pvp

[tribal badger]

now im bored of it, might just try my warrior

its a dec mog

i was trying to decide between arms, unholy surv or feral to try to get it

but arms seems the easiest honestly

[jolly sierra]

yeah

the dumbest and the most rewarding items wise

[tribal badger]

its honestly decently fun to play also

most mobile of the plate bois

just zug zug around the map

[jolly sierra]

i was thinking in naming it Simp or Mesmash

[quaint cedar]

I still don't understand how warrior is just allowed to be S tier forever and never get nerfed

[jolly sierra]

they are too pea brained to realize

if they are op or not

so devs doesn't care kek

seems like orc is the way to go

[tribal badger]

will probably matter less next season with orc racial nerf

it got nerfed right im not misremembering

[quaint cedar]

it did, down to 10% now

[jolly sierra]

yeah u are right

[quaint cedar]

I think it should just be deleted personally

[jolly sierra]

but think even w that orc is strong

[quaint cedar]

4.5 sec kidney shit is going to feel awwwful

[jolly sierra]

cuz baseline has mor STR by race

well i already decided

will call him Simp

[jolly sierra]

the new smasher

[quaint cedar]

a fine zuggy boi

[jolly sierra]

is hunched, to enhance the zug

[quaint cedar]

perfection

[waxen meteor]

your new war?

[jolly sierra]

yes

[waxen meteor]

i am debating having a war or priest

[jolly sierra]

me smash

not me smite

[waxen meteor]

Sounds good

[graceful ravine]

are rogues doomed in 10.1

what class should i play

[jolly sierra]

seems like warrior if they hits 50k

but tbh will play rbg meanwhile if they doesnt buff us fast

safe spot

[graceful ravine]

might be a m+ andy for 10.1, the new changes look great

[waxen meteor]

war is alright but don't want to have another one doing 30 mins queue

[waxen meteor]

Do you feel war plays more like rogue or ret?

[jolly sierra]

ret def

is smashing buttons too

[faint vessel]

How many seconds do you have to wait to sap after vanishing in pvp

[waxen meteor]

6

[faint vessel]

That means u need to wait until target gets out of combat why I can see some can immediately sap after blind

[waxen meteor]

probably means you see it wrong ..

and what's the point of having blind and sap on at the same time

[faint vessel]

I mean consecutive times

[waxen meteor]

i am a bit lost

[vocal surge]

I fall asleep playing warriors instead of ret paladins

[floral meadow]

Hey guys. I need some help setting up a Macro.

• Mouseover Shadowstep
• mod:alt @focus Shadowstep
• target Shadowstep

#showtooltip Shadowstep
/cast [@mouseover] Shadowstep; [mod:alt,@focus] Shadowstep; Shadowstep

but this does not work. Mouseover works, but if i target something, nothing happens.

[tribal badger]

/cast [@mouseover, exists] Shadowstep

[floral meadow]

thanks @tribal badger

🙂

[tribal badger]

👍

[minor cape]

your target has to be out of combat, you have to be stealthed or subterfuged or in dance

thats why you can do a sap at the end of a blind

cause after 6s in blind, target looses combat

well its not useful info cause this feature is removed in three weeks

but looks like you will still be able to do cheap -> blind -> sap

[austere thorn]

Other than SL season 3/4, has outlaw ever been viable? I fell in love with the spec but Im afraid it is doomed as a 'pve spec'/bad rep from shadowlands. Is there any hope?

[nova pulsar]

Hey, in this video, what addon is he using to display some enemy debuffs bigger above their nameplates??

https://youtu.be/HVyvDpfvQKU

[dusty elk]

One of them is https://www.curseforge.com/wow/addons/bigdebuffs/screenshots

[brave plaza]

Hello! Im a fellow rogue main focused on pve. Im planing on getting into pvp in 10.1. So the question is, Will rogue be viable after all the cc nerfs, or is it a bad time to get into pvp as rogue?

[ionic crown]

rogue is fucked dont play

do ret or warr like braindead

[candid tide]

idk i feel like rogue is still pretty gud if u play it well

assa that is

[lavish idol]

what exactly are the pvp nerfs you're referring to

was focused on pve last few weeks and didn't pay attention

looking at murlok seems outlaw made a comeback for solo at least

[potent pivot]

Nah it’s fine

[potent pivot]

[wind dock]

how does undead priest cleanse my bleeds ?

[jolly sierra]

last wod pvp season i recall

[surreal barn]

I am legit wrecking SS as a warrior in blues

How is this a thing I know nothing about warrior

[dull bridge]

did anyone participate in the play with the blues yesterday?

[jolly sierra]

theadoringfan i recall

[glad mason]

Tfw you get griefed by a healer because you didn't win the first round solo lmao

Guy believed assa is the most broken shuffle spec in the game 😆

[potent pivot]

he's living in the past

the good ol times

[glad mason]

And again griefed by toxic healers in the game to 1800 like what is this rating man lmao

[waxen meteor]

Whaaaat

Even guys at my hunter newbie range lobby knows to go sin

[glad mason]

Yeah I just wanna hit 1800 and get off this class

Nothing fun about playing this at this rating

[lone goblet]

Having just started pvping this expansion recently It feels like all the bleed clears now are a much bigger problem than they were in shadowlands.

Partly there just seems to be more of them, but also the spec just has no energy if you don't have bleeds up

So it's a double whammy of all your damage goes to zero when bleeds are cleared, which means your energy regen also does so even getting back up to speed can be difficult

[jolly sierra]

dot again

[tribal badger]

@jolly sierra it begins

[lone goblet]

Sure but when you are at zero energy zero combo points and your bleed just got cleared its like...

well 15 more seconds before I can even get garrote and rupture up again lol

[tribal badger]

got so unbelievably lucky from my conq boxes man

conq weapon, all 4 of the correct tier slot, correct cloak and belt

from zero to nearly full conq gear in 5 minutes

[jolly sierra]

ME SMASH

fkn blizzard is their fault to nerf us too much to use another stuff meanwhile

else i would be full rog tbh

[jolly sierra]

do u dot one or two targets at same time?

[lone goblet]

That's what I started doing now... it seems to help but feels weird when teammates want to just focus someone

Im over here running around just dotting everyone lol

At least then one stormform and my energy regen doesn't poof.

