No
#pvp
surreal barn
grave basin
unless you gain more mastery than you lose verse
sick wasp
its not ideal no
grave basin
HMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMM
sick wasp
i think its not like u will gain more dmg if u get more mast instead of vers
but if we are talking about shuffle
it does make sense
its more dmg for sure
even outlaws gem mastery after a point
surreal barn
You will gain much more damage with more mastery
Check your actual rupture tooltip before and after
sick wasp
yup im just the traditional dude that maxes out vers and focuses on gameplay rather than minmaxing the stats
u are definitely right here
jolly sierra
black luster soldier
surreal barn
During dance they can
grave basin
ive been doing half the damage i could have..
grave basin
my max crit
for all 6 rounds of shuff i just checked
was around 41 to 50k
like fully badged with nightstalker
that's such a big difference
??
surreal barn
Let’s compare it to the dummy
grave basin
dummy is kinda spotty when it comes to values no?
surreal barn
On the dummy that same tick will probably be 65k
surreal barn
dummy is kinda spotty when it comes to values no?
Dummy isn’t that far off from mage, lock, etc
sick wasp
its the pvp valued reduction only
surreal barn
sleep is for the dead
surreal barn
Start with one
grave basin
not sure what for at this point since im not pushing past 2.1
surreal barn
It might be enough after you see where you’re at
grave basin
but i wanna see how thick solid tight i can get
surreal barn
The only reason I went both was because I was behind on other crafteds
grave basin
should i make helm or wrist first
surreal barn
What’s your current gear
grave basin
sick wasp
think he posted a SS
surreal barn
Is that a lifebound helm
grave basin
yes
surreal barn
Get wrists
grave basin
lifebound wrist helm and belt
surreal barn
Damn
grave basin
damn
sick wasp
💀
grave basin
sick wasp
bro went ham on LW crafts
grave basin
i spent my last full spark last week
so more like 2 weeks from now..
wake me up when it's prepatch
surreal barn
You can craft every week with vault
surreal barn
Just spend 6 tokens on the half spark next week
grave basin
everything has socket
except nelt
belt
AND i took the vault gems to gem my ... wrist and helm
so back to half a spark from the weekly
BUT i can get the off hand?
surreal barn
I suppose
@sick wasp I wish I didn’t have that min/max mindset
I’d be better off
In life
sick wasp
I’d be better off
its for the best man,i jsut dont care all that much now u are more than fine
im more of getting the bigger picture kinda guy
grave basin
i thought i was full bis
10mins ago
now im in shambles
@surreal barn if you dont mind, can you post your garrote and rupture max damage in pvp when you get back
im gonna sleep now
surreal barn
Yup I’m @ work
surreal barn
and 207k garrote
You also have to take into account all the extra agility you get from keeping multiple targets ruptured
277+138 = 415/8 ticks = ~52k crit ticks
A lot higher after you add the rupture agi, trinket, stun boots, sophic
Even target health
pearl pasture
Hello there! I have been playing assassination rogue in shuffle for the past few months or so and was hoping for some guidance. Usually, I find dps pretty easy to play as I focus on damage and some CC to get to 1800. However with rogue, it took me much longer to get to 1900. Are there any ccs that I should routinely look out to do during shuffle? I just learned about kidney, blind, then sap. Also kidney and bomb as usual combos to go for. Are there any neat tricks or good combos that I should be thinking of?
jolly sierra
opponent trinket in CD + smoke bomb + kidney + kingsbane = win
stun/cc the other dps in burst = possibly forced trinket or a lot of less upcoming damage
pearl pasture
Thank you - stun/cc on their burst is a great one tyty
dapper chasm
Just a reminder of what a man's stats look like
jolly sierra
sub doesnt counts
dapper chasm
And I still gots rooms to grow
halcyon timber
Anytime someone can stop you - think to prevent that and cover your butt first
Then beat on people
Ex: stop the paladin bop with a gouge or blind then whoop on the team mate
dapper chasm
How the hell you know it's BoP you stopped?
halcyon timber
Or a moment to swap
dapper chasm
Maybe your gouge stopped him from using hardcast heals
halcyon timber
Don’t read too heavily into it man
dapper chasm
I will
halcyon timber
The point is buddy covering his butt
dapper chasm
Booty is more important than air
chrome spear
sub doesnt counts
How
jolly sierra
Ya. <@239851547935113216> are we going sub in TWW?
no way
surreal barn
lol
surreal barn
@grave basin @sick wasp
this was from a duel
rupture only got two ticks in but yeah
it goes higher if you amp up the agility from 2 more ruptures - over 100k for sure
sick wasp
<@1057468068864999444> <@363351758765948929>
thx,very interesting
gusty hedge
jolly sierra
oh boy look at the last one
surreal barn
hunter just got double purge lol
sharp sierra
Does sub kill window look good in the ww or no? Like its pretty hard to get a one shot setup now because how little we hit
surreal barn
gleaming pawn
get fucked Rogues, I guess
grave basin
<@1057468068864999444> <@363351758765948929>
Dayum
gleaming pawn
don't bring your praise for the art team into this! all doom all day until Deathstalker gets fixed 🙂
wintry dew
You're right but man
I wish the other teams matched the art team
in both energy and improvement
gleaming pawn
so true, even if they gave 50% of the art team's hustle the game would be so different in a good way
gleaming pawn
the Outlaws should be on injury watch, I worry about them
surreal barn
lol
potent pivot
https://tenor.com/view/oi-gif-20749371
basically Guy every patch/dev notes post since DF launch
outlaw has been through some wild ups n downs this past expansion
wintry dew
I swear I was reading the channel for a while and boy oh boy
Meanwhile in tww-ass:
So guys, let's talk about wedding rings
potent pivot
honestly the state of rogue has gotten really stale for me, which has led me to just play less
doom posting does nothing :d
potent pivot
ret really changed for the better in DF
wintry dew
True and real. If it wasn't for remix, I'd have shut down my subscription until pre tww
potent pivot
i just don't enjoy playing anything but rogue long term
potent pivot
True and real. If it wasn't for remix, I'd have shut down my subscription until ...
