Jacob's Moons & JLL

[wide flame]

ty shoe showerlan

!!!

this is amazingle

also ty jacob for like the entirety of JLL

u the goate

https://tenor.com/view/cat-ride-goat-gif-10540064

[lean bone]

if you wanted to spam spawn enemies like that it'd be better to just trigger the spawn enemy method instead

[teal vector]

yeah i was just giving an example of when it would run

[lean bone]

a lot of jll components have activate on enable options like that which could be used to more easily trigger stuff if you have a parent object disabled it will treat it's children also as disabled so you can activate the parent and trigger several things at once

which can be easier than triggering each script individually from within one event

[wide flame]

also it didnt work

buuut

i was using a custom enemy without registry

just an edited nutcracker

[mellow path]

A heads up to all you lovely people in this thread, a proper fix for the soft masking errors has been released in DiFFoZTweaks' latest update https://thunderstore.io/c/lethal-company/p/DiFFoZ/DiFFoZTweaks/

[split bear]

wow I wish that mod said what it FUCKING DID

ly diffoz never change

[mellow path]

I think it normally does, I think the ReadMe got made empty when he pushed the new update lol I'm sure he'll fix it

[woven sparrow]

can i get a tldr how its different from what Xu did?

[split bear]

no bro it's been like that

I don't think the mod ever had a readme I remember checking it like two weeks ago and it didn't have anything

[mellow path]

Xu just kills soft masking when it errors, DiFFoZ patches the issue so both mods are safe to have together cus Xu's mod basically just looks for a try/catched error to resolve

You can see it properly works now, no more stretched out compass

[woven sparrow]

ahh aight

[fair sequoia]

[wide flame]

what does it do...

[teal vector]

it tweaks

[wide flame]

does it kill you in real life!?!?!?

[teal vector]

stupid

[wide flame]

IM TWEAKING OUT

[teal vector]

good

[wide flame]

https://tenor.com/view/cat-waddle-waddler-the-waddler-waddle-cat-weird-walk-gif-9738668264510949101

[hoary ferry]

SO...

Do we replace Xus mod

Or what

[balmy blaze]

I think you can have both. From what I understand, DiFFoZ does something to theoretically stop the error by fixing the underlying issue, while Xu sort of wrapped it in bubble wrap so that if it breaks, it doesn't cause more problems. Therefore, you probably only need DiFFoZ but just tested with both and it seems fine.

[hoary ferry]

Should I be safe

And just have both?

[balmy blaze]

It's up to you. Doubt Xu's was very large as far as file size so I don't think there's any harm in having it. I'll probably keep it around for now.

[hoary ferry]

Then I will as well probably

[lean bone]

latest version of jll likely won't softmask anymore but i'd still recommend diffoz mod since it gets the root of the problem better and other mods like esr may still trigger it

it won't hurt anything to have xu's mod but if you already have diffoz mod it probably won't do anything

[teal vector]

Yeah, diffoz' mod should make it not error so my mod wouldn't do anything

All I do is check if the thing is erroring, catch the error and handle it

[wide flame]

just had a random idea but what if there was a jll thing to detect how far you are in the game days wise and it would be able to sorta work like a propset / chance based thing where you could change rooms to be more difficult as a result

sorta like how repo does it

maybe normally a room is a wide floor but a day based propset changes it to have a pit

just an odd thought

[teal vector]

there probably is a JLL thing that triggers based on how far away you are on the day

[neat frigate]

LLL has data to sample for that

😄

[coral wren]

Jacob

[split bear]

gay cob

[wide flame]

jaboingle

[balmy blaze]

Ja-corn on the cob

[shrewd loom]

i love this shit jacob

[restive depot]

omg old door

and usual one at the same time

interesting

[wide flame]

the old door looks so cool is it still in the game files

[restive depot]

as disabled gameobject

not sure if animated

[wide flame]

whats its naem

[restive depot]

Environment/HangarShip/Cylinder.002 and Environment/HangarShip/VaultDoor

[wide flame]

hmm

neat

[balmy blaze]

Yeah, definitely using it at some point. Just got to finish my V72 stuff before making more content

[green shuttle]

is there a thread for LostEnemyFIx

asking because i had a situation where masks spawned in a pit in SubSystems (my friend and i fell in the pit and died, and NightOfTheLivingMimic revived them as masks), started spawning SetDestination errors, but this mod didn't seem to kill them

my config is on the default settings

those 2 masks did eventually get out of the pit so i assume the "attempt relocation" setting worked, but it was only after spamming set destination errors for over a minute

[balmy blaze]

Is there a way to essentially combine the vanilla Lung Prop and Noisemaker Prop script with JLL item script variants? Like an apparatus you can click while holding to make a noise is basically my goal but I don't see the Lung prop stuff in any of them.

[verbal meteor]

Hi, just wanted to report that the mod ReservedJsonSlots or ReservedItemSlotCore combined with OpenBodyCams makes the Radar booster have a gray thing
-# Idk if you made the core mod, someone told me to report it here
-# But you did made the JSON one

Report on OpenBodyCams thread: #1199570032196333648 message

[mellow path]

ReservedItemSlotCore had an update so try reverting it, and if it still happens just delete whatever adds a reserved slot for the Radar Booster

[verbal meteor]

ok

[verbal meteor]

I disabled the Radar Booster from being added to the reserved slot and now it doesn't do that

[green shuttle]

@balmy coral u might wanna look into this for reserved core

[balmy coral]

Okay, thanks for letting me know. I'll try to look at this later today

[balmy coral]

When does this happen? When someone picks up the radar booster and then drops it? And only happens when both Reserved and Open Body Cams are enabled?
Doesn't seem to be happening to me at the moment. I'm using both of those mods atm.

[green shuttle]

Bertogim was reporting it happening when the radar booster goes into a reserved slot with both OBC and either Reserved Custom Position (JSON slots) or Reserved Utility Slots are active

[verbal meteor]

Yeah

I removed the radar booster from the JSON and the bug didn't show up

Reserved Custom Position just makes the JSON for JSON slots

[coral wren]

Hi jacobson

[balmy coral]

Sorry, I got busy yesterday.

I feel like I'm missing something. I'm using OBC and Reserved Utility, with the Radar booster in the reserved slot, and when I grab the item, and perform any combination of things, like swapping items, dropping it, activating it, I cannot get that grey cube to show up. 😦

Could someone maybe share a profile code with me to test with where this issue is happening on?

[green shuttle]

I'm gonna look through the older reports

[green shuttle]

They also had enhanced radar booster at some point, might affect it?

@verbal meteor if you have a profile code where you replicated it, can you send

[balmy coral]

Let me try with that mod real quick

[verbal meteor]

install ReservedCustomSlot

it will make the json

[balmy coral]

Is that its own mod, or you referring to the Json one?

[balmy coral]

Oh, ReservedCustomPositions. That's probably it. One sec

[verbal meteor]

but it's weird since i can delete that mod once it makes the json and its still bug

[verbal meteor]

at some point yeah but it's disabled now

the save file is fresh

[balmy coral]

It's somehow making this object visible apparently.
After disabling that with UnityExplorer, it goes away.

So, the issue seems to be because this object is on the Prop layer, so my mod shows the renderer, but when I don't have the custom positions json file, it shows that it's on the Triggers layer (which would correctly hide it)
I wonder why that object is getting its layer changed.

Let me keep looking.

[green shuttle]

well, i was on track with my theory abt it being a trigger at least

weird that this specific combination is changing its layer

[balmy coral]

Okay, I guess my mod is putting it on there. I guess because my mod filters objects on the MapRadar and ScanNode layers to not show, but it apparently will display the Triggers layer.
These were the criteria for most of the vanilla items, at least.

I didn't make OpenBody cams, so idk if changing the OpenBodyCams_TargetTracker layer to MapRadar from Triggers would cause issues, but if it would, then adding either of these tags to that object: DoNotSet InteractTrigger should prevent that mesh from displaying.

When I get back from some activities today, maybe I can also prevent object Renderers on the Triggers layer from displaying since I don't think they should ever be visible. (hopefully)

[lean bone]

Can I ask why reserved slot core is doing anything with layers in the first place? like what is that for?

[teal vector]

Maybe he's baking a 31 tier cake for all the modders

Have u tried being more grate jacob

I meant to say grateful but that works

[coral wren]

Hi jacobson

[balmy coral]

It was for displaying reserved item slots on the players backs, if the item was set up that way in the reserved data. The players shouldn't see their own reserved items, but they should if they see thenself from another camera, such as body cams, TME third person emote camera, etc.

[vivid estuary]

moving the object to MapRadar would (I assume) completely break the functionality that object is there to provide

could you use a layer mask from the player camera to filter what you move to avoid issues like this?

I can add a tag to it, certainly, but I wanna say that doesn't necessarily save you from other issues with changing layers like that? it would take some investigating for me to make sure that makes sense

do you keep track of the original layers so that you revert items back to their original states?

[lean bone]

ah okay that makes a lot of sense

i like zaggy's idea for just using the player camera layer mask directly to filter if possible. that would also make it hopefully more update proof if zeeks does something funky

[balmy coral]

Sorry, been in and out for 4th of July stuff, but I'm trying to remember all that went into the criteria for how to show/hide the meshes as they get rendered. This was long ago, but it was based off of the game's GrabbableObject's EnableItemMeshes(bool enable) function.

MeshRenderer[] componentsInChildren = base.gameObject.GetComponentsInChildren<MeshRenderer>();
for (int i = 0; i < componentsInChildren.Length; i++)
{
    if (!componentsInChildren[i].gameObject.CompareTag("DoNotSet") && !componentsInChildren[i].gameObject.CompareTag("InteractTrigger"))
    {
        componentsInChildren[i].enabled = enable;
    }
}

Since I'm not disabling meshes, but rather adjusting layers, I had to adjust my criteria to specify which layers to show/hide.
Definitely was not future proofed at all lol, but worked for the vanilla items, so I called it good at the time.

if (!renderer.gameObject.CompareTag("DoNotSet") && !renderer.gameObject.CompareTag("InteractTrigger") && renderer.gameObject.layer != 14 && renderer.gameObject.layer != 22)

I actually like the idea of using the layer mask from the player's camera. I finally got home, so I'mma play around with this. I don't think you should have to change anything 👍

[vivid estuary]

when you change these, are you setting them all to the same layer?

I'm still a little concerned about this, but at least using the camera mask would be a little bit less likely to cause weird visibility issues

[balmy coral]

The current implementation was very makeshift, but getting straight to the point, it apparently didn't revert meshes to their original layers, which was fine at that time, and fine at that point of the mod, but wasn't really future proof.

It's actually kinda late, so I'll need to head to bed in a bit and pick this up tomorrow, but I plan on rewriting that logic, and have it done the correct way. I'll make sure layers are all reverted to their original layer once they become unholstered. When they are holstered and visible on the local player, I'll have to place visible Renderers on a layer that the local player camera can't see, but on a layer that body cams, or third person cams, should see. If holstered onto another player, they just need to be visible to the local player's camera, I believe. In either scenario, I'll avoid touching the layer when they're holstered if those criteria are already met instead of forcing them onto a layer, even though their current layer is already sufficient.

