harder".

[brazen gazelle]

yeah...i'm coming from demo/aff lock those setups were super easy...

[wintry axle]

you'll learn though, it just takes a while to get it in your fingers.

[brazen gazelle]

partly because there was little to no setup and partly because they are 1 or 2 buttons

[potent pivot]

for sin you kind of want to play with someone that has burst

sin does not have a lot of kill pressure, you need that from your team mate

[brazen gazelle]

haha sounds like aff lock

[potent pivot]

aff lock rn has burst/kill pressure

aff lock is a perfect team mate for sin rn

[brazen gazelle]

yeah...i feel like i transitioned away from lock at the wrong time

i'm going to level once i get the rogue geared and at least somewhat adept at playing it

[wintry axle]

@potent pivot - how come the assa build in pinned is running deathstalker? Isnt that super shit? Ambush is so little used.

[potent pivot]

deathstalker is really the better tree for both sub/sin

[wintry axle]

oh wow, i wouldnt imagine.

[potent pivot]

it's better defensively, utility, and damage wise

[wintry axle]

and running without cb/kb will be something to get used to

[potent pivot]

KB just doesn't hit hard anymore

the initial hit does less than envenom

[wintry axle]

yeah noticed, 600k crits, I did that in DF

[potent pivot]

the overall KB dot does decent damage, but takes too long and only if you optimize it by using it with DM, double Shiv, double Tea

atm we're much better off with full aoe dot rot

[wintry axle]

so we run ct on even ST now?

and envenom over dice?

[potent pivot]

if you're going to do like actual 1v1s or duels you can still take kb

[wintry axle]

Yeah, i run it in wpvp.

[potent pivot]

wdym dice?

[wintry axle]

slice and dice

[potent pivot]

you still want to keep slice up when you can

[wintry axle]

alright.

[potent pivot]

envenom extends it

so you don't press it that much

i wouldn't press it in your opener or anything

just press it when you get some downtime after you have dots up

[wintry axle]

alright, thanks for the great replies

[lime oar]

stepping that DB was kinda crazy

[indigo lava]

hey

can you share with me the PVP spec for Assasination and sub please?

[spring bough]

love losing a skirmish because my affliction lock does 10 mil damage less than the enemy affliction lock

and my lock died after me lmao

[potent pivot]

in the pins

[indigo lava]

thanks

[topaz bobcat]

so enh gonna burst 100-0 in 1-2 sec with set or?

[rain crown]

@spring bough aff in my skirm last night was doing 925k dps

[spring bough]

thats crazy the dots are what got me lol

tick for so much

[potent pivot]

enhance was really bad before buffs

but like no one has been testing builds on enhance that i've seen

too busy playing ele

[spring bough]

me and a feral right now vs a sin and sub oh boy

[topaz bobcat]

I'm aware but these numbers are astronomical

[vocal surge]

it all hinges on Sub doing his part in your fight

lol

[potent pivot]

what numbers

[wintry axle]

hmm, dagger or mastery mace in offhand as sub?

murlok says people mainly go mace

[potent pivot]

dagger

[wintry axle]

ait, my thoughts

[potent pivot]

i wouldn't pay attention to murlok for like

a few weeks

[topaz bobcat]

60% buffs to stormstrike and windfury for example

[potent pivot]

yeah but like

+60% of 100k is only 160k

[topaz bobcat]

I think it's way more, doesn't it like proc a mil times during ascention

[potent pivot]

it's all relative to how much they're doing prebuff

[topaz bobcat]

wasn't 40% of their dmg but was their burst

[vocal surge]

Unseen Blade isn't working as its suppose to be in PvP

[spring bough]

outlaw >> sub sin combo XD XD

[vocal surge]

Watched a monk parry all my attacks when he has the Fazed Debuff

[potent pivot]

oof

so it might not even be good in the 1 situation it's supposed to be good in

[vocal surge]

It still slaps

Its just not working as intended

[potent pivot]

yeah my thoughts were that it'd only be better than fatebound vs parry classes

[spring bough]

its def got a consistent burst to it

[potent pivot]

but if that isn't work it's kinda dead in the water

[spring bough]

get a KS around 4 unseen procs thats a couple to a few milly of dmg

[vocal surge]

Trickster has giga burst and far more consistent damage than Fatebound

Your kinda relying on a ~73.15% to stack coins as Fatebound

Which goes down constantly the more and more you stack coins as probability will eventually reset your progress back to 1 - 6

And gotta remember Fatebound's damage prog for Heads is 5% +2% per stack after the first

Or +10% additive for each Tail roll

[indigo hill]

Haven't seen heads stack more than 3 yet.

