pvp

[steel scarab]

Oh yes, that's entirely plausible

[waxen meteor]

All you need to do is survive from their CDs and you win

[steel scarab]

Right

[waxen meteor]

Because double dps don’t have much recovery

[steel scarab]

Right, they definitely don't

If we survive the burst we just win

[waxen meteor]

When it’s 1 dps 1 healer match, it’s more real games for you

[steel scarab]

Right, much harder

[gleaming pawn]

Only scary double dps is rogue/mage and that’s dependent on their mmr

[waxen meteor]

I am not saying double dps teams are bad, but outside of Rogue Mage

[steel scarab]

I've never seen that combo yet, as I said, haven't played that many games

[waxen meteor]

Most double dps team just quick farming

[steel scarab]

Is dk+healer a very strong comp though? She said she couldn't do much to stay alive, every time we've seen that

And this is with me using every disable on the DK, yet she's still dying

[gleaming pawn]

R/M is either really low rated or very high rated. There isn’t much in between with them

[waxen meteor]

DK + healer for us is okay

They don’t have MS nor good cc chain

DK + healer was quite annoying to Rogue Mage though some seasons

[humble kelp]

im at 1200ish mmr and rouge mage has been the hardest combo ive had to fight recently

[steel scarab]

Hmm

[jolly sierra]

had a rsham flaming everyone

in the match

and he ended 0-6

but ngl i hate rshams

[worthy crag]

Think I just found a bug where if rotten SoD and a builder is pressed at the same time (from a macro), the builder wont crit but still consume one stack of rotten

[jolly sierra]

@ realz

[humble kelp]

SOD?

[worthy crag]

symbols of death

[worthy crag]

huh, now its critting like it should o_o

interesting, having a modifier like harm seems to cause the bug

[fossil sierra]

whats best 2set for sub?

[open wedge]

I may have to try rogue out. I was thinking outlaw. Don’t wanna try sub cause they think they can’t die and when they do they send hate mail to you lol

[stoic spruce]

If it's unholy, disarm doesn't work that well unless it's kt and they're low.

[worthy crag]

how much of a difference that the offhand is enchanted?

rather not spend gold on sophic devotion'ing on an honor OH if i can get away with it

[gleaming pawn]

just buy a grade 2

because you don't want to miss out on procs by just having nothing

[untold remnant]

On classes like rogue or hunter that need to kite.. their totems are so annoying. Cause they actually are not enough to keep you alive when you sit in them.

The good resto shamans randomly one shot people with huge lava burst tho

[proper venture]

what are prio pieces to get in order with conquest?

[wintry dew]

Dagger into catalyst set items I'd say. You can also craft 2 items as of now so what some people have been doing is crafting head (lifebound vers + mastery with an embellishment) and infurious boots. (This items will require the pvp additional reagent in the crafting order for this season)

[cursive umbra]

whats the "go-to" sub build now that they fixed shadow finisher from evis? see a lot more run without cold blood and goremaw

is it back to just all in eviscerates?

(and sec-tech)

[thorn pond]

I go with that personnally: BUQAcWb37Z8KXj8LlE1rTPXfsBAkQAAAAAAItkkUSkQKSSICcgkkkkIlUCJlWISSCgSEAAAASIC
I'm no pro but going without cold blood nor maw sounds like giving up a lot of quick burst

[cursive umbra]

just looked at kalvish/nahj and orcrogue on murlok and the snapshot of their spec is all without goremaw and CB

[proven kayak]

Orcrogue is kalvish

[thorn pond]

Yeah looks like a lot of different builds out there. Even some with Echoing Reprimand, others with CB / Maw, others with Brew, honestly pick the one you feel the most confortable with

I think some people really don't like the delay of SecTec

But will try the one without CB and with both Tea and Deeper Strat, gotta see what it does

[cursive umbra]

yeah but both his characters i mean

just taking the snapshot into consideration but if both chars has it it seems like its not just something hes been testing 1 session/on 1 char and then abandoned it

[thorn pond]

^Totally, but I think on sub many builds work fine. Every one of them as their strenght and preferred playstyle I'd say, play what suits you

[proven kayak]

It’s simple really some builds are to cheese some are more stable

The concept of sub rogue is always the same

[thorn pond]

Exactly, cb sec tech allows for very quick powerful bursts, the one without maw or cb looks like a more constant pressure build (didn't try it yet but from what i see, without the guaranteed crits basically but more flat damages)

[cursive umbra]

sepsis.. havent used that for a while. Any techs i need to know about or when to use it best?

[exotic dove]

So far my experiences with Assa is I am killing it in both 2s and 3s right now but in Shuffle its very miserable. Damage is not the issue its just survivability. Sub on the other hand feels great in everything right now since they fixed the Shadow evis talent its rocking and rolling in all brackets and am overall having great fun with it. Even if they nerf sub a bit I feel its still solid. If they nerf Assa Im done with it in shuffle probs.

[ripe sun]

Assa in RSS is very lobby depedent

I only get ret/arms/fury/uhdk/subt/dh as assa in RSS and that just makes me want to delete the game

[wary moss]

We can atleast really dig into arms and ret. Just gotta bait out their CD's

[fossil sierra]

what talents yall use for SS for sub?

[lusty meteor]

Dark brew build we just opening sepsis - cb/st - then keeping stun lock and evis at full cp?

I want to try it instead of the goremaw build today

[jolly sierra]

agree. i hate how they insist in staying in place in such bad pos

[strange stag]

Is no stech,goremaw build good for 2s with heal ?

I would love Simple strike-evi spam build to work

[proven kayak]

This build should be better in 2s with healer

[glossy tusk]

Any advice on gearing stats if I'm looking to play all the specs equally? I like outlaw better in general and SS, but I wanna try some setup comps with friends as sub and sin and see which stick better.

Looking online, everything suggests mastery for sin/sub and crit for outlaw?

[proven kayak]

Pretty much that’s it

[waxen meteor]

I still don't understand how somtimes kingsbane hits 300k sometimes first hit, sometimes quite normal range

can someone teach me

[glossy tusk]

How bad is it to mix and match both stats? Like is mastery close to crit for outlaw or way behind, and vice versa?

[strange stag]

Is there viable build like that?

[proven kayak]

Yeah with darkbrew and thistle tea

BUQAcWb37Z8KXj8LlE1rTPXfsBAkQAAAAAAItkkUSEkSTECikkkEJSLlkElWIhEISKRAAAAIhA

I really like wow but waiting 40mins per solo shuffle is so discouraging

[strange stag]

That build is supposed to Play like assa or outlaw ? Not much burst but consistent ? Or should i only do 30 sec goes

[proven kayak]

it seems liek mreo consistant damage build

u cbna stic kon target and dont force resets and with good cd management i think can be good pressure'

[worthy crag]

assuming you crit your evis during dance+tea window it will do a significant amnt of burst

Its just theres no way to guarantee that crit and the most you can do is get crit up to a certain percentage

Which is arguably wasted stat investment if rng doesnt help you

also i feel like that build is significant worse vs orcs cuz you wont rly be able to fit in 2 evis ever without leaving a gap in stun(talkin about when sblades is on cd)

Whereas sectech and goremaw is just 2 globals for most of the dmg in the go

if ur gonna evis just once its not worth it

Basically youll do some insane potential dmg with crit + sblades thats likely higher than goremaw tech

But again, its potential

[strange stag]

What's the setup then on this build? Lets say target without trinket

[worthy crag]

sblades cheap evis shadowstrike evis

with tea and symbols ofc

its a bit more complicated without sblades

[strange stag]

Would you mind explaining ? Thank you for all info

[worthy crag]

like, do you have first dance, premeditation etc

If you have FD you cheap into evis

then two shadowstrike for another 7cp evis

but that leaves a gap if ur hitting orcs

[strange stag]

Right

If not orc then another cheap after second evi

[worthy crag]

And ur SS still kinda hits like a wet noodle cuz its a mastery crit build with less emphasis on vers

yes and then 2nd evis

I think if you have premed you can sorta just do 1 shadowstrike and do your 2nd evis after 2nd cheap

[strange stag]

Thank you alot , will check today

[worthy crag]

but you dont really take premed i dont think

[strange stag]

I hate stech but love sub xD

[worthy crag]

Personally I think its very good dmg if you have blades but while waiting for blade cd it kinda just stumbles

but i could be wrong, I think the consensus is gonna be more unified in a few weeks

[strange stag]

i see that there is a sepsis in this build, how do i use that in burst ?