Also, regarding your suggestion, adjusting layers will only apply for Renderers on an object whose layer is in the local player's camera culling mask. I think that's a good idea.
Idk why it took me so long to type this. I'm just braindead after today lol, but hopefully I'm not missing anything.

Night guys!

[vivid estuary]

sounds good! good night

[orchid widget]

It turns out the repocket thingy does more than only the sounds

[lean bone]

am i missing something or have you just rediscovered the reason repocket exists as an option?

yes the reason you have repocket enabled on flashlights is to fix the light position. the sound is a side effect of triggering the pocket rpc.

I apologize if im misunderstanding something im tired, it's late, and that's a huge text block to read on my phone lol

[orchid widget]

I kinda forgot about the flashlight position being fixed with the te pocket. My bad

[balmy coral]

Btw, I just updated ReservedItemSlotsCore, and the rendering issues on certain reserved items should be gone. It's a more proper solution now, and should be future proof.
Any layers that might be changed when picking up a reserved item (that is visible while holstered) will be reverted to their previous layer when dropped, to ensure the intended rendering is maintained.

In the example of the Radar booster item, that gray square shouldn't appear anymore.

[green shuttle]

awesome, will try it out

[verbal meteor]

x2

[split mural]

@lean bone I came here to personally thank you

for the invention of this sacred mod

For you have given us a session to remember

may many more misfortunes and moments of hilarity come from such brilliance

[lean bone]

tbh not seen people use this mod much but i definitely think it's one of the more fun things i ever released here

(or at least I've not seen clips or anything with this until now despite the mod's age)

[split mural]

we spent a good 10 minutes setting it up for 10 seconds of video

and it was all worth it

more people gotta know of this honestly

[lean bone]

i forget which one of sickboy's moons it was but i remember doing a very early test session before it had the little interior bits. we had this mod in the test pack for silly reasons, then me and wesley just did essentially cruiser jousting

and i think he kept spawning cruisers on top of eachother which would make them collide a lot and go flying

great time

ofc speak of the devil lmao

[woven sparrow]

Olympus, you can still roam around the whole place

[woven sparrow]

You speak of me, I appear, Im a simple devil

[lean bone]

do you just stalk every channel awaiting your name to be called out? lol

[mellow path]

Ofc he does

[woven sparrow]

WTH

[mellow path]

He's st4lkerboy

[woven sparrow]

Military secret, but whereever you talk about me I appear

[split mural]

if i turn all the light off in my bathroom and look mirror at night before saying sickboy's name 3 times

[woven sparrow]

I wouldnt do that

[split mural]

like im just sayin

full confidence a storm will suddenly arise from the atmosphere before lightning strikes down to reveal he's behind me

[woven sparrow]

s1ckboy

s1ckboy

s1ckboy

[lean bone]

sickboy

[woven sparrow]

^dont be fooled this version of me is the scariest

[lean bone]

you want to test things tomorrow?

[woven sparrow]

Tonight for me?

[lean bone]

ye

it's already 3 for me lmao

[woven sparrow]

Hehe

I’ll need to model some stuff but we can probably test them

[lean bone]

i mean i just want to make sure code works we don't need all the decor lmao

[woven sparrow]

I’ll just put in some cubes with different colors then

[orchid widget]

Someone on my thread reported this:
Reserved slots where still on screen after death
I was holding alt to hold my shovel when attempting to kill a Thumper so maybe if your holding the reservedslot alt it will stay on screen

Also, another 2 thingys I've found while testing things:

• If you somehow pick the flashlight on the 1st frame when it appears and you have the custom slot, the model will no longer load. It still works, and it will light when you press F, But if you drop it, you won't be able to pick it up again.
• If by any chance the item in the reserved slot is a 2handed item, it will be automatically storaged in the slot without being in your hand, being able to change items or even pick another 2handed item.

[lean bone]

again my mod just acts as a bridge for users to register slots in reserveditemslotcore without code. any issues with slots like this should be sent to flip. if he doesn't have a thread in this server the best thing would probably be to direct that user to open an issue on the reserveditemslot github page

[orchid widget]

Yeah, i sent this just in case there may be something with your part, or a way to fix it.
I've sent this in the ReservedSlotCore thread too

[lean bone]

yeah my mod basically just reads files from a folder and interfaces with provided api. it doesn't add or do anything in game if that makes sense?

[orchid widget]

Again sorry for bothering here, but it seems I'm one of the few who actively uses and tests ReservedJsonSlot haha

[orchid widget]

Yeah, I know.
Just wanted to check if there was another thingy like the extra sync thing that you added before

[lean bone]

yeah fair. i get why you do it, i just can't do much for you lol

[orchid widget]

No issues.
I'll only post here if I find an issue with only the Json

[teal vector]

jacob can do everythinh

hopefully

[orchid widget]

KNEW IT /j

[lean bone]

i think flip wrote his reserved slot mods with specific items in mind, so me opening it up for users to do whatever they want may have opened up a lot of little edge case possibilities that were never considered. (like 2 handed items)

[lean bone]

am i jevil now?

[orchid widget]

https://media.tenor.com/2hKngpUf2vEAAAAj/jevil-deltarune.gif

[lean bone]

slap my face on that for biblical accuracy

[orchid widget]

Yeah, I'm currently trying to add support for the new utilities items in the CodeRebirth update, and several of these are 2handed.

[teal vector]

Hopefully Not Jevil

[lean bone]

why not jevil?

[teal vector]

he makes evil things, like uh, non flat women

that was my first thought for the one opposite thing of you

[lean bone]

the opposite of me in your mind is women with great assets for the company?

[teal vector]

yes

[lean bone]

hmm

dunno how to feel about that one just yet

[woven sparrow]

So are you saying current Yacuub doesnt have great assets for the company?

[teal vector]

sometimes the greatest of assets lies on the inside

right @halcyon remnant?

[halcyon remnant]

what

hi

[teal vector]

hi!

[rocky vigil]

hellooo, i have a teeny tiny question about JLL

i want an oldbird to spawn often-ish on one of my moons (to be likely, so to speak),but outside monsters seem to have a +/-3 variance every time they spawn.

after some testing i've seen more times than not that when an oldbird spawns, 1 or 2 more spawn with it and that's way too much......

some peeps in dev-moons told me there is something to force a limit with JLL, and i kinda want to limit them to 1

is that something that can be achieved @lean bone ? (sorry for the ping in advance)

note that i have like 0 experience with JLL as of yet

https://tenor.com/view/cat-cute-gif-13778694842355705836

[wide flame]

I think this is dependent on your outside spawn weights methinks

but something special like jll is probably required for what you want

we'll see if jacob has a solution

[teal vector]

Now that you mention it

Wesley HAS been slacking off

No jeb Reacts

Useless

[stray marlin]

@broken ether

[broken ether]

true that

[teal vector]

That's the wesley we know and love

You can always vacation later

[stray marlin]

your dedication knows few bounds

[rocky vigil]

I was talking to s1ckboy yesterday and thought that maybe putting a forced "spawn enemy" and taking it out of the spawn pool of the moon could work, but I don't know how much would that mess stuff

[coral wren]

Hello PLL thread

Goodbye PLL thread

[halcyon remnant]

pll?

[teal vector]

tldr?

[halcyon remnant]

p?

[balmy blaze]

https://tenor.com/view/cat-meme-pee-cat-pee-funny-lmfao-gif-14727908981812019274

[halcyon remnant]

man i just cannot escape the piss can i

[lean bone]

what?

[rocky vigil]

hey jacob!!! i had a question i posted up here somewhere

i dunno if it's possible but

[lean bone]

?

[rocky vigil]

i don't know how any of this works...........

[rocky vigil]

it was mainly this

[lean bone]

what are you wanting to do?

[rocky vigil]

i want a chance for single oldbird to spawn on a moon

[lean bone]

and what do you currently have?

[rocky vigil]

i have a mid-chance of oldbirds to spawn

sometimes only 1 spawn which is good

but sometimes up to 3 spawn

and that's too much

[lean bone]

you're doing that through normal enemy weights currently

?

[rocky vigil]

yep!

(i don't know another way)

[lean bone]

what i would do is create a game object with a "RandomSeedEvent" and an "EnemySpawner" compontent. (doing seed event since it doens't need to be rpc'd)
on the random seed event leave roll on dungeon load turned on. create two events on there. one event we will leave blank, the other one make the unity event trigger the enemy spawner's "SpawnEnemy" method. (use the one with no parameters for it to spawn at the position of the gameobject)

then for the enemy spawner just set the enemy name field to "RadMech"

keep in mind doing this means they will not be statues and will be awake at the start of the day

[rocky vigil]

that'll probably be a problem, could I add a "DelayScript" so it would spawn later?

[lean bone]

you could

there still will not be any statue tho

the statue their "nest" which only happens when spawned naturally

[rocky vigil]

i see

i'll test it out, see if it feels nice, if not i might just reduce the spawn chance/outside power level

thank you jacob!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! that helps tons (for now, and the future)

[lean bone]

alternatively there is a way through JLL to change enemy power / cap for your moon but it's part of an experimental thing that i warn people will probably be deleted in the future when i make a better alternative (meaning it will stop working at some point if you choose to implement that)

[rocky vigil]

i might wait for the better alternative, so it doesn't break in the long term

i'll keep an eye if you release it in the future

[woven sparrow]

Theres another thingy too where you could set it to an exact hour
But that also has one flaw i feel like. I was thinking what if you spawn the oldbird nest with random prop placer but im not sure if it would come alive after that. I think if you just spawn an old bird it’ll be active already but I could be wrong

[rocky vigil]

yeah that's what jacob said, i am not a big fan of that but i'll do some testing and see

[woven sparrow]

I’d test if spawning the nest would work

[balmy blaze]

I feel like when an old bird spawns it replaces a nest. They don’t come from a nest. But could be wrong and it doesn’t hurt to test it out.

[teal vector]

afaik the game predicts all spawns at the start, then spawns alll the nests which are replaced by the enemy

[balmy blaze]

Yeah so I don’t know that them putting a nest will do anything, but it might cause an old bird to spawn at that location if one is scheduled to spawn anyway? I feel like that might leave an empty nest elsewhere though

Actually, thinking about it, could they copy the nest and have JLL place the copy? Within their copy is the script for either a delay or trigger on a certain hour and it runs an attached enemy spawner and disables their nest copy object?

