mfw I get killed by a MW monk at 50% dampening
#pvp
velvet wagon
mfw I get killed by a MW monk at 50% dampening
At 50% damp you just flip a coin who wins
One cc on healer and you get deleted
vocal surge
it was genuinely infuriating
not being able to push him over the edge
also I dont think we're able to change builds still as Outlaw
Been trying Dispatcher + GSW
but I lack a ton of mobility that HO + GSW has
also less dps because Sinister Strike doesn't do damage
dusky flower
Been trying Dispatcher + GSW
if your not playing HO+GSW your trolling yourself. theres one outlaw build and its not even good lol
dusky flower
<:sub:433007835606155265>
minor cape
outlaw is like in between spec or some shit but in reality can't do burst or sustain that good
dusky flower
pve spec really
minor cape
and i feel bad for it
dusky flower
i was hopeful for outlaw with 4 piece. no dice..
OL didnt pop off still SL2 though so who knows.
vocal surge
Its not even PvE
Its just cucked because its sharing talent trees with sub and sin
and everytime either of those 2 specs get nerfed
Outlaw gets hit by it as well
like the Soothing Darkness and Leeching Poison nerf
when Soothing Darkness was being nerfed due to sub rogues
dusky flower
not at all, dance was a big pick up for outlaw. and outlaw is 100% a pve spec. its topping charts in raid and m+
vocal surge
Thats because its almost unplayable outside of HO+GSW
since you dont have an energy economy to sustain Sinister Strike
dusky flower
thats all it was in SL
vocal surge
Ye
dusky flower
if your energy starved your doing the rotation wrong
vocal surge
That's outside HO+GSW
dusky flower
if you open wrong your fucked
dusky flower
alright then. have fun with that
dusky flower
but you died to an mw? natural or not it doesnt work
vocal surge
Ik
sharp sierra
Lmao i hate this game. Running BWL for my lock war and rogue because i like almost all t2 sets. On my lock i got all rogue stuff, on my rogue i got all my war stuff and on my war i got the lock stuff.
open minnow
i love this shit
proper heath
I mean
this nerf literally means nothing.
The stamina changes will have a bigger impact tho
We are moving in the correct direction for overall pvp balance.
graceful ravine
wheres my +200 inflation mmr
proper heath
What did ven call it. The inflation bomb
graceful ravine
not even a 20% buff to rogue would save me from getting farmed by r1 teams on alts at 2100 mmr in 3s
proper heath
Calm down. It's +20 a week. Do the math .
so in 15 weeks u will be 2400 mmr
🙂
See u in June
graceful ravine
proper heath
This is a sad discord
every week we login to see nerfs to our class. And Cdew farming likes on twitter.
graceful ravine
bold bison
I really want Assa to survive as long as possible so no-one notices how good Sub is
proper heath
I think the higher healthpool actually hurts sub
Assa will be more than fine. Higher healthpool means higher dampening, people living longer. More time for sustain.
unborn portal
15% is 15%
bold bison
Assa will be more than fine. Higher healthpool means higher dampening, people li...
meh I'm not super concerned about it, there's so much overkill in the game at the moment I don't know how difference 770 stamina makes
keen warren
I kinda like dance. I wish it was a bit more of a meaningful button though
fierce laurel
Isn’t find weakness like really good?
gleaming pawn
I truly hate current Outlaw. Never before have I played any spec in this game that actively made me want to stop playing. I've tried and tried, and just cannot get behind Outlaw in any content this expac
keen warren
Find weakness is good, but it's pretty much permanently up without dance
gleaming pawn
CC aside, Dance is there purely for bad luck protection to keep the Ambush train rolling
graceful ravine
dance makes outlaw dmg easily counterable, not that its a big boost anyways
fierce laurel
Right but after you take the fw nodes dance is right there.
keen warren
Yeah, you're ofc going to take dance. Pressing the actual CD in a game though, is fairly underwhelming.
graceful ravine
maybe they could switch find weakness with soothing darkness
so outlaw can take ER+find
- the snd heal
keen warren
I think an 8s dance or a damage modifier would be cool
I actually don't think outlaw is that bad. Maybe I'm coping.
bold bison
how does the queue system work? I queued, got an instant pop, someone declined, I'm at the 'front of the queue' and I've been waiting 25 minutes at like 2k mmr
proper heath
how does the queue system work? I queued, got an instant pop, someone declined, ...
in short. We dont fkin know.
I wish they were more clear. But the whole ETA 12 mins, while sitting in a 50 min que. is really weird.
gleaming pawn
so with the nerf to Hemotoxin to only being 6% better than Wound Poison, is anyone else looking at running different PvP talents? DFA could be marginally interesting to play again especially if you can line it up with ER, or maybe even System Shock
proper heath
I wouldn't swap it. Those all seem like memes unless ur playing amp poison. System shock's damage is so low. I wish it was higher.
graceful ravine
creeping venom is a sleeper
proper heath
Hemo is still good. When I shiv I want them to die. And it still accomplishes that.
Creeping is really fun
gleaming pawn
yeah creeping venom was also on the list and then I just forgot to type it
sharp sierra
Should i be turning my flad chest into vault? I noticed there is no vers on it.
graceful ravine
cvenom doesnt do much mid-game when everybodys zug zug in the middle aoeing, but it does help score kills when target cant escape to a pillar because theyre slowed
works great vs locks
gleaming pawn
6% increased MS just doesn't feel like it will be impactful at all, especially in this fast paced meta. I don't see 6k off a 100k heal, making much difference
proper heath
it's 6% off every heal during that time, and stacks with dampening. Enough to topple people.
Its 100% nerfed feelsbad. but flying in the air with dfa or randomly running creeping isn't consistent.
You can change it sure. But it's the most consistent talent.
graceful ravine
freedom sprint+disarm+smoke bomb probably my default for most games
swap disarm for creep vs ranged casters
proper heath
And shiv can't be dispelled
so if a druid kites away from you. and he dispells poisons. ur shiv will still be on him.
