📖lore-chat

[wraith sigil]

like just a Tang-5/10-Song basic course

[mystic idol]

^

thats basically the ecosystem now i guess

[iron canyon]

considering how different the two languages are, and you need something that can weigh almost the same as an original while not sounding cringe is def hard

[scarlet yarrow]

today i realized gift of gab is just full of ad hominems

[hidden kelp]

I wonder if age/maturity/life experience also factors into some global audiences not understanding burlap sack story? My core guild group are on the older end and most of them seem to get it. Even if not catching all the details, at least the theme and emotional beats weren't missed

[shy heath]

where can I report a macro user (farming flowers)?

[iron canyon]

That could be a factor and also I think the environment ppl grew up matters too. Some people were accustomed to fast paced storytelling, and some might feel impatient, it really depends on the person themselves if they are able to immerse themselves in the story or not. A storytelling method may not suit everyone

[lost crescent]

on their profile card, down at the bottom, to the right...the little button says more >.>

[lost crescent]

Also....bounty them afterwards

[shy heath]

So we can't report them with a videoproof?

[clever trout]

Who is this heartseeker bro?

At first I thought it was qianye but probably not

And who's the|| white haired lady with qianye in the blissful retreat endgame fight? Aunt han's twin?||

[scarlet yarrow]

this guy knows big zhao?

[ocean wedge]

Owwww

[woven sigil]

YM having a vision of what's coming but not understanding it

[tidal grail]

He also knows his true identity but didn't reveal it to us

[iron canyon]

That's both her, just in different forms, it's said that the white haired one appeared man liked because she had part of aunt han's brother's organs, but even these are just theories deducted based on the information we have, no confirmation about it

[clever trout]

Can u share the location pls

Also why did big zhao appear in jin zhongyuan's inner demon nightmare?

[scarlet yarrow]

cos he is big zhao's little brother

[scarlet yarrow]

i'm not playing rn bro sorry

[iron canyon]

it's the drunken martial artist world boss at kaifeng

[iron canyon]

big zhao and jinzhongyuan are brothers (there's an encounter called Winter Gambit where you'll know about them), the past we saw in the quest was about them when jinzhongyuan was younger

[royal plover]

Wtf u mean, its drunken boss

[hushed halo]

I’m not much of a lore person, but noticed smth during the burlap sack quest that has been bothering me. ||Near the end of the quest when he’s dying(?), he puts the seeds on his eyes as the birds are coming for them. Is there a reason it had to be his eyes? Did he want the birds to pluck them out or smth? And if so why, if not then why did he put them on his eyes??||

[royal plover]

Vulture eat eyes first

[woeful mango]

Better chance of them eating the seeds for sure like that

[honest rain]

It's also very "eyeballing" it. Personally, I can't see the difference in models, just different hairstyle making silhouette look bigger/burlier. I think someone said this theory and a lot of people just repeat the statement without actually checking😭

[honest rain]

Scavenger go for soft places (ex. eyes) first, so by putting seeds on eyes he made sure that they get picked up (and consequently carried and spread out) as soon as possible

[ocean wedge]

Hmmm

[royal plover]

Vulture eat eyes first, by putting seed on eyes then the vulture also eat the seed too, then later u see a vulture poop, this poop had seed on it, then the seed grow on the ground

[iron canyon]

The theory came from because how it's known that aunt han has a brother that failed to escape, and the Liang Noblewoman needed the twins' organs for her appearance. During QianYe's first encounter w YM, she said something like if ym caught the scent of a man. Her appearance in her second stage also appears androgynous, so people started speculating about it, but yeah after all, there's no concrete information, so we can't say for sure

[honest rain]

I'm not saying it isn't true, just that the big part of this theory is "2nd phase inevitable of them looks more masc", which I call unreliable eyeballing that many people repeat without checking twice

Also, I tried overlaying the models from compendium (not very reliable too, but imo better than "it looks different"), and they seem to me similar in height and chest, just the hairstyle makes white appear larger (and for many ppl larger=masculine).

I'll see if I can find the pictures, but really, at this point it's "we need more proof from devs"-level on both sides

[iron canyon]

The androgynous appearance makes it hard ngl, you can argue in both because they're possible, she's just as mysterious as Aunt Han, and the fact that these two are both influential characters we'll need more information

[honest rain]

Tbf, I won't even agree with androgynous take, but also I'm faceblind af😭
The characteristics that I can check (general body shape, height, chest) appear to me just like a mildly muscular woman with chest binds. Are the faces really that different or is this a case of "internet saw women with defined pecs muscles and got scared"😭

[iron canyon]

Most probably from the features, because you do have people with an androgynous face that gives two different vibes when they dress themselves differently, so it's not entirely impossible, but since qianye is a well known shapeshifter, things would be complicated, so I guess the illusion can't say much. We never know what bomb will the devs drop, the only thing we can do is wait at least in the records they consistently uses "she" ig

[honest rain]

I saw in one chapter on cn she ||shows off her skill by taking on YM's face, even for male YM||, so it's not impossible. I still think some ppl are just being weird about her boss model😭

[iron canyon]

Even till now people might still mistaken her gender ~~||but still calls her jiejie anyways||~~😭

[wicked prawn]

are these khitan cavalry?

no? oohh who are these soldiers?

[honest rain]

Ate you in Whitecrown fortress?

[wicked prawn]

yups

I just entered. fascinated by the battle frozen in time

[honest rain]

Anxi army

[wicked prawn]

ooohhh this is Anxi the one in horses? who are they fighting?

[honest rain]

You can see a post about them on WWM twitter/X account (https ://x.com/i/status/2032094271319486719 )

[honest rain]

Records consistency doesn't stop some people from calling TianBuShou a woman, so idk how much of an argument you can make about that

[frail mauve]

Tian Bushou is || a woman indeed||, what do you mean

[honest rain]

Which is mentioned in 3 sentences out of about 5-6 texts and many quest appearances... meaning TianBuShou is more consistently refered to as a man than a woman, which, by the logic Eternal applied to Qianye, would mean everyone should adress him as male. Your reply just proved my point that consistency in game text does nothing to sway players that want to spread their take on the topic (examples being TianBuShou's gender, Qianye second phase and such)

[vague shoal]

Isnt that because game doesnt wanna make it obvious unfated tian is a woman?

[frail mauve]

there is no evidence shows that Qianye is a male

[honest rain]

Yeah, I just brought it up bc I feel like Qianye 2nd phase debate is along same lines, and everybody in the fandom has their own take on these topics

[vague shoal]

And the small talk between the patients where they mentioned how unfated tian is so familiar the female body and mindset pretty much confirms it

[honest rain]

Yeah, and if we believe NPCs Zhang Cuo is sleeping with Zheng E

There are a few compendium texts that point to that, but I was making a point about fandom behavior, not TianBuShou

[vague shoal]

You can clearly tell which one is a joke and which one is not lol

There's so many things that point unfated tian is a female too

Text of the game calling unfated tian "he" is just to make unfated tian's real identity not obvious

[honest rain]

Can you?
"Dr.Tian knows women problems so well, it's as if he experienced it" and "y'know, word on the street Lord Zhang got very cozy relation with Lord Zheng" are pretty same level of gossip

One being supported by other sources doesn't make NPCs talk reliable

[vague shoal]

It's supported by sources in game that make it sound reliable, wdym lol

While the other is just clearly gossip/bl jokes

[honest rain]

Have you read the last sentence, or do you just react to first

Unreliable source being supported by reliable source, doesn't make 1st source reliable

[vague shoal]

It's might look like the same level of gossip but when there are clues proving unfated tian a woman then you can clearly tell which is a joke and which is not

Im just pointing out one of the most obvious clue, there are plenty others in the game

If every lore of unfated tian is pieced together it makes no sense for unfated tian to be a man

But alright you can stick to the text that's meant to mislead people thinking unfatied tian is a man as you want, to each their own

[honest rain]

You're using unreliable clue to make your point, when both of us know there are at least two more reliable clues. Basing your point on unreliable clue makes your point unreliable

[vague shoal]

It's not unreliable because it's tied to other clues proving unfated tian a woman

Im pointing it out because it's the most obvious one

While the others you have to read in copendium

Even if the NPC I mentioned isnt the best proof it doesnt change the fact unfated tian is a woman in the end

[honest rain]

I was not making a point about unfated Tian, I was making a point about consistency of pronouns used. If "Qianye [a known trickster character] is consistency referred to with she" is an argument, then "TianBuShou is consistently referred to as male" is also an argument

If we stick to it, in English text it can be argued that Feng Ruzhi, heads of Silver needles and Lone Cloud as well as Dao Lord girlies are all male because the AI netease use defaults to male pronouns in impersonable texts

So I was pointing out that the point made was bad when discussing the specific theory, because it can't be applied consistently across the story

[vague shoal]

So like were you talking about how people thought qianye was a man or sthing? I scrolled up to read and it's still confusing

[iron canyon]

I suppose people isn't saying that she's male, but rather "appears more manly"(in cn ppl wrote 偏男相 which means leaning towards a manlike appearance slightly), as far as we know, qianye is a woman throughout the records

[slender jetty]

🧐

[honest rain]

I mean, I'm not arguing with Qianye fem, I mean that we should be careful with applying consistent pronouns use argument to dismantle theories because

1. We know people don't respect these
2. We know translation is weird on it in some points

Otherwise I agree on other points about Qianye

3. We know devs aren't afraid to write genderfunky characters

[iron canyon]

But because of the lack of confirmation & popular theories (I understand people ain't perfect and would miss out details here and they might misunderstand a statement), some people would actually mistaken qianye as male / turned into male in her second form, so until now it's safe for us to use "she" on qianye, until further info / changes are revealed

[vague shoal]

I havent seen anyone calling qianye a he before

[honest rain]

Imagine the mess that'll unravel in theorycrafting space after ||Qianye copying YM's face scene||, oh it'd be awful

[crimson birch]

oops

[scarlet yarrow]

do liangzhou and qinchuan also have fantasy beasts? i want to fight humans

[cedar basalt]

[frail mauve]

||there will be both human bosses and fantasy bosses||

[shell fable]

Looking forward to it! The game could definitely use more variety when it comes to regular enemies

[distant sage]

awesome

[scenic obsidian]

But even human bosses would be some sort of magical creature

Guo Xin will be the only history based character we fight as a Boss in the entire Hexi Chapter.

||We are slowly moving through history in the timeline of Hexi from Late Tang Dynasty(Jade Gate Pass)to Last Days of Tang Dynasty(Liangzhou) to doom of Tang Dynasty(Qinchuan).||

I have counted it.

||We have only three pure human bosses out of eleven bosses in the entire chapter of Hexi.||

[honest rain]

I guess it supports the whole "dreamworld" concept

[scenic obsidian]

I’m feeling like if it’s not censorship

This chapter gonna be hell of exciting

The dreamworld concept is lame as hell.

