Imperium

[distant stag]

A powerful and highly performant all-in-one debugging tool to test and explore game mechanics and functionality in Lethal Company!

Imperium (Beta) - Version 50 Only

This is the first public beta of Imperium. Please feel free to submit any bugs and or feature requests on Imperium's Github page!

https://github.com/giosuel/imperium
https://thunderstore.io/c/lethal-company/p/giosuel/Imperium/

Disclaimer

Imperium was made with the intent to be a tool to test game functionality and provide more insight into the weird and wonderful mechanics of Lethal Company.
The Imperium team strongly stands against cheating and trolling in public lobbies.

Visualizations

• Visualization of hitboxes and colliders.
• Raycast and spherecast visualization for weapons.
• Landmine / Spike Trap colliders and overlays.

Object Spawning

• Spawning of entities, scrap and map hazards on hosts and non-hosts.
• Killing and reviving of employees.
• Object Explorer for Lethal Company objects.

Teleportation

• Interactive indicator teleportation.
• Teleport to coords / map object.
• Waypoint manager.

Spawn Prediction

• Entity spawn predictions throughout the day.
• Predicts spawns, spawn locations and spawn timers.
• Spawn indicators on vents and outside nodes.

Freecam

• Built-in, custom 3-axis freecam.
• Select / Deselect the camera's render layers.
• Supports teleportation.

Moon Information / Properties

• Information of the current moon / challenge moon.
• Controlling map hazards and objects via Interface.
• Changing of moon variables / weather.

Render Settings

• Custom render and camera settings.
• Control over volumetrics / lighting / frame settings and more.
• Custom render resolution.

Entity and Player Overlays

• Displays entity / employee stats such as HP, Stamina, Weight, etc.
• Visualizes entity path-finding and targeting.

Save File Editor

• Custom save file editor for level saves and general save.

[boreal panther]

Omg man, this seems insane!

Wow!!! I am definitly gonna use it throughout my future testing!

[tall bough]

Holy fuck

[bitter compass]

?modder @distant stag

[limpid eagle]

Added role Modder to giosuel

Yay! @distant stag you've been assigned the modder role. Head to #role-picker to select which type of modding you're interested and active in.

[bitter compass]

Looks insane

[distant stag]

[oak venture]

damn this looks nice, haven't used this but I might just deprecate DevTools/TestingLib if this does everything it does lol

[bitter compass]

How long has this been in the works? There's so much lol

[bleak shard]

Couple days over three months

It's come a long way

[distant stag]

yeah around 3 months, this was the first prototype lol

[bitter compass]

Noice

[tall bough]

From Emp to Imp

[surreal prawn]

[slow island]

This is craaaazy

[sullen pilot]

dearie me

[warm mortar]

would using this for dev purposes be preferable to other dev tools?

cuz if so

[bitter compass]

That's kind of the point

[grim stream]

Plz make sure it’s not client side

[warm mortar]

well from the hitbox stuff it reminded me of fighting game training modes lmao

[bleak shard]

If the host has it, you can use it too otherwise it's disabled

[heady vortex]

oh my god

its beauitful

[grim stream]

ok nice

[plucky granite]

Dude thats such a great mod!

[strange onyx]

Wow this looks really nice, at least at a glance. Definitely will be trying this out!

[distant stag]

[2024-04-06] Update v0.1.3

• Fixed compatibility issues with the v50 rev.3 update of lethal company.
• Adjusted Oracle predictions as the daytime entity bug was fixed.

[waxen plover]

Is this a v50 only mod because none of the keys do anything

[distant stag]

Yep, you need version 50 for it to work

[waxen plover]

Yeah I just booted up the beta and found that out. Thank you.

[grim stream]

So the is helps with performance?

[iron pumice]

no

sadly

i thought that to

[steel siren]

not sure if this is imperium causing this but when i have the mod installed when i land its stuck on loading seed

never happend without the mod on

[sullen pilot]

why would a debug menu improve performance?

[alpine glacier]

I definitely have to test this :o

[grim stream]

I saw someone talking about performance but he deleted the message

He said he was going to test

Also there are settings to lower resolution and disable visual effects

[distant stag]

Yeah, it definitely improves performance in some places and there are optimizations for logs but I wouldn't use it for performance improvement

[distant stag]

Feel free to send me the logs so I can have a look, try starting it without any other mods

[steel siren]

ok

[steel siren]

i got some logs

btw imperium was the only mod in mod list

so

[distant stag]

these are only warnings, do you have any errors? there should be some errors (red) when you pull the lever

[steel siren]

dang

lemme check

[alpine glacier]

Hmmmm... For some reason, my cursor is invisible when accessing the F1 menu 🤔

[distant stag]

are you on the newest beta release? imperium version 0.1.3 is only working on the latest patch of the beta

try version 0.1.2 if your're on an older v50 patch, but no guarantee that it works

[steel siren]

logs

[steel siren]

for the loading seed glitch

[torn bough]

e

[distant stag]

when does this happen? seems like a nieche error since this function runs a lot

[warm mortar]

runtime netcode patcher just deprecated

[distant stag]

💀

[alpine glacier]

[torn bough]

oh no...

[steel siren]

It happens randomly

[distant stag]

Interesting, I'll look at it, thx

[warm mortar]

im so sorry for your loss emperor

this just came out and then rnp just dies LMAO

[distant stag]

its probably not too hard to switch to unity netcode patcher

at least I hope so..

[distant stag]

[2024-04-12] Update 0.1.4

Compatibility

This version is compatible with the v50 rev.4 update of Lethal Company.

Added Features

• Added picture-in-picture mode for freecam (Shortcut: X).
• Added keybind to toggle the Player HUD (Shortcut: Z).
• Added visualization of the outdoor spawn denial points.
• Added night vision to the freecam.
• Added noise markers to indicate nearby noises.

Internal Fixes

• Switched from runtime netcode patching to post-build patching.

QOL Changes

• Dead entities are now marked as dead in the object explorer.

[distant stag]

[Beta] Imperium

[tall bough]

Oh my gahh

[steel siren]

YIPEEEEEEEEEEE

[distant temple]

Are there any incompatibilities with other mods? Cause everytime I try to open the F1 menu in my mod pack it just doesn't pop up and gives me this:

But when I do it with no other mods it works perfectly fine!

[distant stag]

yeah, Imperium isn't really meant to be used with other (content modifying) mods

its meant to be a tool for testing and debugging

[sweet drift]

so it can't be used for mod/modpack testing then

[distant stag]

definitely something I will look into in the future, for now there is no guarantee that it will not break with arbitrary mods

[alpine glacier]

Why does Imperium increase the FOV while sprinting? 😅

[distant stag]

this actually happens in the vanilla game, its just smoothed out so you don't notice it that much

imperium currently has a bug where the FOV change is not smooth, will be fixed in the next version

[alpine glacier]

Oh 🤔

[alpine glacier]

Great :3

[strange onyx]

Is there any way to disable other keybinds and interactions in the game while a menu is open? For instance, if I push F2 to spawn a Tulip Snake, the teleportation indicator appears as soon as I type the first letter.

[cyan granite]

is this mod supposed to work in multiplayer? like have the other player use it as well?

[distant stag]

this should be fixed by default, are you using any other mods?

[distant stag]

yes! you can use it in multiplayer as long as the host has it also installed (for security reasons)

[cyan granite]

well i was just testing it with another player, and it didnt seem to work, all the changes i did only applied to my own client, or changing the weather, like killing myself and then reviving myself, they didnt see me at all

[distant stag]

that's weird, did you use any other mods?