i haven't resubbed yet
wintry dew
Remix was cool for tmogs/mounts/etc
potent pivot
i'm planning on resubbing to snag as many mogs as i can from remix
don't care about mounts or anything
wintry dew
So for someone like me it worked great
sharp sierra
With the changes to rogues acrobatic being gone and shadow dance. Feels like rogue are gonba be weak in pvp in ww
wintry dew
Those are farmed passively
sharp sierra
Depressing
wintry dew
4200 threads on your cloak
gleaming pawn
i just don't enjoy playing anything but rogue long term
that's why i'll do my PvP on the Rogue and PvE on the ret. PvP I'll still be able to leverage skill and knowledge to make up the gap in most cases and I don't bother with pushing 2400+ anyway
potent pivot
With the changes to rogues acrobatic being gone and shadow dance. Feels like rog...
as long as we're tuned correctly it won't really matter
wintry dew
Ez stuff honestly
potent pivot
rogue has always been good in pvp even without acro
surreal barn
i kinda want those wing toys or w/e they are
Man, I found out last week that only you can see them no one else
gleaming pawn
Rogue has never needed acro in pvp, it only ever had it s3 and s4 lmao
potent pivot
Man, I found out last week that only you can see them no one else
oh that's kinda fuckin lame lmao
surreal barn
So lame
sharp sierra
Yea true. Lets hope at least 1 spec comes out the meh stages
wintry dew
Man, I found out last week that only you can see them no one else
It's good enough :C
surreal barn
oh that's kinda fuckin lame lmao
I’d get the blossom leaf thing though it even works in arena
potent pivot
idk what that is
wintry dew
That's... Jade forest completion toy
wintry dew
Every zone has a "big" reward
surreal barn
Cherry Blossom Trail
Just tried out mass rapid fire and holy shit
Are we fucked in blitz
wintry dew
idk what that is
If your plan is to purely get tmogs, reaching lvl 70 will award you enough bronze to probably buy most of the stuff you want
wintry dew
LOL
sharp sierra
You blessed it
wintry dew
So 83+1 runs
wintry dew
Holy Jesus I respect you for enduring that many runs
Most people I've talked to over in tmog took around 1 hour to get both
Either I'm really blessing people with the power of pink
sharp sierra
I wanted to have it to level as outlaw in expansion and look pretty doing it
Lol
How long is it taking beta folks to get from 70 to 80
gleaming pawn
leveling as Outlaw sounds miserable
sharp sierra
Lol
wintry dew
I'll actually be on vacation for at least until 01/09 so I can probably get to max level chilling
3/4 days should be enough
And no I don't have early access
wintry dew
Yeah, same
potent pivot
If your plan is to purely get tmogs, reaching lvl 70 will award you enough bronz...
word that's good to know. and i can buy the mogs for plate/mail/cloth on a leather class can't i
wintry dew
word that's good to know. and i can buy the mogs for plate/mail/cloth on a leath...
Yes
potent pivot
i don't want to level a 4th rogue 
sharp sierra
Lol
potent pivot
honestly not sure what class i'll level in remix
potent pivot
dk and pally are the only 2 melee i don't have fully leveled already
gleaming pawn
once you get the 100% exp base to the cloak, you can level a new alt in a day even just being a quester and hitting the raids as you unlock them. So getting bronze isn't that bad
it's mindnumbing, and I hate all of Pandaria now, but it's not as bad as it could have been
wintry dew
Each set costs 5k bronze, you gain 40k just by reaching 70, plus 30 or 40k more from daily activities while leveling/dungeons
potent pivot
there's really no true way of knowing until it's live
potent pivot
beta pvp theory crafting is almost never accurate
2 abilities get pvp tuning and a class can go from OP to trash in 1 dev post
sharp sierra
Mages got ton of changes
wintry dew
They are getting a class overall redesign
sharp sierra
Shhhhiiiiit
wintry dew
It's normal I'd say
gleaming pawn
yeah we wont know shit until the exp goes live, pvp tuning is so far off from done
they haven't even really done pve tuning
potent pivot
i pray rogue gets a true full rework before 12.0
gleaming pawn
Ret is going to be weaker in pvp though, because their two defensives have been moved to a choice node
so you either get Shield of Vengeance, or Divine Protection
not both
wintry dew
i pray rogue gets a true full rework before 12.0
Anything in specific you'd like to see?
restive pebble
anyone willing to help me with keybinds? trynna mimic ww binds based on similar abilities to assa rogue. for example: tiger palm = mutilate, legsweep = kidney, rsk = envenom
sharp sierra
I heard llyaden say word of glory heals less too
potent pivot
Anything in specific you'd like to see?
i'm just kinda bored of the "spam 1-1-2" and upkeep buffs
wintry dew
anyone willing to help me with keybinds? trynna mimic ww binds based on similar ...
That sounds right
gleaming pawn
I heard llyaden say word of glory heals less too
yes WoG healing is not worth casting as Ret right now. Its tuning is super terrible
wintry dew
I enjoyed playing ret during s1
Played ret pvp for like 2 weeks, reached my highest personal record
Almost 2.3
Meanwhile only reached 2.150 as a rogue
potent pivot
i feel like rogues core baseline flow hasn't changed in 10+ years, while other classes have changed drastically
don't think any amount of talent tree changes will change that
gleaming pawn
you're right, an nope there is nothing that could be done talents wise
jolly sierra
wasnt legion rework enough?
gleaming pawn
they'd have to remove Cheap Shot, then maybe they'd be willing to tune Rogue damage higher
but with CS, there's too much ability to control for top Rogues
potent pivot
wasnt legion rework enough?
i didn't play in Legion so i'm not super familiar with what changes were made then, but i don't think so
vocal surge
Yall talking about TWW rogue?