A monk Revivals. Shivs still on him.
graceful ravine
if a monk revivals, the odds of any remaining MS having an impact is almost 0
team should live
proper heath
depends on how much pressure u have ofc
stable urchin
yo im losing my mind here
sometime after i use echoing reprimand my next shadowstrike will get me to 6 combo points, no shadowblades no rotten nothing
what is going on xD
gleaming pawn
shadow technique, autos have a stacking chance to proc an additional CP
proper heath
Echoing gives combo points
theres no way after using echoing you have 0. unless u used another finisher
stable urchin
must have been premed
i thought it worked from true stealth not shadow dance
was it always like this?
harsh steppe
gm all ❤️
what addon is this? I think it's my dr diminish addon but not 100% sure
i know i need it, but i am trying to move it to a different location, and i can't remember what it was lol
graceful ravine
i thought it worked from true stealth not shadow dance
yes
wanton breach
gm all ❤️
what addon is this? I think it's my dr diminish addon but not 100% sur...
omnibar
harsh steppe
ahhhh tysm ❤️
proper heath
gm all ❤️
what addon is this? I think it's my dr diminish addon but not 100% sur...
I love this question is "Wtf is on my screen!?"
😄
graceful ravine
idg how pika plays without the cool down # on his bars
does he just estimate the time based off his memorization of every cd?
proper heath
What you mean? Pics
graceful ravine
like this
proper heath
0_0
graceful ravine
he actually lost an awc match cos of it too
proper heath
What happened
graceful ravine
he had drake dead in the duel but he mistimed his cold blood, secret tech bc secret tech was on cd for 1 second
so he cold blood evis instead
cos he couldnt tell the cd
proper heath
😮
harsh steppe
ahhh ty i'll put on timers tyty
proper heath
and tech woulda 100% killed
graceful ravine
whazz had a clip of it somewhere and explained it
proper heath
unfortunate
harsh steppe
& what are these 2 diamonds? charges, right, but for what?
graceful ravine
proper heath
@graceful ravine ok but hear me out. Win the AWC, Or have everyone including whaaz talk about you?
It's 5head
I think pika comes out ahead overall 🙂
literally a blizzard feature
graceful ravine
ya u see his ui he disables # everywhere
does he do calculus in his head
to figure out the cds of those
based off the angle of the shading
proper heath
I watched the whaaz video. The shading is sooooooo faint . I cannot see it towards the end.
oh well. Whatever he is comfortable with
Are you guys playing Improved Wound as sub? I that standard?
harsh steppe
ya
scarlet plover
im kinda new to rouge, are have they always been super squishy or am I just trash at using defensives
proper heath
@scarlet plover both are probably true. We are definitely squishy.
Compared to guardian druids
scarlet plover
lol
proper heath
😄
scarlet plover
I played balance in late shadowlands and that was my experince with pvp
bold bison
if you guys get a Sub lobby full of feeders who die within 30 seconds do you waste dances on peeling and try to win, or do you just accept your 2-4 and go next?
scarlet plover
I played balance in late shadowlands and that was my experince with pvp
and im still not fully geared (396 in pvp) but its a lot trying to live after the vial is off cooldown
proper heath
if you guys get a Sub lobby full of feeders who die within 30 seconds do you was...
you want to be the one doing the eating if they are feeding.
bold bison
you want to be the one doing the eating if they are feeding.
I'm new to sub and i'm struggling, usually takes me 2-3 goes to win a game, if they don't last that long it's rough
proper heath
and im still not fully geared (396 in pvp) but its a lot trying to live after th...
if you are 396, you are missing alot of HP. Get even more geared. You will be ok. You will start feeling a bit tankier. But you will never be a warlock. or a DK.
scarlet plover
if you are 396, you are missing alot of HP. Get even more geared. You will be ok...
🫡
helm, gloves, cape and wrists then im done
proper heath
I'm new to sub and i'm struggling, usually takes me 2-3 goes to win a game, if t...
When you are new, dont look at your score and win loss. That doens't matter. You are floating anyways. Find things to practice and improve everygame. and the wins will come.
And try not to blame your teammates, Your teammates will throw .. all the way up until 3300 rating. You have people dying in 30 seconds in every bracket.
You are the only constant in all these games.
bold bison
When you are new, dont look at your score and win loss. That doens't matter. You...
that's what I'm doing, spamming games, I'm at a juncture now where I'm not sure what to focus on to improve past 2k (altho I've just tanked to 1.8k). generally speaking I have a gameflow in my head where I'll do a kidney on healer and cheap go on DPS if we're out in the open, a blind on healer and kidney go if the healer trinkets, a kidney/smokebomb go if they're far from healer, if there's a really good go and my DPS is popping off I'll follow up the kidney on healer with a gouge/duel to give them time to kill etc.
but if I get peeled on my go I'm kinda lost, or if someone throws in 30 seconds I'm not sure whether to blow my 2nd dance on peels for example
proper heath
ofc peel for your friends. Absolutely.
Blow ur 2nd dance for sure. Because u will get another dance.
it's not like u have 2 dances all game.
if you dont peel they die 😦
bold bison
I also find it mega hard to adjust when my team randomly puts everyone on stun DR
proper heath
I also find it mega hard to adjust when my team randomly puts everyone on stun D...
LOL, dude. welcome to solo shuffle. This isn't a bracket thing. EVERYONE will do this to you.
get used to it. Sometimes.. I facepalm IRL because of the shit going on during the game.
sometimes you're like well.. I guess I'm just doing random damage for the next 10 seconds.
sharp sierra
Yeah last game i just had i had healer sapped he trinkets because we burn a dps down and as soon as he trinkets i blind him. 2-3 seconds into the blind the feral we had decided to jump on healer and start dpsing him when we had a guy at like 20% 🤦🏻♂️
Literally no reason, healer is at 100% hp i have their DK disarmed and healer blinded all we had to do was sit on feral for an extra 5 seconds.
proper heath
🤦♂️
dusky flower
on any of his spells
his game awareness is insane. hes always been an advocate. that AWC should be played with no addons.
sharp sierra
Another week no bloodfang armor drops, but i get shoulder helm and chest for a lock. Can’t wait to do it on my lock and get all the rogue stuff
I hate it here.
plucky sage
his game awareness is insane. hes always been an advocate. that AWC should be pl...
Ok but missing a kill because he doesn't use CD numbers which is built in to the game options is a bit overkill and he deserved what he got.
But yeah he's an incredible player otherwise
dusky flower
lol i dont care if he missed a kill or not. dude asked why he didnt have numbers. SMH
sullen umbra
i have been tanking rating for the last 2 weeks its insane
graceful ravine
ever since "inflation" started, # of players above 2400 went from 360 to.... 446
wtb inflation bomb
thats less than classic wotlk gladiators from this past season lol
wotlk this past season got bout 700 ish glads, which is 0.5% of the population
plucky sage
lol i dont care if he missed a kill or not. dude asked why he didnt have numbers...
