I highly doubt vsjw will be the king of PvP 
#Half Hourly limit
signal spear
He did?
grand loom
His summons no longer crit
cyan cobalt
Clunkiest unit that has been a minimum requirement in tournaments
sleek pecan
Cleanses will never be worth unit slot
grand loom
huge nerf
potent cloak
His summons no longer crit
🐛
fickle laurel
Cleanses will never be worth unit slot
signal spear
Lmao I was about to say that has to be a bug
potent cloak
why did it take 3 updates to find out?
wha
didnt it become a issue just this update?
grand loom
wha
didnt it become a issue just this update?
and it took yall 3 updates to fix it it?
fickle laurel
I'm like positive summons were critting before
Or maybe it was 5.0 that broke them
potent cloak
reading comprehension challenge
fickle laurel
when they rewrote the crit system
cyan cobalt
1970 can say anything and people will still consider whether its true...
Add 1970 as a debuff cause noone is immune
fickle laurel
grand loom
1970 can say anything and people will still consider whether its true...
but it's true 💔
summons no longer crit
fickle laurel
Add 1970 as a debuff cause noone is immune
TRUE
grand loom
it has been confirmed
signal spear
But yea sjw wont be good in pvp
grand loom
ht tps://discord.com/channels/1205546848035799081/1291141058650046547/1372082969011027998
olive hollow
Add 1970 as a debuff cause noone is immune
we need a cleanse unit
grand loom
here's the proof it's gone
grand loom
So are they supposed to crit
read the message
its a bug according to pysep
they're supposed to crit but as of right now they currently do not crit for the moment
cyan cobalt
1970 as the new debuff
Funny because there's a super similar display bug where healthbars will show 1919 (I assume that's the default number before its overwritten)
They should change it to 1970 as an easteregg
potent cloak
nerf madea?
cuz oneshotting cid breaks the game😭
fickle laurel
Because they fixed how "static" enemies were handled because all of the static enemies are technically boss enemies
signal spear
They could have just fixed cid
Literally no reason to remove the statue interaction
cyan cobalt
cuz oneshotting cid breaks the game😭
Fixes the game*
Those droprates came straight from hell
potent cloak
Fixes the game*
Those droprates came straight from hell
you wouldnt even win when you did that
game would never end
cyan cobalt
Thats unfortunate
fickle laurel
The drop rates are legitimately fine imho
signal spear
Literally her only use and they took it from her
cosmic lintel
Gimme Liberty and Give me fire, Give me a Uryu buff or I retire
fickle laurel
They did fix the issue. They fixed how the enemies are coded
They weren't gonna add some special exceptions after the fact lmao
signal spear
They should have
potent cloak
the parallel between the "new content too fast to finish" suggestions and the "drop rates are too low" suggestions are crazy
cyan cobalt
The drop rates are legitimately fine imho
30 completions with 2 people on hard with no bird or cid is not fine
Thats 120 3% rolls failed
They gotta add an even harder difficulty, cause this isn't cutting it
cyan cobalt
the parallel between the "new content too fast to finish" suggestions and the "d...
That's just people who don't understand survivorship bias
signal spear
Use the catalyst
cyan cobalt
Make one for bird
signal spear
I can see people complaining about choy or yamamoto but cid and birb are fine
cyan cobalt
the parallel between the "new content too fast to finish" suggestions and the "d...
Plus most of those are asking for replayable content, not mind-numbing "become the human mango" content
Odyssey and Tournaments are the only 2 currently actually replayable content in the game
Challenges don't count because they practically change nothing
potent cloak
half of them actually just want more extremely long grinds like vsjw😭
cyan cobalt
Yea that's good too, guaranteed grinds are great
cyan cobalt
I'd love to do a 100 hour quest for Gogeta
potent cloak
is thrice even a modifier in pvp
fickle laurel
Birb does not need a catalyst lmao
fickle laurel
is thrice even a modifier in pvp
afaik no
olive hollow
will i be able to win in pvp by crashing the other persons pc via intense unit spam
potent cloak
you can try
fickle laurel
will i be able to win in pvp by crashing the other persons pc via intense unit s...
No
But that used to be a method
in the first version
fickle laurel
I was the first test subject of PvP and had my game crashed with umpty bajillion ants
grand loom
But that used to be a method
peashooter?
cyan cobalt
Birb does not need a catalyst lmao
3% to get Bird, 1/400 FOUR TIMES to get a good stat, and then 1/4 to get the correct corruption, and then 1/500 to get a good corruption value
its not fine at all
grand loom
manipulate them to turn on vfx and crash their game using it
fickle laurel
I mean, if phoenix shards didn't exist for birb, I'd say yeah it's way too low
fickle laurel
peashooter?
wont be placable lmao
im pretty sure you cant even use it in multiplayer
grand loom
traitless u probably can
remember they're adding traits, and traitless
doubt traitless will have pvp
we'll see tho
signal spear
Did they say that
signal spear
Cant wait for some guy to turn up with his 1 monarch and watch me ban it
fickle laurel
grand loom
Cant wait for some guy to turn up with his 1 monarch and watch me ban it
vergill will be the #1 most banned unit
signal spear
Yes vergil will be meta because of energy drain
Unless the new gg units have something for that
sleek pecan
Yes vergil will be meta because of energy drain
Maybe
Originally i said he would be ass due to cc immunity
But it looks like most of his dmg doesnt even come from that anyways
For aoe dps at least
signal spear
Originally i said he would be ass due to cc immunity
Honestly cc is kind of ass in this game
fickle laurel
I will say
signal spear
The timer for the next attack still goes down while the unit is stunned
signal spear
We are just making stuff up now
fickle laurel
?
signal spear
In what world would goku be used
potent cloak
goku has versatility
most units have a couple of modifiers that hard coutner them
signal spear
Swap unit with 0 damage
sleek pecan
you swap and you're full damage again
Except you lose over 50% of your dps
fickle laurel
What
solid roost
Kinda
cyan cobalt
buff Orihime to give a Debuff Shield 
fickle laurel
I mean, you'd have to hit 20 energy drain enemies. And it's still not that crippling because you literally swap immediately after
worn fossil
energy drain never shoud have been a thing to begin with
solid roost
Probably is a significant dps decrease if it's a lot of energy drain enemies but it really just depends on the enemy density and what not
solid roost
I mean, you'd have to hit 20 energy drain enemies. And it's still not that cripp...