[worthy crag]

I think it is taken just as a path to cdr reduction

you could press it on blades instead of SS prob, dont really matter how you use it

or use it to cheap shot something without committing dance

[stoic spruce]

ideally vers>crit>haste>mast. Mastery isnt bad it just doesnt really have prio yknow

the mast you get from tier is enough

[strange stag]

i dont see in my damage meeter if Shadowed Finishers are working for me :C but i am hittin 200k evis there on dummy

[soft dust]

Will be the guides for pvp updated?

[jolly sierra]

ended 0-6 today for first time in season

ppl just fkn died everywhere

priest almost never used dome

again another time w a rsham

monk didnt used karma

xd

[jolly sierra]

played again

won 4

[potent pivot]

ye, working on em as we speak

[visual dove]

where can i find and can someone help me with today's sustain damage, burst damage, mini burst damage rottation for assasination in arena

[jolly sierra]

shadenox in youtube

[stoic spruce]

RAHHHHHHH

[jolly sierra]

RAAAAAAAAAAAAAAH

[broken hinge]

ah yes expected wait time 18m - time in queue 30m 🙃

[maiden gull]

this game would be so much fun i shuffle q´s wouldn´t be that long

[jolly sierra]

for me the qs are fast af

dunno why

[wary spire]

Peeps are probably logged in waiting on sod to open up.

[surreal barn]

I think queue time would improve if they bring out rated blitz

[halcyon timber]

Dingdingdingding

[maiden gull]

what cr

[waxen meteor]

why is at 2000 mmr lobby people still don't know what sap is

[jolly bear]

ngl I contributed to a meltdown in the sin channel

[halcyon timber]

Rick :Th-They- they’re just robots Morty! They can’t feel Morty!

[worthy crag]

me press w me do dam

[steel skiff]

Robot: What is my purpose?
Rick: You do DPS.
Robot:...Oh my god

[halcyon timber]

XD you pass butter!

Jerry: whattya say Morty? We put on a pot of coffee get some crayons and knock this whole solo shuffle out?

Morty: I’m just gonna take Rick’s robot.

[steel skiff]

haha perfect

[waxen meteor]

Sigh

Just a bit frustrated.

Thought i could get two 60 today with sub

but all ruined

[halcyon timber]

I completely hear you man

[waxen meteor]

It's actually funny you know

Ret rushed ahead that avoid sap, but i still won r1

then at r4 or r5 i met with ret again

i went, please let me sap

he went, no problem

and he did follow

but r shammy went ahead to engage right awya

i was like ??????????????????????

[halcyon timber]

So anyway he started blasting! (Judgement flying everywhere)

[waxen meteor]

he literally rode ahead to send a dot or sth

i mean how many people i have to talk to before gate opens as sub

[halcyon timber]

rOgUe sAP sOmeThinG

[waxen meteor]

tbh i feel it's totally 60 as long as teammate just don't screw me

i am literally not asking anything more

[steel skiff]

Nothing quite like being in combat as soon as the gates open

[halcyon timber]

Its like people at target on Black Friday

[waxen meteor]

like what's the fucking purpose or sending a dot or ground the other team at gate open, shammy???

you got ret and sub as teammate

you do that like if you have mage/lock teammate, fine

[steel skiff]

I could maybe see an UHDK dotting to spread epidemic to flush out a stealthy, I guess

[waxen meteor]

Just got mad, cause i literally saw easy 60

[halcyon timber]

To make your existence miserable

[waxen meteor]

both lobbies, i started with very easy and quick 30

then people started to screw me

like on purpose or sth

logging in dh now

i have to zug a while to calm down

let me remove my brain for 30 mins

[halcyon timber]

Just remember you pass butter

Good ol butter passing

[waxen meteor]

two lobbies at DH today, none finished..

first lobby, hpal left at r3 in middle of a round. and i received first hate message today from an afflick lock, basically saying i was noob, throwing prision to warrior and cleaned all his dot, i was like dude you were at 15% and warrior sticking with you, i stunned SP and sent prison to warrior, what do you want?? does your dot work when you die?

second lobby just now, healer 05 then quit at r6

[worthy crag]

sounds like another peaceful day in azeroth

[waxen meteor]

yeah

think my blood pressure will be high today

even zug zug didn't cure me

[restive hemlock]

What 2nd embelishment should Outlaw have. Murlok.io shows most using Decay but that seems like it has to be a PvE thing right since we don't use the posion boots?

[steel skiff]

I've been using verdant conduit for the random secondary stat...the uptime is about 70%, and it's not nerfed in PvP, and all the secondary stats are useful for Outlaw

[waxen meteor]

i saw lots of specs are using that

seems a solid option

nothing too fancy but not bad

[steel skiff]

an added bonus is if there are others on your team with the embellishment, the buff is bigger

[restive hemlock]

I like it ty

[steel skiff]

cheers

[stoic spruce]

It's sporecloak but better in everyway

[waxen meteor]

ok, finally finished a zug game

feel cured

[light estuary]

any1 playing rogue in SoD? which vanilla alliance race is best for pvp as rog?

[stoic spruce]

night elf or human

[fervent cobalt]

why doesnt spsis become shadow dmg when you get dark brew?

[sharp pumice]

I'd say night elf, but feral is looking strong as hell in SoD

so Detection might actually be REALLY valuable

[worldly zenith]

Anyone have some tips on how to manage engry better. on sub and assa im trying to use symbols of death and shadow dacne and vanish but i just feel like im out of engry 24/7 and i know im doing something wrong but im not sure what it is

[waxen meteor]

what does sod mean>

[vocal surge]

Season of Discovery

It release 1hr 45mins ago

Me n this hunter both share the same pov

hating BEA

[proven kayak]

I think I’m gonna do undead rogue

For sod

[stable urchin]

sub feels kinda bonkers right now?

its been a while since i killed someone so easily in a dance

[jolly sierra]

https://tenor.com/view/hector-gif-11253742

[jolly sierra]

tell me wtf did u said

[jolly sierra]

dood for ur health

put the whispers in a separated window

so u dont bother in open them

[waxen meteor]

Don’t worry I am not bothered at all

[jolly bear]

I asked about pooling, and I said that haste felt like a dead stat. but this other guy was the reason it happened, I said I only contributed and it was a little bit lol he went CRAZY

I didn’t know you could go !pooling lol

hella people flamed the other guy though

[gleaming pawn]

The people in the pve channels always amaze me at how cringe and toxic they are when anything is even tangentially pvp. Yes rotations and talent choices can and are different, but frothing at the mouth and losing your shit because someone came in to ask about mechanics but are asking from a pvp angle is just not it

[jolly sierra]

eksdee

[surreal barn]

/ (sɒd) slang, mainly British / noun. a person considered to be obnoxious

[jolly sierra]

let me buy a corrupted ashbringer in classic like was w dinars in shadowlands

[radiant shuttle]

short for sodomite

[halcyon timber]

It does or should be as that was fixed a while ago.