To me that sounds like it would simulate the normal old bird behavior

[rocky vigil]

that sounds complicated.... I don't even know where to start, but I'll start testing and see what happens

[sand dagger]

can someone explain this to me like im 5

[teal vector]

goo goo gaa gaa

hope that helps

[sand dagger]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1118459411493560354/1187380958727520346/ezgif.com-gif-maker2.gif

[sand dagger]

i guess ill just wait for someone willing to answer this

since this god forsaken lib doesn't have a single DOCUMENTATION

[wide flame]

500 years in the future jacob will write one sentence about each script and we will all rejoice

[sand dagger]

its literally only word of mouth

which sucks

[wide flame]

one day jacob will dissapear and it will be told down like ancient folkstories

[subtle otter]

"Read the documentation"

The docs in question:

[wide flame]

ur documentation is literally awesome

besides

some documentation is better than none

the only thing i had to ask u about was the one script u didnt explain (that could have change atp it might be there idk)

[subtle otter]

I really be lacking a lot of it, they be cave paintings at the moment 💀

[wide flame]

ITS BETTER THAN NOTHING!!!

https://tenor.com/view/sick-cat-awu-cat-gif-15108566974228447707

[subtle otter]

I do wanna upgrade to hieroglyphs at some point

[balmy blaze]

https://tenor.com/view/here-it-comes-willy-wonka-and-the-chocolate-factory-here-we-go-there-we-go-now-comes-gif-21443422

[broken ether]

[lean bone]

if you check where you got that from it's a part of WesleyMoonScripts, which i've told people in the past is a wild west of mess around if you want but you're probably not getting help. I don't add tooltips or anything to the wesley stuff since it's all purpose built for something in wesley's mod.
that's not saying you can't use it if you want. you're welcome to experiment. but im not walking people through the wesley stuff.
this in particular is the controller for i think it's gloom's interior fog. the fog volume linked has periods of time being very thick and hard to see and periods of time of being thinner and easier to see and is based on round seed.

[subtle otter]

Oh that's pretty neat actually

Didn't know Gloom fog did that

[lean bone]

i might have the moon name wrong i don't really remember rn but whatever the moon is that has that interior fog gimmick

[subtle otter]

There's a few, but ye

[sand dagger]

ig ill do my own documentation if thats the case (with the wes' moons stuff)

trial and error

https://tenor.com/view/dunfb-uncanny-uncanny-cat-cat-gif-11115925002983264063

[balmy blaze]

That actually sounds like it could be cool in a more general use

[teal vector]

If only interior fog was ever fun to have

[mellow path]

Yeah it's just badly designed 😔

[odd jewel]

Is this functional and if so how do I apply the changes to a moon?

mainly looking for a way to change the max count of an enemy

[balmy blaze]

I would guess in the Scene Name field you put the name of the moon scene. Then I imagine you put the same asset label on it that goes on the LLL ExtendedMod for your moon. Might be wrong there but that’s how you do the JLL config stuff.

[odd jewel]

will try that

do you know whether the max count override changes outdoor/indoor count or both?

the enemy spawns both inside and outside

[balmy blaze]

I think it’s both

I feel like I remember being told that

[teal vector]

Enemies cant/won't have different settings in-between moons and spawn pools

You can only really change weight and have that persist, other than that you can make changes for one moon but they have to be reverted back, which is what jacobs doing, so if you change max count, it'll change it for all spawn pools

[odd jewel]

alright i guess i will have to test if it feels right gameplay wise then

[astral laurel]

Is there a list somewhere of what JLL does?

[coral wren]

It wishes mel a happy birthday

Which you should go do

https://discord.com/channels/1168655651455639582/1289403092307279907

[astral laurel]

I don't partake in birthdays for religious reasons, but I can wish her a happy regular day tomorrow

[coral wren]

Wish her the best day ever

[teal vector]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1324330265820266496/1364251672913772628/caption-26.gif

[shrewd loom]

can anyone explain the use for it????

[split bear]

documentation NEVER

[shrewd loom]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1370326052345479239/1399351625126117376/ezgif-3411ab35f2b9e9.gif

[wide flame]

true!

[split bear]

https://tenor.com/view/manul-kitten-silly-cute-cat-gif-9433417145788190338

[wide flame]

https://tenor.com/view/meowl-owl-cat-meowl-cat-fly-in-gif-5323053931683515250

[broken jetty]

Meow meow!

[wide flame]

CLANKER

[astral laurel]

Can we stop with these racial slurs? It’s offensive to ChatGPT and my AI generated moons.

[wide flame]

OIL DRINKING, TIN CAN, RUST BUCKET, WIRE-NECKED, GEAR GRINDING CLANKER!!!

https://tenor.com/view/cat-eye-twitch-cat-eye-twitch-cat-camera-gif-26361958

[astral laurel]

Be careful who you say that around you don’t want to hurt Jimothys feelings

Hes just doing a good job

[wide flame]

https://tenor.com/view/cat-cute-shy-pallas-cat-manul-cat-gif-26196386

the gals are clankers...

jimbo isnt tho

[astral laurel]

Hes a clanka

[sand dagger]

https://tenor.com/view/cockatoo-bounce-gif-2126206371694659580

[wide flame]

splong bloing boingle

https://tenor.com/view/cat-hug-angry-birds-catbird-really-meme-no-fake-gif-9980836029424925531

[split bear]

he's one of the good ones

[wide flame]

tenna is okay too

we love tenna

https://tenor.com/view/cat-cute-shy-pallas-cat-manul-cat-gif-26196386

[stray marlin]

https://tenor.com/view/deltarune-chapter-3-tenna-mr-ant-tenna-gif-14615415140877671026

[astral laurel]

https://tenor.com/view/portal-portal2-wheatley-blue-sphere-gif-19665268

Wheatley is not a clanker

-# I am not a moron

[shrewd loom]

https://tenor.com/view/clanker-adam-sandler-china-robot-running-gif-2549626376734684464

[stray marlin]

Code Rebirth Guardsman has breached containment

[earnest lava]

excuse me jacob

is there a way to implement an escalator

with JLL of course

[restive depot]

What about queen

[split bear]

you've been slacking @broken ether

[wide flame]

https://tenor.com/view/outlast-trials-meme-outlasttrials-gif-4459740097837305633

welseys punishment

brick

[broken ether]

ow

fuck

okay

jeez

[thorn mulch]

Hello hello, I wanted to know when JLL checks tags for stuff like changing interior prefabs (like Wesley's Interiors does with Citadel and Armory) if anybody knows

Otherwise I'll probably scour through the git

Also I just need to know this so that I know how late I can 'change' the tags and have them be registered correctly by mods like JLL

[balmy blaze]

idk if you're still trying to figure this out, but I have a proposal. It's not JLL, it's https://thunderstore.io/c/lethal-company/p/pacoito/itolib/ but it might have something. There's this player launcher script I bet you could mess with to make it look like the player slides up an escalator. Now, I don't know how to animate an escalator, but the motion part seems doable with this.

[subtle otter]

(PlatformGrabbable is what I use for PlayZone slides, would work better for an escalator )

[balmy blaze]

I’ll have to check that one out

[earnest lava]

hmm the slide grabbing thing could work, but it’s a longer distance and slower since you’re going up, i might do the launcher thingy instead if you can change the speed of it so it’s a believable escalator

i kind of want players to be able to be more free while doing it and not be stuck in an animation

[proven trellis]

You might just be able to animate physics regions (top of truck) in a conveyor belt fashion for an escalator

[lean bone]

idk if this helps you much but tag checking is just part of filter components. tags are only checked when said filter is triggered. this usually happens during gameplay or at the start of a level when the level, dungeon, or object is loaded or instantiated. i don't have a one size fits all answer since people use it for different things. but changing tags at any point probably won't effect jll

[earnest lava]

yeah probably

[spark comet]

@lean bone Can't drop items in the void using a ladder behind the ship wreck in Pinnacle

[balmy blaze]

That might be a vanilla limitation. I think if there’s no valid ground within a certain distance below it just won’t let you drop it

[spark comet]

I can drop them near the mountain though (see from 0:40)

[balmy blaze]

I’m not familiar with the terrain there but could it be slightly more raised in that corner?

[split bear]

items have a limit of distance they can go when you're dropping them

[spark comet]

it's possible they fall on the moutain itself

[split bear]

if you're too high up they just won't fall

this is a limitation we learned a while back when generic was making the tower interior

the reason you can drop em near the mountain is probably cuz there's some raised ground or something else with collission right under that spot, whereas in the initial one there wasn't

maybe it's like a suuuuper slight difference in height but it does matter

well atleast thats my hypothesis

there could very well be something else going on there

[split bear]

ye

[spark comet]

I see. well that kind of sucks as for this particular case, this could be used to drop items below to either put them on the cruiser (if lazy to jump/drive too far), or pick them up by hands

do you know if there's a mod or something to alter this limit?

[balmy blaze]

Not that I’m aware of but if there’s no standalone mod you could propose it for ScienceBirdTweaks: https://discord.com/channels/1168655651455639582/1350616165289951272

It feels like a misc tweak that could fit in there if the dev is interested

[spark comet]

good idea

[lean bone]

I posted a JLL update with netcode recompiled for the new version + some minor additions i made ages ago before i went on leave that i never posted.

[wide flame]

hoorah!

[mellow path]

SimpleCommands will also need an update as it errors when any of its soft deps are missing due to the GetTypes change

And will prevent you from accessing Online or Lan

[lean bone]

get types change?

[mellow path]

Also the netcode changes will be needed too

[lean bone]

i was planning to recompile for the new version obv

[mellow path]

Yeah the base game now runs GetType

So some mods with soft deps explode

Hamunii and DaXcess are looking into making a seperate mod to provide a solution for it

[lean bone]

can you link me to another dev explaining it so i can see if it applies to any of my stuff

[teal vector]

Keep your netcode patcher code from the snippet I sent in that screenshot lunxara linked

It's harmless to have and according to paco its needed for edge cases like network variables

[lean bone]

yeah i double checked in game since lunx said it causes things to explode and that's a bunch of bs

it's still in the jll build i posted and it works fine in game im not reposting to remove that

unless something else turns out to be broken

[teal vector]

Lunxara is unaware that the conversation above that was talking about GetTypes is not relevant at all

[lean bone]

is there something else that may be broken im supposed to look at or is that all?

[teal vector]

Should be it, I don't assume you use assetbundles or the like

From here we wait for FPTS and LLL to get fixed

[lean bone]

a little but but nothing that looks wrong on compile

[mellow path]

Well I was testing earlier and SimpleCommands did explode a profile

lol

So I wanted you to be aware of it

[lean bone]

cus it doesn't have updated netcode which i've now held off from compiling and posting to check for an error that doesn't exist lol

[teal vector]

Then it's fine, I'm unsure what assetbundle changes that would be harmful look like between these version changes anyway

[mellow path]

Yeah I pinged Eba that the REPO for FPTS is updated

as for LLL, pacoito did an update on his end so he could work on stuff on V73, I told him he should prolly send the build to Batby

since Batby is so busy

[mellow path]

That being said if you have an easier way to contact Eba like through dm and such you might also wanna let her know about the FPTS update there as well since she isn't the most active in this community lol

[teal vector]

A ping is fine

[mellow path]

👍

[rocky vigil]

yaaaaay, what additions did you put in?