Wasn't it supposed to go to 7 or something?

[vocal surge]

Just to see the same finisher damage output on Trickster as Fatebound, you have a 2% chance of reaching 13 Heads

[indigo hill]

Which of the two has your preference atm?

[vocal surge]

That's without the last hero talent at the very bottom contributing to the damage output

Trickster

1.4 Million damage Killing Spree getting +30% damage and coming out of it

[indigo hill]

Haven't played that yet. The double grapple is very nice to use in bgs

[vocal surge]

I get 2 Unseen Blade procs that deal ~240k damage

[potent pivot]

fatebound is more overall dmg

[vocal surge]

Non crit that can crit

Everytime I face or find a Fatebound Outlaw rpgue

I triple their dps in the same starter while being focused on

[potent pivot]

maybe they just suck?

[vocal surge]

Maybe, but still I find Fatebound doing less overall

On paper it looks good

In practice, it only has double grapple as it's pro

[potent pivot]

i do more dmg with fatebound

[vocal surge]

I do far more damage as Trickster

[potent pivot]

even if you low roll coins it's better imo

[potent pivot]

main gauche is also slapping in mastery gear

[vocal surge]

Is this on a training dummy?

[potent pivot]

last one was

[vocal surge]

i figured it was an extreme outlier

[potent pivot]

what was

[vocal surge]

Main Gauche having that high of an overall

[potent pivot]

that was 40 seconds

pretty positive main gauche is going to slap regardless

in this much mastery gear

i geared for sin/sub first, haven't bought haste pieces for outlaw yet

[vocal surge]

40s on a training dummy as Trickster

[potent pivot]

this was like 20 seconds

your outcomes are always going to be different because of rtb and other shit like crits etc

but over all, in practice, fatebound does more dmg

[vocal surge]

Ye, my 40s on training dummy was really bad lol

with how little procs I got from attacks

[indigo hill]

It's nice they added rng to an already rng spec. 😂

[potent pivot]

the rng is basically similar to RtB

it's rng, but it's not that big of a deal

it's pretty consistent over all

[vocal surge]

20s go brrr

[potent pivot]

what was the total

[vocal surge]

14.17M

[spring bough]

this was against 2 fully honor geared sin and sub rogues... under a minute about 18 mil lmao

[indigo hill]

How do you use the coup degrace? You fill up 5 cp before using it?

[vocal surge]

Max Combo Points, prio over KS

can be used as gap closer but its better to just send it

[vocal surge]

Performance in PvP is just bad

The sub rogue would've done less than half of his damage if I was trickster that game

and my damage would've been far above the Fury War

[potent pivot]

agree to disagree ig

[vocal surge]

Aye, just test run it in PvP

You'll see a very big difference

we can talk about Training Dummies all day but they dont have Vers, defensives, CCs, etc.

[potent pivot]

i have

with both

have also seen Star test em since beta

[spring bough]

the one diff i feel is that trickster gets its special off combo point builders and fatebound gets it off finishers. in arenas sometimes using more builders than finishers and that can def contribute to why coin doesnt always go top in games

and every KS u usually get 4 blades leading to a coup and thats a huge burst

and if thats into a crack window thats huge damage

[topaz bobcat]

poison cleanse totem big problem ?

[potent pivot]

wdym

[topaz bobcat]

Does it have a ton of hp and does it rek assa dmg bigly?

[potent pivot]

it only last like, 6 sec iirc?

[topaz bobcat]

like 9 sec I think last I checked maybe talents to increase it more. CD goes down to 30ish

[forest compass]

is there anything what i can do with honor after have full set?

