#Jinx Rework (CK Retention)

1 messages · Page 1 of 1 (latest)

digital fable
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Okay, I know a lot of people in this server have prejudices against keeping the CK alignment, and think extra kills are harmful. And I know that Ritualist is, and Jinx can be, very overpowered. However, considering a lot of people in the server still have a positive opinion of Conjurer, I don't think CK is a lost cause. Here's my idea to neuter Coven KPN while still keeping Jinx as a CK. I'm still working on my Ritualist idea, hopefully to be posted tomorrow.

Jinx (Coven Killing)

Attack: Basic Bleeding (Basic with Necronomicon)
Defense: None

Attributes:
Unique
14th in Necronomicon Priority (after Hex Master, before Illusionist).

Abilities:
Jinx (3 Charges)
Jinx a player at night, dealing a basic bleeding attack to one of their non-Coven visitors.

  • Basic bleeding means that if the visitor has defense passively or granted by an ability, they will be immune.
  • If a player begins bleeding, they may only be cured by attaining Invincible Defense or being Barriered.
  • They will die two nights after being attacked if not cured.
  • Visitors will no longer see your name, and you may now visit Coven members to Jinx one of their visitors.

With the Necronomicon, additionally deal a Basic Attack to your target, or you will just deal a Basic Attack and not preform Jinx if you have no more charges.

Justification

Hitting a town member with a bleed will not affect the game as drastically as a straight-up kill. Often, they will be cured, and even if they aren't they may be killed by something else anyway. Oftentimes the purpose of the reworked role will be to punish townies for making predictable movements and draw Clerics and Oracles away from important targets by encouraging them to cure the bleeding. If the Jinx does successfully get kills, the deaths will happen later in the game and the townie afflicted will still have two days and nights to contribute.

fallow heron
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oh hey its poison but more annoying to do

spring steppe
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tf is "ck retention"

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lmao

digital fable
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retaining the CK alignment

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most people in the server are against that

fallow heron
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a lot of us arent against it but we are very much down for its deletion

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also this is still 3 extra killd

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which is a lot

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its only caveat is a cleric/oracle hardcounter

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poison is not a good ability

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its really bad

digital fable
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like 15% of games at most will have this get all 3 kills down

fallow heron
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so?

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if the 3 charges arent needed

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then reduce it

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and then theres my second problem

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this has no control over who it kills

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its completely random

digital fable
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my point is the 3 charges are needed for ineffective uses and heals. just that few times will all of those charges lead to a kill

fallow heron
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which is an issue both crus and jinx have

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you made the role swingy as shit

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how do you not see that

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you literally just said it

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this gets to unga bunga on random people and boom more kills

digital fable
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it's already swingy, this reduces how swingy it is because now there's no "you hit an NK, RIP" "there were two visitors, RIP". its still swingy but just not as much

fallow heron
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thats not a high bar?

digital fable
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my point is, the current version can be either extremely harmful by confirming people as not coven and then imploding, or unfairly powerful by getting 2 extra kills in the first 3 nights. this rework is guaranteed to get some value if the Jinx plays correctly, it's now just the question of "how valuable" that can be affected by chance. all roles to some degree have that variable, and maybe this rework relies more on it than a lot of other roles, but i believe it's still a vast improvement

fallow heron
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it can double covens kpn for up to 3 nights using its poison

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at least poison is one kill

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even if its on a cu and is a point and click kill

digital fable
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once again, can ≠ will and basing balance entirely around <10% of the time is unnecessary

fallow heron
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if it can it will

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and you literally admitted this role is swingy af

light lion
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I'm personally down for this.

digital fable
winged locustBOT
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@digital fable has leveled up! (3 ➜ 4)

levelup.png
fallow heron
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wouldnt it be infinitely better if it wasnt

digital fable
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if there was a way to make it less swingy than this, but still retain an ability to kill, i would be willing to hear that idea out. i just want to keep Jinx's ability to kill simply because i think it adds more depth to the game

fallow heron
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what so my jinx?

runic mauve
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so this is just taking jinx but adding a use limit on it, and using stupid wording

fallow heron
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also poison

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it adds poison

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reflavored

runic mauve
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SO ITS A FUCKING POISONER JINX?

fallow heron
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and get this

digital fable
# fallow heron

that has one kill and you're placing it in CU, that's not what i mean

fallow heron
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it loses charges on use not just successful use

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if it visits it loses a charge

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how is it cu

digital fable
fallow heron
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it kills

fallow heron
fallow heron
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conj and pois is proof of that

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and this has injure as well

runic mauve
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also "Basic Bleeding" is the stupid wording i was talking about

digital fable
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summed it up without including any of the actual substance of the rework

runic mauve
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just call it fucking Basic Poison

fallow heron
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what substance

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its jinx that poisons with 3 charges

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that also happens to remove the message

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a common part of every jinx rework

runic mauve
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also why barrier only

fallow heron
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because thats how poison works

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it gets hardcountered by cleric and oracle

runic mauve
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true

fallow heron
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just like poison

digital fable
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alright, whatever, you've made your thoughts on this rework clear. i don't think there's anything else to say

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also "hardcountered by cleric and oracle" is a misunderstanding of it. it occupies Clerics and Oracles potentially for three nights in a row so coven have more kill freedom

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just like bleeds in ToL occupy Chrono and Phys

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not literally occupy since that's a status effect in ToL but you know what i mean

fallow heron
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does it lose out on its kill if a cleric or oracle spawn?

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its kill being its entire ability

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if your answer is yes

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then it gets hardcountered

digital fable
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literally just explained how the kill isn't the entire ability but thanks for your helpful thoughts

fallow heron
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if you want a role to guarantee the book attack, literally make a book support role

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or have pois rb the tp claim

fallow heron