pvp

[gleaming pawn]

So don’t

[frank oxide]

See u guys in 11.0!

[inner tartan]

blah outlaw in pvp is fun

[gleaming pawn]

Sin is still good, and easier to play than Outlaw. Sub getting some moderate nerfs isn’t the end of the world either. It will still do a lot of damage and have all of its CC

[quaint cedar]

I wonder how the upcoming primary stat nerf will affect outlaw

Already feels like I can't kill shit unless the healer is oom

At least in 2s anyways

Guess it doesn't matter if it affects everyone

[inner tartan]

sub still boom

[gleaming pawn]

Exactly

[last jasper]

Wall of nothing. Wrf is that, a teaser? 😂

[stoic spruce]

I guess more tuning is coming

cant wait for all my specs to be gutted kwim

[gleaming pawn]

Yeah super vague and cryptic but in theory they are going to inject some mmr into the system and adjust inflation rates

[last jasper]

50 mmr like the last time?)

[halcyon timber]

Primary stat was a big hit to everyone

tHe gAimE iS tOo fAsT , cLAsSiC fRosTbOlT sPam aNd aUtoatTaczk dmG fOr 40% oF uR lIfE wAs bEtTeR tHouGh

Its good they touched the tier set instead of making silly tuning for zero reason though. Seems as though they are actively reading instead of goofy ass bfa tuning.

[jolly sierra]

the nerf was equal

tbh i dont care

[last jasper]

Yea, from 25% to 12 in 1 season

[jolly sierra]

i would be worried if the nerf just affected a couple or classes or so

[halcyon timber]

Yeah it slows shit down and becomes dampening matches

[last jasper]

Which is dog shit

[halcyon timber]

Some grandpa on N64 should be ok to press start

Yeah the base buffs to other classes is weird too

[gleaming pawn]

yep, I would not agree that they are reading fuck all

because if they were, they would nerf the outying claases instea of leaving them alone and just slowing the game down

[halcyon timber]

They definitely read the rogue hate

And all the “game is too fast” spam by the evokers

They want it to be like pve fighting a raid boss where it takes 4 people to kill 1 guy instead

[stoic spruce]

the arena animations for awc lol

autoattack galore

[last jasper]

Ppl hate rogues every season. There is no need to even read

[halcyon timber]

Yeah even though their classes don’t require a thing remotely to what we have to do to win

“Just hold W boys” “its like playing tekken, just spam low kick!”

[exotic dove]

Looks like the devs think we are fine in PVP but op in pve

well for Assa

Evis for sub took a 7.5% dam reduc

So my sub spec took a hit

[worthy crag]

this disc legit tried to mind control DC me cuz they were 1 go away from losing, and lost, and proceeded to whisper me daring me to link a 2700 achieve

which, their first 2700 and first glad were both from unchained season

[jolly sierra]

dare him to eat a report

[sharp sierra]

guys listen. agility nerf is by 6~7%dmg nerf. and evis 7.5%
But we can change our gears to mastery/vers gears from tier sets. my current mastery is 101% and if i change my whole tier sets, my mastery will 120% or more. so, sub still can 1 shot them i guess cuz there isnt any maximum hp buff. 🙂

BUT, we cant play sub anymore if they do 1 more nerf

[jolly sierra]

dont bother about the general agi nerf

that is something ALL DPS classes ate stat wise in their primaries

[sharp sierra]

ik but for sub is some different

1 shot or no dps and only cc tool

[worthy crag]

ur sacrificing a large chunk of crit though

[sharp sierra]

DF szn 1 was same as now and sub ruined whole DF szn 1 so we need to check this out carefully

[worthy crag]

brew build loses meaning without enough crit

imo

[sharp sierra]

yea ik but we need mastery for big dps after nerf

[waxen meteor]

Just did first 12 myth, with 14 mins remaining time! Man pve is relaxing and jumping on a bus with 3 mins waiting is fun

[sharp sierra]

there isnt any choices for dps
evis dmg will fcked and we need to cover it up

[waxen meteor]

Tbh I think it’s a fairly big hit

[worthy crag]

or, just go back to goremaw tech build with less emphasis on evis

with cold blood

[waxen meteor]

I have not played the tea build yet

[worthy crag]

your mastery wont mean a lot if your evis doesnt crit 6 times in a row

[sharp sierra]

goremaw ST is sucks so much

[worthy crag]

not really

clunky, but not bad

people make it a big deal that goremaw doesnt hit for 250k anymore but its still better than shadowstriking for 35k dmg and evis hitting 110k uncrit

[sharp sierra]

u can burst only 1 target every 45secs

i know this is big dps but blades can 3targets on every go

[worthy crag]

thats kinda how brew already is with sblades, and even more so after evis nerf

your only kill window is just gonna be sblades

yes, but being able to 3 target on blades and going back to just setting up on 1 target is typical rogue history lol

[sharp sierra]

but baldes can get more cds from enemies
goremaw can pull out only 1 cd

[worthy crag]

i mean its not like goremaw build does 0 dmg with blades

my current goremaw build rogue still hits 130k evis uncrit

also like

rogue at the end of the day is just about killing one guy, not all 3

its just right now they can kill all 3 brainlessly with how strong blades are

so they dont want to give that up

[waxen meteor]

But question, brew or bite, it doesn’t change your blade cd, right?

[worthy crag]

correct

[sharp sierra]

yes

[waxen meteor]

I don’t think brew changes that much

In terms of evis dmg

Which is basically the dmg in blade period

[worthy crag]

its combining brew + tea and getting 36~ crit with symbols

[waxen meteor]

And also if they don’t want to avoid sub bursting 3 people, just nerf blade duration

Simple

[worthy crag]

yea well that ship has passed xD

[waxen meteor]

I really dislike how they deal with this now

[worthy crag]

we know what nerf we gettin

[waxen meteor]

Yeah

Blade burst 3 people surely needs to be addressed

But now they seem to be not addressing that only

[worthy crag]

I think evis dmg needed to be tuned ultimately

like, even if sblades is halved in duration it'll still enable them to evis somenoe like 10 times with stun + duel

now if they made blades NOT grant full combo points that would have been a better direction

[waxen meteor]

Nuh

That means undo the redo

That will never happen

I do like the reworked blade, it seems I missed the tea build train completely

Yeah tea allows you to keep going at someone after stun lock with duel and initial cc

Never realized that damn

Till now

Without 100 additional energy and tea, it’s not possible

[sharp sierra]

anyway rogue in this expansion cannot win if pull out 1 cd every burst because every classes can help their allies so rogue with goremaw is bad

[waxen meteor]

They could also probably just make bomb duel as 1 pick out of two

But anyway

[worthy crag]

its a gross exaggeration to say goremaw build pulls out 1 cd every 45 seconds

[waxen meteor]

Nerf has been determined

[sharp sierra]

warr,paladin can make it

[worthy crag]

itll just be more of a player decision, and i still expect tea build to remain more popular, but they will not sacrifice crit to get mastery high

the build needs like 35% crit minimum

and itll be just sblades window only

[sharp sierra]

bro kalvish doesnt play 4sets

fck he changed his gears sry

[worthy crag]

also depends on what comp you play

[sharp sierra]

i play thug 2.7cr last szn

i think theres some diff if with boomy

if not, still crit is worse than mastery ig

[worthy crag]

then it comes down to praying to rngesus

[sharp sierra]

xd

[waxen meteor]

Well tbh I am not super convinced about the crit

You move a bit more stat from mastery to crit or other way around

[worthy crag]

even now a lot of brew build is padded by rupture so if ur playing something like rmx where the mage is presheeping every dot off i'd still favor goremaws build

[waxen meteor]

That’s not like day and night difference

[worthy crag]

but rn a lot of sub rogues just pve with destro lock or spriest etc

[waxen meteor]

We probably talking about 5% diff

At most

Isn’t it

[worthy crag]

if you uncrit during your stun+duel its actually a huge deal

ur talking like 160 vs 240 evis

[waxen meteor]

Yeah but we are talking about less than 5% crit chance diff

[worthy crag]

well, more like 150 vs 230 or so

well 5% is bigger the lower it gets

like

70% to 75% is a tiny diff

but 28% to 33% is huge

[sharp sierra]

hmm..