You responded to the comment about him not using CD numbers and stated that he advocates for no add-ons. Cool, but I'm simply saying it's got nothing to do with not using add-ons.
dusky flower
cool story bro. tell me again before i go to bed later.
dusky flower
im not lol. cool assumption though. 😄
plucky sage
Oh so you're just rude and obnoxious naturally, nice.
dusky flower
lol
take it to the dm if your really that hurt about me typing if not... smile more and enjoy your day LOL
pale storm
wotlk this past season got bout 700 ish glads, which is 0.5% of the population
You talking about across all brackets?
graceful ravine
ya just quick math for all brackets
pale storm
Ok, because for 3s specifically there was only 241 spots including r1 spots
graceful ravine
2s got 400 ish
so that means 14000 wotlk pvp player base for 700 glads at 0.5%
theres 14000 DH's alone in retail pvp
according to this page, 350k pvp playerbase ish, could be more
446 glads for 350k playerbase is 0.125%
pale storm
I think wotlk doesn’t take into account players below a certain rating like 1k iirc
graceful ravine
this statistic page only counts top 5k as well
if retail had wotlk glad requirements (0.5%), we would have at least 2k glads rn
fierce laurel
It also doesn’t account that it just happened and we have at least another 6 weeks.
graceful ravine
inflation mmr doesnt affect wotlk the same way it does retail since theyre % based
same # of potential glads 2 months into the season vs the end
the goal post of CR to get glad changes, but total # wont really
graceful ravine
not nearly fast enough imo
fierce laurel
Did they say when the season ends?
jolly sierra
in retail u say?
graceful ravine
2200 CR is #1000 on ladder atm
If 20 per week inflation goes on for another #10 weeks, we would have 1000 glads
which is still very little
vs 4-5k avg glad in shadowlands per season
jolly sierra
is ironic how the season is so deflated compared to shadowlands
graceful ravine
its deflated compared to every season ever too, not just shadowlands
jolly sierra
thinking in DF having more subs
graceful ravine
gonna be harder for R1s to get R1s too since smaller population and less spots
theyll get r1 in solo tho
graceful ravine
esp with how easy it is for r1s to make alts and be geared instantly
jolly sierra
yeah
raven cliff
I just read the patch notes about the healing reduction nerf from 35% to 30%.
Sooo, what class should I reroll to now that Rogue is a dead class?
waxen meteor
it's not dead, but the specific pvp talent value becomes questionable a bit
raven cliff
Really? From a 5% reduction? I was just joshing
waxen meteor
but you can try reroll to ret for 10.0.7
raven cliff
Oh I am, 100%. I played them for 2 hours in the PTR and fell in love
waxen meteor
Really? From a 5% reduction? I was just joshing
5% reduction isn't big, but anyway we have 24% constant reduction
with talent it used to be 24%->35% now it's 24%->30%
if we think -5% is not too much value lost
+6% as a pvp talent isn't too much value added as well
raven cliff
That's true, appreciate you for elaborating
raven cliff
finally, i can flex 1k8 w ret pre rework
Eh, doesn't count. The mentality in knowing ret is getting a rework carried you the last bit /s
graceful ravine
I have no idea what the ret changes are, just assuming they’re insane
graceful ravine
Any big dam?
jolly sierra
think so, in cleaving
raven cliff
Abilities get more range, they've replaced abilities so they feel more meaningful instead of fluffy fillers, and the resource is much more intuitive to build/spend
jolly sierra
dont recall too much
they are giving them the -20% reduction baseline instead a talent too
graceful ravine
20% reduction for what
waxen meteor
I have no idea what the ret changes are, just assuming they’re insane
all skills from 11 yards to 23 yards
jolly sierra
than holy has
waxen meteor
graceful ravine
sounds fun
jolly sierra
to reduce dmg in stuns
graceful ravine
Time to make an alt??
waxen meteor
who needs mobility when you can attack from 24 yards
jolly sierra
who needs mobility when you can attack from 24 yards
light guides me
waxen meteor
light guides me
well in theory it's not agaisnt lore
you are throwing light to people
so why only 1 yrd range
raven cliff
Time to make an alt??
Go for it! I already have a L70 waiting. Like I said, I tried them in PTR and now I've decided to main it with 10.0.7
jolly sierra
canon wise should be unlimited in range
jolly sierra
yes
waxen meteor
but it's still not confirmed?
jolly sierra
was datamined
raven cliff
I heard ret is also getting a jump skill?
Rumored, yes. Not currently on PTR though
karmic python
Guys dropped from 2298 after Holding ist 1 week between 2200-2300 to 2000, wash my brain to not quit 😐😐😐😐
waxen meteor
Guys dropped from 2298 after Holding ist 1 week between 2200-2300 to 2000, wash ...
it happens
last week alone i dropped to 1800 and jumped back to 2350
i blamed playing too much DH alt
karmic python
Damn also hard, never was so frustratet and cloose to 2,4 with rogue 🥵
raven cliff
Hardstuck at 1100. At least I can't drop much further right
raven cliff
Nah,, I'm too far gone. Thanks tho fam
jolly sierra
np :l
jolly sierra
cdew and venruki should podcast together
wintry dew
100% fr
proper heath
https://twitter.com/ElliottVenczel/status/1630375839551602688?t=30qCEom9F0M4OEvS...
this is a very stupid post
he just wants to complain.
I"m busy watching Venruki's stream atm. he just complains whether he is winning or losing.
I think its his brand.
raven cliff
Don't all big PvPers whine and complain tho?
wintry dew
^ yes
proper heath
yes.
They just whine. Because its content
and gets people in chat to engage.