If it’s not censorship we probably gonna play as a soldier riding horse and fighting these armies

And we gonna dress like this

[clever trout]

Yeah just came back from learning these 2 are same person 😭

What was he doing on the 2nd photo btw?

||Like mc threatened him with a sword but I remember mc being friends with him from boat and inner demon quest ||

||I thought he was on god of avarice's side and was trying to execute wen wuque||

[mystic idol]

it was explained after in the conversation with yingying, zhao 2 doesn't hold a grudge over you for that

he's not trying to execute wen wuque nor is he evil

he was just of the opinion that it was fine to let commoners suffer the poverty if it means they can use the money to build up army and claim the south faster

the logic was explained in winter's gambit

the south is resource rich, if they claim south they can use that to end the poverty

[clever trout]

He didn't recognize us on the main quest when we dressed up as dancers? Or the mirage boat quest just occurred later?

[mystic idol]

and if they open up treasury they'll have no money to raise military, which makes their country weak and susceptible to foreign invaders

[mystic idol]

mirage boat quest is after

[clever trout]

Thanks a lot Shui

[mystic idol]

npnp

[clever trout]

So basically wuque's logic was if the commoners die now its of no use to preserve all that for later?

[mystic idol]

wuque's character is also complicated

because she has self interest in wanting Song to open its treasury

She's originally from the south (although now power stripped by Wen Wuhen [the guy from the mirage boat quest] after she lost the power struggle), and made a deal with Shimmer of the South that if she helps him achieve his plans (to decimate Song economy and weaken them so they can't invade the south), then he will help her get her footing in the south again so she can take revenge

[mystic idol]

if you havent done the campaigns in kaifeng or the shimmer of the south quest yet, do those first

main story -> campaigns/other quests -> shimmer of south for kaifeng area

[clever trout]

I've done all 10 of those

But struggled to understand important lore at many parts 😭

[mystic idol]

okay, so wen wuque along with shimmer was the one who orchestrated the events that we saw in the kaifeng main story quest

[woven sigil]

Zhao Er has a weakness for "hard men making hard decisions" kind of logic, which the Aureates took advantage of placing Lord Shi to whisper in his ear

[mystic idol]

including the economic warfare tactics that made poverty even worse in kaifeng

[clever trout]

Damn... sis out here tryna weaken song economically but the emperor in disguise hangs out with her and us together

[mystic idol]

she had a bit of a change of heart regarding if they should just leave the poor/commoners like that after basically empathizing with granny turtle (also since granny turtle treats her well/took her in after she escaped from the south after the power struggle failed vs Wen Wuhen), which is why she helped us

[woven sigil]

yeah Big Zhao is very conflicted because he's tired of the constant wars, but knows unless China is united the era of infighting and invasions will just drag on and on

[clever trout]

Bro is a cutie potatoie 😭

[mystic idol]

but its important to acknowledge that even though she was helping us, she was also fulfilling her own personal goal anyway, since Shimmer is fine with the outcome as long as it weakens Song and he would then help her

[mystic idol]

yeah, in WWM Big Zhao does a lot of things he wishes he doesn't have to, but feels like he has to in order to stop the constant infighting

[clever trout]

So taking down God of avarice harmed song economy

[mystic idol]

no, at this point the economy was already devastated

[woven sigil]

well Lord Shi was just awful for everyone, he's an Aureate and his advice to Song was intentionally damaging

[clever trout]

Ouch

[woven sigil]

Shimmer's plan was to damage their economy with the Tang coins but he didn't actively want the common people to suffer, then Lord Shi convinces Zhao Er to just seize Tang coins with no exchange, essentially just robbing the people of Kaifeng at swordpoint

[mystic idol]

well, Shimmer didn't actually really care if common people suffered or not

and in the beginning, neither did Wen Wuque

[woven sigil]

it's apathy but not malice

[mystic idol]

but Wen Wuque later changed her mind and proposed the alternate plan

yes correct

[clever trout]

Later they probably went on with future plan of paper notes iirc

And returned the robbed stuff idk

[honest rain]

The mirrage boat technically happens before, but also YM was running around like a little pawn in both quests, so it is plausible that Zhao Guangyi simply didn't get a proper look

[honest rain]

YM is not returning to Kaifeng after Ch2

[mystic idol]

really? There's a pause in the CN language before YM addresses Zhao, when YM finds out that Zhao is also present

[clever trout]

Rip us we always get used assassination pawns

[woven sigil]

at the end of campaign they exchange coins of all types for paper currency, which takes the Tang coins out of circulation but doesn't solve the question of how to fund the military; that leads to Jinming Pool where they squeeze Shu and Jiangnan for tribute and basically say "whoever pays more gets attacked last"

[mystic idol]

like a hesitation in saying his name

I interpret that as catching themselves before saying the real name

plus the way the two interact imply familiarity with each other already

which to me reads more like after main story and campaigns

[woven sigil]

well Mirage Boat is an event quest so it's kinda written to take place whenever

[mystic idol]

sure but you can still usually place a chronological order (or at least before X events, after Y events) to some degree with them

[woven sigil]

like the bigger thing is YM should definitely have a reaction to meeting Wen Wuhen since he's Wuque's archnemesis

[clever trout]

Exactly

[honest rain]

I might have to replay it, but purely logically, YM is not running circles (unlike players, who have too much free time on their hands), they are moving in "straight" plot line

So it's either the Wuhen and his bf quest happens before Ch2 or way later

[clever trout]

But they were on friendly terms and he also helped him out

Tho the thief was just pranking

[mystic idol]

YM is also not that dumb to declare your allegiances

to someone who you don't understand anything about

the fact that Wen Wuhen invites YM to go to the south

but was rebuffed by YM imo is exactly that

putting distance between the two because YM is cautious of who he is

or what he's capable of doing

[woven sigil]

you can read it that way but it's written weakly cause you could be playing it before Kaifeng

[mystic idol]

you could also do the CNY event before finishing ch1

and then you'll be missing aunt Han/ruby/yidao even tho blissful retreat hasn't been burned down

[woven sigil]

yeah it's just a general issue with event quests everywhere

[mystic idol]

and she's right there in the story

[woven sigil]

don't worry she left the red envelope in one of the unburned buildings

conveniently undamaged

[mystic idol]

so I don't think using event quest indicates that it can be at any time and chronologically doesn't matter

[floral swan]

is everything in this game made by ai? why was the hexi main quest and voice acting so trash

[woven sigil]

some of the English voice acting probably is

[clever trout]

Burlap's voice acting was better than male mc imo 😭

[mystic idol]

imo its better than Kaifeng and Qinghe

so there's improvement

[floral swan]

wtf ru smoking

[woven sigil]

English dub is painful

[clever trout]

In expressing emotions and stuff

[mystic idol]

qinghe and kaifeng english va was abysmal

[clever trout]

Yeah talking abt eng

[mystic idol]

at least hexi tried to match the vibes of cn

ok so you're complaining about a gameplay preference and using that to say its AI

[clever trout]

Guess there's lot of hate on ch 3 so far cuz we didn't get the hype play after that story rip

[mystic idol]

imagine only being able to enjoy "hype" scenes

[floral swan]

now why would i care ab some random old man

[mystic idol]

and lacking empathy to settle down and think about larger than individualistic needs

[floral swan]

if i wanted to sleep id hop on yt and watch something not play where winds meet

[mystic idol]

ch3 is the first and only chapter where it takes a step back from the main character and events that seem to be unrelated to us

and uses a diff kind of story telling

[clever trout]

We went there in delusion anyway

The veiled lady dropped us there

Btw a diff topic ||I think li zuo is our dad||

[mystic idol]

in cn too a lot of people were confused at whats the relation

or like, why talk about these stories/tales, why show us this etc

until after hexi concluded

[clever trout]

Gotta wait till the conclusion then

[mystic idol]

but generally fs CN's opinion is Hexi = Qinghe > Kaifeng > Mohist hill for main story

[woven sigil]

yeah but it's not gonna help people who just mash through

[clever trout]

Patiently without spoils (tho I most likely search up spoilers fast😭)

[mystic idol]

i mean tbf nothing is going to help people who are just looking to play monster hunter but wuxia

[woven sigil]

same people leaving notes in Ch1 going "ugh I hate this stupid kid"

[mystic idol]

there will always be people like that it just cant be helped

[clever trout]

||that guy u beat up on top of mountain sees li zuo in ur place. In trailer we tried to approach jiang Yan carrying baby who threatened us with a sword....later li zuo stood in our place||

[mystic idol]

youre not

this is largely disproved in CN

[barren kelp]

can someone help me

i log on to the game on steam and its telling me to create a new character when i click resume or the characters

[clever trout]

Ruby 😭

My daughter

[barren kelp]

cant access my main account

[mystic idol]

i wont explain cuz spoilers but in CN its revealed where YM came from

[clever trout]

Oh heck yeah pls dont

[mystic idol]

maybe check your steam account login, or if you binded your account to some other platform, try logging in on that

[barren kelp]

i didnt bind it i was playing last night

when i log on today i cant access my characters

[honest rain]

I am so concerned about that trailer scene, because it draws parallel between YM-Jiang Yan relationship and Li Zuo-Wang Qing... but it's also possible that devs just put in a cool shot to show BBEG in the trailer (/cope)

[north trench]

lore i know about this game. that even powerful character have limit like tian ting go to prison

[ocean wedge]

Hmm

[scenic obsidian]

People in Kaifeng had almost half century of nightmare experiences

[lilac prairie]

Just wait in the menu and eventually it will load in

[scenic obsidian]

Whenever a new group of ruler enter the city, the ruler would allow their henchmen to raid, r*pe and rob people of Kaifeng for at least three days.

And this kind of purgatory happened at least 7 times in 50 years.

[analog anvil]

Are we talking about the thing that current incumbent of Kaifeng did NOT do

[scenic obsidian]

Yes.

All of his predecessors did except one of them

[iron canyon]

It happened quite early, people understood the ||qianye taking ym's appearance|| because she was introduced & well known as a shapeshifter

[iron canyon]

also because the court needs someone to take the responsibilities for their decisions, so zhao er took it up, it was a huge gamble after all

[unkempt atlas]

🤘

[tranquil sparrow]

Anyone from velvet shade have votes dm me I can bring joy into your life little bit

[royal plover]

Ym come from someone hole

[royal plover]

He is strong but not strong like naruto, he cant beat entire batalion

[bright smelt]

anyone knows which is the requirement to craft bow and ring for lvl 86 gears?

[wicked prawn]

ask here #🌱beginner-questions. This channel is for lore related questions

[celest flume]

Ouie

[fluid gust]

The lore about burlap sack man goes on to explain how he goons for 10 hrs a day before he sets on for his quest through the desert

[fading trout]

Is there a general channel?