[fervent cobalt]

on details its always nature

[halcyon timber]

Odd , dunno. Check the talent contribution on a dummy without dark brew then switch back to test again to see if the 10% is in effect

[spring bough]

5-1 got 3 KBs from sudden demise as sin LMAO. first 3 rounds lasted probably 1 minute if that LOL

[halcyon timber]

Don’t think its nuts when people triple your damage pve’ing an entire match / bg outside of cds. Tuning is about to happen again per the devs blue post (next week.)

[spring bough]

why do i get 2 vicious saddles everytime i cap out the reward lmao

[radiant shuttle]

reported

[spring bough]

cant even use them already have all the mounts lmao

[chrome schooner]

I got 4P on one of my rogues

holy moly

why does it hit the pvp dummy for 120k but players for 25k

[jolly sierra]

i have 4set

[chrome schooner]

we've been scammified

[jolly sierra]

and hit 60k in a guy in outdoor

[chrome schooner]

and in instanced pvp ? :p

[jolly sierra]

didnt noticed ngl

but think is even less

lol

[chrome schooner]

ye + the current builds don't spam envenom

[jolly sierra]

cuz u will have like 2 guys always w u

i refuse to go ER

XD

[lucid citrus]

im getting the same results sadge

[jolly sierra]

seriously reconsidering just go 2set

[chrome schooner]

yes

I initially said and thought

4p is good

'cause free dmg + okay stats

but the damage actually is ridiculous inside arena for some reason

so yeah

probably playing versa mastery parts is better

[jolly sierra]

gotcha captain

however i dont have spare pieces anymore, so will need to endure for at least this week using that stuff

KEK

[gleaming pawn]

someone will have to do the math then, on if the damage in arena is less than the increased damage to bleeds and poisons from using the non-tier conq in those slots

actually, can we even get mastery on chest and shoulders, I cannot remember anymore

[gleaming pawn]

so yeah, 633 mastery vs playing with 4-set

[jolly bear]

okay guys i decided to try out outlaw on my second rogue

[sharp stone]

anyone playing sepsis/ tea?

[jolly sierra]

consider vers too

[gleaming pawn]

yeah maybe, though it's DR'd pretty good at that point

[waxen meteor]

DRed mastery vs crit basically

[worthy crag]

should do a poll of sub players doing dark brew build vs rotten

[mystic shoal]

so no 4pc

easy

[worthy crag]

ridiculously low?

[waxen meteor]

I have been running brew since this season

Man the rupture dmg is really good

[chrome schooner]

mine hits 25k for 100k Envenoms

and it also just doesn't proc much since I don't play a build that envenoms overly much

[worthy crag]

so why tf does higher pvp rank still give heroic dungeon ilevel crests

i thought dueliest and above queues were supposed to give heroic level crests

[halcyon timber]

Youve been struck by a smooth criminal

[sharp stone]

which one do u play

[worthy crag]

im playing rotten

[sharp stone]

this dark brew build is piss useless for some reasaon once again out of 28 evis my top crit was 106k

second finality pnt does make 0 difference to me and my rng lol

was goremaw nerfed or whys people changing to dark brew sepsis anyways lol

[lucid citrus]

do you have 4 set?

[halcyon timber]

Need high mastery for it and it does its job well

[worthy crag]

you sure its not a stat issue? even on a vers build evis crit should hit more than that

[final kite]

They fixed crests from pvp for whoever talked to realz about it

[halcyon timber]

Yes hotfix was posted today

[worthy crag]

what a shitty night, like literal 40 minute queues to join RSS and then TWO lobby dodges in a row

by the SAME person

ughhghghghgh

like, they join, /afk right out, another 40 minute queue, them again, /afk right out

reported for deranking

[halcyon timber]

Definitely scumbagging there man. That’s uncool.

[worthy crag]

oh good, cuz i'm gonna be in deep shit tomorrow when I join raid and im like 458 ilvl, and everyone else is 470+..

i ran 0 keys since season started

Ohhhh the chests always gives whelpling crests

and the higher crests are deposited directly into my currency tab

I was looking for them in my inventory for an eternity

[jolly sierra]

dude this is fkn amazing

wyrms are good af for crafted weps

[halcyon timber]

Yeh pretty slick.

[jolly sierra]

had a very bad RSHAM in the match

which lose 2 times in a row

and did ragequit

-7

nice

fuck rshams all my homies hates them

well, ppl is not that toxic

gladly

[worthy crag]

loss of acrobatic strikes is actually so noticeable

holy

[jolly sierra]

damn

[stable urchin]

They changed to darkbrew because shadowed finishers was fixed. Make sure you are running that talent. 100k seems low i think i got up to 200+k with all enchant procs and trinket. Sepsis is just a filler, its not a sepsis build (a better shadowstrike to quote nahj)

And ofc you need big mastery for big evisc

[sharp stone]

yy i was just refering to my bad rng

[sharp stone]

also kalvish calls it sepsis / tea build so im just using the same name

[worthy crag]

What i'm still not convinced about is, why take a chance for a 200k evis when cold blood guarantees that amount with sec tech and rotten guarantees that with pv goremaw

and even that 200k is with blades, feels like the build just falls flat on dmg without blades up

[languid ravine]

glad you found your soulmate :3
Maybe one day I too will find the special someone who hatecringelaughs at Ret paladins the same way I do

[thorn pond]

I really like the CB/Maw build but still tried the brew build a bit on a dummy, and on a full go with shadowblades, etc. it's more or less on part with the CB/Maw/Rotten build (give or take a few k). On a go without shadowblades, both builds seems to be on par to damage. Sepsis does a good chunk of damages too (240k on the dummy). Even without CB, sectec does around 350k (still on the dummy). Even without SecTec and the buff to rupture, the full dot does around 400k on the full duration. Overall, the build feels nice. It seems you rely less on cds to do good damages: a go without sepsis or shadowblades is still very good whereas with maw/sectec/cb you need to have them ready to be able to put pressure. But also, Maw, cb and tech don't have a really big cooldown so

[cursive umbra]

CB is a wasted talent, just crit without it 😉

[languid moss]

Hi, how do you get the set effects in pvp now?

Conquest vendor only sells "normal" epic without the set effects

[wintry dew]

you have to catalyst the items into tier set

in this case, you have to own a conquest (head/shoulders/gloves/chest/pants, only these count for tier set bonus) or have luck in the vault pvp options

If you dont know how to catalyst: https://www.icy-veins.com/wow/revival-catalyst-guide-for-dragonflight

Also it must be a conquest item so you get the "Equip: Increases item level to 489 in Arenas and Battleground"

[languid moss]

Ah I see!

Is that something new? Thanks for explaining!

[wintry dew]

This started during shadowlands expansion season 3.
So in theory it isn't new to us since we've been getting it ever since then

[languid moss]

I see, i haven't played pvp since SL S1 so might explain it, thanks!