[cyan granite]

lethal config, more additiona suits, lcultrawide and lcbettersaves

[distant stag]

hmm, it might be a problem with the new netcode patching

since runtime netcode patcher was deprecated

you could try using version 0.1.3

[cyan granite]

alright we'll try it out and i'll get back to you in a bit

[cyan granite]

yep that seemed to fix it

i guess it is a problem with the new netcode

[distant stag]

thats good to know! ill make sure this is fixed in the new version!

thanks!

[strange onyx]

Yeah, a ton, haha. I can try to find out what breaks it then.

[shadow ferry]

With the invisbility setting, does that make you invisible to the enemies, other players or both?

[steel siren]

enemies

[shadow ferry]

I see

I think it'd be really cool if there was an option to be invisible to other players as a small little troll

unless freecamera already does that

[distant stag]

You can do it with freecam I guess, though I don't see how this would be useful for debugging

[shadow ferry]

not for debugging in the slightest

[distant stag]

[novel lake]

Would it be possible to either redirect (or copy) Imperium notifications to chat (or to another persistent gui)? When testing combat with godmode on, the "enemy took 1 damage" and "godmode blocked X damage" often appear quickly one after another, so it's easy to miss them

[distant stag]

redirecting them to chat would be an option but IIRC you can't really scroll up (?) what about logging the event so you can check in the logs?

[strange onyx]

Just to follow up, it was the Minimap mod which was breaking things, if you're interested.

[distant stag]

ohh, thats good to know, I will check why it's breaking

thanks for the heads-up!

[pseudo notch]

Dose this work on the v50 release?

[distant stag]

it only works on v50

[pseudo notch]

I tried it on v50 but I could not get it to work

[distant stag]

were there any errors?

[pseudo notch]

Nope

[distant stag]

do you have the logs?

[pseudo notch]

I tried press all of the fn’s

[pseudo notch]

I can get them later I’m not in my computer right now

[pseudo notch]

The default key to open it is F1 right?

[distant stag]

yep

sounds like a problem with other mods

[pseudo notch]

Ok I will try again later

[distant stag]

try using it without any other mods

[pseudo notch]

K

[novel lake]

Yeah, I don't think it's a big deal that you wouldn't be able to scroll up through damage/godmode messages in chat, but considering the length of the messages you wouldn't be able to see more than 1-2 of them, so maybe chat's not really an improvement

Logging would be better than nothing, but pretty awful UX

[elder sigil]

Is there really any tiny chance Imperium could embrace a bigger scope, by becoming a debug tool for non-"pure" LC, aka LC with mods?
I'm a bit puzzled su much effort went into debugging just the "vanilla" unmodded version. Maybe I'm missing something.

[distant stag]

well supporting modded isn't just something I can just do or not do

I have to check with every mod, that I want to support, individually to make sure its compatible with Imperium

I am changing the spawning system to hopefully support custom items in the next version

[torn bough]

!!!!

[distant stag]

no promises tho :3

[torn bough]

custom enemys-

[autumn pawn]

Are there any ways to change the keybinds that Imperium uses? I use Hotbar plus which assigns my inventory slots to my numbers, which then moves my emotes to my F-numbers, and thus, Imperiums default keys are overriden.

[distant stag]

It's currently not possible to change the keybinds

It's on the list of stuff that I want to add tho

[autumn pawn]

Even with something like InputUtils?

[distant stag]

I would need to add support for input utils first

but it's not the highest priority rn

[autumn pawn]

Fair enough

[distant stag]

feel free to open an issue on github, maybe more people are interested in this feature so it gets a higher priotity

[strange onyx]

How to spawn a Spray paint or a Tulip snake with this mod? Seems like nothing with spaces work.

[distant stag]

I'm reworking the spawn system in the new version, should work then

[strange onyx]

Ok, thank you!

[eternal grotto]

This is gooorgeous, what a beast

[distant stag]

Thanks!

[strange onyx]

How do I use the save file editor? There doesn't seem to be a save button anywhere.

[distant stag]

the values are saved automatically when you press the return key in an input field

same for the toggles

you would need to restart the game for most of the changes to take effect, tho

[strange onyx]

None of it saves, though. I've setting the credits, days, steps taken, ship unlocks. I've tried restarting the whole game, quitting and reloading the save, using LobbyControl to save and load the save. I'm not sure what I'm missing.

No logs are even generated.

[distant stag]

hmm, very interesting

I'll have a look

thanks!

[strange onyx]

Thank you! This mod's gonna be so amazing once the kinks are worked out.

[distant stag]

Imperium 0.1.5 [Beta]

I re-wrote the entity and item management system to improve the compatibility with mods that add items and entities with LethalLib.

In general, using Imperium in existing v50 modpacks should now work a lot better, but I still can't guarantee that it doesn't break with certain mods.

Compatibility

This version is compatible with the v50 update of Lethal Company.

Known Mod Incompatibilities

• NutcrackerFixes by Zaggy1024 - Breaks F-key menus
• Minimap by Tyzeron - Conflicts with the cursor locking

Changes

• Completely rewrote the Spawning UI and entity handling system to be more robust.
• Added support for modded items and entities.
• Items, scrap and spider webs can now be teleported from the Object Explorer.
• Added indoor spawning vents to the Object Explorer.
• Added breaker boxes to the Object Explorer.

Internal Fixes

• Changing the weather in real-time is now fully implemented.
• FOV transitions are now smooth (e.g. when sprinting).
• Fixed a bug that caused freecam inputs to go through when the UI was open.
• Fixed the BepInEx dependency.
• Fixed a bug that caused problems when spawning entities with a space in their name.

QOL Changes

• Entity spawn location can now be picked interactively when in freecam.
• Freecam now spawns above the player when opened for the first time.
• More overlays now correctly look at freecam when its active.

[distant stag]

I changed a lot of stuff to hopefully make it more compatible with mods ^

[elder sigil]

Yay! Thanks! Gonna test it right now - if it can be used with mods it would be extremely useful for, well, the whole modding community using mods 😄

I'm literally drooling just looking at this page (from the store). That's just beautiful, everything looks so neatly organized 😍

[sullen pilot]

hypothetically, if i were to wish to use imperium to be a bit silly in a friends only lobby, would all players require the mod?

[torn bough]

you just have to be host

[sullen pilot]

:D

[distant stag]

multiplayer is currently a bit bugged but it should work on version 0.1.3

as loong as your the host

[sullen pilot]

what's the problem with the most recent versions?

[distant stag]

i switched from runtime netcode patcher to the other one

and now some RPCs are not worting

[sullen pilot]

the other one, very descriptive

also by god is this useful

[distant stag]

the evaisa one that patches the assembly after building it

[distant stag]

thanks!

[steel siren]

sorry if this is annoying but will u fix the loading seed glitch?

sorry for asking

[autumn pawn]

Are you sure it's caused by this mod?

[strange onyx]

Trying to spawn Spray paint still results in 0x spray paint being spawned even after today's update.

The spaces in names still break things.

[steel siren]

last time i tested with no mods only imperium it still did it

but i will try to test again

[autumn pawn]

Huh, alright. Just that bug sounded like the same thing LQ also does

[steel siren]

What mod does LQ stand for?

i think i was wrong sorry

im not sure

weird

i got these logs

something about navmeshes

[autumn pawn]

Lethal Quantities

[torn bough]

getting stuck on random seed?

[steel siren]

yuh

[torn bough]

same

multiplayer or solo?

[steel siren]

both

[torn bough]

its just multiplayer for me rn

[distant temple]

Idk if it's just me but this mod has some conflicts with Control Company. Even if I change my keybinds for the control company the menu is gone and I can't select any enemy to control.

[distant stag]

This happens when you spawn in an indoor entity outside or in the ship and vice versa

[heady vortex]

Hm

For some reason my spawn list is greyed out and I cant interact with it at all

\

@distant stag you know why this is happening?