[lean bone]

nothing to get hyped about. just stuff i did a few months ago before disappearing

[wide flame]

check the update log, its useful stuff

[lean bone]

iirc just some extra event stuff on already existing components but changelog says more

[wide flame]

biggest one for me is being able to do specific delays on one delay script

using a new calling thingy

(thats it in my caveman terms)

but the others are pretty useful too

[rocky vigil]

Oh nice, i recently used the hourly events, i'll have to check

[lean bone]

tell me if there's any issues cus it's been a while since i did that and i don't really remember what i did ngl

luckily i keep detailed changelogs while developing instead of trying to catch everything after

[teal vector]

That's what separates bad devs (you) from good devs (me), if your changelog isn't just "look at github" you're not doing it right amh

[rocky vigil]

sure, once I update JLL i'll test it, tho i'll have to wait until i can actually play a modded moon on v73

[lean bone]

just a reminder JLL is designed to not be dependent on LLL. so whatever's going on should be fine

[rocky vigil]

yeah but the moons are iirc right?

[lean bone]

rn yeah

[stray marlin]

new JLL update aint v72 friendly, i presume?

[lean bone]

uh didn't test but most likely not

[stray marlin]

aye aye

[lean bone]

if you're playing last version don't update

[stray marlin]

aye aye aye

[lean bone]

I have a thing i should post but it's kinda a big text block. idk if i should like split multiple messages or what

[teal vector]

post it into like pastebin

like one of those twitter drama twitlongs or whatever they're called

raises tension

[lean bone]

idk how one makes a pastebin

maybe I'll just do that tomorrow or something

[teal vector]

dont raise tension THAT much im really curious now 😭

i would read a notepad++ message if i had to

[rocky vigil]

I would separate in text blocks (idk how long a message on discord can be)

[teal vector]

yeah^

[subtle otter]

2,000 characters without Nitro

[rocky vigil]

whatever it is tho, the sooner you say it the better imo

[vale ember]

JLL dead? I knew it

[woven sparrow]

JOnlyTrite was added

[rocky vigil]

JTriteScript

[vapid sundial]

no

god no

[lean bone]

https://pastebin.com/YFp29HYT

[orchid widget]

Can I write an opinion about this here? Because, as you know, it's a bit more complicated than just choosing whether to do it or not.

And I want to be sure I have permission to give my honest opinion to avoid any possible inconvenience.

[lean bone]

yeah feel free. just note i probably will not respond to things at least immediately. I've been anxious about even making a post about this for a while.

[orchid widget]

Don't worry, i don't need a response. Or even a read it if you don't wanna. Just something I want to send and hope it can give at least something.

[orchid widget]

Okay, this is going to be a bit long. And I think I've previously offered a somewhat similar opinion regarding the future of Lethal Company modding.

First and foremost... I'm not someone relevant. I don't know how to program this language (I do some programming for work. But it's a very different style for that to be of any use to me here.) And despite knowing that doing so is a task whose mental effort I can't even imagine, I don't have the right to offer that proper opinion as part of this community, despite having been here almost practically since its inception.

However, the reality is that everything in life evolves directly or indirectly, both ourselves and the environment around us. Things live and die.

I've seen it since the beginning of Lethal Expansion, which was the first mod that allowed loading custom moons and scraps with some ease, the first versions of Wesley's Moons started there. However, that mod had some drawbacks, from some custom moons that were included by default, to internal development issues that caused some dissatisfaction among the developers of these moons.

After that, someone made a fork that only included the moon loading base (LECore). It was practically the same, but removed the base moons and other minor features (which I can't remember right now).

From that dissatisfaction, LLL was born, a more stable alternative that was appreciated by the community, but also caused some mild dissatisfaction among modders for having to decide whether to use this new core or stick with the other one. A number of modders abandoned their moons because of this. Obviously, little by little, ways to transfer moons more easily were revealed, but after that change, there was an inconvenience that discouraged some.

LethalLecelLoader isn't perfect... I don't think the definitive 'Modding Tool' exists. We've had problems (some more serious than others) with this mod, having to see the destruction of some mods that (in my opinion) had huge potential. (I'm sure you know which one I'm talking about.)

What's my point with this?

Everything is meant to be improved, and that's not always good news. There will always be people who are in favor, and others who are against. Could this cause problems? Very possibly.
But are you willing to put up with it?

Ultimately, the one who has the final say is you and your team. I may never see the fruit of this. But kill me if you think I'm not willing to look forward to the future of this game, which, to be honest, is already on its last legs in terms of its "popularity" compared to other titles.

I support you, whatever your decision... The most important thing is you, your health—emotional, physical, and mental.

So... Do you want to embark on this new adventure?

[mellow path]

I mean pacoito and I have been discussing uploading the new LLL build and pacoito seems interested in maintaining LLL

So I feel kinda neutral on this

[teal vector]

Thank you for letting me know about this, I've been feeling like this was the case for months but I kept working on improving it and making it as good as possible for people, everytime I asked no one would ever give me a straight answer so I do really appreciate knowing this now, I'll still be developing it but I atleast now know how my target audience feels about DawnLib (simply because I'm one of the main developers I assume)

In my opinion, like you said in there, you love to code, that's why I also made DawnLib, there are clearly people who love and enjoy your work and you seem like love coding it too, I'm a bit late to the party as I started making DawnLib's moon and interior solutions after I was told about your solution and how you abandoned it (that might not have been the phrasing I don't entirely remember)

[mellow path]

This being said I think Jacob would make a very good API, and having multiple maintainers is good

Batby not being active right now and saying he was gonna upload the new build and doing nothing has also left a sour taste in my mouth

[green shuttle]

Interesting read, thanks for posting. I have a few things I can think abt with this (within the scope of a user, obviously I don't want to speak from the scope of a dev since I know nothing about that)

I'm of the opinion that options are always a good thing. I've definitely made passing remarks in the past about not wanting to go back to the times of there being two apis for moons (LLL and LE) but I think the opinion has changed since then. It's always good to have alternatives unless they actively clash with each other, which I seriously doubt you would do against LLL or DawnLib.

I'm not entirely sure why people are against DawnLib? The most I can think of in regard to it is that it has been kinda buggy, but that's a phase basically every mod goes through, not every developer is perfect. My best guess in DawnLib's case is that since it's an alternative to something that already works it isn't as necessary? I won't really prod further on this topic cus I don't wanna stir up potential bad feelings abt it.

In regards to LLL, I can see where you're coming from. I personally don't think it's responsible for a single dev with basically no time for modding to be in singular control of one of the most major content loaders for this game. Especially whenever it can't keep up with major changes in the game (v73, v50 (or 55? I forgot)). I don't want to be hard on Batby cus I know he's dealing with heavy college work and other irl stuff, but these long periods of inactivity is why there is interest in an alternative now.

From my perspective this could be another evolution of the modding scene. Just as LLL overtook LE it might be time for something else to overtake LLL now. It sounds like you have a good plan to take on this project, and if you were enjoying working on it before I'd say go for it. Even if it turns out that it wasn't very necessary, you can still say you did it and enjoyed it, rather than throwing away a bunch of good work.

I don't mean to ruffle anyone's feathers here, this is just what I think as a lowly user. What choice you do make eventually, I hope you'll enjoy it.

[coral wren]

imagine a heart moving, very intelligent opinion on the subject that sways the reader

[teal vector]

I'm swayed

[coral wren]

this better sway me lunxara

[mellow path]

I read the full post and I do agree with a lot of these points, Batby even still has kinda been inactive and leaving broken promises. So you working on a new API could be a very good thing especially with how good of a coder you are which you have shown via your JLL work and other projects. So if you get the motivation to do it I think you should, but don't force yourself to and yeah I agree that you could make a potential successor to LLL with how inactive Batby is nowadays and has been in the past. It also sucks that pacotio got LLL working on v73 day one and we've been waiting several days now for Batby to push the update, after he told pacoito he would review the changelog and do so days ago. I do think pacoito is in a good position to push and maintain a fork of the build he's done, but a proper new API with active maintainers could go a long way since I doubt pacoito plans to really expand or add new features to LLL he would more so just focus on keeping it updated and stable until Batby returns based on our talks

[coral wren]

Lunxara lib when?

[mellow path]

Lol

[coral wren]

You know what

im making my own ultimate lib

Rodigo Lib

https://tenor.com/view/dr-bean-dixon-dr-coffee-futurama-themepark-bender-gif-25160461

[sand dagger]

guess what

badqlib is right around the corner

it will feature:

credit removal, every mod that uses it will now belong to me

[coral wren]

https://tenor.com/view/oscars-standing-ovation-clap-clapping-applause-gif-5089552

you sir

[sand dagger]

trademark stamps, my signature pfp will be featured in every single mesh of the game

[coral wren]

have swayed me

[sand dagger]

and last but not least

uh

pizza parties for everyone who uses it on saturdays

[coral wren]

BADQ for president

[mellow path]

Btw since Jacob said if he does this he would be doing this API from scratch I would expect it to take a good few months for him to release it similar to how DawnLib was in development for months but I think it'd be worth seeing what he comes up with

[sand dagger]

This COMMUNITY needs a hero..

okay but jokes aside

[mellow path]

So we'll still need pacoito's fix of LLL in the meantime whether Jacob does it or not

so Moon and Interior devs can update their stuff

[coral wren]

can you even wait that long?

[mellow path]

Yes

I would rather see a stable, polished API release

than something super buggy

[sand dagger]

I don't care if we get an "all-purpose" lib, it would definitely help a ton by just having few or a single apis instead of a thousand of them for niche stuff that you want

[coral wren]

daily progress ping for jacob :

[mellow path]

Ye

[sand dagger]

okay i lied

500 libs

each with a single line of code

i am so smart.

[coral wren]

thing is DawnLib is already achieveing that, its just it seems people dont want to use it because they either dont know about it, want to stay on LLL or could be because they dislike xu

[mellow path]

Lol I've done a lot of testing of paco's LLL build and it'll be good to tide everyone over while Jacob works on his thing, we just need to get it uploaded and I doubt Batby is gonna do it at this rate

[coral wren]

i can blame all the bugs on you then

[sand dagger]

thats raw unfiltered ignorance wtf

[mellow path]

I got lobby reloading issues fixed

[sand dagger]

its like if you avoided using computers because the person who made it is gay or whatever

[mellow path]

I like DawnLib tbh, so it's probably the learning curve or smth most likely

[sand dagger]

would it be ethical if we uploaded a patch..

[mellow path]

I doubt people are not wanting to use it to spite Xu

[sand dagger]

like in the good old days of v50

[sand dagger]

i would be WILLING to learn it

[coral wren]

Idk which modders jacob asked but weve had a group of mooners who dislike us who are big members of that server

[sand dagger]

like holy shit its a 5 story cake??

[mellow path]

It's MIT Licensed, pacoito is just trying to see if he can find a way to prevent the current LLL from loading right now when it's uploaded since some mods won't update

since the current LLL explodes v73

lol

[sand dagger]

weeeirddd..

like dude

its free shit you can have to work on

tf are you complaining for

[mellow path]

Weird

Did you guys piss in their cereal or smth?

