pvp

[waxen meteor]

Do most people actually read other classes that closely?

[jolly sierra]

dunno but at this step feels straight psycho

[halcyon timber]

Yeah they hop in and try to sabotage our shit a lot

[waxen meteor]

i think a lot of people is just like

rogue >>

fuck!

without really knowing what's going on

[narrow tangle]

we will have some kind of execute yay

[halcyon timber]

Yep just dingdingdingding going on

[waxen meteor]

don't think it will live that long

[jolly sierra]

that is a stroke

[halcyon timber]

Dh will get it through eyebeam just wait

[vocal surge]

ngl

They should reduce damage done by Dreadblades

its kinda nutty

[narrow tangle]

so are we super op in 10.2

am I just checkin talents rn and they look fantastiko

[stoic spruce]

If you do DB + KS you do huge damage

[halcyon timber]

Nahh don’t use that op word. Other classes are hitting hard af too

[stoic spruce]

Not Outlaw thank god

[vocal surge]

I've already done that

lol

[waxen meteor]

I will miss DTB

having 4 poison on buff column just makes me feel complete

[narrow tangle]

are they gonna remove it?

[jolly sierra]

no

but is nerfed af

if u pick the proc chance talent

it will still proc by 24% chance

compared to current iterations

[narrow tangle]

oh

[jolly sierra]

ppl here is deciding to both just run wound poison or deadly with hemotoxin, like in shadowlands

but seems like DTB era is over

[halcyon timber]

Yeh boy off to fern gulley. I dig it

[languid ravine]

I dont get the drama around Crimson Tempest.
Just have it not suck and it is solved completely, how hard can it be

[halcyon timber]

Cold af !

[languid ravine]

owo my new favourite mount

[halcyon timber]

Love that mount

[languid ravine]

is that an arctic Sabretooth Sea-raptor?

[halcyon timber]

No idea, new post

Its a dream kitty raptor

Outdoor earned or something/shrug

Fel motorcycle looks cool but i def like living mounts

[languid ravine]

half penguin half Lion

[halcyon timber]

Sick af too

[languid ravine]

neat but its just one of a hundred cat mounts

[halcyon timber]

New scarab mount looks cool too

[quaint cedar]

Lots of cool mounts this patch

Though I'm with @halcyon timber , not a fan of the motorcycle.

[halcyon timber]

Def want the raptor boy though

Might replace my fox

[jolly sierra]

the only real motorcycle

[queen geyser]

I think the gripe now is that Blade Flurry is baseline for Outlaw, Black Powder is baseline for Sub, why isn't Crimson Tempest baseline for Sin?

[queen geyser]

Wrong. No sidecar to stuff your friend into for bg shenanigans

[halcyon timber]

The side car is for snacks and grenades

[queen geyser]

And PvErs you coax into doing bgs

[halcyon timber]

XD

[queen geyser]

Otherwise known as

[halcyon timber]

Get in loser!

[queen geyser]

Bait

[jolly sierra]

rogues walks alone

[halcyon timber]

Lol like in thor . Let’s play “get help”

[queen geyser]

When the tides turn yeah but there is no greater experience in this game than doing rogueish shenanigans with a non-rogue friend

Or even another rogue

[jolly sierra]

tbh i never go with friends in 2side mounts

they usually moves by themselves

also in pvp u go by urself in stealth, unless there are other rogue, he will move by himself too

[wary spire]

I need that bike.

Also new undead mog parts are pretty cool.

I will farm ze bike.

[jolly sierra]

edgy bike

[wary spire]

I am an edgy bitch.

[halcyon timber]

XD

[jolly sierra]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7aMOurgDB-o&pp=ygUUdG9reW8gZ2hvdWwgdW5yYXZlbCA%3D

[fallow rune]

Sub better than assassin for bgs/open world?

[vocal surge]

man

rogue sucks in 10.2 ptr

wish we got

yknow

a small buff

[surreal barn]

If you’re wondering if the felsteel longblade is worth crafting

[waxen meteor]

NE girl looks good

I am gonna skip my cow Druid idea

Alliance body horde heart

also this single hand sword looks hot

[surreal barn]

Is that from heritage??? Looks nice

I didn’t know we could mog the glaive

[sour charm]

Daily: Bring Back Vendetta and give Assa some defense post

Now its time for bed

[peak agate]

Need me old school dispatch back. Our OG low energy execute. 😭

[spring bough]

hows the testing been going? havent been on since the other day

[vocal surge]

[nova viper]

Maaaan

im sutipd, help me

i can switch this on this side?

nvm i do it! xD

[marble oasis]

Why are people so fixated on how rogue compare to others. You should be focusing on how it feels this early in a PTR. Tuning comes later.

[pliant spoke]

anyone else feel energy starved with 2 points into vicious venoms on PTR?

[vocal surge]

XD

[jolly sierra]

this isnt over

[vocal surge]

XD

[last jasper]

Should try harder, mate

[wanton breach]

"just deal more damage so the game is over faster"

[minor cape]

we both chillin in that subreddit

reading those deranged posts

[proven kayak]

Solo shuffle is the biggest expose of people getting rating free out of non coordinated 3s teams and 2v2 unbeatable meta comps also exposing healers are cr inflated all those years is very funny they are the ones who gets mad

[jolly sierra]

yeah not enough

[jolly sierra]

relatable af, ccs are a myth

[jolly sierra]

its one of the funniest wow subreddits imo lol

[wary spire]

At least they're more sane than the forums.

But admittedly, the bar is low.

[twin burrow]

anyone in eastern PA want to play golf or pickball this afternoon

[jolly sierra]

what is eastern PA

btw realz is being mauled in forums

[twin burrow]

eastern PA is like compton / bedstye .. really hood place

my borough is thorough

[minor cape]

why the rework is cool

[jolly sierra]

sounds like some localized stuff

[twin burrow]

ah nvm then

[marble oasis]

I wouldn’t really be taking much notice from someone named after an anime character but that’s just me.

[thick slate]

I agree i went to solo shuffle and it exposed the conversation i had with a girl when i was cheating on my gf

10/10 exposure care when you step in

[jolly sierra]

assa pve andys:
give us more aoe

realz:
k reworks crimson tempest and gives more spread to do some aoe but nerfs IC

players:
😠

[jolly sierra]

weeb energy hits hard

[uneven grove]

why are you here???

[wary spire]

TO BE FAIR some of the aoe stuff doesn't really make sense. Like that new mut aoe talent you're not using mut in aoe, you fanning knives.

[thick slate]

Ez reroll

[jolly sierra]

well agree w that, seems like assa tree is flawed af

(still want my defensives)

[uneven grove]

good idea, can't blame you

i played rogue mostly in season1, when i heard rework is coming i got excited

assa looks fun on PTR

[wary spire]

And tier is aoe envenom, I don't really pve, but I don't think you envenom much in mob packs, no?

[jolly sierra]

emmmmmm

poison bomb

[wary spire]

Ah, right.