[jolly sierra]

dot both dps so when ur partner switch target u can deal enough dmg

also to make the other healer deplete his mana faster

the idea is have presence w the dmg, also as u say, to regen energy, u regen twice usually doing that

tbh i dont dot the healer cuz i wanna gouge him between goes

so i just dot both dps

[minor cape]

meanwhile in 1.4k

(assas dude went 0-6)

[jolly sierra]

poor guy

[tribal badger]

man

zug zug leaping onto the enemy team > aoe fear > roar > avatar storming

should not feel this good

"oh look i did 2m damage in 10 seconds"

[hollow sundial]

Should play a hunter, stun trap ppl in the opener and get every cd in the game

All while pressing your 2 button rotation, bm is hard

[lone goblet]

god damnit,I was 3 points from 1800 and went 2-4

Was really looking forward to not having to pvp again for a long time, Now I have another hole to dig out of.

[glad mason]

Feel this sentence so much

[lone goblet]

god damn bleed clears piss me off so much.

This match against an evoker, holy pal, warrior

and my bleeds got nuked 3 times in a row

its like I cant do shit.

[jolly sierra]

tbh if i would go warr in a go i would leap to healer, fear him then charge to dps w stun and burst

sounds funny in paper

[tribal badger]

thats what i usually do

but when all 3 r stacked uop

its hard to resist just 3 man roaring

into a 3 man avatar storm

the damage is hilarious

[jolly sierra]

that happens, at least u will have a compensation for tier bonus if ur burst is dispelled or fades

[tribal badger]

3 man roar does like 600k damage over a single cast

bleed spec apparently btw

[jolly sierra]

once i saw a DH literally 1 shotted by 2 warriors after being charged

but yeah, the bleed hits hard af

[tribal badger]

yea nd then ur running 2 MS during bladestorm + sweeping strikes up

so you just MS twice for 90k+ on targets in it

man this is so funny

[jolly sierra]

nono, dunno what they did

but was charge

and died after 1 sec

was not undergeared

just fkn died XD

[tribal badger]

i mean charge itself does like 40k damage

chunking someone just with double charge with the pvp talent

kekw

then a col smash into a MS crit i could see it

[jolly sierra]

fuck i recalled that talent

once a guy killed me doing that

just charging

in that moment i just stared w my rog how the guy died and just decided to leave

[tribal badger]

ya the talent that makes charge a full root also makes it do like 30k base damage

[jolly sierra]

after that i can confirm why they flex too much with their CR

[nova viper]

hiho

i need talent's for sub rouge

[dull bridge]

murlok.io

[nova viper]

its 2023

and they dont have "copy" button on talents? xD

[copper maple]

It's worth putting them in by yourself to actually read what they do

[minor cape]

unending reslove made me appreciate feint more

[tribal badger]

@nova viper the pvp faq has builds

or u can go to murlok to see what a majority of top rated people r running rn

2 methods

#pvp-faq

[nova viper]

yea im in murlock

and i dont understand

[tribal badger]

u can directly copy paste builds from faq

murlok shows u the top 50s talent choices

[nova viper]

Wtf. What is mean?

wheres legend

what is orange, what is purple

xD

What is grey

[tribal badger]

well

the color is based on how many people have taken it

if u notice anything thats close to 50/50 players picking is orange

that means its basically always taken

purple is ~40 players

[nova viper]

[tribal badger]

usually taken but not always

the color just shows how standard they are

the number is the top 50 rogues

so 49 rogues take find weakness

etc

49 of the top 50 that being

[minor cape]

dont look at that

look at top dudes on the class

and take their build

[tribal badger]

thats what that is tho

[minor cape]

it even has a copy string

[tribal badger]

thats showing the talent selections of the top 50 rogues

for w/e bracket u chose

[minor cape]

nah, its overall

but you can choose one guy

[tribal badger]

what do u mean overall

[minor cape]

like from many different builds

[tribal badger]

its the top 50 sub rogues overall in the entire ladder yes

well yes some of them play different builds

thats why theres some 7-8 choices

but it shows that

[minor cape]

however they might play slightly different things

and it shows wierdly kinda

[tribal badger]

sure but any of those talents with 50/50 or 40+/50 are probably part of the best build

because 90% of the top rogues are taking it

[minor cape]

so i would suggest looking at one guy

[tribal badger]

or 100% for some of them

[jolly sierra]

when i build shit w alts i just choose the orange and purple stuff

[tribal badger]

^

[jolly sierra]

if there are spare points i choose something has not 0

and feels comfortable

[tribal badger]

soloq builds can differ a bit also because u tend to pick up a bit more self sustain/less coordination required talents

which is why i use murloc

[jolly sierra]

yeah

[tribal badger]

most guides just show top 3 v 3 build recommendations

but soloq is a different beast from 3v3

tbh

[jolly sierra]

but tbh w rog i always chose gouge, even when wasnt too picked

cuz i got used w panda racial

[lone goblet]

Bouncy?

[tribal badger]

panda has a racial incap

[minor cape]

isnt it weird how people choose nightstalker perk

that doesnt work

[tribal badger]

no because u cant go lower down the tree if u dont

[minor cape]

[tribal badger]

u pick it for pathing

otherwise u cant get FW

[minor cape]

i know

but still sad

[jolly sierra]

like picking exsang or MA for shrouded suffocation

and the path is shit w doomblade too

[proven kayak]

i have more than a month to play is rogue playable ?XD

be honest

[jolly sierra]

nope lol

we are behind thanks to locks, BMs and rets

just stomp us

[austere thorn]

Im having more success in shuffle as outlaw rather than assas..go figure

As assas I just cringe when I get ret lobbies, which is 90% of the time, cuz they just bop my bleeds and when they are on my team they blind them 😄

[jolly sierra]

demo lock is, just deletes you into an axe toss, even in AWC was a thing

[minor cape]

demo is hard cause you cant really stunlock him

maybe not such a big problem for assa but for sub for sure is

thats what i hate abount current meta - two unstonlockable classes and one that can just live through your stuns anyway

🥹

very easy to stop your shadow dance

[jolly sierra]

demo is hard cuz they can tank ur entire dmg and make dmg to u even in stun

[minor cape]

