#Put a hard cap on cooldowns

29 messages · Page 1 of 1 (latest)

cyan blaze
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I'm not the first to suggest a hard cap as a way to possibly fix the issue of memories having a one second cd by the game's end even without looping, but I haven't seen any true suggestion of it other than "add a hard cap". So how does this sound (numbers would be additive):

Cap based on difficulty:

  • Easy: no cap
  • Normal: base cap of 1s
  • Ominous: base cap of 2s
  • Nightmare: base cap of 3s

Then, on top of that, add to the cap based on number of loops, but the penalty starts in world 4:

  • World 4, no loop: +1s

Maybe change them to .5s if the higher difficulties end up being too hard. This could also address the issue of people getting bored in multiple loops and ending their runs by intentionally dying.

  • At the beginning of each loop: +1s
tacit shoal
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Then we need cap of stats as well, cause, for example, flashy fenrir with speed of light no even need cooldowns.
Maybe better scale stats and cd cap based on world number.

jaunty shale
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I think there are 2 issues with this:

  1. Certain abilities should be able to be scaled low. (Butcher's strike, frostbite, etc.) Definitely not to 0, but maybe somewhere between like 0.25-0.5s. Why would anyone take abilities that are designed to be spammable when they have a cd that can't be pushed below 3s.

  2. This would also be very weird to implement with Essence of Momentum specifically, as that just subtracts from the current cooldown. Is this specific essence the reason why we want such high base cooldown caps?

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I don't think it's an unreasonable thing to put cooldown caps in the game though, but they do have to be based on the ability itself, not a global flat cap.

cyan blaze
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I'm certainly open to finetune the idea, thought it would be an interesting thing to think about. Probably would be better to look at it from an ability by ability basis.

Momentum wasn't the reason, specifically. It was the overall meta of people rushing to get cooldowns as low as possible, then face-rolling the keyboard/controller to spam everything (which created the deluge of people asking for autocast). I think Momentum would be fine in this hypothetical scenario because that is just one essence that can't be duplicated for the rest of your abilities... easily (I think triggering attack effects would help the other memories though, right?)

As I mentioned before, I was also thinking about people saying they're getting bored in multiple loops and ending the game theirselves. This would force them to think about how and when to use abilities.

languid pasture
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I agree this is an issue that needs to be addressed, feels way too strong and can be annoying when youre not playing self writing story. def needs to be done on a per memory basis tho, which makes things tuff

cyan blaze
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I suggested in one of the latest autocast threads that since we have delusional for temporary percentage-based healing penalties, an equivalent for Cooldown Reduction seems like another viable idea.

cyan blaze
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I have no idea what the fish emoji means @proven pagoda

proven pagoda
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NachiaStare fish

cyan blaze
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Is this a Gen Z thing? Use non slang, please

proven pagoda
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🐟

deft egret
past jasper
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I don't think it means anything

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Also, I am in favour of less cooldown reduction, but a hard cap is probably the worst way to achieve that

deft egret
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  • Maybe a soft cap that reduces the efficiency of cooldown reduction below 1s. (preferably each memory should have its own soft cap value)
  • Maybe attach a negative modifier to all the Essences that do reduce cooldowns.
  • Maybe just rebalance the games to have all skills have way more cooldown (1.5x-3x base cooldown)
  • Maybe reduce base cooldown reduction per memory level)

Then rebalance all enemies and players to be way tankier, all abilities to be more impactful and say goodbye to the braindead spam meta that the current system enables...

Generally all this talk about cooldown being problematic isn't actually a cooldown issue imo, but rather a pacing problem. They can either keep the pacing as it is and people will complain about short cooldowns, or they can change the pacing to be slower and a group of people will emerge that will complain about the long cooldowns (and the associated slow pacing). This is more of a question of what they want their game to be and who the target audience is (I have no clue).

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I certainly find it weird that you can remove cooldown entirely by simply upgrading your memories to +1000 (exaggerated). Generally anything above +100 is already low enough of a cooldown that you wouldn't need an essence to reduce it further, which is probably just amplifying the issues with cooldown even more.

cinder river
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I think increasing base cooldowns and base power is the way to go. Particularly for the level up bonuses on the memories.

past jasper
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I'm planning to mod the heck out of the game as soon as that is supported

proven pagoda
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imagine momentum right technically gives you 0 cooldown but only after actually hitting them with it meaning that you're limited in casting speed

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but with things like essence of flow if you have the right ability you can positive loop it until you are attacking 1000000x a second

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well still depends on memories but

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its a point yk yk

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I'd prefer if the game was more modular I think the game balance of building stuff is relatively fine but being able to change cooldown lengths etc by sliding a slider would be nice

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the game is NOT balanced to be clear but I appreciate that

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getting 100k dreamdust from spectral bullet only is awesome but I can see how some people want more challenging gameplay

deft egret
# proven pagoda but with things like essence of flow if you have the right ability you can posit...

You're kinda underestimating Momentum, since it can do the same thing "with the right ability", its just that instead of an ability that does light damage, you want to have an ability that gives you attack speed such as Battle Cry or even Arrow Storm (you can cast it while its duration is still running via momentum cooldown reduction), which perpetuates a loop of increasing attack speed and increasing buff stacks.

deft egret
deft egret