Bismuth makes this game unenjoyable.

[faint wing]

Bismuth is way to broken. Shes so high above the level of literally every other character that it feels like watching someone with hacks on. Her constellations make it so you dont even have to play the game, just press wasd, and her flexiblr constellations are way past fair. I can't even enjoy this game anymore because my friend always runs bismuth and instantly decimates every boss and entity on the map. Like what do you mean theres a constellation that makes her skills have effectively 0 cooldown. At this point i literally just watch my friend play the game despite also being in the lobby. We did a run where we quit after the first world and his damage output was already in the hundred thousands. Its like they didn't even care about attempting to make her balanced, and just through every op thing they could think of into her kit just for the sake of it. When you play her (obviously when shes levelled up) you dont have to attack, cast memories, find essences, "fight" bosses (because they stop existing immediately) or make effectively any descisions besides whether you want to press w a s or d. She quite literally invalidates everything the game stands for and something needs to be done about it.

[glacial phoenix]

Valid 💯

[rotund kite]

pretty much yeh

[left elbow]

Bismuth is not broken

[rotund kite]

Bismuth is a really fun character, the issue is the default skill she has. Its starfall on crack, AoE, slow and light damage so Essence of Flow does everything.

1 essence of flow on her default skill is enough to clear basically the entire game

[left elbow]

I'm not sure I see why its a problem?

She is still mortal

Unlike for example Mist with a stacked passive

[rotund kite]

its not unless you have the issue OP is talking about. The difference in power make coop not feel super great cause she outpaces everyone

[left elbow]

Mist is much stronger compared to Bismuth idk

[near vessel]

I also do not think Bismuth is broken and that every character has an insane level 30 spike

At least in some way or another

[slate imp]

I think so too, mist + fleche + obsidian + whatever else you want, CDR, autocasts and she goes ham

[near vessel]

^ this pretty much

Vesper literally cannot die once you get to level 30...

At least Bismuth can

I do not think that this means Vesper needs to be rebalanced though

I think its safe to assume that if your friend has Bismuth at lvl 30+ then you have one as well with insane power creep

[drowsy flare]

I don't think that bismuth is broken, as any class has the potential to have a build similar to bismuth, but she definitely does have a base kit that is oriented towards an easy time making an auto-cast, screen clearing build.

After playing twice with my friend, I refuse to play with bismuth in multiplayer anymore. It's just too easy for her to make other players in the lobby irrelevant with her auto-casting abilities

I'm going to give it one more go with my friend now that he's got alternate abilities unlocked for her, but I definitely refuse to play with bismuth in multiplayer if they're using her default abilities.

[left elbow]

I don't see this at all in my games. The opposite really. Bismuth has great potential but I feel Mist and Aurena have much greater impact. Nachia is amazing too and I've seen Shells slap the whole battlefield while I am just walking behind. I think Bismuth is very squishy and she is supposed to nuke as she is a mage. Perhaps her numbers could be lowered but I don't agree with it. It would make her too weak

To add that Yubar can basically fly around immune forever while essences tied to it oneshot everything around

[drowsy flare]

I'm not saying she needs to be nerfed, she's perfectly fine and viable. I'm just saying that her default kit has a very high potential of making the game play itself, which is unfun for the rest of the party.

I'm not saying she needs changes, just that I'm not going to play with someone playing her in multiplayer because I've experienced it twice that I'm useless for half of the game because of her auto-targeted spells killing everything before I can even reach them.

[left elbow]

On what difficulty? Bismuths I see get two shot by enemies

[drowsy flare]

yes, she has low hp, but you literally don't have the do anything but focus on dodging with her default kit

ominous dream

[left elbow]

Thats a good gimmick in my opinion, I don't see how it makes others feel irrelevant

[wanton sparrow]

She has like negative 50 armor. Any difficulty above yellow she will get 1 tapped by bosses even with glacial shield and PMP. She’s very good yes I think other characters need auto aim and auto cast abilities it shouldn’t be gatekept by her. It reminds me lf Death must Die or even Deep Rock Galactic survivor. Both have auto aim auto cast. Bismuth shouldn’t be the only one. Other characters are GIGA jacked through like others have mentioned. Vesper is unkillable. Nachia once built right is also a team battery makes entire team almost unkillable. Aurena becomes a 1 shot god but she needs a bit of setup. Mist has a “I press right click once and everything on screen dies I’ll jump to every single enemy in .5 frames and delete it.” So yes Bismuth is strong but she ain’t crazy like some of the other stuff in the game

[left elbow]

Perhaps its a bit unfair she doesnt have to shoot but thats also a curse no?

[drowsy flare]

because everything dies instantly with her auto-cast, auto-target, abilities (assuming you have a good build). Or they at least die faster than other players can target them or reach them (if they're a melee character)

It's not a huge issue IMO, just I won't be playing with anyone that brings that build in multiplayer

[left elbow]

This is not true on Nightmare sorry, with Lucid Dreams. At least its something I have never witnessed

[drowsy flare]

Paranoia + damage buffs make this easy to pull off. You could even do it without paranoia and with something like insight and flow.

I haven't played on nightmare yet, so sure, it could be true it's harder to pull off there, but I'm sure it's still doable with the right build

[faint wing]

The problem I'm having is that playing with her makes the game unplayable because i basically just watch my friend kill everything before i can even touch them

[drowsy flare]

yup, that's why I refuse to play with people playing bismuth in multiplayer. There's no point in you being part of the party.

My opinion might change after seeing her other abilities being used, but that's what I think about her default kit

[faint wing]

My problem with this is that even though vesper is immortal, he doesnt infringe on your gameplay. Like yes he will outlive you, but there's still risks and decision making and fighting. Literally in area 1 with bismuth i literally cannot even touch enemies due to her instakilling everything on the map.

[faint wing]

This is basically my problem with her, you've just worded it a lot better.

[faint wing]

Nightmare, shes getting like a shield 5 times her health bar almost permanently

[faint wing]

What you're describing is exactly what my friend does every match. It is just as easy to pull off in nightmare difficulty