10.0.7 made this discords pvp channel a cry chat

[jolly sierra]

and u cant pillar them

[minor cape]

this too

[jolly sierra]

10.1 i think tbh

[minor cape]

both

[jolly sierra]

felguard says hi

[minor cape]

at least we got eviscerate buff

now it will deal 31k instead of 30

yeah!

i dont think demo is that strong at all too tbh

[jolly sierra]

also i cant restealth to those fuckers

cuz i have a pet 24/7

[minor cape]

demo loves cocks

proof

[jolly sierra]

tell us the spec, cuz i fkn die in assa

just an axe toss and its over for me

dont think is that easy

[minor cape]

its kinda like he is there he deals some dam just have to kick hand of guldan (i dont know what it does i just kick it)

[jolly sierra]

i have ur screen with 365553533 imps

even without tyrant is hard

i know

[minor cape]

i didnt

[jolly sierra]

fear

then casts gul'dan

nice

u still got hit by gul'dan with mortal coil

[minor cape]

you know how pvp community hates classes that are not fun to play against

like rogue or demo

[jolly sierra]

ofc he just scratch his asshole while do the dmg

[minor cape]

but yeah its overtuned i guess but after this ret shit nothing scares me anymore

[jolly sierra]

no merit

[minor cape]

but it was always like that

🥹

[jolly sierra]

tbh ret become easier tho, i didnt played ranked in like 3 weeks

[minor cape]

i didnt have much problem w ret

[jolly sierra]

but ret feels easier to kill, yeah

[minor cape]

but i didnt play rogue

[jolly sierra]

but demos and BM

[minor cape]

last 3 weeks

[jolly sierra]

REEEEEEEEEEEEE

[minor cape]

bm is just too much dam

like its marksmanship level of burst

[jolly sierra]

yeah

a burst every min

[minor cape]

dont you sometimes wish marksmanship and ele shaman were meta

[jolly sierra]

MM is easy af

[minor cape]

yes

bm is not 😦

[jolly sierra]

even easier after tap removal

sad

[minor cape]

wasnt even hard w tap

[jolly sierra]

nah

[minor cape]

its just dead in two goes

[jolly sierra]

just pillar lol

[minor cape]

just line it bro

[jolly sierra]

aimed shot

strife to pillar, wait till cast is over

go

[minor cape]

how about kidney him and he turtles

after

[jolly sierra]

will trinket and u just run

[minor cape]

kidney him again and he dies

[jolly sierra]

yep

[minor cape]

[jolly sierra]

300 IQ

[minor cape]

same with ele sham i feel

honestly ele sham meta was the easiest shit

for rogue

[jolly sierra]

i still recall when i played w ret in blade edges against a mage and a sham

everytime i went to bridge i was tossed away

[minor cape]

fuck blades edge thats another thing

epic fall down run for 20 seconds

gameplay

nokhund also has stuff for casters to climb and its much cooler

tbh

[jolly sierra]

nokhud is good as rog too tho

the plataforms are blind spots

[minor cape]

yeah its kinda fun for both

melee and ranged

[jolly sierra]

yep

tbh liked a lot that arena

[minor cape]

i dont really like the huge wall

in the middle

wish it was two pillars or smth

[jolly sierra]

well everthing has its flaws

[maiden quest]

is it noormal that a priest is dealing 150k one time damage on me ?

nearly one shoting

[tribal badger]

with what ability

[maiden quest]

SW pain

and other dots

Like details says 100k dps

[tribal badger]

probably details bug

[maiden quest]

jesus, he literally dot me for 98% of my health just ith passive dot wtf

eh is 361 and able to one shot

[tribal badger]

its probably all his dot damage over the whole fight

a single set of dots will do like ~120k damage over their full duration

but thats 18 seconds

[maiden quest]

well there is no way in hell i beat him unless I get 420+ ilevel

[tribal badger]

yes fighting spriests 1v1 is very difficult

their instants still do a lot of damage and they have hella sustain

[maiden quest]

i go in, open it, I am 10 % health over 0.5 sec timer at hand

[tribal badger]

its hard to outlast them

[maiden quest]

its impossible you need a pocket healer

[tribal badger]

i mean they dont have anything that does that so idk what ur experiencing

takes them 10+ seconds to kill you usually

unless ur letting them free cast

[jolly sierra]

usually i need to restealth a lot against them

[jolly sierra]

and fight between goes

[maiden quest]

Well I vanish after my opener because im at 10% hp lol

This class is insanely beyond broken, need to be put against ret

Tho I think ret doesntr stand a single chance

[jolly sierra]

nah u can

i've fought them before and is not hard

[maiden quest]

it is

Especially whe I have this gear

[jolly sierra]

u need to line a lot

[maiden quest]

this is pve gear

[tribal badger]

i mean theres only 67k damage in that combat log photo

[maiden quest]

which means glass cannon

[tribal badger]

thats really not that much

but yea if ur undergeared its gunna be much more painful

[maiden quest]

well i was from 226k to 20k in mere secs

he is 361 lol

[tribal badger]

its not to that

unless u have like 100k hp total

[maiden quest]

do i need 430 ilevel ?

[tribal badger]

theres only 67k damage in that section

[maiden quest]

this is 3 sec

this is after my cos because otherwise I was a corpse

[tribal badger]

ya thats like what, just under 100k damage?

in 3 seconds?

thats 30k dps

[maiden quest]

then i selath and flew away

[tribal badger]

warriors/rets do that in a single ability

[jolly sierra]

i do 200k w final veredict

[maiden quest]

In a nutshell, i cant open him without cos, tis just totally not possible

[jolly sierra]

u can

u need to go between goes and interrupt shit

[maiden quest]

unless fleeing gliding and kiting after the 5 sec ks

yea

like go in 5 sec ks and go out, 10 times

But peeps in duel tends to /forfeit and insult you when yo udo that

calling you pussy ass 'b*tch"

[jolly sierra]

meh

[maiden quest]

And telling you they oneshot you whenever they want withotu vanish lol

which is so true

[jolly sierra]

they are just bad, pvp consist in that

[maiden quest]

yeah well nobody likes wasting time in duelling someone who just goes and come back

its just unfun for both the players

[jolly sierra]

why u complain then if u play with their rules

[maiden quest]

