Class function

[boreal girder]

General Problem:
Classes currently don't feel closely tied to their intended or perceived identities.

Class Identities:

Barbarian:
Should feel like an all-or-nothing brawler — rushing in, stacking buffs, and dishing out massive DPS, aiming for positive trades through sheer force.

Fighter:
Should embody the feeling of playing something like the game For Honor. Focusing on parrying, blocking, and dodging, relying heavily on mechanical skill and timing.

Cleric:
Should split into two clear archetypes:

A pure mage-healer focusing on mana management and cooldown usage.

Or a holy warrior (paladin-style) who stacks buffs, self-heals, deals low to medium damage to players, but excels at high damage against mobs, playing more like a heavy tank.

Wizard:
Should be the fast, high-damage AoE class — able to unleash devastating spell combos if the player has the skill to properly aim, cycle, long cooldowns, and manage resources.

Rogue:
Should be the absurdly fast, high-burst damage class with the survivability of a wet napkin in a wind tunnel if dodging and sneaking fail.

Ranger:
Should function as the sniper archetype — excelling at long-range, high single-target DPS but sharing the downsides of the Rogue and Wizard: low health and heavy reliance on proper cycling and positioning

Though it's only my opinion. If the community agrees in their perspective then this could become the actual reality of the classes.

What do some of you think?

[faint raven]

I mean yeah, that's kinda how we all want the classes to be like, don't we?

[boreal girder]

Glad I'm not in my own world

[mortal monolith]

I would love to see classes have more specialized gear/skills. Making each class a unique experience.

[abstract sleet]

This would be ideal. It's a shame the devs don't see eye to eye.

[vital prawn]

I agree to this post Im already getting my proposed skills look into by the developers.

[abstract sleet]

Maybe you can convince them to improve rogue somehow?

[boreal girder]

They need to completely rework the class. There's no real invis, or strategies that feel rouge like. Assassination or thief type focus

[vital prawn]

Im working on rouge revamps while also creating New skills and passives to make rouges better in a balanced and fun direction.

[boreal girder]

You talk to devs or sum?

[vital prawn]

I know someone and I get my information pinned when I forwarded my suggestions or ideas.

I also have almost 2-3 year experience with game developing and coding.

[boreal girder]

That's actually really cool. Wish they would do the same with some of my posts

[vital prawn]

They do it's just takes time for it to hit the board by the team responsible on reviewing the post.

Im just like everyone else tho they can look into alot of my ideas and thoughts on things and choose not to take it.

[boreal girder]

They have for sure taken one of my posts word for word so ik they look at it. I just wish they would move away from the direction they have been

[vital prawn]

They are a small group we just have to hope bro

[boreal girder]

This made me feel good @vital prawn

[vital prawn]

Thats great bro 👍🏾

[boreal girder]

Yeah can't be too hard on them then. Ik work is focused not by the people programming the game but those in administrative positions, making focus be primarily how to make more money rather than quality at times

[vital prawn]

Yeah that is one of the many issues they are currently dealing with.

I waisted my gold and time testing the damage or utility for skills and provide the information for them.
This out of my own will without pay or anything in return just to have a better game overall.for everyone.

[boreal girder]

They still might be over relying on ai rather than people given what they have said and the lack of changes to something like barb. Could be wrong those

[vital prawn]

Bro trust me if I told you the shit they said to me you will be pissed off

[boreal girder]

I'm sure I would be upset but not surprised.

[abstract sleet]

It seems obvious to me...with things like paying for a bag expansion. Or having blue support gear be the maxmimum lvl for free gear instead of purple...It's hard knowing that the game seemed to have a better system during beta.

Maybe I'm alone on this but since then I think their intentions have been evident. I know a dev has to make money but...with all the money they've poured into the game atmosphere and animations...they could've spared some cash for other things, no? I mean they could make bank with cosmetics alone but they definitely have structured the game to favor paying for better weapons or...to grind. EDIT your average player won't have time to grind like that...also explains why they give away so much stuff for free too.*

Not that it wouldn't be too good to be true for a free to play game but...still.

[vital prawn]

I agree and this have alot to do with why things aren't appealing to everyone.

[boreal girder]

Its true you can gain some gold and progress by paying money, there's no doubt. But it doesn't keep you from accessing it. The only real paid for items that are inaccessible are the cosmetics and emotes from the battle pass, and the upper end of the draws for cosmetics.
Nothing is really pay to win in this game. It's pay to progress and even then the progression is so minimal you will eventually be caught up to or even lose to people based of skill regardless.

If anything they should focus hard on class balance and then make 100 percent paid for cosmetics

[nimble gorge]

I agree, although the stash and inventory hurt. It is the biggest draw to the game from my perspective. It is not p2w only p4-convenience.