Multihit units to down to 0 in seconds tbh
fickle laurel
And if your opponent sends energy drain enemies with any amount of health to not die by being sneezed on, they're wasting money
fickle laurel
Multihit units to down to 0 in seconds tbh
Yeah, that was kinda the intention
Drain was kinda made with PvP in mind
worn fossil
Drain was kinda made with PvP in mind
meanwhile, jinwoo completely ignoring it be like
fickle laurel
And was in the dbz stages to introduce people to it
solid roost
I still don't really love it considering just how centralising it is but hey maybe we'll see it actually being positive overall
fickle laurel
Whats the multiplier for energy drain
Still being changed, i dunno what the final cost mult is gonna be
solid roost
I wish cleanse units were actually good
fickle laurel
every suggestion just gets derailed from the initial topic and just goes into a discussion about one of 3 things I swear 🥀 gen 2 for talking about specific stuff ahh channel
Not actually every one but
worn fossil
me when the devs try to force us to use sakura
solid roost
Yeah cleanse units being this ass is a bit of an issue
solid roost
That's assuring
signal spear
Cant wait for the next monarch merchant who ignores the entire gimmick
solid roost
Can't be more immune than vsjw
fickle laurel
It was kinda the same situation with the new corruption shards. One of the major problems was just the lack of familiars that were worth gambling corruption on and all the ass statted ones just weren't worth anything, so the only way about it was to just farm more copies until you had a good enough one. That's why they decided to add the shards in afterwards
fickle laurel
Can't be more immune than vsjw
Imagine if he was immune to mind control too 
solid roost
Yeah they should do that 😎
signal spear
You already know they will release a unit thats immune to that soon
solid roost
I saw a suggestion about making passion units immune to that or smth
fickle laurel
No that's not foreshadowing I swear
calm crater
Can't be more immune than vsjw
can be john smith or sakura
solid roost
can be john smith or sakura
?
solid roost
Sjwv is immune to everything just like john smith
signal spear
They implement a new challenge and then conveniently sell the cure in the form of a new unit
solid roost
Since unknown element
signal spear
Who just so happens to need monarch
cosmic lintel
Why is my screen so dark bro
solid roost
Who just so happens to need monarch
Sjwv is one of the least monarch dependent units in the meta rn ima be real
solid roost
That's just
fickle laurel
So then don't use the named summons
solid roost
Yeah you don't use elite summons with deadeye
fickle laurel
you can still use him as an arise spammer with deadeye
solid roost
You use auto arise with deadeye
signal spear
Yea the 3k hp summons arent doing numbers
solid roost
Yea the 3k hp summons arent doing numbers
4.5k on crit, times that by 3
fickle laurel
Or even use beru with arise on to make use of his second passive
solid roost
That's pretty sizable damage
solid roost
Yeah it's based on enemy hp
signal spear
That's pretty sizable damage
All that for less than a third of monarch bears hp
solid roost
10%
solid roost
All that for less than a third of monarch bears hp
You can't exactly summon as many bears as regular shadows can you
signal spear
I was already generous with 3k hp summons
grand loom
Imagine if he was immune to mind control too <:smirking:1325994251498295448>
pointless
solid roost
Nobody's saying monarch is not better
signal spear
You can't exactly summon as many bears as regular shadows can you
Literally sell and replace him
For 2 more bears
solid roost
Literally sell and replace him
Ain't nobody doing that in regular stages 💀
frozen oasis
Sjwv is one of the least monarch dependent units in the meta rn ima be real
vsjw will definitely be meta for pvp traitless and trait enabled. id argue deadeye vsjw would be better than monarch for pvp
fickle laurel
unless they plan to add enemies with mind control
that's def not going to be an enemy mechanic. It's just babidi's boss mechanic
solid roost
vsjw will definitely be meta for pvp traitless and trait enabled. id argue deade...
Better for kills tourneys, that's about it
frozen oasis
Better for kills tourneys, that's about it
mb i meant pvp
fickle laurel
I'm gonna be real, I don't think vsjw will be that meta for pvp
solid roost
That's something
frozen oasis
I'm gonna be real, I don't think vsjw will be *that* meta for pvp
summons…
potent cloak
most of his kit can get countered very easily
grand loom
summons…
They don't crit
so he wont be that broken
Yhwach wont be used either due to mind control
solid roost
most of his kit can get countered very easily
What unit is that not true for is the question
frozen oasis
Me when I throw an absorption enemy at you and heal off all your summons
what does absorption do
fickle laurel
What unit is that not true for is the question
That's kinda the point though. You have to cover your bases
solid roost
Yeah that's true
fickle laurel
what does absorption do
Summons heal instead of damage
potent cloak
What unit is that not true for is the question
none
but vjsw has hard counters
things where there is no counterplay you just cant use that part of his kit
fickle laurel
Literally every buu has that mechanic except kid buu
solid roost
I'm just saying that making vsjw useless takes more than making most other units useless imo
solid roost
none
but vjsw has hard counters
things where there is no counterplay you just ca...
Ig?
frozen oasis
Summons heal instead of damage
does that apply to that specific enemy type or to all enemies when absorption enemy is on the map
solid roost
Kinda true for Vergil with immunity too
fickle laurel
Problem is that vsjw's dps is actually kinda mid at base
grand loom
does that apply to that specific enemy type or to all enemies when absorption en...
does it matter?
frozen oasis
does it matter? <:Hmm:1224776463501365308>
grand loom
because what's stopping ur enemies from spamming multiple absorption enemies?
solid roost
Problem is that vsjw's dps is actually kinda mid at base
52k is alright unless you're saying we won't be able to max him in the first place
fickle laurel
does that apply to that specific enemy type or to all enemies when absorption en...