I'm not talking about facetanking which rogue was pretty much able to do until then but at least standing a bit

[jolly sierra]

rog needs to restealth constantly

[maiden quest]

in duel it's ok but in world pvp the guy just take his drake and ly away, it's frustrating

[jolly sierra]

i got a frost mage whining after winning against him bt just using manuv and KS in prepatch

[maiden quest]

maybe outlaw is better aagainst it

[jolly sierra]

just told him he was bad af and he was frost nova me almost all time

so no right to whine

[maiden quest]

we have 2 vanish now which also makes it easier

[jolly sierra]

switch to assa and u win

[maiden quest]

what change does that make

[jolly sierra]

garrote is a silence

[maiden quest]

I"m passionately in love with sub in pve but havent etsted it yet in pvp

also i was duelling that guy with m+ talents

[jolly sierra]

just go assa and u win

[maiden quest]

I was thinking about picking another spec for pvp

to change

[jolly sierra]

garrote dot up then kidney exsang u hide to restealth

[maiden quest]

If I do RBGs, and shuffle

[jolly sierra]

go again, u kidney this time w deathmark

done

[maiden quest]

well hes long gone but I sure will give it a go

[jolly sierra]

ive fought in skirmishes 1v1 against shadow

[maiden quest]

What is your take on assa for 2s2 3v3 shuffle and rbg ?

[jolly sierra]

was easy af

what

[maiden quest]

what do you think of it

[jolly sierra]

is good

but squishy

[maiden quest]

Dunno what I'd pick between sub and assa for it

gameplay is different tho, assa you are pretty much pveing 2 targets

[jolly sierra]

yeah, but the idea is cc, sub is nerfed af

between goes i usually gouge the healer and go to beat another dps

[maiden quest]

well sub is cc bot, it annoys me since i kinda tunnel vision the arenas

requires way too much awareness

[jolly sierra]

play as you want

[maiden quest]

so idk, maybe pick assa or outlaw

depends the gameplay

[jolly sierra]

but if u wanna beat shadow go assa

[maiden quest]

So what difference does it make gameplay wise ?

[surreal barn]

You need pvp gear either way since yours doesn’t scale up even a little

[jolly sierra]

the damage is constant

instead in burst windows like sub

u burst in some moments yeah but most damage is periodic and u play rot

[tribal badger]

👏 warrior elite set unlocked

time to take a break from these 30m soloqs

😴

[maiden quest]

what's your opener ?

[jolly sierra]

wtf when did u started w warr?

[tribal badger]

uh

like 3 hours ago

str8 up to 1850

not a bad mog this season

next seasons looks great tho

[jolly sierra]

if is melee

MFD>kidney>garrote>rupture >echoing reprimand>shiv>envenom>mutilate>envenom

[tribal badger]

man theres something just so wild about playing ret/warr

[jolly sierra]

gratz wtf think i can if i level the warr fast can get the same

[tribal badger]

like just randomly forcing cds from the enemy team

without pressing any cd

[maiden quest]

and bone spike ?

[jolly sierra]

i have a lot of conq stacked

[tribal badger]

cause MS crit twice in a row and suddenly one dude is 40% hp

warrior is so satisfying

[jolly sierra]

usually i use it after the opener

in a kidney window

[jolly sierra]

me smash

[tribal badger]

and its absolutely wild how easy it is to swap to defensive play

[jolly sierra]

u are worgen, i'll go panda then for the lols

[tribal badger]

compared to on rogue

[jolly sierra]

and the gouge

[tribal badger]

oh 2 people are targetting me now

swap dstance> start dumping rage into ignore pain

warrior actually feels so tanky

not as good as pre nerf ret but

very tanky

[jolly sierra]

yeah

also defensive stance

strong af

[tribal badger]

just doing 5k hps

by pressing IP on cd

and passive healing

[surreal barn]

Yeah i queued my warrior in blues the first time yesterday… amazed at how much easier it is

Plus coming from rogue you’re at an advantage bc you have that “GTFO they are using their burst” mindset drilled into you

The bad warriors just sit there los their healer and take it right in the butt

[jolly sierra]

u at w rog mentality

that is the advantage so u just cc in goes like w rog and go to smash

[surreal barn]

Exactly

Charge and intercept defensively if you have to

Don’t even get me started on how great reflect feels 😂

Now that’s what our cloak should do lol… take a pvp talent that gives you a chance to reflect

[jolly sierra]

yeah lol

to reflect glacial pike w cloak

[surreal barn]

The choreographed shaman burst as well

[jolly sierra]

yep

[fading blade]

shurikens dont hit anyhting outside duel right?

[jolly sierra]

i think it does, works inversed

if some pally uses blinding when u are phased u get the cc

[fading blade]

hm i tried on a monk with pet and didnt get any cp

[jolly sierra]

dunno then, but at least stuff from outside does reach phasing

[fading blade]

no statue either

shadow duel so weird

[graceful ravine]

U don’t get cp for pets, regardless of duel

[fading blade]

what about other players

[wicked tide]

Man the game just feels ruined in pvp for sub rogue

[fading blade]

xd

[wicked tide]

im playing at 1900 mmr (2.8 cr pre ret) and between my teamates griefing me on dr's and me doing no damage i just feel frustrated the entire game in shuffles

[faint vessel]

Is it time to reroll to warlock

[wicked tide]

no i made my rogue in vanilla

and besides i already made a warrior

[tribal badger]

Warr is a blast

[wicked tide]

It just is dumb man the game is so dumbed down

[faint vessel]

