Jester (Neutral Evil)

[west shadow]

The Jester is an agent of chaos who will act evil on purpose to trick the town into lynching them, haunting a player & killing them when this occurs. Every day, they need to send enough messages to fulfil a "chatterbox" requirement, or they will be unable to win & die at the end of the day.

What are your thoughts on the role?

• How strong is the role compared to other roles in their faction?
• Do you think the role is fun to play as?
• Is the role fun to play against?
• Do you have any experiences or stories with this role to share?

<@&1428003109862510732>

when the discussions are daily

[latent wraith]

BURN IT

[rich gull]

Oh boy i can't wait to diss on this

[hollow elk]

peakest role in the game, next discussion

[torn violet]

Yesssssss

Wait noooooo

I was excited and then I read the role

Everyone fire react it in hopes it burns

[torn violet]

Most obvious rage bait

Let's talk about goblin

[hollow elk]

no counter therefore ragebait ez

[rich gull]

Easily one of the worst roles in the entire game, all it does is allow evils to act blatantly evil by pretending to be a jester and town is forced to hang every evil even if it's a jester which most of the time helps evils. The gameplay of jester is also very boring, you sorta just ragebait town into hanging you by spreading misinformation, there are better roles that feel more satisfying when you accomplish that goal but as jester you get hanged, haunt someone and then you do nothing for the rest of the game. Honestly this role creates more problems than it solves, jester should be reworked to not be a glorified mislynch role.

[torn violet]

I'd rather it just be removed

[rich gull]

They'll never do that

[torn violet]

We can hope and dream

[rich gull]

When was the last time a role has been removed

[torn violet]

If clash did it with heal spell

[torn violet]

Heal spell

[rich gull]

This isn't cr

[torn violet]

Anyways imo goblin dousnt sound that fun but it works far better in botc because of one simple reason

Roles are not revealed on death

[hollow elk]

roles won't be removed but they can be overhauled (ie vanilla pirate) where its basically a different role

[astral flame]

Kill jester with fire

Or make it an outlier and double down on the chaos

[torn violet]

NO

[clear meteor]

jest is best

[echo thicket]

i ll be the devils advocate and defend the jester

town doesnt get punished for hanging an evil, they get punished for hanging a low priority evil

imagine if you exe inquisitor exe and wildling as a jailor

[torn violet]

Best ti not best role

[echo thicket]

even though you didnt exe town it still leaves a bad taste in your mouth

[torn violet]

Yeah but the problem Is there isn't a reasonable way to determine how high priority they are in a lot of games

[primal tinsel]

this is the best role ever and i can't even begin to explain why it's so great

• it punishes town for hanging anyone too suspicious, because they have to think if the evil they're hanging is a jester or just a bad evil
• enables critical thinking
• punishes coven or other teams siding jester, because it's a neutral role
• overall great mechanics
  9.2/10

This is THE best role ever

[torn violet]

Yeah you definitely need therapy

[torn violet]

The difference is you're the one holding the positive

[spiral garnet]

I have no comment

[dim kernel]

Just like me fr fr

[echo thicket]

no comment means you are agreeing with me

[west shadow]

No comment means you love gorg

[chilly blaze]

Least psychic jester

(I still won)

Doom was an absolute W and doomed Mon tav crus

And not me

So I was outed fake pirate when Mon exploded

[echo thicket]

in tos1, i random accused d2 as bg/gf/arso someone d2 and they turned out to be arso xD

town still lynched me the next day

[astral flame]

Jester really is just monkey on a typewriter, huh. You have 100 jesters all spouting random nonsense and eventually they get it right

[rich gull]

NEW HERO LEAK!?!?

[latent wraith]

me casually catching the serial killer as "lookout" N1 (pest then decided it was a good time to transform D3)

[torn violet]

yes this is what we need to get this discussion downvoted

[chilly blaze]

But all 100 jesters get it right instead

[wild junco]

Carnival was a good mode bring it back

why isn’t VIP dead yet

[torn violet]

No clue

The idea itself is only mildly bad it's just really bad because it's easier to accidentally throw and any team can throw

[lilac orbit]

Typical jester players spam and throw around toxic remarks and say “dude I was a jester that’s what I’m supposed to do”

[chilly blaze]

Cause ppl vote it

[spiral garnet]

who is gorg

Also I lied

[torn violet]

gorg

[spiral garnet]

My comment about jester relates to the rhetorical question: “What about goblin? What about boomdaddy?” BotC is designed around finding a single demon and executing them, meaning that you should have context by the time you get to that point who the demon is if you play well as good. ToS Jester is just an excuse to gamethrow and play bad.

[dim kernel]

Nunny

[torn violet]

Facts

[spiral garnet]

I’ve just gone over Jester many times

you get the point if you have seen me speak

[echo thicket]

nunny

or nulley?