[wintry dew]

No worries, you really missed it yes, since we started having tier sets again during the 3rd season (on the sepulcher of the first ones raid)

And in order to ""bad luck protection"" some players, they created the catalyst

[languid moss]

Ye thats understandable

[wintry dew]

(there were players without 4/set for weeks l, even months due to bad luck)

Right now we are getting 1 charge every other week, so we got our 2nd charge this week, so you could get 2set today if you got the conquest pieces

(again, only head/shoulders/chest/gloves and pants count for the tier set)

[languid moss]

Wish I could have to finish pve stuff first

[wintry dew]

KSH/curve/20s?

[languid moss]

Ye, have to save the charges in case i get a upgrade stuff like that

[wintry dew]

Did you get 2k Rio or HC fyrakk?

[languid moss]

Ye

[wintry dew]

Because doing one of them rewards you with a free tier token

[languid moss]

Oh I have 4 set for pve already

[wintry dew]

Ohhhh

[languid moss]

But not on myth track

[wintry dew]

Yeah my bad was under the impression you had less info about the game, you a pumper then

[languid moss]

haha ye ty tho! Was just curious about the pvp part, because as i remembered there was no tier set xd

[wintry dew]

Now you know

[sharp sierra]

what time did they say they were announcing the major tuning being done tuesday?? I think its today some time but unsure

From what i read, this will be one of the biggest tuning changes being done in all of dragonflight

[proven kayak]

That not sounds good if you are rogue

[jolly sierra]

uh oh

[stable urchin]

lets hope they nerf secret technique and forget that eviscerate can oneshot

but im expecting shadowed finishers to get nerfed by 50% in pvp

and maybe 33% dark brew nerf

[halcyon timber]

Completely fine sobe lizards channel for 120k ticks on disintegrate though

Tab targeting elemental shaman or warlocks just back to smoking stuff for no reason with their demonology zoos behind pillars.

[sharp sierra]

i feel like damage is too high across the board

ALL abilities should get like a 30 to 40% nerf

or maybe bring crit damage from 125% to like 75%

i'd prefer long slooow pace games

way healther for the game

i miss 10 mins arena matches lol

always finding that window kill

now its just zug zug pve

[tribal badger]

just say u wanted outlaw deleted fam its ok

we understand

[sharp sierra]

lol nah i love outlaw

[tribal badger]

🥹

[sharp sierra]

but everything in the game hits too hard

crit damage modifier needs to be toned now

to even half of what it is now

[halcyon timber]

Pvp needs to be fast , this isn’t pve with millions of life

Certain classes mosh pit. Not a rogue problem

Kiting and cds are key yet people don’t and we end up with 50 things people can do in a stun instead of defending or calling for a team mate to peel .

Shuffle as an unbiased and randomized environment shows people don’t defend or utilize things too late, chase crap out of los of their healers, don’t off heal if they are able to etc.

[tribal badger]

ya i mean ur basically asking for the dampening meta to be back which is pretty unpopular generally so gl :p

[halcyon timber]

Dampening and taking forever to do anything and making us ineffective sucks butt.

We should be slapping and not reduced to stun bot team mate assist damage. That mentality can sod off.

[surreal barn]

The 1 minute dps trinket definitely contributes to the craziness

For classes less cooldown reliant I’d say it helps them even more

[halcyon timber]

Rogue is very cd reliant and doing silly crap to us just hurts us and helps the zuggers. People holding a life long vendetta against us because they can’t afk eating cheetos while their demon zoo mongos us down need to just beat it already.

[jolly sierra]

i dont get it

if i win 4

both mmr and CR are equalized

why tf i won just 9 CR

[waxen meteor]

I don't miss at all tbh

I think a mix of fast pace classes and slow pace classes are quite good design

like in very old days, RMP is basically run & gun, while Warrior/Warlock/Druid is trying to just slow cook you

[halcyon timber]

Not to mention lots of classes with their zone abilities, multi defense tools while stunned etc. people can stretch a match out to 10 min if they choose. Zero reason to slow stuff down because of granddad reflexes.

They aint slowing rets and locks and other W key classes, rogues shouldn’t be effed with either.

[waxen meteor]

I mean it's almost natural to be a mix of fast pace and slow pace classes

it's same in all sports or games

there are football/basketball team that are super agressive and offensive teams

and there will always be some team just doing defense and counter - attack

[halcyon timber]

Agreed a mix is good and healthy.

Same time the weird creep of things is off putting. Classes shouldn’t be “good at everything “ the pve kids push that nonsense a lot and it bleeds into classes.

[surreal barn]

Can you imagine 10 minute matches in shuffle lol

For that 9 rating

[worthy crag]

they nerfed dmg by 10% in wod and matches ended up going to like 23 minutes long

and they reverted it

[waxen meteor]

long matches are boring tbh

[worthy crag]

you cant talk about nerfing dmg across the board by a flat percent, it has an insane effect

[waxen meteor]

even today if one round lasts more than 3 min, i start to lose track of things

tbh i normally don't even look at 3 mins CD skill after pressing it once

the healing reduction thing is also to avoid marathon game i think

[steel scarab]

@sharp sierra I completely disagree with your point of view. I should be able to kill someone in a stun using a single DPS cooldown.

It is not fun gameplay needing to wait for dampening to get to 75% AND I have to cc a healer AND I have to make sure my target has no defensive cooldowns ready AND make sure their PvP trinket is on cooldown

Furthermore, I should not need a bunch of Weakauras and add ons to track all of the above bullshit to score a kill.

It is non-intuitive, unfun gameplay.

Healing is way too strong, defensive cooldowns are way too strong, and talents and ability damage not working the same way in PvP as they do in PvE leads to incredibly confusing interactions and in many cases makes optimization asinine and unintuitive

[steep loom]

Lol well, from the sound of it, maybe pvp in wow just isn't your game.

[steel scarab]

It is crazy that, as a new player, I could theoretically build a set of crit gear for a month or two and never realize that the value of crit in PvP is massively diminished because the game never tells you this

That's a dumb comment, because I really enjoy PvP, but as a pure DPS class, you can't tell me that it feels good having to line up 4 cooldown abilities and CC a healer to score a kill simply because personal defensives are so powerful and CC is so short that we can't even kill people reliably

It's insane that anyone would WANT a ten minute arena game

I remember that garbage against Resto druid + warrior back in TBC and it was cancer

[lucid citrus]

But but but this is what pvp is? You play to get rid of their major defensive cooldowns, their trinkets and cc’ing the healer..

That is the main concept for a rogue..

If you don’t like that play style, maybe try playing warrior or DH? You don’t really have to think about doing those things and can PVE things down

[waxen meteor]

For starter, can refer to this

[waxen meteor]

Trasnlating the photo into text lol

[steel scarab]

If the game designers decide that a class is going to be balanced around tracking the cooldowns of your opponents, the game UI needs to track those things for you without the need for a bunch of external mods

[waxen meteor]

In a way, I agree with this, but it seems Wow has been adapted to 'users find your own way in addons'

[tribal badger]

well knowing what ur opponent is likely to do/gameplan is is part of the skill factor of pvp tho

do any pvp games track ur opponents cds for you?

im trying to think of other mmo pvp

[waxen meteor]

dota doesn't

[tribal badger]

games that are entirely based around pvp (think mobas like league and dota) dont even do that

[waxen meteor]

but it's not mmo

[tribal badger]

why would wow?

[waxen meteor]

cause you won't get a chance to do second ult ever

in one battle of course

[wary spire]

I feel like assa's easier than law.

