Dude people have A MILLION HP
#pvp
severe helm
im aware they both do piss damage but mut hits harder
steel scarab
Incredibly marginally considering it does EVERYTHING ELSE worse
Also
On 5 targets
It hits HARDER
potent pivot
it generates more CP on a single target
steel scarab
Due to the one talent
halcyon timber
Fan does?
steel scarab
Fan does
severe helm
mut is def better in ST than fok
but yeah builders are a little toooo weak for assa
but weirdly enough so are spenders
potent pivot
On 5 targets
this is pretty irrelevant though except for bg team fights
severe helm
both spenders do piss damage
potent pivot
where you'd press fok anyway
severe helm
rupture, crimson tempest, envenom
all shit dam
your best two abilities are garrote and kingsbane
both generators
steel scarab
this is pretty irrelevant though except for bg team fights
Or in arena with pets
potent pivot
rupture, crimson tempest, envenom
CT is doing pretty good on beta at least
halcyon timber
Combine ld with extra effects though
steel scarab
Rupture does more than KB lately
potent pivot
Or in arena with pets
that damage barely matters though and they don't gen more CP
steel scarab
Pets don't?
potent pivot
sure it makes you do more dam to main target but w/e
steel scarab
Why wouldn't they
severe helm
kingsbane does insane damage lol
potent pivot
wdym
severe helm
like 40% of someones hp just off the initial hit
potent pivot
kingsbane does insane damage lol
not on beta 
severe helm
it was insane
steel scarab
Fan gets more CP the more things you crit
steel scarab
If you crit multiple things you get lots of CP
halcyon timber
Bc warlocks write eviction letters
halcyon timber
Spammed FAT 5stacker envenoms
steel scarab
I didn't notice it stopped being a thing, but no wonder it's felt worse
halcyon timber
Is why
lime oar
halcyon timber
Was a long time ago, don’t remember its been so long
potent pivot
https://tenor.com/view/touch-grass-grass-edit-discord-mod-take-a-shower-grass-gi...
idk if you're trying to bait but it's kinda weird
steel scarab
Just not player pets?
halcyon timber
Was like wrath or something
steel scarab
We didn't have fan in wrath lol
potent pivot
It definitely works on everything in M+
m+ isn't pvp
lime oar
I just find this dude raging every night about rogue specs funny
halcyon timber
Was like the fookin cant do x rules to pets and sheet
And then the drs for pets started sneaking in
steel scarab
Ability tooltips need disclaimers so people don't play operating under the assumption things should work a certain way when they don't, because "we nerfed that in pvp but if you don't read every patch note from the past two decades, you won't know"
I'll start: Fan of Knives does not generate CP on pets in pvp. There
Now I wouldn't be mad if that was a thing
It's not a thing
And that's annoying
potent pivot
tool tip bloat is a real thing man
steel scarab
I know, totally
potent pivot
they can't put the entire spell data on a tool tip
steel scarab
Maybe like a
"Click here for additional details"
And pull up a window you can scroll through
I don't think that's crazy
potent pivot
i do think that there should be a pvp toggle
steel scarab
Absolutely should
potent pivot
so that you can see the pvp dmg outside of an actual arena/hitting a dummy
cinder elm
sry im new, does all the honor gear go to legacy vendors after tww starts
or should i keep grinding for the rest
potent pivot
@wintry dew
wintry dew
potent pivot
i honestly don't remember if honor gear does or not, i know conquest gear does
wintry dew
All the sets go into vendors (the conquest and honor sets we had throught DF) for 12 marks of honor each
cinder elm
awesome
wintry dew
Im fairly sure. If you're in game, try porting to oribos
potent pivot
thanks Royal 
outer sky
Broskis I am sipping single malt scotch and smoking cigars on a fucking fishing boat with no land in sight right now and I am loving it. Totally forgetting about the fact that I turn 30 tomorrow so may as well be dead already and the fact that both my favorite WoW classed are absolute trash for the next xpac ❤️
potent pivot
wintry dew
Broskis I am sipping single malt scotch and smoking cigars on a fucking fishing ...
You're legit living the life
I hope you enjoy that view my man
halcyon timber
Shark steaks are bad af too btw
potent pivot
Broskis I am sipping single malt scotch and smoking cigars on a fucking fishing ...
i'll be welcoming you to the club 
potent pivot
they're okay
outer sky
Shout out to Starkink internet though like for real. Who would have ever thought I could be 50+ miles from land on a fishing boat and still be able to game on 50-70ms
And it all fits in a suitcase
wintry dew
And it all fits in a suitcase
Y'all safe there?
halcyon timber
He is the storm
potent pivot
damn that's wild
outer sky
Y'all safe there?
Yeah we're fine. My wife got tipsy and threatened to throw me overboard a few times but otherwise it's all good
halcyon timber
Got yourself in a monkey harness
graceful ravine
anyone got a pic of the TWW s1 glad mount?
outer sky
Nah the best man from my wedding is here too
wintry dew
Nice, party hard 🎶
potent pivot
anyone got a pic of the TWW s1 glad mount?