Basically fox news.
turbid rose
I've never seen Pika or Xaryu complain too much, but not an avid watcher. Heard Bahjeera somewhat complain.
proper heath
Who is the highest pvp streamer?
raven cliff
Pika and Xaryu keep it internal and just whine about each other
turbid rose
Pika and Xaryu keep it internal and just whine about each other
I actually have seen that lol.
jolly sierra
pika once said "rogue is dead" in twitter
and dropped more than half rogues pop in that season
raven cliff
Pika's a huge troll tbf
turbid rose
I'm just glad Rogue has an active community and content creators lol. Made learning it and playing it more enjoyable. That's why I picked up warrior originally.
raven cliff
Same. Love the Rogue community
vocal surge
You know what'll help Outlaw Rogues in PvP?
turbid rose
Rogue definitely has one of the better communities lol.
vocal surge
Buffing Sinister Strike and Fatal Flourish
raven cliff
Speaking of communities, have you guys seen the Druid Discord server?
turbid rose
Yeah, it's mostly shit posting from what I can see.
raven cliff
It's so bad it made me want to play something else
proper heath
Speaking of communities, have you guys seen the Druid Discord server?
i was in their pvp section a few days ago. and it was just people posting pictures of their Biceps ... and then I left.
raven cliff
Looks like it was created literally a day ago
turbid rose
Same
I was gonna try Feral, then just kind of dropped it.
Pally was a lot of bitching about Pally.
raven cliff
That's justified though 😄
turbid rose
Sometimes.
jolly sierra
ironically this community should be the most toxic
turbid rose
I've been 1 shot enough by Rets that I feel like sometimes they cry too much lol.
turbid rose
ironically this community should be the most toxic
I see what you did there.
jolly sierra
where lol
turbid rose
There.
jolly sierra
where
turbid rose
Oh, were you not going for a pun? >.>
I thought you were alluding to Rogues using poisons. XD
vocal surge
x)
raven cliff
Oh shit, I forgot to apply my poisons again
jolly sierra
no, i was talking about the outdoor edgy undead players which just trashtalk everyone
and make us be hated lol
turbid rose
Ah, yeah idk. I hear people complain about Kidney every so often.
I also feel like playing Rogue awakened my inner asshole as well because I felt obligated to gank anyone I saw open world. But I do that regardless of class, so may just be me.
raven cliff
Same.
Though I rolled Undead specifically so I can eat them out afterwards too
jolly sierra
me too, i love when ppl just ragewhisper u then u kill them back when log in
turbid rose
I haven't had too many rage whispers, I usually ignore it though. Ain't got time for children throwing tantrums lol. And yeah, I play undead on horde side for will of the forsaken and noms.
jolly sierra
is funny af, better if u don't say anything
raven cliff
I like to sap people as they're about to fly off or the last second before they finish their hearthstone. Pisses people off
turbid rose
I like to sap people as they're about to fly off or the last second before they ...
Ok, I'm guilty of this too.
Maybe people are rightfully pissed at Rogues tbh.
turbid rose
I sap people mining and herbing too.
proper heath
Lol I try not to fuck with people as a rogue too much. Only harmless stuff.
We are so OP in world pvp.
Dont want to be an ass.
raven cliff
Subtlety is viable too, not just Ass 
proper heath
Lol
turbid rose
Yeah lol, that's why I'm double gathering. Idk what's worse, just murdering someone, or just sapping for lulz.
proper heath
I really can't play any other class than rogue for pve. The stealth mechanic is just too good quality of life .
turbid rose
It really is.
proper heath
Sneak past all the mobs, finish your quest insantly.
raven cliff
And Vanish!
turbid rose
Yeah Vanish toom
proper heath
I tried to play my shadow priest Pve. And like I have to kill 50 mobs before I can get to the quest mob in the dungeon.
And if you pull anything... well GL.. can't mount
turbid rose
Yeah.
proper heath
you better turn around and waste 10 secs killing it
raven cliff
Only other class I've really enjoyed is Frost Mage. Good CC, can kill lots of mobs at once easily, and you have a counter to everything
turbid rose
BM Hunter is kinda nice too.
pale storm
Sheesh… arms, fury, marks lobby is monka
raven cliff
My first match in Solo Shuffle as Rogue was against an Unholy Death Knight, an Arms Warrior, and a Fury Warrior - on Blade's Edge.
And the healer kept being toxic at me for not doing anything
turbid rose
Yeah, was hard for me to learn Rogue. Was too focused on trying to do all kinds of stuff like lock down healer while applying pressure and stuff. Didn't even know my rotation or how to open lol.
Still terrible at it, but more comfortable than I was.
velvet wagon
https://youtu.be/EnX_VBXLSeQ?t=186 can someone explain how he resaps here?
without using vanish
keen warren
meld -> stealth
velvet wagon
meld op i guess for rogue lol
wintry dew
velvet wagon
ah mb i didnt see
wintry dew
Yes it is
raven cliff
meld op i guess for rogue lol
But can they eat people? 
turbid rose
Definitely no Noms.
hoary bear
anyone else got the bug in arena where sometimes u get out of stealth but your bar is stuck and it still shows ur stealth bar and u need to reload?
its so annoying
jolly sierra
yeah, needed to disable an specific addon to stop it
raven cliff
I'm using the same abilities on both bars, stealth or not. Anyone else?
turbid rose
My bar 1 changes when I stealth, but that's it.
hoary bear
I'm using the same abilities on both bars, stealth or not. Anyone else?
but why
calm roost
sharp sierra
Yeah sometimes happens and then i get a message saying something with UI is messed up to disable or ignore. If i disable it basically does the same thing a /reload would and if i ignore there will be a few abilities that don’t respond on press
Everyone still using vault delvers chest? Found it weird just looking today that it doesn’t even have vers on it.
Bruh, i was on my rogue and was doing BWL for bloodfang pieces so while i’m doing them i put my spec as sub for faster movement. Arena poped and wasn’t paying attention and went in with all random talents action bars not even set up.
potent pivot
probably shouldn't be trying to evade the bot filter
it deleted your original comment for a reason
bold bison
just played a 1-5, my team mate died within 30 seconds in FOUR rounds
cba man
they took turns griefing me
unborn portal
5% is big
tribal badger
that makes hemo barely better then imp wound lul
isnt imp wound fully stacked like 24%
hemo 30%
proven field
Well how many healing spells are % based off stam vs off Int
tribal badger
ur giving up a pvp talent to turn ur 24% ms into a 30% ms for 8s
seems pretty meh but im sure assass will be fine
proven field
Well with the 40% buff to stam I think you’ll find it will actually truck harder
Depending on how each healer scales
tribal badger
huh
i mean
its not like they reduced MS effects across the board to "tune them" for the stamina buff
its just sin
so pretty sure its supposed to be a net nerf
every MS effect gets stronger from the stam buff
proven field
True I just mean it’s barely a nerf that you likely won’t even notice
Healers already gonna panic
lucid citrus
people still running Hemo talent?