Absorption is a mutator, it's just for the enemy that has it
frozen oasis
it's cheap
its not like summons will be the main dps. its just an addition to ur dps
grand loom
Don't his elite summons bypass absorption too kinda
They do less damage,
frozen oasis
it would lead to spamming absorption with another modifier and im sure using more than one modifier increases yen usage a lot
fickle laurel
it's cheap
I mean, it's not that cheap considering you'll need to crank the hp multiplier to make sure they actually survive to reach the summons. Or stack other modifiers on that help them, like immunity or resilient or w/e
Immunity is hella expensive though because it counters so much
frozen oasis
I mean, it's not that cheap considering you'll need to crank the hp multiplier t...
exactly why vsjw will be meta
fickle laurel
any form of CC/stalling, nullify, bleed, etc
grand loom
exactly why vsjw will be meta
of course but he won't be that broken compared to other units
who can make a bigger difference
frozen oasis
of course but he won't be that broken compared to other units
what units would be more broken
besides vergil
grand loom
dante
frozen oasis
and dante
grand loom
can bypass energy drain
sleek pecan
You already know they will release a unit thats immune to that soon
I LOVE FEATURE CREEP POWER CREEP COMBO
fickle laurel
I mean
fickle laurel
Vergil has like two modifiers that completely counter him
grand loom
for a shit ton of yen
frozen oasis
Immunity being one of them
does lucy counter that
grand loom
Can't follow-up if an enemy can't be frozen
does that matter?
scarlet anvil
does that matter?
yes
grand loom
vergil just need the tag
fickle laurel
And dante has a couple modifiers that counter him
grand loom
they don't gotta be frozen
fickle laurel
does lucy counter that
no
fickle laurel
if they're immune
scarlet anvil
honestly if we're talking about pvp here
fickle laurel
how about lancer
no
grand loom
just disable traits and ban all limited-time units
traitless and traits
fickle laurel
so the tag won't appear above their head?
If they have immunity, they can't be frozen. Which means no lockout. Which means no tag
scarlet anvil
disable stats as well
grand loom
will be a thing for pvp
scarlet anvil
will be a thing for pvp
fair enough
frozen oasis
imo goku+vegeta and vsjw and cid and buu will be the best pvp units from what ive seen so far
fickle laurel
There's a couple modifiers that are as of yet unique to pvp as well that I don't think I can talk about yet
but the names were shown in videos at least
I don't know if they were explained though
scarlet anvil
There's a couple modifiers that are as of yet unique to pvp as well that I don't...
would stats be a thing in pvp
fickle laurel
yes
scarlet anvil
or does everyone have like 0%
sleek pecan
imo goku+vegeta and vsjw and cid and buu will be the best pvp units from what iv...
Goku secret only
grand loom
If they have immunity, they can't be frozen. Which means no lockout. Which means...
Is it true you can get a shit ton of yen in the 5 figures as long the enemy is too busy spamming enemies to your base?
sleek pecan
All others have glaring counters
scarlet anvil
yeah nobody's gonna play pvp lol
frozen oasis
Goku secret only
ya bc he a swap unit
scarlet anvil
if anything rng-based is there it just isn't fair
grand loom
yeah nobody's gonna play pvp lol
according to who?
delicate lava
yeah nobody's gonna play pvp lol
why
frozen oasis
if anything rng-based is there it just isn't fair
stats? are u serious
scarlet anvil
stats? are u serious
Yup
grand loom
bro, your idea is even worse 💔
grand loom
because stats wouldn't change anything
fickle laurel
Is it true you can get a shit ton of yen in the 5 figures as long the enemy is t...
Yes and no? You build wave econ by sending basic enemies, but sending modifiers will take away from that. Think BTDB sends where the blimps cost income instead of building it
scarlet anvil
z+ stats are so easy to get and godly is only a 1-3% difference at max
still a difference
fickle laurel
Also stats are not that deep a difference 🥀
frozen oasis
still a difference
the difference isnt significant which is why it doesnt matter
solid roost
It's not even 1%
delicate lava
still a difference
acting like no one will play it cus of a 1% diffrence in damage lol ☠️☠️☠️
fickle laurel
Surprisingly enough, people actually like using the units they spent time/resources on making
scarlet anvil
just remembered it's roblox we're talking about
solid roost
My like triple almost max roll godlies don't even do 1k more dps than just high roll z+s lol
Godlies are a straight up scam
scarlet anvil
Surprisingly enough, people actually *like* using the units they spent time/reso...
Good point
solid roost
More cosmetic than anything else
sleek pecan
Surprisingly enough, people actually *like* using the units they spent time/reso...
For ranked you should be able to use stat rolls but for casual nah
fickle laurel
I don't see why there should be a difference there
scarlet anvil
i mean i don't know how big pvp would be
fickle laurel
especially for stats of all things
scarlet anvil
but if it's like
a really significant part of the game
i think making it as fair as possible would be the best play
solid roost
Stats literally do not matter beyond z+ dawg they don't matter in inf lb or wl why would they matter here
grand loom
i mean i don't know how big pvp would be
big enough to the point it's the main content for update 6.0
scarlet anvil
Stats literally do not matter beyond z+ dawg they don't matter in inf lb or wl ...
good point
frozen oasis
a really significant part of the game
sure but when stats are so easy to get then its not crazy to put them in pvp
scarlet anvil
but your takes are awful either way
yeah now that i think about it it doesn't really matter too much
1-3% matters if it's like
something bigger than this
solid roost
but your takes are awful either way
What do they say about throwing stones on other's houses while your own is made of glass
frozen oasis
i would understand if u have concerns with familiars tho
sleek pecan
Stats literally do not matter beyond z+ dawg they don't matter in inf lb or wl ...
Because its a casual mode while theres not a difference between z+ and godly there certainly is a difference between z+ and a and i want casual players to be able to just plug and play the mode
grand loom
ur too busy worrying about the % of stats but not about the modifiers itself?
scarlet anvil
ur too busy worrying about the % of stats but not about the modifiers itself?
kinda
solid roost
Because its a casual mode while theres not a difference between z+ and godly the...
If you can't even get z+ stats idk what to tell you, literally the freest thing in the game to get
scarlet anvil
actually no modifiers would be a bigger issue
solid roost
But ig?
scarlet anvil
you're locked to five slots
sleek pecan
What do they say about throwing stones on other's houses while your own is made ...