[jolly sierra]

but is still shit, barely hits 1600 dmg

[uneven grove]

but we won't go 4set in pvp

[wary spire]

Like most of the pvpers kek

[uneven grove]

will we?

[jolly sierra]

we are just going 2set for now tho

[wary spire]

Stats look crap. So probably nah.

[jolly sierra]

BUT DEFINITIVELY WE ARE DROPPING S2 2SET ASAP

[wary spire]

YEP

[jolly sierra]

FUCKING GLITCHED SHIT

[uneven grove]

hope the passive Exsanguinate will make it to live

that looks op af 😄

[wary spire]

Say bye bye to your energy.

[uneven grove]

i skipped s2 entirely

[jolly sierra]

u did well

but F for the elite xmog

[wary spire]

Mog is nice tho.

[uneven grove]

yeah, plus 60 energy mutilates, but the 70% nature damage on muti and ambush looks good af

[wary spire]

Ye

[jolly sierra]

its the best one atm

[uneven grove]

for 1800 rating?

[wary spire]

Yep.

[jolly sierra]

yes

[uneven grove]

i got it 1st week on my monk

then quit

[wary spire]

Smart.

[jolly sierra]

the one for rogue

i say

s3 one is shit

[uneven grove]

ahh yeah it's different now per class not armor type

[wary spire]

IS ALRIGHT

[jolly sierra]

yep

[wary spire]

Just don't use helmet

[uneven grove]

i like the s3 armor for rogue, but i am not a big tmog guy

[jolly sierra]

FUCKING MASK DOESNT MATCH W ANYTHING REEEEEEE

[wary spire]

Change to the clown one.

I don't hate it.

But yeah s2 is def better.

[jolly sierra]

i wonder how will look s3 illusion

and im skipping week 1 in rated SS tho

dont wanna meet ranks one again

[uneven grove]

tbh i am not really excited about SS anymore, cba waiting half hours

but solo RBG finally

hope that will work out somehow

[jolly sierra]

yeah im thinking in going solo RBG in that week

when i reached 2k4 w ret in s1 and played s2 in week 1 got a lot of matches w guys titled with " X gladiator" and shit like that

def going rbgs, sure

[uneven grove]

ret abuser smh

[jolly sierra]

brrrrrrrr

[surreal barn]

After getting this seasons enchant the will to push completely disappeared and it was glorious

If next seasons enchant sucks I’ll solo rbg as well

[fallow rune]

Should Sub use Gloomblade or stick with backstab?

[minor cape]

preference

[fallow rune]

What's the preference in it?

[jolly sierra]

i wanna that fkn enchant

but im waiting for season ending announcement

so i push w wheelchair again

from 1k9

[surreal barn]

Smart tbh. But right now sub does decently well against mm hunter

I used gloomblade build mostly

[jolly sierra]

rogs indeed in general does well against mm hunters

[surreal barn]

And while MM slaps they make a good partner for us lol

It’s a win win

[jolly sierra]

yeah yeah

[spring bough]

Finally got my ass of thunderlord server yesterday after trying in trade to get something for what felt like hours. Went over to Tich and got what I wanted crafted within 20 seconds 😂

I’m with the real pvp boys now 😂

[surreal barn]

Welcome

[glacial aurora]

Anyone try sin on ptr yet?

[jolly sierra]

i did, still need a healer

but im loving the stroke from new capstone

[dusky quartz]

did any of yall cook an assa pvp ptr build ?

[glacial aurora]

Sudden demise seems really cool, is it good at killing people or no?

[uneven grove]

yes, but just on dummy

[uneven grove]

i tried this

[dusky quartz]

will try thnx

[uneven grove]

tbh ambush with +70% nature damage hit really good

and helps with managing energy above 100

since it is free when it proc

[dusky quartz]

is cttc worth picking over EP ?

[uneven grove]

no clue, it will depends on if you can stay in combat with assa

or just bleed up and kite xd

but tbh just my 2 cents, but Sudden Demise will be gutted for pvp most likely

[dusky quartz]

yea for sure

[uneven grove]

if that happens you can still take 4 posions with kinsgbane and AOE shiv

something like this

[dusky quartz]

so you just take wound poison with first build

[uneven grove]

yeah

also you need to waste a point on mind numbing to get to master posioner and improved wound

if you don't have the 4 posion talent on assa

[dusky quartz]

ahh unlucky that you waste one

[uneven grove]

but posions hit like wet noodle

compared to all the bleeds

[jolly sierra]

yes

seems like bis for solo shuffle

btw ppl here are dropping DTB

procs like shit

[uneven grove]

i mean they have to nerf it to like 5% in pvp

to be somewhat not good

[jolly sierra]

the proc rate is actually 24%

to get a poison proc

if u pick DTB

[dusky quartz]

yea 30% nerf is giga

for dtb

lol

[jolly sierra]

we are using hemotoxin again

[uneven grove]

i mean DTB is for utility

not for damage

[jolly sierra]

still

[uneven grove]

how much mind numbing is nerfed in pvp?

[jolly sierra]

like by 33% or so

[uneven grove]

still a really good thing

[jolly sierra]

but reduce just by 9% overall the casting speed in pvp

better go for sudden demise and TTB

its shiv time

[uneven grove]

DTB looks bad cus there is the 2 point talent before

which only adds crit to posions

useless in pvp

since posion damage is laughable rn

[halcyon timber]

Ill sudden demise u bb squirrel

[uneven grove]

feel like if passive Exsanguinate will hit live, we can just bleed up everything then chill for 20 sec

[halcyon timber]

Its cool af

[uneven grove]

you dropping wound? i would just use wound posion with crippling

[jolly sierra]

wat

[halcyon timber]

XD es un chiste

[jolly sierra]

yeah going w hemo talent

[uneven grove]

yeah i am not complaining, love the rot playstyle, the more annoying you can be the better

[jolly sierra]

aaaahhh lol

[uneven grove]

but why would u need deadly? damage is not good at all

just use wound

[halcyon timber]

Internal bleeding is filthy af now too

[uneven grove]

true, especially with the AOE garrote + rupture talent

imagine on RBG

[halcyon timber]

Glad you guys got love

[uneven grove]

if solo RBG will be somewhat popular, no chance i am afking at a flag

gonna aoe bleed everyone's ass

[halcyon timber]

I do agree crimson tempest should be baseline w what i just caught up on reading from last night to today

[dusky quartz]

thing is no update for defensives so idk ...spec is second highest first blood rate in shuffle right now

might still be the same problem

[halcyon timber]

Do the pvers ask too?

[jolly sierra]

is still damage

[halcyon timber]

Or sre they getting boners about aoe only still?

Are

[dusky quartz]

pvers are only tunneling on the aoe aspect of the spec

feels like

[halcyon timber]

Poopy

[dusky quartz]

but i guess its justified since the spec has never performed historically in mythic+

always F tier kek

[jolly sierra]

the main issue about DTB is the proc rate

[halcyon timber]

I guess same time f aoe

[jolly sierra]

damage from deadly is still decent

and we can use hemotoxin to fill the lack of MS

[halcyon timber]

Leave aoe to harry potter classes .