[spiral garnet]

Nunny I think

[wild junco]

gamethrowing is more fun as marshal anyways :(

[echo thicket]

so it seems like everyone hates jester here

[spiral garnet]

It’s just a very beginner sdg role

Once you realize how abusable it is it doesn’t work

[echo thicket]

it definetelly doesnt worked in "ranked" setting

but its fine in unserious modes in taa and jackal returns

[spiral garnet]

JR is semi serious

[echo thicket]

its still chaotic enough for jester to be fine

[spiral garnet]

It's really not but you do you

Depends on context ig

[torn violet]

This was my first time seeing

[torn violet]

It should be everyone. But yeah for some reason some people like it

[torn violet]

Imo it dousnt work there unless you go out of your way to play not cringe

[spring glacier]

this role sucks

[rugged whale]

Remove the Jester Haunt mechanic and replace it with a requirement where everyone has to type 500 messages apologizing to the Jester or the Jester will kill them next game

[torn violet]

Make Jesters win con be to be the leftmost player and rename it to wester

[wild junco]

I always find it funny whenever someone’s really sweaty all game and the moment they guilty a jester they’re like “gg wp jester that’s a good strategy you did good”

[sour relic]

very fun to play as not so much against

[spiral garnet]

amazing strat of forcing town to play correct

[chilly blaze]

All fun and games until the enchanter forges the jester as what they are claiming

[echo thicket]

make jester say the jester keyword before getting lynched

[wild junco]

#1426666267535736883 message

[spiral garnet]

I love how this says it "trick(s) the town" into hanging them but I outright say when I am Jester

[latent wraith]

"I'm Jester, guilty me"
The Town has voted to execute Jester with a vote of 13 to 0.
"YOU ABSOLUTE FOOLS"

[echo thicket]

thats how its supposed to be

[spiral garnet]

It benefits town to have me not only gone but also killing an evil for them

[echo thicket]

what if you miss and kill a townie

[spiral garnet]

That's why you ask the tpow who to kill

[torn violet]

marsh can be 1/5 wahoo

[spiral garnet]

that’s on the marshal for being sus

and for the tpow claim for killing the real tpow

[cedar mason]

I had an idea for a jester rework where you win if you die by any means but you naturally have powerful defense, but a one time use ability called spook that removes your defence and makes you suspicious murder and trespassing for one night, as well as letting you visit someone (so you can die to a rampage or smth) idk if yall think it’s too op

[torn violet]

thats just a massive jest buff

i do like the idea of getting yourself killed via not hanging though

[cedar mason]

Yeah same however there’s still the glaring issue that the mere existence of jester causes

[mental wharf]

injestigator is back

[torn violet]

Yeah but I think a jest that has to die to win would be a lot more healthy

[cedar mason]

Agreed

[torn violet]

(maybe with the exception of vigi and definitely with the exception of jailor)

[arctic mountain]

I got haunted by a jester on my transformation night as solo SC where i was hard confirmed. Burn this role into the ground

[winged knot]

the amount of free will this role gives you is incredible. breath of fresh air considering how much deduction and stuff you have to do as other roles

only thing i don’t like is the fact that you can send One Message and win. like you’re given the freedom to do whatever you want in order to be hung and you choose to…stay silent as much as you can…

[chilly blaze]

Most fun role to play as least fun to play against

[verbal gull]

jester is the best role in the game

[wild junco]

I actually hate playing jester more than Pirate/Doom (executioner can die in a hole)

I like playing stupid as other NEs where it doesn’t matter since I’ll win soon

but the moment I have to rely on it to win it doesn’t feel fun for me :(

[rugged whale]

I feel as if some people scroll jester, because I haven't played jester in vanilla in a hot minute

Playing Jest isn't the worst thing in the world IMO, especially if you're not lazy with it

[chilly blaze]

Yeah

Jester is really fun

[rugged whale]

I don't enjoy playing against Jester though

[chilly blaze]

If you don't just

N1: 4 sus

1f1

[chilly blaze]

Oh yeah I'm sure everyone agrees

I like faking tracker

And late posting known info

Sheriff n1: 4

"Sheriff visited 4"

[rugged whale]

I once won as Jester in JR by faking Seer and only getting Low Energy every night lol

and even after being put on trial I was going "these are my results, what do you want me to do?"