sec
outer sky
graceful ravine
that is ugly as fuck
outer sky
One of the worst ones they've ever designed
halcyon timber
outer sky
It's also bad because everyone got the exact same mount with an even better skin for free during the BFA pre patch
halcyon timber
War of thorns bat mount
halcyon timber
Lots of bats in the caves all over though
Pretty nasty ones in the ringing deeps
Good world pvp out there too
Lots of them munching on bodies too
outer sky
This one just seems uniquely lazy to me
They took the bfa prepatch mount and recolored it
halcyon timber
War of thorns plaguebat yeh
outer sky
Next xpac the glad mount will just be a giant turd with a harness
halcyon timber
Was good world pvp till they nerfed the pee out of us due to propaganda
The custom zeppelin is cool though
potent pivot
i hope they don't try to make them follow the theme of the expansion
feel like we've had a lot of bad ones in the past couple expacs
outer sky
Sinful and draconic were the best ones we've had in a long time
spring bough
how much do we have to pay a dev to add the mount for the solo bg or shuffle achieve lol
graceful ravine
DHs have a bat mount like that for free
i usually at least play the first season of every expansion, but rogues not looking very spicy atm 😦
for both pve and pvp content
fading blade
glad shriekwing mount mid af
potent pivot
i usually at least play the first season of every expansion, but rogues not look...
i'm not sure about pve, i know sin is good in m+ on beta.
but for pvp we're fine
@outer sky
CUQAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAMDAAAAAAY2mZmlpBYmhxYmZMzMzMjZZWmxMLbDzwMDGzsMGAAAAmhBbmtBGwCYZYCZWYM
drops Lingering Darkness for Symbolic Victory and Sepsis for Flag basically
it has to drop Deeper Daggers because of pathing which i don't like
but it seems to be doing better than the last build post nerf
signal raven
is honor still not transferable or what.
muted abyss
is honor still not transferable or what.
it was, but then blizz fucked up another transfer and had to disable all transfers
basically we probably won't get it until launch
muted abyss
Yup, the first time around there was an issue with honor level, so only like 5 peole cared, but they disabled it lol
potent pivot
I guess I missed my 10 minute window.
i wouldn't be so sure about it not getting it til launch
it only took a few days for them to fix war band banks
muted abyss
We'll see, I hope it is fixed soon. Maybe Tuesday at the latest if they do fix it before launch
or during the time when mop remix ends, idk
potent pivot
it's likely something they're actively working on, so i think there's a decent chance we get it back before launch
they could fix it before reset
waxen meteor
is there still blitz (not rated one) anymore in live?
potent pivot
is there still blitz (not rated one) anymore in live?
should be yeah
or do you mean like
regular bgs
waxen meteor
no, the old blitz like in season
strange i dont find the option
might be because i am just newly lv70
even daily bg win shows reward as exp
not honor
potent pivot
oh idk if that's a thing anymore or not
jolly sierra
doesnt counts as cap tho
i have empty vaults
but have sense
cuz TWW have not vault anymore
outer sky
guys check out this pic from before I left yesterday
It's so trippy
the sky and the ocean are the same color
so you can hardly see where they connect
visually, ofc
potent pivot
damn that is kinda trippy
jolly sierra
what a tsunami
outer sky
@potent pivot what do you think about not taking Thiefs vers?
graceful ravine
i'm not sure about pve, i know sin is good in m+ on beta.
but for pvp we're fine
just spent a hour running heroics as sin, its so much better than it used to be
but concluded pve is not my cup of tea
im already shivering from the potential grind i need to if i were to m+
potent pivot
<@629463378250956810> what do you think about not taking Thiefs vers?
thiefs vers?
oh the outlaw vers talent
i kinda think not taking it is a little troll but like
it just depends what you're talking about swapping it for really
like is it just to take FF and Sleight?
outer sky
I was just doing skirms with some outlaw rogue I met on beta
SS is down
and he was doing a lot of damage
and had respectable rating
and he said
oh also he said he only ever plays outlaw
and he said
outlaw is basically unplayable without Count and Blade Rush
and so to get them both, which he says you have to, you need to drop thiefs vers and ghostly strike
potent pivot
it's definitely playable without BR imo
like it feels not as good but it's not trash because of it
we weren't taking count before it got buffed and it only got buffed by 5% so i'm not sold on that either
like i'm fully down to drop GS
but it'd have to be for like...
GSW
there's zero shot you drop GS just for CtO or BR
potent pivot
and so to get them both, which he says you have to, you need to drop thiefs vers...
dropping the vers doesn't even get you either of them?
unless i'm tripping?
outer sky
sec
potent pivot
if i drop vers i can't take anything in the top section of the tree
so it's not competing with BR or cto
it competes with like, Sleight and FF
potent pivot
i would definitely stay vers over TT
outer sky
I mean it does buff your audacity procs I guess
GS just feels too good to drop
I'm a lazy shit and macro it to BTE
and I still like it
outer sky
well audacity scales off your chance to double SS
potent pivot
to give you a well thought out answer on that one
yeah
strikes also have a chance to give rolls
but idr if extra strikes from TT can do that
outer sky
i dont see why they wouldnt
outer sky
Skull and Bones
potent pivot
it's more clunky than you'd think
outer sky
it's like Jenga lol
outer sky
remove one piece and the whole structure falls over
potent pivot
compared to sin and sub
outer sky
I really need them to revert the ace nerf man
potent pivot
some shit interacts some doesn't etc
outer sky
that feels so bad
potent pivot
one thing i will say
dropping a capstone just to have BR for example
i don't think that's the play
i'd have to play it to know for sure though
i would rather drop cto for BR
all day everyday
outer sky
idk if this is an unpopular opinion or not but I kinda wish they'd just get rid of hook and give outlaw another charge of step
I hate the hook, man
potent pivot
outer sky
half the time I get CCd mid way
outer sky
that has a high af opportunity cost
potent pivot
wdym
outer sky
I personally dont play it
potent pivot
hook->kick->hook
outer sky
you're extending its CD and you miss out of the passive freedom you get from the other talent
potent pivot
that passive freedom is rng
outer sky
so is everything outlaw
potent pivot
i'd rather not leave my movement up to rng
can you see the uptime of that on details
in auras/buffs
outer sky
honestly man casters at high ratings, unless they're stoned af, will fake your ass every time if they see you hooking towards them mid cast
outer sky
can you see the uptime of that on details
yeah but SS is down so I only have skirms to look at which isn't reliable
outer sky
ok sec
outer sky
well its moreso that skirms are so short you dont get a long enough time sample size to judge it by
potent pivot
some could have 100% uptime and others 0%
outer sky
I'll pound a dummy for 1m
potent pivot
yeah
outer sky
before I test this, what % up time do you think it needs to be for it to be worth over the hook?