Yeah was reading in here the 300 energy really gets drained by the extra bleed talents now

Which is cool

[jolly sierra]

the main issue w assa tree actually is than it doesnt have any defensives choices

sub and outlaw does

[halcyon timber]

Oh spec side?

[jolly sierra]

yes

[uneven grove]

2 feint is good af tho

[halcyon timber]

What would you realistically ask for to be unique?

[uneven grove]

and we just got improved crippling

[halcyon timber]

Because mix and matching isn’t a thing it seems unlike old days

[halcyon timber]

Yeah improved crippling is filthy af

The 10% in the class tree is actually good

People sleep on it but it actually is solid

[jolly sierra]

still needs more

like more healing received or something like that

[halcyon timber]

Yeah healing recievedthat i got was an old talent

Back in cata that was actually really well thought out

[jolly sierra]

giving us either cheat death or elusiveness for spec tree alongside class one

lol

[halcyon timber]

Huh

Like an upgrade for 10 more%

?

[jolly sierra]

if i pick cheat death, then in spec tree i can get elusiveness too

[halcyon timber]

Ohh mk

I don’t see that as a big deal

[jolly sierra]

or maybe something like another vanish dunno

[halcyon timber]

Meh something unique and not copying us

[jolly sierra]

but if it stay like that ill be still get permatrained

[halcyon timber]

There is a reason prep didn’t come back

Can’t remember why when i asked but it didn’t on purpose

Yeah rogues don’t do well into apes anyway

[dusky quartz]

they could bring this back

[jolly sierra]

they wont stop beating u if u have double feint u know

[jolly sierra]

yeah something like that

would be good

what about 2 crimson vials for assa?

[uneven grove]

nah i hate too much self healing

enough pure dps classes have insane amount of self heals

mutilate damage is now looking decent finally

this is just a 800k elite mob without any CDs

[halcyon timber]

That’s a great idea honestly, was legion iirc right?

Yeah im not huge on damage dealers healing a lot regardless of whos doing it

But things change so everyone has to heal somewhat . Encounters aren’t the way they were back in the day

[jolly sierra]

the thing is rog has one of the worst self healing in game overall alongside hunts

[halcyon timber]

This iteration feels good but isn’t excessive, especially since a lot of it is condition based and is a HOT, and it has already been nerfed several times accordingly

[jolly sierra]

tbh i dont care about which defensive could we get

but need anything to endure ppl permatraining us

[halcyon timber]

Its ok recupere didn’t heal for a crap ton back in the day either

Recuperate

[jolly sierra]

recuperate is recuperator talent from now

[halcyon timber]

Meh

[jolly sierra]

basically

[halcyon timber]

Its vial does what recuperate did but over 4s

[uneven grove]

i don't understand this

[jolly sierra]

im sure recuperate healed like crap

[halcyon timber]

Recuperator is more the improved Recupe talent from back in the day

[jolly sierra]

back in the day

[uneven grove]

how the 70% nature component of ambush

can hit harder

than the actual ambush?

[halcyon timber]

It was 1.5% or something every 3sec back in cata

[jolly sierra]

u are talented with 70% more dmg

for both ambush and mut

alongside mastery

[halcyon timber]

Pp slam

Yeh ambush is good again

[uneven grove]

like 70% more? 170% of base damage?

the talent hit more than the actual muti/ambush

[chrome schooner]

Because nature dmg isn't reduced by armor byt the physical part is

Also it's buffed by our mastery

[uneven grove]

you can talent out the +1 combo point on ambush aswell, so when it proc it is free, 3 or 4 combo points, and generating 6 energy if talented into venom rush

[uneven grove]

i have 26% mastery, seems odd that talent hit 5x more than the actual spell

[jolly sierra]

:l

[uneven grove]

this was broken af back in cata

[halcyon timber]

Yeh kept getting changed

[uneven grove]

i hate it

[jolly sierra]

the thing is as shadenox said

it bypasses armor and u have a lot of talents supporting both nature dmg and ambush damage itself

also it procced as crit

so

[halcyon timber]

Loved recupe but yeah it was 1% per sec w math. Wasn’t THAT good , you could still die easy to shit

Warrior second wind is pretty much what their bitter immunity is now

Or whatever those armored hobos call it

[halcyon timber]

That’s sick af my man

[uneven grove]

blindside or free shiv with 200% extra damage

i think free ambush is better

[halcyon timber]

Yeh 300% now w another talent yeah?

[chrome schooner]

Yeah idk maybe it's bugged in some way, but 1° the physcial part ignores armor, 2) the nature part is buffed by mastery, 3) the nature parti is buffed by Shiv, 4) the nature part is buffed by the 2p and 5) your nature dmg on your screenshot was a crit while the physical part wasn't, and so if you play lethality you get a 6) it's buffed by lethality

so

[uneven grove]

shiv is only 30 energy anyway and does shit damage regardless

[chrome schooner]

it ends up being buffed a lot

[uneven grove]

i don't mind it, just looked way over the top at first sight

@chrome schooner aren't you the assa who makes youtube videos with text explanation?

[halcyon timber]

Yessir

[uneven grove]

ahh cool, i know the name was familiar 😄

[jolly sierra]

i rlly wanna run blindside, but i become narrowed w talents actually

[halcyon timber]

Hes a kind and gentle murderer

[jolly sierra]

if i take sudden demise, kingsbane and AC i cant take blindside optimally

[halcyon timber]

What do you end up trading out primo?

[uneven grove]

it's basically a choice node, Blindside or Tiny Toxic Blade

you need one of them

but probably not both ever

[jolly sierra]

thinking a lot, im in job, would drop 5% more poison procs but it locks me in talents if i do that

[halcyon timber]

2 feints should be noticeable along w the extra small stuff as well. Thinking we can bang in the mosh pit a bit till we can stabilize

[jolly sierra]

TTB is disgustingly good with new assa iteration

but blindside seems good w the nature dmg buff

[halcyon timber]

Yeh blindside is cool

Prob even filthier w dance

[jolly sierra]

tbh i need to get into PTR solo shuffle when devs starts their tests with blues

maybe there can test the stuff

[halcyon timber]

Yeh

Dn being 5% now is nice bump too

W atrophic for a base 8.6% not including versatility and other ish

Feint active yadda yadda

[jolly sierra]

atrophic needs to be either buffed or removed

is shit

[halcyon timber]

Was hoping forvreinforced leather to make a come back honestly but this is good too

2 feints is better

[uneven grove]

it is op in raid

so they bring rogue cus they have a buff actually

[halcyon timber]

Yeah dunno, atrophic is passive and helps regardless of target where if it was buffed we would have to get nerfed elsewhere and then be “encouraged” to path it that way and it wouldn’t be fair so to speak

Feint having two charges is honestly a god send from the main man

Veil is sticking around for now as well so that’s still solid (even though takes 2 brain cells to just aoe bleed / disease/ cc through it though other classes gripe)

[jolly sierra]

doesnt interact w shiv at all and dunno will be too good if DTB is nerfed xdd

[uneven grove]

not for us pvp andies

how is movespeed for us in pvp?

we have +15% from talents

[halcyon timber]

Solid af

[uneven grove]

can we stack it further with enchants?

isn't it capped or something?