[chilly blaze]

You see if you fake info you will always be correct

So that seer will was 100% correct trust me

But yeah jester is really fun to play

Bc chais

Chaos

But sucks to play against

Honestly just remove haunt

Losing a day is bad enough

[reef forum]

i wonder what i think of jester

[torn violet]

Negatively

[reef forum]

🤔

[wild junco]

Gay

[torn violet]

True jest is happy

[spiral garnet]

Jailor in a nutshell

nobody wants to be jailed

[torn violet]

Retri n1

Or Necro n1

If they don't have (book)

[spiral garnet]

ah yes, no coordination

[torn violet]

It happens like a good 30% of the time on vanilla because book priority is waxk

Or like in grace

[safe pollen]

no

[unkempt surge]

why so serious

[raw bronze]

funniest stuff as Jest is saying wrong info off the top of your head, and it's right actually. yes it means i do not get hanged but i always find it amusing when the 'jest best ti' thing is real

[torn violet]

And the thing is it's not even rare for some reason, like it's a meme but it's also somehow true

[wild junco]

I think every townie should fake claim TI since it worked so well

[astral flame]

New strat unlocked: just random hang

[hasty laurel]

jester is a good role

[karmic escarp]

This role should get it's wincon somewhat inverted... You only haunt innocent voters and if it's unanymous, you still lose.

ig you could word it, haunt a player to win the game

[torn violet]

It would still suck

It needs a full overhaul or to have a high amount of guilties (aka more than a single trial of em) that they must receive

[echo thicket]

again, this would only punish people who want a high priority evil out more

jester could use a rework

but this aint it

[urban nova]

It depends of his claim. If he claims TI, then evils are cooked because it's best TI. if he claims other alignment. its mid tier

[chilly blaze]

Or hear me out

You remove haunt

Completely

[reef forum]

congratulations! this is a neutral benign role!

[chilly blaze]

Give jester facade real

[opal matrix]

Am I the only person here who likes Jester?

[torn violet]

what is wrong with you

[reef forum]

i'm just gonna leave this here

[echo thicket]

jester simply works best in person where you know the people well enough and can reliably read someone socially, or in games where with location based mechanics like among us

[opal matrix]

is it just me or does it seem like every role in tos2 sucks?

[echo thicket]

its just you

[torn violet]

Bingo

[echo thicket]

people here like to complain about everything

i dont think i have heard of a single role who someone has no issue about

even the simplest roles like retri and investigator have some people complaining about

[torn violet]

I've never heard of a complaint about pilgrim

Or covenite

[spiral garnet]

Imperfection ≠ Unsatisfactory

People assume all of the people who are nitty gritty about stuff are just whiny but it's really just that they see small improvements that could be made.

Another thing is people lump people who complain about specific roles with people with complain about other roles

There's an actual group of people who think Jackal is underpowered and they get lumped into people who avoid apoc like the plague and they get lumped into the people who think town is unhealthy in its current state, and so on.

[torn violet]

do you think jackal is underpowered?

[spiral garnet]

no lol

[torn violet]

Agreed though I do think jackal could use a little smth not cuz it's to weak but because jackal while it has a lot with managing it's recs it could use smth to be more interactive

Pre recs dying

[torn violet]

Wait why did you yay this?????

[karmic escarp]

How is Jackal not underpowered? It's basically sit on your ass doing nothing for 80% of the game

Obviously I'm talking about the role, not the mechanic

[reef forum]

it's not underpowered, it's a social role in a game where the meta is rushing kill power

[torn violet]

its the fact that the rest of the faction makes up for it and its kinda hard to balance jackal as a mechanic while buffing it

imo its ability is recs

which is quite strong

[spiral garnet]

Jackal is pretty social based yeah

that's the point of it

#1430171762481692693

[gray slate]

Jackal is heavily underpowered

[torn violet]

I love that the jackal discussion is in the jester one lol

But considering part of jackal is recs imo it's pretty strong

[gray slate]

Yes and no when it's so easy for recruits die that grace period becomes a necessary evil
I once watched saw the recuit jinx jinx the recuit invest on Tuba's stream

[torn violet]

That's more of a jinx issue

Imo

[gray slate]

Recruit jinx shouldn't kill their own teammates

[torn violet]

But I don't think town rec having defence is the worst idea or jackal having an able to give recs defense

[torn violet]

For sure

[gray slate]

I feel like at bare minimum all 3 members should be life linked with recruits dying at jackal and other recuit is dead

[torn violet]

Eh imo it's a bit to much since they don't know who jackal is

And I like the fact they don't know who jackal is

[gray slate]

They should know who jackal is and their roles

[torn violet]

Maybe jackal dying if recs die

[torn violet]

Eh I like the dynamic

That you kinda wanna subtly hint it

[gray slate]

It's dumb ngl

[torn violet]

Hard disagree

[gray slate]

Jackal has a lot issues when it comes to recruits and the last thing it needs is more issues

[torn violet]

Agreed

But for different reasons

[echo thicket]

avoid apoc like the plague
Almost like there is a** plaguebearer **in there !

[wind prairie]

Why does that say Neutral Evil? That's a Town Investigative role