Im rerolling a warlock my rogue is chicken shit i cant kill anyone ina stun

[wicked tide]

and you get punished for wanting to play more techinical classes

just feels bad, i mean nobody even cares about DR's anymore just do damage and a micro CC here and there and gg

just would be nice to know if they have a plan for sub rogues

[ionic crown]

this will make sub great again

60k gloomblade *4 after dance end

BUQAAWulQAmRd/c4Iy2r7VOUFAAARJBAAAAAAQISSiICBIIJIJJJJJJRKik0CkQSgERAAAA

[dull bridge]

yo bro wait bro I need my dance to end to deal damage

[jolly sierra]

bring hemo back

[dull bridge]

also isn't this basically the current build

[ionic crown]

think whatever u want. im just introducing different way it is

kalvish use this almost same
https://check-pvp.fr/us/Dalaran/Kalvish

like WOD rogue playstyle i guess

[pallid rune]

damn, shouldve gone for the rogue elite set earlier in the xpac then 😦

[jolly sierra]

u are still in time tho

even w everything fucked up

[pallid rune]

prolly wont be good enough

used to zugzug with ret/war/monk

[ionic crown]

i know but least it can useable

we cant 1 shot them anymore cuz blizzard have removed so we need to find another way to use sub rogue

or play some braindead classes

[jolly sierra]

he still need the 1k8 xmog tho

so better keep trying

[pallid rune]

someone recommended assa instead of sub so ill try this

[jolly sierra]

yeah go like that

u will be squishier but will hit more

[waxen meteor]

how much zandara troll recover skill can heal?

just saw a ret doing 1on1 with a sin rogue (i was simply wathcing since there's only 1 joined on that sin rogue side)

ret did bubble and cast the race skill, hp went back like to 100%?

[jolly sierra]

100% health if is casted

i do that trick everytime

zanda are op af w pally

[tribal badger]

its a full heal from base ya any damage interupts it

so obviously good combined with bubble

[jolly sierra]

is a free lay of hands basically

[waxen meteor]

wow that's nice

can hunter do that with turtle?

or no because turtle doesn't clean dots

[jolly sierra]

dunno tbh in that

just can confirm w ret

cuz my own is zanda

KEK

[waxen meteor]

looks a nice combo with bubble

just need plastic surgery

[jolly sierra]

XD

imagine the possibilities

u have 5% more crit by proc, a glider every 15m and another lay of hands

[jolly sierra]

level 18 from some hours ago, everything is going according to plan

tomorrow will level again

[minor cape]

panda dk is funny as hell

[broken otter]

Hey, so, do we have a general consensus as to which of our specs is likely to be the dominant RSS spec come 10.1/S2?

[jolly sierra]

is a warrior

XD

[dull bridge]

not really, none of the specs are looking great with the current changes

[broken otter]

Damn, that sucks.

[tribal badger]

tier wise i think subs looks the best

followed by sins

but sub also has the lowest base damage rn

sins might make envenom focused builds ok

[dull bridge]

I'd say assa since it relies the least on your teammates reacting to your cc and it's the best performing RSS spec currently, don't thing anything changes that next patch

[jolly sierra]

dont think sub will be any good w both the crit nerfs and the crit based tier

assa even was thought to be a nerf target in s2 with current status

[dull bridge]

sub 2set is good but it's nowhere near enough to move it up a tier, and sec tech is getting nerfed even more

[tribal badger]

zz grinding out 2100 on my rogue feels like its gunna be a pain compared to my warr/shaman next season

going back from classes that always do big D damage and can just randomly get enemy defensives for no reason besides u crit/procced twice in a row

[jolly sierra]

we need rog buffs asap this is pathetic

[waxen meteor]

Panda war?

[jolly sierra]

i wanna the rewards but w my rogue, if i cant get safe then i will need to farm w another classes meanwhile

[jolly sierra]

ye

think will need t3 warr boots

[rich totem]

what spec should i be playing in 3s?

[jolly sierra]

anything but rog

[tribal badger]

3s is more organized so whatever teams up best with the comp ur playing

unless ur asking about soloq

[rich totem]

i hear that im running with a frost mage and disc priest

[tribal badger]

probably sub or sin

[dull bridge]

assa

[tribal badger]

either work honestly but sin is better rn i think

[rich totem]

okay phew thought i was going to have to learn sub pvp, i can do pve sub well enough but cant get it right in pvp

anyone have any good builds for sin? i looked at the page just wanted to make sure they arent out of date. im around 1500 rating

[jolly sierra]

murlok.io

[rich totem]

thank you, been trying to get into pvp for awhile just youtube hasnt been very productive for me

[dull bridge]

there really any good guides for wow pvp in general

(unless you're playing survival hunter)

[jolly sierra]

in that case ask bicmex he is in this chat

[rich totem]

thank you! makes me excited to get some 3s done later

[chrome schooner]

Has anyone tried to be a Kigsbane gamer, assuming you don't need a mortal strike effect ?

[jolly sierra]

dayv i think

was testing some time ago and using it in high ranking

are you curious for the 4set?

[chrome schooner]

More curious for now. DTB is useful for Wound and Numbing on top of the "normal" poisons. But if you don't need a MS, with Numbing being as nerfed as it is, it makes DTB ... less valuable. I am aware that on paper (and in PvE) playing DTB with Amp nets the most damage but in PvP right now I believe it is difficult for Rogues to secure an uptime sufficient (because if you don't kite you die) to get really good value out of the added damage from Amplifying hits while also having enough stacks when it matters (on Kidney, that is). In PvE you use Shiv on CD and usually have insane uptime on target as well as on the Envenom buff, so you deal a lot of damage with Amp itself, plus always have stacks on the buff to consume on every Envenom almost, and you always make good value on your Shivs. In PvP you might have to kite a bit before your Kidney, causing stacks to drop or to not stack high enough. People might press a poison dispel. You may want to Envenom for SnD or for sustained damage before your Kidney Shiv, causing you to consume the stacks and not have that big go damage when you actually do a go.

So I was wondering, in the current way to play, with how fragile Assassination is, if Kingsbane couldn't be a good alternative when you don't need Wound, because then you could do a go, Kidney Shov KB, do damage Shiv again, peace it until next Kidney, have a small go with partner CDs of whatever, peace it again, Kidney a 3rd time with KB again and so on. That way running a lot doesn't hurt your damage much, and you get a bursty tool.

I haven't really tried although I plan to, so I was simply curious whether someone had done it somewhat seriously.