Kettle calling teapot black 
cosmic lintel
Surprisingly enough, people actually *like* using the units they spent time/reso...
My facking Naruto and Sasuke?
scarlet anvil
you're locked to five slots
or well four
solid roost
1-3% matters if it's like
It's rarely ever 3% lol
fickle laurel
Because its a casual mode while theres not a difference between z+ and godly the...
I think if you're concerned about casual players, stats are one of the least impactful things to look at lmao. That's why they're irrelevant in the talk of traitless content
scarlet anvil
It's rarely ever 3% lol
yeah i know
potent cloak
rather than stats if you want a truely fair experience you should ask for all unob units to be banned from it😭
stats are hardly a issue
frozen oasis
I think if you're concerned about casual players, stats are one of the least imp...
i dont think familiars should be in casual pvp
sleek pecan
If you can't even get z+ stats idk what to tell you, literally the freest thing ...
Why needlessly disregard a portion of the playerbase like newplayers who want to immediately try pvp just because of your assumption that everyone has z+ stats on everything?
scarlet anvil
rather than stats if you want a truely fair experience you should ask for all un...
yeah that's something i talked about too
but a lot of the units in the meta right now are like
limited time
if you're gonna ban units that aren't permanent you'd be banning a lot of the meta
grand loom
i dont think familiars should be in casual pvp
it should,
ranked games like r6, valorant, and cod allows them
why can't av do it?
sleek pecan
it should,
Static rolls for familiars
grand loom
same with lol
frozen oasis
it should,
thats unfair
potent cloak
ranked games like r6, valorant, and cod allows them
what
grand loom
#1 most popular ranked game
cyan cobalt
rather than stats if you want a truely fair experience you should ask for all un...
Fire idea
sleek pecan
ranked games like r6, valorant, and cod allows them
Wth you talking about
grand loom
i'm using those as a example
sleek pecan
Where tf are “familiars” in any of thise games
frozen oasis
ranked games like r6, valorant, and cod allows them
they dont have familiars what are u on about
scarlet anvil
randomly rolled stat increases
grand loom
examples??
potent cloak
yea where are val familiars😭
grand loom
ever heard of them?
fickle laurel
i dont think familiars should be in casual pvp
Traitless they wont be
sleek pecan
examples??
YOU are the one making the claim oml
frozen oasis
solid roost
Why needlessly disregard a portion of the playerbase like newplayers who want to...
If it's casual enough for a level 10 player to be able to do the shre
sleek pecan
Dumbest av player
cosmic lintel
Well deserved Role
grand loom
I only mention cod bc they got a ranked gamemode
solid roost
???????
grand loom
?? they actually have one
sleek pecan
I only mention cod bc they got a ranked gamemode
How do ANY of those games have familiars
grand loom
in bo6,
solid roost
Well deserved indeed
frozen oasis
solid roost
😭
sleek pecan
Tf???
scarlet anvil
Wtf are familiars in cod dawg
think of familiars as a randomy rolled stat boost instead of actual familiars
sleek pecan
scarlet anvil
even then i don't think any of those games have something like that in competitive play just because of how unfair it'd be
grand loom
How do ANY of those games have familiars
look, I was just using these as an example because what do they have in common? ban phases and nothing else
solid roost
Yeah none of those games have anything like that idk what this analogy is
grand loom
for weapons, and operators
sleek pecan
None of those games have rng based mechanics except for maybe like spray patterns
scarlet anvil
for weapons, and operators
the main issue about familiars is the stats on them
not obtaining them
getting a perfect birb compared to an okay one is a pretty big difference
solid roost
None of those games have rng based mechanics except for maybe like spray pattern...
They have kinda p2w factors to them sometimes, for example certain weapon skins in cod could just have significantly better iron sights than the base gun and whatnot, but yeah NOTHING like familiars
thorn flicker
For me familiars are fine besides corruption, bird and maybe padoru
cosmic lintel
thorn flicker
Basically 50% of it lmao sadly
solid roost
Birb is the only problematic one
sleek pecan
No comment on ranked
scarlet anvil
Birb is the only problematic one
padoru could be considered problematic too
thorn flicker
Birb is the only problematic one
Padoru was/is op on 15 waves stages but prob not on pvp
scarlet anvil
having a low cd padoru on speedwagon is a huge boost to your money gain
on fifteen waves atleast
solid roost
Yeah I don't think 100 money should be that game changing based on what we've seen so far
scarlet anvil
especially without fortune
sleek pecan
padoru could be considered problematic too
Birb is god level threat
While padoru is wolf level lol
solid roost
Maybe I'll be proven wrong
cyan cobalt
Yeah I don't think 100 money should be that game changing based on what we've se...
It is pretty good, often allows you to clutch an extra upgrade early
solid roost
Yeah birb is the real annoying deal here
scarlet anvil
Yeah I don't think 100 money should be that game changing based on what we've se...
you can afford an extra farm a wave early with padoru speedwagon
without fortune
solid roost
Birb is just a stupid concept ima be real
It just exists to buy them more time for update
sleek pecan
Calling birb just good is disingenuous
solid roost
As a way to stall the more sweaty community
sleek pecan
The most insane form of powercreep the game has seen yet
solid roost
It's not even the powrcreep
That's manageable
It's the stupid ass gambling
For no reason too
scarlet anvil
It's the stupid ass gambling
birb isn't that hard to get though
but if it's the stats
yeah
those suck
scarlet anvil
didn't think before typing mb
sleek pecan
It's not even the powrcreep
If they add a familiar better than birb it will very possibly be better than monarch 😭
scarlet anvil
If they add a familiar better than birb it will very possibly be better than mon...