[waxen meteor]

I know what you mean but that’s not really how math checks out..

Yeah 5% out of 28% is a huge boost percentage wise

But in reality, it’s still 33% of your evis crit or 28% of your evis crit

The only adv is probably you avoid mastery stat stack dr

[sharp sierra]

let me check.. 15% reduce evis dmg from 295k evis dmg

[waxen meteor]

I guess for top players it’s an acceptable nerf

[sharp sierra]

its 250k

[waxen meteor]

For lowbies like me playing solo for most times, less efficient gos with less dmg from myself really hurts

[worthy crag]

so if you go down the route of pulling crit off to get mastery up and giving up 2 set

youll have to run the risk of not critting on your "big go"

its just something youll have to accept

litearlly bad luck

[sharp sierra]

but even if 38% crit has bad luck tho

[worthy crag]

yes, but considerably less

[sharp sierra]

hmm...

[worthy crag]

I think with like 36~38 crit youll get at least 3 evis crits during full stun + duel

[sharp sierra]

seems ur right

[worthy crag]

and thats not counting like shadowed part

im talking purely physical first portion

so my alt is like poorly geared with tea build sitting at a few % of crit lower than most others

which most people would come down to a similar crit % range if they decide to all in on mastery

its definitely easily felt how less often i crit

I think as far as tea build is concerned, the play is to still maintain the crit stat as well as 2 piece

As far as tea vs goremaw is concerned I think tea has a higher ceiling with blades up, but goremaw is more consistent

tea build dmg is going to feel pathetic without blades next patch

cuz even now, without blades, you can usually get in 2 evis on a go

smthin like kidney heals, cheap shot kill target + first dance evis -> shadowstrike shadowstrike evis cheap shadowstrike

so ur doing like 35k shadowstrikes, on top of nerfed evis which would usually come around 100k uncrit or 155~160k crit

[sharp sierra]

then how about crit mast ring? nahj uses that

[worthy crag]

goremaw sec tech could be somewhere around 165~170k (with PV 4 stacks), sec tech hitting around 220~230k

with only 2 GCDs

I was never a fan of how many GCDs it takes to actually evis somenoe twice within 5 second tea window when blades is on cd

its like 6 globals

to not leave a stun gap

I think ultimately what gear you craft or what missive you use is unimportant as long as you get the 30/30/100

like 30 crit 30 vers 100 mast

but yeah crit mast ring is desired to hit that mark imo

I think tea build will remain superior in double dps 2s, sub/healer 2s for sure as well as alot of 3s comps

solo shuffle im not sure yet but tea will probably be marginally better

RMX I'd say tea might not be as good

but like once people realize how much sub dmg falls off with blades on CD it'll be difficult to bait things for the next blades

which would happen a lot esp with the trinket bonus nerf

[waxen meteor]

And they have way more stress on us when they receive way less stress in go

[halcyon timber]

Working as the forums intended

[waxen meteor]

But man, 34 vs 38 % crit in your stun + duel doesn’t create much diff…

Your mathematics expectations are close

[sharp sierra]

30/30/100 seems the best

crit vers mast

[waxen meteor]

That’s good to avoid stat stack dr

[sharp sierra]

2 sets with crit mast ring will gonna big deal for sure

[waxen meteor]

Just remember there are lots of things that can zero out your crit stat

[worthy crag]

I forgot to mention this but with the overall game pace slowing down with trinket set nerf, tea build might run into a damp game where you actually run out of tea charges

Right now games are quick enough to end before that but

[waxen meteor]

Like hunter

Like lock

[worthy crag]

Like once you start getting on 0 charge, itll be FULL 60 seconds to get it back cuz it doesnt CDR with combo points like dance

or 45 with a vanish

[waxen meteor]

tea out of cd is annoying

Got that few times in sin 2s

[worthy crag]

yeah thats like the situation you dread the most as sub

and itll prob happen a lot more frequently

starting next reset

[marsh ridge]

we just got nerfed %8 on agi, aroun 20% on set and 7.5% on eviscerate?

[marsh ridge]

so 200k evis having around 150k coming from base and 50k from clone with 2 sets. this 150K got nerfed directly %8 and %7.5 and became 127.5K, 50k from clone became 38.25K and the total eviscerate damage was nerfed to 165.75K. so its a 18% nerf to eviscerate damage

correct me i made a mistake in the calculations

[tardy spruce]

hi guys, where is the info about me randomly breaking stealth out of combat and pre-combat (no buffs, trinket use, nothing has been cast yet, still leave stealth randomly)

[sharp sierra]

try some test and ill pst the result here

about agility nerf, eviscerate nerf calculate

[outer sky]

What's the best rogue spec to play in 3v3 arena right now

?

[stable urchin]

guys the nerf to 2 set is 40% compared to what it is now its not 20

[lapis breach]

Try checking the combat log

[marsh ridge]

eviscerate is our main damage in most builds and its getting nerfed around 18%...

[wintry dew]

Where's the math behind 8% AGI? Didn't notice anything on the patch notes

[last jasper]

PvP trinket set from 20% main stat to 12%

[wintry dew]

Okay thanks my dood

So we burst less

I hope this doesn't go downhill and we get to the point we are just hitting with wet noodles

[last jasper]

isn't sec tec clones suppose to do less dam than initial hit?

details now shows me all 3 almost identical

[sharp sierra]

normal agi=13665pvp
after nerf agi=12754pvp

13665agi evis tooltip dmg= 84983
12542agi evis(trinket change for calculate) evis tooltip dmg= 79324

So, 12754agi evis dmg= 79324+@ but still 7.5%evis dmg nerf not applied

There are difference of 300 eviscerate damage for every 30 agility
So, 12754-12542=212agi difference
212/30=7.06times
300x7.06=2,118dmg

Then, 12542agi nerfed evis dmg=79324
79324+2,118= 81,442 evis dmg
7.5% nerf = 81,442*0.925= 75,333

75,333= the tooltip dmg of 7 combo eviscerate damage after get nerfed
from 84,983 (11.3% damage reduced)

🙂 seems not a big deal huh

[last jasper]

skills tooltip are mostly bugged and might not show correct dam.

[sharp sierra]

theres no buffs like nightstalker ik that

i used shuriken toss to pvp dummy for calculate

[last jasper]

plus 2set nerf would took some % of our burst as well

we still should be great tho

[sharp sierra]

we dont need 2sets cuz its probabilistic

anyway we dont need worry for nerf sub is still broken

[last jasper]

Yea. Blades and tea are the main sources

[sharp sierra]

and we can 100% dmg as now if we burst without thief bargen debuff

or 3secs wait after blades on for big 2nd evis

[vapid ledge]

This is likely a dumbass question but it's my first time playing Dragonflight. Just hit 1850 and got the mog fully unlocked, if I lose some shuffle rating will I lose the pieces?