bold bison
my first 0-6
I hate this game
whenever I watch high rated gameplay for pointers I never see anyone getting peeled on their go
I can barely press sectec for the first minute of the game
I don't understand
I don't get how to get better at this
I got scammed by skillcap, they have virtually no sub rogue content
jolly sierra
did u bought a skillcapped sub?
bold bison
I did
jolly sierra
if they fail i helping u they will refund ur money
bold bison
CD-R build, starts by Aiden saying how strong Outlaw Rogue is
I’ll email them tomorrow, I’m too tilted, going to sleep it off
harsh steppe
so i think i have the verrrrry basics down but i'm still confused on what i should be doing to the kill target while i'm blind sapping the healer? i saw a video that said to use marked for death > kidney the kill target, but i'm running the dm & db build from the faq, which doesn't include MfD
jolly sierra
show ur talents in a screenshot
harsh steppe
harsh steppe
ah mb
fiery eagle
god damn sub is hard in SS
jolly sierra
i recall subs doing that
harsh steppe
ah ok ty
but what about while im sapping & blinding? just wait out that whole blind, then the whole sap, then the shorter sap, then the shorter sap again? that's what im doing atm and i am just standing there
jolly sierra
you cant trust ur partners, if the 2 mongos than u have as enemies are beating them maybe one of your partners will die
try joining them after sapping'
harsh steppe
ah ok so just get as close to the kill target while still maintaining my cc on the healer?
but o/w just standing there waiting out the blind & sap is ok?
i jsut feel like i should be doing something to kill target while i'm still in stealth
jolly sierra
sap and go
harsh steppe
ahhh that explains it tysm ❤️
jolly sierra
blackjack will trigger after sap fades, so u have -20% healing done from enemy healer
then u are struggling them a lot, specially with ur go
you can save the blind for a go
100% sure healer will trinket that if u go w kidney on a dps
harsh steppe
ok tysm
and do i need to pay attention to my energy? seems like i just need to focus on my combo points
harsh steppe
ah ok
watchign some pro rogues out there and they have their avatar in the very top left with tiny little energy bars, idk how they can even pay attention to that so far away lol
i'll keep the energy bar from the wa in the faq then, tysm
jolly sierra
maybe they know how sub flows in the combat, so knows how their energy regen
but u need to know then u are energy starved
harsh steppe
ah makes sense, tysm
harsh steppe
yep! been watching that one on repeat super helpful
waxen meteor
I am not sure opening by cs is good anymore
fierce laurel
It is.
worthy crag
so is fury legit now after the patch or still a meme spec?
waxen moon
is sub better or assassin in pvp/WPVP
stark river
both are good. assa is easier/more meta
minor cape
i just want to say that if you are a rogue in wpvp
once you open all the enemies INSTANTLY switch to you
but i believe sub is better in wpvp for farming your sparks and shit
because of the double vanish
raven cliff
but why
Old habit from when I played Subtlety. Also, to easier practice my muscle memory
minor cape
i also dont swap out stuff
its same for me both stealthed and not
cause what rogue abilities do you only use from stealth
harsh steppe
gm ❤️ yall ready for another noob question?
willow garden
Do you guys thistle tea to get mastery buff before you open ?
worthy widget
proper heath
Do you guys thistle tea to get mastery buff before you open ?
absolutely not . Where did you get this info?
2nd person to have said that.
Mastery affecting our dots is Dynamic. So you're drinking a 1 min cd, for exactly 3 ticks of garrote and no other benefits. what a waste. dont do it.
willow garden
@proper heath some guide lol. Also if you open on one person do you use two garrotes so u get full combo points and rupture mfd kidney then continue ?
proper heath
<@201883219396657153> some guide lol. Also if you open on one person do you use ...
I think I know the guide you are talking about. I dont wanna shit on the guy, there theres some really sus info in that guide.
To answer your question:
a 5 Combo point rupture is not necessary, this isn't a raid boss.
When I open, the rotation is Garrote, you will have 3cp, Rupture, MFD kidney. Thats 3 Globals. And the person has all dots and is in a stun. On a caster or a healer, they will still be silenced into a stun.
If you garrote garrote, rupture, MFD kidney, The person will be not silenced for 1 global, and will be able to peel you.
For Melee, Just MFD kidney, Garrote, Rupture, Shiv, Echoing. Send him home.
Garrote Garrote Rupture is for raids, where you have all the time in the world. to setup your pve rotation. No one is gonna peel you. Garbage .
Thistle Tea before opener. GARBAGE. you can thistle when you have full dots. Guys in a kidney, and you're about to envenom the guy.
I'm standing next to you in game. hi dude 🙂
willow garden
@proper heath ok great. And when you going for the kill it also doesn’t matter how many points rupture you put as long as it is in there ?
Sspika?
Oh I see u lolll
proper heath
Yes, After your opener. When the game progresses and you are prepping for your next kidney, then you can put up a 5 CP rupture. Then you can slice and dice. Etc.
But when you open, Garote, Rupture, MFD kidney. Dont double garrote the same target into a 5 point rupture. not in the opener.
willow garden
No trinket?
willow garden
Looking at ur gear
proper heath
I'm in pve gear
willow garden
Ahh
willow garden
Hahaha good info man
proper heath
was just saying hi
willow garden
I need lot of practice
proper heath
if you are giga struggling, keep asking questions. contact people. ask what ur doing wrong. Vods are great.
because the amount of times someone links me a vod, and I'm like dude... ur literally not pressing one of your key abilities.
Record urself. upload it. Ask people for criticism. its really the fastest way to gain rating.
willow garden
This is my 7th alt so just need more time practicing and building up muscle memory
I will try to do that 🙂
proper heath
Gl dude. Just msg if u need help. Btw my transmog was better than yours.
Good talk.
willow garden
Last question before u go
willow garden
When is all melee lobby and am the obvious target you take cheat death over elusiveness?
Haha
proper heath
No. Elusiveness when used correctly far exceeds cheat death. 20% damage reduction during their pressure is huge.