Lol

[coral wren]

Iunno ask beanie

[sand dagger]

nah if i DID dislike xu (which i don't) i would definitely still use it

[sand dagger]

Oh right.

i saw that go down

[coral wren]

but yeah no idk, hoping its not because people hate xu and its just people dont wanna change or dont know about dawn or think its buggy

but the way jacob phrased seems like it might be a possiblity

[sand dagger]

im just getting into moon making, i am ABSOLUTELY WILLING to learn it

teach me the days owl man

[coral wren]

I can teach you how to piss in someones cereal

[sand dagger]

it feels more like its just that they're used to the tools we have rn

[sand dagger]

im sold

when do we start

[mellow path]

Yeah I took it as people prefer the tools to be similar to how LLL works

[coral wren]

yeah I think so too but yeah recently seems like most modders are mad at us

learned s1ckboy was mad at me and xu lol things are fine now but yeah alot of held grudges

[willow stone]

https://tenor.com/view/manul-pallas-cat-leave-gif-2568071787324807370

[sand dagger]

no

gen no

[willow stone]

incredibly batby

[sand dagger]

thats not what i meant

NO

[willow stone]

https://tenor.com/view/indiana-jones-manul-polly-bol-lev-gif-15084512328990706428

[coral wren]

ManulLib

[sand dagger]

We shalt learn and grow from our mistakes.. It's no use holding grudges when we are supposed to work together.....

[coral wren]

https://tenor.com/view/pikachu-death-oof-rip-gif-25875782

[sand dagger]

execution

[green shuttle]

can't he do something like what diffoztweaks does and use a patcher to remove lll from the chainloader

[mellow path]

I think that is what he might be trying to do

@subtle otter This is what you've been trying to do right?

lol

From our talks it sounded like that is what he's doing anyways

[subtle otter]

I did in fact get a preloader thing to work

It remains gullible

[mellow path]

Maybe have it target the version of LLL?, basically have it check for LLL 1.4.11 or lower and stop it from loading

[subtle otter]

It works

But it's still gullible

[mellow path]

Hmmmmm

[stray marlin]

Jacob, i am 100% for this concept. take ALL the time you need for this. im talkin until 1.0.0. adapt as the vanilla game updates itself.
sorry to read that such a dilemma was flopped onto you. you did the right thing in letting the community know of where you were in this ordeal.
just remember your own well-being first.

[subtle otter]

(Also ye I'm still finishing up a proper reply to everything, I've just been a bit distracted )

[woven sparrow]

Holy shit you finally did the poll

[rocky vigil]

After reading everything I don't have, like, a big speech, but I'm happy to see the whole picture. I've seen and used your work before and I trust the skills and knowledge you have, so it's a 1000% go for it from me.

[coral wren]

Not even a 10000% go 😔

[woven sparrow]

I’m gonna fucking tear up

[teal vector]

https://tenor.com/view/the-binding-of-isaac-the-binding-of-isaac-fans-the-binding-of-isaac-players-binding-of-isaac-isaac-fans-gif-24015613

[woven sparrow]

Thats me mom! Ive been mentioned!!!

[vale ember]

Pikachus?

THERE'S MORE???

[woven sparrow]

https://tenor.com/view/pikachu-pokemon-gif-24144543

[vale ember]

That is not "oki doki" at all

[winged echo]

https://tenor.com/view/bleach-tybw-thousand-year-blood-war-bleach-trailer2-bleach-pv-gif-26116525

[astral laurel]

I'm going to be honest there's nothing wrong with overlapping features, if anything its a good thing since if one mod stops updating or gets inconsistent updates then having an alternative can allow mods to not just be forsaken and doomed to never be compatible with modern versions.

Also I'm unsure why people don't want to use DawnLib, since as its grown there's kind of been less and less reason not to use it as it covers some really cool use cases. Regardless, if modders have a good reason not to want to use DawnLib then it's better if there's another mod with overlapping features since it gives people choices on what they want to use.

[split bear]

My opinion is that even if there's a split, it will be a matter of choice and no one will be forced into anything, don't even gotta be a problematic thing to have two APIs floating around (imo)! It will only guarantee LCM's survival for the foreseeable future to have multiple options I think

If there's x, y and z API and the dev from z API gets bored and leaves or gets too busy or just doesn't care about updating you've still got two APIs that are functioning and somewhat maintained

maybe just I'm stupid but a split doesn't mean we'll have division and conflict! just means you have a different option

two cakes

*grins gleefully

[daring imp]

We all appreciate the hard work that you’re putting in! I personally think that you should upload the api. You could mention that it was built up from LLL and rename it to something like Everything API or something like that. In the end I think it’s a great idea to have a dev that will actually be active and update the api that a lot of mods depend on. Take all the time you need and don’t push yourself.

[woven sparrow]

DawnLib imo is incredibly cool, and Bongo and Xu are great developers. The issue many devs have is that they dislike Xu.
I’m not starting a debate and I’d honestly like to not continue this discussion, we’ve talked about this with developers a lot and I also talked with Xu about this briefly.
That fact of the matter is that while some dislike Xu, most of us dislike the current way of how LLL is.

We’ve been waiting for fixes, promised features to be implemented for about 2 years now and theres a looong list of what’s wrong with LLL.
LLL is still a great mod and Batby really made something incredibly useful for devs to use but the issue with making such an API is that you either need to be active (which he is not) or let others improve or at least maintain what it already has (which he refused to do multiple times, there have been many developers raising their hands to be maintainers and fix issues, and there have been even more pointing out problems).
Im only going to talk about this personally but I think I can safely say many of us feel the same way but I digress, I grew tired of pointing out issues or asking for features to be improved / implemented / finished, that would never be done. I seriously considered leaving the developing scene at least for moons (and one day potentially for interiors) when v73 came out, as I didnt want to keep working with this mod that just keeps on getting bandaid fixes to make it work for each game updates.

[ancient haven]

I've had a few people ask if Resonance is abandoned by now. Since soundapi is currently drowning in college papers I'm kinda stuck with it's development.
That's not stopping me from making content for it though. I still regularly make new stuff and improve the features I made previously, even if I have no idea when I'll be able to upload any of it.

This is unlike batby, who at this point has done jack shit for the same amount of time despite promising otherwise.
This is in stark contrast to Bongo, who has at least communicated with me in regards to soundapi and has made some attempts to fix it's issues. Not to mention Dawnlib and college have also been keeping him busy.

If you make an "LLL replacement" and batby comes back to it with a negative impression; womp womp.
He's had all the time in the world to update the thing.

24 votes for yes and 0 for no should also tell you something

[split bear]

I don't doubt Batby's also busy like Bongo but for a big API like LLL the innactivity is really disheartening

I like to joke about SoundAPI but it is nowhere near the spot LLL is rn

[mellow path]

The fact he also said he was gonna wait for the dust to settle to fix it himself when pacoito fixed it day 1 also says a lot too, like pacoito deserves to be a maintainer but knowing Batby he won’t do it

[mellow path]

Yeah I have felt so bad recently seeing how devs have been reacting about LLL not working when I’ve been helping pacoito test the new build and get bugs fixed, it got to the point we started talking about creating a TS Team and making a fork but then Batby replied to him in dm and said he should be pushing the update today so I just hope the guy sticks to his word. It’s disheartening to see so many devs be impatient snd be impacted by his broken promises

[teal vector]

Also the thing about soundapi is that bongo would love some maintainers which LLL had more than ample opportunity for

[split bear]

pacoito? yeah we need your help

https://tenor.com/view/packgod-i-need-your-help-imp-gw2-zombie-gif-8470780539185564844

[teal vector]

You got this paco

[split bear]

Adding that to the thread name on dev-resources would help a lot, I wasn't even aware they were open to maintainers

glad to hear it, too

[mellow path]

Look I’ve pointed it out before and as much as I respect Batby and the API he built I have noticed a trail of narcissistic traits and behavior from him. The way he has told people he would take on maintainers then always rejects them, the way he has held grudges and targeted specific people etc. Even the way he treated Jacob was also a sign of it. I respect the work he’s done but yeah the dude is far from perfect honestly and I don’t wanna talk bad about him either but I know I’m not the only one who has noticed it

[subtle otter]

https://tenor.com/view/cat-blink-blinkingcat-cute-funny-gif-8859604814399687515

[split bear]

You already talked smack about him like two sentences ago LOL

[mellow path]

I don’t hate him or hold any grudges against him though

But I don’t like the way he’s treated devs and broken so many promises and I don’t like the behavior he’s shown

That being said I wouldn’t blame some devs if they do hold resentment or grudges against him in ways for all of it, I know most don’t and are just more annoyed at the inactivity and broken promises above all else though

[daring imp]

Although batby is allegedly posting the update today, I still feel that a replacement should be made. Several reasons have already been said but, being inactive, being rude to others trying to help, and making false promises. I know he is most likely going through a lot, but a lot of people depend on his mod and ghosting devs when they are just trying to help is not the right way to approach the issue.

[split bear]

It can all be chalked up to college keeping him busy, him not wanting to add any ol' rando to the project, maybe sprinkle some portfolio motivation in there but at the end of the day guy's just busy I guess.

Doesn't mean it isn't frustrating to have the most important API in the modding scene behind lock and key though

-# Also fyi a lot of the mean shit Batby's said to people was warranted. Still doesn't excuse the current state of LLL but just sayiing

[undone compass]

ima be honest, I think a majority of people don't want to switch to DawnLib for these 2 main reasons

First it's still actively in development and there is no official documentation yet so people like me who wants a nice doc to look at and to see what can be done and how it can be done... just can't use the lib without asking questions in the thread or by looking at the code on github and learning all of that myself. Even if it's technically not hard to do all of that, some people may find it pretty anoying to do that while there is some great LL and LLL tutorials out there to do pretty much whatever you want

Second is that LL is still working (technically). Yes the code is bad and there is some small issues (i remember having a very bad experience with LL when zelda and I created the Spark tower because LL does not support nest enemies very well). But it still works. Switching from a working lib to another working lib, even if the new one is better, will probably make some devs thinks they don't need to switch
Also you said (if i remember correctly) that you'll update LL to use DawnLib in the background yes? Then this means there is even less of a reason to switch unfortunately
As for seeing DawnLib as a LLL replacer, i think the first reason explains way more why people might be hesitant to switch. I don't use LLL myself because i only swear by code so I can't really elaborate on this matter but I think the reasons I describe are not far off than what people are thinking about DawnLib

Personally I want to eventually switch to using DawnLib but it's clearly not in my priority list rn because of these 2 reasons.

