#Jester change (Nug-locked edition)

114 messages · Page 1 of 1 (latest)

unreal citrus
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I think Nuggy's jester change was a great idea, but I'd like to alter it a bit to make it more fun, and remove the "know everyone's roles" thing. Changes below:

When a Jester is lynched while fulfilling their Chatterbox requirement, they win and choose a Guilty or Abstain voter to Haunt. The Jester cannot view or interact with the dead chat.

Any town-aligned player that is Haunted will be dealt an Unstoppable Attack.

non-Town-aligned players will be able to morph into a new not-in play role. Additionally, the Jester will be able to speak with this player and his immediate team at night as long as the haunted player is alive. Opposing alignments that may speak to you at night (Jailor, Pirate) will never hear the Jester. Use the special ability to go to dead chat permanently.

Morph specifications:

  • Coven Killing / Power roles can become any Coven role, so long as they are Coven-aligned.
  • Common Coven and other Coven-aligned entities (Such as Cursed Soul (Coven)) are restricted to non CK-CPOW Coven roles.
  • Apocalypse aligned players can become an acolyte.
  • Transformed Horsemen cannot morph.
  • Pandora-aligned players can choose between either Coven or Apocalypse roles.
  • **Neutral (Killing) **roles can become any other role in the same subalignment, but retain their original faction. **Neutral (Pariah) **roles can become any other role in the same subalignment.
  • Egotists, Recruited Town, Town Traitors, and Vampire-aligned players with Town roles can become any Town role that is not TPOW.
Jester_sleep.png
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This is just a little example I made for fun, in a few minutes.

The Town Traitor Admirer is Apocalypse-aligned, but because she is a TT, she can only select Town roles.

Anyway, long live Nuggy

nuglock.png
rose prism
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Orange name must upvote

In all reality I like all the Jester suggestions involving haunting an evil for benefit because it means Jester wont immediately target town powers.

Of course they still could, but in general with this (because you get to talk) you're gonna aim for an unconfirmed townie to find coven, which subtly helps town while still provding a boost to coven

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One question I have is that it looks like they retrain at night, so haunt is a day ability(...?), but you have to choose it after you get lynched, so you have like a 10 second window?

I assume it'd just work like Vanilla exe torment where it chooses if you dont

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I also think it would be neat if town also "feel the presence of a jester" and can do things accordingly. Wouldn't impact that much but its nice to know you're dying and getting to make a final action

plain aurora
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Pandora instantly becoming apoc

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I love it lol

unreal citrus
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Thanks for the feedback.

"Feeling the presence of a Jester" is just a feedback notification I made up to denote "A Jester is speaking to you and whoever is in your night chat

unreal citrus
plain aurora
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I feel like removing the unstoppable attack should be mandatory

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bc unstoppable attack + role change

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thats kinda

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op

thorny vault
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this is better than haunt but meh

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i still don’t like the wincon of jester

plain aurora
unreal citrus
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So fair

rose prism
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IYT Serial Killer becoming Werewolf on n4

unreal citrus
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I remember in Nuggy's original post someone wanted for Jackal to be able to get an NK role but idk

thorny vault
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i think jackal staying as jackal is fine

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additionally

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i don’t think evil common townies should be able to become town power

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because recruited spy to recruited prosecutor moment

unreal citrus
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just not TPOW?

thorny vault
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town power should just be off limits imo

unreal citrus
thorny vault
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yeah thats better imo

silk scaffold
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the problem with this is that it still punishes town for hanging an evil

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BUT

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i do like this soooo much better

subtle horizon
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Questions:
• Because of the way this works, jester picks who to haunt during the day, can they pre-target (like how old exe could have a pre-set target for torment) or do they have to choose in the last 10 secs of the day?
• Morphing is completely optional, right?
• What if they morph into a role that's already in play, does it just cancel out?
• Can any cov role become acolytes with pandora or only Cpow/CK?

buoyant badge
keen phoenix
unreal citrus
maiden fog
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I'm confused

unreal citrus
unreal citrus
# maiden fog I'm confused

Which, is cool when you're trying to help the Wildling because he doesn't have danger sense

But not cool when you get to kill the Marshal who was hidden with full knowledge.

maiden fog
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Yeah

thorny vault
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idk

unreal citrus
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Then you know which person is town and can make assisted scumreads on TPOW. I mean, I'd rather you don't get extra information when you already won.