[jolly sierra]

in that case, isn't amp a good option too? you can discard it for the stacking eff but the dmg itself is the same than insta poison in PVE case

and that isn't few, maybe can work well with the 4set and we can just use hemo

think even w dispells can be useful, if it lands well you can hit easily 80k tho

[tribal badger]

^

if wound isnt so necessary u could just stack amp/deadly

for much bigger poison damage

you'd still do more overall damage then kingsbane probably

[jolly sierra]

tested it in PTR and with 40% dmg i hitted like 60k in envenoms without amp

agree

tbh think our assa build can be with the talents than aren't too picked RN

like the 10% more poison procs and the nerfed damage boost for poisons

but that for next season

[chrome schooner]

With the future 4P we'll see how it goes, I was more talking about right now

Also yes, as I said I am well aware that the best PvE spec for highest overall damage is Deadly Amp, my point was that in many PvP scenarios you wouldn't exploit that anywhere near 100% value, while being glued to a target for the 14s of KB, 5 being a stun, is rather easy

So, yes, if you playtest on a dummy target, Deadly Amp always wins, there is a reason why the PvE build goes with it

That's just not how PvP happens

[jolly sierra]

yeah can agree with you in this season, but we can agree this step of season is shit for us anyways

we need more testing imo, remember how we were going amp at start of season and ended dropping everything for wound

[hollow sundial]

I feel like with the way class design is its always nice to have ms

[chrome schooner]

I meant if you play with someone who has a baseline one

Do you know by how much it's nerfed or is that a random comment ? :p

[tribal badger]

isnt it 10% in pvp

or is it even less now

not saying its not good

[chrome schooner]

A 1.5s cast, which is a rather long cast in PvP already as everyone has haste or casts spells naturally shorter, isn't even increased by 0.15s with the current PvP modifiers.

[tribal badger]

well it slows everything tho, pretty sure it even slows dot ticks

its just a solid damage reduction

let alone to the slowing effect it has on actual casts for more room to kick

its basically -9% haste

which is a very effective overall damage reducer

on wizards

[jolly sierra]

imo is still too soon for discuss this, lets wait for 10.1 and starting testing there

[chrome schooner]

People are supposed to be in Kidney in your Shiv. And their first instinct when coming out of it aren't to actually hardcast some random BS but to use an instant CC, mobility spells, or instant casts

[tribal badger]

oh im not even talking about the shivved effect just the passive

idk what it goes up to during shiv

[chrome schooner]

Aaaah, I love being taught how to assa

[jolly sierra]

but im leaning to DTB amp tbh, amp poison with 40% more dmg goes brrrr

[chrome schooner]

I guess the very wrong way of playing only carries up to 3400+ on the popular seasonal bracket, that's good to know.

[tribal badger]

nah im just pointing out dont underestimate the raw DR value of mind numbing

its value is not simply in casts taking 0.1s longer

[chrome schooner]

I assume you're at least more successful with your superior way mr Lopez

[tribal badger]

it reduces the damage a wizard does by a fair amount

[chrome schooner]

It'd be dissapointing otherwise

[jolly sierra]

equi technically you are r1 atm, right?

no just curiosity

[chrome schooner]

I have 2 chars on #4 and #6 at the moment

I did say 3400

[jolly sierra]

checked murlok.io

and had like 2 chars in the top

[potent pivot]

chill out

[jolly sierra]

just wanted to ask

now w him logged

[chrome schooner]

Simply answering a comment about "the very wrong way to play the spec"

[potent pivot]

not everything is about your rating, have an actual discussion instead of flaunting as your argument.

[chrome schooner]

I am the one having an actual discussion, if you read it

[potent pivot]

i get where you're coming from, i do

[chrome schooner]

he's the one who says "lmao lol you play very wrong"

based off

0 arguments

just emotion

[potent pivot]

but let's be amiable here

[chrome schooner]

I do, but you have to understand that double Shiv is only 1 extra shiv in the entire game right

That means you get 1 shiv outside of a go

then the other shivs always sync back to your goes/drs/etc

So, no, you're really not supposed to have a lot of shiv instances outsides of goes

In practise too.

yeah then you also have kidney back

what is that argument

If you double shiv

At ANY point

then when the 2nd shiv fades you need 41s to get double shiv back

So unless you actually sit behind a pillar for almost 2 DRs

No

It'll happen if you don't use your spells right

Then, yeah, I guess not pressing it at one point lets everything cool down

lmao

go to a dummy

press shiv

wait until the effect ends

shiv again

set a timer

tell me when you can double shiv again

spoiler

it's 41s

yah, so in the end the argument becomes

"if you play bad or if the game happens horribly for over 2 mins, then you can do it heheheheh"

right ?

so it's pointless

then one can argue well, you can double shiv every go

just have a go every 41s

yes yes

yes, stuff happens in a match

but if you are 5s left on 25s timers 5 TIMES IN A ROW

then you're getting completely bullied by the enemy

and you're not winning

[jolly sierra]

think gonna go home and read this later, become heated af, see ya guys

[chrome schooner]

And so, the game isn't supposed to happen that way, as it's your job to make your setups work as they should

that's how you win games

forcing your gameplay over the enemy's

rather than letting them stop yours over & over

yes, sometimes you reset

so, again

in MOST SCENARIOS

you won't double shiv

it will happen yes because you have 1 extra charge after all

but for the huge majority of all games

you'll have 1 shiv per go

yeah then youa gree with what I said at start when you started arguing

so I don't get why you even started the argument

the big picture is 1 shiv per go

and since you pump diring kidney, the majority of the shiv happens when the KT is in a kidney

and so, in the majority of the times

the shiv'ed numbing is not used

my rating eh :p lets drop that one

sure

w.e

you're right, hope you're happy!

[tawny kestrel]

[dull bridge]

rogue discord: civil war

[chrome schooner]

It fits the Rogue theme somehow

[hidden dome]

Playing Outlaw in this Season makes me want to delete the rogue I had since TBC and reroll

Arms just look at you from across the map and already outdamages you

[scarlet shell]

rogue waaaaaaars

[scarlet shell]

true and real

they press bladestorm and somehow outdamage me

[hidden dome]

Yep, I also love that you can't cloak the spear anymore

[halcyon timber]

Yeah instead of turning it to magic again they just decided to give us a new talent to be able to clear nonsense like that.