vocal surge
Atm nm
Been busy all day and just had time to glance here
I suggested some talents on the forum but there doesn't seen to be feedback for em
potent pivot
sub rog was completely washed i recall
from what i can remember sub was kinda cool back then, but i'm more talking about how all 3 specs revolve around mutilate(fok)->envenom type spam
gleaming pawn
Rogue is the OG builder > spender architype
potent pivot
Rogue is the OG builder > spender architype
yeah i guess i've just gotten really bored of that idk
gleaming pawn
that's fair, I've been branching out more and more this expansion because of it
potent pivot
i feel like if the specs had a bit more basics differentiating them from one another that'd be sick
jolly sierra
i felt reworks were like shit tbh
halcyon timber
Really don’t want to legion 2.0. There were a good bit of changes In tww and customization in how a rogue chooses should matter via talents
jolly sierra
cuz it restricted a lot just for a class fantasy
fucking the spec itself doing that
halcyon timber
The angle by creating dynamic abilities such as evolving dispatch / eviscerate into cdg is cool while not stripping us or “all in this only” crap that legion did
potent pivot
cuz it restricted a lot just for a class fantasy
like when they got rid of the original talent trees where you could kinda dual spec?
gleaming pawn
Rogue feels nonexistent
by representation or by abilty to do anything to your opponent
vocal surge
Normally we're good at CC but in TWW, CC gets off people faster than SL
halcyon timber
Yeah we will see in tuning, them focusing on team fighting may allow us to be tuned well instead .
A lot of shit breaks cc agreed
On purpose
Even our shit does
jolly sierra
like when they got rid of the original talent trees where you could kinda dual s...
like when they took gouge away for like 2 expansions
cuz outlaw was the dirty brawler since legion
halcyon timber
Pruning was dumb af
jolly sierra
shadowblades being restricted to sub only
potent pivot
Pruning was dumb af
ngl i think pruning is a necessary evil for MMOs like wow
potent pivot
like when they took gouge away for like 2 expansions
i don't mind things like this, but now the game's CC is way too homogenized so it kinda had to come back
i very much prefer classes only having a couple specific CC types
jolly sierra
i don't mind things like this, but now the game's CC is way too homogenized so i...
the problem is when you remove efficiency for aesthetic reasons
gleaming pawn
the funny thing is, the PvE side where all the stops and defensives got introduced in the first place all hate the amount of stops and defensives in the game now and want them pruned
so at least they are kinda on the same page as PvP on something
potent pivot
the problem is when you remove efficiency for aesthetic reasons
losing gouge didn't make much of a difference for us though honestly
halcyon timber
They created it by being the wailing caverns
vocal surge
Don't forget there's a lot of classes with passive CC duration reduction
halcyon timber
Dunno idc about best, i care about rogue kind as a whole
Shouldn’t be reduced to stun bot
potent pivot
agree
halcyon timber
Because some nerd trinkets gouge in 2024
gleaming pawn
it's still amazing people trinket the opening sap in 2024, but here we are
halcyon timber
And people don’t los or peel
Somehow our fault
They also reduced cc in tww by lots of choice nodes as well across a lot of classes
Most of our stuff breaks on people passively being dumb so they have zero to gripe about
jolly sierra
Because some nerd trinkets gouge in 2024
i recalled a ret with 2k3 rating trinketing a gouge
stoic spruce
Classic rogue takes
jolly sierra
and then eating a kidney to waste his bubble
halcyon timber
Makes sense
potent pivot
Classic rogue takes
stoic spruce
Be the cc bot like a good rogue
potent pivot
nou
jolly sierra
cc bot as usual
potent pivot
being a cc bot was fun when we could do nice set ups
like rmp cc the entire team and land a kill with dance and combust
etc
surreal barn
Every hunter is about to have both scatter and binding
halcyon timber
Good for them. They can quit hijacking posts like an angry mom out front of wholefoods talking about the carrot cake gave her diabetes when she decided to eat the whole thing in one sitting
Hunter does look good though, glad the devs could carve out time in their busy cycle they are prob doing
halcyon timber
Hunters need to solve a children’s shape game with hunter themed blocks before logging in
Evoker tokyo drift breathing on them and taking 75% increased damage from disentegrate for being singled out while the hunter los’s their healer is imminent
plucky escarp
Hunter tree does look sick. You get everything. Binding, scatter, pet stun and knock trap
Plus two charges of wall.
And then there is some mastery change for SV that I don’t really understand but it sounds like it makes you tanky
Would be pog
surreal barn
And for melee cleave you can literally aoe stun every dr
plucky escarp
Everything is coming up milhouse
surreal barn
I tried some deathstalker
stoic spruce
nerf rogue
Nerf sub*
surreal barn
I think it can still kill one in a stun 😂
blissful osprey
is forgestorm mythic any good for outlaw pvp. doing like 2-3% of damage breakdown in a match at the moment but missing so many stats. +650 agilty
gleaming pawn
raid testing, but still good info for those curious about tww Sin
#tww-assassination message
potent pivot
is forgestorm mythic any good for outlaw pvp. doing like 2-3% of damage breakdow...
nah not worth
stoic spruce
Nerf popo repeatedly
Nerf my peeeeeeeeen
halcyon timber
LOL
vocal surge
Nerf my peeeeeeeeen
-5in
stoic spruce
You hear that little buddy? You grew!
sharp sierra
haven't played sub in a long time but holy shit is it bad in pvp lol
sleek bluff
I'm assassination in pvp, but I feel like I don't do good pressure
Is there a rotation for kills?