[steel scarab]

I mean

The answer is really easy

[waxen meteor]

Probably given the fact sin is more trained

[steel scarab]

Either everyone should have it, or no one should have it

It's insane that a person with a bunch of weak auras can go against someone without them and just have this huge advantage

Just bake it into the UI

[wary spire]

Ah fair enough.

[steel scarab]

Or make it so you can use weakauras in PvP

[waxen meteor]

In a way, it's a effort everyone can make. in another way, I do get what you are saying

I personally don't like 129302348028 addons or mods on game

even at wow, in the past, you cannot play touranement with addons, iirc

[steel scarab]

Very much agreed

[waxen meteor]

like in WLK time etc.

[lucid citrus]

You should look up Skillcapped videos, they share great information on what addons you need and other ways to improve your pvp experience

[waxen meteor]

Personally speaking, forcing the players to spend a lot of time and patience on addons (and also they expires every now and then), is not the best practice

at least for me.

I actually do not know other games that require these much addons like wow

but i don't play a lot of games, i can't judge

[steel scarab]

It's terrible practice. It makes new people not want to play.

[halcyon timber]

Gw2 and ffxiv don’t either. They also listen to pve gimps there and nerf tf out of pvp related stuff

[steel scarab]

The game should present the necessary information we've all been relying on Weakauras and addons for

So everyone is on the same page

[halcyon timber]

Takes a lot to do that and prob is a big wip

[waxen meteor]

or block them

and then it becomes total skill cap

I persoanlly don't have weakauras

[halcyon timber]

Restricting api is something they are doing

[waxen meteor]

I am fine playing at sub 2400 range

[jolly sierra]

yeah, that discorauges me a lot

[halcyon timber]

I don’t use enemy weak auras, i just like making my own for my abilities

[waxen meteor]

maybe i do need to re-arragne a lot of things doing 2400+ games

[jolly sierra]

i say, i got punished more than rewarded

i balance the mmr

and still won less

[halcyon timber]

People need to open their eyes too

[waxen meteor]

I got a complete trained lobby as warlock against double DH and a ret

that's not healthy for a fairly new caster player

[halcyon timber]

New people should be doing bgs first anyway

[jolly sierra]

haha i have high IQ

[waxen meteor]

I am fairly fine with people training me even playing caster, but man double DH is crazy

especially when ret doesn't throw anything to you

i am quite surprised because it's still a 1800 lobby

and he doesn't even enable the dmg reduction aura

[halcyon timber]

3% or reeeeeeee

[jolly sierra]

XD

[waxen meteor]

tbh there are so many DHs at lower range now (like 1600-1800)

quite easy to deal with

they don't know how to deal dmg even

then zug 247

[halcyon timber]

Not sure how dh got the ret ticket with “hit everyone hard all the time for free”

[waxen meteor]

yeah i don't know either

i think DH is actually a quite okay kill target

especially after 1min 20 seconds

[halcyon timber]

Eyebeam does 300k+

Resets meta and other jibberish

Yet rogue is evil

[waxen meteor]

well i think more complains DH over rogue these weeks

at least before sub is fixed

[halcyon timber]

Dunno, people can step off

[stoic spruce]

I really don't think a lot of people are complaining about rogue tbh

[waxen meteor]

Not even on S tier

[halcyon timber]

Dev does fist of fury disintegrates

Monk can kick you in the snout for 200k+ rising caprisun kicks etc

Rogue isn’t a problem

[waxen meteor]

Rogue's problem is just we are super noob killer

And you cannot convince people to accept they are noobs

So they will complain

there's no way out of it

Imagine some noobs to accept the fact 'I am killed by rogue 'one shot' because i am bad at the game'

it will NEVER happen

[halcyon timber]

Not allowed to do damage because w key classes get upset they had 1 min of up time doing consistent big ass hits

Feral does 350k bites atm

No one mentions that

[waxen meteor]

Feral seems to be doing some quite big dmg now

but i don't see too many of them

[halcyon timber]

Too busy whining about 50k ambush

Heck even restoration can rake convoke kill you w all the added cat power

New moon and all the chicken ape talents with zero set up doing like 250-300 k full moon

200k ish starsurges etc

[sturdy dune]

why is everybody running sepsis/dark brew? is that new goto sub spec?

[jolly sierra]

least toxic healer:

[halcyon timber]

Its just an alternative that has always existed and focused on finishers

[jolly sierra]

i was ret here btw

[halcyon timber]

Literally play what you want

[halcyon timber]

You are a magnet for finding cruddy people primo

[jolly sierra]

yeah

the guy started insulting for free

since start

cuz we didnt called target

in time

XD

but won anyways

[broken hinge]

returning to the game. is there a good general plater profile someone recommends for arena?

just encountered demolock nameplate spam - really distracting

[wary moss]

Cold blood or deeper strat for a danceless sin build?

I'm using deeper atm but am considering CB for the fat king's bane crits

[waxen meteor]

I still need help for someone to explain to me why KB first hit sometimes hits like a truck sometimes quite normal

[jolly sierra]

because the % where u use it

it gets boosted by zoldyck around 35% hp

[waxen meteor]

oh yeah that could be the reason!

[jolly sierra]

ye lol

[waxen meteor]

but tbh, it seems not a common scenario that we send KB when they are alraedy below 35%

[wary moss]

Get them to a around 50% dot them up, deathmark, shiv, KB. Dead

[jolly sierra]

yeah, that happens in late game mostly

[chrome schooner]

it's not

but when it happens it's basically a 35% hp execute

I've had it only once that someone survived this

and it was a lock (so more hp) & he had a shield

[wary moss]

Combine with sudden demise, it's so sick

[halcyon timber]

That’s illegal

[jolly bear]

outlaw kinda fun

im kinda impressed they made all 3 specs fun and decent at the same time

[wary moss]

For real, I'm so glad I'm not shoehorned into playing sub

[jolly bear]

ive come to the conclusion i cant stand playing annihilator on warrior

[surreal barn]

It’s all fun and games till we get our damage neutered 🐶

[jolly bear]

tbh if that happens whats the point of playing rogue? to be a cc bot and run around the arena cuz we cant kill anyone?

[sharp pumice]

It's happened before

[jolly bear]

people cry too much

[stoic spruce]

Bring back dreadblades

Move crackshot windows to adrenaline rush

[jolly bear]

outlaw players really dont like taking dance do they lol

[stoic spruce]

I don't play Outlaw to play like sub

The pvers like it

[jolly bear]

pvers are braindead

[stoic spruce]

But they're dumb and will crash their car if it gave an extra 2% dps increase in sims

[sharp pumice]

I don't feel like dance belongs in assa/law

[stable urchin]

Yeah i dont like it

[wary moss]

Yeah... I don't wanna play dance in sin or combat

*outlaw

[sharp pumice]

I'll play it to get the advantages if I need them but, bad decision on blizzard's part

[wary moss]

Glad sin doesn't need to take dance

In pvp anyway

[chrome schooner]

It kiiinda does

:p

[jolly sierra]

how u wouldnt take it if it does affect KB damage?

[sharp sierra]

i wonder what time they'll post the tuning changes today

[gritty heart]

Do these 2 sets have any effect at all? I see no difference

for sub

[twin burrow]

It's it's own damage profile in details

[steel skiff]

I really don’t care for it, but I recognize there are those who like the playstyle. What grinds my gears is that it’s effectively mandatory; anything else and you’re effectively gimping your dps. At least give us choices. Not a lot to ask.