[halcyon timber]

New sprint talent is filthy

[uneven grove]

that too man

[halcyon timber]

Enchants will prob get nerfed honestly

Crafted items were already

[uneven grove]

plus u can take the 30% movespeed debuff reduction easily

[halcyon timber]

For ptr

Yeah stride is cool

[uneven grove]

assa is insanely mobile rn especially with the improved crippling

[halcyon timber]

Actually pairs up well

Yeah less waddling from laser tag arcane mages now

[jolly sierra]

seems fine in that aspect

[halcyon timber]

Dh is gonna get kamehameha as a talent probably

Wouldn’t be surprised if their fodder demon was scrapped for active healing talent as well

Hear me out, what if assassins got valeera’s will but modified obviously?

Would that appease you red stabbys?

[uneven grove]

@jolly sierra make a char on Razageth PTR if you want to test out shit later

[peak agate]

Wait, so is ambush doing decent damage. It didn't seem like that on the ptr?

[halcyon timber]

Yes sir it is

[uneven grove]

i am on PTR, just bought full s2 gear and full shit, gonna test it again

[halcyon timber]

Its an actual ambush again which is filthy

[uneven grove]

now i have 41% mastery

[halcyon timber]

Tea too for you guys + shiv would make that crank hard af

[jolly sierra]

lol im in the same server

sure, im coming back home in a couple of hours

[uneven grove]

average ambush noncrit on pvp dummy is almost 60k for me

with the posion damage + actual ambush damage together

[jolly sierra]

try it into a skirmish

i have like 60% baseline mastery

[halcyon timber]

10.2 RISE OF ROGUES actual patch name

[jolly sierra]

think u can keep getting more mastery

[uneven grove]

how 😄

i only found obsidian gear at vendors

[halcyon timber]

Gems and such and sockets from vendor

And mastery enchant is pretty pog

[jolly sierra]

crafted gear

drop ur profession and pick leatherworking

u have insta max skill and knowledge in vendor

if u are picky u can drop LW later for BS and make a dagger

(and yeah, i have full socketed gear too)

[uneven grove]

ahh crafted gear

maybe if there will be a pvp with blues i will do that

to max out gear

[halcyon timber]

Really love how they did the necklace sockets this expansion. That was cool

And combination gems again

[jolly sierra]

yeah, good af

[uneven grove]

8 ambush hit harder than 22 mutilate

[jolly sierra]

i just pick mastery/vers gems and the purple diamond

[halcyon timber]

Hope they continue that profession work moving forward.

Love to see direct damage on assassins again . That’s sick.

[uneven grove]

Feel like if nothing will change I will drop SBS for Indiscriminate Carnage

[halcyon timber]

Ambush being a nuke again. Yeh boy

[uneven grove]

i wonder if that proc from shadow dance too

the aoe garrote and rupture

[halcyon timber]

Someone was saying stuff like that yesterday and it seemed solid

Oh dance garrote too for iron wire still giving 15% too yeah?

[uneven grove]

it does

[halcyon timber]

That’s pretty filthy

[uneven grove]

[halcyon timber]

Fuggin pog

[uneven grove]

this works with shadow dance

[halcyon timber]

That’s clean af

[uneven grove]

tbh u can take dance easily now, only thing u have to sacrifice is the 3 yard auto attack range

[halcyon timber]

O internal bleeding will be sick w all that

[uneven grove]

let me see something

[halcyon timber]

Stranger things monster arms range can suck it

[jolly sierra]

internal bleeding hits like a truck rn

[uneven grove]

this is dance -> garrote + garrote -> 6 points rupture -> aoe shiv 2 times for 16 sec debuff

on 3 targets, i didn't hit any other spells

ignore sudden demise tho, one dummy was at low HP

[halcyon timber]

You got the ptr details from wowup?

Just installed as normal right?

[uneven grove]

no clue, i just downloaded the newest from wago.io

website directly

[halcyon timber]

Oh right on

I have to check it out when i get home then

[uneven grove]

i mean on RBG this will be filthy, you don't need crimson tempest, just open with double garrote, it will go on 5 people if you lucky enough, same with rupture

do this again with dance after 20 sec

then with vanish

[jolly sierra]

i wonder how much does hit TTB with AP compared to blindside

[halcyon timber]

Shiv being what 2 charges every rotating 1 min

Or 1per 30sec right?

Blindside being 20% not including low health range bonus

[uneven grove]

TTB on dummy with 4 target shiv

it's nothing imho

[halcyon timber]

Prob 1/10 should proc a blindside?

[jolly sierra]

2 charges, every of them recarging by 30s each

[jolly sierra]

interesting

[halcyon timber]

20% should be decent proc , better than my weapon master at 15%. I either get lucky or really un lucky

[uneven grove]

actually if you think about it you are rewarded if you keep your energy above 100

and free ambush which gives 3 combo points at least

is super handy

[halcyon timber]

Freakin slick thinking

[runic pecan]

Is like every assa rogue pvp guide outdated because top players have very different talents from the guides that I see?

[peak agate]

Oh ok. I was getting like physical 35k crits on pvp dummy I couldn't tell what the other yellow damage was.

[uneven grove]

don't think anyone plays assa in this season

[jolly sierra]

i did

was a torture

[chrome schooner]

There's me !

[jolly sierra]

nature dmg for assa is not bad anyways, but bleeds takes the advantage

for a lot

AND I WILL GLAD DROP MY FUCKING TIER FOR HONOR GEAR IN S3

fuck that shit

[runic pecan]

Got go 2025 in solo shuffle with assa, feeling kinda proud xd

but dropped a lot now again

[jolly sierra]

congratz u played one of the most underrepresented specs in SS rn

dont bother too much w dropping, we have everything against us right now as spec

[runic pecan]

O shit its shadenox

What do you think of deeper strategem if I may ask

[uneven grove]

forget posion damage and shiv damage 😄

it's ass

[jolly sierra]

oh shit is Shadenox Assassination from YouTube

[runic pecan]

and im a fucking undead, dont have money for a faction change haha

[jolly sierra]

oof

[uneven grove]

UD is best race anyway

[halcyon timber]

They should disable old tier right away to avoid tuning nonsense. So we don’t pay for the warcrimes of prior seasons

[runic pecan]

Eating lesser races is great 😎

[jolly sierra]

or just disable all tiers for pvp

[halcyon timber]

bUt MaH pARSe

[jolly sierra]

REEEEEEE

[halcyon timber]

Dingdingding

[jolly sierra]

DINGDINGDING

[uneven grove]

Touch of Grave still fcking break stealth???

man...

i cba

[jolly sierra]

yes

[jolly sierra]

blizzard hates both assa and undeads

[peak agate]

Racials should just be disabled in rated pvp

[uneven grove]

^

[last jasper]

Can confirm. Ud - master race.