potent pivot
i really don't know tbh
definitely over 50% i feel
i think that's gonna end up just being a choice for whatever feels best
but i like the idea of double hook
hook->kidney->hook to other target
there's so many possibilities there for high skill plays
that's the kinda shit i like
outer sky
well I was wrong, it's not a visible buff anyway
potent pivot
but if the uptime is high enough then it's kind of a no brainer vs shit like frost mage
outer sky
so I cant track it
outer sky
I mean
I can infer
a bit
sec
Tails only provides a buff it it's flipped in a row
the first tails flip is just damage to the target
so the uptime is at least 51%
just based on tails alone
It's hard to calculate heads
probably 70% uptime is a fair guess
give or take
idk that sounds pretty damn good to me lol
outer sky
I'd say 65-75% is a fair range based on the tails buff uptime
heads is a buff even on the 1st flip so I can't calculate it
so say around half that
that range seems good
native moat
can i get some help queing up for PVP islands please im alliance
wintry dew
can i get some help queing up for PVP islands please im alliance
This isn't LFG discord my friend, you gotta use your own tradechat or create a group in the LFG system and pray
indigo hill
What is the big difference between fatebound and trickster?
Since fatebound seems to be the one for pvp but I noticed trickster also seems to have some nice stuff.
balmy shuttle
just logged on my outlaw rogue to test things, but the spec seems to be completely broken. armor scaling, crackshot not working, stealth randomly breaking. insane that all of this went to the live servers
indigo hill
Armor scaling is intended. Rest is bugs. Stealth is always shit at the start of an expansion for what ever reason.
halcyon timber
What is the big difference between fatebound and trickster?
Trickster works around Unseen blade which can pop kind of hard and grants a stack of a buff called Escalating Blade - after 4 you can then perform a Coup De Grace (hard hitting Eviscerate/ Dispatch). It stacks up quickly and using Secret Technique / Killing Spree ignores the Internal CD to grant 2 more hits which help and talents like Thousand Cuts / Flickerstrike also help it. As you engage frequently, you gain a stacking finisher buff called Flawless Form and it does pack a good chunk for Outlaw and for us Subtlety rogues. Surprising Strikes is a nice touch esp as someone who has always digged hard backstabs + ambush etc over the years. Cloud cover allows for you to get fazed debuff off on targets (unseen blade interaction) so they will take 5% more damage from you and the additional effects. I've been big about Trickster since alpha testing and it definitely does some cool stuff.
Fatebound is pretty much probability that evens out,both sides of the fated coin are useful. As you use a finisher it flips and whatever it lands on, it grants you either a stacking damage bonus or a cosmic (shadow/frost/holy/physical/nature combined schools umbrella). On each crit you deal 30% more damage as cosmic (fate intertwined) and the capstone can add another blast off consecutive build ups of that lucky 7 coin and grants agility (7% I think ) (doesn't feel ridiculous). It flows well, gains a good bit of combo points from deal fate and has some ways to guarantee some favorable roles for on demand action. Both do well, the choice is yours.
lime oar
Trickster seems more fun. But idk I haven’t touched beta, I just read this thread when I’m bored 
grave basin
is every class just having this as a baseline now?
makes your entire kit so worthless
halcyon timber
Yeah, its bonus damage to those abilities. I dunno, im thinking of it as an additional hook to X without running into this ability deals too much so they have to tone y down.
Ex fatebound is all finishers dealing x more with the fated coin. The finisher was still the vehicle and the coin is pretty much replicating whatever finisher it was which is cool.
grave basin
feels like really bad design when so much of your dam is just 1 bar
it's the same for warlocks and wither
halcyon timber
People complained back when things were all core and wanted more special attacks. This is the consequence of that taking over. Its still us doing the damage, it is just additional effects tacked on to those abilities so they aren’t doing ridiculous damage.
I can maturely see why they chose it from different angles. I dig it but yeah i would trade anything to go back to core any day but the main man said they aren’t repeating that but they are taking lessons of the past and I can honestly dig that.
I don’t mind it as I have had a lot of time to think about it. Core still pulls its weight, special attacks do their thing. Neither side is extremely dominant. Dunno how demon surge works from that photo but I imagine their is an activator so it is more like “this attack does x more but written as surge” which is the same thing except it is just split up in details / combat logs. Surely there is more than one activator / use which does allow for dynamic elements and creativity of the individual.
lime oar
I don’t mind it. People complaining and crying about subs playstyle every day, balancing your cd’s and lining them up perfectly for that kill window is part of the fun. It’s just shitty when the dmg wasn’t there.
vocal surge
"Can we nerf Cheap shot? Make it a 30s CD. Nerf Shadow Dance. It's too op. And then can you nerf Eviscerate, Shadowstrike, Backstab, and Secret Tech by 75% while gimping their Vanish charges pls? Sub rogues are just so unfair..."
The sub rogue doing 1/4 of their DPS output: "Bruh."
surreal barn
There’s one thing that will make me snap
Above anything else they do to rogue
They put a time limit on stealth and I’m out
harsh kiln
might aswell play a warrior at that point
we're getting closer and closer to becoming one every change they make anyway
a lesser one i might add.
stoic spruce
Failed to mention the "1/4" of their dps output is during CDs and damn near one-shotting.