I'm doing thistle shadow dance death mark kings bane shiv shiv
And it doesn't do shit
sleek bluff
Shiv > bane > shiv?
halcyon timber
XD
waxen meteor
Let me do a real question guys
gleaming pawn
you shiv before kingsbane, and then again when kingsbane has less than 8 seconds left so you amp the initial hit and the ramped ticks at the end
waxen meteor
I'm doing thistle shadow dance death mark kings bane shiv shiv
Do you use kidney 
jolly sierra
are you sure u need to use both shivs in 1 run?
we care the most for the initial hit
does this even matter now? lol
gleaming pawn
The initial hit is heavily nerfed, the final ticks were unnerfed recently, and the final ticks is where most of the damage comes from if you ramp it correctly
Also 8 seconds of bleed randomly is not as much as using it with the final ticks of kingsbane and they line up perfectly
jolly sierra
are you sure u dont wanna save the other shiv to run away or mess their movement?
usually we do that with warriors and stuff like that cuz is undispellable
gleaming pawn
I find stepping friendlies to get away a better method of running than shiv and stepping. Over committing CDs that heavily impact your damage
And if you’re going for max KB damage, you should use Tea with less than 6 seconds remaining. Also to amp those final ticks
jolly sierra
have you tried in some time stuff like messing a healer with cc, smoke bomb and then shiv?
guy will lose a lot of time reaching his team
gleaming pawn
I find throwing knife crippling poison is enough of a slow
Not discounting the success you’ve found using it your way, you’re just leaving a lot of KB damage on the table not using both shivs
jolly sierra
its fine
we can question each other and still respect anyways
we are adults anyways XD
gleaming pawn
Exactly! And PvP is all about reading the situation and capitalizing with whatever is going to get the win in that moment. Be it kiting or slowing someone, or more KB damage
potent pivot
haven't played sub in a long time but holy shit is it bad in pvp lol
sub is fine tbh
surreal barn
are you sure u dont wanna save the other shiv to run away or mess their movement...
I keep shivs for when I have empowered garrotes tbh
surreal barn
@dapper chasm currently modding your vanish icon into my player icon
dapper chasm
<@506443451320107009> currently modding your vanish icon into my player icon
That touches me in ways I don't mind
Just keep in mind it has layers that you probably don't need just so it moves out of the way of target-of-target
That can be resolved by deleting one layer and removing "hide on ToT" on the other
surreal barn
Yeah
dapper chasm
Ahuh, and I'm sure you think "David" would look better with a nice scarf
I am an arteest
dapper chasm
It's a statue, you fucking philistine
surreal barn
That the one that sits on the terlet
dapper chasm
No, it's the one with the perfectly normal sized penis
Look at it, just resting on his balls like it should
surreal barn
An artist would make it a little larger
surreal barn
Sounds like your penis is the only one you have ever seen
dapper chasm
And the Greeks thought large penises were obscene and a sign of low intellegence
dapper chasm
Sounds like your penis is the only one you have ever seen
I've seen plenty of cock, thank you
It's actually how I know I am straight
If you heard "I don't like broccoli" from two people, and one had never tried it - which opinion would you consider more valid?
But I knew it wasn't for me the second I tried - I turned around, said thank you, but it's not for me. I even shook all 12 of their hands
wintry dew
But I knew it wasn't for me the second I tried - I turned around, said thank you...
I don't know if I should be concerned or not
dapper chasm
Well, 3 of them were just there to man the cameras. I'm not a sicko
sick wasp
haven't played sub in a long time but holy shit is it bad in pvp lol
sub very good,it gets rly complicated though
surreal barn
it’ll still be good
idle root
does honor reset between expansions? i dont remember
drifting flint
Picked a bad week to learn rogue. Doing skirms against people riding out on elite mounts as I'm full honor gear staring at my bars
surreal barn
Skirms are kinda just like that
jolly sierra
weird, my ones were easy af and capped shortly after weekly reset
surreal barn
Maybe you’re just pro
stoic spruce
gleaming pawn
Alright Popo, why do you have an Assa ability in your name when you’re a diehard Outlaw gamer. This is false advertising
stoic spruce
I'll see you in the arena
waxen meteor
does honor reset between expansions? i dont remember
I think normally yeah
drifting flint
for assass. more important to get weapons first? or 4 set
steel scarab
The 4 set is very nerfed and bad in arena
Only 2 set is worn
Even the 2 set isn't particularly great TBH, but it's worth wearing
drifting flint
weapons it is then
steel scarab
Just mainhand I'd say
steel scarab
Is feral generally considered a poor matchup for assassination
Because it sure seems like it
jolly sierra
<@239851547935113216> seeeeeeeeexo
SEXOOOOOOOOOOO
maybe
hol up
DO WE HAVE TWW PTR?
surreal barn
Nah just beta
jolly sierra
F
stoic spruce
You're getting the butt dagger
surreal barn
The Zeiss slice
jolly sierra
interesting
steel scarab
Vs them, I meant @surreal barn
Fun SS story! I had a full melee lobby, 2 fury warriors, 1 DK. I start off strong, 3-0. Then had 2 close games and got crushed 1 game, went 0-3. Felt bad. 10 minutes into the next queue, I realized that whole match I was wearing PvE gear. ilev 511
TLDR, I am terribly bad at this game
sick wasp
now thats a babe
fast imp
Fun SS story! I had a full melee lobby, 2 fury warriors, 1 DK. I start off stron...
https://tenor.com/view/jail-right-to-jail-right-away-parks-and-recreation-parks-and-rec-gif-16177531
wintry dew
now thats a babe
tawdry lodge
fat bound
wintry dew
You know it
surreal barn
Fatestalker and Deathbound
wintry dew
Fatestalker and Deathbound
Actually sounds cool
pastel burrow
yeah i actually fuck with Fatestalker, that's sick
karmic summit
finally as sub bois
twin burrow
no offence but its cap thinking your good if your not at least top 23 on sub solo ladder, but grats i guess
|| good shit brother||
steel scarab
@karmic summit excellent work
karmic summit
thanks bois
karmic summit
no offence but its cap thinking your good if your not at least top 23 on sub sol...
shit must get better
twin burrow
there is a secret ladder only the most inner connected players know of. me? I would know personally, as i peaked top negative 15 last season at -11. thats why i laugh at anyone who thinks being ranked a positive number should be allowed to vote or even not be deported
wintry dew
finally as sub bois
Huge work my dood, good fucking job
potent pivot
finally as sub bois
gzgz
karmic summit
i lost a lot of hair due to warriors murdering stun drs
surreal barn
i lost a lot of hair due to warriors murdering stun drs
There’s a Reddit sub where bald men try to make each other feel better about being bald
if you need any support
karmic summit
i am not bald tho
surreal barn
not yet
karmic summit
i have funneled my anger into good things
karmic summit
just logged in
frank dust
Heyo first time playing pvp rogue assa is there a good pvp guide for some basic stuff like rota, poisons etc. ?