[potent pivot]

you can transfer it to alts with a 20% tax

but you're going to need a lot of honor for sockets

each socket is around 15k honor

[forest compass]

sockets?

[potent pivot]

to put gems in your gear

[forest compass]

how u get them for honor?

[potent pivot]

vendor

[forest compass]

is it available now?

[potent pivot]

the reagent item is, the socket item isn't

hang on i'll show ya

that's the socket item

it costs 2 Bloodstones and 9750 honor

you can get the Bloodstones from certain rare chest spawns in the open world, but they seem really rare so far

and the chests you get from winning games

also rare from those though

[forest compass]

oh thats good so at least there is a reason to collect honor

[potent pivot]

supposedly you can get them from the wpvp chests

the ones that air drop

but no one i know of has gotten one from those either

[forest compass]

what is there any best proffesion for rogue?

or dosent matter?

[potent pivot]

doesn't really matter, you need to be engi if we run goggles though

but don't know if we're going to bother running them or not yet

[forest compass]

what proff for the money?

[potent pivot]

whatever you want really

as far as i'm aware all professions have some way to make gold

but i'm no expert

maybe @wintry dew knows

[wintry dew]

All professions right now are doing some money, but one must understand crafting well to do it

I've done around 50k+ just by gathering stuff per example

[potent pivot]

i think i'm going to wait til everything gets cheaper before i level my crafters

i don't want to sink gold into leveling them and end up at a loss

[wintry dew]

I've put my BS warrior to use, maxed weapons (daggers) already

[potent pivot]

i sold a BS recipe for 150k

[wintry dew]

nice!

[potent pivot]

i got it from a pvp chest

super lucky

[forest compass]

nice

[potent pivot]

how much did it cost to level it up?

[wintry dew]

nothing

[potent pivot]

oh really

[wintry dew]

I farmed all the materials myself while leveling my DH (lvl75 purely by gathering while i watch anime and stuff)

[proven kayak]

My only income is the recipes

[forest compass]

is it better than honor one?

[worthy crag]

was sec tech 1 min cd in DF?

[wintry dew]

Path to daggers maxed out, all i did was craft each repice i've learned ONCE for a bonus talent point, then bought the cheap talent points from vendors (and there's a vendor in map 4 as well, using their currency)

[surreal canyon]

whos got the one button meme macro for ass

[wintry dew]

And collected all the skill points treasure (2 per map)

[forest compass]

is that dagger better for pvp than honor one?

[wintry dew]

no

pvp is always better in pvp

[forest compass]

just tho u mea by can upgreded it somhow for pvp

[potent pivot]

doesn't exist

[potent pivot]

i really need to farm more stuff in the world

i've basically been in dungeons/bgs/comp stomps since launch

[wintry dew]

I've done almost NO dungeons

just having fun

[potent pivot]

all the dungeons i've done were just lvling in normals

[wintry dew]

This will be mainly the characters i'll be using

[potent pivot]

that rogue mog holy 🔥

[wintry dew]

Thanks :3

[potent pivot]

wait both of them

daaamn

that nelf rogue mog goes hard

[sick wasp]

Human is just

a beauty

nothing to add

also the orc with the gigachad shoulders

bro's on srs mog tech

[wintry dew]

to be fair warrior one is a full set. T3 shoulders + Naxxramas set

Nelf rogue tmog was created by JJ

Elite s3

Dh is another full set

#1262437829150113855 message rogue tmog is this one

i'm missing the weapons still

[sick wasp]

thats a rly nice one yeah

smooth and rogue theme'd and all

love it

[wintry dew]

Human must be the closest to "normal rogue" as i can

Like the good old days

[proven kayak]

Humans rogue mog is goated

[sick wasp]

I like this one btw Used to have something very similar on my Elf as well,diff hair though

the waist could be ebtter

[wintry dew]

Unfortunately for the guy, he's using a full set

[sick wasp]

but its aa nice touch

yup

[spring bough]

oh wow i can finally upload a clip. me after finishing off the afflic lock and then dealing with a sub rogue

killing spree got him after the infinite stuns lmao

[wintry dew]

Beautiful

[spring bough]

Realized that sub rogue was the one from earlier too 😂

Bro def hates me lol

[stoic spruce]

Trickster?