[distant stag]

its currently WIP, there were some complications that I will try to fix in the next version

[heady vortex]

understood

mb

[distant stag]

all good, I didn't mention it anywhere in the changelog

[steel siren]

oh

[urban coyote]

Hello, can you please make the intro (The "Greetings, Padawan") optional? Specifically, something I could turn off in the config. I use imperium sometimes for singleplayer and I tend to prioritize consistent atmosphere with the mods I use, so I try to avoid things like that.

My bad if I've got it wrong, I'm having a tiny bit of trouble figuring out which mod is causing it, but turning imperium on/off seems to consistently cause the easter egg to start/stop.

Thank u for making this mod btw, it's the only debug mod that consistently works for me 👍

[distant stag]

Yeah, sure I could add a config for that

[normal trench]

Not sure if its been reported already, but the mouse cursor doesnt seem to appear when you open the menu. You need to be actively looking around as you open the menu for it to appear.

Also some menus aren't interactable when you are in freecam

[distant stag]

yeah but that shouldn't be a problem, thats how the game does it usually

what menus aren't interactable?

[normal trench]

At least the teleport menu

[normal trench]

No no, the mouse cursor doesnt appear AT ALL when the menu is already open. I need to be moving the mouse when I open a menu for the cursor to appear

[distant stag]

yeah, but is that a problem? you won't be using the cursor anyways before you move, no?

[normal trench]

Its pretty hard to use the menus without a visible cursor :P

[distant stag]

but you need to move the cursor to use the menus, no?

[normal trench]

Hold on...

[distant stag]

or am I missing something?

[distant stag]

ahh I see what you mean

this is most likely a mod incompatibility

what other mods are you using?

[normal trench]

It might be freecammer how that I think about it, lemme check

Nope

[distant stag]

might be minimap

but id have to check

[normal trench]

Its minimap

[distant stag]

Imperium will soon have it's own minimap anyways

but the mod incompatibility is known

[sullen pilot]

even when things do spawn, the oracle always says no enemies spawned

[distant stag]

oracle or the spawn report?

[sullen pilot]

spawn report i mean

[distant stag]

because the spawn report doesn't include entities that haven't spawned from their vents yet

aka indoor entities

[sullen pilot]

doesn't include outside enemies either though, i've seen a hawk spawn infront of me while it says no enemies spawned

[meager ember]

not sure if anyone's reported it yet but the mod breaks if you host a lobby, leave the lobby then host a new one

NullReferenceException: Object reference not set to an instance of an object
  at Imperium.Core.MoonManager..ctor (SelectableLevel level, Imperium.Core.ObjectManager objectManager) [0x0002c] in <c42d373936674adea180e79f30d377da>:0 
  at Imperium.Core.MoonManager.Create (Imperium.Core.ObjectManager objectManager) [0x00025] in <c42d373936674adea180e79f30d377da>:0 
  at Imperium.Imperium.Launch () [0x000ee] in <c42d373936674adea180e79f30d377da>:0 
  at Imperium.Netcode.ImpNetCommunication.ReceiveImperiumAccessClientRpc (System.UInt64 clientId) [0x000d6] in <c42d373936674adea180e79f30d377da>:0 
  at Imperium.Netcode.ImpNetCommunication.__rpc_handler_912480818 (Unity.Netcode.NetworkBehaviour target, Unity.Netcode.FastBufferReader reader, Unity.Netcode.__RpcParams rpcParams) [0x0003b] in <c42d373936674adea180e79f30d377da>:0 
  at (wrapper delegate-invoke) <Module>.invoke_void_NetworkBehaviour_FastBufferReader___RpcParams(Unity.Netcode.NetworkBehaviour,Unity.Netcode.FastBufferReader,Unity.Netcode.__RpcParams)
  at (wrapper dynamic-method) Unity.Netcode.RpcMessageHelpers.DMD<Unity.Netcode.RpcMessageHelpers::Handle>(Unity.Netcode.NetworkContext&,Unity.Netcode.RpcMetadata&,Unity.Netcode.FastBufferReader&,Unity.Netcode.__RpcParams&)```

[distant stag]

Hmm, I thought I fixed that

I'll have a look, thx

[sullen pilot]

forecaster seems to have some trouble with lots of moons

[meager ember]

that reminds me... I get an error whenever I try to switch weather (it seems to still work even with the error though)

NullReferenceException: Object reference not set to an instance of an object
  at Imperium.Core.GameManager.RefreshWeather () [0x000bf] in <c42d373936674adea180e79f30d377da>:0 
  at Imperium.Core.GameManager.ChangeWeather (System.Int32 levelIndex, LevelWeatherType weatherType) [0x00012] in <c42d373936674adea180e79f30d377da>:0 
  at Imperium.Netcode.ImpNetWeather.OnWeatherChangedClientRpc (System.Int32 levelIndex, LevelWeatherType weatherType) [0x000e3] in <c42d373936674adea180e79f30d377da>:0 
  at Imperium.Netcode.ImpNetWeather.ChangeWeatherServerRpc (System.Int32 levelIndex, LevelWeatherType weatherType) [0x000e3] in <c42d373936674adea180e79f30d377da>:0 
  at Imperium.Netcode.ImpNetWeather.__rpc_handler_2306371807 (Unity.Netcode.NetworkBehaviour target, Unity.Netcode.FastBufferReader reader, Unity.Netcode.__RpcParams rpcParams) [0x00056] in <c42d373936674adea180e79f30d377da>:0 
  at (wrapper delegate-invoke) <Module>.invoke_void_NetworkBehaviour_FastBufferReader___RpcParams(Unity.Netcode.NetworkBehaviour,Unity.Netcode.FastBufferReader,Unity.Netcode.__RpcParams)
  at Unity.Netcode.RpcMessageHelpers.Handle (Unity.Netcode.NetworkContext& context, Unity.Netcode.RpcMetadata& metadata, Unity.Netcode.FastBufferReader& payload, Unity.Netcode.__RpcParams& rpcParams) [0x0004e] in <895801699cfc4b4ab52267f31e2a4998>:0```

[distant stag]

yeah, this is already fixed in the next version

thanks!

[distant stag]

yeah custom moons are cursed for imperium, I'll eventually fix this but it's not the highest priority rn

did you load these levels with LLL?

[sullen pilot]

yep

[distant stag]

does other stuff work as expected with it?

I have actually never tested it with the new LLL

[sullen pilot]

it seems to yeah

[distant stag]

very good

[true laurel]

Hi, one question, currently the mod doesn't work with HDLethalCompany, is this expected or incompatibility?

[meager ember]

I use it with HDLethalCompany with no issues 🤔

[true laurel]

Umm weird, maybe something else is causing it to not work, but is strange because just when I add Imperium it stops working

[distant stag]

any logs?

you shouldn't need hdlethalcompany anyways as Imperium has all (or at least most) of the render settings built-in

[true laurel]

Don't really see any errors from Imperium

To see the comparison with HDLethalCompany working

[distant stag]

oh yeah but thats because imperium has its own graphics settings

specifically, it overwrites the resolution at runtime

you can change that in F1 -> Render Settings

[true laurel]

Ohh I see, thank you so much for the time, I'll check it out

[distant stag]

no worries, have fun!

[heady tinsel]

oooh this is goated

this makes testing mods infinitely easier

[steel siren]

i just found out the loading seed glitch was one of my mods sorry for complaning so much

it was "general improvements"

[distant stag]

Alright, good to know 👍

[strange onyx]

Is there any way to set the value of an item with this mod?

[distant stag]

its only possible to set the value of items spawned with imperium

if you want to change the value of existing items, I'd recommend to use unity explorer

[strange onyx]

How do I set the value of an item I'm spawning? 3rd arg?

Ok, yeah, it's 3rd arg.

[distant stag]

yep

[buoyant cipher]

animations seem to be broke when i use imperium

is it a setting im not seeing or a glitch im encountering

[distant stag]

what kind of animations?