I would assume no

[jolly sierra]

no u wont

[vapid ledge]

Bless

Im free to spam queue and farm a vicious saddle

[jolly sierra]

XD

[vapid ledge]

Do skirmish wins count towards the saddle?

[jolly sierra]

nuh uh

[vapid ledge]

Feck

Need to find someone and spam queue 2s with I think

[jolly sierra]

yep

[vapid ledge]

Need my cute spider mount

[last jasper]

3s gives more % per win. If it’s important

[proven kayak]

gius i took a break still got the gear and the tokens do i go 4set on sub or 2 is good

[vapid ledge]

Ooooh I think I'll do that

Mostly just wanna farm up a new whip to ride around on

[last jasper]

2 set just got nerfed. But all top rogues runs 4set rn

[vapid ledge]

I would check murlok.io and just see what the top rogues are running

Cause yeah like Egoist said most are 4 set

[proven kayak]

ty guys

i did actually checekd

and most of them running 4set

[marsh ridge]

you didnt include 2 set nerf as well.

[waxen meteor]

Two classes only

2400+ lobby

[surreal barn]

[worthy crag]

11% nerf to the biggest source of dmg is pretty big

not unusable, not sure if it's "still op"

[waxen meteor]

What?

[worthy crag]

was replying to that

[waxen meteor]

Ah cool!

Man I think impact would be quite clear but it is what it is I guess

[worthy crag]

lol i've seen 2 same spec rss lobby but i dont think i ever saw 3 same spec rss

[waxen meteor]

At least it looks like we won’t get more nerfs

[worthy crag]

dont be so sure xd

[waxen meteor]

Man my DH alt had been seeing every lobby 2000+ with at least 2 DHs before second DH nerf. multiple times 3 DHs

Since like first week

Now I see a bit less double DH

But was crazy before nerfs

First week was so crazy, i basically just went to middle of everyone right away and sent fel bar then took several of everyone’s defensive CD

Then start to play

[vocal totem]

Can someone help me with crafted ring for pvp, i need signet of titanic insight, can i make finger witouth lesser verdant trophy of conquest

[waxen meteor]

Not sure what exactly you mean

But I think we get next craft next week

So we will have double craft rings

Don’t think there’s a way to craft without the spark nor conquest spending

[last jasper]

Without a trophy it would be just a 456(?) ilvl ring.
Random bg drops item that give u quest for 3 free trophies

[slim iron]

Can someone help me prioritze my conquest spending? Tier is from PvE and main hand dagger is the only thing I've bought so far from the conquest vendor.

Weapon > Trinkets/Neck/Rings > Else?

[waxen meteor]

Spec?

Sin or Sub

Regardless, you can craft three now, in your case. Craft head and foot from mission items, craft one ring with conquest.

Wrist, belt and cloak, use catch up trophy

Remain will be conquest, so take trinket first then off hand weapon/necklace, neither is prioritized item

So your conquest spending will be Ring - Trinket - then whatever

[last jasper]

isn't oh that gives main stat > necklace which gives less mastery?

[waxen meteor]

Yeah tbh I am not even certain necklace is an upgrade or downgrade for sub due to the play style

I will surely take it for sin

Right now I think I have only off hand, necklace, ring and medallion to be upgraded before complete s3 gearing

Ring will be next week craft, necklace I can buy already but I haven’t

[last jasper]

Same

[waxen meteor]

I might have to regear and give up 2 or 4 tier

Good nerf

[last jasper]

Was looking for oh. But I forgot we would have spark next week

[slim iron]

Sin, thanks for the advice. My crafts are already made for PvE content, I'll work on PvP boots next.

[waxen meteor]

Then use conquest for head after trinket

Or it depends you can wait for sparks for head, it’s free 875 conquest item, I would rather not waste 875 conquest

What did you craft for pve?

[slim iron]

Toxic boots, Helm (Which I can use a trophy on for PvP), and Toxic Patch Bracers.

[jolly sierra]

ewww

better craft a verdant conduit or the 90% hp mastery embelishment

[worthy crag]

hm, will have to debate dropping 2piece post patch

[wintry dew]

he's a pve guy, he will have to wait for the new crafts

[waxen meteor]

What’s the secondary on those

[wintry dew]

crit haste probably

[waxen meteor]

I just checked pve page

Looks like mastery crit are the preferred stat

[wintry dew]

helm and bracers probably crit vers

[waxen meteor]

If it’s mastery crit pieces you can play with the two crafted toxic

[waxen meteor]

Not ideal but probably better than honor gear

[worthy crag]

ima try 0 set, heavy verse & mast goremaw build after reset

and see how that goes

i mean itd still take a few weeks to actually go to 0 set because ill have to buy the pieces with conquest

[waxen meteor]

I am about to do that too, but you can’t convert tier back

So probably you gotta wait a few weeks

[worthy crag]

yeah, im gonna just commit to having no crit investments

and the 30% proc chance to do 30% shadow dmg on evis for 2p is not worth the stat loss

[waxen meteor]

The mastery crit two pieces are probably still alright

[worthy crag]

yeah, going to still prioritize replacing other green/trophy slots

[last jasper]

you can have 100 mastery with the 4 set. Would be even more next week. What is the point of dropping it

[worthy crag]

cuz im not playing tea build with my main rogue

the crit from the set pieces is mostly a dead stat cuz i have rotten + cold blood

[last jasper]

Yea, but how much would extra mastery beyond 100 would give compared to 4 set?

Is 4 set extra 20% nerfed like 2 set or not?

[worthy crag]

the biggest gain will be on vers, and IIRC 100% mastery isnt a specific breakpoint or anything, its not any harder to gain a % past 100 than it is before

i dont think 4 set is changed

[halcyon timber]

Was only the 2 set that was changed.

[last jasper]

Yea, they nerfed only 2 set. I just don’t know is 20% from 4p nerfed or it’s straight +20%

[worthy crag]

i dont think its nerfed if ur talking about a pvp modifier

[halcyon timber]

In pvp the set was 35% not 50% so not sure what blizzy meant there in the post.

[worthy crag]

i know some people (or most people) have picked up sec tech with 4 set to take advantage of the guaranteed shadow clones but i'm not sure if its better than just pressing evis

i guess it might be once evis is nerfed

[last jasper]

Lmao, for real?)

[worthy crag]

but that means you're also adding in one finisher worth of gap between building & spending finality

[cosmic thistle]

when do i want too change smoke bomb too dismantle couldnt find any good answers on google

[halcyon timber]

Well its 70% in pve , halved in pvp naturally so 35% and now .5 down to .30 on their notes indicates -60%. So the set will be 15 in pvp now.

[last jasper]

When facing rogue

[worthy crag]

or frost dk

[halcyon timber]

Which i could give a single flying eff about tier set reliance to begin with but the nerf is a big deal just on the set alone. Nerfing eviscerate slows that down even more and then you look at per armor class as well and defensive use.