wintry dew
Guides not really, i can point you in the right direction if you understand rogues tho
plucky escarp
Doesn’t shadenox have a guide on icy veins for assa? It seems up to date to me https://www.icy-veins.com/wow/assassination-rogue-pvp-guide
Although I thought you were supposed to like, imp garrote, rupture, garrote in a caster opener.
wintry dew
Instead of a guide, i'd rather just literally watch shadenox on youtube
potent pivot
Although I thought you were supposed to like, imp garrote, rupture, garrote in a...
text guides for pvp are usually not the best thing to look at
somewhat helpful if brand new to pvp, but vids are typically the best form to get info, though they also get outdated somewhat quickly as well
he does include a double garrote opener in his guide tho
plucky escarp
Oh nice! My bad
Why garrote > Mutilate > kidney > Shiv instead of like, garrote > shiv > kidney. I think with the second imp garrote and a shiv you’re at 5 combo points.
potent pivot
Why garrote > Mutilate > kidney > Shiv instead of like, garrote > shiv > kidney....
one reason could be that shiv has to crit to give you 2 cp
also something to note: you'll use fan of knives a lot instead of mutilate in 3v3/shuffle
if you won't break CC and you can hit 2+ targets, it's general recommended using FoK instead of mut
most people are running a FoK build etc
not sure if that's mentioned in the guide or not
plucky escarp
Makes sense bro ty
safe pelican
finally as sub bois
Touch grass 😒
stoic spruce
I approve of this sub hate
stoic spruce
Touch grass 😒
(This post was approved by real Sub haters)
waxen siren
anyone got any builds for beta yet?
potent pivot
anyone got any builds for beta yet?
nop
just mess around and test different things - that's what betas are for
sick wasp
finally as sub bois
huge gz,thats the way
karmic summit
thanks man appriciate it
twin burrow
U top 23 yet or u a outlaw main in drag?
frank dust
Guides not really, i can point you in the right direction if you understand rogu...
I understand rogues but was just a pve player 😄
Thanks to you all for the infos i will check out shadenox then 🙂
karmic summit
U top 23 yet or u a outlaw main in drag?
I am at the life place rn ill pusher harder when i am home
twin burrow
mods? ^
jolly sierra
???
twin burrow
just a follow up from a joke yesterday, i apologize for the confusion
potent pivot
just a follow up from a joke yesterday, i apologize for the confusion
ok because i was like, if anything, you're the one being rude to them lmao.. but i left it alone thinking you were just kidding
twin burrow
ty
idle root
bro when you play the first 3 rounds with the same healer and you lose all 3 rounds and then after the first round you're against them and you win, they leave
like, bruh
let me get my 3-3 
jolly sierra
its still crappy tho
outer sky
if I macro badge to kingsbane will kingsbane be effected by badge?
potent pivot
if I macro badge to kingsbane will kingsbane be effected by badge?
badge's effect is dynamic, so once it's activate it affects everything across the board once activated
if you want to make sure the very first dmg of said spell is affected by badge, just make sure it goes off first - won't be a big deal though either way
potent pivot
its still crappy tho
you know it's bugged right?
jolly sierra
you know it's bugged right?
i talk about ambush requirement
jolly sierra
dude just add "Ambush from Blindside" too and u will fix a lot
potent pivot
dude just add "Ambush from Blindside" too and u will fix a lot
well you're already going to cycle into more marks with full cp envenoms
so i'm not sure it's really necessary to add blindside
jolly sierra
the problem is u must start w an ambush and use a vanish or running to restealth to try again
in pve is worse tho, they are forced to vanish
potent pivot
vanishing isn't an issue in pve
it's always been used for similar purposes like an extra shadowstrike on sub etc, unless you need to save it for a specific mechanic
potent pivot
so you ambush into 2 stacks -> use 2 5+ cp finishers -> full cp envenom into 2 stacks -> use 2 5+ cp finishers -> full cp envenom
and it cycles like so
jolly sierra
what if u switch the target?
potent pivot
you'll just have to choose which target you want marked at the beginning of the match
potent pivot
i'm sure you'll get restealths etc and then swap if you want, but it's pretty rigid on that front
wintry dew
xD
potent pivot
it's really not that bad imo
all these trees are is a little extra passive dmg
running the fatebound tree almost looks worse in regards to it's capstone
flip the same side of the coin 7x for +1% to all stats
tf is that
ew
i like the cold blood talent on fatebound
gleaming pawn
The capstone is boring and uneventful for Fatebound. It increases your stats by so little it might as well not exist
potent pivot
i feel like in pvp we'll opt for the tree with better utility honestly
jolly sierra
gleaming pawn
But which will be best for Assa is going to be hard. Right now Fatebound pumps single target. Deathstalker is so broken we don’t know how it will shake out for damage but having to get restealths to get more marks will suck
potent pivot
gleaming pawn
Either way these trees are more encouraging of a single target playstyle vs the multi dot rot we have currently, imo
potent pivot
i don't think they'll change our playstyle drastically tbh
if envenom dmg is still crap with the added benefits of deathstalker
gleaming pawn
From anyone curious, It’s from the pve side doing raid testing, but here’s whispyr discussing the latest assa stuff from yesterday https://youtu.be/OxUYCiPfBOg?feature=shared
potent pivot
if you mean on beta - tuning is going to be ongoing even after launch
wouldn't be too worried about it atm is all i'm saying
steel scarab
Folks, what's the easiest way to get a spark?
karmic summit
utility wise deathstalker seem the best tbh the better cloak+evasion and big cdr in shadowstep (atleast for sub) will feel like tping around
surreal barn
All that really matters is kill potential, will just have to see how much damage sub does in a stun after balancing + stun resist gem
But yeah sub definitely feels like the play
gleaming pawn
Which is why it’ll get gutted again before the end of week 1 🙂
golden island
does assas use 4set?
steel scarab
No
outer sky
how do you play smokebomb cleave? Ive heard its really good but it doesnt seem like it would be
outer sky
assa/UDK
karmic summit
how do you play smokebomb cleave? Ive heard its really good but it doesnt seem l...