While entire team is CCd
muted abyss
They put a time limit on stealth and I’m out
Yeah, almost no other game has this level of stealth, it's always a cooldown and short duration
honor is transferrable agian btw
last jasper
Yeah, almost no other game has this level of stealth, it's always a cooldown and...
Except there is no other mmo game with a healthy player base
I tried sub on the beta. I was already annoyed by the number of modifiers in Dragonflight, and now there are even more. Eviscerate can hit anywhere from 600 to 2 million.
halcyon timber
Above anything else they do to rogue
Like gw2 then keep nerfing rogues even though warr literally hits 1 button
muted abyss
I tried sub on the beta. I was already annoyed by the number of modifiers in Dra...
Yeah, that's honestly my gripe with modern wow. You hit like a wet noodle and have to use cooldowns to do any appreciable damage
halcyon timber
I tried sub on the beta. I was already annoyed by the number of modifiers in Dra...
Other games gripe even more.
halcyon timber
Failed to mention the "1/4" of their dps output is during CDs and damn near one-...
Understood but one shot is def overused. Fel reaver killing you by monkey stomping one time is a one shot. Btw OUTLAW WILL RISE AGAIN! The revenge of rogues has started!!!
last jasper
Yeah, that's honestly my gripe with modern wow. You hit like a wet noodle and ha...
I’m okay hitting like a wet noodle unless I press buttons. I don’t like that I also need to dance around procs and other stuff for 2mil finisher. While frost mage literally spam ice lances for 1 mil
Also I miss old Premeditation
surreal barn
Like gw2 then keep nerfing rogues even though warr literally hits 1 button
That and rift
Whatever became of rift lol
halcyon timber
xD freakin a . All rogues will stand together. We all have to do well, the infighting about being best and all that crap gets no one anywhere. I do believe in Outlaw and Assassins and they will make it work.
potent pivot
halcyon timber
heh
stoic spruce
xD freakin a . All rogues will stand together. We all have to do well, the infig...
I refuse to stand with sub rogue
@worthy crag gets it
halcyon timber
I refuse to stand with sub rogue
yes we know popo pooopoo
take your wendy's baconator and drink your sprite
stoic spruce
Only the best for Outlaw mains
stoic spruce
I'm a sophisticated outlaw main
worthy crag
take your wendy's baconator and drink your sprite
that shit is like 1800 calories
surreal barn
How did you all get diminish to work
old brook
How did you all get diminish to work
old brook
On enemies or just dummies?
surreal barn
Both
Well, dummies and pve so far, queue hasn’t popped
Oh I’m a dumbass
Had them both installed
old brook
Ah good catch, was just about to say I just tested in skirm and I'm seeing the gamut lol
halcyon timber
that shit is like 1800 calories
It is very very good for your happiness though
cinder elm
does wound poison affect only traditional healing, so like it has no affect on barriers that count as healing
jolly sierra
FINALLY
worthy crag
does wound poison affect only traditional healing, so like it has no affect on b...
It does affect absorb shields, just like dampening affects them. But it doesn't affect mitigation (like power word barrier or PS) and I don't think it affects % based health increases like desperate prayer or rally
worthy crag
so what exactly is the pvp modifier on invigorating shadowdust
its obviously not 50% anymore
Also does honor reset with new expansion launch?
worthy crag
guess im going back to taking 2/2 for it then
potent pivot
i haven't seen anyone drop it on beta
the only main builds i've seen so far are DM builds
worthy crag
I used to run 1/2 for it and another point into shadowcraft when it was 50% in pvp but
at 75% its too good to give up
potent pivot
no one taking goremaws
worthy crag
any non-evis build will be a meme, so no goremaw
potent pivot
kalv prefers sepsis build
worthy crag
not sure if both hero talent trees for sub needed to double down on finisher damage
potent pivot
nahj was testing flag which seemed halfway decent but at higher ratings you're way more open to being counter played
worthy crag
sepsis is good, but i dont think weaponmaster/first dance required to reach it are worth it
esp with new premeditation
worthy crag
that could be useful for staggering stealth and dance
potent pivot
the build i have linked in the pins
is basically what people are running on beta
without hero talents
worthy crag
ive been telling him how good swift death is since like s2
yeah shadow focus is definitely overkill
with vigor
potent pivot
yeh
this is just what kalv runs
and he does quite well with it but he's also just kalv so
outer sky
Replicating shadows seems kinda pad ish idk
worthy crag
I was not aware people were not taking planned execution, but I guess it makes sense with deathmark crit guarantee
potent pivot
Replicating shadows seems kinda pad ish idk
it is, but it's the only way you do reliable dmg
worthy crag
so nahj has swift death + replicating shadows?