[worthy crag]

21%

70 * 0.5 (50% modifier in pvp) = current 35

70 * 0.3 (after nerf) = 21%

[halcyon timber]

Yes but using their indicated .5 to .3

Confusing but it “should” be 21

[last jasper]

1/3 from 70 is going to be 23.3% extra. Plus another 10% from 4p

[halcyon timber]

Right

[last jasper]

Funny 😂
Despite they actually pumps a ton of dam

[halcyon timber]

Just more dumb issues caused by returning tier to shit

[worthy crag]

yesterday i had this pug disc rage at me for dropping bomb against a rdruid because it was fdk + rdruid

[halcyon timber]

Should of left it out of the game but kids always get crazy over it and obsess with numbers

[worthy crag]

and decided to throw

for tea build the tier nerf changes nothing

youll still want to pick up 4p

because how much it helps toward getting 30 crit

[cosmic thistle]

What dream craft gear does assasin need?

[last jasper]

I’m dumb. How is 4 set sync with tea build? Dark brew?

[halcyon timber]

Mastery enhances that

[worthy crag]

well, the ideal stat you want is 30 crit 30 vers 100 mastery

[halcyon timber]

Tea should of been hit

[worthy crag]

none of the 4 pieces have haste, so they all offer good stats

and enough crit to actually get it up to 30

so the set bonus is just a bonus

[cosmic thistle]

What dream craft gear does assasin need?

[last jasper]

Lmao

[worthy crag]

you should decide for yourself after looking at vendor items

[last jasper]

@jolly sierra mate 😂

[cosmic thistle]

so their sint any that i must must have?

[last jasper]

Well, evis was hitting like a truck.

[worthy crag]

not really, no dream craft is a "must have"

if ur min maxing its a diff story

[cosmic thistle]

min maxing?

[halcyon timber]

Agreed but tea also should have been hit.

[worthy crag]

nah, tea will be in a weird spot after patch even if 0 changes directly

with the trinket nerf and overall dmg nerf, games will damp long enough where you are out of all the 3 charges

[last jasper]

Maybe blades. Or bargain. When u eat back to back evis for 200-300k that’s the problem

[worthy crag]

and you can't even shorten it like you can with dance

right now tea is just good cuz games never last that long

but once it does, youll have 1 tea per minute, or 45 seconds with vanish

which is really shitty

you wont be able to blindly press tea every go

[last jasper]

Currently u need like 2-3 go before it ends

[halcyon timber]

Agreed but bargain should have been a higher penalty anyway. Blades isn’t a problem when it has been poop for years. The blades change was great

[proven kayak]

To be fair it’s the first time I feel I’m the main dps in solos feels like sl early s1

[halcyon timber]

Tea is just a crutch at this point. While i dig the call back to the old days it shouldn’t be a 1 min cd anyway

[worthy crag]

yeah its not like this nerf will kill sub lol

far from it

[halcyon timber]

We will be fine

[proven kayak]

What’s the nerf btw

Didn’t checked

[worthy crag]

trinket set bonus nerf (all dps specs), 7.5% evis dmg nerf, 2set shadow dmg reduced from 35 to 21%

[last jasper]

It’s not. But with cdr plus bargain they r back really fast. And sub with blades would eat in a stun lock

[halcyon timber]

Right

[wintry dew]

That was already answered before, you should check your vision with your doctor.

[worthy crag]

yeah they nerfed combo point generation over the years such as reducing cheap shot from 2 combo to 1 combo generator, and then they go ahead and make sblades give full cp

kinda weird

[halcyon timber]

And shaman wolves cdr , aug cdr , other classes etc aren’t a problem

Tab targetting classes arent a problem but when rogue does stuff . Heaven falls.

[worthy crag]

because rogue has duel

[wintry dew]

SUB has duel

[halcyon timber]

And other classes can stop it with aoe effects

[worthy crag]

because sub has duel

[wintry dew]

😛

[halcyon timber]

Cap totem / deep breath / static field and move it away etc

[worthy crag]

the reason sub is hated if it does actual dmg is because theyll just chain that dmg with duel

[halcyon timber]

Yeh

[worthy crag]

thats a select few classes though

like hpal or holy priest has nothing for duel

[halcyon timber]

A lot of classes can stop it

Hpal can do the blinding glare nonsense

Blind aoe thing etc

[worthy crag]

yeah if they are allowed to cast it in 10 yard range

also most rogues would just chain duel with cloak

[halcyon timber]

Always a “if x”

Aint ever a perfect scenario

Agreed though

[worthy crag]

people are biased to think sub is the most brain class but when it does dmg 75% of the sub playerbase just go to a oneshot cheese macro chaining duel sblades cloak and just press 1212121212

and that's ultimately on the way duel is designed and the fact that only sub has it

which brings back to why ppl hate it when sub does dmg

[halcyon timber]

You do work your butt off and if people don’t figure it out after 19 years thats on them

[last jasper]

Nah mate. Currently if u don’t have cds/trinket and there is a sub with blades it’s pretty much over

[halcyon timber]

Its only a rogue problem always will be

[worthy crag]

idk, im okay with the balance of DF in general

[halcyon timber]

You should die regardless if an enemy uses cds and you don’t bubs

[worthy crag]

warrior isnt immortal like they were in the past 4 expansions and ret pallies lost undispellable freedom

[halcyon timber]

You “have nothing” you should die

[worthy crag]

yea but the problem is duel draws out way more shit than it should

esp chained with sblades

[scarlet shell]

only way Sub kills anything is if the enemy presses virtually no defenses

[worthy crag]

or the fact that it requires very specific CDs because it has to be aoe

[jolly sierra]

or he can recraft w a guy to switch the embelishment

[scarlet shell]

i agree that sub needs their damage reeled back a little, but really defensives does wonders.

[last jasper]

As much as I love sending evis in a stun lock, but the dam was way high 😂

[halcyon timber]

Yep its whatever though

[worthy crag]

and ever since they got the ability to cloak physical disarms it's grown even more braindead

[scarlet shell]

there is no way a warrior easily dies to a sub

[halcyon timber]

But it wasn’t in wrath?

Back when glyphs gave ps

Lvl of dr

[jolly sierra]

AAAAAAAAA

[worthy crag]

super old expacs arent the same game anymore

[halcyon timber]

Right

[jolly sierra]

pls end my suffering

[halcyon timber]

And people can take 2 steps to the left and bleed us now

To go through cloak

[worthy crag]

itd probably be best if duel is just flat out removed from the game

[halcyon timber]

Just like when people whined about combat readiness and they just had to not attack us for 3 sec or whatever to get it to fall off or cc us

[worthy crag]

that and good dmg cant coexist

and if ppl want sub to do good dmg, which i also want, then duel shouldnt exist

[halcyon timber]

Due can go aeay

Duel*

[last jasper]

you are playin as sin right? 😄 share some advice 😄

[jolly sierra]

daga kotowaru

[peak agate]

I've been trying to get 1600 in 2s and it's been a struggle for me. I get close but I ultimately run out of CDs and get destroyed by DPS who throw out 250k nukes with less effort than I need.

But still have fun

[worthy crag]

one of my alt rogues has had the worst vault luck and is sitting at like 31% crit and 88% mastery

aka real shit stat

i look at my evis crits and the top one of em is like 163k, gives me real depression

[cosmic thistle]

but it isnt, one said a foot craft i said i have that and i said is their anythign else no one answered

[last jasper]

wait a sec. 4p means sec tec clones as well or only the one that 2p triggers?

[worthy crag]

it triggers off of sec tech clones

thats why ppl put in a talent point to take it with 4pc

[halcyon timber]

Correct

[wintry dew]

@cosmic thistle

[cosmic thistle]

u dint @ me so cant see evertything

[wintry dew]

You wrote 5 mins later

We ain't paid to coach

[worthy crag]

wait why is winter veil live on classic but not retail

[wintry dew]

Isn't it in orgrimmar / iron forge?

