Creature balance

[digital frigate]

I gotta say, loving the game so far, I've already put 8 hours into it and am having a blast. But a few points of balance I want to discuss:
On the player end:

• Social is by far the easiest build. I waltzed through a run completely brokenly, never clicking attack by just having a squad of guys.
• The only movement ability worth trading your starting Dash for is Hunker Down if you have spikes, or Sprint. Scuttle and leap just are not nearly as good. This also makes the minimalist gene worse...
• The Red Berry evolutions are wildly imbalanced. Legs and Wings are WAY better than tentacles, and Alpha and Pollinator are just so much better for their builds than Ruminant is at all.

On the Enemy side:

• The cat enemies are the worst. Sprint at you from off-screen, hit you for a minimum of 20hp, and they move faster than you if you don't have legs/wings. The least fun designed enemies in the game by a mile.
• Aggro leashing is basically non-existent, this makes getting away from any predator early impossible if there's not a nearby burrow and it's really annoying.
• Prey creatures should have to un-burrow eventually. Not nessicarily in the same timer as Darwin, but eventually. It's annoying for the alphas especially.

These are my thoughts after playing for a bit. Looking forward to the expansion of the Water biome, and I am still loving the game a ton, just wanted to share my thoughts on the areas that chafe after 8 hour of game.

[spark canyon]

The only movement ability worth trading your starting Dash for is Hunker Down if you have spikes, or Sprint.

May I introduce to you our lord and saviour, Slide Gang
Long range, shorter cooldown than base dash, doesn't need anything but Slither as a prerequisite (which on its own is really good, too)

I will say I have a strong opinion about Sprint - it needs some speed stat and terrain adaptation increases (other Evos), otherwise, at base stats it's worse than any other dash imho. However, when you're a maxed out speedy boi, it goes hard, gotta admit.

Leap has a thing going for it, where being airborne makes you immune to being hit. Probably the only mobility option that acts as a perfect dodge. Not my preference, though.

Scuttle, I have a thread where I describe my sort of love-hate for it. Base scuttle decent, because shorter cooldown than base dash, Arthropod scuttle, I'm reserving final judgement for when I try it some more. Opinion: There are currently better options.

Legs and Wings are WAY better than tentacles, and Alpha and Pollinator are just so much better for their builds than Ruminant is at all.

For a fair comparison against Legs + Wings, try Tentacles + Slither. Both pairs are compatible together, and achieve similar things.
Admittedly, Tentacles/Slither need more of a level investment into them, but Tentacles at level 3 give you the same evo options that Arms do, without the Arms stats (unlike Legs specialisation), and if you're already rocking a beak and spit, Tentacles give more of their relevant stat (Ability) than Bipedal/Arms would.

Alpha and Pollinator are both gregarious/social build types, which, yeah, Social is currently strong, because enemies got stronger. Taking that away, though, Ruminant with a good investment into Prey (so being a small, quick, opportunistic pest of a Darwin) can sustain you regardless of what you do, as long as you don't get hit (which is decently easier thanks to Prey evos - mostly dodge, size decreases, extra speed). Combine that with Basking (Scales specialisation) and Nomadic, and you can just watch the stonks grow 📈

Aggro leashing is basically non-existent

Disagree.
Enemies tend to switch targets when being hit by something, so you can bait a beeware to bite into a turtoid, and you will see them react to that. Also works with Alphas, and even bosses (eventually)!

Also, if you're a bit further away from a Beeware or Pantther, you can put a Turtoid between the two of you (with a bit of speed and foliage usage), and the predator will generally turn away if they aren't too close to you.

Important note: I don't mean to argue who's right or wrong, I consider this more of an expansion on your conclusions from my perspective. If it helps you see some things from a different angle, that's my intention, and I can rest easy. That said, feel free to return the favour, I could also need a different perspective, myself

[digital frigate]

This is more meant to be "on their own, they are better", not in-combination. Wings giving the massive terrain adapt boost and legs being such a base jump kinda put tentacles to shame, especially since Arthropod and Bipedal are so good and so easily gotten. Pollinator is "Veg gets better the more POI you get", which scales and builds with Snout and Nodmadic into the highest level build I have gotten so far. Meanwhile, Ruminant has anti-synergy with Snout because poison puts Ruminant on cooldown, that's why it's just worse than Pollinator, as both Ruminant and Pollinator reward you for not doing combat as much, but Pollinator is just a better reward because it's splashable into combat builds on tope of it.

[digital frigate]

That's not what aggro leashing is. Aggro leashing is where aggro falls off if you get far enough away from/have run away from an enemy long enough that aggro naturally falls off. I should not have to shirk my aggro so much, and it's especially bad early game when you spawn in a more hostile environment, like Snow and Desert on A5+, or you get unlucky with burrow spawns. It's really really bad early, and mildly annoying mid/late run. It also has a negative on post-bosses, as so many enemies rush you at once because you drew their aggro before the cage went down (or as soon as they spawn where the cage was, kinda unclear which). But I have died more than once to an enemy rushing in from off screen as I am eating the spoils of a downed boss.

[digital frigate]

Slide is fine, but I have gotten it... once? in all my runs? I think it's a little too rare for my tastes, but I see the appeal.

Leap being unavailable until you get Legs evo 2 (or at least I have never seen it until Legs evo 2) is annoying, and it feels clunky the once I have used it.

Scuttle is weird. Four leg scuttle is fine, but again, 4 leg required. And Arthro Scuttle being only quad directional kills it completely to me.

Sprint on the other hand has scaling, something none of the others really have, and it allows better weaving between blows, such as the Krabaroo's or the Crabotaur. It also allows you to start outrunning the Crabaphant's roll, which is great. It's just really versatile and allows for better counters to certain bosses. And it makes breaking aggro possible by putting in the distance, scales with the best perk in the game imho, Nomadic, and it makes kiting easy for all ranged attacks. It just has it all in comparison.

[buoyant zinc]

Enemies will give up after some time and different factors (depending on enemy type, your hidden Apex level vs their Apex level and your Social stat.

There's even a way to reduce how often enemies target you in general if you take certain Prey playstyles.

[spark canyon]

hmm... not aware that e.g. leap needs legs lvl 2, might just be coincidence / evo pool so wide, that you just don't get the option early enough.

My honest gripe with sprint is that it's strongly affected by terrain - I have tried it in a snow biome (or even water as an extreme), and that's where it really suffers, before you get Slither lvl 3 or Wings. Other dashes "just work", regardless of terrain. Kind of makes it feel like a "noob trap" if you get it too early. But, agree on the scaling and maneuverability - once it gets going, it feels good.

Also, just in general - the fact that people have varying preferences is a great sign imho

[buoyant zinc]

Also, just in general - the fact that people have varying preferences is a great sign imho
Absolutely!

Us seeing loads of different threads arguing and saying 1 particular playstyle is obviously the best most OP one to play (but them all being different ones) is a really really great sign 😄

[digital frigate]

Okay, good to know. It just feels, especially early game, that it takes longer than is comfy, if that makes any sense? I know the game isn't necessarily supposed to be easy, but early game aggro is nearly impossible to break without burrows, so you kinda have to hope you get a good attack/movement ability out the gate, otherwise you're getting into constant fights that start being genuinely a chore if rain or snow happens or, more commonly, a swarm of three shows up.