[buoyant cipher]

using terminal, using landing/launch lever, and emotes seem to just act a bit strange

let me double check real quick to make sure it wasnt something else

[buoyant cipher]

ok i did that, after enabling it in my mods, and testing the animations i had problems with, i had problems with them again

[buoyant cipher]

ill give some details now
so when you used terminal, the animation that alligns the users view with the screen wouldnt occur, and it stays misaligned

the launch/land lever animation doesnt occur, but it lands like normal

emotes seem to be misaligned with players view

[distant stag]

do you have "Disable Locking" enabled by any chance in F1 menu?

[buoyant cipher]

uh ill check

yes i do

ok so it was a setting i was not seeings lol

[distant stag]

hehe

yeah, thats what it does

[buoyant cipher]

well thank you

[distant stag]

no worries!

[lost portal]

I don't mean to be a pain but how would I unlock the mouse when using imperium

[distant stag]

wdym with unlock the mouse?

[lost portal]

its fine now I fixed it

the problem was minimap

[distant stag]

yeah, imperium is not compatible with the minimap mod

I will add a built-in custom minimap to imperium in the next version anyways

[torn bough]

really need to fix the teleport key and minimap key to not work when using the spawning menu

[distant stag]

wdym minimap key

minimap aint even in the mod yet

[torn bough]

when!

[sullen pecan]

hi is there a setting that will make the ship not leave after dying?

[distant stag]

its coming in the next version

[sullen pecan]

ok, thanks!

[rough grail]

f1,f2,f3 literally do nothing

the bepinex log had nothing

so uh

kind of confused

[feral sentinel]

imperium adds a new collider called "ImpNoiseListener" on the Enemies layer to the player camera

due to some jetpack jank in vanilla, the jetpack collides with that while the player is flying at high enough speeds, which causes the player to die to gravity and explode

im working on a plugin to fix the jetpack exploding in mid air and was running into issues with that creating inaccurate results in my testing

not sure how easily that could be addressed or how much it matters but it was an interesting incongruency

[distant stag]

Do you have Minimap installed?

[distant stag]

Ah damn, I thought it's only a trigger

[torn bough]

your awake

[distant stag]

No me slep

[torn bough]

good

less sleep more imperium working!!!

[torn bough]

nuh uh wrong nerd emoji

[rough grail]

Nope

No control company or minimap

Even tried a new profile with just bepinex and imperium

Didn't work

[distant stag]

that's very weird, I have never heard of this one before

are there stil no logs even with Imperium + bepin?

could you send them?

[rough grail]

Literally nothing just the "imperium loaded" stuff and then the scan information

No warnings or errors

Not a hardware thing either trust me I tried

[rough grail]

Because there's nothing in the logs its 100% just something on my end

I'll get back to you if I fix it

[distant stag]

That sounds very odd

[brisk bane]

do you have to enable another player (non host) to use the imperium menus or is that not possible because i was trying to test some multiplayer stuff but my partner couldn't use the menus

[rough grail]

Uninstalled steam and r2modman, reinstalles and now it's working fine💀

[distant stag]

LMAO, well good to know that its probably not an Imperium error, still very odd tho

[torn bough]

welcome back to earth gio

[distant stag]

you both need to have Imperium installed, but multiplayer is broken in the current version, if you want to use it, I recommend using v0.0.4 for now until v0.0.6 is out (soon)

[torn bough]

2 weeks later ):

[alpine glacier]

What exactly is the Freecam teleport button for?

It seems to always teleport me to the ship, no matter where the freecam is 🤔

[rough grail]

Just testing the item teleport feature rn, items seem to just fall through the ground when you tp them

[distant stag]

yeah, its currently broken, will be fixed in the next update

[distant stag]

also something that will be fixed in the next version

[alpine glacier]

Are you also adding a way to teleport the player via the freecam?

Like the teleport pointer, but coming from the freecam

[distant stag]

yep!

i am not sure when I'll be able to release it, I am currently on vacation and I stil need to fix one or two things

[alpine glacier]

Yeeee, enjoy your vacation! 🙂

[distant stag]

thanks!

[timber coral]

For some reason I suddenly can't host with Imperium on, even in friends only mode

this is the error message i get

[sullen pilot]

sometimes when i teleport to a fire exit, it teleports me out of bounds and sends me flying into the abyss

stepping into webs and below snare fleas seems to still alert them even when invisible

[distant stag]

Do you have the "Skip Menu" setting on in quickload settings?

[distant stag]

Yeah, invisibility doesn't protect you from snare fleas or spider webs as they have their own mechanic to detect you

[rough grail]

when you do eventually fix this and plenty of other things, can you also add a "teleport all items" button

tedious if you have new items that you spawn in and have to manually do multiple clicks to get one at a time

[distant stag]

Wdym multiple clicks?

[rough grail]

just annoying yfm? f1, scroll, find the item, click, find where you want to place it, do that 10 times since it falls through the groun 99% of the time, repeat for 8-10+ items..

you get it lmao

clippings getting fixed the next update so

[distant stag]

Well once the items don't fall through the ground it shouldn't be a big problem anymore, right?

[rough grail]

adding that would be helpful and very appreciated

👍

[rough grail]

if not a "teleport all" function which I think would be annoying to code (maybe not, no idea), maybe add a "quick teleport" option where when you click on an item to bring it to you it just places it at your feet

that, plus a multi-select would be peak fr

[distant stag]

I am still not 100% sure if I know what you mean, once I fix the fall through ground thingy, the items should spawn in front of you anyways

[rough grail]

what I mean is the blue circle where you can look around and click where you want the item to be placed, im asking if you could make an option that disables that and just automatically places it at your feet when you select an item to be teleported to you

my bad if my previous explanation was garbage

this

reason being: tedious when your trying to tp multiple items and are having to constantly re-open the menu, scroll, and find what your looking for

did that make sense or nah 💀

[distant stag]

Yeah, I get what you mean, I just wasn't sure in what case you would need to teleport a lot of items at once

But yeah, a general setting to disable the indicator should be pretty easy to add

[rough grail]

oh im testing a mod that adds items to the inside of the facility

just needed to see if stuff was spawning properly or not

[distant stag]

Ohhh, alright makes sense

[rough grail]

yeah sorry for the confusion man

[distant stag]

Haha no worries

Yeah sure, can add that

It's on the list

[rough grail]

alright sounds good

thanks

I gtg now

[distant stag]

[timber coral]

yeah actually i think that's the last thing i did before quitting the day before this happened. can i change that with lethalconfig?

because i can't host so i cant do it ingame

would reinstalling change the config

[distant stag]

you can change it in the r2 config editor or in the config file directly

[alpine glacier]

Last time I tested the multiplayer function didn't work 🤔

Does it not work when using LAN?

[distant stag]

Yeah, multiplayer is broken in the current version, it will be fixed in the next version

[boreal panther]

I just want to say that I tried your mod for some testing of my mods, and It works just soooo well! Beautiful work!

[bitter compass]

Thanks

Worked hard on it

[distant stag]

Thanks, I'm happy to hear that! Huge update is coming soon with a built in map, minimap and interface skins, stay tuned!!

[timber coral]

how do i use the freecam, when i press F or whatever the button is i can't move the camera position at all

[distant stag]

Are you using any other mods?

Or are you using a keyboard layout that doesn't have the default WSAD layout to move?