I already did Christmas quests today

[worthy crag]

oh ok, nvm then

ironforge in 2023

[wintry dew]

It's always there bro xD

[last jasper]

4th time in a row...

[halcyon timber]

Yeh boy

[signal dagger]

what spec would you recommend for a new player in pvp

[cosmic thistle]

how tf am i supposed to win against this fkign havocs they are INSANE

[halcyon timber]

Steep learning curve on rogue regardless man.

You dismantle essence break and force them to eff up

[scarlet shell]

its always the 6th guy

[halcyon timber]

Feint a lot too merek

[scarlet shell]

Havoc is easy to beat

[halcyon timber]

Assassination will be the most straight forward, Outlaw and Subtlety have a lot more going on

[scarlet shell]

They are insanely stupid

[halcyon timber]

They trinket gouges and saps in 2023 and go to the forums about it

[signal dagger]

so i cant really go wrong with any of them? just work on getting through the learning curve?

[halcyon timber]

Yes sir

[scarlet shell]

They don’t think before charging in

[signal dagger]

play what i like kinda thing

[halcyon timber]

Yep exactly

Learn the tools of the trade

[signal dagger]

alright. i appreciate it. thank you 🙂

[halcyon timber]

Play what you like man

No sweat

[cosmic thistle]

i must have 0% chance winrate they always heal so much and burst so much

[halcyon timber]

Its alright man, take it as practice

Keep improving and don’t give up

[waxen meteor]

Depends…

If you are sub probably yeah

If you are sin, can be challenging

[mortal jay]

Shadowmeld the front loaded damage of hunt

[waxen meteor]

DH 100-0 you in 3-4 globals with 1-2 crit

[mortal jay]

makes dh angry

[waxen meteor]

That could be done without any stun

[mortal jay]

dismantle the back end damage

[waxen meteor]

Eyebeam or the hunt, followed by essence break, blade dance, death sweep, you can be cheat death already

With all the dots already on you

[mortal jay]

improved cloak stops nearly all of a dh's burst

improved evasion cuts his damage in half

feint is useful if you can time his burst

and a dh needs to be on you to do damage.. its not like chasing a mage across the map

[waxen meteor]

Keep in mind DH doesn’t need many CD to burst you 100-10

For sin it’s not that easy in 3s

You can play fairly well in sin+heal vs DH+heal

[last jasper]

how is aug easy and devoker is hard?

[waxen meteor]

Not exactly certain, not my list I never played dev. But when I played Aug last season you have one combo that does a huge burst and used mostly all your CDs then you pretty much have only 2 skills to push for rest of your play.. like BM

Until you do the combo against when CD comes back

[last jasper]

Yea, I know it’s skillcap. I played aug too. For fun in s2. But there is much more buttons to press. Heal, save, shield, maintain buff. While Dev is literally eyebeam kiting melees

[radiant shuttle]

they do be beaming

[stoic spruce]

quit being a bitch

[worthy crag]

lol what

[stoic spruce]

go to a pve channel if you want to talk about taking good things away

[worthy crag]

no, im just not delusional enough to think sub deserves everything good

[stoic spruce]

you know what

I get it

I'll meet you halfway

take cloak away from sub

[worthy crag]

What

[stoic spruce]

the cloak talent. take it away from sub

[worthy crag]

it and duel can both get gone for all i care

But kinda weird to be told to go pve when im prob far above in pvp

[stoic spruce]

Im not sure how duel made it into the ga,e

because asking for a nerf is what pvers do

its cringe

its an arms race against other players

[worthy crag]

So youd rather have power creep for eternity?

[stoic spruce]

for assa and outlaw yes

assa/outlaw>everyone else

[worthy crag]

Ok, good to know you are totally not biased

[stoic spruce]

not being biased gets you kicked around

[worthy crag]

I mean, "i deserve good things while my enemies stay at status quo" is the literal definition of a pve mindset

[stoic spruce]

against NPCs

[worthy crag]

And ur basically wanting your enemy players to be npcs so you can walk away with a w

[stoic spruce]

did I say that?

[worthy crag]

not being skilled does

How else is outlaw & assa > everyone else supposed to be interpreted lol

[stoic spruce]

outlaw and assa better than everyone but not by a mile

[worthy crag]

and the players of every class with that mindset is the reason pvp is dying because its a cesspool mentality

My class is superoior, my class deserves good shit etc

[stoic spruce]

yeah because begging for balance for the last 20 years has worked in the past

[stoic spruce]

yes

[worthy crag]

Its fairly well balanced though?

[stoic spruce]

yeah thats why theyre nerfing trinket bonus

[worthy crag]

If it turns out bad it can always be reverted

[stoic spruce]

you know in your heart of hearts it wont

[worthy crag]

Ive been down a much worse road before

8% primary stat nerf is nowhere near as bad

[gleaming pawn]

nerfing the trinket bonus for everyone has nothing to do with balance. If it applies to everyone, it doesn't effect balance

[stoic spruce]

not really true. Some specs work a lot better in slower games

[worthy crag]

In a way it does because it benefits dampener comps more than others, but like i said this nerf isnt as bad as some that happened in past expacs

[stoic spruce]

others not so much

[worthy crag]

like when they reduced total dmg by 10% and increased stam by 10% in wod

Every game was extended to like 23 min long

Devs have been more incremental with tunings than they ever were, no spec gets thrown out of the meta with a single patch

But ppl still complain cuz they think whatever they play should never be tuned down

[jolly sierra]

maybe they did that cuz 1k players still whines for 1shots instead get better

same as happened w cc nerfs

[stoic spruce]

hey man, dispelling poisons is hard work

[jolly sierra]

their selfishness ended in this circus

[jolly sierra]

still dont get how tf sepsis is good when dispells exists

[worthy crag]

for sin or sub?

[jolly sierra]

sub

[worthy crag]

Cuz itll still tick alot while the dispeller (usually healer) sits in cc

Or the fact that their first global out of cc has to be a dispel is a significant pressure too

[jolly sierra]

does it ticks that fast?

[worthy crag]

They have better things to press

[surreal barn]

The fact that I can use it and then insta cheap the healer or peel is pretty cool

[worthy crag]

Yeah thats a good use case too

[jolly sierra]

even any drood, pally or monk can do the job

ah i see

still weird, dont get used to that being just used in s3

[worthy crag]

They can, but they have better things to press, esp if ur teammate is pumping combustion etc

[jolly sierra]

i still recall going w flag

for example i love KB for s3 cuz it cant be dispelled

and hits like a truck

[worthy crag]

ive actually killed warriors and hunters before with a sepsis ticking under their parry

Actually sepsis go is p good on hunters cuz theyll just ros anyway

and i save sec tech for next go

[jolly sierra]

for me that happens with KB run

30s later i go DM

the burst for themselves is good enough to pressure a kill

if not, well i have KB 30s later

[stoic spruce]

Why is my nose itchy

[jolly sierra]

allergic reactions to poisons

[stoic spruce]

Dang. I knew it.

[jolly sierra]

F

[stoic spruce]

This is why I don't main assa Panda

[jolly sierra]

that is fine, i feel comfortable w my combo lol

[mystic raptor]

I am kinda new to sub and wonder if you guys ever use rupture in arena

[stoic spruce]

This sounds weird but I remember a long time ago, someone told me I should wash my face with toothpaste. I just tried it and my face is so smooth.