Seriously. Cheat death is only for stuff where you can potentially get one shot. Like sub rogues going you.
willow garden
Alright then
proper heath
Elusiveness for everything else. However! If yo u are new. And u suck at pressing elusiveness. Go cheat.
willow garden
I have weak aura for feint so I press it on cd
proper heath
I press feint on instinct. If you are new. You will probably not do that. Go cheat death to make ur life easier. But know that there is a better way.
And the worst part is. 90% of the time. Cheat death doesn't work. and I die to it bugging.
Or I die through anyways.
humble python
Whats the difference between the 2 relevant sub rogue builds?
I think theres 2, the rotten/Invig or Finality
hazy pewter
anyone know of any rogue guides (especially assa) in this style https://youtu.be/8unZuMgWtEg
its basically him doing a vod review of his own game where he is constantly pausing and explaining his thought process and why he's using each ability step by step throughout the match
I found this extremely helpful when I was learning WW but so far the only rogue guides I've found were the more generic "heres all the information you can get by opening up some armories and looking up a rotation guide"
proven kayak
anyone know of any rogue guides (especially assa) in this style https://youtu.be...
I can do it really simple for you, go mage cc rogue if rogue trinkets you all in him in ks and he flops, if you are ccd your healer should keep rogue in combat,also you have to kick the sheeps. Knowing your limits and your partener for not overlap or over force cds can make you win easy till a certain cr point(-2400)
hazy pewter
Sorry, I should've been more clear. I don't mean the matchup specifically
just the format of guide
probably the thing I'm struggling with the most is just the general bloat of rogues kit and the reasons why you would use X over Y in a given situation etc etc
Like when I play my WW my options are far and away more limited
but even still, hearing why he used what he did when he did in that guide was very applicable to almost all of my matches not just that comp
It was a lot more educational than every other guide I had seen up to that point so I'm hoping an equivalent exists
proven kayak
Sorry I dont know someone like this but shadenox videos used to be a good lesson how and why he does stuff in his matches very simplified
But I mostly learned by trial and error never studied stuff
bold bison
It was a lot more educational than every other guide I had seen up to that point...
I haven't found a guide like that yet, I'm in the same boat as you, but one thing I do is watch VODs back of high rated Rogues at 0.5x, if I don't understand why they've done something outside of the 'do a go on DR' script, I pause and try to work it out
it's a bit laborious compared to a guide but it might be the best option
hazy pewter
yeah shadenox is the closest I've found
jolly sierra
yes
rancid cipher
I miss only crafted head for full pvp or?
I started to spend conq on tmog from the set so I would just like to clear that out, if anyone can take a look*
fierce laurel
If you run 4 piece you run set helmet.
harsh steppe
do i need any of these optional reagents to make my ring? like the secondary stat one?
rancid cipher
If you run 4 piece you run set helmet.
And which item is my 2nd embell for pvp then?
I assumed that I only need crafted head to complete pvp gear
waxen meteor
do i need any of these optional reagents to make my ring? like the secondary sta...
For ring i guess yeah
for head and foot, not that needed
minor cape
do i need any of these optional reagents to make my ring? like the secondary sta...
100% you need the ring 418 ilvl
so you need that concentrated primal infusion
harsh steppe
conc primal infusion, anything else? embelishment? 2nd stat?
i want it to be perfect
fierce laurel
And which item is my 2nd embell for pvp then?
Lariat boots.
fierce laurel
conc primal infusion, anything else? embelishment? 2nd stat?
Mastery verse customization.
harsh steppe
is that an item?
fierce laurel
It’s cheap from the AH. Click the space and it will show you the options of what they’re called
rancid cipher
Lariat boots.
I have one lariat thats crit/mastery. Should I craft new one for pvp if im barely hitting 2k rating?
bold bison
hold blind in shuffle to win the game or send it early to get trinket?
harsh steppe
ohhh tysm @fierce laurel found it
proper heath
hold blind in shuffle to win the game or send it early to get trinket?
send it early to get trinket
harsh steppe
is this the embellishment i want?
proper heath
@harsh steppe You can only have a max of 2 Embellishments. You will craft Lariat, which is 1. And boots, which is another.
You cannot put another embellishement on
So no. That is not the one u want
harsh steppe
this one?
proper heath
Basically , you can't make that. You need to get someone else to make it for you.
harsh steppe
chrome schooner
- you need the item to make it 418
harsh steppe
so i need to make that elemental lariat, then use that lariat to put into my ring?
chrome schooner
No
proper heath
NO you bitch LOL
fierce laurel
I have one lariat thats crit/mastery. Should I craft new one for pvp if im barel...
The pvp one is fine.
chrome schooner
You want the lariat
On its own
as a 418 item with an effect
your pvp boots are also an item with en effect
you can have a maximum of 2 effects
harsh steppe
NO you bitch LOL
well that's not very nice
chrome schooner
so the ring, you just don't apply an embelishment
you just craft it like that, without effect
since you're limited to 2 effects
(boots + lariat taking those slots)
harsh steppe
i'm not worried about the lariat for now, i just want to know what to put in here
but it sounds like i dont need one, correct @chrome schooner?
chrome schooner
you put nothing in here
if you craft the lariat
since the lariat has a passive effect
and you can equip a maximum of 2 passive effects
fierce laurel
You can put the dust for +1 to sparkles.
chrome schooner
hehe
harsh steppe
having a hard time understanding but it sounds like i can make my ring w/o the embellishment, so i'll go ahead and proceed aha
tysm guys
chrome schooner
well it's simpler than you seem to think !
harsh steppe
this is what i want next?
chrome schooner
you can only equip 2 items with an additional effect (embelishment) at a time. the pvp boots with 5% empowerement on the CC reduction are one, so you have one left
which means that IF you craft the lariat, which comes with a passive effect as well, then you can no longer equip items with an additional effect
And so, IF you craft your rign with one
harsh steppe
ahhh
harsh steppe
& bis is embelisshed boots & neck, which i want
chrome schooner
since the strongest 2 effects are boots + lariat
IF you wanna tryhard and craft alariat eventually
then your ring needs to NOT have a bonus effect
that's it!
harsh steppe
ty ❤️
harsh steppe
IF you wanna tryhard and craft alariat eventually
my middle name is tryhard hue hue hue
fierce laurel
You can embellish ring until your 20th concentrated prima focus.