[timber coral]

I'm using that toggle flashlight with F mod

[distant stag]

Maybe try using it without any other mods and see if it works

[alpine glacier]

Ummm 😅

[distant stag]

haha yeah its not made for custom moons

not yet, at least

[alpine glacier]

Yeah xd

[timber coral]

The stun timer seems to be incorrect in some cases. What I mean by this is it might display and count down from 7 to 0 but those 7 seconds are 25 seconds long

example, turn off flashbang render, flashbang a coil and watch him

||also like all the stun grenade times on both wikis seem to be wrong wrong||

[bitter compass]

where?

im pretty sure i wrote that part

and i tested it

pretty sure this is correct

like 99%

[timber coral]

both mirahaze and fandom. i tested butler coil forestkeeper and oldbirds

Idk whats going on with the code but just stun a coil to see what i mean

[bitter compass]

the wiki with 99% accurate information is lethal.wiki

it has guides in it which should contain almost guaranteed true information

idk about other wikis

[timber coral]

didn't know this existed and wasn't referring to it

[distant stag]

Yet another wiki

(well it's for modding, so fair enough)

[torn bough]

sole wiki for mouthdog when

[sullen pilot]

how do you enable and disable different layers in freecam? like triggers and stuff

SPACE? SPACE?

[rough grail]

Skibidi

[torn bough]

❌

[distant stag]

Yepp

Arrow up and down to select

[timber coral]

@uneven stump do you know what's going on with your stuntimer display?

[alpine glacier]

Is it planned to add an option to visualize Interact triggers?

Also... The OOB option seems to be broken.

Is this known?

[distant stag]

you can already see them in the freecam (and also soon with the new map)

and ye, the OOB is not implemented yet, I removed the option in the new version

[alpine glacier]

I cannot see them though 🤔

No markers on doors, light switch, teleporter button, ...

Or anything I added InteractTriggers to

[distant stag]

you have to select the correct layers in the layer selector (L) while in freecam

Arrow up / down to navigate and space to select / deselect

[alpine glacier]

I selected all of them 😅

[distant stag]

are you talking about these?

[alpine glacier]

I'm talking about InteractTriggers

[distant stag]

ohh

uhm I can look into that

[alpine glacier]

That would be awesome!

Would help me a lot with my latest project

[distant stag]

would you happent o know how I can identify them? do they have a special layer or tag or do i have to go by script?

[alpine glacier]

GameObjects with the InteractTrigger component should have the InteractableObject layer and InteractTrigger tag

[distant stag]

alright, perfect, might be able to squeeze this into the next release

[drifting condor]

Hello, I have a little problem, I can't open the render settings menu when clicking on it

Am i doing smthg wrong ?

[distant stag]

The button just doesn't work? Are there any errors in the logs?

[drifting condor]

the log when i click on the button

But I just tested with lethal control disable and it work

It's seem that i can't open the render settings when I'm in control company mode

Same thing for the moons settings btw

[distant stag]

Yeah that's probably a mod incompatibility, feel free to open a GitHub issue

[drifting condor]

Well I don't know if it will really be necessary, once in the ship there will be no more problem

I wanted to know if it was possible to make the entities spawn somewhere other than our position, like make them spawn inside with a random position ?

[distant stag]

When in freecam, you can pick the location

But this feature is not yet released

Very soon

[drifting condor]

Oooh niiice

Thank you for this mod really, its was the only one I was waiting for. Now i can be the perfect host for my friends !

[distant stag]

Hahaha

[drifting condor]

I am actually stuck in random seed loading

[distant stag]

yeah, this is also fixed in the new version

[distant stag]

Imperium v0.1.6 [Beta] - The Map Update

Imperium now has its own isometric map and minimap!

Besides that, Imperium's UI got a complete overhaul with new components, better and more consistent alignment and brand new interface skins! There are currently 8 different interface skins to pick from.

I also reworked the night vision system to be more uniform and comfortable to use.

[boreal panther]

That is INSANE

Good job Emperor

That is such a good work you are doing here

you told me to look forward to the mod, well I got my eyes wide open

[distant stag]

Added

• Added a hybrid 2D/3D isometric map - Open with F8.
  • Added minimap - Open with M.
  • LMB - Look, RMB - Move, MMB - Zoom, R - Reset
• Added an option to prevent the ship from leaving automatically.
• Added eight new interface skins to pick from.
• Added option for host to allow or disallow Imperium commands from clients.
• Added visualization for interact triggers.

Changes

• Completely overhauled the look and feel of the Imperium interface.
• Reworked night vision to be more uniform and comfortable to use.
• The custom welcome message can now be turned off in the settings.

Internal Fixes

• Multiplayer works again!
• Security doors now correctly open and close.
• Fixed a bug where changing weathers was causing an exception on certain moons.
• Fixed the freecam teleport button in the Teleport UI.
• Fixed a bug where Oracle crashed when a vent was overwritten.

QOL Changes

• Teleport Indicator can now be toggled with T.
• The "Vent" category in the object explorer can now be collapsed properly.

Known Issues

• Switching between Unity Explorer and a Imperium UI directly breaks the cursor.
  • To fix, just open and close Unity Explorer once.
• Scanner overlays are broken at higher texture resolutions.

[oak venture]

Holy damn, nice work! Also btw, how easily do you think Imperium could be applied to other Unity Mono games? Or is it very much tied to LC? Not that I need it for other games, just curious

[distant stag]

Well since this is the first mod I made for any game, I am not sure how hard it would be to port it to another Unity game, most of the features are quite LC specific, though

[oak venture]

I see. How is the UI system built? Could that be reused at least?

[distant stag]

I built my own framework for the UI, and I do actually plan on moving that to it's own mod, as I think there is a clear lack of good (or any) UI frameworks for Unity modding

Not sure when that will be though, as my Imperium todo list still quite large and keeps growing with every release haha

[oak venture]

ah, nice! Yeah I think the only UI thing for Unity I know is UniverseLib from Unity Explorer, but yeah it's kinda deprecated, and the person who maintains the newest versions of Unity Explorer hasn't really done things to keep UniverseLib really alive for use by other people at least (like, it's not on NuGet for example)

But I could use a library for making Unity UI stuff, currently I'm just using OnGUI since it's the only thing I know and can be applied to non-unity stuff with some porting

[drifting condor]

lmao

[distant stag]

Yeah, I have looked at universe lib before, my UI framework actually integrates with mods that use universe lib, so you can use them seamlessly

But yeah, there are a lot of things that I don't really like about it / that could be better imo, especially from the developers perspective

[oak venture]

yeah I don't really know anything about it other than it exists lol

[alpine glacier]

The new Update is SICK!

There's just a few things that are a bit weird 😅

• Teleporting yourself to an item usually causes you to fall out of the map
• Teleporting items to you likes to cause the item to fall out of the map
• Teleporting things like vents and breaker boxes also places them into the ground
• Certain UIs cause the Minimap to render like the old one (Specifically the Moon Settings one. It's usually better to disable the Minimap while browsing the UI anyway though...)

I also think you left a spammy debug message in there xd
Dragging the map will cause "DRAGGGGGGG" to be spammed.

And changing the theme throws an exception.

Other then that... An insane Update ❤️

[distant stag]

wdym it renders like the old one?

that should literally not be possible as they are not related at all

[alpine glacier]

I'll make a screenshot next time

[torn bough]

🥳

[muted mauve]

could there be a way to zoom in and out further?

it sometimes doesnt cover the entire map

[distant stag]

do you even see anything when zooming this far out? lmao

[muted mauve]

it's because i'm trying to make a guiding map for all moons, and it doesn't zoom far out in a way that captures the entire map lol

[distant stag]

ohh, youre probably better off using the freecam for that tbh

you can change the FOV with LeftArrow and RightArrow to make it look more isometric

[muted mauve]

ohhhhh

i honestly didn't know that

thanks dude

[distant stag]

no worries!

[muted mauve]

also how do i check off the layers when in freecam?

[distant stag]

arrow up and down to navigate and space to select

[muted mauve]

i see i see,,

thanks!!