[fluid gust]

Yes

[north trench]

what does goons mean in this context?

is it mean working

[trail trout]

Is the whole jade gate pass quest about an old man?

[royal plover]

Any reason why dev make story about hexi dispute its not any relation to main story?

Are they put this so they can have time to make real main story late, like filler does in anime?

[cinder inlet]

Hexi is more like historical. I liked the current ending although the walkthrough was boring, the story of seeds and the defenders quiet cool

[frail mauve]

Hexi only released 1/3, to early to say it has no relation to main story. tbh it's less than 1/3, content in Liangzhou and Qinchuan will be much more than Jade Gate Pass

[iron canyon]

It's for us to get to know the past to understand what exactly happened until this point of time, we only got 1/3 of it, it takes some time

[fallow schooner]

question, the scene on the last chapter of Qinghe, someone grab the wanderer so he doesn't get blown up, does anyone know who that was? it was a woman's hand wasn't it?

[honest rain]

Everyone is pretty confident it was Aunt Han

[minor nova]

[livid geyser]

Guys can we please write a petition to finally add the feature “Transfer character so they

[coral dove]

can we?

[rose bough]

is hexi a real world?

or dream realm

[north trench]

hexi exist in real life

[rose bough]

how did we transferred to hexi?

[north trench]

i think that because mc go back in time to late 700s

[rose bough]

how we can see the glimpse?

[rose bough]

that golden fortress thing?

[north trench]

someone ask us to draw painting from tang dynasty then somehow we wake up in tang dynasty to draw it

[rose bough]

so it is dream realm like Blissful Retreat?

we can reverse time there

[north trench]

yeah

[rose bough]

we are sleeping the whole time in hexi then

[north trench]

yes in lore

sleep time chamber

idk how long time gunna past when hexi finish we finally draw the painting

probably they just gonna make it short time canonly

[rose bough]

did you know any good lore video or blog or lore site of wwm

so that i can get some clear idea >> i forgetten most part><

[frail mauve]

You can watch WWM Girl's video on YouTube. She makes many good lore videos about wwm

[pure sonnet]

Where aunt han at yooo

[carmine ice]

soon, you'll find her soon enough

[foggy horizon]

lll

[celest flume]

at home

[scenic obsidian]

Indeed

Or you guys can tag me anytime

Officially rename my self as Chinese History Guy

[scenic obsidian]

Both

||It’s a combination between MC’s dream, historical setting, cultural references and modern censorship.||

[scenic obsidian]

I am feeling like they were trying to catch a pop-culture trend in China, because the mainstream Chinese pop culture had a “Tang Dynasty Fever” starts from 2022 to 2025, which large amounts of soup operas, games and fictions became really famous during this period of time.

[clever trout]

Bro I'm embarrassed to learn out only now that han and jiang are not couple

[scenic obsidian]

We don’t know the exact age of aunt Han but she is probably ten years older than uncle Jiang

[vague shoal]

Why do you think she's that old lol

[clever trout]

I knew she looked older but we saw uncle last like years ago so he might've gone old by then

Regardless she's breathtaking beautiful

[vague shoal]

I think they are around the same age, in their 30s

[scenic obsidian]

the game never states an exact age gap between Han Xiangxun and Jiang Yan, but based on the timeline, Han Xiangxun is clearly older. Jiang Yan is about nineteen during the Zhongdu Bridge incident and roughly in his mid-thirties by the start of the main story. Han Xiangxun, who is already an established and experienced Jianghu figure and later raises the protagonist, appears to belong to an earlier generation. Most players therefore estimate that she is roughly ten years older than Jiang Yan, give or take a few years, though no official number is confirmed.

[vague shoal]

What if she was already famous in her 20s?

[scenic obsidian]

Not likely because you need to give her time to work for the pavilion.

[vague shoal]

Idk she had plenty of time from 18 to current age lol

Or 16 if she was like MC setting out at the age of 16

[clever trout]

Han started raising us after jiang yan's disappearance?

[vague shoal]

They raised the MC together

[slender jetty]

🤔ohh

[clever trout]

Oooh

[woven sigil]

she met Jiang while he was still on the run and went "well I can't just let this guy be a single dad... for the baby's sake"

people in Heaven's Pier were fully shipping them together

[scenic obsidian]

So clearly Aunt Han is much older..

[wanton nimbus]

😈 oh no

what a shame

[clever trout]

Lmao why

[spiral escarp]

So what exactly is velvet sect? is it basically a certain industry in the real world?

[clever trout]

I'm afraid I'll look like a beggar in that sect

[scenic obsidian]

it is very reasonable to conclude that Han Xiangxun was already close to adulthood, if not fully an adult, when she began working with pavilion. By the time the organization took interest in her, she was no longer a novice but an experienced jianghu operative known for her face-changing techniques and involvement in covert infiltration networks, which later became central to the conflict surrounding Blissful Retreat. In other words, she was likely recruited only after she had already built a reputation and practical skill set, meaning she would have been at least near adulthood—and most likely already grown—when she started acting on Xiujin Lou’s behalf.

[spiral escarp]

No I'm just confused. Is it just a hangout for single people or is it a "place of pleasure" or whatever the game calls it in one of the dialogues

[scenic obsidian]

||Yes, Ancient Chinese prostitution industry||

[woven sigil]

Also spoilers

[spiral escarp]

Yeah I figured. How dare these people send my character an invitation

She shan't partake in such activities

[vague shoal]

You dont need 10 20 years to establish a reputation in the jianghu

[clever trout]

I thought it was just elegance and clothes 😭

[spiral escarp]

Yeahhhhh no

Too many hot single women in one place for that lmao

[vague shoal]

Like being known as water lady at 25 then work for aureate pavillion for 10 years is still long enough

[clever trout]

Midnight blades all the way but I last 0.5 second in fights

[vague shoal]

Most MCs in wuxia stories become famous when they are young anyway

[clever trout]

So just scamming ppl as 9mw

[spiral escarp]

I was considering the masked troupe but I don't wanna advertise in world chat lmfao

[scenic obsidian]

But Uncle Jiang is only 16 when he took us from the battlefield of Zhong Du Bridge, and aunt Han already have her business and that was during five regime and ten kingdom era, a crazy chaotic period in Chinese history.

[clever trout]

Damn

[vague shoal]

We dont know if aunt han met jiang when he was 16

[spiral escarp]

Yo what is all this lore bro I barely understand anything ingame and y'all talking about back stories

[vague shoal]

He could have raised us till 7 or 8 then met aunt han

[clever trout]

If he can why can't we, let me adopt the rat triplets pls

[spiral escarp]

Aunt Han x Jiang ship?

Doesn't aunt han have a husband or something

[vague shoal]

Aunt han is at most late 30s

[clever trout]

Nah fam just i started it saying i thought they're couple

[spiral escarp]

no idea

[scenic obsidian]

That will make Aunt Han even older because the pavilion established way before the Zhong Du Bridge incident and that’s when Li Zuo and Khitan built their alliance because that’s the point of time when Khitan conquered China.

||Khitan already have zombie army during the Zhong Du Bridge incident.||

And Uncle is only 16 years old at Zhong Du bridge

[woven sigil]

Whatever the age gap it's close enough that people in the town wanted them to be a couple

[vague shoal]

Do we knowif aunt han already established her business when uncle jiang was 16 though

[scenic obsidian]

A fun fact: Ancient Chinese people don’t talk about the women’s age. So people have no clue how old Aunt Han was

[vague shoal]

I think she was still known as the water lady and havent retired

[scenic obsidian]

And Aunt Han is a great plastic surgeon…

[vague shoal]

I read somewhere in the game that when jiang first known aunt han she was still wearing a mask or sthing

[scenic obsidian]

That’s doesn’t make sense because they were enemies

[vague shoal]

We dont know what kind of role aunt han played in the aureate pavillion yet

Dont even know how long she was in it

[scenic obsidian]

If Aunt Han still working to the pavilion at Zhong Du Bridge, that means she is working for Li Zuo, and Li Zuo was helping Khitan.

No way they know each other at that time.

[vague shoal]

Or it might have been a short term deal

[scenic obsidian]

And the biggest historical fact is

After the Zhong Du Bridge Incident, Qinghe and Kaifeng was raid by Khitan ruthlessly for a couple years.

[vague shoal]

There's too many things we dont know about aunt han to guess her age correctly

Everything about her past is just speculation besides when she was a child

[scenic obsidian]

I am gonna dig deeper to find more evidence, but at this moment of time there is no doubt Aunt Han is older than Uncle Jiang, just how many years older.

[vague shoal]

Yeah I think she's older too, but not by much for sure

[viscid cloud]

Rip burlap

[scenic obsidian]

||Set against the collapse of the Five Dynasties order, the narrative timeline can be reconstructed around several firm historical anchors. In 938, Shi Jingtang ceded the Sixteen Prefectures of Yan and Yun to the Khitan Liao, permanently reshaping the northern frontier and setting the geopolitical background of the story . The decisive in-story anchor occurs in 946 (Kaiyun 3 of Later Jin), when the Khitan conquest of North China coincided with the Zhongdu Bridge incident; at that moment the protagonist was an infant and Jiang Yan was approximately 19, providing the only fixed personal age reference. Over the following decade (946–960), corresponding historically to the chaotic transitions from Later Han to Later Zhou within the Five Dynasties period , Jiang Yan and Han Xiangxun jointly raised the child while operating within a fragmented northern underworld shaped by warfare, private militias, and frontier commerce; this environment also plausibly explains the early rise of the Pavilion network and its gray-zone contacts with Khitan markets. In 960, Zhao Kuangyin’s Chenqiao Mutiny founded the Song dynasty, marking the gradual restoration of central authority, yet northern frontier instability—and with it clandestine trade networks—persisted. By 962 (Jianlong 3 of Song), when the game’s main storyline opens, the protagonist is sixteen and Jiang Yan is about 35, while Han Xiangxun appears already an established senior figure within both Jianghu and institutional power structures. Taken together, the historical chronology, Jiang Yan’s fixed age point, the earlier emergence of pavilion during the Five Dynasties turmoil, and Han Xiangxun’s demonstrated seniority strongly suggest she was already a fully mature actor by the mid-940s, making her most plausibly several years older than Jiang Yan—likely in the range of roughly eight to twelve years—though no canonical source confirms an exact ten-year difference.||

[celest flume]

holy yap

catman

[honest rain]

Iirc, the records of their dialog from back then mention infant, so YM was still little

[scenic obsidian]

So after we put all the historical events together. We can have a much concrete timeline.