If you run pvp neck until then
pale storm
If you can’t get the 418 crafted lariat or ring, just get the conquest ones
patent fossil
Are there any resources for rogue duel/1v1 matchups? Or is mostly "cc them during their big CD and then burst->reset"
background: I stink
wise breach
Some day I will get another Spark of Ingenuity so I can make a PvP Lariat, it's been over 2 weeks since my last one
jolly sierra
KEK
potent pivot
I assumed that I only need crafted head to complete pvp gear
yes the helm is fine. optionally you can get lariat but it's only worth it if you can get it at max ilvl, and correct stats etc
tawny kestrel
how did u manage to go 2-6
tawny kestrel
maybe
unborn portal
potent pivot
2-6
unborn portal
I lost before I joined and I lost after game ended
2-6
cant wait to go home and get this fucking shaco armor
potent pivot
cant wait to go home and get this fucking shaco armor
potent pivot
oh ya
unborn portal
yes
Im buying both hoods/scarf and black pirate hat
easy
probably gold chest backpack too
toxic yarrow
I’m going for the dark moon outfit fitting for a rogue
jolly sierra
to go crazy like cicero
raven belfry
jolly sierra
u cant? lol
then what is the sense of getting that without using flames of ragnaros?
unborn portal
The purple sword with flames of ragnaros?
quasi grail
If you're not using https://www.wowhead.com/item=113082/precious-bloodthorn-loop you're missing out on actual BIS🥶 Extra vanish 😮 8000000dps hack 真他妈的狗屎 +1000 rating🫡
jolly sierra
The purple sword with flames of ragnaros?
the other one
quasi grail
Huh works in bg's. Hate blizz
jolly sierra
i thought was about the 2h swords
stable urchin
how do you guys use shadowblades?
its so clanky with ER
do i use them seperately?
on the go i dont have ER?
tawny kestrel
how do you guys use shadowblades?
if u are playing the dark brew + er build which i assume u are
then just use blades randomly at some point
hazy pewter
how did u manage to go 2-6
The same way we go 7-1 https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/290367584770064386/1080344862165053521/image.png
waxen meteor
The same way we go 7-1 https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/290367584770064386...
teach me
brittle glen
will assassination rogue > resto druid > spriest be good as a comp?
stark river
Yep. Good comp.
brittle glen
nice ty
dull bridge
I’m going for the dark moon outfit fitting for a rogue
yeah we're all clowns here
petition to add dance to restless blades
hazy pewter
I just watched Xars video for that game
at the end he looks to see if 3420 is r1 overall
a rogue has 3421 lul
humble python
Whats the difference between the 2 relevant sub rogue builds?
I think theres 2, the rotten/Invig or Finality
dull bridge
yeah I'm 5k XP 😎
pale storm
It was 3300 cap, 20 increase per week, the mmr cap won’t be that much higher, probably 3500, but I guess rating could be higher
jaunty mirage
Whats the difference between the 2 relevant sub rogue builds?
I think theres 2,...
dark brew probably has more sustain if you maintain rupture
jolly sierra
i still don't get why cheat death just let me instadie instead reducing the dmg after the fatal blow xd
humble python
dark brew probably has more sustain if you maintain rupture
is dark brew mainly for rupture damage?
and finality etc
And does the burst rotation change depending if u play rotten or finality?
humble python
And sorry for follow up question, is tier not worth it?
jaunty mirage
tier is always worth it
humble python
most sub rogue just run 2pc
Oh I didnt know that, why not 4 set?
jolly sierra
the problem is was against a BM/MM/warr and then 2 dhs and the same warr
in 1 round the warr 1 shotted me in a global
so enough for today, i don't wanna meet him xd
sullen umbra
good work, keep climbing
yes chef
sharp sierra
which class gets trained the least
bold bison
I rarely get trained on UHDK
sharp sierra
mage and boomkin feel impossible to play when getting trained
jaunty mirage
which class gets trained the least
statistically its uhdk
by like a lot
then demo/bm hunter/frost dk and i think maybe fury war are all kinda close in "second"
jolly sierra
thought arcane wasn't too focused too
jaunty mirage
its not bad no
nothing really comes close to uhdk
but arcane would be like the "third" tier if you were doing it that way
jolly sierra
i see
jaunty mirage
its not even the least trained mage spec
jolly sierra
is that frost?
jaunty mirage
which are very heavily represented in shuffle overall
i mean not just that
even with melee having way too much mobility
its still incredibly difficult to train a frost mage
jolly sierra
imo my worst target overall between mages
is an arcane
the fucker just kites more compared to frost
jolly sierra
i still in BFA
jaunty mirage
with frost youre just snared the entire time
jolly sierra
when i tried to get an arcane to kill
the guy just ran with mov reduction and then if i get close just used root
yeah, at least the snare has dr
but tbh i really hate when ppl call frost or arcane the targets
cuz they run a lot or has disgusting defensives against melees
bruh that record
neither me have that
torpid swan
do warlocks have something that eats kidneyshot? i had it happen a few times now on warlocks where they're not DRed but they dont get stunned from a full kidney
hazy pewter
precognition maybe?
waxen meteor
yeah frost is hard to train for double melee and if you don't train him he burst on melee crazy
and double kill
jaunty mirage
do warlocks have something that eats kidneyshot? i had it happen a few times now...
Precog
torpid swan
ah good catch
jolly sierra
random whispers be like
potent pivot
random whispers be like
a day in the life of a female panda rogue 
jolly sierra
yep lol
waxen meteor
Damn i run into pikaboo
jolly sierra
wat
waxen meteor
in solo in run into pikaboo...
waxen meteor
no they totally confused me i got 1-5
i don't know why, but they kept yelling me to go straight to monk no matter what and do not swap for any reason
i feel i did horrible because i followed that direction
and they were even saying do not even sap dps
it's a healer monk
jolly sierra
wtf
waxen meteor
I feel there's some drama there
jolly sierra
at that CR was that?
waxen meteor
2400 ish MMR
i had a 5-1 before that game
so i was at 2329 and MMR was a bit higher
that monk was even not coming out of the gate at g5 g6
and they still wanted to simply go there...