[distant stag]

Alright, I published a quick hotfix (v0.1.7) fixing these errors (except the map but I believe thats some kind of mod conflict)

[alpine glacier]

Testing it tomorrow, for now I'll go to bed

[distant stag]

also, not sure if you saw it, but i added the interact trigger visualization

[sullen pilot]

what in the world

[alpine glacier]

Hm?

[alpine glacier]

Yes, I saw that :3

[alpine glacier]

About the Minimap issue:
I was just an idiot.
For some reason, I had FeralMinimap installed.

I didn't install it via r2modman, causing me not being able to just search for it...

[alpine glacier]

I didn't notice that message 'till now xd

[serene marsh]

why nAbady told me about this

[distant stag]

Yeah, that's new, I added access control for imperium clients so the host can decide what clients can and can't do

[torn bough]

you should make a trust system so host can allow access to certain users mainly friends

[distant stag]

I am planning on adding more fine grained control later on, so you can give certain clients certain abilities

[torn bough]

(:

[manic ember]

is there a mod that makes the in ship map look this good? xD

[distant stag]

well it wouldn't be very hard to replace the real map with this, I am planning to move the map to it's own mod anyways but that will probably take some time

[manic ember]

thats cool, just when i saw the detail on it, i was like "thats nice", so figured its probably a mod in itself 😄

[distant stag]

the bugs arrived to consume your corpse

[distant stag]

haha yeah, not yet unfortunately

[torn bough]

yes

[alpine glacier]

I'm the host ;-;

[alpine glacier]

Also... No main entrance, eh?

[distant stag]

Did that happen after you left and rejoined a game?

[alpine glacier]

No, I just started the game

[distant stag]

LMAO

[distant stag]

I think I already fixed this problem but I didn't want to just push a new version with only this change

And I am currently on vacation so I won't be able to work on the next update for a few more days

[tight urchin]

I notice this happens when I use a profile including all of my regular mods, but doesnt happen when i do a brand new profile with just a few mods/moons.

This was my experience with the previous version of imperium tho, havent had the chance to use the latest update.

[distant stag]

Lol, I have never had this happen to me

Very interesting find..

Do you maybe have an exact mod list / an idea of what mod is causing it? I am assuming it has nothing to do with imperium tho (?)

[tight urchin]

No clue what causes it exactly, and I sincerely doubt its imperiums fault. When I get some free time, I'll try to see if I can narrow down what might be causing it.

[distant stag]

Would be interesting to know, but yeah, Imperium doesn't really mess with the levels at all (there was a problem with scrap spawning but that was fixed in the latest version)

[manic ember]

erm.. interesting question, is there any possibility that with the overlay for entities (or well anything)... if a mod were to detect that "imperium" is also loaded.. that it could add extra information to the overlays?

for example..

im testing something for my mod, so i spawn a masked, like in the picture above, i can see thier normal information.

what im suggesting is... allowing other mods, to give themselves compatibility with imperium.. so when the mod makers are testing.. they can add more information to that.. fed from their own mod.. so instead of having to check logs (like i am right now), they can just see it on screen?

in my case.. im having to reset the masked 1-40 times.. as on spawn, the personality changes.. if there was a way for me to be able to go "if imperium is also installed, add these variables to the masked".. then when i spawn a masked, they would show, and be updated from my mod..

is that possible already? possible in the future?

for me, it would be great.. i assume it would be beneficial for others too, perhaps for people creating their own monsters and need to perform checks that may not be normal.

edit:- i should add, i will still need to reset the masked many times, im just wondering if i can do it without trying to see through log spam every reset xD

[distant stag]

this sounds like an interesting extension

in general, I am working on a variable watchlist, like in the debugger

[manic ember]

glad you think so

[manic ember]

thats cool 🙂

[hazy gulch]

A quick q, if I want to disable imperium as the host just so all the hotkeys dont mess with my gameplay, is it possible?

[distant stag]

well currently it is due to a bug but its not intended lol

[hazy gulch]

What do you mean? Im currently using it

[distant stag]

you mean an option to turn off all keybinds?

[hazy gulch]

I mean, yeah just disable its keybinds and popups

Theres times where I want to use it and times I dont want it distracting me

[distant stag]

but how would you turn it back on when there is no keybinds anymore?

[hazy gulch]

Well Id assume thered be only 1 keybind to enable/disable

[distant stag]

hmmm, interesting idea

[hazy gulch]

Cuz like it seems to have a lot of buttons to it, and stuff like my F to use flashlight already conflicts with it

[distant stag]

in any case, this is not possible currently

[hazy gulch]

kk

[distant stag]

I plan to add input utils support in the future so you can rebind all the keys

this would probably fix this problem, right?

[hazy gulch]

I guess? More like it would mitigate it. I just want an option to hide it and turn off most of the keybinds until I press a button to unhide it if I need it later

Like I feel like if I tried to play normal LC with this on it would obstruct some things

Also as a q, I was looking at the f5 menu for the oracle stuff. And it said Wave 1 a thumper should spawn, as I spawned in the planet though it gave me a popup that said "Wave 1 nothing spawned >.<"

Does that mean something is messing with the monster spawns

Or else its just wrong, which is weird. I just observed a thumper spawn and then it told me nothing spawned in the wave

[distant stag]

so the thumper did spawn and the prediction was correct, but the spawn report popup was wrong?

[hazy gulch]

It spawned in a later wave where nothing was predicted to spawn, so thats odd too lol

Im just testing on Titan rn, and it predicted that C0 and C1 would have a thumper spawn, but I didnt notice entities till C2 where it predicted nothing, which is when I noticed the thumper

[distant stag]

did you check at the beginning of the day or right before it spawned? there are things that influence spawning in the game but oracle should update

[hazy gulch]

I checked when I first landed, and periodically

[distant stag]

hmm, interesting

well its not 100% stable yet as it's still beta but I can check it out

do you have any other mods?

if any other mods use the same RNGs as the spawning, everything will be off

[hazy gulch]

A lot of other mods, so I wasnt really bringing this up as a potential problem for your mod, I was just curious how accurate the oracle is

It seems more stuff is spawning now, so Im fine I guess

I was just worried the spawning was bugged for a second

Im guessing the oracle thing is based more on vanilla spawn predictions, not counting for potential modded spawn rates. I dont know if I have one of those or not, but I have a lot of mods so perhaps

[distant stag]

yeah, if other mods use the same RNG, you can't really rely on oracle anymore as I only account for vanilla code, the fact that the correct entity spawns but in the wrong cycle is a strong indicator that some other function is using one of the RNGs.
There are two RNGs, one is responsible for the entity types and one for spawn times / spawn locations and some other stuff

[distant stag]

yeah, correct

[manic ember]

a quick question, so im perfectly understanding..

the red line between a monster and yourself = they are tracking you, nothing more, nothing less, right?

[distant stag]

the red line points towards the targeted played, yep

[manic ember]

ah ok, i just saw when id gotten away from the monster it was still tracking me through walls, but i think its because of a long timer and i turned running speed up + maybe cause i gave it ears 😄

[distant stag]

I think it depends on the entity but I am not 100% sure, the line is only drawn when targetPlayer != null and movingTowardsTargetedPlayer == true

but as expected, there are probably inconsistencies between entities

[manic ember]

masked, and it is coming for me, i was just surprised, as i had gone around 3/4 corners, thought it was "it can see me", but targeted player makes more sense.. 🙂

[distant stag]

yeah, I am currently working on a rewrite of the visualization system

hopefully that makes it more intuitive in the future

[manic ember]

i think your mod is great already, so i look forward to the extra functionality that will provide 😄

[distant stag]

thanks! glad to hear that

[alpine glacier]

Air visualization update when? /joke

[distant stag]

me when the world is just a red block

[hazy gulch]

In freecam, is there anyway I can identify what one of the big trigger blocks around the ship does? Im debugging stuff rn

Like what is this trigger next to me and the cabinet

[distant stag]

you could probably use Unity Explorer to disable an object and see if it disappears

there unfortunately isn't really a way to identify an object yet

[hazy gulch]

Im not familiar with Unity Explorer, is that something else I have to get

[distant stag]

yeah, its a pretty cool mod that basically lets you do anything

but it's not super easy to use if you are not familiar with it

but it has an object explorer that lists the object hierarchy of the whole scene

Imperium works well with UE together

[hazy gulch]

Is there a way to see the triggers and stuff in my normal pov instead of the map?