birb is 20% damage 20% range 40% cd and 20 cc at max right
sleek pecan
birb is 20% damage 20% range 40% cd and 20 cc at max right
30 30 40 30 theoretical cap
potent cloak
birb is 20% damage 20% range 40% cd and 20 cc at max right
30 cd
scarlet anvil
30 cd
that is quite some stat
i wouldn't say it's on the same level as monarch
but it's definitely an extra mythic trait lol
scarlet anvil
i'm strangely okay with it though
sleek pecan
Its lazy
solid roost
I'm not gonna say anything more about it because if I do ill probably get myself banned
scarlet anvil
it keeps a reason for the cid raid to be played even after cid gets powercrept
sleek pecan
Thet just locked it behind low rates and called it a day
solid roost
But I feel very strongly about birb's balancing
scarlet anvil
if they don't add any better familiars
sleek pecan
So stupid
scarlet anvil
keeping birb as the best familiar
thorn flicker
30 30 40 30 theoretical cap
Balanced for a familiar
sleek pecan
Balanced for a familiar
…
solid roost
That 30 30 45 30 is not happening usually but that still doesn't make the familiar any less stupid when it's literally just a gamble sim
thorn flicker
birb is okay
Acting like its not like eth+deadeye 😭
solid roost
It is not okay bruh
solid roost
Whoever balanced birb should be forced to stay away from familiars for the rest of time
sleek pecan
But its locked behind low rates 
-pyseph
thorn flicker
But its locked behind low rates <:smile:1230607814213242982> -pyseph
Lmfao
solid roost
I genuinely don't understand who thought it was a good idea
Actually want to have a talk with them
scarlet anvil
Current traitless tourny is impossible
fun
solid roost
They don't care
thorn flicker
scarlet anvil
what if we made the enemies bloons and we turned the units into monkeys and called it bloons td 7
sleek pecan
Cant wait to see how ranked pvp will turn out…
solid roost
I hope they don't pull an odyssey
If they do then that's just so cooked
They've hyped this even more than odyssey at this point
scarlet anvil
i feel like pvp is either something nobody will play or only like the best will play
sleek pecan
*either the mode no one will play or the only mode people play
scarlet anvil
it's just kinda hard to balance something like this in a game where rng is a major part of the game
scarlet anvil
yeah
and honestly
correct me if i'm wrong
but i don't think there's much strategy in this game
sleek pecan
There isnt
scarlet anvil
you're capped at four units you can bring
sleek pecan
They overhype it so badly
thorn flicker
but i don't think there's much strategy in this game
Not a lot
scarlet anvil
most of the time it's just bringing damage units
solid roost
There's strategy if you don't have any monarchs what so ever
sleek pecan
Every unit in this game is an aoe damage dealer
solid roost
Soon as you get a good monarch it goes out of the window
scarlet anvil
There's strategy if you don't have any monarchs what so ever
no even without traits
sleek pecan
Except like 2 exceptions
scarlet anvil
there wouldn't be much strategy
solid roost
There's strategies without traits in harder modes
scarlet anvil
where you place your units doesn't really matter since you only ever place them around the start
signal spear
There is strategy in higher wl
solid roost
Tournaments and boss rush have strategy but I won't talk about them since that's just minmaxing
solid roost
Wl however does have strategy
scarlet anvil
is it teambuilding or like
solid roost
Not really
scarlet anvil
actually placing units and stuff
signal spear
Its both
grand loom
is it teambuilding or like
it depends on the boss, and the room itself
solid roost
Wl has teambuilding
solid roost
Too bad wl is a shitty ass mode to grind
solid roost
Getting reset from 310 to 50 gotta be one experience
signal spear
Yea I literally wont touch wl until like 2 weeks of 6.0 have passed
grand loom
something more than place and do damage
vsjw does that already
same with goku
better support than kata with spirit
signal spear
And people hated using vsjw in tournaments
scarlet anvil
vsjw does that already
something more active than vsjw
solid roost
Goku is arguable his best utlization is literally just auto swap
signal spear
How long is the cd between different crowd control effects
grand loom
How long is the cd between different crowd control effects
it depends on the unit doing it
some got different durations
signal spear
Oh I see
Because with goku you optimally would want to time it
So the slow happens as soon as possible after the stun
grand loom
yeah he swaps every 2 attacks using spirit (must be over 100%+)
signal spear
I will do the math
grand loom
probably cuz he's mid
signal spear
Should be easy
scarlet anvil
i wonder how the devs would go on with the game though
like after pvp
what other mechanics can you afd
add
grand loom
unique ones
solid roost
Goku with Blitz and 100% or better darkspirit has constant slow and stun
scarlet anvil
it's bound to die out if it's just like
signal spear
No you would need 165% familiar
grand loom
it's not hard to invent in new mechanics
signal spear
So you cant get a 3 attack cid swap sadly
scarlet anvil
it's not hard to invent in new mechanics
i mean like with units and such
then again we are on roblox so i don't think it'd matter too much lol
novel zenith
Dayum
scarlet anvil
Next mechanic will be enemies that drain spa
oh that'd be cool
grand loom
hmm water bypass those
signal spear
It would have the same problem as energy drain
scarlet anvil
if vsjw didn't exist
signal spear
Bring unknown or water
scarlet anvil
It would have the same problem as energy drain
what is the problem with energy drain
grand loom
what is the problem with energy drain
low amount of units are immune to it
scarlet anvil
that'd be fine if there were more units in the game
good point
i mean debuffs are a good idea in concept
but there's just not enough units ingame for it to be executed well
spare gull
what is the problem with energy drain
not enough cleanse units
scarlet anvil
and if there were how many would be good enough to be usable
spare gull
immunity is one thing
scarlet anvil
not enough cleanse units
that too
spare gull
but like if you add more immune units
why add energy drain in the first place
whats the point
fickle laurel
hmm water bypass those
yknow the funniest part about that?
Uryu is a water element. Which means he's immune to any enemy trying to debuff his SPA.