[jolly sierra]

the chat turned rogue

what a fucking bad dad joke

[jolly sierra]

u will now if u pick the cloak talent for 10.1

[halcyon timber]

Yeah man it sucks

[wicked tide]

Can we get some discussion going on on how to currently win as sub in shuffle

[jolly sierra]

you don't

[surreal barn]

Honestly I’ve had to switch back to the one shot build and I don’t particularly enjoy it. This is at 1.9-2k gameplay though.

I can’t comment on anything higher. I haven’t been able to climb higher after dropping since 10.0.7

[wicked tide]

The biggest problem with winning as sub in shuffle is your teamates can grief u harder then the enemy can just by DRing things randomly

[severe nexus]

So do we double shiv?

Jokes

[surreal barn]

As sub I guess if I could only give one tip it would be to hold your big boy burst until after everyone else has used theirs

If that makes sense?

[agile leaf]

@jolly sierra Hi sorry to bother, can you give any tips on solo shuffle? cant pass 800mmr, need to get 1k to upgrade the purple gear

[jolly sierra]

gouge a lot the heal, dot both dps, when the round starts go w sprint to the healer and sap him 3 times, then blind, if there are a trinket then kidney and go to fight

in a go use kidney with bomb to force a dps trinket then you can go seriously with deathmark in the next go

you have two bursts, one with exsanguinate and one with deathmark, is adviced to use deathmark first to force defensives

[agile leaf]

deathmark after garrote, rupture for double right?

[jolly sierra]

deathmark after having every dot up

rupture and garrote for both targets

in your kidney goes after opener use bone spike in both dps too

mainly in the kill target but at least one in the other

[agile leaf]

gotcha gotcha, ty

[jolly sierra]

np gl

i was farming and an hordie (my faction ofc) attacked my ret

[potent pivot]

you don't have to upgrade it unless you want to make the PvE ilvl higher

[jolly sierra]

because im a scumbag i take opportunity to report him for language KEK

[jolly sierra]

the guy come with a friend

then i used the racial to glide and the guy started shotting me in air and died by falling while i ran away without issues and still won honor from him

funny af, just leave the scene to make him seethe

[west bolt]

is cowl worth running in pvp

[potent pivot]

the one that you pair with the ring in pve? not really

it breaks cc iirc

[jolly sierra]

cowl?

no

[west bolt]

gotcha

[jolly sierra]

both nerfed and break cc

[potent pivot]

you want the boots

that reduce cc

[west bolt]

which ones?

[potent pivot]

and lariat most likely, especially if you do pve at a decent enough level to get it 418

[west bolt]

im new to pvp so my lariat is maxed out

[potent pivot]

they should be listed on the gear section of #pvp-faq

[west bolt]

only do pve

[jolly sierra]

to finish, because the guy brought a friend to healing him, whispered his friend and said "tell ur friend next time to don't slip when is trying to beat me"

[potent pivot]

lariat is p good as long as you have the correct stats on it

which if you pve and want to pvp (both as outlaw) i believe the stats should line up nicely (crit/vers)?

[agile leaf]

can i farm bloody tokens whenever? or is it a event/quest thing

[potent pivot]

you can, by killing players in wpvp

but there's also crates that drop from the sky that drop a lot

iirc 500 for first loot of the day-200 for every loot after

[west bolt]

im playing sin in pvp

so it would be vers/mast?

would be best if i craft a second lariat

[potent pivot]

they drop in random rotation between the 4 zones, sometimes you can find raid groups/parties that are flying around waiting for them to spawn

first horde/alliance to open the crate wins it for their factions

[potent pivot]

yes

[west bolt]

can i sim what piece of gear is best for me to buy next?

for pvp

or like how do i go about knowing what to get

i already got a honor trink

[jolly sierra]

hmmm

[potent pivot]

you also can just recraft your current lariat, but most just make 2 so they don't have to constantly recraft between contents

[jolly sierra]

but

will you play this season as assa?

or are u preparing for next one?

[west bolt]

both

messing around rn

havent pvped much before but seems like fun

[jolly sierra]

emmmm

[potent pivot]

it's mostly the same all the time. MH wep first, then other pieces of gear

[jolly sierra]

use the lariat w versa mastery

[potent pivot]

but ye trinket is also important

[jolly sierra]

but for next season tbh

[potent pivot]

that's what we just said

[jolly sierra]

you will be using the crafted ring, the boots

[jolly sierra]

wait lemme finish

and think you won't be using lariat because MAYBE will use another embellishment

in the ring

[potent pivot]

@west bolt gear prio follows most of the same principles as PvE, but no you can't sim it

MH wep, big budget items like chest/legs/helm, OH wep etc

[west bolt]

not trinket first?

[jolly sierra]

trinket

buy crafted ones

[potent pivot]

trinkets are big yeah

[jolly sierra]

meanwhile

in AH

[potent pivot]

but you can get honor/crafted

i'm mostly talking about what you should buy first with conquest after getting those

conquest spending should be done with a bit more though than honor/crafted gear etc

slightly harder to get your hands on, so you use it with the most impact per piece you can

also some of the wpvp gear is BiS

you can upgrade it with the weekly reward from the wpvp quest

trophies of strife or w/e

[west bolt]

bis for pve?

or pvp

[potent pivot]

pvp

like you can't get vers/mast bracers from conq vendor

but you can from the wpvp vendor, then you upgrade them from 408 to 421 pvp ilvl

[west bolt]

i see

ty

[potent pivot]

just look up the weekly trophies of strife quest etc if you haven't already seen it

[jolly sierra]

we only talk from pvp here

if you wanna check the bis list you can browse murlok.io for the spec

so you can chose better

[agile leaf]

wont 5/6 and only got 45 ratin, other guy gets 2 wins and gets 90.. itll take forever to even get 1k rating

[jolly sierra]

nice you got it

no guy you are going well

that is for mmr difference

[agile leaf]

ic ic

[jolly sierra]

if you keep constantly winning you will raise a lot

[agile leaf]

do you have to win 3 rounds to break even?

[jolly sierra]

if you have positive mmr change then yes

but that happen after winning like 4 rounds in a row in 3 matches

usually if is not the case you win 0

[agile leaf]

gotcha, thnx for ur tips it helped out

[jolly sierra]

you welcome

if you wanna more tips later, just @ me i don't care tbh

im just leveling atm

[agile leaf]

through TW?