And finally, concerning @lean bone message and the LLL fork, ill say go for it. Not because LLL does not work properly in v73 but because it's a personnal project about something that you love doing (code) and no one should prevent you from doing your passion (unless you have irl responsibilities of course)
Im not sure if im going to use it but i don't care, just do it my friend

I think having general APIs for everything is as good as having separate APIs for specific things, so this will not change any of the decisions that people may had when choosing a lib
The goal here is to create something that you want to make, exactly like you did for JLL. I was considering using JLL in the past but for some reasons I was too lazy to do that but honnestly thats not important since like you said it kinda blow up
So again, prioritize your stuff and you should avoid thinking about the benefit of having a general API vs multiple specific APIs because at the end devs will choose which one they want, we dont need to have only 1 choice you know
Look at the state of LLL today and youll understand what I mean

[teal vector]

All totally valid, I would definitely like more people to ask in the thread currently though so I can gather how people would like things to be made but other than that it's valid

[undone compass]

Oh yes i agree with that
But now imagine if someone new is coming to the modding scene, they have some great ideas and they are a beast when it comes to using Unity
They'll first search what APIs they could use (if they dont want to code everything), and they will most likely found wikis and tutorials about LL and LLL
If they dig up a little more they might even found about JLL and the editor support
But today, Im pretty sure they will not go for DawnLib because they already found some others great libs

Since those apis are still working, they will not think anything else and use them pretty much directly

[teal vector]

Yeah I agree, I am someone who's made tutorials for both of those mods so it makes sense, I'll eventually have to make proper better tutorials for dawnlib but unfortunately making the lib as good as possible is priority rn unless I had another maintainer as active as me :p (not to say that I won't be making tutorials later)

[undone compass]

That makes sense, looking forward to this

[teal vector]

I hope so too, I have scouted a few people in hopes they'll agree to help maintain etc so hopefully that goes well

[astral laurel]

Just thought id give some input that DawnLib documentation would be amazing

[vagrant dagger]

I haven't been too active in the lethal company modding community besides making some small reskin type mods but for about a year or so, me and a friend have been brainstorming a possible moon mod with a lot of custom mechanics/items.
Most of the custom stuff we needed would probably require outside help or isn't really all that possible but from the features you listed a lot of them would make this idea no longer such a large undertaking.

If you do release this fork, I would have to thank you for making our mod plausible (or at least allowing us to dream bigger)

[restive depot]

we need to destroy them faster

https://tenor.com/view/pikachu-death-oof-rip-gif-25875782

[woven sparrow]

what did you say?!

[restive depot]

clean up trashichi

https://tenor.com/view/shironeko-cat-holding-a-flower-shironeko-sleepy-cat-holding-a-flower-silly-cat-sorry-gif-2983801009814780729

[woven sparrow]

https://tenor.com/view/touhou-touhou-project-nue-fumo-fumo-doll-gif-26792738

[teal vector]

Don't make fun of s1ckboy

it's not his fault he was a born hoarder

and hoards all manners of garbage

it's a serious issue and with enough intervention sessions he'll manage 😔

[woven sparrow]

https://tenor.com/view/pikachu-gif-24653014

[stray marlin]

explains a lot

[woven sparrow]

WHAT

[stray marlin]

explains why it keeps happening

[woven sparrow]

it doesnt

[balmy blaze]

Honestly, if you want to do it, then do it. I think that's the main thing. I don't know if I'll keep using LLL, switch to Dawn, or switch to yours but I don't think it's bad to have the options. What I wouldn't want to see is them not work together, Like LE and LLL eventually became incompatible iirc. That's really my main concern. But I'm sure it's possible to make them work together. I think others have already said alot on the subject so I won't go on too long of a rambling now though.

[teal vector]

Yeah it wouldn't make sense to not have compat

[stray marlin]

https://tenor.com/view/apes-together-strong-0p1sf-gif-20906166

[stray marlin]

||yes it does||

[woven sparrow]

https://tenor.com/view/pikachu-angry-angry-pikachu-pikemon-pokemon-gif-16268096204573495797

[willow stone]

He might have been referring about his actual life

[mellow path]

If that’s the case it would make a lot more sense tbh

[lean bone]

I wanted to let this bake for a while and after checking in I'm very surprised to see unanimous results. I never would've thought the response would be like this. I was expecting the poll to be proof that people didn't want this at this point but I'm happy to be wrong. I would've thought maybe an active maintainer being allowed on LLL would change people's opinions after a few days but that didn't happen either. (or maybe people forgot who knows)

also i read basically everything people have said in this channel now and I want to say thank you to you guys.
But i think as discussion continued things got muddy a little bit. I want to clarify 2 things.

1: I will not be releasing the LLL fork. I am done with that. The fork is dead. If nothing changes on the poll I will be creating a new api from scratch with most (if not all) the features I worked on for the fork plus a collection of new features I have been concepting.

2: I was kind of hoping some people would choose to speak up and explain more on why they didn't want to switch to dawn lib which did not happen. That is fine, i let them choose to remain anonymous or speak up if the wanted to. The only issue is that left some people to assuming some things that aren't necessarily true. One thing mentioned is devs liking the tools from LLL and not wanting to learn new tools. Trust me I've been basically tech support for people behind the scenes. They do not like the tools from LLL they would love to switch to something better if it existed. That is not a reason people don't want to switch to dawn. The other thing is people not liking xu. That is maybe true for 1 or 2 people but saying that's the reason for everyone is disingenuous. I don't really want to get into it here. I don't want to be involved in any arguments on that. I am neutral as I said before. But if xu wants to know more they can reach out and I can tell them some of the reasons I have heard from others anonymously.

[undone compass]

Good luck with the new api if you are really going to do it
For the DawnLib situation i really think most of the people dont want to use it because of that #1273213762542895104 message
Like you have so many docs, wiki, video tutorials for LL and LLL but none for DawnLib, thats pretty much the entire reason imo

[lean bone]

just out of curiosity have you ever looked at the LLL wiki?

[daring imp]

I honestly don’t know why everyone’s hating on Xu. Secondly, the only two things I’d want from a big api is one that is built well, and one that has multiple active maintainers that will continue to maintain and work on the mod.

The last thing I’ll say is that I really dislike having multiple apis that devs are using for the same task. I of course love options, but when they overlap, that’s when things get messy. So honestly don’t really know what I would do considering that DawnLib plans to be the big API and this mod too. But idk it’s whatever you what to be honest.

[woven sparrow]

Pacoito and I are willing contributors

[undone compass]

Me? no

i dont use LLL

whats wrong paco

[split bear]

I would say even if LLL has a wiki that's just ok (which from what i'd seen some sections are still yet to be filled) it has a sturdy tutorial available and a lot of resources you can use to make stuff for it

[subtle otter]

I do still be interested in mayhaps integrating some of the improvements you did into the LLL fork (and eventually to main LLL soon™), but yeah I understand if you just wanna get started working on your thing

If there's anything you need compat-wise from LLL I don't mind doing small releases to patch specific things

[subtle otter]

Also while I don't really plan on doing any like major contributions (I be distracted with some stuff), I'd be down to test stuff and/or suggest improvements and fixes

[undone compass]

I didnt know LLL wiki was mid, but i still said "tutorials" so that does not change my argument

[subtle otter]

[split bear]

exactly LOL

this is the one I was looking at a while back I think

[undone compass]

simple man, what you mean by this emote?

[split bear]

it's not a big deal cuz I was able to ge the info from experience people like generic and wesley

[undone compass]

LMAO ok, to be fair i didnt know that but we have other solutions to learn how to use it

[subtle otter]

I often don't really know

[restive depot]

never stop greed

[lean bone]

yeah im not debunking you. i just thought pointing out wikis was funny in context of LLL. there are like 3 pages that actually have information on the whole wiki and the ones that do have info are like wrong? like the compatibility page lists tags for the vanilla moons. but if you cross reference that with the csv that has the tags actually applied to moons then you see a lot of the tags the page says the moons have they just don't, like "Snowy" "Forest" "Desert" "Quota" "Ice"

[undone compass]

No problem then
My argument is still real, it's much easier to learn those other libs than DawnLib
Heck, i tried using it just today but i found a limitation that is kinda annoying

[subtle otter]

It do be a pretty different system

[undone compass]

yep, and thats sad

[subtle otter]

Sad how?

It's just different, it can be learned

[undone compass]

Yes but that makes transition annoying

and stop with the greed lmao

[split bear]

he's addicted

[subtle otter]

I'm just greedy sorry 😔

[undone compass]

take that

[astral laurel]

I agree with this.

I haven’t touched DawnLib much besides trying to learn a few things, it’s an impressive API but consequently is quite dawnting.

The moon stuff especially look really good and feels less convoluted than LLL’s system.
I’ll likely be swapping to it

I may have replied to the wrong message, I’m referring to the one about the little documentation compared to LLL

[teal vector]

I'm not sure if the pun was intentional but I approve

DawnLib is also obvious a newer API, nothing is set in stone, and I'm not the only one working on it, if people wanted to they could explain some of the frustrations with it that they find, if there were more maintainers I'd be writing documentation and tutorials instead of code daily but I only do it on Thursdays rn when I'm doing my really boring af AI-yet-not-supposed-to-be-an-AI-tech class

But yeah I imagine most people's difficulties is in things like setup, which is why I've made unity packages too but anyway I sorta digress

[heavy light]

Okay so I haven't been a part of this discussion before, but I have one big worry about the creation of a yet another large API for content creation.

Basically, the API needs to be maintained until the end of time. This is of course not a problem if you're planning on being a part of the community for a good while and if contributors appear. There are ofc also modders who will update an unmaintained API for a new game version because otherwise potentially a lot of mods would break for no good reason. Anyways, the issue here would be that it's yet another API to maintain.

Another option is that for example LLL would eventually become history, like Lethal Expansion. Ofc this can be worked around and LLL content compat can be made, but that can potentially be a lot of work (or maybe not). In any case, there's a shit ton of value in keeping LLL alive simply because of the amount of mods that rely on it.

A somewhat clunky API (LethalLib) that exists forever and only ever pushes the minimum amount of breaking changes as possible in general is way better than an elegant API that keeps pushing breaking changes.

Though, LethalLib has an issue (and so does basically every other large API) where they use vanilla types for stuff like Items for example, instead of creating their own proxy types. The issue here is that Zeekerss can push breaking changes, and a proxy type can make consumers of the API avoid that breaking change because the API itself can make the proxy type work with the new game version.

It's a lot of work to make such a system though (and optimally stuff you'd likely reference in your item or enemy code would also have some proxy types), but thankfully Zeekerss has been really good at not pushing such breaking changes. But yeah, an API which never makes breaking changes and gives the ability for consumers to become almost immune to breaking changes in the game would be almost perfect.

[neat frigate]

zeekerss has not been really good at not pushing breaking changes, he's been terrible at pushing any changes

[woven sparrow]

Meanwhile repo:

public void SomethingFunction(float, float float, bool)

to

public void DifferentlyNamedFunctionWithChangedParams(float, float, float, float, float)

I love to search for the new function name everytime they do a massive update

[warm fog]

public void AnotherNamedFunctionWithMoreChangedParams(float, float, float, float, float, bool)

[stray marlin]

we all float down here

until we bool

[lean bone]

I'm not so worried about maintainers personally. I already have ~3 people who expressed some level of interest in helping maintain such a project post release and I don't even have an api yet. If people are already offering I don't think it'll be too hard to find helpers after documentation and such is made which I would try to take the time to do.