Which means he can't flip it
scarlet anvil
Which means he can't flip it
what would flipping an spa debuff be
actually can uryu flip energy drain
scarlet anvil
oh
fickle laurel
last I knew though, something broke and he doesn't even get a proper damage buff anymore though
But he's still basically immune to it
scarlet anvil
uryu is reflecting debuffs back onto the enemy though rifht
right
like the passive is that it reflects debuffs back onto the enemy
scarlet anvil
oh
fickle laurel
and inverts any debuffs applied to him
signal spear
Can he reflect snare
fickle laurel
I dunno, I've never tried
He probably does
But it's probably coded to be reflected as a stun
signal spear
Speaking of snare will it be in pvp
fickle laurel
No
Unless it ends up being added later, but I doubt it
Sturdy used to be a modifier but we took it out because there's no salvaging it
grim shadow
Unless it ends up being added later, but I doubt it
They doing my boy snare dirty 😭
solid roost
They doing my boy snare dirty 😭
I pray they continue doing that 👍
Idc what they say or how long it's been I'm always gonna have the belief that they made snare so that Igris couldnt do well in the stupid rengoku raid as he would've otherwise
👿
grim shadow
I mean, they made snare useless in upd 1
grand loom
Sturdy used to be a modifier but we took it out because there's no salvaging it
it would make pvp takes less time to end
grim shadow
They often do anti meta stuff
signal spear
it would make pvp takes less time to end
You can simulate sturdy by sending enemies with 5x the health
grim shadow
Gojo was certainly smth
Fire too
solid roost
Anyhow snare is just a shit mechanic ima be real
Hate it slightly more than energy drain
solid roost
Fire too
Fire units were pretty useless upto the point yama came out ima be real
Sukuna took 599 years to get that buff
And even then he was kinda meh
signal spear
And then yama was made completely irrelevant the next update
grim shadow
Hate it slightly more than energy drain
Disagree, energy drain is harder to counter unless inmunity, even sakura couldnt do much until all the enemies are gone
solid roost
Disagree, energy drain is harder to counter unless inmunity, even sakura couldnt...
I mean I guess?
grim shadow
Fire units were pretty useless upto the point yama came out ima be real
I mean, u could beat the raid with unevo jogo
solid roost
Yeah tbh snare was basically irrelevant after that since nobody ever played that stage
signal spear
Idk why they thought removing the only reward from the stage was a good idea
solid roost
Limited unit
👍
Plus raids aren't really supposed to be smth you go back to after getting all the stuff from them
Also I highly doubt someone is that upset over not being able to get rengoku of all things 💀
signal spear
Thing is new players literally wont even play them once
high trail
Theres still the rrs
solid roost
They can play them for the rrs from shop
signal spear
The rrs take too long
solid roost
And enemy index but that's irrelevant
signal spear
Youre better off doing 30 minute challenges
high trail
Sbr i can agree is more of a problem since its like a 22 hours farms
cyan cobalt
sbr -100% dmg > energy dragin -100% dmg
solid roost
Hell no
Love train
Is so fucking dogshit
First of all it's been bugged for the longest time
Half the time the game doesn't know what unit is supposed to be immune to love train and which isn't
Last update gilgamesh was immune but gojo and fucking vsjw weren't
The bosses have 3000 hours of iframes that lucy doesn't even stop I don't think because they are just animation iframes
I could go on
I think there's a reason that was the 2nd most if not straight up most worst recieved update
cyan cobalt
gogeta tp also pretty sure still doesnt work on that map properly
solid roost
Yeah so in short sbr raid is beyond ass and nobody should ever do that unless they're a masochist
green stag
L just put av above school work family and you can play 20 hours a day
potent cloak
You have to tp on elevated areas
that should be fixed now
grim shadow
Also I highly doubt someone is that upset over not being able to get rengoku of ...
Is mostly bc they doing that a lot
At that point just remove the raid
solid roost
What?
grim shadow
Like, give an incentive to play to just remove it
solid roost
Well unobtainable units are kinda needed
grim shadow
Sadly, yes, but i dont think that raids or the story units should the limiteds
solid roost
Story hasn't been so far
And tbh both the raid unobtainables are just so useless
Ig Diego is needed for inf lb but that's literally it
keen bane
lol
sleek pecan
Can i get a tldr
cyan cobalt
Can i get a tldr
To the post itself? The vote section highlighted is basically the TL;DR
sleek pecan
To the post itself? The vote section highlighted is basically the TL;DR
No to what people talked about while i was gone
cyan cobalt
Oh mb
tacit stag
lol
grim shadow
No to what people talked about while i was gone
Nothing relates to the post basically lmao
sleek pecan
Not the easy thing
marsh mango
this suggestion is the epitome of crab in a bucket mentality
sleek pecan
this suggestion is the epitome of crab in a bucket mentality
Yeah because people are pretty much botting
Thats what mangos are
Its not fun competing with bots
grim shadow
And it is that unrelated convo i want to know about 😭
Idk, one was about how broken was vergil, another of how the raids are content that nobody does
high trail
this suggestion is the epitome of crab in a bucket mentality
You see the problem isnt mango itself, is about the gap between their rewards, making more than double of the total rrs of a dedicated player in the same span of time is ridiculous.
Well not the same span of time but you get what i mean
fickle laurel
The problem isn’t entirely the mangos themselves, but it’s more about the gamestate they force as a result if they’re able to go crazy
Because now players feel forced to use them to keep up
cyan cobalt
this suggestion is the epitome of crab in a bucket mentality
Mango users are literally the crabs in the bucket
"The game sucks SO MUCH, that we don't even play it! So just join us, and don't even play the game or else 😡"
Think about it for a second
sleek pecan
Yeah its crazy how the people who spend the LEAST amount of time actually on the game dictate what the rest of the playerbase has to put up with
cyan cobalt
It's even worse when you can actually find some that straight up don't even want things to improve, they just want "a game to mango and chill"
Go play incremental/idle games
sleek pecan
Let me mango bc i dont have time! But idc if you cant mango bc i still get the rewards!
cyan cobalt
They were literally made for that
sleek pecan
Like go play arx lil bro 
cyan cobalt
Like go play arx lil bro <:sobpray:1360013201235902765>
Have you seen the YT comments about that game?
"I don't care that they stole basically every single model from other developers!! I'm so glad they are back!!"
"Its okay they stole everything, they are small team"
People are just insane (though lets be honest these are kids aged 8-14)
sleek pecan
Have you seen the YT comments about that game?
"I don't care that they stole bas...