[jolly sierra]

so wont bother about fix that shits anytime soon

[runic pecan]

Should just rename to Master Race from undead

[jolly sierra]

and yeah who tf cares about 2set if is about to be replaced in s3

[halcyon timber]

New forsaken heritage gear looks sick afffff

[last jasper]

We live in a tolerant world

[last jasper]

Haven’t notice this actually

[halcyon timber]

Pp kick spike boots for internal bleeding

[uneven grove]

i just put bleed on 3 dummy, vanished

it broke in 3 sec

same after 2 minutes when I tried again

totally forgot this exist

[halcyon timber]

Fuggin a

[last jasper]

It’s might assa feature 😂
Never notice as sub.

[uneven grove]

well only rupture can proc it for you

if a dot proc the UD touch of grave racial

it breaks stealth

[halcyon timber]

Why isn’t it changed to direct attacks then?

[last jasper]

Oh. Rarely press that hotkey lol

[halcyon timber]

Isn’t that how the void elf version works?

[jolly sierra]

assa 2set pulls u from stealth too

[halcyon timber]

nO onE cArEs ABouT pVP , iTs a mInI gAim

[last jasper]

The only thing that break vanish is my guy always wanted to swing after vanish, so u need to spam stop attack

[halcyon timber]

As they get butt effed in front of their precious raid

[peak agate]

This shit is so annoying I just made my self mastery/verse pieces to replace it.

[jolly sierra]

eVEn pVp peT baTTleS arE moAr rELevanT

[halcyon timber]

i Jusat wanTed mY warMode bOnUs

[jolly sierra]

why the rogue do that to me REEEEEEEE

[halcyon timber]

XD

El oh el

[uneven grove]

s3 set for pvp is underwhelming tho

[halcyon timber]

That’s good, wont result in gutting core kit

[uneven grove]

15% AS and nature damage is meh, 90% of your damage is bleed

[last jasper]

Just watched Venrukis video. Assa tod looks good 😂😂

I like it. I might give assa a try lmao

[jolly sierra]

yeah but the nature dmg buff from 4set is still very good

[halcyon timber]

wE FOund ROGuE dOes dMg SO we FiXed ThaT - pvp notes

Rogues are effective at unaliving people , more news at 9 jim

[uneven grove]

anyone doing skirmishes from here on PTR? 😄

[halcyon timber]

Not atm, watching art videos xD

[jolly sierra]

can try later

im still in job

[halcyon timber]

Got hw to do too

Planning on remaking my ui and setting it up as weak auras as a project

Want to enter the student art contest later this year and try snag a scholarship from it if possible

[runic pecan]

Do you guys prefer cheat death or elusiviness*?

[jolly sierra]

elusiveness w double feint

[halcyon timber]

Elusiveness all day

[uneven grove]

with 2 stacks feint will be the go to now

i am 99% sure

[halcyon timber]

Active mitigation over rng dying to aimed shot anyway

[runic pecan]

defo yeah

are you running dismantle cloak and smoke bomb?

[halcyon timber]

All day every day boyyy

Dfa can be nice too though won’t lie

[runic pecan]

its really fun yeah

[halcyon timber]

Avoiding cc and the 15% bump does hit hard with our new talents

[jolly sierra]

smoke bomb/hemo/cloak, disarm or dfa

[halcyon timber]

F uuuuu mortal coil!!!

F uuuuu stormbolt!!!

[jolly sierra]

im not using dtb anymore

bah

[runic pecan]

is hemo still worth it 🤔

[jolly sierra]

yeah again with DTB nerfed

[runic pecan]

Oh are you all playing the ptr

[halcyon timber]

Yep we live here now

[runic pecan]

Is assa fun in 10.2?

or good

[jolly sierra]

seems good if u are getting strokes from sudden demise

they are insta and unreactable if u met the criteria

imagine that in SS

[runic pecan]

wait hahaha the dots insta bleed out if under certain percentage?

I havent really read any notes

[jolly sierra]

if u met a criteria by doing twice as total remaining HP from target in active bleeds u make that amount in damage insta

that works very well w active exsang effect

[runic pecan]

That sounds fun

Should probably hop on ptr

Could you give a build to use in solo shuffle or something?

[jolly sierra]

emmmm

sec

[uneven grove]

imagine if Touch of Death would work like that too

insta

[jolly sierra]

https://www.wowhead.com/ptr-2/talent-calc/rogue/assassination/DANFVUVBVBUVViRFCARNVURUUSZQRFiUQCFU

shadenox baked this one yesterday

[jolly sierra]

how many times ive missed tod cuz the guy was way too far away lol

[runic pecan]

ooh thanks

[jolly sierra]

np

[uneven grove]

i didn't even think about picking echoing reprimand tbh

it is probably better than coold blood

but not better than shadow dance

[jolly sierra]

we are still in testing phase

so maybe ER will be removed who knows

also no fkn way u are forced to pick athro/numbing to pick more effect in non lethal poisons

even if u are not using those poisons

[uneven grove]

https://www.wowhead.com/ptr-2/talent-calc/rogue/assassination/DAOFVUVFFBUVQmJBQCAENVURUUWJQUEiUUCEU

this is what i find the most fun so far

[jolly sierra]

wut

no way, we are using crafteds there

[fallow rune]

Best pvp talents for battlegrounds?

As sub rogue.

[languid ravine]

duel, midnight, smoke bomb

[jolly sierra]

no

its life giving stuff with versa/mastery

[iron ravine]

Hey yall! New to the server and newish to rogue. Out of the 4 listed talent builds on the server, what do yall recommend for 3v3's?

[midnight bough]

im having such a bad time as sub on shuffle, im not the best player but i play low rating (1.4k) and i feel like doing tons of cc, following dr, playing by "go" and not just randomly using my cds. but I feel too much relient on my teammates compared to other classes i played with (dk and monk i climbed to 1.8 in few days)

anyone can share their expirience on sub in shuffles just to know if its just me, or not?

[languid ravine]

it doesnt get much better at 1.8 cr is all I m saying :^)

[jolly sierra]

pain

[halcyon timber]

yeah it ain't easy, kinda just locked into DR hell in shuffle and kinda don't really do damage until you do and then catch a lot of REEEing about it

vault currency x 6 and you trade it to the drakonid guard right there and you can add it that way

no sweat man

[spring bough]

is it november yet? ready for this to be live lol

[halcyon timber]

yeah seriously, far better than live

[spring bough]

lets make this a retroactive patch second its ready it just goes live lmfaooo

they owe us lol

[halcyon timber]

really crazy how a few mechanical changes and inspiration from older expansions really changed up our stuff

[spring bough]

having that burst finisher is so nice for outlaw. doing tech type damage lol

[halcyon timber]

super thankful our man took all feedback -> used old expansion stuff --> put a modern spin on it and good lord it is engaging and fun.