Usually they have a rsham aswell dk pulls all in sham puts down a static field assa and dk do aoe
karmic summit
into caster cleaves how d you multi dot?
Just los and play like sub i would say
twin burrow
flip the same side of the coin 7x for +1% to all stats
I felt the same but 1% all stats should give at least 3 percent overall
Dmg
sick wasp
2 hours shuffle played as hpally
can see how hpally struggles against priest and rdroods
still rival 2 ezclap
i think that there are so little few healers in the game right now
that the game pushes u someway inot higher tier ques
everytime
im negative ratio and still queing into 1.8k+ teams
also
hpallies dont use even their 2p set bonus
low wadi
Hi, when we use feint as assa if speced in cheat death or maybe there are guides where defensive mentioned
karmic summit
Only one i know is bladestorm against warriors they do a lot of aoe damage
Not sure but maybe ret pal does some aoe aswell
sick wasp
Hi, when we use feint as assa if speced in cheat death or maybe there are guides...
anywhere u can mitigate incoming aoe dmg
grave basin
Did they just tune deathstalker numbers
Instead of actually fixing the core mechanic being bricked
stoic spruce
How is it bricked
sick wasp
ye talking of nonsense nodes 😅
until now rogue is in general undertuned
all 3 specs
and fatebound and trickster function
partially
deathstalker still makes no sense
wanton breach
deathstalker still makes no sense
it's just a placeholder talent tree so we would shut up about not having a third hero talent
surely it will get replaced by a real hero talent tree
sick wasp
<:copium:854628182104080414>
balance druid goebbelism
😅
still cant believe the overview dratnos had on rogue
''100% more dmg in vendetta''
almost chocked on water on that
wintry dew
He's good @ reading
wanton breach
still cant believe the overview dratnos had on rogue
if you go to dratnos for his opinions about rogue there is something wrong
wanton breach
new hero talent
sick wasp
a cringer
wintry dew
Tf is a dratnos
a guy
sick wasp
definitely a cringer
jolly sierra
OOF
cedar skiff
god king garen is one of the best lore charactors ever made in existence
how they played with his charactor and cranked it up x10
its brilliant
dratonos sounds like a gay dragon
we are not the same
and vaeira sounds like some weird cosplay name
or a random NPC generated name
surreal barn
Vaeira Aurelius Maximus
wintry dew
The Third
jolly sierra
god this chat XD
steel scarab
Found a book that may help me on my quest for 2400
surreal barn
I’m kind of disappointed
I thought you looked more like Kevin James
My mind is now twisted
wintry dew
Found a book that may help me on my quest for 2400
You know whats up for sure LOL
dapper chasm
Found a book that may help me on my quest for 2400
Your shirt has lose threads on the ends
Oh, my bad - those are your arms
sick wasp
there are some locks u find in shuffle
total garbage
they just stand there while u go oom doing 200k hps as a paladin
run out of bops/sacs and they die without even moving
and there are some locks,which mount on a rank 1 dragon and ask for conc aura and blessing of summer
😍
we like the later
jolly sierra
seems like i will need to permachose coins from vault to catchup w crafted stuff
else will be stuck for timegating xd
sick wasp
im 524 with crafted ring,legs,neck and feet on my paladin with like,a day played
healers are like chicks
u got good boobs u get free stuff lul
jking ofc
glass bear
im 524 with crafted ring,legs,neck and feet on my paladin with like,a day played
Your pala has pretty privilege
sick wasp
Your pala has pretty privilege
idk man,ive only qued for a day
less than a day
150 games
grave basin
150 games in none day
one
that's almost how much i have on my rogue the whole season
😂
wintry dew
that's almost how much i have on my rogue the whole season
i guess he means in 24h game time
grave basin
as a healer that's not too crazy
twin burrow
hey just to make sure, besides the pvp crest what do i need to add to the mastery awakend crafted helm?
twin burrow
got it ty
sick wasp
😂
healer ques are instant
the moment u press shuffle it pops
but if u wanna find the actual total ques its 150 divided by 6
now my mmr is about 2.1
think if i try playing hpally till TWW im gonna get elite
halcyon timber
Nope but that is a cool idea though
Doing anything meaningful to you is always cool.
sick wasp
Or am I the ultimate nerd
probably unique even among ultimate nerds
neat dove
hey for sub:
When facing a DK, should you talent out of Dark Brew? (turn poisons/bleeds into shadow damage)
AMS dispells rupture and you cant reapply it while its active, missing out on a lot of damage
maybe take "The Rotten" instead?
sick wasp
dm+db
also cb
if u dont like the passive macabre stacks u can always stay goremaw
i dont like it personally
thing is,talents vary its shuffle
test ur stuff and see what makes u feel more comfortable or plays out better
just dont take tea,its cringe
neat dove
why would i not take tea?
sick wasp
u dont like the extra dmg and cold blood?
neat dove
tea gives mastery
sick wasp
so u like to press tea and rng the crit
neat dove
this is what I usually run but my question was about taking out dark brew when facing DK due to AMS
sick wasp
rather than have consistency in critting
w/o acro
and lethality
to take energy regen and leech
and tea
idk how that makes sense for u
but to each his own
also the point on wound poison is so 2 seasons ago
neat dove
if youre not commenting on dark brew vs DK than Id rather not you comment at all
sick wasp
ok
potent pivot
surreal barn
Trickster slaps
potent pivot
this is what I usually run but my question was about taking out dark brew when f...
i don't think it's worth swapping off dark brew because of ams personally. another thing i'll say: if you're coming here for help, don't be rude. if someone says something trying to be helpful that doesn't answer your exact question, there's nicer ways to go about answering them back
surreal barn
feels nice right? 😉
Yeah feels good. @potent pivot should make a rogue called Notrickster
wintry dew
LOL
sick wasp
surreal barn
The smokescreen is cool af
potent pivot
neat dove
i don't think it's worth swapping off dark brew because of ams personally. anoth...