[vague shoal]

Thing is in wuxia stories people can still achieve alot even when they are young so saying aunt han needs to be old to be able to establish herself as a senior figure dont make a lot of sense

[vague shoal]

Yeah I'm thinking we were probably 5 or 6 when aunt han started taking care of us or sthing

[scenic obsidian]

||That’s true in a general wuxia sense, but the issue here isn’t just “achievement at a young age,” it’s relative positioning within this specific timeline. Jiang Yan has one fixed anchor—he was about 19 at Zhongdu Bridge—while Han Xiangxun is already portrayed at that point as a fully established Jianghu actor with institutional authority, stable networks, and decision-making parity with him. In wuxia, young prodigies absolutely exist, but figures who simultaneously command long-standing organizations (like Xiu Jin Lou), operate cross-border systems involving Khitan trade, and occupy clear senior standing usually imply longer accumulation of capital, reputation, and alliances, not just talent.||

[vague shoal]

Im pretty sure she was more of a solo player as water lady

[scenic obsidian]

You need time to put everything together…

[vague shoal]

A lot of people know her dont mean she has a well constructed network of connections

[hidden kelp]

Infant is not 5-6. It's like <1-2

[honest rain]

1. We know she's less than 80, bc that number is used in "even when (..)" sentence
2. We know she was adult when she met Jiang (jianghu logic, at least 16)
3. We know it's been 16years since previous event

Leaving us with lover boundary of 32 and upper boundary of 80, purely mathematically

But she's likely mid 40s, if I had to make a guess

And nobody trying to say she can't be in her 40s has never seen a good-looking mid40s woman

[vague shoal]

My bet is she's 38-40

[scenic obsidian]

You need time to build all of this—especially in the Five Dynasties and Ten Kingdoms period, a chaotic era when regimes changed every two or three years and new groups kept coming to Qinghe and Kaifeng to plunder and massacre.

[hidden kelp]

Asian don't raisin

[deep lion]

Maybe out of topic but isn’t our aunt han almost a villain?

[scenic obsidian]

Not true

[scenic obsidian]

In some perspective, yes.

Cause the pavilion sided with Khitans and Khitans are the villains in the story.

[scenic obsidian]

And plus plastic surgery.

[mystic idol]

Han Xiangxun is actually very ruthless also, MC is the exception

[hidden kelp]

I just remembered something. Relevant to discussion 😂

[woven sigil]

Heaven's Pier was built during the Khitan invasion from refugees Aunt Han rescued, so she wasn't on the side of the Khitans by the end of the war at the latest

[deep lion]

That’s what i was confused about lol, the story tells how ruthless and villainous kithans are but then most of the mc’s close circle was ‘hanging” around them

[scenic obsidian]

So this makes the things much more interesting, because the pavilion was established before the war, and the war last about 3 years. That actually made the pavilion much older than we thought.

[honest rain]

Since when 5 or 6 an infant

[mystic idol]

Just Han Xiangxun, she was a part of aureate pavilion until some time after massacring Liang family

[deep lion]

Isn’t tian ying a kithan spy? (And im pretty sure aunt han and unc jiang knew tian ying)

[scenic obsidian]

We are assumed that the pavilion was established 3 years earlier than the Zhong Du Bridge incident. But if aunt Han already left the pavilion at the end of the war and have time to establish her business in Qinghe, that means her time working with the pavilion are much earlier than we thoughts

[mystic idol]

Tian Ying is against the Khitans, he and hanging blade are essentially under Chai Rong

[woven sigil]

we know what year Aureate Pavilion was established, Baoda 1 = 943, the year before the Khitan invasion of Later Jin

[scenic obsidian]

The war last about three years

[woven sigil]

yeah 944-946

[deep lion]

Maan this shi is so confusing 😭

[vague shoal]

Right, infant is only 1 or 2 years old

[scenic obsidian]

So the pavilion is already four years old when the war end

[mystic idol]

You might be confusing the end of Qinghe dark surge, tian ying goes to khitan to continue being a spy there and undermining the khitan — he’s going as his next mission, not because that’s who he is

[scenic obsidian]

So Tian Ying was under cover as a agent like James Bond

[hidden kelp]

Tian Ying went undercover in Khitan territory as a spy for Song/Han Chinese by changing his identity and blending in with Pavilion.

[mystic idol]

^

[deep lion]

Oooh i get it now some james bond shi

[woven sigil]

Tian Ying stole Aunt Han's face changing techniques so he can infiltrate anywhere

[scenic obsidian]

Yep

[opal meteor]

[rain dew]

For feather

[opaque rune]

Oh no it's that day of the week again XD

[frail mauve]

Aunt han is only a little older than Uncle Jiang, there is no way she's 10 years older.

Jiang Yan is 35 years old now. Aunt Han maybe around 37 years old.

[scenic obsidian]

No, she is definitely much older than Uncle Jiang. The pavilion itself is four years older than Uncle Jiang, by the time Uncle Jiang took us from the battlefield of Zhong Du Bridge, he is 19, and Aunt Han already left the pavilion and have her own business in Qinghe. The war itself last about 3 years. In ancient China, women can’t establish legal status in society until age 16, so by the time Uncle Jiang met with Aunt Han, she is at least 25 years old.

Even aunt Han only worked for the pavilion for three years and somehow able to get out of the pavilion and establish her business in Qinghe in less than a year, she is still 7 years older than Uncle Jiang.

And plus, a liquor brewery needs time to brew….

Otherwise, what can they sell? Lemonade?

In ancient China, the most common types of baijiu(白酒） typically required 4–5 years of brewing.

So the age gap would be only larger.

And in game, we have Aged 10-year “Tears of the Departed.” This indicates that the cellar must be at least ten years old.

Moreover, in ancient China, a “ten-year aged” label was often nominal; the actual aging period was usually longer.

[woven sigil]

it seems like Heaven's Pier was founded a few years before the pear wine got started, because everyone there knows the story of how Madam Han only returned to her home once, and brought back the pear tree branch that became the foundation of their brewing; that would be when she went back for her revenge and found out her brother was already dead

[scenic obsidian]

In ancient China, alcoholic beverages were produced without distillation, so the fermentation process was highly unstable. Often, years of effort merely served as preparation for later brewing.

Growing peach trees take time, brewing takes time, learning how to do all of these takes a lot of time.

[woven sigil]

also while checking some dialogues I find stuff from the rebuilding arc has started sneaking into global

[scenic obsidian]

Plus, uncle Jiang was famous of drinking large amount of liquor frequently.

Where he got those from?

[foggy tiger]

i dont think too much on it

his name is jiang wu lang/jiang yan. he uses a nameless martial art

he's completely vibing the jianghu wanderer. he just need to be fond of alcohol to complete the image

[scenic obsidian]

No problem.

I am just trying to puzzle things out, since we only have two places have record of liquor brewery in our story.

So it must be one of them.

One at Kaifeng, one in Qinghe.

[hidden kelp]

Why are people allergic to the idea of mature women. we hold up half of the sky you know LOL

[honest rain]

Only two official breweries, but many places sell wine or have jars as decorum. I think it'd be fair to treat them as "brandname" liquors and "off-brand" or home-made. Chances are Jiang got whatever alcohol he could, while game only shows us "big" productions

[frail mauve]

The year Chu Qingquan became a spy and went north was 949. Before he left, he fell in love with Aunt Han at around 943-948, while Chu is described as a teenager back then, he won't be older than 19, which means Aunt won't be too older than 19. And Zhongdu Bridge battle happened in 946, which uncle Jiang is 19. So Aunt Han is no more than 5 years older than uncle Jiang. Also, in the game it says the blissful retreat has been founded for more than 10 years but less than 20 years from 962, which means it was founded after 943 at least.

So there is no way Auny Han is 10 years older than uncle Jiang.

Why would you connect Aunt Han's age with the establishment of aurette pavilion? There's no clear evidence in game that shows Aunt Han has worked for it

I'd rather rely on clear in-game timelines clues than guessing.

[woven sigil]

the bell tower fight is 959 not 949, three years before the start

[frail mauve]

The year Chu went north was 949

[hidden kelp]

Where does it say this

[scenic obsidian]

It‘s 959

Chai Rong Died at 959

Year 949 the late Zhou hasn’t even being established.

[frail mauve]

隐燕计划就是949啊

959悬剑都解散了还潜伏什么

It's 949, they work for hanging blade, not Zhou dynasty.

[woven sigil]

it's very clearly 959, it's the fight Ruby saw three years ago

[frail mauve]

the bell tower fight and the year Chu went north was not the same year

[woven sigil]

also Chu didn't go north as part of the Faceless infiltrators, Han refused to do the procedure for him

[celest flume]

He drank so much wine from aunt han that he cannot pay so he handed us over to her

[scenic obsidian]

LOL

[frail mauve]

If Chu didn't go north, how did he end up dying at Black Water City

Chu just didn't change his face

[woven sigil]

he went north after the theft Tian Ying carried out, in 959

[frail mauve]

年复一年，南来北往，这是远在959年之前

959之后褚清泉就再没回过南边了

此事距今已13年

褚清泉第一次去北方距今已13年

The first time Chu went north was 949. The last time Chu went back to Qinghe was 959.

[woven sigil]

which is when the bell tower fight happened

[scenic obsidian]

Yep

[frail mauve]

钟楼打架只是为了换脸，不是为了争吵去不去北方

[scenic obsidian]

Because the guy on the rooftop told us the bell hasn’t make a sound for three years already.

So he went north twice basically, one at 949, one at 959.

[woven sigil]

Qingquan worked for Hanging Blade but couldn't be one of the infiltrators in the north because Han refused to change his face, it says right in the crescent jade antique

[frail mauve]

Yeah that's what I said

[hidden kelp]

He did go north that's how he died in the north

[frail mauve]

He went north in 949 for the first time. Back then, they were all teenagers(少年少女)

[woven sigil]

then Hanging Blade decide to steal the technique from her in 959, and ask Chu to distract her since they know she wouldn't kill him

[frail mauve]

寒姨这里的描述也是少女
The description here also says that when Aunt Han fell in love with Chu, she was a teenage, which means she was less than 19 around 943-948

[scenic obsidian]

青葱年华 in Chinese referring to 15 to 22 years old.

[frail mauve]

那褚清泉的旧物就不会写那个少年南来北往多次了。而且游戏里还有褚清泉在北方的时候写给寒姨的信，说什么北方的景色怎么怎么样，要是能和你一起看就好了

[frail mauve]

青葱“少女”

[scenic obsidian]

我觉得这个基本就是虚词…

你怎么解释都可以…

[frail mauve]

In ancient China, 22 is old enough to be a mother. You can't use modern standard

In any cases, Aunt Han is most likely 3-5 years older than uncle Jiang.

[scenic obsidian]

And we have no idea how long Chu and Han dated.

[frail mauve]

When Chu disappear at 949, they describe him as a teenager.