[last jasper]

Yea, sure. Before go. Pika even talented into +20% for rupture

[mystic raptor]

What about black powder and shuriken storm

[last jasper]

Powder is pve only. U can spam storm if there are few targets around so u can reset ur dance faster

[mystic raptor]

ok and how do i usually use my rupture should i maintain it and refresh it constantly on the main target or ?

[halcyon timber]

Dot specs like affliction as an example

Ferals become better too while also still doing 350k bites

[stoic spruce]

So true

[quaint cedar]

talking about the primary stat changes?

[halcyon timber]

Revert some outlaw nerfs too

[quaint cedar]

feral benefits a lot too because they are super squishy

so taking less damage overall is good

[halcyon timber]

The healing revert on feral should be “decent “ too no?

And enhancement shaman

[quaint cedar]

yeah that too

[halcyon timber]

Shaman playing diglet is always funny to see

[quaint cedar]

still can't believe outlaw got nerfed week 2

as if it was even a problem to begin with

[last jasper]

Don’t stress too much about it. You can rupture both dps between go to put some pressure on healer. Same on main target before go, but if u don’t is not a big deal

[halcyon timber]

Shaman colorized 1965

[quaint cedar]

now everyone already knows to CC us or trinket on stealth windows anyways so we're back to doing fucking nothing

primary stat changes could be bad too because outlaw's secondaries are kinda shit so we rely a lot on primary

but idk

I don't really much care anymore tbh

[halcyon timber]

Working as the forums intended -_-

[mystic raptor]

gotcha thanks for helping

[halcyon timber]

Rupture gets a lot of value for sure

[last jasper]

It’s good to rupture war/huntard. So when they parry/turtle they kept taking damage

[halcyon timber]

Rupture warlock pets to break up their soul link too

They split life /dr w their goons

[jolly sierra]

can be possible sometimes, i have a soap which i can use in my face to remove grease and shit like that lol

[stoic spruce]

I let it sit on my face for around 20 minutes

New skin new me

[last jasper]

https://tenor.com/view/ryan-reynolds-wtf-what-the-gif-23856906

[jolly sierra]

a

[stoic spruce]

b

[jolly sierra]

c

[stoic spruce]

d

[stoic spruce]

Lizards every now and then

[last jasper]

e

[stoic spruce]

f

[last jasper]

G

[atomic loom]

Whats the typical burst opener look like as sub with flag

[jolly sierra]

H

[waxen meteor]

I

[peak agate]

T

[last jasper]

L

[last jasper]

Check pikaboos vids on yt. He’s playing with flag rn

[atomic loom]

Thanks ill look, seems like everyone is playing sepsis now

[sharp sierra]

12%of sub mastery = actually increase 3.87%dmg WTF

[stoic spruce]

M

[last jasper]

He is playing sepsis as well 😂

[atomic loom]

guess sepsis is the play then

[last jasper]

Nah it’s just there cuz u need to get to cdr. Basically press and forget

[worthy crag]

How many weeks into the season does conquest get uncapped?

[fossil sierra]

Why does my omnibar not work in arena's? I downloaded it and it shows it when I test but when I go in nothign...?

[last jasper]

Season 2 was uncapped after like 9 weeks

[waxen meteor]

we are probably half way there now

[worthy crag]

i need soo much conquest

[waxen meteor]

yeah that's why i said no nerf set after season starts

people spent conquest and convert

but there's no way back

[worthy crag]

their stats are just not very useful for me now

[sharp sierra]

ive calculated eviscerate dmg after got nerfed

7combo / my gears 84,346>78,094

[worthy crag]

that looks way too small, are you sure?

[sharp sierra]

yes

[worthy crag]

does that account for agi nerf as well

[waxen meteor]

i think the main question is have you counted the shadow dmg part?

[sharp sierra]

7.5% of eviscerate dmg= decrease naked eviscerate dmg

[worthy crag]

it affects shadowed finishers as well as finality so it will probably be felt harder than that number suggests

[waxen meteor]

yeah for sure

[worthy crag]

but im surprised its still such a miniscule drop

i mean, 84k to 78k is like, barely 5%

[sharp sierra]

agility before nerf= 11467x1.2=13,760
agility after nerf= 11467x1.12=12,843

i tested my agility 12,670 without any gear changes

so 84,346>78,094 is the result

+-500

and you can cover it if u play 2sets and full mastery gears ( hellbloom chest/ crafted pants)

So u can get 15% mastery but actually increase 5% of eviscerate dmg

and 4sets doesnt work for shadow technique

if u play 2sets, u will loss only 6% crit and still 27% crit remaining

[waxen meteor]

is this evis in dance?

or out

[sharp sierra]

theres not any buffs

[waxen meteor]

k

[sharp sierra]

only activated pvp gears

theres no gear changes, no any buffs

ive calculated with only some trinket changes

but there will something difference here if my math method wrong

blizzard's nerf mechanism is always based on naked spell dmg

[last jasper]

I don’t to be rude but this looks way to low. Like 7.5% from evis is not, but 1k agi lose is a quite a big hit

[sharp sierra]

let me show u how did i calculated

[worthy crag]

well, NAKED dmg decreasing by that amount looks like it checks out

if you account for dark shadow, shadow dance, symbols, finality

that 6~7k diff in naked dmg pumps up to be much more

[sharp sierra]

i didnt include that things

[worthy crag]

Are you sure of this?

[sharp sierra]

TBH

i already tested it

same dmg

[worthy crag]

interesting

[sharp sierra]

55k with nothing buffs

1 clone dmg

54k~55k

[worthy crag]

yeah 2 set, 27% crit rest mastery sounds alright

[sharp sierra]

i used SS 3 times and wait for remove nightstalker and used ST

and same dmg 🙂

[worthy crag]

holy fk RSS is giving me mugambala mugambala blades edge tonight

real cool maps

i have 1 rogue goremaw build the other running tea

i think after tue ill commit both to goremaw build tho

[sharp sierra]

ig ill play same build as now

the nerf seems not big

[last jasper]

My concern is overall main stat nerf.

[sharp sierra]

its 900 of agility nerf

[worthy crag]

its a sizeable nerf but it still makes it more than a viable build

[last jasper]

I’m not talking about rogues. I mean they just nerfed mostly everyone by 8%

[worthy crag]

cept healers

[last jasper]

Like we have 30 min q, well now ull have a longer games on top of that. Cheers

[sharp sierra]

i think theres something different math here i did math again but its kinda weird

i need to check ptr first

[worthy crag]

i mean if dps players get salty and quit for doing less dmg

its going to decrease q timer

rn

healers just constantly face zug gameplay

[sharp sierra]

nerfed agility= 11497x1.12=12,843 this is fact

so ill math again with this

[last jasper]

Longer games would make q even longer. Even if ppl won’t leave

[sharp sierra]

based on 12,646 for math ezly

o shit i need to remove deeper stratagem

fck

[worthy crag]

eh, i dont think 8% stat nerf is going to be that dramatic

[sharp sierra]

5combo evis dmg with 12,636agility = 51,024

[worthy crag]

but right now queue time is long not because of game duration but because how stressful it is to heal

[last jasper]

It’s not. But I don’t like the direction

[sharp sierra]

naked 5combo evis dmg= 2837

7.5% decrease from 2837= 2624.225

geared dmg 51024 is increased by 1698.52% from 2837

geared dmg 51024 is increased by 1698.52% from X

X is nerfed dmg

X = 47,197

perfectly 7.5% decreased dmg

also, 47,197 dmg is based on 12636agility so we have more 197 agility here

As result, if you wanna test this, set the trinkets like this picture and decrease your eviscerate dmg by 7.5%

and add more 197agility dmg

[worthy crag]

so pretend all the modifiers multiply that base dmg by 4, resulting in 204096 pre nerf

188788 post nerf

[sharp sierra]

and theres 296dmg difference here for every 73agility

and we need more 197agility

almost 600 dmg diff

and the final eviscerate 7 combo tooltip dmg is 72,849

+600= 73.4k

[last jasper]

Long qs are cuz ppl don’t want to sweat for 1.8 mmr. Why bother. And those who left are being stomped by r1 players.