They are selfish is why
Same can be said about the mango players here
Same demographic
Cant comprehend the concept of sacrificing something from themself so the game can actually innovate
Everything must be more more more
With no costs
My way or no way
fickle laurel
I miss when mangos were just “record > repeat” inputs
And not “make a bot play the game for you”
sleek pecan
Should have left mangos in 2024
fickle laurel
The first case I still don’t like but I can at least somewhat accept it.
cyan cobalt
If the devs wanna support mango, they should just make it a feature (so people can move on to actual games that are for playing, not a childrens version of biiitcoin mining)
wide crypt
This suggestion still going at it
cyan cobalt
I'll basically keep bumping it for the whole 2 weeks duration, I wanna get as much votes as possible, whether its a ⭐ or a 
I wanna see what most people think about mango and manual play
sleek pecan
Close to 60/40
high trail
Its so even tho, means how divided the community is
sleek pecan
As it was in the poll
cyan cobalt
You're right
Though, I think more people would have voted for the bottom if they asked it once the raid was actually fixed up
sleek pecan
Also
This server has a million members
I think its a fair assumption to say the inactive members arent particularly excited and content with how the game currently is
cyan cobalt
Now that you mention it
If they did a global ping asking everyone to get on the game... 1 million CC
That's kind of crazy
thats basically several times more than triple AAA giga corps
cyan cobalt
Said fact makes it even worse that roblox is basically one of the worst platforms from so many angles
Even mobile app stores are less exploitative
At least there you aren't tunnel visioned into an engine from which you can't take your knowledge anywhere
sleek pecan
Roblox definitely profits more per user than any gacha game lol
cyan cobalt
Oh this is gonna run into a problem
Once it reaches spotlight, itll only have the star reaction there
Which means we wont be able to measure the people who disagree as accurately
olive hollow
Oh this is gonna run into a problem
Once it reaches spotlight, itll only have th...
They would still see the original post
So they would react accordingly
royal kelp
they should just remove hourly challenges entirely (or atleast the rr challenge) and make daily challenge give more rr
sleek pecan
48/85 is just barely over 50%
i think you should have just went for the root of the problem
And polled directly about mango
And if people think its healthy for the game
sturdy zodiac
they should just remove hourly challenges entirely (or atleast the rr challenge)...
Ive gotten 5 monarchs from this just let me be happy
high trail
No
solid roost
And polled directly about mango
the game scales to it
if you try and make the game unmangoable
you will fail
as i mentioned before
it took less than 24 hours
for cid mangos to be made
all you did was make it so that in order to mango you need monarch units
sleek pecan
literally could have just made the beacons light up
in the order
or used audio cues
for the order
but ig its unmangoable 🤷♂️
light w
cant be mad
sleek pecan
for the order
the game is making a choice
as i have always said
mangos arent this unstoppable force
cyan cobalt
mangos arent this unstoppable force
Definitely not unstoppable but they cant start banning anymore since practically all CCs do mango too
sleek pecan
not saying they should ban
it
just pivot away from designing content that makes it convenient lol
theres conveniently a dialogue popup for the beacon order
wonder why...
cyan cobalt
Lmao
solid roost
mangos arent this unstoppable force
Literally tell me how you could stop them
I'm actually curious about the ideas y'all have to counterract mangos
inland dew
Pineapples
cyan cobalt
I'm actually curious about the ideas y'all have to counterract mangos
For image detection mangos, you could have things that can't be looked at at the same time
They can still just flick their camera back and forth
sleek pecan
I'm actually curious about the ideas y'all have to counterract mangos
Look at the messages i sent above bwo
solid roost
theres conveniently a dialogue popup for the beacon order
It could be literally any qte and the outcome would be the same
solid roost
For image detection mangos, you could have things that can't be looked at at the...
Yeah they can easily do that
sleek pecan
It could be literally any qte and the outcome would be the same
Okay then tell me how the mango would work around those
Remove the numbers
solid roost
It can detect any text/image on the screen and follow any preset set of movements or instructions
solid roost
Just make them light up in a certain order
Yeah that'd work out great when the light is barely noticeable on low end devices or just bugs out.
Audio cues 💀
solid roost
Yeah that'd work out great when the light is barely noticeable on low end device...
This is legit already the case btw ps it's almost impossible to notice on lowest graphics
I've barely ever seen people who play ts with audio on
sleek pecan
Yeah that'd work out great when the light is barely noticeable on low end device...
Literally could just make a minecraft beacon light shoot out from the pillar brah not that deep
solid roost
Forcing people to pay attention to the stage by having an auto loss mechanic is already pushing it
solid roost
Literally could just make a minecraft beacon light shoot out from the pillar bra...
If it's distinctly noticeable then could mangos could probably do it
solid roost
Image detection?
sleek pecan
Theres no numbers
solid roost
Theyd have to light up in an order wouldn't they
sleek pecan
Theyd have to light up in an order wouldn't they
And how would it detect a random order across a 360 degree field
solid roost
Just have the mango go to a specific spot whenever it detects "Lord of shadows" text
sleek pecan
Its going to be constantly turning?
solid roost
Yeah some of them do that actually
sleek pecan
Yeah some of them do that actually
How is it going to track the relative position of the beacon?
If its rotating?
solid roost
There's definitely a few angles on that map from which all beacons are visible
sleek pecan
Still doesnt answer the question how the beacons would be distinguishable from each other
solid roost
Still doesnt answer the question how the beacons would be distinguishable from e...
The area surrounding the beacons could be used to distinguish them
Just detect images of a lit up beacon and the surroundings
sleek pecan
Just detect images of a lit up beacon and the surroundings
Literally besides that one tree and the base there is nothing inside the crater
solid roost
There's the floor is there not
That's enough
Mangos can already navigate to literally any spot on any map
sleek pecan
Have you even seen somethting like this actually in use?
solid roost
Not as convoluted as this but certainly things involving doing a preset action when a certain boss spawns
sleek pecan
Mangos can already navigate to literally any spot on any map
“Anywhere” is stretching it
solid roost
Or going to one place to do something when as a certain timer goes off
solid roost
Or just make random spawns lol
Lmao
sleek pecan
AD goes so hard
solid roost
That's already the case btw
cyan cobalt
other than parkour with moving platforms, these image detection mangos are practically like bots
basically cheaters ruin everything
sleek pecan
That's already the case btw
No theres tp to spawn and placing the speedwagon down
solid roost
Mangos can detect what spot you spawn in, restart the match till you spawn in the correct spot, and go from there
sleek pecan
Yeah just remove that feature
solid roost
You want to remove tp to spawn?