[distant stag]

not currently, only in the map cam and freecam

you can use picture-in-picture mode tho, with X

[hazy gulch]

Cool, how do I edit the layers in freecam?

[distant stag]

arrow up / down and space to select

[hazy gulch]

Thx

[distant stag]

[distant stag]

Imperium v0.1.8 [Beta] - The Visualizer Update

I reworked the whole visualizer system and added a lot of new visualizers and indicators, including indicators for entity LOS and noise detection.

There is a new UI from which all visualizers can be managed!

Added

• Added many new visualizers for various game objects and layers.
• Added a new notification type for access control and spawning notifications.
• Added a new interface to manage all the visualizers in one place.
• Added entity LOS, proximity and noise detection visualizations.
• Added an option to disable out-of-bounds triggers.
• Added an option to unlock all unlockable items in the terminal shop.
• Added a scaling option for the minimap in the minimap settings.

QOL Changes

• Entity and Player info panels are now rendered in screen-space, resulting in higher resolution.
• The size of the visualizers for indoor and outdoor nodes has been decreased.
• Clamped the freecam movement speed between 1 and 200.
• Fixed a bug where changing the resolution would tank frames.

Internal Fixes

• Fixed a bug where Imperium client access would lock the host out.
• Fixed a bug where the render pipeline changed the aspect ratio of some screens.
• Fixed an issue where not all notifcations were toggleable.
• Fixed a bug where the map camera clipping would not adjust when in unlocked mode.

[hazy gulch]

Is there a way to set the interior of a level? Id guess not since thats part of the seed, but just wanted to ask

[distant stag]

There isn't a way to do that currently

[proper oyster]

lets GOOOOOOOOOO

[hazy gulch]

How do you reset the freecam to your character?

nvm

Its r lol

Is it possible to disable lighting in freecam or the map?

To just have it on unlit mode?

[distant stag]

wdym with unlit? if you were to turn off all the lights everything would be pitch black

[hazy gulch]

Thats why I clarified unlit, basically how it would look in the editor where everything is just fully lit by default

Thats how its called in some engines at least

Dont know what itd be referred to in unity

[distant stag]

I think this is not easily possible at runtime

at least not with the render pipeline of LC

[sullen pilot]

after setting a moon to clear this happened

fixed after i set experimentation t oclear

[bitter compass]

The testing level is considered the same as whatever level you're currently on

Before u land anyway

[hazy gulch]

Is this client sided?

[distant stag]

Most of the functionality is client sided, but there is multiplayer functionality
If you join a lobby with Imperium, the host needs to also have it installed + have Imperium client access enabled

[hazy gulch]

If just the host has it enabled, is that ok?

[torn bough]

think you made an oopie in the latest cuz
my friend and i testing and we couldn't join each other without the mod

also i got an error occurred
when pressing host button :1000quotastare:

[distant stag]

yes, you will not be able to use all features, and stuff like changing the time will cause severe desync as the clients don't get notified

but it works in general

I will add better, more intuitive support and better access control for this case in the next update

[hazy gulch]

Also yeah I can confirm all clients need it to connect

[distant stag]

All clients need to have imperium?

[torn bough]

yes and i sent you dm of stuff

[manic ember]

so.. when an entity enters the ship.. should it be registering as "in ship" rather than "outside"?

i recorded a video where the masked is supposed to ignore items anywhere except for "in the ship", they successfully did that (picked up an item in the ship, the only place its allowed).. but, the overlay always said "inside" or "outside", not "in ship", while if I as a player am in the ship, your mod tells me im in the ship.. thought i should point this out as i assume thats incorrect (that enemy entities do not register as in the ship when they are)

[bitter compass]

do enemy entities even have an in ship property?

im pretty sure they dont

otherwise they'd be able to also get grabbed when you're flying off 🤔 (unless zeekers does some extra handling there, also enemies arent meant to go inside the ship except very few so he probably didnt care enough to add it in, but i havent checked so i cant say)

[distant stag]

yeah, they do

[bitter compass]

oh that's surprising

[distant stag]

they have the same three identifiers, inShip, inElevator and inFactory as the player

[bitter compass]

ah my favourite property, inelevator

[distant stag]

hmm, interesting, all Imperium does is reading the variable that's defined in the entities' EnemyAI, I guess this is just a game inconsistency then

[distant stag]

for the longest time I thought they are identical but it turns out elevator is just the general area around the ship while ship or hangar refers to the ship insides

[manic ember]

i think the problem is different, and i think i worked it out.

[bitter compass]

wait wait how general are we talking

👀 this could be useful

[manic ember]

"isOutside" is a bool....false = inside, true=outside
there is a seperate bool... "isInPlayerShip"

oh i missed some of the conversation before i replied 😄

but yeah, they identify as inside/outside, everything else is a seperate check i think, so to define as "in the ship", would need to check "isInShip", not "isOutside".

[bitter compass]

also i just realised lol, how often do you maintain the wiki, are you any good at wiki's in general? we could use someone to help write stuff for lethal.wiki modding 🤭 (i can be really lazy but if directed ill write what needs to be added usually lol)

[distant stag]

let me find the screenshot

[bitter compass]

that'd be great

maybe i can use it to add area weight to the navmesh agent for my enemy

so they stay the fuck away

[distant stag]

yeah, that would probably work

[bitter compass]

i thought about baking my own navmesh around the ship with a patch

but i had to giveup halfway lol, patches are my weakest

[distant stag]

I am currently working on navmesh visualization in Imperium, might come in handy

[bitter compass]

that'd be sick yeah

i basically had no way of knowing if my patch worked tbh

[manic ember]

i used..

if (maskedEnemy.isInsidePlayerShip && !isHoldingObject)

to tell a specific personality in my mod, to pick up items only in the ship.. because their personality says "steal",but they brought an item to the ship, and then stole the same item out of the ship xD so now they dont pick up items, unless they are in the ship.

maskedEnemy is a ref to EnemyAI.

[bitter compass]

lol should just make it so they can't route to ship while holding an item or cant drop while on the ship

depending on what ur doing anyway

not 100% sure

[distant stag]

I think there is some special navmesh stuff going on that they are even able to access the ship, I forgot how it's called

maybe you can just disable that

[manic ember]

rewriting old code x.x wishing i wasnt.

some masked bring items to the ship.. but the one personality im editing atm.. i want it not to.

once ive finished fixing bugs.. and start writing AI for other mobs, ill probably re-write all the masked stuff better, like in the way you suggested, but for now its all about making things that exist, work xD

[bitter compass]

that's fair, one of the things i wanted to originally do in #1241786100201160784 was edit enemyAI (its still on the todo list) but i absolutely hate patches

i'd rather make a whole custom enemy, 3d model it, rig it, animate it, give it super great functionality, before i touch a patch

[manic ember]

well i was fine with patches til i had to work on an ovveridde for sound... but luckily im putting that on hold, until i fix whats broken (aka everything)

[bitter compass]

for sounds it looks like #1220501885753098250 did it pretty wel so u might wanna look at the source code for that

[manic ember]

erm.. so.. the way i understand it.. is..

the masked (at least) can climb ladders.. so if you route them to the terminal while landed.. they arent routing to the ship.. they are routing to the floor in the ship,.. while its landed.

the floor of the ship effectivly becomes a plane on the moon, so when the ship lands, it must be properly integreated with the moons surface so the masked (at least) can use the ladders/etc)

anything that cant use a ladder, i think needs an eyelessdog or baboon hawk style entry (geronimo?)

when the ship takes off, it is no longer part of the moon.. so the masked do not stay with it.