potent pivot
yes
worthy crag
i didnt go for replicating shadows in favor of keeping shadow technique and planned execution
eh
shadow tech is prob worthless
people only took it for symbols crit but
even that seems less relevant now
so it gives me 2 free points
potent pivot
your dmg outside of goes is just so terrible
and having stronger rupture on KT before your go helps
worthy crag
i was just running rmp and thought about putting rupture to pad meter but the mage was perma sheeping the dps too so
as long as im stun petting for a good mage idc about my dmg
outside of goes at least
potent pivot
yeah i can see that
worthy crag
ditching shadow tech and planned exec just gave me 2 points
which means I can take replicating now
and im going first dance sepsis
which gives me an identical build as nahj
well
minus flag I guess
im never running that hsit
worthy crag
yeah I know, so mine is identical except for flag vs sepsis
worthy crag
id wager 90% of the time streamers take it is to just meme giggle in chat when it does dumb dmg
worthy crag
sometimes I used to do it when i could not hit the pathing node to sepsis but
pv is just so bad
potent pivot
you get a couple 500k strikes
he's saying sepsis is also bugged
the strikes it gives you have +25% dmg and teleport you
as if you were actually striking from stealth
i'm not sure if that's a bug or if they intentionally made it that way
worthy crag
the 25% part? That's been a thing in DF too, im pretty sure
i did some dummy tests on that
in early df
halcyon timber
stealthed strike always gives the 25%
worthy crag
yeah, gotta be stealth and not subterfuge or dance
potent pivot
is that just base strike
halcyon timber
si
potent pivot
ic
worthy crag
It's always been a thing, just horribly unreliable
potent pivot
i've never paid attention to it
worthy crag
I used to take manually 180 degreeing my rogue after sepsis to trigger the teleport version of SS
instead of the normal one in melee range
potent pivot
like obv i knew strike from stealth ports you
worthy crag
it worked like half the time though
potent pivot
if it continues to port you it could be even better into mages n shit
just for the port
even if it's unreliable
worthy crag
Yeah sometimes it will port you sometimes it never will
well
ive noticed a pattern that it has a higher chance of porting you near the end of sepsis window
and then again when sepsis pops
hard to explain, it was a while ago
Im just trying to understand how to use premed and first dance together
but maybe people are just taking first dance as a pathing node to sepsis
halcyon timber
Yeah old school style w the sv days
worthy crag
I prefer pressing dance the same global i stun the target or after they are stunned
but that can be a thing
dance kidney shadowstrike I guess?
kidney dance shadowstrike
hm
but first I need to get used to losing acrobatic strikes
halcyon timber
depends situationally but yeah
potent pivot
I prefer pressing dance the same global i stun the target or after they are stun...
ye he was
he was pressing rupture first glob in kidney/dance
not sure if he was always doing it or not
def saw it a few times tho
worthy crag
oh so like
BFA nightblade buff azerite trait gameplay
when nightblade used to buff your next evis w.e
halcyon timber
Yeah ol night's vengeance
potent pivot
you mean back when sub was actually enjoyable?
i didn't play from cata->bfa so idk
worthy crag
night's vengeance was a decent trait, i can dig that rupture then
worthy crag
and im pretty sure rupture dot tick makes 0 diff even if its 4 cp rupture or 7 cp rupture
just longer duration
halcyon timber
rupture yeah
potent pivot
just duration yes
halcyon timber
really disliked that
potent pivot
both sub and assa throw out low cp ruptures to get rolling
worthy crag
season 5~7 everyone was playing sin arcane
potent pivot
i just liked the design
at least from someone just watching the gameplay
i never actually played it
halcyon timber
constantly got nerfed
worthy crag
It was pretty fun
potent pivot
it looked like sub had more cool visuals back then?
worthy crag
legion sub and pre-corruption sub in BFA was alright
halcyon timber
not really it was just nonsense akarri's
I dig the duality we have though I will say that
dark brew pretty much is nightblade without "having' to rupture
worthy crag
So nahj would do like, kidney as a finisher, pop dance into FD rupture, and then premed empowered SS into evis
halcyon timber
yeah all customizable depending on what someone can do
potent pivot
sech tech earlier iirc?
potent pivot
it was like
halcyon timber
was at the end of the nonsense MOP style tree
and dealt all physical damage but yeah
worthy crag
I see
halcyon timber
I'm a big advocate for sepsis regardless though. Nice multitool.
worthy crag
I was the only night fae sub rogue for the entirety of SL
so
im pretty attached to it
potent pivot
but i'm talking about during Blades too
worthy crag
I mostly liked soulshape though
potent pivot
so everything is full combo points
worthy crag
Yeah
halcyon timber
I was venthyr because i'm doom and gloom with it all . Def appreciated the fae and their lore though.
worthy crag
and 75% shadowdust means more access to blades too
worthy crag
Not sure when they upped that
worthy crag
night fae cove legendary was pretty fun to play with
and not a braindead evis evis evis spammer like kyrian
potent pivot
i liked kyrian once we got the cov leggos
worthy crag
the real offender was the set bonus though
potent pivot
multiple points from ER was so much better than regular ER
halcyon timber
I dig what they stood for and their sacred watch but I def like the redemption style of the venthyr
halcyon timber
I do miss Renethal and the boys
potent pivot
so far anyway
worthy crag
Whats the TWW 4piece?
potent pivot
sec
halcyon timber
buffs finisher damage after secret technique
it's impactful, definitely trade some stuff for it but yeah
worthy crag
hm
halcyon timber
yeah 10 + 8% in pvp too just incase warlocks start spreading misinformation
potent pivot
i really hope it doesn't get nerfed
it's such a waste of a cool part of the game when we don't run them
halcyon timber
at this point who knows man
weird they decided to unnerf caster stuff to 100% but keep a tight watch on us for whatever reason
halcyon timber
si
A lot of instant casting from warlocks in TWW too
whichever the one is with wither
potent pivot
it's weird that they nerfed outlaw's set
halcyon timber
shaman + mages + warlocks will be a pain
potent pivot
like it's already dog shit unnerfed
halcyon timber
yeah listened to propaganda
At least the tier for Outlaw is built into fatebound which is nice (the 5% part)
for them
Inexorable Assault might be the way they deal with mages and crap too + unbreakable stride
potent pivot
yeah me n star were talking about that yesterday i think
i like the idea of Death's Arrival so much more
potent pivot
double hook just sounds so broken to me
halcyon timber
just not when we become too dependent on stuff like that though and then get snipped
potent pivot
yeah
halcyon timber
Simultaneously a druid if you will, (new wildstalker talent I think?) sees that and knows the rogue likes to do that -> Uses ursol's vortex and roots you in it
potent pivot
the fucking
halcyon timber
then mass roots when you get cleared anyway
potent pivot
Step->Kick->Hook macros people were using
halcyon timber
he skill shot your skill shot ig
potent pivot
does that shit still work
halcyon timber
Don't know but probably not
potent pivot
you know what i'm talking about?