I feel like I've been very respectful with my comment
potent pivot
maybe it was just the way it reads as text
neat dove
i suppose I could have thrown in a "please"
sick wasp
I feel like I've been very respectful with my comment
to go one step ahead of you im sorry if u think i mocked u,it was an honest reaction that wasnt meant for mocking,just doesnt make much sense coz its less dmg in arena in most cases
sick wasp
maybe it was just the way it reads as text
its fine my man,dont bother,no offense taken
neat dove
im only in DF for like 6weeks now, I took the talents from guides, then top players (who still sometimes play sub and not assass) and then adjusted a few talents to work out better for my rank
but basically all guides and top players have tea
sick wasp
like if u open the ladder now highly doubt u will find one in top 10
ild actually be surprised
potent pivot
sometimes guides are out of date
neat dove
my "personal" touch was for example picking replicating shadows instead of first dance, elusiveness instead of cheat death and nimble fingers instead of superior mixture
sick wasp
hold on gonna sniff data out
potent pivot
either way there's no 1 size fits all build
neat dove
and I can tell what is their PVP and what is their PVE loadout by the talent choice, cuz aint noone running flagellation and shadowcraft in pvp
surreal barn
I have seen flag taken
potent pivot
so if you're happy with it, it's all good
surreal barn
Outside of pve
People swap talents every other shuffle match depending on who you vs
neat dove
sure, but if you look at palumors sub loadouts for example, one is almost exactly like the icy-veins pvp guide, and two are basically the icy veins sub pve talent trees
surreal barn
Pretty sure palumor hasnt queued since week 1
neat dove
perchance
maybe i should switch to assass as well but i feel more comfortable with sub
more control
and its fine in the 1700-1800 range
surreal barn
No I can’t
I never thought I’d be playing Hunter for more than a week but here I am
potent pivot
maybe i should switch to assass as well but i feel more comfortable with sub
you can reach any goalpost playing sub imo
surreal barn
I’d say go sub and git gud bc in TWW it is looking better than assa
sick wasp
and its fine in the 1700-1800 range
sub is very unforgiving but in that range u shouldnt rly worry about talents all that much
ild play wahtsever feels more comfortable and if i wanted to climb ild pick a spec that gives me space to check and control the flow of the game better
neat dove
i did switch to assass for a few games but ive barely played it since I came back and I felt much squishier than with sub
I used to play both 50/50 basically
sick wasp
if u play sub in 1.8 u can play sin in 2-2.2
trust me
sin just zones in bleeds everything out,kidney's something
vanish blind and repeat
neat dove
but only 1 vanish 😩
sick wasp
win/lose go next
neat dove
and i dont wanna play nightelf
surreal barn
if u play sub in 1.8 u can play sin in 2-2.2
Idk man the healer diff between 1800 and 2.2 is massive rn
sick wasp
Idk man the healer diff between 1800 and 2.2 is massive rn
also very true
sick wasp
but sin being that oppressive with poison n stuff creates more effective dmg
surreal barn
True but it’s kinda like pve healing to an extent
sick wasp
thats why the more u climb the better healers u face the less heal you force them do
yup true
neat dove
finally got above 1800
and i forgot to switch gear, luckily i always have pvp trinkets in my inv for warmode
ok technically not "above" 1800 😄
exotic dove
Been playing a bunch of beta and what not. I was playing a bunch of different things and one of the biggest things I have noticed probably with the changes is how tanky Hunters got. Seems like Blizzard just gave up on the whole kiting thing with Hunters and just said here you go have 2 wall charges lasting 8 seconds increased self healing etc
My Hunters like it my Rogues however on beta not so much at least for right now lol
Of course all this is subject to change but the defensive stuff wont
surreal barn
Been playing a bunch of beta and what not. I was playing a bunch of different th...
Sentinel gets a heal based on damage done now as well
They have access to both scatter and binding simultaneously
exotic dove
Pack leader for BM and surv every time you press wall or turtle you heal 20% of max health and you have 2 wall charges on a 1 min cd
or 1.5 min cd
surreal barn
It’s for MM too
exotic dove
Sentinel has Damage reduction shield proc
Pack leader is for BM and Surv while Sentinel is for MM and Surv
MM doesnt get that self heal cause its in pack leader
also surv new mastery is basically another vers
but only up to 6% dr
surreal barn
The skill that uses exhil when wall is pressed and vice versa
exotic dove
thats in dark ranger
surreal barn
Ah yes dark ranger
Which honestly slaps as well
The binding shackles are pretty fun to play around it seemed to stack with tar trap
But I mean, you still can’t press the walls in a stun and you can pump hard if you save the trickster cloud for when they are 50% health
exotic dove
yeah all they can do is roar of sac themselves but it does prevent crits
neat dove
bruh i wanna make a trinket-vanish macro but i cant find the trinket icon 😭
they should make subriders for items and abilities, like class or npc abilities, and wearable items and which slot
guess ill use the old trinket icon
hmmm can you make a macro similar to focus shadowstep kick for vanish?
focus shadowstep kick I have to press twice for the kick, can i make it so when I press the trinket-vanish macro once, it only uses trinket, but twice its trinket vanish? eh guess its susceptible to still getting ccd
potent pivot
hmmm can you make a macro similar to focus shadowstep kick for vanish?
focus sh...