I'm really happy outlaw is strong, no reason for any class / specialization to just be "fine"

[surreal barn]

Anyone on test realm for me to test an opener

[halcyon timber]

I've been Subtlety since the beginning and it's the only way i'll be but really happy to see friends enjoying themselves

really happy the pendulum shifted a little as he said and you realy can choose diff stuff to customize more

[midnight bough]

exactly

[halcyon timber]

if no one is cc'ing and a mosh pit is hppening I attack the healer and look for cds to be traded and kinda take it from there.

it's more about adapting and kinda just go with what you're given at the time

like jackasses still trinket saps in 2023 , use that to your advantage as an example

or people using adaptation for whatever unearthly reason

[surreal barn]

Damn

[spring bough]

what realm you on i can hop on

[midnight bough]

its still crazy, i had a match where i instantly removed holy pala bubble and bop had a full control on the fight and still loosing because people are running around like chickens and i burn all my cds because external apperently beraly exist on shuffle low rating

[surreal barn]

100-0 before even sectec went off

[surreal barn]

Vyranoth

[halcyon timber]

yeah swap on sac / bop against paladins and interrupt Tyr's deliverance as much as you can

If some nerd is using blessing of sanctuary then you're in for a rough match regardless

[midnight bough]

its funny how good you have to be as a rogue to push, i swear i got 1.8 on my dk and monk in 2-3 days

and rogue i get stuck between 1.4 to 1.6

[halcyon timber]

it's definitely rough, not all sunshine and stabbing as other classes like to think

[spring bough]

whats your char name i just got on i will head to valdrakk after gearing

[midnight bough]

ye, i love rogue coming from m+ enviorment but its making me thinking if that level of difficulty is ok for me on pvp

[surreal barn]

Deadguys

[halcyon timber]

yeah just keep practicing is all man

more patience and thinking goes into it

especially w nonsense like precognition existing, have to be really slick w stuff

[jolly sierra]

i'll log in ptr later

there are a lot of gold world quests

2 from wpvp and the one from ohn'aran arena circle

[glacial aurora]

Could u explain wym?

[halcyon timber]

It feels a lot more complete with the changes to Shadow Techniques and Shadow Blades

• Blades is 20% but affects all abilities and fills combo points which makes it actually feel like a good cool down where you feel excited to use it.
• Shadow techniques is solid but takes a little playing around to adapt to but it is wayyyyyy better than on live. It stores combo points with generators. Say you get 3 ST procs -> your next generator generates 3 additional CB pts and it feels far more deterministic because you can use it WHEN you want instead of hur hur waiting on RNG to get going.
• we have a lot of new talents and reworked talents that bring back the planning and precision feel to Subtlety where generators feel impactful and CDs are actually solid. haste also doesn't feel like trash because of how the mechanical changes to these abilities played out.
• Sepsis and flagellation feels solid on ptr depending on how you chain your stuff, shadowstrike feels great, abilities are overall stronger and less reliant on extra cd's like secret technique to feel impactful.
• Goremaw's being back was huge to me as it gave a lot of punch, allowed for nice planning or aggression and gave 3 finishers. There are a bunch of builds you can do and they all really feel solid. But you don't "have" to use any of the extra stuff per say and can include or exclude what you don't want to emphasize on instead.

Older expansions utilized the full kit of Subtlety and it is beautifuly done in our tree.

• Generators don't do noodle damage if you want to emphasize on it (feels great and is my preferred style of stuff)
• Plenty of cool finisher focused nodes (very good like the old days.)
• new sick talents from class tree that help all rogues survive, evade, and reengage when you want.

TLDR: The soul of Subtlety feels like it is back and CDs aren't the "main hero" and instead feel like solid additional abilities you can use to get the job done. You aren't fooling around waiting on burst donkey nonsense and have agency to how you want to fight.

Tuning will happen as it should but the CORE kit of Subtlety really feels solid again instead of gimmicky.

[twin burrow]

u can run 2 covvies and an artifact ability in 1 build

[halcyon timber]

Right and that is a choice a player can make which is cool

If people want to have a bunch of CDs then cool as it is up to them, same time core kit doesn't suck ass like last 2 seasons and that feels absolutely great.

no one should be tuned around people cd stacking, that was the player's choice to do so and should be responsibly tuned instead of making everything piss poor (ex: season 1 tuning and part of season 2 until the incremental changes over time happened). Additional abilities aren't the "main hero" any longer and the pendulum was nudged in the opposite direction and is beautifully done by Realz and his team.

[unique bramble]

Yo this was a great read, thanks for writing this. Can you do one for assa?

[halcyon timber]

I appreciate the kind words but I'm only Subtlety, I would ask Panda or Shade on their thoughts on it.

Adoring Fan or Bandit are 2 Outlaw rogues I truly trust as they are very solid too

[unique bramble]

Compare ptr sub to a previous iteration of sub pls. E.g mop sub

Which is it most like or not like any of the previous iterations

[halcyon timber]

I'd say it's combined over all of the iterations and has precision , power, and planning built into it beautifully.

Reminds me of Mop / Cata + pre legionish

[unique bramble]

Woah. So you’re saying it’s the best iteration of sub to date? Aside from tuning

[halcyon timber]

Best is subjective

[unique bramble]

Yeah what’s your op

[halcyon timber]

I love it hands down

I absolutely love it

and I'm a big " i love smashing backstab" type guy

Core abilities are worth it and to me THAT is great

additional stuff like reprimand is an accent to rogues instead of a "defining" piece if that makes sense

[unique bramble]

Do you think the new ptr sub is able to play with more specs now? Or still only boomkin , hunt & mage ?

[fallow rune]

How does Premeditation work?

[halcyon timber]

I think it will revolve around coordination and being smart but it isn't zug fest

premeditation is the same as on live

[fallow rune]

I'm not getting any slice and dice after using Shadowstrike out of stealth.

[halcyon timber]

first strike will grant snd and second strike while active will grant 2 more cb pts

kinda like control is king if you play w that (cheapshot grants slice)

[fallow rune]

Ah, so Shadowstrike, Cheap shot, shadowstrike.

[halcyon timber]

well always try to stun your target first but yes that is an example of how it could work

MFD is effing sick on PTR too , def say it is competitive w 7 cb pts

[spring bough]

dueling against a sin rogue. second i hit 35% every time i instantly die

240k 220k GG

[jolly sierra]

yeah is both u dropping him to 0

or is bad ending

[spring bough]

not hitting any CDs just testing it out

its wild to see lol

[jolly sierra]

ah

try a real duel now

its a glass cannon dont worry

[potent pivot]

going to have to wait for the season to start for stuff like that imo

[spring bough]

its just funny seeing that 200k every time lol

[fallow rune]

Anyone got a good burst macro for sub rogue?