[spring bough]

Yeah

[stoic spruce]

Nice

[spring bough]

Almost doubled their team dmg

last one for me. fatebound 3s. both specs fun both rip feel like they on equal footing tbh

healer stood 0 chance

[surreal barn]

Damn

I think fatebound will be it with dampening meta

Ngl

[narrow tangle]

rip acrobatic strikes

you'll be missed

[wintry axle]

what addon shows cps on target frames like that?

[spring bough]

I did like 5 more mil dmg in the 2s game I had in trick was probably 5-10 seconds longer

[spring bough]

Should be betterblizzframes and betterblizzplates

[wintry axle]

thanks

[median yarrow]

anyone of you have strong opinions about easiest to get into rogue pvp spec right now? i don't really do pvp i think strongest i went was legit 1400 in bfa or something so i'm straight ass at pvp, but i kinda wanna give it a try this expansion

[steep kiln]

So while comp stomp is going on. buy many Vicious bloodstones. then xfer as much honor as you can to alts so you can xfer it back once season starts to buy Jewelers setting

is that the play to get many sockets once the season starts

[potent pivot]

that sounds really troll

you lose 20% every time you transfer honor

[fervent shell]

you can do it with base UI

[steep kiln]

ya guess you'd lose 40% after xfering back. seems pretty sweaty

[potent pivot]

i think buying some of the stones is fine

other than that get honor cap on as many characters as you can if you're sweaty

not transferring - but actually playing the alts

[steep kiln]

👍

[potent pivot]

you can loot the stones from other stuff too

[steep kiln]

I gotta lvl alts still. just been playing rogue

[potent pivot]

so i wouldn't buy all of them yet

you need 18 of them total

so buy maybe 10ish for now

[potent pivot]

this is a common question but it's really relative to who you ask

probably assa or outlaw

[median yarrow]

i'm getting shafted on sub in comp stomp right now so i'm open for anything

[potent pivot]

sub generally requires a lot more game knowledge and mechanical skill

[median yarrow]

it's what i play in pve so i figured something might transfer

[potent pivot]

outlaw basically just smashed everything on cooldown

[steep kiln]

guessing you need more than 2% haste for outlaw?

[potent pivot]

assa has to maintain dots

[potent pivot]

!stats

[lethal roost]

These are the recommended stat priorities for each spec in PvP. Please keep in mind that having suboptimal stats on some pieces such as tier set pieces is not the end of the world.

Subtlety: Vers>Mastery>Crit>Haste
Assassination: Vers>Mastery>Crit=/=Haste
Outlaw: Vers>Haste=/=Crit>Mastery
You likely want to stack at least 20% Haste on Outlaw for an extra GCD during ADR/Crackshot windows. Take 'em by Surprise gives you 10% during CS windows, so you only need 10-15% from gear.

[potent pivot]

ye

[steep kiln]

sweet thx

[idle root]

i got hit by a 2mi aimed shot (I have 3.5mi hp)

[potent pivot]

Add Ons for Midnight PvP

List will continue to be updated as more add ons catch up with all of the Midnight changes.

• Platynator - (nameplate addon)
• Arena Core - (Gladius replacement)
• MiniCC - (various aura alerts/bigdebuff functions)
• MyDRs - (DRs of CC used on you)
• MidnightDR - (nameplate DRs)
• MidnightDiminish - (target/focus frame DRs)
• DRTracker - (basic DR tracker)
• BattleGroundEnemies Fixed
• Leatrix Plus - (has max zoom out function)

[median yarrow]

i'll try outlaw in comp stomp, see how i feel

[potent pivot]

Outlaw feels surprisingly shit in comp stomp

Assa aoe does pretty well there

Outlaw feels good against other players though

[median yarrow]

ah i see

[stoic spruce]

its so bad

in comp stomp

[potent pivot]

Yeah idk why outlaw feels so bad in comp stomp

Maybe the NPCs have high armor

[topaz bobcat]

ah u play comp stomp

i thought that was for afking

[potent pivot]

To farm honor

[topaz bobcat]

yes, afk with bot

[hidden moth]

do u guys have seperate UIs for pvp? i just did my pvp UI but some stuff is uncomfortable for pve dungeons

[potent pivot]

Afking can get u banned fuck that lol

[spring bough]

messing ppl up in these dalaran 5v5s

arms war then MM dead

sub got me after lol

[stoic spruce]

youre in his matches?