I’m happy about the reduced price for 1wk inventory- it makes grinding to plat5 and sustaining possible. The stash hurts though: just potions and crafting fill it, let alone having differing sets for each class/ trio:solo, pve set. But still- not p2w.

In my mind a p2w scheme is one where you can gain items that are better and unobtainable through game play. We will see; but it seems they have these ideas in grasp and while treading the line, stay in the right.

[boreal girder]

They have to monetize something beyond just cosmetics that impact gameplay. As of right now we can at least get free backpack space from in game currency and events. But at launch they might go full pay to win mode in the game, you never know with these companies.

[abstract sleet]

I think It becomes inaccessible by top tier players that run and purge maps with their top tier equipment. Not their fault, just the way the game is designed.

Some of that will change at global launch(if this game gets to that point), sure.

I wouldn't even consider it P2W if I didn't get 1 tapped or knocked out in 2 hits by a zweihammer with a 7+ rating when all I'm running against that is just standard support gear b/c I can't drop 30k to get a legendary load out or something to compete...to include potions. And then assuming my skill will be enough to keep me alive longer than 2 games.

My point is that if you can buy top tier weapons you can dominate lobbies assuming you arent a complete baffoon at playing. You don't have to be great either. You can buy top tier weapons with cash. Or enhance the crap out've them.

That's a P2W model. Or damn near close to one. It certainly is for skilled players... This game has a decent disparity between skill and load out so it isn't completely rigged in favor of whoever has better gear, but it plays enough of a role where your average player is going to realize it. Because your average player is going to be running nothing but support gear, and anytime they get high gear the big sharks will take them out and loot their stuff. It's easy to farm this way in hard because the one other player on the whole map usually has some purp items but isn't great at preserving them.

& that's what happens now. It's been one of my biggest gripes. The only thing worth actually doing is completing collections because you can't advance for long anywhere else without dying and losing everything, and a good load out is expensive to constantly run unless you play literally all day.

I don't even bother with hell dungeons anymore right now and run nothing but support...because it's the only thing that makes sense. And when I do play hell, I can do nothing but hide and avoid players who think this is COD or fortnite instead.

As long as the majority of your playerbase aren't those players which I think it's about 50/50 ish now.. maybe there'll be some hope to stick around the mobile market before it becomes too expensive to keep servers and game support running.

Otherwise...🤷‍♂️

I don't think I'm being pessimistic either. There's a substantial portion of players that I think feel similarly. But hey...maybe I'm wrong.

[nimble gorge]

Support gear should not leave normal. This has been the complaint since the first ps1: my support gear in NM gets rolled. Yes- support gear is 485 GS, NM cap was 650. You’re not going to compete.

The gear cannot be bought with cash though- I mean I suppose, through gold and market. But it’s still the same gear that is accessible through grind.

What needs to change is access to gear.
The
“Need Purple for NM>Drops in NM” Dilemma

There should be some way to grind purples in hard, and grind lege in NM. Suit yourself in this difficulty for the next. However- with additional stats added at +3/ does a +5/7 blue compete with a plain purple?

[karmic fjord]

They need to cap support gear at green to give value to blues drops, AND drop the gear requirements for hell BUT ban support gear in hell so u carry nothing but value. I now I have a 5×5 map to hide in. I can bring in gear and pots from hard. They have find me between 2 maps for solo. I also have access to better gear.

I feel the goal of the game should be dumping them in hell not trapping them in NM

[faint raven]

meh, blue support gear makes sense imo

I do agree on the no support in hell though (which you should be doing anyway if you want any chance of surviving)

[nimble gorge]

Support gear is missing a stat compared to looted blues: they are not even blues!

[karmic fjord]

It's close enough I don't change them mid dungeon. I vendor most of them because I would loose money trading them. The only blues and greens of value are thing like short swords that should be in support gear for class that have access to it but isnt.

[nimble gorge]

12 slots means 12 stats are missing. Having blues on is 485 GS: this is the biggest discrepancy in “Skill” of course someoneone wearing true blues, had 12 more stats effecting their character! Then playing the “green gloves for purple +5 weapons” game. This is the biggest issue with actual talks of “balance”.

The base is off: we can’t even really discuss what could need a buff or nerf.

[boreal girder]

I think it sounds like your biggest issue is a lack of an ability to gain gold and win fights. Respectfully

[abstract sleet]

We could duel if you like, see if the issue is my skills. I've got no claim to fame and certainly I'm not a blood diamond or crown type.

The majority of the playerbase won't be though, they'll probably hang around gold and platinum for the most part. Maybe lower. I'm usually around plat.