I think for something like that you’d have to set up a sequence macro, which can be kinda janky
neat dove
i just gotta buy an MMO mouse so i can have all 3 on a button, trinket, vanish, trinket+vanish
surreal barn
Nah man don’t combine that
neat dove
why not, i sometimes get ccd right after i use trinket before i use vanish
surreal barn
Then you’re not pressing the binds fast enough I’m not sure what to say
I believe macroing trinket vanish is a bad habit
What are your binds for trinket and vanish?
neat dove
as I said id still keep regular trinket and regular vanish, but sometimes I wished I had them simultanously, I think Pika uses it as well
my mouse has 2 extra buttons on the side, one of them is my trinket (the other kidney). I click vanish 😅
technically its on 7 but thats not really reachable
potent pivot
my mouse has 2 extra buttons on the side, one of them is my trinket (the other k...
i would highly advise redoing your keybinds so you aren't clicking any abilities
do it in steps to get used to it if you have to, but definitely do it it's such a game changer
neat dove
im too old
ive added several since I came back but im at my limit, on my left hand at least
I've used my focus step kick macro 0 times since Ive assigned it to shift2
hence why i wanna buy an mmo mouse, i think i still have capacity on my right hand, a lot of stuff im still clicking which i definitely shouldnt
vanish, evasion, dismantle, gouge, shadowblades, symbols of death
smoke bomb, shadowy duel
stoic spruce
Only thing i click is stealth
gleaming pawn
heathen
surreal barn
Don’t 👏 click 👏 vanish 👏
stoic spruce
I SAID STEALTH NOT VANISH
neat dove
also i swear you used to be able to click stealth with shadowdance active, when was that changed?
gleaming pawn
you've never been able to stealth while dancing
neat dove
damn
steel scarab
If I can just like
Magically win my next 2 SS
My suffering ends
Pray for me brothers
valid lagoon
🫡
snow wyvern
Anyone have apply Deadly and Wound poison macro?
untold remnant
Magically win my next 2 SS
Race change to night elf and you will have 300 extra rating
clever elk
Anyone got a WA/Addon for Sending conq boxes? This extra window anoys me
sick wasp
ok technically not "above" 1800 😄
played with that DK yday iirc,bro doesnt know what trinket means
gz btw
keep climbing
sick wasp
Pray for me brothers
go full basic,it always works,sap the healer open hard on dps,bomb early,blind the healer,swap and murder if he presses trinket
high gulch
Anyone have apply Deadly and Wound poison macro?
I use a WA to apply poisons. It let's me know when they aren't on or only have 5 min left and are clickable.
karmic summit
whats is the best way to learn pvp? Spamming solo shuffles/arenas?
Just be in a arena what ever it its
outer sky
So is trickster the likely pick for arena in tww?
wanton breach
too early to tell tbh
tough spruce
Whats the deal with fire mages damage? Fought some in 3s (including a rank 1) and they were just outdpsing my aff lock. Any ideas how to counter their dam? It was mostly ignite and living bomb
tough spruce
Twice it was at dalaran sewers so it was kinda hard
Is it worth dispelling living bomb?
surreal barn
good question, I think they can just easily reapply
tough spruce
Maybe @chrome schooner can help. Saw you play fire rmp, any tips on how to deal with the mage?
neat dove
whats is the best way to learn pvp? Spamming solo shuffles/arenas?
any form of practice, also duels in front of capitals. And ask for feedback, what you could have done differently
steel scarab
@sick wasp swap to the healer if the healer trinkets? The only healer I've been swapping to is Holy Paladin since they seem squishier than the other healers
gusty hedge
whats is the best way to learn pvp? Spamming solo shuffles/arenas?
duels, vs people who know a lil something/ duels in general. Bgs /arena /wpvp.
all diff pvp play styles. arena different pvp than duels/wpvp/bg.
but in short, learn your class and gcds, keep practicing. training dummy helps imo. you can try different openers/burst/ rotations and track progress to see what works for you
wanton breach
and once you know a bit about what you can do, learning what others can do is also very important (team mates and enemies)
neat dove
yeah thats something i gotta do as well, last really played in legion, theres a lot of new stuff im not that familiar with yet, and the buff/debuff bars arent really helpful anymore with all the bloat. a healer casts 1 spell and has 5 different buffs, a DH throws 1 glaive and you have 5 different debuffs
untold remnant
whats is the best way to learn pvp? Spamming solo shuffles/arenas?
I feel like 3s is a whole different game mode then solo shuffle. And if you do well in shuffle you get false confidence that you are good at the game then get your ass handed to you in 3s at around 2k mmr 😄
surreal barn
yeah, 3s is a lot more anticipatory and shuffle more retrospective
Both different skills
Like no comms, how are you gonna react after being Roar of sacrificed, BoP’d, and evasioning at the same exact time
shell pollen
What is going on with stealth in BGs?
vocal surge
You can do it
nova viper
yeah, 3s is a lot more anticipatory and shuffle more retrospective
I dont have friends
i must play solo
surreal barn
one of us
nova viper
wow pvp community is super nofriendly and when u dont have old titles, history of rating etc noone wanna play with u 2s or 3s
Soo... imo solo shuffle system is future of wow pvp - like solo RBG que from TWW
plucky escarp
The future of all PvP games is solo Qs
Unfortunately
People either don’t want to make friends to play games or coordinate their schedules or don’t have the flexibility or time to do it.
sick wasp
<@363351758765948929> swap to the healer if the healer trinkets? The only healer...
every healer,dont think about it
everything can die,it doesnt matter how tanky it looks
sick wasp
Are you gaslighting me so I lose even more rating?
usually i gaslight DHs and Rets and punish them
idk when i was near that range and i was going like an elevator eveyrday
i just locked my brain to just act and dont think
go full mechanically and do basic stuff
worked out
steel scarab
There are a lot of times I overthink
jolly sierra
steel scarab
Sometimes I'll lock a healer into a huge cc chain (5s kidney, gouge, Blind) when his trinket is down and I'm just standing there staring at him while I keep him cced
And I look over and my teammate is zugzuging the 90% destro instead of the 25% DK
And I'm just like
You know
I should probably just be dpsing
jolly sierra
ppl is stupid just follow them else will be fucked
that is the reason im using an addon to track their current targets
steel scarab
True
sick wasp
Sometimes I'll lock a healer into a huge cc chain (5s kidney, gouge, Blind) when...
that was never an issue for me since ive practiced sub alot in the past
and the ''swap to healer once he trinkets'' its as old as wrath and tbc
still works like a charm
steel scarab
Even though they have more defensives than ever and more HP than everyone else?