[spring bough]

yeah

Vaanncleef

Pirate may or may not be in with me too XD

[topaz bobcat]

makes sense to nerf subterfuge to 1.5 sec in pvp

[stoic spruce]

ah yeah nah we dont need crackshot

[topaz bobcat]

going to write a post on forum, it's not fair rogue is so strong

[stoic spruce]

I found a cursed build

[spring bough]

link it

can i play trickster as it lol

[potent pivot]

we got an undercover opp on our hands

[potent pivot]

i used to yeah, but setting it up was always so annoying

[stoic spruce]

ye

oops

[stoic spruce]

ye

[potent pivot]

there's an addon you can use for addon profile sets

so you can open the Esc menu->addons thing and it'll have a drop down for profiles

i'm pretty sure you can make class WA HUDs not load in arenas

constantly swapping the addon profiles got old to me tho

[topaz bobcat]

remind me what is the diff between cosmic and chaos dmg?

which one bypasses magic -% effects?

[stoic spruce]

cosmic is arcane and nature I think and chaos is shadow, fire, nature, and something else

[topaz bobcat]

Ah so gets reduced by both -nature and -arcane dmg?

[stoic spruce]

yes

I wish we could go up talent trees

instead of only down

[fervent shell]

I thought they took whatever resists least?

[potent pivot]

i don't think either bypasses (-) magic effects

[stoic spruce]

oh yeah they dont

I misread

my b dawg

[potent pivot]

afaik magic is pretty all encompassing

[spring bough]

where that build at popo

[potent pivot]

if it isn't physical, it's magic

[stoic spruce]

magic types havent meant much since like

tbc

maybe wrath

[potent pivot]

well

for your kit they kinda do

like assa with nature dmg, sub with shadow

[stoic spruce]

yeah if your mastery effects nature dmg or whatever

[potent pivot]

cosmic and plague are both amped by nature or shadow buffs

[stoic spruce]

but thats about as much depth as there is with magic types

[potent pivot]

cosmic and plague both have nature so they are amped by sins kit

plague has shadow so it's amped by sub's kit

but yeah i don't think any defensives really tailor to magic types these days iirc

[topaz bobcat]

there are some racials

and some classes have against fire and shadow I think

rest just anti magic

[potent pivot]

yeah just base passive shit

i meant like usable defensives

mb

those racial/class passives usually don't mean much

[stoic spruce]

this aint gonna save you at ALL

this did more damage than DB initial hit

[topaz bobcat]

diff between life and death for 5.4k rating players like me

[spring bough]

interesting

get that extra dispatch dmg

[stoic spruce]

its melting atm

[spring bough]

bro

[stoic spruce]

sup

[spring bough]

coup did 1.47 million 1 cast

wtf

[stoic spruce]

yeah

[spring bough]

by switching crack to dispatcher

[stoic spruce]

youre still playing around stealth windows because pausing adr is insanely op but this is fun

[spring bough]

it was doing like 500k with crack builds lol

i do kinda dispatch more in areans / bgs too

esp in down time lol

[vocal surge]

yo Popo

you should join Dal's 5v5 1v1s

[stoic spruce]

erm

no

[vocal surge]

Why not?