[sharp sierra]

84,346 > 73,400 is the final answer

still seems not bad huh

decrease 12.98% of eviscerate dmg

but u can cover it by 5% with 2sets and hellbloom/crafted mastery gears

actually increased 15% of mastery but it isnt 1:1 raito so it will be 5%

[worthy crag]

its multiple reasons

but that is a reason too

[last jasper]

Yes, correct. But in my opinion this one is like the biggest

[stoic spruce]

O

[halcyon timber]

P

[stoic spruce]

Q

[midnight bough]

is this a build up for BFA style 30 mins games?

[exotic dove]

So my Assa Rogue with increase mastery embellish over 90% health is over mastery cap to where my addon says 100 rating loss but below it I am under by 150. Not full geared yet and only crafted ring and chest

Will be over probably by next crafted piece or two

below the 90% hp in pvp combat. With my Crit already at 20% have some thought about going haste as assa after mastery cap since it affects are dots

[stoic spruce]

Potentially

[fading blade]

Glad you exist, I love math

[wintry dew]

https://www.reddit.com/r/worldofpvp/s/XNn4YWg3nK

Check the first comment xD

[wanton breach]

it's not wrong

[waxen meteor]

Well in a way it’s true

Especially early expansions

Rogue comes out early just die

I remember in TBC/WLK, In some RM mirror essentially is just mage 1 on 1, which ever side rogue has to come out to help first loses

[jolly sierra]

its true

the 1st one getting a stunlock wins

[wintry dew]

Not saying it was wrong

Just finding it so accurate it hurts

[jolly sierra]

i recall in SL prepatch

found an elite assa rogue in outdoor from the filthy spanish server we hate here

i was trying sub

without any issues i killed him disgustingly fast and he stopped bothering

yeah, rogue vs rogue is ironically very effective, but im sure a hierarchy between specs does exist

[lapis breach]

I'm playing Sub, trying to do solo random rated arenas, 478 pvp ilevel, and I feel like I can't burn anyone down early and then I'm stuck waiting on CDs. Should I be able to kill people in the first 10-20 seconds? Feels like I'm missing something.

[halcyon timber]

That’s normal

Then you get tuned every expansion, nearly every patch to be less effective and rely on team mates more.

[lapis breach]

Not exactly what I had in mind for a Rogue!

Are we just utility and moderate overall damage, then?

[halcyon timber]

Results may vary is the honest answer

[lapis breach]

Yeah fair. I just want to be able to jump someone in BG or arena and actually kill them

[halcyon timber]

Lots of “it depends” as it comes down to a priority system

[lapis breach]

Right now I feel like I do about 60% of damage, then I'm out of steam and they recuperate and kill me

[halcyon timber]

Setting the table for team mates

Then you get nerfed because yep

Patience and timing are key

[lapis breach]

Maybe I should watch some streamers

[halcyon timber]

Just practice and use a lot of situational awareness

[lapis breach]

Thanks, I'll work on it!

[halcyon timber]

No sweat man

[lapis breach]

right now I'm opening from stealth with a macro:

#showtooltip Shadowstrike
/cast Shadow Dance
/cast Symbols of Death
/cast Shadow Blades
/use !dagger
/cast Shadowstrike

then I do Eviscerate, CB/ST macro, Eviscerate, etc. until I run out of steam, am I doing anything wrong there?

Maybe I should be using Flag before Eviscerate

[halcyon timber]

Its just a priority system, no “rotations” . Rogue depends on what enemies can be ccd, how long do you have and how can you mitigate their stuff.

[worthy crag]

478 is pretty low tbh

also trying to kill someone in 10 to 20 seconds is going to set you back more than distributing your dmg more evenly thruout the match

flag is a waste of a talent

only works on bad players

[lapis breach]

that makes sense, thanks, yeah i'll prob drop flag

it's annoying to fit it in anyway, another gcd

what about talents, any recs?

[waxen meteor]

Yeah most main chars now are at 486 ish

With more than one socket

[waxen meteor]

You have tea build and bite build as two major builds for sub as of today

But you have quite a bunch of choices

[lapis breach]

that's probably my issue, i'm 478, undergeared

[waxen meteor]

It’s undergeared but playable

Sub tree last two rows have too many good choices

Flag just doesn’t seem to have a priority anymore

[lapis breach]

thanks, yeah, i hear that -- redoing my trees and so many choices to make

[waxen meteor]

Am not close to computer

[lapis breach]

bite seems really powerful

i'm gonna replace flag with that i think

i dont like tea, too many buttons

[waxen meteor]

But you can copy kalvish profile for tea build

Bite is a lot more setup

You need to pick vein

When you have 4 stack, dance bite

So you have rotten to crit your bite

With a big bonus dmg from vein and rotten both

But tbh even without the rotten/vein bonus bite can still be a solid choice

It’s just we have too many good options down there

[lapis breach]

oh wow that is a nice combo

[waxen meteor]

Can only pick a few

[lapis breach]

but yeah, that's very different from what i have right now

[worthy crag]

Bite build is more setup and buttons to press actually yea

It can be pretty painful backstabbing 4 times just to get perf vein stacks up while ur getting pummeled by melees

thats why tea build is significantly more popular, smoother gameplay and higher potential dmg

On the downside tea build can fall off in dmg heavily when blades is on cd, has no access to acrobatic strikes

and it's more stat dependent imo, like you HAVE to have good ilvl and stat allocation for tea build to be effective

[waxen meteor]

Man yesterday I saw some guy trying to use tea build in skirmish

Just horrible

Probably just watched too much kalvish

[fossil sierra]

whats wrong with the tea build?

[lapis breach]

thanks for all this!

really helpful info

[halcyon timber]

Nothing is wrong with it , just a different playstyle

[waxen meteor]

No nothing wrong with the build just a lot of things wrong with the person

Probably people watched too much stream and think they can send one go and kill three people by themselves

[fossil sierra]

oh I read that as if tea is bad haha. was like wtf have I been doing wrong then.

[wintry dew]

AVERAGE

AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAH

Oh i just had to complain

it popped

[stoic spruce]

I swear that's all you need to do sometimes.

[lapis breach]

anyone have a nice goremaw talent tree?

i want to try this out

not finding much online

[wary moss]

Gl homie

[worthy crag]

https://www.wowhead.com/ptr-2/talent-calc/rogue/subtlety/DAOUVVRRBUUVJkIRQCFAOVFQUFVBVBUESlFBQ Smthin like this

[lapis breach]

fantastic, thank you!