[jolly sierra]

nah fresh char

[potent pivot]

i'm lvling through TW atm

[jolly sierra]

need to reach lvl 30 asap

to fly

this is frustrating af

[waxen meteor]

I still feel ret nerf on wings so funny

with such a visual noticeable skill like you are gonna kill the world

it does just 10% bonus in pvp

[jolly sierra]

wings goes brr

[tribal badger]

😴 queues super long again

got to 2080 thatll need to do for the weekend

2400 warrior grind off to a good start

[jolly sierra]

u are fast

i have my warr at lvl 28 rn cuz i returned from work

else would be higher

[tribal badger]

i had a couple super good lobbies i went 5/6 in in a row

spiked my mmr hard was very nice

got up past 2k in just a couple games

but queues up to like 30m+ again zzz

[jolly sierra]

the price of success

the leveling is fast anyways, almost 30 already

wm on + ten lands potion = gotta go fast

[waxen meteor]

there seems to be way more quitters lately

[jolly sierra]

well if u win the most doesn't seem like a problem tho

[minor cape]

this shit is op for leveling

🫡

[wary spire]

Lads, is there any hopium for rogues in the next patch?

I see.

[agile leaf]

how can i get 2 piece tier if i sticktly do pvp?

[minor cape]

through revival catalyst, google it

also from great vault

[faint vessel]

I rerolled warlock lol

[potent pivot]

Ye TW dungeons are like 60% more exp per than regulars

Iirc

[minor cape]

me too

welcome to the club buddy

[minor cape]

i went from 60 to 70 in a couple of hours didnt know it was even possible

i got a lot of those dungeons from pandaria that are compeleted in 3 mintues

[potent pivot]

Nice got lucky

You can get lvl boosted from 60-70 in like 10-20 minutes rn apparently

Usually like ~100k gold

[west bolt]

That sounds experience

[surreal barn]

Free if you fan and vanish as others are giving the boost

[potent pivot]

[atomic loom]

Hows everyone feel about the state of rogue going into 10.1?

[minor cape]

oooooh

wait thats how i do sparks quest!

[surreal barn]

Beware they will eventually send a DH from opposite faction to try and assassinate you.

It was honestly more fun trying to survive than the current state of rogue pvp 😂

[minor cape]

and you also get a duel with a dh

well you can duel a dh as a rogue

not that bad no?

[tribal badger]

sure except when u get the healer thats clearly going 0/6 in ur first 3 matches in a row then they quit after you beat them in the 4th game

🥹

[minor cape]

also its weird how dh rarely expect rogue to shadowstep sap while he tries to find you lel

[tribal badger]

oh wow guess i lost 3/4 games must be a bad player

[minor cape]

fax, stupid shit but you also sometimes get easy 3-0

[untold remnant]

How do you guys generally win solo shuffle rounds nowadays?

[minor cape]

we all parked and play alts

🫡

[tribal badger]

playing arms warrior instead of my rogue

^

[minor cape]

but as sub - get defensive cooldowns and use your cc to burst with secret tech

[untold remnant]

It is just not fun anymore.. I want to play my rogue, but it feels hot garbage

[minor cape]

the big condition is so that healer cant save his teammate

[untold remnant]

And it is not getting better

[minor cape]

duel, bomb, kidney healer, blind healer

that type of stuff

[hidden dome]

As an Outlaw I try to force some defensive CDs with my "burst" and then just play cc-bot when my partner uses his burst.

That works sometimes

When my partner wastes his burst then I just lose usually. But that is the Outlaw way

A shaman stun totem just survived my 6 cp Dispatch lol

[tribal badger]

r u sure they werent just running the talent that makes a second stun totem spawn out of the first

if it dies or goes off

thats a 1 hp totem

[hidden dome]

That wrong, they haven't been 1hp totems for a long time now

log on a shaman and see yourself

And yes, It 100% wasn't the follow up totem as the totem had like 5% hp left after my dispatch

I saw it's hp bar

It just that Outlaw Finishers often hit for less than 20k in Shuffle 🙂

[tribal badger]

ya sorry by 1 hp totem i meant the lowest hp threshold totem which i think is 5% shaman hp or something

which i guess sits at ~20k rn depending on stam buff/earth ele being out

[minor cape]

20k cmon

any melee presses some shitty instant ability and does 50k

buff rog

[untold remnant]

Buff rogue indeed

[west bolt]

Any good YouTube videos to help me get into pvp?

Also do you guys play execute or bleed on sin?

[hollow sundial]

https://tenor.com/view/summer-child-my-sweet-summer-child-old-nan-game-of-thrones-gif-5580217

[tribal badger]

oh you mean like learn pvp for this season

i was about to link some warcraftpvp og videos

[west bolt]

I mean anything

Fundamentals

Wanna pvp next season

[tribal badger]

well

theres not really any guides for next season up yet

theres some pretty radical pvp changes hitting so its mostly doom n gloom for next season

[faint vessel]

Destro seems to be a lot of fun, pretty tanky, solid damage kinda hard to escape when trained but hard to kill

[minor cape]

yup im also destro

really cool spec

demo seems to be meta

but who cares

[faint vessel]

I dont like the pets

[minor cape]

same

i play sacrifice

[faint vessel]

Whats your rotation looking like?

[minor cape]

conflag shadowburn right away

then immolate

then by situation

[faint vessel]

The pet i have is the felhunter for interrupt

[minor cape]

dude

ill blow ur mind rn

if melee cleave sacrifice voidwalker

when they train you

[faint vessel]

I dp shadowburn, conflag incinerate

[minor cape]

use its ability then pact

you will get a HUGE shield

its cracked

[faint vessel]

Then chaosbolt or do the shadown conflig incinerate again

[minor cape]

but only if dont need interrupt

put up immolates

its important

incinerates are best after double burn cause burn to ashes stacks

[faint vessel]

Hmm ok

Ill play around

But its crazy damage

[minor cape]

also not much point in casting bolt and incinerate

if no blackdraft

[faint vessel]

Rogue feels like hot garbage

[minor cape]

you will be kicked

oh yeah

like you press this fucking shadowburn and it does 60k and you are like okay rogue cant do damage i get it

[faint vessel]

U can bait interrupt with incinwrate

Fear and mortal coil too