Ig you could
You'd increase the amount of work they need to do
Wouldn't really stop it though
sleek pecan
No it would literally require tos-violating scripts like in AD
sleek pecan
Not if the spawning is entirely random
solid roost
We are no longer cooking 💀
So in order to prevent mangos you're removing tp to spawn
Pulling an ad
Removing the spectate feature
What else
😭
sleek pecan
Removing the spectate feature
Wouldnt have to remove spectate feature
solid roost
Remember what I said
In the pursuit of stopping mangos
You'll just make the game worse overall
👍
sleek pecan
And why would you need tp to spawn if not for reseting your character
solid roost
And this would harm tinytask way more than it would ahk too
sleek pecan
You'll just make the game worse overall
Literally only removing to to spawn
solid roost
Removing a feature to try and combat mangos
sleek pecan
And making it so you have to walk a few second before the match starts
solid roost
💀
sleek pecan
You can literally jusst add a reset character option
silver cedar
ye ngl it wont stop people from getting creative
solid roost
Yeah that really benefited ad right
sleek pecan
Yeah that really benefited ad right
Execpt those scripts were actual exploits
solid roost
Execpt those scripts were actual exploits
How do you think those changes impacted a regular player in ad 💀
Fully making tinytask worthless
sleek pecan
How do you think those changes impacted a regular player in ad 💀
Badly because they didnt change the rates but nothing stopping av from rebalancing the rates
solid roost
Isn't that something
sleek pecan
Ion get it
solid roost
Badly because they didnt change the rates but nothing stopping av from rebalanci...
Why would they:
- Piss off most of the community
- Remove features from the game
- Cut their own income
Just to try and prevent mangos?
sleek pecan
Why would they:
1) Piss off most of the community
2) Remove features from the g...
Its not even removing a feature just make a reset character button that teleports you to the closest area in bounds if you are out of bounds
And isnt a significant amount of the community also against mangos?
The only real case is that its unprofitable
Which
Well
solid roost
And isnt a significant amount of the community also against mangos?
That's not really the part of the community that actually makes them money is it
sleek pecan
That's not really the part of the community that actually makes them money is it
No its probably people in time chamber you really think 35k people have a 35 usd mango???
solid roost
Also you'd have to remove the spectate feature for this to have an impact otherwise you could just place speed, spectate, and then walk around the map till you find the correct position.
silver cedar
No its probably people in time chamber you really think 35k people have a 35 usd...
ppl paying for mangos?? 💀
solid roost
Yeah
sleek pecan
ppl paying for mangos?? 💀
Froggie is 35 usd
silver cedar
i thought its free?
solid roost
Also non formal probably would have a way to get around this if you asked him
sleek pecan
Huh
I got scammed i guess
I looked at the free server
But there was literally nothing there
silver cedar
got a shiny too
sleek pecan
Where the hell are you getting a free frog
That is diabolical
I want my money back
silver cedar
brb
sleek pecan
Also you'd have to remove the spectate feature for this to have an impact otherw...
How would that even work if you spawn in a random position?
Its not like you just place a speedwagon in the correct position?
lavish peak
💔
solid roost
Its not like you just place a speedwagon in the correct position?
Just spam place him over multiple spots till you see he got placed
If he doesn't place in 50 tries you can try and move
Or go to lobby and start again
sleek pecan
Just spam place him over multiple spots till you see he got placed
Okay and how would know that where he got placed is a good spot
solid roost
Okay and how would know that where he got placed is a good spot
That doesn't really matter
You're only spectating to get the preset camera angle
Anyhow again you just made tinytask irrelevant
sleek pecan
You're only spectating to get the preset camera angle
Except its a random location so the screenshot wont even be the same
Across runs
solid roost
Except its a random location so the screenshot wont even be the same
Just have multiple sses along a certain axis
sleek pecan
Uh huh
solid roost
Yeah you could do that just way more effort
Free promotion for non formal 🔥
Also fact of the matter is that several things in this game still just scale to mangos I'ma be real
solid roost
I really hope they don't expect people to manually grind like 130 essence stones per unit
130 is an understatement too probs
Same for gems, idrk how you'd actually get gems besides mangoing inf
sleek pecan
Cant tell atp
Because at the same time they thought it would be a good idea for 10 stones to drop from a single present
silver cedar
you'd lose 30% if u remove mango ngl, having to manually grind for no actual progression is some sissyphus shii
solid roost
The only "non-mangoable" modes are the worst recieved and least liked ones too
Nobody likes odyssey
silver cedar
fr
solid roost
Rewards are shit, doesn't feel that engaging, is probably impossible without monarchs.
Idrk about the last point since
You know
But the first 2 are just factual
solid roost
Not really
sleek pecan
More involved i should say
solid roost
It's literally just very slightly better than old paragon
Not even that much involved because the strat is literally to just reset till you get good modifiers early and then just cash out by boss room 2 at most
solid roost
Yeah some cards are useless others are game changing
sleek pecan
Not even that much involved because the strat is literally to just reset till yo...
Yeah idk why the designed it so that its most efficient to cash out early
silver cedar
like what am i going to do with 32 mill god statue that i have ni money to kill on bc i wasted it on statues
solid roost
Yeah idk why the designed it so that its most efficient to cash out early
Because it's literally impossible to go past boss floor 3 if you don't have generational luck
Bosses that even Vergil can't do shit to
cyan cobalt
is floor 3 3000 intensity atm?
Cause i got past it basically every time
dunno why early cashout is better though
sleek pecan
Wdym floor 3 is 3000
cyan cobalt
i dont emember the new intensity values
silver cedar
floor 3 is max 600\
cyan cobalt
oh lmao
silver cedar
every 200 intensity is new floor
sleek pecan
3000 would be going max intensity to the third boss room
Which is probably impossible
silver cedar
and the game is not even good unless u play on 200 intensity each