That's also partially why I locked out dead chat. Jester begging from dead people is criminal levels of cringe.

small cypress
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anyway ok

round granite
digital herald
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Somehow this idea that “anti-town is inherently good” has convinced this community that this is a good change?? This does literally nothing to fix jesters problem. Literally NOTHING.

maiden fog
digital herald
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No.

thorny vault
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more of an adhesive bandage

maiden fog
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So called "free thinkers" when they see antitown Jest (it still has all the issues of normal Jest)

thorny vault
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still better than an evil dying

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since jester is never being changed

unreal citrus
digital herald
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I am it’s so sad

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The double standard. I offer a significant improvement and people cry “it’s not reworking the game from the ground up!!!”
Orange name gives the worst designed role in the game a lolipop and the community goes “wow progress ✨”

maiden fog
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I was thinking of a different post

digital herald
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I’m actually going to make a suggestion dedicated to explaining the difference between being anti-town / anti-evils and anti-cooperation

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Because I swear. People are seeing the problem but their concept of how to fix it is completely wrong

unreal citrus
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Anyway

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Jester would be nice to get a full rework but that will never happen

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Might as well make it as least awful as possible

zinc cargo
maiden fog
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Some changes will never be done

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So more realistic compromises suggested in their place are the best we can do

zinc cargo
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pretzel means "i wish it was something else but if it comes down to this i'll take it"

unreal citrus
unreal citrus
celest sparrow
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I’m still going to try to morph the outted rit/voodoo/NK

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Actually I might even shout who I am haunting

bold hearth
errant jolt
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About the ego/rec/tt/vamp, you should add that they can become a new TPOW if they are already TPOW.

earnest kite
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jest is by no means should be a strictly anti-town role

zinc cargo
earnest kite
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why the hell all NE roles should be anti-town, when they are agents of chaos

thorny vault
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because helping town as a neutral evil is not good

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“agent of chaos” rarely is good design either

earnest kite
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jest should not punish only town for hanging an evil

thorny vault
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wow its like the jester win condition is shit

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glad we reached that conclusion

zinc cargo
earnest kite
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the problem is that there isn't many other wincons

zinc cargo
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people have had other ideas for NE win conditions

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we don't need to stick with jester just because "it's been around too long to remove"

thorny vault
zinc cargo
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visit prediction as NE designspace is one that i personally am very fond of

thorny vault
zinc cargo
thorny vault
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the other thing for jester i posted a long ass time ago

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where you pick a player and if they die tonight or tomorrow you gain progress to winning ontop of cleaning their will and stuff

zinc cargo
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ehhhhh

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death prediction as a NE is something i had the idea for a while ago but it's not something that hinder's town's ability to share information or coordinate

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what if i made like. a neutral evil workshop similar to those other workshop posts

haughty nest
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not Neutral Chaos

digital herald
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NE and NP names should be swapped, they don't accurately reflect their purpose

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I'm a bit tired of people going "durr it has 'evil' in the same so we should design them strictly anti town"

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Okay, where in "Neutral Pariah" does it have "evil"? Pariah just means an outcast, so really Doomsayer is a Neutral Pariah

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your semantic arguments are worthless, everyone knows what kind of roles go under "NE" and what kind of roles go under "NP"

unreal citrus
# digital herald I'm a bit tired of people going "durr it has 'evil' in the same so we should des...

Nobody who says "It's Neutral Evil" genuinely means "It has the word evil in it and that's the only reason why it cannot hurt evils ever."

NE should hurt town more than evils because it itself is an evil that leaves town when it wins (taking one potential lynch out of the equation by default.)

Not to mention that one Coven dying is way worse than one Town dying. One recruit dying is 2/3rd of the Jackal team. One NK dying is an entire evil team dying.

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old Doomsayer was a serious problem. At worst (3 evils doomed), then you get 4 evils ripped out of the game. Now, evils have a chance to survive, and Town has a chance to save the TPOW. Swing is lessened on both sides. Doom isn't perfect, but it's the best it has ever been by far.

digital herald
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Your missing the point but I don’t have time to correct you rn, figuring it out is your homework

unreal citrus
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You are getting all upset for what?

unreal citrus
west tide
unreal citrus
west tide
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ah my b

unreal citrus
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np