I already proposed an idea in my original post to possibly make an addon mod that's basically a gutted LLL dll with bundle loading and api calls replaced to new api equivalents. Automatic conversion plugins in editor like LLL had for LE projects are nice and all but that requires devs to migrate their stuff. If i do something this way it could allow LLL projects to be usable with some of the new stuff and load without needing to be updated (only needing to migrate if they want to use new stuff). It likely wouldn't be perfect but it could keep a lot of things alive for a lot longer.

I get what you're suggesting with proxy types but it's kind of an uphill battle. to some extent with LLL as an example extended content at least partially serves that purpose no? (i know not exactly just hear me out) especially with the validation step you can run checks to make sure everything required for that type of content is present. if some update happens in the future adding new systems we can't possibly predict rn and it breaks things you could add code on the api side to apply some default value fixing legacy content. But there's no way of knowing what will or won't exist in future updates. There's no way to make a perfect proxy that can fit all the needs. And expecting developers to start using that proxy exclusively and trust that it will exist in the future is a harder sell. I think it's better to solve a problem when it actually happens rather than make guesses to solve a problem we don't yet know about. I'd probably have some sort of verification stage for content where fixes like that could be applied.

part of the reason JLL has a bunch of clutter is because i leave most all legacy things in there to ensure I don't break things using the old stuff. I would definately take care to not do anything breaking in any updates.

[lean bone]

repo modding sounds like minecraft modding lmao

[woven sparrow]

little minigame

Find the lost function

[sand dagger]

https://tenor.com/view/slenderman-collect-my-7-pages-fade-in-lucaluvspandas-dap-me-up-gif-8718876965664072190

FIND MY FUNCTIONS

[vale ember]

I love democracy

[lean bone]

The people have spoken and I have begun working on something new. No clue how long it will take as like I said before, I am starting completely from scratch. There is a lot I want to make so don't expect anything too soon. This post is just to confirm it has begun. I've been quiet because i have started cooking.

I do want to announce though that since I had a few people offer to pay me for this I decided to enable monthly memberships on my kofi. I don't have a lot to offer on there, it's basically just a means of supporting me if that is something you want to do. There isn't any difference between the tiers aside from the price atm so it's just pick based on how much you want. I will try to post some dev logs, maybe coding talk?, & updates on there. How much I end up posting on there will be based on if/how many people decide to support me on there.
Mostly just testing the waters tbh.
nothing is final. everything is wip. no clue how long it will take. 👍

[mellow path]

I would expect quite a few months at least and tbh take all the time you need on it, I would rather it come out in a state that you feel really happy with when you release it

[stray marlin]

i still say wait for vanilla's 1.0.0 before publicly releasing. v73's arrival screwed so many things up, and id hate for you to be slammed with request after request for an update

[teal vector]

zeekerss is supposed to be back soon as he says...

[stray marlin]

https://tenor.com/view/doubt-intensifies-gif-14242619

[split bear]

that's like saying wait for minecraft 2.0.0

[vapid sundial]

minecraft 3 coming tomorrow

[split bear]

10pm???

[vapid sundial]

hopefully

[restive depot]

wesley stop slacking off, we need jebrealemotion under every message

[stray marlin]

if only you could mass emote

[balmy blaze]

Oh he's so far behind!

[broken ether]

I am.. I really am..

[balmy blaze]

look at him go!

balance has been restored!

good job Wesley!

[broken ether]

I'm all caught up

[woven sparrow]

He did it! What a lad!

[vale ember]

oh this pfp frame is much better

[split bear]

for real

[green shuttle]

one must imagine wesley happy

[gusty tide]

nature is healing

[lean bone]

Hey I just want to ask if anybody would be opposed to me updating ReverbTriggerFix to change the experimental config option default to enabled?
I'm aware of a few possible problems it may cause but they're extremely niche and i personally am not aware of any moons where they may occur.

Reason I'm asking is because in the past few weeks twice now I've been helping debug some random lag issues and the answer has been related to vanilla ship reverb triggers producing lag when in certain positions. Enabling this setting in the config entirely fixes the lag when standing inside. i also haven't heard of any issues when using this setting from any users as of now.

[split bear]

I personally would not mind jacobson

[mellow path]

I'd say it'd be a good idea, that setting has always fixed several issues for me and I've never really ran into bugs with it

I even had a talk with pacoito cus he was looking into ReverbTrigger stuff and realised what you did is better with that option on lol so funny timing to ask :3

[lean bone]

for the record what he was suggesting was my original plan but after messing with it for a few hours i realized i could do it the way i did it which would be so much easier and slightly less efficient probably but effective

[teal vector]

the way it was being done with the trigger being turned off or whatever it was felt pretty awkward when i last looked at that implementation but ig if it works might then doesnt matter too much

[rocky vigil]

⬆️ the culprit and the reason

[mellow path]

Yeah, it actually fixed a ton of issues on some moons in the past for me, specifically some of Rosie's moons like Summit that had weird Reverb triggers near the elevator that caused massive lag

[teal vector]

uhm isnt the lag caused by reverbs stacking?

[mellow path]

Prolly, but having OnTriggerEnter on fixed it

[lean bone]

esp when ik people are doing a ton of patches for reverb triggers in like every lc optimization mod i didn't want to deal with transpiler fighting

[teal vector]

i guess its possible that rosie's moons had stuff like that but im pretty sure it was just a couple of rare vanilla instances that it was mostly meant for, oh well

i didnt even bother touching it lol, your mod was already doing that

it does worry me a bit if another script is also trying to get the OnTriggerStay event at the same time though on the same collider, unless its not the collider you disable, i dont remember tbh

[mellow path]

I'm sad that the custom shader Summit uses got broken, Summit was admittedly one of my favorite moons by Rosie lol

[lean bone]

i don't disable the collider no

[teal vector]

oh was it the script?

[lean bone]

yup

[teal vector]

should be fine then, even if a little dubious

i probably didnt use dubious right

[lean bone]

main reason i had it off normally is because of how i did it in a kinda quick jank way. i'd like to make it done better in the future i just never got around to it and am now tied up in other things.
and nobody that i know of has had problems with it so far, and if they find ones that are troublesome they can always turn it off

[mellow path]

You can always improve it when you have time yeah, but it's never been an option that has caused problems

[subtle otter]

You know what though you can probably skip the Coroutine that waits for a frame and just call OnTriggerStay() yourself but once

At least that's what I do for my SaneReverbTrigger™

But yeah it'd be better to fix reverb triggers overall, my thing there is a separate component

[winged echo]

I have ran into odd item dropping sound issues with that experimental option enabled in the past on the hadal interior very specifically

[subtle otter]

If you mean missing sounds it's probably too many AudioSources playing at the same time mayhaps

[winged echo]

pooootentially, everytime i dropped it on a certain surface inside that interior, i would get an error thrown at me until i turned that setting off, but worked fine with other surfaces nearby. #quirky

[subtle otter]

Weird

[jade gorge]

dunno if this is anything, and if it is I dunno if it should be posted here or for JLL, just covering bases 🙂

[Warning:JacobG5.JLL] [User] Found duplicate entry of Magic Wesley.Hallowed content, skipping for now.
[Warning:JacobG5.JLL] [User] Error Parsing C:\Users\lloyd\AppData\Roaming\r2modmanPlus-local\LethalCompany\profiles\Acalians Company\BepInEx\plugins\Magic_Wesley-Wesleys_Moons\PolarusModConfigsJLLMod.json
System.ArgumentException: Cannot use any of the following characters in section and key names: = \n \t \ " ' [ ]
Parameter name: key
  at LethalPerformance.Patcher.Patches.Patch_ConfigDefinition.CheckInvalidConfigCharsOptimized (System.String value, System.String name) [0x0004f] in /_/Patches/Patch_ConfigDefinition.cs:47 
  at (wrapper dynamic-method) BepInEx.Configuration.ConfigDefinition.DMD<BepInEx.Configuration.ConfigDefinition::CheckInvalidConfigChars>(string,string)
  at BepInEx.Configuration.ConfigDefinition..ctor (System.String section, System.String key) [0x00011] in <cebe69d7792f4abca78b685257766c60>:IL_0011 
  at BepInEx.Configuration.ConfigFile.Bind[T] (System.String section, System.String key, T defaultValue, System.String description) [0x00000] in <cebe69d7792f4abca78b685257766c60>:IL_0000 
  at JLL.API.CustomConfigEntry.RegisterConfig[T] (JLL.ScriptableObjects.JLLMod+ConfigValue`1[T] config) [0x000ce] in <d225a018702d4a58967fb1c753cb959a>:IL_00CE 
  at JLL.API.CustomConfigRegistry.RegisterMod (JLL.ScriptableObjects.JLLMod mod) [0x0005d] in <d225a018702d4a58967fb1c753cb959a>:IL_005D 
  at JLL.API.JFileHelper.LoadFilesInPlugins () [0x000af] in <d225a018702d4a58967fb1c753cb959a>:IL_00AF 
[Info   :JacobG5.JLL] [User] Finished reading 6 files.```

[lean bone]

send this to wesley it's his problem

[teal vector]

uh shouldnt JLL parse the string given to get rid of illegal characters rather than the user just knowing about it?

[lean bone]

probably should. i have some checking to prevent illegal file names im p sure but if you read the error it happens in bepinex not me. one of the few places i usually use try catching is when interacting with the file system just to hopefully save from any malformed files or corrupted data causing unexpected issues. maybe im lazy for that but whatever it's a lethal company mod. I think that happens to be catching the error when loading his config thing which is on user level cus it should blair as a loud siren to wesley reguardless of his logging level in testing that he messed up and to fix it before posting it but ig that didn't happen.
JLL isn't checking for or even aware of this rn. probably could make it so it does but it's so niche i don't know if i care to drop everything to do that rn

[nova depot]

How do I fix this error with JLL?

[nova depot]

Thanks

[rocky vigil]

@lean bone it seems like simplecommands is doing some funnies if you install it alone (without LLL/WR)

[lean bone]

if it's the unity input system throwing a get types error then for now just install hamuni's mod that fixes it

[rocky vigil]

Yeah I think it was

[ancient oasis]

Does jll have a script that lets you randomize objects on a moon. Like dune a prop thing

[balmy blaze]

Like this? This spawns a random object on a random outside node

[subtle otter]

Could also do SpawnableOutsideObjects if the prop needs not be networked

At least I assume JRandomPropPlacer calls Spawn() if it's got a network object

[balmy blaze]

Yeah. In my case for some reason I thought you couldn't make custom SpawnablOutsideObjects but I've since been proved wrong and I don't care to refactor it lol

[subtle otter]

Lol

I mean ye both things work for the same effect basically

[balmy blaze]

Actually, I also have this stuff configurable. You can toggle off if these extra props spawn inside/outside in that JLLExtraObjectsContainer so I probably won't change it. I don't know how exactly you could change the SpawnableOutsideObjects list through a config (without custom code of course)

[subtle otter]

Yeah it'd need code

[nova depot]

What does the Blower Fan Script do?