[stoic spruce]

im shy and bad under pressure

[vocal surge]

You'll be a natural

[stoic spruce]

no im just a natural shit talker

[spring bough]

youll slap trust

run thru some people its fun lol

[stoic spruce]

maybe one day

[spring bough]

im about to use that change in the build in here lol

[stoic spruce]

its destroying the bots in comp stomp as well

so

idk what that means

but there you go

[stoic spruce]

you try it yet

anticipation is killing me

oh my GOSH this build makes love to the healthbars

im deleting that build

yall cant have that

thats mine

[rain crown]

Linkkkkk

I want

Maybe try some olaw tonight

[potent pivot]

too late

i've already made improvements

[stoic spruce]

dont you dare

[spring bough]

Yeah I was getting huge dispatches from it lol

[stoic spruce]

trickz no

[potent pivot]

the only problem i saw

[stoic spruce]

NO

[spring bough]

I wish I could drop ace with that

[potent pivot]

was the lack of a certain thing

[stoic spruce]

NOOOOOOOOO

[spring bough]

But no other way to get FTH

[potent pivot]

can't live without crack

[spring bough]

It’s actually pretty funny it’s like old times

Just slamming dispatch

[stoic spruce]

https://tenor.com/view/crying-baby-cry-gif-13805535

[spring bough]

Then no one can stun u in a crack window lol

The dispatching killing spree kings 😂

[harsh kiln]

Yall talking about greenskin build with no crackshot?

[stoic spruce]

no greenskin

I mean....

yeah totally >.>

[harsh kiln]

Let me in on the secrets

[stoic spruce]

RAHHHH THIS BUILD IS HAVING SEX WITH THEIR MOTHERS

I need that new cpu

now

[vocal surge]

https://tenor.com/view/world-of-warcraft-plunderstorm-wow-plunder-gif-15700434299578423005

[spring bough]

@stoic spruce drop crack for GSW

Trust

Getting bigger pistols than I am dispatches

750k pistol

With CTO

No crack

[stoic spruce]

idkkkkk

I mean yeah but

idkkkk

[spring bough]

Pistol one dispatch two on dmg

[stoic spruce]

bro I am wiping the floor witht hese hoes

[spring bough]

Don’t say that in game chat you’ll get silenced 💀

[stoic spruce]

you should see what I say about subt players

this no acro is so stupid

[spring bough]

Can one of yall get hired as the next rogue dev and put that back solely for us

Maybe add back the BF adding 2yarda too

[vocal surge]

I have an idea

why dont we all queue

as a 3s Outlaw team

Triple Outlaw vs the world

[spring bough]

We would get nerfed

[vocal surge]

Popo

we need to cook

[potent pivot]

Brother

[vocal surge]

3 Outlaws

vs the world

[potent pivot]

How bad do you want to get nerfed

[stoic spruce]

lets play no capstone and not get nerfed at all

[spring bough]

😂

[vocal surge]

Lol

We all play Fatebound

[spring bough]

Still getting nerfed

[vocal surge]

Free Glad 3s

[potent pivot]

So you finally want to do more damage? We’ve been waiting

[stoic spruce]

buddy

[potent pivot]

[stoic spruce]

fatebound aint worth the coin its printed on

[vocal surge]

^

[potent pivot]

Delusional and poopy

[vocal surge]

Atleast we aren't doing

[stoic spruce]

for someone named notrickz you have a lot of them

[vocal surge]

Triple Feral

[spring bough]

Been back n forth all day again and trick just more fun and rips lol

[vocal surge]

that can casually bleed an entire team ezpz

[potent pivot]

I hope you match into a glad and lose because you’re gcd locked

I’m joking ok

[vocal surge]

https://tenor.com/view/spongebob-fish-izctrl-gif-21698702

[stoic spruce]

im not

it wont happen

[spring bough]

GCD locked while doing a milly damage lol

[vocal surge]

Me looking at all the dead glads

[stoic spruce]

because he'll be DEAD

[potent pivot]

Lool

[stoic spruce]

great minds think alike

[spring bough]

Trust go against the grain it rips

Next time dal does 5v5 trickster vs fate outlaws

[vocal surge]

True

That's if we even get another Outlaw

[spring bough]

Can’t wait for day one of season then it’s off to the elite mog races lol

[jolly sierra]

finally lvl 80

[spring bough]

Time to get that honor gear

[vocal surge]

^

[stoic spruce]

yall

get the yarr addon

[spring bough]

thats kind hard ngl

doing that while plunderlording people tomorrow

[inner tartan]

U STOLE MY CANDLE

[topaz bobcat]

Rogue unfairly strong

[stoic spruce]

yeah assa melts

its wild

[jolly sierra]

done

[spring bough]

which one of u trolling on this fake acct

[stoic spruce]

mf how

[potent pivot]

i'm sorry, my name is Warrior. nice to meet you.