How old do you think Aunt han will be

[woven sigil]

the confusion is you saying disappear, he didn't disappear while working for Hanging Blade 949-959, like you yourself said he went back and forth

[scenic obsidian]

I couldn't find that description anywhere

[woven sigil]

he only disappeared after 959 when they robbed Aunt Han, he had nothing to come back to after that

[frail mauve]

Here

[scenic obsidian]

This two paragraphs can describe as two different time period

[frail mauve]

他的主人曾是被人寄予厚望的少年英才，却突然消失在江湖上。这里指的就是949年参加隐燕计划

[scenic obsidian]

Which Chu can be famous way before joining the plan of Yingyan

[hidden kelp]

Young man doesn't literally mean teenager

[frail mauve]

少年 doesn't mean young man

青年 means young man

[scenic obsidian]

It just these two description doesn't imply Chu went North as a teenager

[frail mauve]

then what's the evidence of Aunt Han is 45 now

[woven sigil]

it says he disappeared, it doesn't say anything about 949, that's you assuming the exact date

[frail mauve]

after all blissful retreat was founded no more than 20 years

[woven sigil]

you said at the start "rather rely on clear in-game timelines clues than guessing." but this is you guessing 949, we're told three years ago over and over

[frail mauve]

游戏里说了褚清泉参加隐燕计划了好吗

[scenic obsidian]

Cause Jiang Yan is 35, Zhong Du bridge Jiang Yan is 19. And Zhong Du bridge is the end of the war. And the war last three years.

[frail mauve]

还有寒姨旧物里也说了曾珍重送出去但又取回来，此事发生在13年前，就是949年

[scenic obsidian]

And Aunt Han already at Qinghe when Uncle Jiang came back from the battlefield

[scenic obsidian]

And this one even said Han Xiang Xun’s business established a decade ago

[frail mauve]

She established blissful retreat at her early 20, is there any problem？Yingying is only 19 and she has already set up big business

[woven sigil]

also wait do you not have the third paragraph here? is your screenshot on mobile or?

[scenic obsidian]

Yingying have tremendous family background

Han Xiang Xun is pretty much on her own.

[frail mauve]

the third paragraph exactly says that Chu join the spy plan

[woven sigil]

no it says he didn't

his lover refused to change his face

[scenic obsidian]

Yes, even that doesn't mean he went to north as a teenager.

[frail mauve]

那褚清泉怎么会在北方给寒姨写信

[woven sigil]

he wanted to become faceless but Han refused

[scenic obsidian]

It only stated he became famous as a teenager.

[frail mauve]

他只是没有换脸潜伏，但他也去北方了

[scenic obsidian]

So he can older than a teenager

[frail mauve]

What you say is just guessing

[scenic obsidian]

You asking for concrete evidence, but you don’t have that standard for yourself

We are using common logic to try to puzzle out the timeline

[frail mauve]

I show you, but you guys refuse to believe

[woven sigil]

I'm not debating the ages, don't really care that part, but Chu and Han last seeing each other in 959 is very clear over and over

[scenic obsidian]

Becasue your evidence ain't concrete either.

You did a lot of guessing in between

And you don’t want to admit that

[woven sigil]

heck there's even a cat that Chu gave Han that is ten years old, so they had to see each other in 952

[frail mauve]

the evidence from game is not concrete, than what else is more concrete

[frail mauve]

这和我说的不矛盾啊。949年参加隐燕计划，从此经常南来北往

959年之后再没回过清河了

[scenic obsidian]

Basic logic and time gaps between each major historical events such as the time to take to establish a brewery and year of Zhong Du Bridge Incident

[woven sigil]

not everyone in Hanging Blade was part of the faceless

they did more than just that one project

[frail mauve]

隐燕不全部意味着换脸

949年褚清泉一定是去北方了的，不然不会有寒姨旧物写的13年前吵架这个信息

[scenic obsidian]

不羡仙是酿酒的，酿酒需要很长的时间

如果十几年前就建立好了

[hidden kelp]

"它的主人曾是被人寄予厚望的少年英才" only means he was already known when he's a teenager. It doesn't mean he is a teenager when he met auntie or joined Hanging Blade

[scenic obsidian]

那说明十几年前就花了很久准备了酒窖

[frail mauve]

游戏里就是写的十几年前建立啊

谁说陈年酒一定是一开始就有

不羡仙也没有二十年陈酿，只有十年陈酿

[scenic obsidian]

那是不是我13年前把酒窖盖好，下一年就有酒喝了。

[scenic obsidian]

为那个年代的米酒放不了20年

那是非蒸馏酒

20年酒精早跑光了

[frail mauve]

所以呢，跟寒姨十几岁开始做生意也没什么问题啊

盈盈白手起家也能做生意，少东家现在自己开家业也是16岁白手起家

寒姨为什么一定得二十五六岁了才开始做不羡仙的生意

[scenic obsidian]

他是未央城前任城主，这个等级比不了

[scenic obsidian]

因为没有证据证明她有一个富裕的家庭可以支撑她做这些

[frail mauve]

他们相爱的时候描述都是少男少女好吗，前面有青葱少女的描写

[scenic obsidian]

反而有证据证明她可能家门不幸

[frail mauve]

她会换脸啊

[scenic obsidian]

不然怎么被卖进梁府

[frail mauve]

她在开不羡仙之前就已经是洛神了

洛神还不挣钱啊

她是来不羡仙之后从江湖隐退不再用洛神名号的

[scenic obsidian]

那一个13岁的小姑娘上哪儿学的换脸？学了一年就学会了？

[frail mauve]

谁说是13岁了

[scenic obsidian]

你说她很小就开始做生意了

[frail mauve]

不大于19岁，这中间有6年

[scenic obsidian]

这中间还不考虑战乱的问题，清河能有这么多人居住在这里是五代中后期了

[frail mauve]

游戏里给的信息就是十三年前他们谈恋爱 那会是少男少女

[scenic obsidian]

手帕只是说13年前寒香寻就想烧掉这个

根本就没说那个时候他们就是少男少女

[frail mauve]

还有，游戏里很多次说了，不羡仙居民都以为寒姨江叔是一对

[scenic obsidian]

是你硬要把两件前尘旧物的时间轴硬拼到一起

[frail mauve]

如果他们俩差十岁

[scenic obsidian]

废话，他们俩一起养孩子，在那个年代还没有别的其他的关系可以允许搞这个。

而且宋代以前女子改嫁很正常

[frail mauve]

如果这两个旧物时间轴差很多，他们就不会是一个系列的旧物

[scenic obsidian]

没有守活寡的

[hidden kelp]

It doesn't say that, those are two separate items

[frail mauve]

it's not

[scenic obsidian]

特别是五代十国这种天天死人的环境，夫妻俩差10岁以上的大有人在

柴荣和他老婆差21岁

[frail mauve]

我说游戏信息，你说游戏外，那还聊什么

[scenic obsidian]

我们在试图用游戏设定的历史背景

来补全里面的线索

[hidden kelp]

People can be in a relationship for a long time, they have items throughout their relationship. Where does it say those two antiques are the same age?

[frail mauve]

那我在用游戏内已有的线索来推测有什么问题呢

[scenic obsidian]

问题是你的逻辑链条之间没有强关联性

然后你要硬推过去

说逻辑通畅

这里面缺失的部分本来就要靠历史背景来补充

不然要这个历史背景设定干什么

[frail mauve]

褚清泉的旧物里明说了，他本来是少年，然后突然消失在江湖上。你们非要说这不是在讲他消失的时候是少年

[scenic obsidian]

是你非要说他消失的时候是少年

[hidden kelp]

That doesn't mean he was a teenager when he disappeared.

[scenic obsidian]

这个根本就没有类似英年早逝

[frail mauve]

问题是你所说的历史背景和人物经历并没有直接关联，除了中渡桥江晏19岁，其他都是你的推测

[scenic obsidian]

这样的表达

天妒英才这样的表达也没有

[frail mauve]

他消失是因为他去北方了啊。游戏里褚清泉还在塞北给寒姨写信

[hidden kelp]

Also is this channel supposed to be in Eng

[scenic obsidian]

It just so tired I have to go over and over again to translate everything

[scenic obsidian]

Because that’s where the timeline can lay its foundation on.

[hidden kelp]

Yeah I know but better stay in Eng just in case mods come. Idk how strict the rules are

[scenic obsidian]

It’s the most important piece of information for us to build the timeline.

If we don’t know Jiang Yan was 19 everything pretty much falls a part.

[frail mauve]

But there is no other relationship between zhongdu bridge with othet character

[hidden kelp]

I agree. It's speculation to say Chu was a teenager when he left for the north

[frail mauve]

Only Jiang Yan is 19

[scenic obsidian]

There are, because we know Li Zuo is there

And Khitan army already have zombies

That means the pavilion is already established

[frail mauve]

So what? That doesn't mean Han was working for him back then

There is no evidence in game proving that Aunt Han worked for them or when did she work for them

[hidden kelp]

I thought there was evidence on the CN server that she worked for Pavilion. It's not in Global yet I agree

[scenic obsidian]

Yes.

[frail mauve]

No clear evidence. Just speculatiom

Let alone talking about when

[hidden kelp]

Isn't this whole thing speculation? 😂 There's no direct evidence in Chu or Han's age. Just people making different assumptions based on different interpretations of the same wording

[scenic obsidian]

Yes, exactly

[frail mauve]

But there's at least in game text talking about there age when they fell in love.

But no a word about when aunt join the pavilion

I would rathet trust the former onr

[hidden kelp]

Okay sure. Relationship can last a long time though

[scenic obsidian]

Even Aunt Han didn’t join the pavilion, a brewery business needs a long time to establish and that set alone can prove Aunt Han is much older.

You need time to learn how to brew, time to establish the brewery and time to brew.

[frail mauve]

I don't agree with that. YM set up the business after blissful.retreat was burnt

Is YM OLD

[scenic obsidian]

And there is no anything said Aunt Han succeed from anyone.

[scenic obsidian]

Because the wine cellar is still good.

And we succeed that from Aunt Han

But no evidence Aunt Han succeed from anyone. Otherwise the in game text gonna mention it 。

[frail mauve]

And there is no evidence says that blissful retreat sells aged wine since day 1

[scenic obsidian]

But the wine need years to brew

[frail mauve]

Auny Han is rich enough just being the Water Lady

[scenic obsidian]

Especially chinese white wine

[frail mauve]

She didn't need anyone else

[scenic obsidian]

But she can‘t speed the brew，that's chemistry.

Even she have all the money，all the tools，all the people.