halcyon timber
noticed we can no longer hang glide in stealth too
last jasper
shaman + mages + warlocks will be a pain
Pretty sure mages are gonna get nerfed a bit. I mean frost.
halcyon timber
makes me think they prob busted up druid's tea time too
last jasper
Gm, guys
halcyon timber
Pretty sure mages are gonna get nerfed a bit. I mean frost.
doubtful my man
morning man!
potent pivot
you could macro focus step/kick with hook[@me] and it would instantly hook you back to where you were originally
halcyon timber
but yeah Trickz I know what you mean
potent pivot
ah
halcyon timber
probably took the function out though
halcyon timber
esp since the mousover deathing totem nonsense
silly shit doesn't need to exist
def robotic af
potent pivot
i feel like they need to make the game more playable
requiring addons to know which totem to kill is trash
halcyon timber
Yeah I just use elv and make nameplates different
shit is agitating but whatever if that is some kind of shaman defense force propaganda hill they want to die on
they did resize minions and crap so that's nice (when warlocks are against you and elementals etc)
potent pivot
yeah ig that's better than nothing
halcyon timber
Same time I dunno, people need to learn and stop being a fool not killing counterstrike and then going full dumb dumb into the shaman and blaming a healer
or trying to run out of electric dog fence and kill it instead of griping
takes only a few moments to familiarize themselves with enemy abilities and read up on stuff.
halcyon timber
Yeah that's listening to shaman ' my tOteMs hAvE 10 hP "
like the new stone shield totem or whatever it is has a lot of life + Static has X% of their life I think? (like mage frostwall 40%?)
potent pivot
them having actual hp is just bad design imo
halcyon timber
Ig it is better than them being unkillable
like how minions are from frostfire mage and diabloist warlocks
errr Sunfury mage
the moltres Fire + Arcane summon
Ancestors from shaman are the same
unkillable counterstrike + earthen grasp would suck bad
potent pivot
yeh true
halcyon timber
Pretty sure mages are gonna get nerfed a bit. I mean frost.
I wonder if they are going to 3/4 nerf the Frostfire Root talent to .5s or halve it to 1s
outer sky
Shaman totems should all die the moment they take any direct damage, IMO
halcyon timber
mario lava level totem being back is annoying
outer sky
besides like, earthen wall or something
halcyon timber
high uptime on those flameshocks
last jasper
I wonder if they are going to 3/4 nerf the Frostfire Root talent to .5s or halve...
idk but frost is ridiculous rn. and they can't leave it like that into release
halcyon timber
hurrrr hurrrrrr me damage look at me dmg spongebob me boy!!!!
halcyon timber
idk but frost is ridiculous rn. and they can't leave it like that into release
oh you bet your bbq sammich it will as they are prob going to keep a couple casters in dumb dumb land + precognition a few weeks in then buff hunters to thin the herd
outer sky
One thing they really need to fix, because I'm assuming it's a bug and not working as intended. Is that earthgrab totem doesn't release you from it's roots when its killed. That's just dumb. And the reason I think it's a bug is because literally no other totem works that way. Every single other totem's effect ends the instant it is killed. Earthgrab seems like a weird one to intentionally make an exception for. But even if it is intentional it should still be changed to work like every other totem.
potent pivot
isn't the root dispellable
i can see where you're coming from but it's also just a root that requires retical placement
so like
outer sky
It's just a meaningless inconsistency
potent pivot
wouldn't that just make kinda shit if it dropped when totem died
last jasper
oh you bet your bbq sammich it will as they are prob going to keep a couple cast...
I wouldn't say mm is in a bad shape rn 😄
outer sky
wouldn't that just make kinda shit if it dropped when totem died
Maybe? Could say the same about counterstrike totem. If it gets killed instantly like it should then all it cost the other player was a global and it didn't do any damage. Same with root totem. It should cost a global to kill and do nothing once killed. That's how a lot of totems work. It would still be worth pressing to kite, keeping someone rooted for at least one global has value especially for a shaman that has spirit wolf.
potent pivot
Maybe? Could say the same about counterstrike totem. If it gets killed instantly...
yeah like i said i see your point, i'm not exactly disagreeing if you know what i mean
but it being dispellable kinda makes it w/e if you have a good healer at least
maybe instead of it rooting you full duration it should take 2-3 globals to kill
?
2-3 globals to kill and then root breaks on kill
i wouldn't mind that i think
prolly 2 globals max now that i think about it tho
outer sky
Dispell has a CD though. Dispell the root totem I already killed and now there's no dispell for the fear that was cast on me while I was killing the totem
Like just make it work like every other totem idk
cosmic frigate
quick question whats better for pvp sub or assassination?
outer sky
I play some devoker and I never realized how broken grounding actually is lol
outer sky
quick question whats better for pvp sub or assassination?