[jolly bear]

oh because of crack shot

[mystic shoal]

what makes dance bad though

you literally get damage amp

and ability to cheapshot

[wary moss]

Does it? I have been doing pretty good without it. Just on remand and deeper strat

[mystic shoal]

It's not really the 'Outlaw/Combat' staple, but realistically, the spec is better with it than without it

[jolly bear]

I thought only sub got a damage amp from shadow dance

[mystic shoal]

you take Nightstalker

to get Shadow Dance

also BTE Spam in Dance is nuts

[jolly bear]

oh shit my bad I thought night stalker was the 20% movespeed above subterfuge

[mystic shoal]

naw that Shadowrunner

You get that too tho

[jolly bear]

I just looked I see it now

[tribal badger]

well outlaw used to be a "does good damage all the time while being tanky" spec design for rogue

[jolly bear]

above improved ambush

[tribal badger]

crackshot has really shoehorned it into being a "does kinda big damage during stealth, not really much damage between" spec

feels weird to be peelable as outlaw

shadowdance is like a global taunt now

[mystic shoal]

It's still tanky but

[tribal badger]

at 2150 i press it and i see every enemy cc button light up

[mystic shoal]

yeah your main windows are Shadow Dance and Vanish

and if you get CC'd -- yup

YUP

LMFAOOO

[tribal badger]

like legit

getting triple dr'd in 3 seconds on 3 different dr catagories

[mystic shoal]

Getting stunned in Dance makes me want to punch some shit bro

[tribal badger]

which just leads to winning

so i dont even mind it

but its hilarious

like actual global taunt rn

[mystic shoal]

I've swapped Sin

and it's a headache

I just wish Outlaw had Find Weakness

I'ma say this shit until it happens bro

give outlaw Find Weakness

[jolly bear]

I think crack shot during adrenaline rush would be cool

[mystic shoal]

Yeah that too

[stoic spruce]

Because if you use it for cheapshot, you miss out on a good bit of damage

[jolly bear]

probably would need rebalancing though

[mystic shoal]

oops didnnt mean to react

meant to hit reply

[stoic spruce]

Lol

[mystic shoal]

but you're 100% right

[jolly bear]

well it fits

[mystic shoal]

but imagine not having dance at all

you still miss out on a good bit of damage

so its like eh

[stoic spruce]

That's exactly the problem

[mystic shoal]

I'm a lil biased bc I'm so used to having dance since the beginning of S1, even in PVP

It was weird at first but after adjusting it's w//e

[maiden gull]

dance is good to peel when shit goes down aswell

[stoic spruce]

Because if you play around SD, by proxy, you're playing around vanish and resets

[jolly bear]

because it’s a global taunt???

[mystic shoal]

I think the problem isn't even dance

[maiden gull]

no because u can stun both dps if needed

[mystic shoal]

Outlaw could use access to more things like

Shadowdust for example

[jolly bear]

I like my answer better

[stoic spruce]

HO and Crackshot are the problem in reality

[jolly bear]

you already have true bearing

[maiden gull]

you think they will post the balance changes today?

[stoic spruce]

SD just enables it more

[stoic spruce]

Yeah

[maiden gull]

fingers crossed outlaw does not get nerfed

do they balance around m+ or raid?

Sin will get the hammer 100%

[thorn pond]

Sub too, hope they don’t burry the spec into the ground

[maiden gull]

Dh needs to get nerfed and BM, Demo

[jolly bear]

I don’t even understand how to AoE in sub for m+

[maiden gull]

then we are in a good spot

[tribal badger]

not even HO tho

s1 and s2 law did very good damage while playing defensivly

(holding vanish and dance for peel/escape)

this version of law does not

[stoic spruce]

Fair

[tribal badger]

its rlly just crackshot, and the fact that all its damage is tuned into it

[mystic shoal]

what the actual fuck are we doing here

[maiden gull]

i enjoy law far more tbh

[jolly bear]

I don’t know why they let tanks queue

[maiden gull]

then in s1 s2

[tribal badger]

tanks r so cursed in solo shuffle

because every tank does 1 of 2 things

[maiden gull]

ace proccs love it

[tribal badger]

1: its a healer (prot paladin)

[maiden gull]

the sound everything

[stoic spruce]

I wonder if there are any actually good builds without crackshot or HO

[tribal badger]

or 2 its a psuedo cc bot that lengthens the game and hardcounters physical dps (bdk/prot warrior/brm/veng)

and it just feels awful

[mighty helm]

quick question for you guys: I dont have 4p yet so cant test it myself, but do you guys cancel the "bad" RTB buffs before rerolling with 4p? I cant do conditional checks on buffs, so I was thinking that not extending the bad buffs is ok, if I can make sure that I increase the chances of always extending the good buffs. What do you guys think? Am I silly?

[stoic spruce]

Hey a good bdk pumps dps levels of damage

[tribal badger]

u cant cancel rtb buffs

[mighty helm]

fuuuuu

[tribal badger]

the problem with those tanks is they all have super strong pvp talents that basically just go "screw you physical damage dealers"

so tanks tend to hardcounter heavy physical damage specs

like arms, law and marks

[jolly bear]

if you’re gonna play a tank in pvp bdk is the one

[stoic spruce]

They fly so far under the radar that no one expects them and the next thing you know they're topping dps charts

[tribal badger]

they do heavy cleave, if u can prevent them from cleaving they arent that impressive

but they really hit 2 targets stacked extremely well

[stoic spruce]

Even in st they still hold their own

But yeah

What are you going to do, disarm bdk?

[tribal badger]

its really just offensive cause i read thru the tank pvp talents and like

they have really good ones that spread their DR to allies to make them tankier

which is toxic design

[stoic spruce]

Death Chains is so hot

[tribal badger]

but also 90% of that DR is physical DR

so its just like ???

in lobbies vs arms or outlaw or marks they r so heavily weighted

just unfun to face

[stoic spruce]

Tanks have the best pvp talents

[tribal badger]

veng has the best one imo

the stun that chains someone to you and then u can targeted yeet them

that one is 🔥

[stoic spruce]

Prot Warr Dragon Charge 🤤

That's a good one

BRM has some fire ones as well

Like an aoe CC immunity

If it yeets players, I'm a fan.

[mystic shoal]

I won

21M from BDK is absurd tho

[stoic spruce]

See?

They're good

[mystic shoal]

facts

[olive light]

As sub, what’s the correct usage of sepsis. Do I only use with symbols/shadowdance? Or simply off cd

[edgy sluice]

are sub and assa almost the same now or is there still a big difference ?

[wary moss]

Have you played both? They play quite different

[edgy sluice]

tried both today not to sure yet what i like more, just got into rogue. which is why im curious which spec would fit me more to learn the class

[halcyon timber]

Pick what you are drawn to most then build off that.

Things won’t resonate the same as a new rogue.

[edgy sluice]

okay in that case i think i'll play sub for now,. thankyou guys 🙂

[halcyon timber]

No sweat, remember to have fun

All 3 are good, don’t let people fill your head with nonsense

[tribal badger]

alot of hardcore rogues would probably so sub is the roguest rogue spec

[edgy sluice]

oh that wont happen for a while prolly, on my feral i had like a 20% winrate and now im 1200 rating haha

[tribal badger]

its still the most setup based gameplay with the least sustain damage between goes

while retaining alot of the defensive vanishing/resetting principles

but all 3 specs are decent so play what u find fun

[halcyon timber]

Yep

[olive light]

@halcyon timber you’re a pretty good sub player aren’t you

[twin burrow]

She is yes

[thorn pond]

I think someone said earlier that Nahj saw Sepsis as an improved ShadowStrike basically. Use it whenever it fits. For example, with shadow blades up, Sepsis will fill up your point so you could use it during a go. Outside of Shadowblades, Sepsis doesn’t fill up your points that much so during dance I tend to use it either to fill up the last 1-2 points I need before evis, or when dance ends to put up a dot

Still the main damage output of the build is evis, Sepsis is there as a filler because the talents fits and has its utilities too

[olive light]

My last question is, do we only use symbols with secret technique? assuming we aren't running goremaws. Is it noob to macro them together?