[frail mauve]

I said, she doesn't need to sell 10 year wine since day1

[scenic obsidian]

the brew time is still there

[frail mauve]

Isn't there any 1-year wine irl

[scenic obsidian]

Not in Song dynasty

Because there was distillation back then

[hidden kelp]

No I think Ariane is saying when she first founded Blissful Retreat, they didn't sell anything for a few years until the first fermentation was ready. She was able to sustain the initial startup phase with her private money

[frail mauve]

Even in Song dynasty there is

[scenic obsidian]

Basically impossible because you need a license to sell wine at that time.

And a license require you have everything set up and for testing

[hidden kelp]

I think Ariane is saying exactly Han didn't sell wine for the first few years

[frail mauve]

you're at five dynasty man

emperors have changed quite a few times in less than 5 years

[scenic obsidian]

We are, but this region still under control of some ones. Especially brewers are heavy taxed .

No matter who took office, this part won’t change much

[hidden kelp]

It's possible tbh. Start-ups has a r&d phase usually. The first part of establishing something usually you make no money

[frail mauve]

You tell me who is ruling Qinghe

Why is Qinghe using five dynasty coins rather than Song coins

[scenic obsidian]

During the Five Dynasties and Ten Kingdoms period (907–960), the Qinghe region (in present-day southern Hebei/northern Shandong) passed through the hands of several northern regimes rather than functioning as an independent polity. It was first controlled by the Later Liang (907–923), then incorporated into the Later Tang (923–936). After Shi Jingtang founded the Later Jin (936–947) with Khitan support, Qinghe remained under Jin administration until the Khitan Liao conquest in 946. Following the collapse of Jin, the region was ruled successively by the Later Han (947–951) and Later Zhou (951–960). Finally, with Zhao Kuangyin’s founding of the Song dynasty in 960, Qinghe became part of the new unified imperial order. In short, Qinghe was governed continuously by the northern dynasties in sequence rather than by local separatist regimes.

Do you know why we see that many refugees in Qinghe?

Because this area is relatively stable

And that’s also the reason why uncle Jiang brought us here.

[frail mauve]

That doesn't mean Aunt Han has to be more than 25 to do this. I tell you yingying is only 19 and she has already set up big business. You said it's because she has rich family. And I said Aunt Han is rich too she's the water lady

[scenic obsidian]

It told you a million times Yingying has a tremendous background

And that set apart with Aunt Han

[hidden kelp]

It's possible Aunt Han might be a genius. 😆

[woven sigil]

okay so, in the scene where Han and Uncle Zhou pour out all the wine, he says it's been aging ten years, that means brewed in 952, the Khitan withdrew in 947, there's five year span at least in which Aunt Han could have gotten the wine business working

[frail mauve]

Being Water Lady and have partnership with hanging blade is not a tremendous background?

[scenic obsidian]

And Aunt Han never have the money compares to Yingying’s family. They have a freaking yacht

[woven sigil]

the real question is how they grew so many pear trees that fast but I don't think devs worry that much about trees lol

[hidden kelp]

Google says 8-10 years for pear tree to get to maturity

[scenic obsidian]

Do you know how much you need to build a freaking yacht in Song dynasty?

[woven sigil]

jianghu magic tree growth, just like we did for that Longevity Fruit Tree

[scenic obsidian]

Even Big Zhao can only build a couple battleships with the national treasury in his hand.

[scenic obsidian]

Exactly

Everything takes time. And seems like time doesn’t exist in your dictionary.

[frail mauve]

I mean, being a partner of hanging blade, and Chai Rong and Zhao may also knew Aunt Ham

[scenic obsidian]

Chai Rong didn’t rise to his power until much later.

[frail mauve]

I don't think it's hard for her to get the permission

What about Fengdao and Wei Renpu

They're all hanging blade

She's rich, she knew some big shot in the court

[scenic obsidian]

There is no evidence Feng Dao is member of the Hanging Blade at least in the early days.

[frail mauve]

Isn't that enough

[scenic obsidian]

And Wei Ren Pu didn’t rise to power until Guo Wei took the regime.

[frail mauve]

She doesn't need to be 25-30 to achieve what you said, she can do this in her early 20s too

She doesn't need 10 year wine to be sold from day 1

[scenic obsidian]

You need a couple years to build the cellar, and couple years to test the product, then start the actual brewing.

Before you can even get your license

All of these takes time

[woven sigil]

you both take this too seriously

[scenic obsidian]

I am gonna wrap here. Dinner times

[hidden kelp]

It's honestly possible with Wuxia logic. But you two clearly have different opinions and don't think it's gonna go anywhere

[scenic obsidian]

If Han Xiang Xun have Yingying’s family’s level of money, the MC would not be the young wanderer , we would be prince of Qinghe, and Uncle Jiang would be a Jiedushi(Warlord)

[hidden kelp]

You gotta admit this is game logic not irl so anything is possible

[rigid totem]

So blueeeeee

[scenic obsidian]

And we gonna be the pirate King

Take that Khitan!

If Aunt Han and Uncle Jiang are that rich, we don’t need to live in that small house deep inside the bamboo forest. It looks a house only has one bedroom.

[honest rain]

It seems that it was Jiang's depression hut, YM got a place in Blissful retreat🤔

[scenic obsidian]

And that roof leak when is raining

[honest rain]

That's what 3years of no maintenance will do to a house, yeah (assuming that Han didn't let YM and Ruby spend much time near the bamboo hut, they won't have time to maintain the house)

[scenic obsidian]

But is still far far simpler and subtle comparing to the big yacht Yingying’s family

[honest rain]

True, but also Wens are a family of settled show-offs, while YM's family are all light on their feet due to involvement in spy shenanigans

[scenic obsidian]

If we have Forbes Rank of Fortune at that time, Yingying’s family would be on top of that.

[scenic obsidian]

Maybe, but the key problem is Yingying’s family was known as 城主（Lord）. It’s a whole different class to normal civilians.

[frail mauve]

You don't need to be one of Yingying's family to start a business

[scenic obsidian]

But all the people with a big business in this world are pretty much nepo babies in this game.

Even MC is one of them.

[frail mauve]

If so all the hotels and restaurant will be Wen's

[scenic obsidian]

Yes, they are! the guy organize the trade business in the guild is Wen Wushuang

They are not a real estate family

[frail mauve]

Aunt han is qualified enough

[scenic obsidian]

They specialized at trading

From fact we don’t have any guards or servant, Aunt Han ain’t reach their level for even close.

[hidden kelp]

Wen family are the Rothschild of Jianghu 💀

[honest rain]

Definitely. I think we don't really have anyone to compare to in-game, as most of Han's business is underground dealings as Water Lady. We can confidently say she is much richer than her status as Boss of Blissful Retreat would imply (which already is a lot), but due to nature of her work it doesn't directly translate to social status as it did for Wens
On the other hand, Jiang is a teen parent & jianghu wanderer, his pockets can't run that deep

[frail mauve]

At 946, Jiang Yan is 19. Aunt Han may be 24 and blissful retreat may also be founded this year. It's highly possible that Aunt Han is no more than 5 years older compared to Jiang

[honest rain]

Based on TianBuShou's stash, we know that underground part of the business is thriving, we just can't tell how much

[scenic obsidian]

So Yingying’s family is that kind of people can organize diplomatic visit to Big Zhao and Kaifeng, it’s a whole different conversation.

[honest rain]

Why do you hate idea of older woman family member?

[frail mauve]

Why do you hate the idea of young woman being rich and successful

[honest rain]

I don't hate it, but we already have Yingying and other characters to fill that role. Why do you keep insisting on making Han Xianxun as young as you can reasonably go?

[frail mauve]

Because I believe in game text rather than pure guessing

[hidden kelp]

The game text is vague though. So you're also guessing

Y'all are going in circles

[distant sage]

ok

[hidden kelp]

Just agree to disagree and move on

[honest rain]

You're doing way more guessing with going "wuxia-logic" low, than @scenic obsidian is doing with using historicaly known logic

[idle pollen]

If we claim guild heros realm today can we claim again when the breakthrough drops later this week?

[frail mauve]

So we're all guessing, just believe in our own ideas, why do you accuse ppl like this

[honest rain]

Wait, @scenic obsidian when did you change from being MB elder

[frail mauve]

You called speculating on in game text more guessing

[scenic obsidian]

I am still, I just trying to use a better title so I can help this community better.

Like there are always people asking why there wasn’t any Mongolian in WWM in the voice channel.

Everybody miss Genghis

[honest rain]

Speculating on in-game text that is intentionally vague is more guessing than applying historic knowledge to said text in the game known to take historic information

[frail mauve]

What you say historic knowledge isn't vague?

[honest rain]

It is less vague in comparison

[frail mauve]

So funny

[honest rain]

Sometimes I wonder if they know any other groups involved in chinese history, and then I realise they probably don't

[frail mauve]

Has any law in history stipulated a minimum age for opening a restaurant

[scenic obsidian]

Chinese people good at doing two things throughout our history, recording history and building gigantic tombs.

[woven sigil]

most in the west have little exposure to Chinese history other than British colonial history and uh Rot3K/Dynasty Warriors

[cerulean bluff]

Yea, it's understandable

[vague shoal]

Yingying is probably same age as uncle jiang

[frail mauve]

Uncle Jiang is 35 now. Yingying is around 19

[vague shoal]

19 is too young for someone who was married and took over weiyang

[honest rain]

As Jiang Yan in first cutscene, maybe?

[honest rain]

Married what

[frail mauve]

In ancient China 19 can be a mother of a 3 year old child

[honest rain]

Are we talking about the same Yingying

The Ember of East

[vague shoal]

She had a husband

[scenic obsidian]

Think about son of Larry Ellison murdered Larry and became head of Oracle..

[cerulean bluff]

Who was he?

[vague shoal]

But she killed him and took all the power of her husnband fiamly

[cerulean bluff]

[scenic obsidian]

The dude behind Paramount and Skydance.

[cerulean bluff]

I see

[frail mauve]

When the khitans invaded kaifeng 11 years ago, yingying was still a child

[scenic obsidian]

Child can be 12

Vagueness

[frail mauve]

yes, so today yingying can be around 19-22

[vague shoal]

In her bio bro

[frail mauve]

And little Fu called her sister, not Aunt

[honest rain]

Don't you love when we can barely guess ages of all the main actors in Kaifeng story (Zhao brothers are probably their irl ages of 35 and 23, but for everyone else your guess is as good as mine)

[vague shoal]

Maybe not 30 but late twenties

[scenic obsidian]

Yes, otherwise I am wondering how can he change from an Alpha male to me in couple of years living in the palace.

[vague shoal]

Yingying that is

[hidden kelp]

It's called hitting your 30s. Everything is down hill. Be forewarned, children

[scenic obsidian]

There must be some unknown gourmet in the royal kitchen.

[loud hearth]

Guys, I just found a hidden lost chapter that has to do with the veiled edge skin, I believe there’s 2 more. One is called Trial of Blossoms, the other is called Night of the Nine Mortal? Where do I complete them? Can’t find anywhere on youtube,google and Reddit.