On retail assass, on beta we are still deciding
cosmic frigate
ok thank you
potent pivot
On retail assass, on beta we are still deciding
you know they turned shuffle back on right
just in case you didn't
they've been turning it on/off so randomly
halcyon timber
It's to make sure people get up and take showers
potent pivot
i imagine it's for launching hotfixes
halcyon timber
yeah based on wowhead segments probably
outer sky
you know they turned shuffle back on right
Yeah I played a lobby on outlaw earlier. Today was my 30th birthday so I've been hanging out on the deck of the boat all day/night with my wife and best friend. Just played one lobby after they went to bed like half an hour ago
Outlaw feels like the best of the 3 specs
But it also feels super mid
potent pivot
Yeah I played a lobby on outlaw earlier. Today was my 30th birthday so I've been...
oh yeah, happy birthday man
halcyon timber
Don't tell popo, he will get a rager
halcyon timber
What's Assassin kid's tier again? it's a stacking psn damage amp and I forget the 4pc
potent pivot
4p is just bleed dmg from those stacks
if you have 5+ stacks you get 10% bleed dmg but it's nerfed .5 so 5%
outer sky
I've tried sub on beta pre-LD nerd and it felt horrible. But I only could play SS, obv. Maybe better in real 3s where i can choose my comp
halcyon timber
hmm
potent pivot
kalv n nahj been doing ok in shuff
outer sky
if you have 5+ stacks you get 10% bleed dmg but it's nerfed .5 so 5%
Yes but the criteria to proc 4 set is also nerfed in pvp. You only need 2 stacks to get 4 set to proc
potent pivot
but they could prolly play as a hunter's pet and do ok
halcyon timber
xD
potent pivot
Yes but the criteria to proc 4 set is also nerfed in pvp. You only need 2 stacks...
oh that's weird af
halcyon timber
I think Assassins will end up alright, wouldn't be surprised if there were some data they were aiming at for them before considering X y z for tuning
They did the same with shadowpriests recently on a few things. I would imagine Assassins would end up the same.
halcyon timber
xD
outer sky
For 5% increased bleed damage that you can get with stats for the whole game by forgoing it
I'm also iffy on running 4 set as outlaw
Best case scenario you get 9% BTE damage
And usually you spend the stacks before you get 3
May be better to just fo for stats
potent pivot
well the way outlaw's stats are, you can probably run set without really fucking anything up
outer sky
I'm testing it on and off right now
outer sky
Idk mastery is looking insanely trash right now
potent pivot
it isn't
outer sky
On my meters it is
potent pivot
they even buffed it a bit
outer sky
I just don't see a point where you'd sac vers or crit to gain mastery. Maybe you could drop some haste for it if you are above the 0.8s GCD haste threshold for ADR
outer sky
It really feels like a tier set that doesn't need to be nerfed in pvp
potent pivot
before the haste ADR change all stats were pretty equal in value for outlaw (besides haste)
i agree
it's kinda dog shit anyway
outer sky
Even 2 set doesn't really do much. But you can get 2 set with great stats so there's no reason not to run it
Little free damage
outer sky
yeah I'm just not sure if it's good enough to lock yourself into the tier stats
Will probably depend on how mastery scales
If I'm right and it's lacking we probs don't play 4 set. If it's decent maybe we will
potent pivot
we stacked mastery in early DF
like outlaw's best stat was just mastery at one point
outer sky
I think it's pretty underwhelming regardless
potent pivot
at least that's what people thought
outer sky
Playing it vs not playing it is probably the difference of 1% overall dps
potent pivot
yea i just don't think it matters
stoic spruce
We'll have to see how tier tuning goes I spose
potent pivot
it's already nerfed by .5
halcyon timber
We'll have to see how tier tuning goes I spose
popo! what is better?
Chicken Teriyaki vs Italian BMT? (Subway)
outer sky
Italian BMT is BiS
halcyon timber
I love both of them sammiches
stoic spruce
Toasted ofc
halcyon timber
but chicken teriyaki is def my fave
with an ocean of that sweet onion teriyaki sauce
and banana peppers and shit
worthy crag
is this about subway
worthy crag
Chicken teriyaki is my go to as well
potent pivot
halcyon timber
fuckin love subway
worthy crag
but subway is so pricey now
outer sky
You want to get the #23, Hotshot Italiano double toasted on herb and cheese bread. Then added lettuce, extra onions, jalapeños, pepper, oregano, oil, and red vinegar.
worthy crag
was like 16.50 last time i bought from them
potent pivot
i love the philly from subway
halcyon timber
philly is bad af
halcyon timber
with like 14 little trays of philly
outer sky
Their chicken bacon ranch is pretty good too
halcyon timber
bad af as in badass
halcyon timber
I'd call something nasty or something
potent pivot
i always get the philly
halcyon timber
only thing that is an act of terrorism is the god damn veggie patty
halcyon timber
that and mayonnaise are direct violations of the geneva convention
potent pivot
that and mayonnaise are direct violations of the geneva convention
++
halcyon timber
veggie pattys are the new water boarding
potent pivot
the only way i eat mayo is from chicken/tuna salad
stoic spruce
Black bean patties are good tho
halcyon timber
reminds me of MREs and I can smell that damn veggie patty
stoic spruce
Mmmmm
potent pivot
oldschool MREs 
halcyon timber
xD
potent pivot
feels like eating fucking cardboard
halcyon timber
the fuckin milkshakes were wonderful
used to eat the strawberry banana milkshake powder with a spoon out in the field
potent pivot
the spaghetti or w/e it was, was fucking terrible
outer sky
the only way i eat mayo is from chicken/tuna salad
I mix mayo with ketchup and Dijon mustard and relish then add some salt and pepper. Goes great on a burger or chicken sandwich
stoic spruce
I love mayo
potent pivot
i like ketchup and mustard
potent pivot
but mayo is just not ok
stoic spruce
Mayo on a slice of bread is bis
potent pivot
i would puke
outer sky
i hate mayo on burgers
You don't taste mayo. It's just a base. I rarely put plain mayo on anything either. This transforms it
outer sky
i would puke
My mother in law adds mayo to her cake batter to make it creamier
potent pivot
idk man
i've had mayo on burgers with other condiments as well
maybe it's ok with very certain stuff
stoic spruce
Bro spicy mayo is the best
potent pivot
but any of the burgers i've had it was a no go
stoic spruce
Spicy mayo on a spicy chicken sandwich with a hot dr pepper made my childhood
potent pivot
My mother in law adds mayo to her cake batter to make it creamier
yeah i mean you definitely ain't tasting it like that
i'm sure
outer sky
Yeah you don't
halcyon timber
What if you took a bite out of your birthday cake and it was mayonnaise on the inside?