It does not interact with the player so what does it do?

[rocky vigil]

Have you played beanie's vehicle hangar and or 30-Row? The fans work with that script

Basically pushes the player

[nova depot]

Is there a other script that I have to put with it?

[rocky vigil]

I think you need a game object that acts as the direction where the "wind" is blowing from if I'm not mistaken

I don't quite remember tbh

[halcyon remnant]

Was bored and tried pulling the script in question up on github, i could be talking out of my ass since I've never used jll in my life but seemingly whatever you're putting the component on needs a trigger collider?

collider would be as big as wherever you want the wind to be acting on players

theoretically of course, again could be wrong

[rocky vigil]

Yeah also that, you need a trigger collider that marks there the "wind" is acting

[halcyon remnant]

Yeah

[rocky vigil]

I forgot because basically every area of effect stuff needs one

[nova depot]

Ok, Thanks

[split bear]

also LC Office

[rocky vigil]

Oh yeah true, I forgot

[nova depot]

When the player is in the box collider trigger I can't jump and I fall slow with the Blower Fan script, Is there a way to fix that?

[lean bone]

the force is relative from distance to the object you put in the script. you can't jump cus being in the wind counts you as falling iirc. if you're just falling slowly and not being pushed up it means you need to increase the force

[wide flame]

waiting for wesley to jeb me

i know hes making his way down.

slowly bringing jebs as he goes

oh god

i see them approaching

HELP ME

IM BEING OVERTAKEN

GOD

SAVE US

[broken ether]

what has this channel done to me

[wide flame]

https://tenor.com/view/tiny-jens-jeb-minecraft-tiny-agnes-nooo-gif-23685860

[split bear]

HAHAHAH

fuck yeah dude

bet you won't jeb this next message wesley

[wide flame]

oh

he

hes dead...

[nova depot]

I WILL

[split bear]

i killed him.....

[wide flame]

quick

switch it to pregnant man emoji!!

[split bear]

Wesley if you jeb this you're forced to split your interiors up

[wide flame]

im self reacting to save us from jeb in first place

[split bear]

BEANIE YOU BITCH

YOU FOILED MY PLANS NOOO

[restive depot]

wesley if you jeb this message then nothing will happen

[split bear]

wesley if you jeb this you're splitting your interiors up

[wide flame]

wesley if you jeb this, it means you are legally binded to split up the interiors. and if you dont jeb it, you will live knowing this thread is truely not jebbed to perfection.

oh

he

did both

WERE SAVED!

[teal vector]

wow u did it

[split bear]

guys real

oh he actually jebbed it

peakm.....

[wide flame]

thanks jebsley

[split bear]

Wesley can you name weslerman "jebsterman" officially

[teal vector]

hot reloadable interiors are acceptable too (in the case that splitting them up is a headache)

[split bear]

I don't think it is he just said he's lazy

well it could be both LOL

[teal vector]

that stuff can be fairly time consuming honestly

[broken ether]

They're all already split up bundles
I just upload them all together

[split bear]

Wesley blink twice

[broken ether]

I just despise updating several mods
(hence why the standalones are mildly behind atm)

[restive depot]

Wesley if you jeb this you will rotate your every tile for every interior to 67 degree towards Y

[wide flame]

i wouldnt mind them being uploaded in mini packs for some of them.

the expanded interiors can definitely go together

saves you some work

[broken ether]

That's what I've been thinking

[split bear]

add me to your TS team I'll be your secretary

[broken ether]

hmm
I'm going back to headache town

[split bear]

Wesley blink twice

[split bear]

yeah that

[wide flame]

Only pack i can think of is:
Expanded Interiors - Mineshaft Exp, Facility Exp, Spooky Manor

although

nah

hmm

i guess its technically vanilla variants

and they are all trial interiors

so it could be named either of those

since spooky manor is expanded

its just altered

as for the rest of the interiors... I do think they should be standalone truly. I cant think of logical pairings

[split bear]

yerp

[astral laurel]

just scarcely update the standalones unless its been a while or its broken

I will literally release cheese from the rooms out back if you add standalone rubber rooms, its so peaks

[balmy blaze]

Or, here me out, my approach where the pack is empty and just downloads the standalones as a dependency lol

[split bear]

I think your approach is fire asf but the world ain't ready for it

[vapid sundial]

hey wesley do you need a script for that

[mellow path]

I don't blame you, you do have a lot of moons so it's understandable to dislike updating them seperately

[rocky vigil]

I wish there was a batch upload

[teal vector]

it would be nice if there was something like that, though i guess technically with enough odd scripting you would get it done it wouldnt be pretty

it's why i settle with the dawnlib setup, stuff is technically connected but in reality its all standalone

and instead of mod downloads its just configs, saves so much time

[lean bone]

how are you managing to turn a convo about wishing you could batch upload on thunderstore to a dawnlib pitch?

doesn't even make sense in the context of wesleys mods. the whole reason for standalones for him is to avoid downloading extra content. configs to disable things in game still means you spent time downloading all that and waste disk space on it if you don't want it.

[teal vector]

it's always been about ram usage, disk space isn't that big of a deal

it's also about convenience

and yeah, i did talk about it in the context of dawnlib, because i've had the same problems and issues with my own mods and this is just how i tackled them, im sorry if that rubs you off the wrong way

[split bear]

it does add up though

[subtle otter]

The humble 10 GB Clear unused mod cache

[teal vector]

yes it adds up, but which one is drastically and 100x more relevant

[sand dagger]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1044813642505400342/1431407107722313798/wptdvmp06mze1.gif

i just remembered i need to clean that

[wide flame]

light work

mine was 37 gb once

[sand dagger]

mine was 5 GB

[subtle otter]

I mean I've heard users having issues completing the whole Wesley's Moons download, but yeah it's not necessarily game-related and more of a mod manager thing lol

[sand dagger]

shit........

[teal vector]

idk how yall get it so high, maybe im constantly clearing my mod cache and forgetting about it

[split bear]

doesn't matter, both are bad and should be avoided

brazzah

[teal vector]

definitely, i've heard about people complaining on that end

[subtle otter]

The download is a Journey in and of itself

[sand dagger]

Heh, both are good and should be pursued.

[split bear]

I think debbie's was like

[teal vector]

i agreeth

[split bear]

47

[sand dagger]

I am so rebellious..

[teal vector]

i wonder what the highest someone's ever had was

[subtle otter]

Wonder what the unused mod cache WR is

Yeah lmao

[rocky vigil]

i just want to be able to update all my moons at once

without opening 9 tabs

[subtle otter]

Ye that's what Xu was talkin about with CR being split into parts but in the same mod page, I didn't really interpret it as a DawnLib pitch tbh, just explaining her reasoning behind it

[sand dagger]

hey while im at it

how does navmesh blockers work

[subtle otter]

They block..... the NavMesh

[sand dagger]

no like

how do i USE it

[subtle otter]

Lmao

[sand dagger]

i don't want my terrain to be fucking.

[wide flame]

you make a block of it

[sand dagger]

BLUE

[wide flame]

and it blocks

[wide flame]

turn off the renderer...

[sand dagger]

yeah but whats the component

[wide flame]

no its

[subtle otter]

Can be either a NavMeshModifierVolume or NavMeshObstacle if you need it to be toggleable

[wide flame]

in your navmesh settings

i mean

no

[rocky vigil]

navmeshmodifiervolume

[wide flame]

its

[sand dagger]

nono

[wide flame]

OUGHGHGHHG

[subtle otter]

Whar

[sand dagger]

i want a portion of my terrain to NOT be navmeshed

[wide flame]

do you want the VISUALS GONE

or

THE NAVMESH itself

[sand dagger]

the navmesh itself

[lean bone]

does gale not like... delete cached files after they get a certain age? how does that happen lol

[teal vector]

imagine me opening up 50 tabs to update CR lmao

[wide flame]

really big box collider set as trigger with navmesh obstacle component set to CARVE

[split bear]

I don't use Gale cuz I have a huuuuuuuge brain sorry

[sand dagger]

okay ill see how it goes

[wide flame]

(its pencil sized, dont listen to him)

[subtle otter]

Nah should do NavMeshModifier volume if you don't need to toggle it

[rocky vigil]

i would use navmeshmodifiervolume and set to not walkable better

[subtle otter]

Ye

[split bear]

you're not allowed to comment on that, minor

[wide flame]

i always use obstacles and it works fine

[teal vector]

navmesh obstacle do be more costly if you're not toggling

[subtle otter]

It works fine but it's a bit more computationally heavy iirc

[wide flame]

ok mr stickdick minecraft

[rocky vigil]

boo beanie not OPTIMIZED

[teal vector]

thats why it's better to use the modifier volume to bake it

[subtle otter]

It's more convenient for like doors for instance

Only way to do it with a Volume would be to rebake lmao

[wide flame]

me when 1 navmesh obstacle makes my moon horrible and awful for performance

https://tenor.com/view/cat-standing-cat-standing-falling-falling-over-gif-9663251229376830097

[rocky vigil]

exactly

[subtle otter]

Catch me doin wild shit as a micro optimization

[wide flame]

you're not making me very jolly right now

[rocky vigil]

huge block of navmeshmodifier slop please

[rocky vigil]

me when s1ckboy looks at me making moons

[teal vector]

the obstacle to your performance

[subtle otter]

Also make sure the object you have the thing on is on the Room layer, or at least a layer that has NavMesh on it

[teal vector]

you forgor to uh toggle these 30 settings on the renderer, set the audio to mono and uhm delete the project for extra file size

[subtle otter]

Can blame ANY lag on the NavMeshObstacle if it happens to occur on a Beanie moon

Everyone gets a free pass

[teal vector]

free ticket

though also uh there's more problems with obstacles

[split bear]

cope

[sand dagger]

rrrriiighhtttt

[teal vector]

more gameplay related ones to using them

[wide flame]

im coping it im copenhagen

[subtle otter]

The component, to clarify, it needs to be in the same layer to actually affect NavMesh

[teal vector]

i did just remember how toy store pathing was absolute hell for enemies because wesley was using obstacles instead of volume modifiers iirc

[rocky vigil]

also the block of navmeshmodifier should be inside environment!

[subtle otter]

Ye in the hierarchy that receives the Nav'ing of mesh

[wide flame]

im not using it for small areas

[sand dagger]

can i put in NavMeshColliders?

[wide flame]

the few spots im using it enemies have a wide area to go around and its not very complex at all

[subtle otter]

Ye

It's arbitrary

[sand dagger]

ic ic

[subtle otter]

Organize it to your whim

[wide flame]

so yeah i could fix it but if it works it works and im lazy

if it aint broke dont fix it

[teal vector]

i think the way it was fucking with them was that enemies thought they could go through the area with the obstacle, but they couldnt, and they wouldnt try to path around it, thats why i was mentioning it, but yeah it's pretty specific