[spring bough]

as outlaw getting the crit % RTB before opener makes BTE crit 100% of the time is crazy lol

[surreal barn]

What I don’t like is saving combo points during symbols, you want symbols during your burst with shadow blades and really don’t need any combo build up during that time

I mean you get all the combo gen you need from blades alone

[halcyon timber]

I like that talent honestly as blade's won't "always" be available

but yeah I get what you're saying

it's definitely a big improvment over last season

[surreal barn]

I feel like it works more with a front loader build

[halcyon timber]

That makes sense, however damage being frontloaded so heavy in these past 2 seasons runs us out of gas quick

[potent pivot]

for which spec? there's multiple builds for each

[iron ravine]

Sub. Sorry realized that they are all listed

[halcyon timber]

the st changes were to prevent overcapping and allow for planned play. SHT is smooth now and it feels freakin good. Sht from before was clunky garbage that needed a resurrection and realz nailed that out of the park. Shadowcraft is nice becasue the CBs can be stored and used for finishers as advertised where I'm not a fan of macabre and that's cool to get similar results while not "having" to play the same way.

[potent pivot]

i personally prefer the first 2 listed

one focuses on playing around rotten and vanish CDR, the other one doesn't. the 2nd one can be a little easier to learn the basics on imo.

[iron ravine]

Awesomne!!! thank you!

[midnight bough]

can anyone help me understand, im 1290 rating and won 5 out of 6, why i got only 3 rating points

[surreal barn]

Your MMR was lower than your CR

[midnight bough]

if it helps

[surreal barn]

You probably lost the last couple games before this 5/6

[midnight bough]

oh

[jolly sierra]

u had a bad streak

and just fixed it

[twin burrow]

assa seems better tuned then sub, hows outlaw feel?

[halcyon timber]

Lots of tuning has already been confirmed by realz, don't get hung up on it my man

[jolly sierra]

DTB DTB DTB

wheelchairs looks more lifeless in next season

looks more like wheelchairs actually lol

[halcyon timber]

yeah boy looks like knights of the round from ff7

hat actually is pretty cool, it will be even more meaningful to stab them now.

[twin burrow]

too late, literally bet my friend 100 doge assa will be it. welp

its only like 6 bucks, i can make more bets to get it back. next class- tinker

[halcyon timber]

wouldn't sweat it, it's getting tuned

[halcyon timber]

"Lord Farquat! He huffed and he puffed and signed the eviction notice!"

[thick slate]

There isnt anything more satisfying, than DFA'ing all of a mage's dbs in a duel

like my god

that guy was mad

like

why am i so insane

[fallow rune]

Shadow duel or disarm for random bg's and world pvp?

[vocal surge]

anyone need a test partner in PTR?

[thick slate]

disarm ? bro what

its a duel in durotar

1v1

[fallow rune]

Ye, Dismantle.

[thick slate]

yeah i know what it is

but why would i disarm a mage

[halcyon timber]

That’s up to you in what you feel is best fitted for your kit at the time man

[thick slate]

Oh thought that was a reply to me hahaha

my bad

[halcyon timber]

Crap ton of melee > dismantle

[fallow rune]

What about Gloomblade?

[thick slate]

i'd say shadow duel nets you more usefulness

you can do nice plays with it

[halcyon timber]

If you don’t care about generators then you can skip it

Duel is a multi purpose tool as well

Just be mindful you can still be aoe stunned / ropped in it etc

[fallow rune]

5 seconds just feels like such small time for a 2 min cd

And its costs 50 energy

[halcyon timber]

Yep

It’s up to you man, find what you like and roll w that

[jolly sierra]

"the rogue has fallen in love with the rework"

[jolly sierra]

to avoid him casting duh

[thick slate]

[halcyon timber]

Back in the day dismantle did lower caster damage

Dismantle does lower armor on shielded targets though

Also works w prey on the weak still

[thick slate]

yeah but barely noticeable just for that imo

[fallow rune]

Havent played for sub for years, but friend wanted to do some bg's again.

So looking for the most suitable pvp talents for bg's and world pvp.

[halcyon timber]

That was when he was mocking shrek for loving fiona in the court right?

[jolly sierra]

yes

[jolly sierra]

that guy hyper was a genius then for disarming mages between rounds

[halcyon timber]

XD freakin a

[halcyon timber]

Actual paladin players talking ish to everyone

Should make that into a paladin meme template for when they ree

[jolly sierra]

ret main calling other people for doing no damage or chastising for running out of defensives

[halcyon timber]

Wut DO u mEan I dIe aFtaer DIvIne ShIeld?

[jolly sierra]

dEfenSivES?

then u say "yeah where was the bop"

[languid ravine]

what do you mean after divine shield? I thought before divine shield

[halcyon timber]

Defensives? Never heard of her - ret

[jolly sierra]

the guy says "lol u bad l2p kekw"

if u ask them for bubble

when they have no abs and didn't used it

then is bc the monkey used another ability

in that 1 sec momentum

before dying

consuming the gcd

[halcyon timber]

Yeah all singlet target abilities also aoe ! We need buffs - ret + demon hunter romance

[jolly sierra]

hope the rework consists in having dh being deleted as class

reworking fkn game

[halcyon timber]

They are gonna be line cooks at applebees when they find out they have to use 4+ buttons

[jolly sierra]

in my server saying "dh just have 2 buttons" is a common meme

and sometimes even leaps some dh excusing themselves about that lol

[halcyon timber]

“Don’t have to use blur if i kill an entire team first”

[jolly sierra]

lol u bad u lose against my 2 button rotation

[halcyon timber]

We need self healing! Literally heals by smoking people and silly crap like the hunt doing 40k ticks and 30% leech with 20% dr from having prison tattoos

[halcyon timber]

EYe bEaM sUcKss (does 250k with it ) xD

[jolly sierra]

is not enough with that necro cov ability they kept?

[halcyon timber]

Hobo portal fight?

Yeah that thing should whoop their ass

[surreal barn]

Vader force grip and throw gonna look great on DH

[halcyon timber]

Yeah shit is cool honestly

Thought that was for vengeance only though

[jolly sierra]

tbh

would be cool

if illidan grasp

would work like an strangle and kept the target rooted and with an animation grabbing the target by the neck

[halcyon timber]

Vader stun is lightning lasso now

[fallow rune]

What's the good use for feint?

[halcyon timber]

Does a crap ton of damage

[jolly sierra]

enemy cds countering

[halcyon timber]

Anytime you suspect youre going to be street pizza

[jolly sierra]

like when a warr uses colossus smash

and u have nothing

[halcyon timber]

Yeah feint and kite like a mad man and pop that Gatorade vial open really quick

[jolly sierra]

prefeint a sub using shadow dance tho

or when u are the kill target

and both dps are training u

[fallow rune]

Did rogue get two Evasion?

[halcyon timber]

Nope

Just veil of midnight gives a secondary small one now

Instead of from stealth

Can still be dotted through wnd stormbolted etc . Not a big deal

[fallow rune]

Huh, we dont use Marked for death?

[halcyon timber]

Whirling pp punch and filet o’ fish slaps will hit you too (aoe abilities)

Not strong enough till 10.2

New mfd is nasty

[fallow rune]

How does it change?