[loud hearth]

大老肥了

[scenic obsidian]

It’s not fat it’s fluffy

[loud hearth]

有福气

[scenic obsidian]

Try Bilibili

[orchid urchin]

interesting

[woven sigil]

they're the questlines to promote the fancy outfits, we've only had two release so far

[balmy kite]

[fallow schooner]

the amount of times the mc fainted and survived feels like straight up plot armor lol

[tulip swift]

true

[deep lion]

They’re too dumb and naive to die lol

[woven sigil]

it's our most powerful secret technique

[delicate sentinel]

[rancid lake]

👍

[slow lark]

🤓

[zenith kernel]

[iron canyon]

but it's not entirely impossible, considering how ancient people grew up to be mature at a very young age

[vague shoal]

Yes but I think she needs a few years to take over her husband’s family, her rise to power in weiyang etc

So I guess she’s 23-25

[weak sigil]

[spare mural]

wahaha

[hidden kelp]

My personal opinion as well. But it's all speculation

[wild willow]

Hello

[willow cairn]

hello hello, nice day

[scenic obsidian]

No worry, Yingying is mine now.

[flint sand]

Just need to kill the husband, ez 👀

[scenic obsidian]

No worry, I’ll make sure he is sleeping with fish tonight.

[flint sand]

Dont forget to concrete his feet so he can make more friend with fish

[vernal summit]

didn’t she alr kill him no?

[iron canyon]

Her in game husband may be dead, but there are a lot players behind the screen lining up for her

[scenic obsidian]

Me me me

[scarlet yarrow]

yingying is married?

[vernal summit]

I’m her wife though, kill her husbands but don’t kill me

[hidden kelp]

not anymore

[scarlet yarrow]

why didn't i catch it? there was not a mention of it

[hidden kelp]

it's in the Journal > World > Characters > Ember of the East

[vernal summit]

she told us the story about “someone else” kinda I think?

[woven sigil]

she was married off and killed her husband for the money

[rare crane]

[royal plover]

Domt worry, they will dead too

[solid stump]

guys what do you think is the lore behind the mc?

[tough halo]

What year is the setting of WWM?

900?

[woven sigil]

962

[tough halo]

Thank you

[cedar basalt]

follows an interstellar traveler searching for their kidnapped sibling in Teyvat, a fantasy world ruled by seven elemental Archons under a mysterious, oppressive sky-city called Celestia.

[elfin oriole]

you

[slate finch]

woo

[scarlet yarrow]

why are there potatoes and tomatoes in game when it did not exist yet in china? game = unplayable 😭😭

[solid stump]

oop

[gray matrix]

[twin blaze]

[iron canyon]

considering how the game also has stuff that can't be applied in rl word, let's just close an eye

[quick socket]

So the burlap sack just has seeds?

[hidden kelp]

Watch the MMW Girl video on Burlap Sack, it gives a good explanation

[tired dirge]

[rose bough]

WWm Girl is legedary FR

she connects dote way too good

[royal plover]

U can also watch fwalicia, she put the year timeline also

[rose bough]

is that diff yt creator right

[royal plover]

?

[lusty patio]

Best character in the game?

[crimson birch]

zheng e XD

[alpine path]

zhai xu

[vague shoal]

Bai rong

[solar lintel]

tian ying!

[midnight raven]

Where do i go to ask a question

[honest rain]

Depends on your question! If you have questions about the story/world of wwm, you're in the right place!

About game in general #🌱beginner-questions
About combat mechanics

• PVP #⚔️pvp-build-discussion
• PVE #🧐pve-build-discussion

[midnight raven]

I search it up apparently it comes out in April I was going crazy

[honest rain]

Are you sure you answered the right message

[midnight raven]

Yes?

[honest rain]

Neither your 1st question nor my reply mention any release of anything in April. You'll have to use full sentences or reasses the conversation direction

[midnight raven]

Ok so I was looking on where to find part two of hexi I found the answer from youtube so I no longer need help

[ebon monolith]

[gloomy stone]

so who is your mc?

[celest flume]

Clipped
Heavy vested interest spotted

[prisma saffron]

can someone help me? im at the south gate avenue part 6 quest, and i cant seem to talk to feng lao'er. i have the part where it sais im to talk to him but i cant interract with him at all

[median plume]

Yea dont ask me after i had the best afternoon nap in history and i dont even have school tomorrow cuz of bad weather

[median plume]

Search on youtube

[prisma saffron]

i have searched

i wouldnt ask here if internet had the answear

[celest flume]

Relog

[prisma saffron]

i did relog but he still not giving me an interraction. have relogged 4 times

[median plume]

Its a bug

[celest flume]

Or teleport somewhere and then return to quest point if its a bug
Cancel and retrack quest

[prisma saffron]

didnt work either

[celest flume]

Can u show me a screenshot im dms since u don't have image perms yet

Oml your profile flashbanged me

[alpine path]

Could you please ask in #🌱beginner-questions instead? This is a lore discussion channel

[prisma saffron]

oh sorry i thought it was lore since it was a wandering tales lore quest

[stray owl]

:> good night

[honest rain]

Please use #guild-recruitment for this, this is channel for lore and story discussion

[scenic obsidian]

So the dancing lion in the games are from south China

There are different style of dancing lions in China

Mostly differentiated by regions

The correct type of Dancing Lions from the Kaifeng region look like this

[honest rain]

Sometimes "rule of cool" wins design-wise

[scenic obsidian]

The reason why the dev team chose the dancing lion from south China because their northern counterparts are too ugly.

[foggy tiger]

Rather than that I think the actual reason is the southern version is more popularised in Chinese culture

[scenic obsidian]

That’s also part of the reason

[foggy tiger]

Also 男儿当自强 plays during the fight, so it's pretty much homage to Wong fei hung. And southern lion dance appears in those movies not the northern ones

[scenic obsidian]

So the dev team really likes Kungfu Movie from 80s Hongkong

[foggy tiger]

Ngl anybody who grow up during that time are gonna be influenced by that

And reasonable to assume dev team are gonna be full of people in that age group

[north trench]

just figured out Bao is she

[shut plaza]

what am I looking at??

[clever trout]

And water flows 😭

Pick up your pickaxes

We're heading home

[scenic obsidian]

[meager meteor]

I won't place too much of a bet on it. Dunno if the translation is correct. There is no he or she pronoun in Chinese. They've been using AI to translate everything so it can randomly turn into a he or she.

[north trench]

there is 他(he) and 她(she) in Chinese both pronounced tā

[idle reef]

What is not to love?

One reason the design varies in the game is also the style.

[chilly void]

Hi
I have a question about Kaifeng’s main story quest, specifically what happened at the heroes’ assembly. From what I understand, Wuque was tasked with making the government believe the gold making vessel was real using illusions, and that was supposed to thwart the government’s tang coins confiscation policy somehow?
That’s the part I don’t get, how was that going to work? Assuming the government does buy it, how does that help tang coins gain value?

[idle reef]

The lion dance actually has styles, with 2 still existing to this day, the rest majorly forgotten or losr.

Northern Lion Dance (Beijing/Hebei Style) and Southern Lion Dance (Guangdong/Fujian Style).

There is a good article on HK Hub about lion dances: thehkhub(.com)/(what-are-lion-dances)/
Remove brackets please.

[idle reef]

Hello Nightmare!

That is an interesting interpretation of the events of Kaifeng Main Quest but it is erroneous. Not to say it is your fault, this game has complex lore.

I would suggest WWMgirl's videos on the Kaifeng chapter.

I can give you a TLDR if you wish.

[north trench]

oh yaa i like to mention that final burlap sack quest scene the art style is changing?. is there reason for that?

[idle reef]

Probably to signify the yin/yang nature of the memories and what followed.

In chinese art, symbolism with water and watercolor is meant to invoke feeling of strength and harmony after turmoil and hardwork.

[scenic obsidian]

That part is confusing at first, but the idea behind Wuque’s plan was more political and psychological than economic.

At that time, the Song government was trying to confiscate Tang coins because copper was extremely scarce and needed for military expenses. If the government believed someone had discovered a way to turn base metal into gold, it would fundamentally change their perception of scarcity. In other words, if gold (and by extension valuable metal) could supposedly be manufactured, then the urgency to seize and melt down Tang coins would weaken.

Wuque’s illusion was meant to convince the officials that the gold-making vessel was real, creating the impression that the state would soon gain access to a new source of wealth. If the government believed that precious metals could be produced artificially, the pressure to confiscate Tang coins would decrease, because the coins would no longer seem like the only critical reserve of metal available.

So the goal was not literally to make Tang coins more valuable through economics. Instead, the plan aimed to manipulate the government’s expectations about future wealth, which could delay or undermine the confiscation policy that was hurting the people of Kaifeng.

In short, it was essentially a political trick: if officials believed the state could soon produce unlimited wealth, they might stop squeezing the population for copper coins.

In fact, Zhao Guangyi most likely understood that the gold-making vessel was a fraud. However, he chose to play along because it created an opportunity for him to achieve other political goals.

By allowing the spectacle to unfold, he could use it as a pretext to gather talented individuals from across the realm under state supervision, while also tightening control over society. At the same time, the government could justify harsher measures—such as forced levies, confiscations, and other coercive methods—to replenish the treasury.

So from this perspective, the “gold-making” episode was less about belief and more about strategy. Zhao Guangyi was using the situation to consolidate authority, mobilize resources, and extract wealth through state power rather than through any genuine expectation of producing gold.

[chilly void]

That makes a lot more sense now. Thanks

[ocean wedge]

Hmm

[scenic obsidian]

Feel free to have different interpretations.

[karmic shale]

[nimble pilot]

Am I the only guy who lowkey just really hates Yingying tho

I want my wine back so bad

who care if you give me money back, its not about the money

[plain star]

She will give back the wine to you at the end (when you complete both main quest, dark surge and all the campaign)
But btw, I don't like her neither.

[celest flume]

waifu material but in the end left no significant impression for me

[plain star]

I'm more impress with her cruel cousin, the guy who has the mirage boat.
Too bad he's into his gae thief friend.

[celest flume]

wen wuhen?

[iron canyon]

To me her character was quite alright, she's the one breaking the stereotype in a men hierarchical family, and can be as cruel as anyone else, which was how she climbed up to match wuhen (iirc from wuque's bio, it's implied that the title of ember of east can be held by more than one person, but only one that stands out the most would become the city master). Tho we don't have much info about their family other than wuhen and wuque, really hope we can have more stories about Wen family at least (an extra fact is that in a book about wuhen & junbujian, wuhen implied that he hated his family)

[celest flume]

not sure if i spelled his name correctly

[celest flume]

yaoi

[plain star]

People didn't like this boat quest much.
Seems that the devs tried to wash off his sin and put him in a relationship with a guy to bait yaoi fans.