like a lava cake but.. mayonnaise xD
halcyon timber
😦
stoic spruce
Dropped my phone on my face
halcyon timber
I hope a hobo shits in your garlic bread
stoic spruce
I hope a hobo shits in your garlic bread
Jokes on you
halcyon timber
Jokes on you
hobo de popo
jolly sierra
are u talking bout fried chicken?
in this country they are advertising original recipe nuggets for KFC im hyped af for buying them
those are in like 3,99$
for 10
potent pivot
teriyaki chicken is like
chinese food style chicken iirc
it has a sauce etc
but we were talking about diff sandwiches
jolly sierra
ah i see
potent pivot
in this country they are advertising original recipe nuggets for KFC im hyped af...
kfc can be pretty hit or miss here
i feel like it's kinda dying out honestly
jolly sierra
kfc can be pretty hit or miss here
rlly? in this country is like S+
potent pivot
yeah in US i'd say it's one of the worst fast food places
jolly sierra
ive heard popeye is crazy good
jolly sierra
genuinely curious about give a try if i go to US someday
potent pivot
popeye's def S tier
jolly sierra
here went in bankruptcy and left the country
potent pivot
lmao
jolly sierra
sad i was unable to taste it
jolly sierra
cant say anything bout that tho, never heard about it
but other good chain here is BK
potent pivot
BK is ok here
jolly sierra
is a very safe bet to eat
potent pivot
Wendy's is also ok
jolly sierra
wendys is ok too here
but tbh
one burger than left me crazy the time i went
was from johnny rockets
FUCK
potent pivot
lol
jolly sierra
for my bday
jolly sierra
a friend was about to tell the fuckers was my bday so they camped my body singing it
REEEEEEEE
potent pivot
that's one of the best burger places
potent pivot
it's more expensive
but they also give you like a bag full of french fries
chipotle and five guys were my fav when i was buying take home
jolly sierra
nah if it worth the taste im buying it
dont care about price if it worth the moment
potent pivot
yeah
there's a lot of chinese and mexican restaurants here
no huge chains tho
there's one fast food chinese place called Panda Express
jolly sierra
oh here we have a lot of peruvians restaurants
potent pivot
i don't think it's very good though imo
jolly sierra
its ok, name doesnt give any taste lol
a place can be called dogshit but if they have the best french fries ever done in this timeline then its ok with that name lol
jolly sierra
what a king buffet
BTW im dumb af, just noticed i can poison thrown weapons in all my life
potent pivot
lmao
potent pivot
some cata shit?
jolly sierra
i think they will
like they did in SL
when assa was crap for early seasons and they buffed it by a lot
halcyon timber
when assa was crap for early seasons and they buffed it by a lot
Wouldn’t be surprised if some stuff was on their radar and they are going to push some stuff out for you guys within the next week maybe.
jolly sierra
Wouldn’t be surprised if some stuff was on their radar and they are going to pus...
hope so
halcyon timber
I wonder if it will be a kingsbane + envenom looksy. Wish we had some data to look at for now but yeah hard to say. Don’t want to see you guys get binned bc someone trinkets a 3s gouge and Q.Qs about it.
outer sky
you should try Five Guys
Speaking of expensive
halcyon timber
Five guys is sick af too
outer sky
hopefully they make some changes to sin soon for tww
Don't make me get my hopes up 😦
last jasper
😩😩
halcyon timber
Spicy chicken sandwich all day
And fries + banana pudding milkshake (they only do it in the summer)
outer sky
It's the only fast food meal I'd ever consider ordering at a real, sit down restaurant If nw option was available
halcyon timber
I like cookout too. Double burger + onion rings + chicken nuggets and a strawberry banana shake is deadly
Realistically, what is the most reasonable thing they could do for Assassination to give them some help?
Watching mages do 1.1M ice lances is just … yeah man. Yeah.
potent pivot
<@239851547935113216> go to chick fil a trust me
oh i forgot to mention chick fil a
def the best fast food there is
outer sky
Realistically, what is the most reasonable thing they could do for Assassination...
I think we all got spoiled by mega kingsbane. If they massively buff envenom or kingsbane or our bleeds it could be good
Whenever rogue is suffering it's basically always because of damage
Even with these CC nerfs our CC is fine
halcyon timber
Agreed, envenom help would be solid.
outer sky
I'm going to be playing with Thick as Thieves a lot next season
The CD on kidney and tricks are the same now
So every kidney your teammate gets 15% more damage
That is not bad at all
And blackjack is kinda bleh anyway
outer sky
Ok guys
Idk if we want to run 4 set as outlaw or not
but if we don't run 4 set
then we definitely dont run 2 set
It's terrible
that's across 6 games
and all it does is damage. There's no buff or anything
so that 345k damage is all I got from 2 set
it could be 10x that and still not worth it
half of one person's health bar in damage over 6 games
so
no
ew
gunna test running no tier
yeah if you drop tier you gain 1% vers plus some crit and that 1% vers alone is twice as much damage as 2 set
and you get the .5% damage reduction
so the question is whether or not 4 set is worth it
and I'm going to say 4 set is probably NOT worth it
because