[spring bough]

Outlaw*

[potent pivot]

not done YET

[jolly sierra]

wut

[spring bough]

was correcting the header on ur character frame

[stoic spruce]

still need your stat stick

[jolly sierra]

now?

[potent pivot]

yep

[jolly sierra]

nice

[potent pivot]

pog

[jolly sierra]

speedrun

[spring bough]

how many other chars did u get 80 before that lol

[jolly sierra]

0

[potent pivot]

should i clear the map of all quests ...

never done it before and i want tabards n shit

[spring bough]

i wanna get this tyr hand tabard, anyone have it?

err tyrs guard

tryna figure out how long it takes

[potent pivot]

i'm sure you can figure out how to get it on wowhead

[spring bough]

bunch of quest chains lol

looks long

[waxen meteor]

i sort of get you guys why taking of KB

dmg is kinda disappointed

[potent pivot]

yep

[jolly sierra]

which enchant were u talking about?

[waxen meteor]

the deathstalker marker has to been enabled by amush is kinda bad tbh

it's a werid requirement

for sin

[jolly sierra]

in wep?

[potent pivot]

basically everything cool takes forever to get

[spring bough]

pretty much lol

[potent pivot]

you mean which one is best? radiant power if ur really going to buy it

[waxen meteor]

it totally makes sense to sub, but for sin, having to find a open global for ambush can be a bit tricky

[jolly sierra]

gotcha

gotta buy one for future OH

[potent pivot]

it's not that bad

[waxen meteor]

and bigger issue is if you miss ambush in open, you don't get to ambush...

[jolly sierra]

so wont be a waste

[waxen meteor]

unless you vanish

[potent pivot]

they'll prolly be cheaper later on

[waxen meteor]

i have no problem with it if i don't get cced at open

[potent pivot]

but you do you ofc

[jolly sierra]

ye ik but better have at least 1

so u dont stay behind

[waxen meteor]

but if got some random cc, it's kinda hard to get the mark on

like whole game

unless we spend a vainish for that (or of course you are NE)

[potent pivot]

open with cheapshot

gar-gar-rupture-ambush

[waxen meteor]

yeah cheap - garrot then for example you get a fear

what do you do

[potent pivot]

ignore the mark until you can get it up

the mark isn't what you're playing around

if you can apply it, cool. if not, cool.

[waxen meteor]

doesn't no mark basically means having no hero talent?

[potent pivot]

yep

it means not using the capstone

[waxen meteor]

yeah that's why i said to build it around ambush for sin is not a good desgin

[potent pivot]

you still have other stuff on the tree

[waxen meteor]

as sub you can dance to ss easily, so you can enable your hero talent sort of anytime

[potent pivot]

there's stuff on the tree that does not require Mark

rupture dmg, FoK and CT dmg

etc

[waxen meteor]

yeah that's alright

i just feel it can require a skill we are accessable most of time for mark

as an overall design

[topaz bobcat]

guys, I'm just saying, but if we all go together and just suggest nerfs to our class right now

we could preempt and avoid a massive nerf

[waxen meteor]

you mean to warriors?

[potent pivot]

rogue is not powerful enough that it warrants nerfs

the only thing that warrants nerfs is assa's aoe

and no one cares if they nerf assa's aoe i don't think

as long as it's ST gets buffed

[waxen meteor]

as long as it's ST gets buffed

[humble spear]

Is it okay if I stay Orc? Nelf race change has been bugging me lately 😦

Have to mention all my chars are in horde server too

[stoic spruce]

yes

[potent pivot]

all my characters are on a mostly horde server as well, but now that guilds and cross faction AND cross server it doesn't really bother me.

one thing i will say though regarding your question: if you aren't playing at a really high level it won't matter much not being night elf.

if you're really trying to push yourself and get as high rating as you as a player possibly can, then it's worth it

if you're just going to get the transmog stuff and have fun, don't worry about it

[spring bough]

im gonna start club haymaker for any1 thats wants to join the kul tiran ranks