[celest flume]

i just completely ignored whatever info was in the quest and just watch the yaoi bickering

[iron canyon]

Yeah the quest is certainly weird since we don't even have a proper introduction of what the family is, only bits and pieces of the past from wuque, which she isn't even a part of the family now, it will be better if it was given more context at least

[vague shoal]

What sin did he do again

[plain star]

This quest is just an advertisement for the boat, I think (and still make the boat low quality af).
It doesn't mean anything deep to the lore.

[iron canyon]

We never know how the devs would close up everything, since he's somehow "tolerant" towards jun bujian's absurd behavior (and this lasted for years), but in reality he was just as cruel as anyone else

[iron canyon]

I guess Shizue is referring to how he let wuque lost everything

[vague shoal]

Just 2 people fighting for power

Pretty sure yingying killed his whole family and relatives too lol

[woven sigil]

yeah she held a bunch of his relatives as hostages but he just let them die to get what he wanted, whereas when he takes her mother hostage she's not ruthless enough and surrenders

also the lore book you get after the Mirage Boat quest explains that the Wen family was miserable growing up, and after Jun Bujian robbed Wuhen as a kid he'd rather starve in the streets for a week than go back home

[stone abyss]

[north trench]

there is wen wuhen quest?

wen wuque brother?

[woven sigil]

yeah the mirage boat quest in Qinghe

Gilded Chase, starts in Harvestfall

[royal plover]

There mirage boat quest, and quest with another brother beauty in the shade

[north trench]

oh i remember quest name doesn't remember doing it after see YouTube walk through maybe because i never do it

[nimble pilot]

i gotta complete all the dark surge and all the campaign quests? even the building one? fuhhhhhhhhhh

[iron canyon]

depends, certain quests like wandering tales or encounters might actually give you the fragments, if you want to know which to prioritize you can search up for guides

[twilit stag]

Good morning

[chilly void]

Btw sorry I didn’t reply.
I have watched it and it left me more confused tbh.

She says “if both the government and the people believed the vessel worked, then the people would pressure the authorities to exchange iron coins for copper ones” and that would defeat the confiscation policy.
I don’t see how the gold making vessel being real would lead to pressure on the government regarding the tang coin situation?

Another thing she said is “Southern Tang worked with the Dao lord to smuggle their worthless iron coins into Song. They wanted the Northern Song government to exchange these iron coins with valuable copper coins. If they do that Song would have to spend their war budget and would have less money left to spend on fighting.” I believe the Dao Lord wasn’t involved initially and only started smuggling after the situation got really dire? But maybe I got that wrong. Anyway I still have the same question here, why would the government exchange the two currencies?

[iron canyon]

It's like killing a bird with two stones kind of situation. Just like how the person up there explained, if the government believes is real (because Song is broke rn) = there's a way to produce wealth to solve their money crisis & achieve political/millitary goals (exp: northern campaign). When the commoners believe the vessel works, this could create pressure & conflict between the commoners & the court (since the vessel can generate money, that means the court would be able to let them exchange currencies), which essentially part of WuQue's pawns to force the court to do something, as the flooding Tang Coins in Kaifeng is disrupting the court's already unstable economy. So the court had to choose between: 1. Solve the money crisis, stabilize Kaifeng 2. sacrifice the commoners, let them suffer for this period of time and continue the southern campaign first

[iron canyon]

Tang coins were made from iron, while Song coins were made from copper. Copper is also needed in the creation of military weapons, for the operations to unify the nations, you'll need money & weaponry (and also food), so copper is also getting increasingly scarce here. Also quoting what the person above said up there, if iron & copper can be made into money, that means if we use something else, like paper as money, it would solve the root cause of the whole issue. Money crisis will be solved, and the metal can be used in the making of necessary equipment for their respective uses.

[supple zodiac]

hello

[jade aurora]

Is the "unseen mountain" part of the hexi expansion?...the mountains in the north of the map

[iron canyon]

unseen mountain ||is chapter 4|| hexi is a 3 part map consisting of jade gate pass, liangzhou (opening next month) & qinchuan

[royal plover]

It bit complicated and hard to understand at beginning,

But what I understand is, they use vessel to paying song, bc with the vessel they can pay song without their own real copper coin.

But to do that they need ppl in song court and common ppl believe story of the vessel are real, this where yingying and her goon and the act of heroes assembly play.

Ppl in heroes assembly saw that the vessel really can product copper coin from empty air, then after this the vessel need to dissappear, this why they create a play like sudden explosion and the vessel got stolen by ghost market residents(nmw).
But instead product copper coin, its product tang coin.

That gonna explain why so many tang coin on kaifeng (its not from the vessel, but from southern tang who illegally distributed tang coin into kaifeng). Yeah the magical vessel and the story it can product coins are just decoy for tang coin

And this yingying plan turn out suffer the common ppl more.

And another thing yingying didnt expect is lord shi was spy of aurete

[iron canyon]

Tang coins are also helping the folks in a way. The stolen vessel was used to hide the fact that they're introducing tang coins into kaifeng & to the commoners hands. Meanwhile, through river master's help (bloodscale hall, in digging the undergound tunnel) & Zheng E (disguising as master of grain), they transported all the grain from the Evernormal Granary (which was closed as it will be used for millitary purposes). That way, the folks can use Tang Coins to buy food from the ghostlight market, also creating a value of tang coins in a way.

[iron canyon]

Although lord shi was fake, he also serves a purpose here. Since Lord Shi would enforce the collection of Tang Coins (from how there are so much Tang Coins in Kaifeng), it would only provoke the conflict between the commoners and the folks further, which only makes the mess even more chaotic

[mystic idol]

didnt help for long though, because the amount of tang coins flooding the market caused inflation

[viscid mantle]

Hello everyone

[jade aurora]

When will they release chapter 4...any idea ?

[north trench]

is there specific weapon masked troupe use

[floral lake]

🙏

[crimson birch]

in global just like how WoH uses mo blade, masked troupe weapon is not established yet, however on cn there was a promotion of this (which might signal masked troupe weapons)
not much info has been released except for a trailer video with he wanchun in it

[north trench]

is there specific weapon inkbound order use

[crimson birch]

inkbound order is not out in cn yet. spoilers:
||however after the imperial palace region and the storyline, we meet with uncle chen (who is from jiangnan) who will bring us there. Jiangnan is inkbound order's headquarters so we might have more info on it once cn gets to jiangnan but for now no information about it.||

daily shen yiren hate

[cerulean bluff]

isn't that spoiler?

[coarse osprey]

Is there a summary for Murong yuan's story because Honestly I didn't understand anything from the quest 💀

[north trench]

what he do i forgor?

[north trench]

probably in yutubey

[crimson birch]

the 12 years of feud I feel like most people unlock it so I didn't spoiler it

[honest rain]

He was the leader of attack on Zheng clan

[north trench]

now i remember

[crimson birch]

he was one of the attackers that led the attack on the village where zheng family lived

wow

text to speeh is ahh

[crimson birch]

luckily he died

[honest rain]

IIRC, Jiangnan also got Sulver needle HQ🤔

[north trench]

why zheng'e and not zheng'er

[cerulean bluff]

||however after the imperial palace region and the storyline, we meet with uncle chen (who is from jiangnan) who will bring us there||
how is this not spoiler?

it's way far from what global currently has

[crimson birch]

oh thought u meant 12 years one

since it is the last message i sent before u reply

ill spoiler it thx for the point out

[cerulean bluff]

👍

[honest rain]

@crimson birch Zhu Yu's fans say Jiangnan

[crimson birch]

oh my more lores of SN in jiangnan soon then

[crimson birch]

zheng e is how his name is written in closet to english. zheng'er is more like nickname

the er is mostly used behind names in a nickname way

or thats how i understand it

[iron canyon]

at least the folks had food for short term, it's a messy situation indeed

[iron canyon]

No idea yet, for now the rate of release is one month per part of hexi, it would take some time between hexi and unseen mountain for sure

[twin briar]

do you know if or when we'll be on part with CN in terms of content ?

[honest rain]

If devs plan on it, it might take 1~1,5 year. Tho, it might be best to keep global an update or two behind to keep pace and for translation Qual

[iron canyon]

That would be complicated but in extremely simple words: Rong Yuan grew up with LiYun (adopted father, who saved her from a war), LiYun & Rong Yuan had a tense relationship because she's the type who does't like to express herself, while LiYun was the irritable & straightforward typ, so both of them would often argue. LiYun, Murong YanZhao, ShiShouXin & ZhaoKuangYin were basically battle allies, among the 4 of them, she was closest with YanZhao. LiYun was loyal towards late Zhou & after ZhaoKuangYin ascended the throne, he refused to submit, therefore decided to proof his loyalty through death. He didn't want to drag Rong Yuan down with him, so he decided to let YanZhao continue to raise her (as I mentioned, she was close w YanZhao, this incident was also the reason why LiShoujie, Yuan's brother, was jealous as LiYun favored her more, bc he brought LiShouJie along with him in his death plan). Rong Yuan didn't understand why her father would do so (in her eyes, LiYun's actions = abandoning her), through her mother's Mohist token, she entered Mohist Hill Sect.

Back to MurongYanZhao a bit here, YanZhao did try to help LiYun by persuading him, and also asked for ZhaoKuangYin to leave LiYun alone, but LiYun was just too naive, which is why he became mentally unstable in the end. (He's neither loyal enough towards the court, nor his friend). Rong Yuan betrayed the sect after receiving LiShouJie's letter, that emphasized YanZhao's achievement in neutralizing LiYun's rebellion, and intentionally suppressed the truth that it was LiYun himself who wanted to be dead.

That basically became the spark that made Rong Yuan sank into deep misunderstanding, she: betrayed Mohist->entered LuMen -> used her identity as YanZhao's daughter to take over YanZhao's military authorites and built the warship. Then as part of the Ember of East's plan, she got to know Rong Yuan through ShiShouXin, slapped the truth, and made her see things clearly, which was why she decided to destroy the ship. Not only to help Ember's side to delay the northern campaign, but also to atone and put an end to whatever she had done in the past. Her original plan was to ignite the explosives when the ship was at a secluded place (so that it doesn't hurt the innocent), but the intervention of YM was pretty much a good tool for her to just end all things & fake her death in the end.

[silver kiln]

[scarlet yarrow]

ain't this guy dead?

[vague shoal]

I remember you explaining this before, should just find the old message and link it

[coarse osprey]

Does that mean she isn't Dead?

Well that's great to hear. She's my favourite after Aunt Han

[honest rain]

You run into her in Mo and Lu debate

[gray marsh]

im looking for war challnage for practice where can i send msg ?

[barren monolith]

War challenge?

[gray marsh]

yes