[halcyon timber]

40sec cd, fills all cbs, target takes 15% increased finisher damage from you for 15 sec i think

It’s close damage to having 7 but falls short a littleeee but that’s a good trade off

[fallow rune]

And Slice and dice, do we use it or is it better used on Eviscerate ?

[halcyon timber]

Like old premed slice back in the day?

You “can” but premeditation (if talented) already grants slice for 10sec on first strike

Slam eviscerates into people’s eye sockets all day

[fallow rune]

Oh not premeditation but actually using combo points for it.

[halcyon timber]

Oh , snd is as needed

Typically you maintain slice really easy

Has a small pandemic window in it like rupture (will overlap 8 sec and add it to existing snd)

[fallow rune]

What makes some use Gloomblade or Backstab?

[halcyon timber]

8 or 6 whatever

Gloom just ignores all armor , gives fw from any angle, and does decent damage

Backstab does 20% more from behind, only applies fw from behind and is weaker but its up to you

[fallow rune]

Usually is hard to stand behind them unless they're locked down.

[uneven grove]

bro even DFA, so much spells to press on rogue i swear 😄

[halcyon timber]

In the patch dance is 1 talent pt so you can get a little more stuff

Dfa is filthy

People sleep on the 15% but a cb dfa can slap especially with flag

[halcyon timber]

Yeah have to dance around a target a little with backstab like the old days

I tend to strafe a lot anyway so they have to keep turning into me. People cant dodge from behind (except for dh)

[jolly sierra]

dfa is funny af against the druid ursol vortex

u leap, get dragged, then move back to target

[halcyon timber]

Druids when you dfa vortex

[jolly sierra]

XDDDDD

[halcyon timber]

Gawwwwddd daymitttttttt

Reeeee

[uneven grove]

ahh man i might resub now with the epic edition upgrade

and gear up before 10.2

[sour charm]

DfA should just be baseline

[halcyon timber]

We asked but pve kids reeed

[uneven grove]

tbh we could say this for like 70% of the pvp talents

[halcyon timber]

We kept requesting bomb too but its ok

Choices gotta be made

[uneven grove]

imho current design of pvp talents sucks

but what do i know

[sour charm]

New sprint talent shoulda been manu erability

[halcyon timber]

New sprint talent is clean

[sour charm]

And yes, Bomb baseline would be great

Not saying it isn't. Just saying that being stuck in roots and slows kinda sucks

[halcyon timber]

Old maneuverability didn’t stop us from just being rooted again / dog humped by a hunter though xD

Was nice but yeah

[languid ravine]

Wind walker at 2k cr: facetanking a Ret paladin for 2 mins straight, probably doesnt even ask himself why he died

[halcyon timber]

Unbreakable stride is nice though when paired with other stuff on ptr

[halcyon timber]

Whattya mean I can’t trade in the paint with a ret? Buff my 5 defensives blizzy

[sour charm]

I also still want Prep back for every spec but that is never happening FeelsBadMan

[halcyon timber]

Karma is what? 130% now
Dampen harm 70% on stronger attacks i think
Fort brew
Other stuff?

Yeah prep was asked about but wasn’t in the cards

[languid ravine]

I think dampen goes up to 50% less damage taken

but imagine you just Port out of the fight for 100% less damage taken

[halcyon timber]

People sleep on Jade serpent statue too

Shit heals a lottttt

[sour charm]

Statue gameplay is absolute cancer however

Fun to cheese duels with

[glacial aurora]

Anyone try AOE kidney yet? Is it busted or no

[sour charm]

I assume its highly situational

Matchup/lobby talent

[halcyon timber]

Its fine but will get tunedhard if it goes live

[sour charm]

But it allows you to easier set up for yourself in melee lobbies

[halcyon timber]

Wouldn’t expect secondary kidneys to be more than 2s at most if it makes it

Yeah it is very nice qol

[glacial aurora]

Also goremaws being g bsck is so amazing I've been waiting since legion lol

Will never forget the one shots with old weapon master

[sour charm]

Speaking of stuff that isn't staying: Assa Demise being a 35% auto execute

It is really funny tho

[languid ravine]

classes having better healing totems than shaman: monk, resto druid now has a tree totem

help me team

any other classes?

[sour charm]

What do you mean, shaman totems are great and basically immortal

Because I press mutilate twice on one, it still lives and I am now energy starved

[languid ravine]

really

I think if mortal strike crits a healing tide it is gone

not sure, might need two GCDs instead

[sour charm]

Yeah I was joking about current assa not killing totems whatsoever

Other melees just smack them tho

They have good healing though if people don't kill them

So its kinda hard to balance

Make them tankier? Then their throughput has to be lowered in pvp

Which also feels bad

[languid ravine]

priest no longer has a lightwell do they?

imo give all totems a Dampen Harm effect and reasonable healthj

so they dont flop instantly to a big hit, but two or three smaller hits still get it done

[sour charm]

Still, my two biggest issues with the rework are: lack of defensives and no dispel protection.

Anyway, time to pass out. And I like the dampen idea for totems

[halcyon timber]

Yeah love goremaws, i asked several times about it lol. Had a lengthy discussion about how it could fit and so glad it is back. Definitely a playstyle preference

Yeah double healing tide is annoying af

Especially when they blanket you away with static dog fence totem

[peak agate]

I read a suggestion of cdr for death mark if it's dispel. I like that.

[halcyon timber]

It might get a “marked” feature where you can just reapply it regardless

Like they have the debuff on them even if it gets wiped but you can just reapply it again

[peak agate]

That's a good alternative as well.

[halcyon timber]

Yeah realz talked about that as a possibility

Which was solid

Not sure how assassins execute is gonna be worked in but i hope it stays for you guys

[uneven grove]

ret can bop karma, rogue can cloak karma, like it is nothing, dampen is 20 or 25% wall

[peak agate]

I don't count on it. That's why I rather just old dispatch back. It's less oppressive.

[halcyon timber]

Force cloak first

Not “that” easy but yeah or karma other targets that can’t

[halcyon timber]

Right on man

What did the old one do again?

[peak agate]

330% weapon damage at 35% and below or something like that

[halcyon timber]

Could just slam at x right?

Yeah that’s what i was fuzzy on

Ambush doing 70% additional as nature is kinda like that no?

Not including shiv and everything else tied in

[peak agate]

Yeah.

Ambush needs the "ummph" so I guess it works out for the better.

[halcyon timber]

Glad to see ambush work in a unique way for you guys

It’s pretty sick

[peak agate]

Yeah other wise it's Ass(pun intended) I think it should also get a stealth modifier but I'm thinking for thematic reasons and less DPS

[surreal barn]

The amount of binds that I might have to have is frightening

I hope they throw away some shit lol

[peak agate]

It's not as bad as let's say a resto shamen. That shit is rough for me lol

[halcyon timber]

I mean binds are only as complex as we want to make them . Ie builds and choices

Shadow craft doesn’t need to change, just pve propaganda . Shit works real well

Makes generators fuel for finishers and finishers consume extra sht for finisher damage

Not hard to understand