[wintry dew]

3 rounds, won 2, hunter randomly left xD

[jolly sierra]

XD

classic hunter behaviour

[lapis breach]

ahhh you have shot in the dark instead of improved shuriken storm because gloomblade already applies find weakness, ia ssume

[worthy crag]

nah thats a flex point, u can swap it if you want

but goremaw build is a lot more energy starved than tea so youd prob want free cheap

Can you carry over this week's pvp quest into next reset for instant spark fragment?

Like haviing it completed this week but turning it in next week

[waxen meteor]

Think no

Better just save reputation candies

That will immediately get you spark beginning of the week

[fossil sierra]

fucking hardstuck 1760 geting q's with nothing but warr,dk,dh...

[wintry dew]

AAAAAAAAAAAAAH complaining just so it pops early

It popped

[waxen meteor]

Warrior queue

Shame!

[wintry dew]

already got my 1800 set on rogue

im done

[potent pivot]

[wintry dew]

?

[scarlet shell]

idk man they should just make healers super op and queue times would decrease for dps

thats a bandaid solution IK but Hpal meta was me getting in games

[jolly sierra]

huh

what is wrong trickz

[glossy sky]

You can't upgrade your honor gear with honor anymore?

[wintry dew]

no

[waxen meteor]

That doesn’t resolve the problem

Healer already OP

[scarlet shell]

thats why i said bandaid

[waxen meteor]

[scarlet shell]

there is a more complex solution for this

[waxen meteor]

Quickest bandit, Double CR gain/loss and honor from solo for dps specs

[scarlet shell]

i am sure blizzard wants to still hook players in until like what, the last few weeks of the season?

now we need to convince blizzard to just allow massive inflation rn lmao

[gleaming pawn]

a wild NoTrickz sighting! What is this black magic

[fossil sierra]

yeah got 1800 now I can put rogue down since its getting nerfed haha. fuck lobbies over 1700 shits aids as sub atleast

[waxen meteor]

Still fun to play rogue

My ret DH lock over 1800 too

[wintry dew]

I'm still just so proud i got 1800 on the first day, and havent PvPed on my rogue since then xD

[waxen meteor]

Still queue every week

3s sometimes is toxic too

mglad only

3300 exp

[potent pivot]

just pogging he hit his goal

[wintry dew]

I HIT MY GOAL IN THE FIRST DAY XD actually thought you saw it 😛

:3

[jolly sierra]

gotcha lol

wtf

[wintry dew]

complaining for a fast queu

🙏

[fiery gorge]

What is sub rogue stat prio for pvp ?

Agility > Versatility > Mastery > Crit ?

[steel scarab]

Is Subtlety 2v2 with a holy paladin partner just absolutely nonviable, or are we just really bad?

Assassination we do okay but as sub I just cannot kill anything

[wintry dew]

From 700 rating to 1800 in a single day

[jolly sierra]

what a speedrunner

[last jasper]

At this point I’m surprised u were able to find that much ss games 😂

[jolly sierra]

im lazy af and barely play once a day w every char

[last jasper]

U we’re playing all night yesterday 😂

[wintry dew]

Weren't that many, but my mmr was almost at 1800 since I was 0 cr

So I was getting big gains

What's the website to check the wins and losses?

[last jasper]

Just saw poor ele “gj feeders” 😂

[jolly sierra]

yeh, to cap the day w 4 chars XD

[wintry dew]

XD

[last jasper]

U can mouseover ur rating in default ui

[jolly sierra]

im thinking in stop if i reach w a char 1k8

then i would have 3 remaining

[wintry dew]

I mean the matches, like how much did I go each match today

[jolly sierra]

then i get w other 1, 2

and go like that

[last jasper]

I already got bored. Cuz of q times.

[jolly sierra]

meh got used

[last jasper]

Idk, it was okay in s2. Right now I lose fun. With all alts at 1.7

Fdk is my last hope. Cuz jeez they are fun to play

[jolly sierra]

just make battleground blitz rated already

problem solved

[last jasper]

The q for blitz is almost the same as for ss

And might will be even longer when they’ll add rating into it

[gleaming pawn]

I don't know about that. Having ratied tied to it should in theory improve wait times. I know I for one don't bother with Blitz because it's so easy to cap conq every week

[jolly sierra]

with blitz being rated you would split players towards branches

w that q should be faster

[last jasper]

curretly it tied to weekly qeust, plus ppl spam it to farm honor, for fun etc. when they add rated it would be locked under ilvl. My guess it would make it longer. could be wrong

But ss back in sl q times was 5-9min

[halcyon timber]

Community perception and constant bantering puts a ding it queue times

As well

[last jasper]

I would finally be able to finish my artefact quest for 10 rbg wins lmao

[halcyon timber]

Yeh boy

[surreal barn]

Release it now por favor

[jolly sierra]

si

[waxen meteor]

Told you why other day…

[waxen meteor]

Vers crit probably similar that both come behind mastery.

Depends on build

[fiery gorge]

what was the reason? Would interest me too

[waxen meteor]

Very low dmg outside burst window, both sub and healer needs to know how to play in kill window and collaborate very well, basically this is a combo that requires a lot of skills to work

Things like oh I don’t know what happened but he died hardly happens for sub + heal 2s

[fiery gorge]

So for sub beginners its better to play full burst comps ?

Like ret pala + sub rouge

or similar ?

[waxen meteor]

Well overall sub is not very beginner friendly. Sub + dps is fine, rogue mage still one of best combo in 2s as double dps, this season we can do pretty well with destro lock too

If you aim to practice and improve your skill from beginner,sub + healer is best. But you d better have a real good friend that willing to do this learning curve with you…

[jolly sierra]

got w the warrior

a sub rogue

probably the worst ive seen

i called him to use the fkn wound poison

he used insta

lose 3 rounds

leaves

xd

[mortal jay]

sigh.. frost mage, fire mage, warlock pumping consistent 60k how the crap do I come out of that lobby even breaking even

[inner tartan]

did ele get a big buff or something

[mortal jay]

not sure about last season. I know eles are a definite fotm this season

[gleaming pawn]

Ele has been very good all expansion

[mortal jay]

does fan of knives hit their totems?

[gleaming pawn]

no, you have to single target down totems

[mortal jay]

is that worth it to switch and target big ticket totems like healing stream?

[gleaming pawn]

yes, you should always be killing big totems like healing and spirit link

[mortal jay]

i have been trying. but its tedious cause it seems like they just drop it right back down. I'm sure its different totems. Surely they have cooldowns on them

i need to figure out a way to get big nameplates on them

i'm not sure I track exactly what sudden demise is saying. is it a legitimate option n pvp/arenas/solo

[waxen meteor]

I wonder if there’s a macro to kill those things by seq

Like the flags, totems, lock’s summons including obelisk

[gleaming pawn]

in theory you could have a window come up to at least click on them to assist with awareness that they are up and targeting

but it would be an addon, if not a very complex weakaura

[mortal jay]

awareness and game sense are my downfall. but at least I'm self aware 🙂 iknow how to put damage out..push 40 to 50 in a 2 or 3 minute round. Now I just gotta learn....everything else

[stoic spruce]

They got rid of totem macros in wrath

[mortal jay]

as i've tinkered with my talents I've somehow picked up fatal concoction.. thats not really a great talent is it?

[surreal barn]

Yep. Best alternative is using your nameplate profile to enlarge those for ez clicks

[last jasper]

When I was trying to remove pets plates I found out that better blizzplates by default (I believe) puts c clickable icon of specific totem on top of them. Which super easy to click and kill

[surreal barn]

I’ll have to check it out