[stable urchin]

symbols when you dance

[olive light]

that makes sense, thank you

[stable urchin]

I macro dance with symbols although ideally you want them separate

thistle tea you definitely want separately

[stoic spruce]

WAIT

@halcyon timber youre a girl?

peak desktop setup

[echo canyon]

I've noticed that assa is playing now with shadow dance. Why is that? also when is the best time to use thistle tea as assa?

[tribal badger]

dance snapshots with kingsbane and makes stuff hit really hard

more of sins burst got moved into kingsbane and out of slamming back to back envenoms (which ER helped with)

dance is just strong in general, lets u cross CC with garrote/cheap and get strong garrotes out

[echo canyon]

just returned to wow. need to watch more vods to catch up

thanks for the insights

[olive light]

okay last question sorry. Is it bad to macro shadow blades + dance together? Thieves bargain makes it 1.33 min cd and with the vanish cd reduction it makes shadow blades up a lot. I know its probably not optimal, but is it really bad

[waxen meteor]

tbh i think thieve's bargain is not a mandatory pick this season

[olive light]

I've looked at murlok and the majority had it so i chose it, im still learning sub

[stable urchin]

Dont bind shadow blades with dance

[waxen meteor]

keep shadow blade out

agree

but it's also not that bad if you biind them together

i mean, if you do dance + symbol + shadow blade

if shadow blade is on cd, you press that key, it's just dance+symbol, isn't it?

[olive light]

Do you bind on-use trinket to anything

[waxen meteor]

with blade

[stable urchin]

I bind it with dance

[waxen meteor]

Just speaking of this week, if you are able to sap and open, and if your teammate has the sense to cc the other dps, your open should guarantee a trinket, and very likely a major defensive CD

[olive light]

I've looked at the top 3 sub rogues in solo shuffle and they aren't running secret technique and running weaponmaster instead. Why is that

i thought sec tech was insanely good

[halcyon timber]

Capitalizing on high mastery and finality etc to where secret technique isn’t as dire with the 2 set. (Tuning pending on tuesday)

• tea and all the other things that are probably likely to be scathed on Tuesday.

[waxen meteor]

wait what on Tuesday?

[halcyon timber]

Thought they said more tuning next week

[waxen meteor]

[halcyon timber]

Dec tuning inc etc

Beginning with this most likely

Warlock buffs

[vocal surge]

2 druids decided to play: "Lets bully the rogue"

twas feral boomy in a skirm

it went from Cyclone spam into me stomping both into the ground lol

[halcyon timber]

https://www.wowhead.com/news/more-class-tuning-changes-coming-on-december-5th-includes-buffs-and-nerfs-336396

[waxen meteor]

well, pvp stat?

we are always low population isn't it?

[halcyon timber]

XD

[vocal surge]

XD

[vapid ledge]

How is everyone getting their splintered sparks ? I did a bunch of pvp on my alt this week and only got 1 splinter so far ?

I've seemed to just randomly get a couple splinters every week but this one lol

[jolly bear]

i think theres only 5 rn?

[vapid ledge]

5 would make sense lol

I was a little confused because I only had 1 splinter so far this week

[jolly bear]

its 1 a week

2 weeks for a spark

[vapid ledge]

Aaaah okay getting the first spark week 1 threw me off it seems

[jolly bear]

there's a quest that gives you a spark for a splinter

[vapid ledge]

That's what threw me off lol was doing that and getting 1 last week and week 1

[jolly bear]

yup

[stoic spruce]

Has anyone here tried ER/KIR?

[stoic spruce]

Blizz has such a way with words

[halcyon timber]

Standard procedure man

Frost will rise again

[stoic spruce]

I think it is now actually

It's finally better than blood

POV: I pull you out of stealth on my DK

[jolly bear]

how many years until Frost is good again???

[stoic spruce]

Well its better than blood now and blood is good

Well

Not if my disarm has anything to say

[halcyon timber]

Not sure what they are doing w dk other than favoring unholy

[stoic spruce]

LMAO

I've never seen it put that way

[jolly bear]

unholy still has way too many buttons and set up

[halcyon timber]

Well i have zero idea other than unholy notes

Not frost

[jolly bear]

but at least it isnt trash

[sturdy dune]

is flag anygood with the dark brew spec?

[halcyon timber]

Can be, just counterable

[stoic spruce]

It also has to take talents for the spec to function correctly B)

[halcyon timber]

Telegraphed flag unless you do it sneakily

[sturdy dune]

thanks for always answering my questions lol

[halcyon timber]

We all do here man

[stoic spruce]

Dawww

[jolly bear]

idk why they force you to take epidemic

[halcyon timber]

Experiment and make it work for you is the answer

[stoic spruce]

You're not forced to take epidemic but you are forced to take 4 talents, 5 talent points for the spec to glow smoothly.

Unholy tree SUCKS

RAHHHHHHH

[halcyon timber]

XD

[stoic spruce]

I'm sad

Everyone moved to SoD and now the queues are taking forever.

[halcyon timber]

Be cooler if the moved to SOAD

[stoic spruce]

I can't upgrade my pvp gear for pve if I can't get queues >:(

[stoic spruce]

Season of a Discovery

[jolly bear]

forced to take epidemic

improved festering strike could connect to replenishing wounds

[stoic spruce]

Go down the Dark Transformation talents. That way, you're not taking 2 dead talents for one amazing talent.

3 dead talents

[halcyon timber]

Dk will get worked on after ret

[jolly bear]

ret???

[stoic spruce]

Uhm

Wut

[halcyon timber]

Ret forums are nuts again

[stoic spruce]

Lol

[jolly bear]

DID THEY NOT GET ENOUGH???

[stoic spruce]

Oh jeez

[halcyon timber]

XD

According to them no

[jolly bear]

WHAT THE FUCK COULD THEY POSSIBLY WANT

ANOTHER 500K SHIELD???

[stoic spruce]

Leap prolly

[halcyon timber]

https://the5280mermaid.com/cdn/shop/products/PippaIFarted.jpg?v=1652125607&width=1445

[stoic spruce]

Lmao

Bro I can't believe they actually thought they'd get leap.

[jolly bear]

but you give up the only route to bursting sores and pestilence

[stoic spruce]

Pestilence is bad

[halcyon timber]

They want more magic mitigation and better mobility last post i read a few days ago

[jolly bear]

when they give up bop and bubble they can have more mobility

[halcyon timber]

Auras and blessings

And prob 50 yard gunship damage

[stoic spruce]

And that holy strike damage shit

Tf is that?

Magic or physical. Make up your mind.

[jolly bear]

but bursting sores isnt 😭

apoc with bursting sores is a nuke

[stoic spruce]

You're absolutely right but look at what you have to take to get there when you could take the DT talents and have those windows pop off without 3 garbo talents.

[sturdy dune]

one more question, what should the second embellish be? the mastery one?