i am not sure what was going on
jolly sierra
sometimes ppl just trolls
waxen meteor
i don't know tbh i feel some of them know each other
jolly sierra
i got a lock once which just gave up after 3rd game
jolly sierra
that happened to me once, the guys straight sabotaged the victim when was his partner
waxen meteor
the fucking thing is monk surely knows what's going on
jolly sierra
and when were their enemy they just asked to go straight to him
waxen meteor
imagine two dps run out but monk stays at home
jolly sierra
that happens a lot xd
waxen meteor
he is not afk
he sent the teleport out of gate and run back to arena entrace
two dps runs to our healer
they wanted me to go there to monk
waxen meteor
Sigh... if it was a normal game i might have reached 2400
anyway will reach there one day
jolly sierra
think so
waxen meteor
I think i probably will hit 2400 even with 4-2
waxen meteor
the problem is not to target monk
jolly sierra
MW is a very good target
but his game was sabotaged
so no way can get something from that
waxen meteor
the problem is the very clear instruction from everyone else
Go MW, don't even sap DPS
never swap
never change
blabla
waxen meteor
I mean the first two games are kinda normal
i had 1 win
G1 a healer got killed in 10 seconds
G2 i won with normal game
From G3, EVERYONE is yelling to go Monk
potent pivot
but not even CCing the dps is weirdchamp
potent pivot
you play on NA?
waxen meteor
yeah
potent pivot
i figured since you said you VS'd pika
waxen meteor
yeah i think i will be on some video clip as a dumb rogue soon
I think i run into multiple people here
like davy as well
and wowslayer
etc.
a troll rogue is very unique 🙂
jaunty osprey
bruh
i've gone 3-3 on my alt rogue for the past 9 lobbies
stuck at 3150 on it
i keep getting 3x caster lobbies on blades edge 😦
waxen meteor
Stopping tonight and go sleep
been losing since that weird game
think i need to play another day
jaunty mirage
i keep getting 3x caster lobbies on blades edge 😦
if you told me i could remove blades edge from the game but the tradeoff was rov gets added back in
id happily take it
thats how much i hate blades edge
dusk spindle
have anyone actually seen Bots in SS or is it just streamers
potent pivot
yeah i think a few people have
old dome
which pvp site is better/more up to date?
Drustvar or murloc?
rancid cipher
I have one pvp question that is also general...
Is Arathor tabard alliance equvalent of Defilers tabard from Arathi Basin?
And are those reputation shared, if I hit exalted with arathor I would have Defilers one if I switch to horde?
warm lance
raven cliff
Just started doing Solo Shuffle. Done 3 games so far, and all three games have ended prematurely due to someone leaving. I thought they fixed this?
Man, I haven't finished a game yet and my matchmaking value has dropped from 1500 to 1000. I leveled this rogue so that I could try and get out of elo hell 
tender ferry
Can’t remember the last time I’ve encountered a leaver. Just sounds like shit luck
potent pivot
Is Arathor tabard alliance equvalent of Defilers tabard from Arathi Basin?
You’re probably better off asking that one in #transmog I think 
proud moat
Pikaboo's sub guide says to not use Echoing, but all the top rogues use it. Is there a more up to date guide out there?
potent pivot
Pikaboo's sub guide says to not use Echoing, but all the top rogues use it. Is t...
Video guides get outdated pretty quickly, or sometimes their authors put weird shit in them
proud moat
Are there any decent non Echoing builds? I've never liked the ability
potent pivot
Are there any decent non Echoing builds? I've never liked the ability
You’d just take Alacrity into Deeper Stratagem, but I think overall ER is the better choice
wicked rampart
and wowslayer
I have to actually queue again for you to run into me tho lmao
jaunty mirage
You’d just take Alacrity into Deeper Stratagem, but I think overall ER is the be...
Lot of people are playing deeper strat atm
Even with dark brew apparently
waxen meteor
I have to actually queue again for you to run into me tho lmao
you run into my healer alt as well
jaunty mirage
Just started doing Solo Shuffle. Done 3 games so far, and all three games have e...
The fix is that you can still get points
wicked rampart
My new favorite is people on my team soft afk'ing the first round (just not playing but still there) and then the other person from that team ends up rage quitting so I never even get a chance to break even on the game
jaunty mirage
Some nights def feel like you almost need to not do too well
tribal badger
im guilty of that because i forget that for some reason omnibar prevents me from using any offensive abilities everytime I queue into the first soloq of the day
and need to reload mid fight to fix it
🙂
jaunty mirage
Most of my leavers lately were on the 4th round when I’ve gone 3-0
tribal badger
even when its fully updated
proper heath
Did you guys know. That leaving solo shuffle doesn't drop your mmr. Only your cr.
jaunty mirage
Yep
proper heath
So you can be 1k cr and 3k mmr.
tribal badger
you'd need to abuse it pretty heavily to do that
and you'd probably get banned
blizzard did mention they would watch for players abusing the leaving system as its not intended gameplay
jaunty mirage
I think the issue is there’s nothing to deter people from just leaving if they start poorly
proud moat
You’d just take Alacrity into Deeper Stratagem, but I think overall ER is the be...
I've seen a couple people playing Seal Fate/Vigor, is that a PvE build?
proper heath
So if u wanted to drop rating, You'd have to do a Venruki. And do a -72 X4 😄
tribal badger
eh its not so much an issue anymore now that everyone gets rating based on matches and its a ban worthy offense to do it too often
wicked rampart
im guilty of that because i forget that for some reason omnibar prevents me from...
Yea but I bet you at least run in and try to do something, what I'm talking about is them actually just hard sitting the opening room
tribal badger
well i run in, try to sap, get an error, /reload, and the game is usually half over by the time I get back in
🥹
i need to make a WA to remind myself
to reload in the starting room fo my first soloq every day
its so consistent
wicked rampart
Tbh I'm still just more mad at the leaver than the afk person
Like sure it sucks but play it out ffs
proper heath
well i run in, try to sap, get an error, /reload, and the game is usually half o...
That would be an OP opener. Sap, MFD Full kidney, Garrote, RELOAD UI, Rupture. Shiv.
😄
tribal badger
probably gunna just camp now that I hit 2450 on tuesday
its rather depressing to be a 2450 outlaw rogue and see you are rank 18 on the soloq ladder
outlaws down so bad
humble python
Asked this yesterday, but didnt get all my answers, whats the difference between rotten and finality builds for sub? and how does the burst rotation change if I play one or the other? And I also see a few rotten build run gloomblade, whys that? And why does most sub only use 2 set and not 4 set?
tribal badger
was it yesterday i thought it was 10.0.7 changes not a hotfix
proper heath
It was ysterday.
tribal badger
dispatch gunna go from hitting 12k on plate to 15k on plate