Doesn't help that my 2 favorite classes are cleric and rogue.

In any case, usually I'm fine with most of my encounters and fights.

[novel sinew]

Nobody wants to only play normal, it's filled with bots and it's boring. There's an argument for no support in nightmare(I think it does with all the hell kits im not trying to donate gear to them) but I hard disagree with only normal

[novel sinew]

Imo the game is pay to win, buy all the collection buffs, buy bag upgrades to bring more meds, buy god roll BIS gear for every slot, buy uniques, buy top tier meds, buy S tier Mercs, and if you die you can just buy it all back again. A free to play guy has to go back in with 2-4 weak meds, support gear with no bonuses, always has middling collection score, and they have to fight the guys who did pay for everything every death. On top of all that the guys who pay have the best access to Soulstone farming so they have entire abilities and counters available to them that a f2p man would only have a fraction of(and mostly trash ones like debuff reduction). The game is 100% p2w

[boreal girder]

I'm always down to duel! Rouge isnt in the best spot for sure. Cleric is pretty good in solos though as lomg as you're not being gear gapped hard by a barb

[boreal girder]

I literally have been in support gear only on nightmare clearing out people with gold and purple sets. It's not about gear and their rolls as much as it is skill. As for collection you can't just buy the gear you need with real money im not sure where you got that idea? This game has pay to progress features and cosmetics. Not pay to win. Unless you have information saying otherwise

[boreal girder]

I agree. Nightmare shouldn't be accessible with the current gear score from support. I even think hell should be increased so it's not just people in cheap purple sets

I think uniuqes should also be put into solo mode via adding inferno so uniques aren't so team dependent blocking out solo players

[nimble gorge]

It’s your choice to run harder difficulties or not: but the rules are the rules. The GS cap is only so limiting. And knowing and understanding that jewelry and caps and belts have bonus stats on them for minimal GS^, understanding +5 is now 2 additional stats. This is a risk/reward situation.

I didn’t say you Have to Run Normal, but if your in hard even- you have players who push they cap intentionally. It’s the rules we play by. But the biggest complaint all day- even if you take in to account some of the “we need balance” conversations. Is my support gear (which is 485) is not matching up to the guys running OP intentionally hand picked 520. Well it shouldn’t. The support gear is missing a stat- and is not optimal even if it wasn’t. Compared to the Lich Jewelry! Those blue gloves are a waste of GS.

It’s not P2W- as paying gives no additional benefits that cannot be earned through time grind.

I finished my common collections ps1: running hard. Running normal. Using the bonus scrolls and collection gems.

I pushed 8/9 toons to plat5 last season, and already I am working my 6th for this season. I suit up to the cap- and run agi/ms/action- I run these 25 dungeons quick- quite literally 5.5hr game time.

The truth is- to reach Plat5 (even with the loot cap at 1k) it takes 25 dungeon runs. That’s it. 25 normal runs: doesn’t sound as oppressive when it’s broken down like that does it?

Would you trully ask to take the benefit of finding these great rng roles away?

[novel sinew]

The benefit is skipping the time grind itself. You are immediately back to where you were saying everyone else who are doing the time grind. Yeah I know skill can outpace gear IDC about that tbh because when you meet a fair match and they pay money you are statistically more likely to lose. (if you're in the rebuilding stage)

[abstract sleet]

Sounds good. My tag is #AA222TE7.

[boreal girder]

Just add me my name is Xerxes

[brisk crypt]

I love you post this is my idea of what the class should feel like

[karmic fjord]

I disagree, for a pvp game like this rogue cant be high burst and stealth. That leads to landmine assassination styles of play that are very hard to counter and not enjoyable to play against. The other player needs time to react and counter play or they feel like a victim and quit playing all together. Rogue should focus on a stun lock and poison builds. Let the rogue apply a lot of poison quickly, Then stun them to keep them from healing out of it. This gives the other player time to heal out of it and counter play. When a rogue stealths behind u while looting and kills u in one dagger throw, thats not fun for the victim. I did that to a lot of people last season. Those made my score go up yes, But the games from last season i remember having the most fun was vs barb and fighter and last one standing only had a hand full of hit points even if i wasn't was the one standing.

[boreal girder]

I see your point. But players would simply have to counter them by attacking in areas to be camped, use of torches or visibility skills like cleric has, and proper cooldowns. Rouge should be the highest threat in short, quick fights. The massive lack of durability would be their trade off.
Rouge as it is , is honestly nothing like a Rouge. It needs improvements along the lines I mentioned in post, but to the degree in which the changes are made are up for debate.

[faint raven]

There's also the new soulstone that you can get from quests that counters rogues