[halcyon timber]

Up to you man, can always reference murlok io stuff.

Mastery makes fat hits so

[stoic spruce]

Don't get me wrong, that build is still very strong but you're not forced to go that way. Which was my point.

Hell I still run something like that

[jolly bear]

sad murlok has absolutely no one going the DT build

[stoic spruce]

Do they have 4set?

[jolly bear]

which makes me think I am missing something

looks like some do yeah

[stoic spruce]

The 45 second goes are a lot better when you have 4set

Oh I bet I know what they're doing

[jolly bear]

looks like trash in pvp if its nerfed by half

like literally negligible

[stoic spruce]

It's around 9% if you stack mast

[halcyon timber]

Silk lining is solid, new secondary stats one is solid.boots are a good choice too.

[stoic spruce]

Are they going double morb/ghoulish frenzy?

[jolly bear]

no

[jolly bear]

they are not

[stoic spruce]

Where are the points going then?

Oh well

Unholy has a lot of variance in the builds so there's probably some new tech.

[stoic spruce]

Don't even get me started

And then you sound them because you got dam incoming and they

Shocker

Blink

[stoic spruce]

You know what I miss?

All Will Serve

That's such a cool talent

It's just not good :/

[vocal surge]

looks like Outlaw doubled

with players in Solo Shuffle

[spring bough]

everyone catching on to it being good? lol

[jolly sierra]

that shit turned into a meme rn

gotta save it for future generations

[spring bough]

"in certain situations" i dont think there are any that are good if youre underperforming LOL

[cosmic thistle]

played wow for 4 days doing 70-90k dps is it bad?

[spring bough]

as what class?

and spec

[cosmic thistle]

assasin rogue

[stoic spruce]

Aug/FDK was OP but we both know who they'd favor

[spring bough]

70-90k sounds pretty good for arena. during some bursts you should get in the 100ks

[cosmic thistle]

whaaat hoow

[edgy sluice]

Compared to me sitting at 40k id say ur a natural

[spring bough]

when they are loaded with bleeds and you hit tea, shiv, dance, cold blood, into a kingsbane its a huge spike

[cosmic thistle]

i dotn have cold blood or dance

@spring bough uknow a good assin rogue pvp talent tree thats really good

[spring bough]

@cosmic thistle try something like this build. can move a few pts around here or there

[jolly sierra]

u can take or not take subterfuge

if is the case take the feather talent and the imp wound one

[halcyon timber]

Feather is the jam

[jolly bear]

;/

[cosmic thistle]

holy the build is op

why only play with 5 dots tho?

[jolly bear]

what

[cosmic thistle]

5 combo points only

not 7

[jolly bear]

oh you said dots lol

dots refers to damage over time, aka bleeds and poisons

which assassination has both

I think assassination only has 6 max not 7, and I think its preference

cuz you'd have to give up acrobatic strikes and lethality for deeper strategem

[cosmic thistle]

the dmg is insane tho

[jolly bear]

you cant do damage if you cant reach them

[stoic spruce]

Assa doesn't deserve it anyway >:(

Acro belongs to outlaw

[jolly bear]

and sub !!

[stoic spruce]

And yall stop using gouge. Thats outlaws too.

[jolly bear]

I have muscle memory for gouge so no

this means all damage and not just auto attack damage right? cuz otherwise it would say auto attack damage?

[stoic spruce]

No >:(

Outlaw only!

Yall took Dreadblades too

Next you'll take blind cdr

The nerve

[stoic spruce]

All damage

[jolly bear]

good

I'm gonna try the DT build

[stoic spruce]

I'd only try it if you've got 4 set

[jolly bear]

you think all the dead talents are worth it?

[halcyon timber]

Acro is prob removed in 11.0

[stoic spruce]

Eri hush

[jolly bear]

stop with your logic

[halcyon timber]

Back to outlaw bro where it belongs

[stoic spruce]

Until you get 4pc yeah

[stoic spruce]

Yassss

[halcyon timber]

Zero reason to have it for others

Reprimand is prob gone too

[stoic spruce]

Ily bro

[jolly bear]

this is what im trying

[jolly bear]

I actually liked ER once I understood it

[stoic spruce]

Hmmmmm

One sec

[halcyon timber]

Im fully behind encouraging diversity, but not dependency

[stoic spruce]

Based

I don't remember running this build

Hm

What the hey

I had morb!

My armory lied to me

[spring bough]

some of yall outlaw should try running

dancing steel and precise in solo

its wild damage lol

[stoic spruce]

https://tenor.com/view/dumb-and-dumber-uh-yeah-jim-carrey-durr-gif-17557827642477210431

[spring bough]

3 100k lobbies all back to back lmao

116k flurry so far lmao

[vapid ledge]

Is there any reason why Gladius won't show when people trinket?

I have the trinket module enabled and even did a reset of the addon settings and it's still not showing on the frames when someone trinkets CC

[wary spire]

Man what a cool background pic

[shadow creek]

The rogue talent tree backgrounds are actually pretty good

[stoic spruce]

Outlaw untouched bois

[wary spire]

Yeah they alright.

[wise breach]

Tuning notes are up

[wary spire]

Don't like hunt or war much.

[wise breach]

Fairly minor

[stoic spruce]

Fury got love

[pale storm]

Rogue
Subtlety
Shadow Blades extra Shadow damage reduced to 15% (base 20%) in PvP combat
Thief’s Bargain (PvP Talent) cooldown reduction value reduced to 20% (was 33%)

[shadow creek]

y'all have a link? I'm apparently internet impaired today, can't find them...

[pale storm]

https://www.bluetracker.gg/wow/topic/us-en/1729075-class-tuning-incoming-december-5/

[stoic spruce]

https://www.wowhead.com/news/upcoming-class-tuning-on-december-5-havoc-dh-assassination-rogue-and-bm-hunter-336515?webhook

[shadow creek]

Thanks!

[stoic spruce]

FUCK

[olive light]

thats not too bad tbh

especially with more dh nerfs

[shadow creek]

DH & BM got some justifiable hits

I feel like they pumped fury because arms is doing so well

[stoic spruce]

I love it

[shadow creek]

making it literally an arms race

[wise breach]

Fury should never be viable in PvP change my mind

[steel scarab]

Yikes. Kingsbane and Blindside got hit in PvE, not just in PvP

[wise breach]

I mean assa is dominating logs, and while you can attribute some of that to getting fed PI and Aug buffs, it's not just that

[steel scarab]

If they reduce Kingsbane damage in PvE by 15%, does that mean it got hit even harder in PvP?

[shadow creek]

The game needs some braindead specs like DH, Fury, and BM, otherwise we'd lose a sizable chunk of our population

[wise breach]

Sure, but when you can zug zug and keep up Slaughterhouse with zero thought, it's just dumb

They shouldn't have buffed it again

[fading blade]

same in pvp

[steel scarab]

It's never good when brainless button mashing puts up similar results to another class that's forced to use its brain

[stoic spruce]

You eat popcorn with a spoon

[shadow creek]

Honestly I think it's just a curve that people land on based on their comfort zone, enjoyment, and commitment. For example I love playing Survival, but I don't have the time or patience to learn that level of complexity...but, I find BM incredibly boring, so that's out, too

[spring bough]

sick outlaw got ignored i love it lol

[exotic dove]

For Sub I am glad they left evis and damage like that alone I am fine with them nerfing that

Assa I saw the kingsbane nerf coming but its fine we will be good still