[manic ember]

will do.. but i already patched the audio... just not understanding why it seems so shit..

masked hear me.. but audio levels seem whack... but yeah maybe that mod will give me clues on improvement. 😄 thanks

[bitter compass]

icic, yeah good luck!

[distant stag]

but I think some special object exists that tells the game that the navmesh continues on the ship catwalk

like a navmesh bridge

otherwise it can't pathfind to it and it will never attempt to use the ladder iirc

[manic ember]

as i say.. the masked never really step on the ship, the ship has no navmesh.. i think its just.. a place on the moon is defined as "the ship"

[distant stag]

oh yeah, definitely

but I think its still disconnected

and somehow bridged

as its higher up

[distant stag]

I can't find the screenshot rn but I can get a new one later

[manic ember]

maybe, the question is, what if you could pause the ship, in midair, ebfore it lands, then spawn a monster and tell it to go "to the terminal" would it walk on thin air where the ship "should" be, or would it error?

[bitter compass]

okie thats fine

[manic ember]

all i will say is.. if you spawn a masked in the ship in orbit.. it wont move, but as you land... it moves like it does when you take off, which i felt gave insight into how that floor "is"

[distant stag]

it would walk on thin air

because the entities and the ship never actually collide iirc

[manic ember]

then.. in the ship = a fake status defined by the person who made the moon, surely?

[distant stag]

thats why they just phase through the ship when it leaves

[distant stag]

yes

i mean not sure actually

because there is also a trigger that keeps you in the ship when in space

[manic ember]

so if i made a moon and said "the ship is where the breaker box is in the interior" then when the monster goes near the breaker box its "in the ship"

[distant stag]

and that travels with the ship

[manic ember]

its not applied to monsters though i assume

[distant stag]

idk if they are different triggers or the same

i would have to check in the code how exactly the status is set

either by entering a bound

or by passing through a trigger

and they could either be parented to the ship or the moon

like the triggers that activate / deactivate the weather are all on the moon

[manic ember]

well, i think the monsters just ignore the bounds of the ship, while we dont. there is just extra bounds for the monsters, so they cant go through ship walls.. i d k, but thats how it seems to me.

[distant stag]

okay, I lied, for entities there is only isInsidePlayerShip and isOutside

plus, isInsidePlayerShip is never set, except when a masked is reverse TP'ed into the ship lol

[bitter compass]

loool

[distant stag]

so it makes sense, that it doesn't get updated when the masked walks into the ship

nevermind, I lied again

audio reverb triggers can also set it

[bitter compass]

pathological liar

damn

[distant stag]

not sure which ones or if any triggers actually do it, but technically its possible that a trigger updates the isInsidePlayerShip

I would have to check in the unity editor, its annoying to do it with just with the asset files

[manic ember]

so my mod should "update" that? 😄 because masked in my mod do walk into the ship. lol

(EnemyAI)maskedEnemy).isInsidePlayerShip

this is often the variable im pulling, so i would have thought the EnemyAI would know it already that its in the ship. i do not set this variable anywhere so i think it just naturally changes when the EnemyAI enter the ship.

[distant stag]

i wonder when it's actually set, because the functionality is there

[manic ember]

ill be loading up to test something in a second, let me spawn a masked in the ship, and see what it says.

[distant stag]

it might be tho, that isOutside overrides the check in Imperium

meaning, isOutside is still true even if isInsidePlayerShip is true

and for imperium, if something is outside, it cant also be in the ship

[manic ember]

well.. the ship is outside xD

[distant stag]

I can invert the logic and send you a fix if you want

[manic ember]

one sec, let me add in a little check of my own, to pull all those variables and output them to a log.. see what it says "in the ship"

well, if this is an indicator, i think ship is always outside.

did this in orbit..

[Debug :LethalIntelligence] LethalIntelligence.Patches.MaskedAIRevamp.Update @ isInsidePlayerShip=True
[Debug :LethalIntelligence] LethalIntelligence.Patches.MaskedAIRevamp.Update @ isOutside=True

[distant stag]

yeah, this makes more sense

so that means that there is an on stay trigger parented to the ship

[manic ember]

so some more info..

ship hasnt landed yet, spawned in mid air.. the masked is sort of a bit "under" the ship, phasing through the floor.
[Debug :LethalIntelligence] LethalIntelligence.Patches.MaskedAIRevamp.Update @ isInsidePlayerShip=False
[Debug :LethalIntelligence] LethalIntelligence.Patches.MaskedAIRevamp.Update @ isOutside=True

likewise... after landing..
[Debug :LethalIntelligence] LethalIntelligence.Patches.MaskedAIRevamp.Update @ isInsidePlayerShip=False
[Debug :LethalIntelligence] LethalIntelligence.Patches.MaskedAIRevamp.Update @ isOutside=True

so, maybe it doesnt update

im confused.. lmao

oh im an idiot.

the thing i was checking "isplayerShip" against originally.. was the item on the floor in the ship.. -_-

isInPlayerShip*

so... "isInPlayerShip" is the status for "in orbit"

[distant stag]

wut

[manic ember]

on the planet, the player ship doesnt exist... but if something is "isInPlayerShip=true" then i assume its registered to leave with the ship

[distant stag]

so the variable is never true when landed?

[manic ember]

more complex than that.

monsters dont register as in the ship
players do
items can do

but items also "can not".. like my masked drops an item in the ship, i dont think it registers as "in the ship"

so, when i thought i was checking masked in the ship... i was actually checking "that item is in the ship"

so they were never knowing they are in the ship, so your program is doing the right thing.. im just a doofus

[distant stag]

least convoluted zeekerss code

[manic ember]

on the bright side... this leads to a possible solution for telling something it can exist in the ship.. or shouldent enter the ship 🙂

[bitter compass]

my favourite part of the code was when he made a target player, and didnt network it

😎

in the enemyAI

[manic ember]

i assume when items are detected as "added" to the ship, it transfters items from the moon, to the ship.. players the same.. so.. can add other things to the ship.. or block them from going there maybe?

[manic ember]

could probably reverse patch that to make it work.

but reverse patches are not fun.

[bitter compass]

pft

no point

i just make a network variable

so much faster and easier

[distant stag]

i dont think zeekerss has found out about network variables yet

[bitter compass]

he doesnt use em, ever

lol

so yeah i would agree

[cyan granite]

im sorry if this has been asked a millon times but is the multiplayer fixed yet, or is the fully functional multiplayer coming back later on?

[distant stag]

Are you talking about the breakage that was introduced yesterday?

I have been busy but I'll have a look later

[cyan granite]

i dont mean to cause more confusion but im just talking about the multiplayer that got broken since runtime netcode patcher was deprecated, which was like after version 0.1.3 if im not wrong

[distant stag]

Ohh, I actually fixed this in v0.1.6

but it seems something broke again in v0.1.8 (the release from yesterday)

[cyan granite]

okay i actually did NOT know it was fixed that early, but alright thx for the info 👍

great job you're doing with this mod btw

[manic ember]

totally agree, without Imperium id be progressing with things so much slower!

[distant stag]

Thanks guys! It's really nice and motivating to get so much positive feedback

[manic ember]

i kind of feel like this is an easter egg, but, i figured id show this after what was just said.. xD i like to write things in funny ways 🙂

for debugging the many routes my mod goes down... i have an extra debug mode with very spammy logs (which auto turns on when imperium is installed so others should never get the log spam), when its turned on the logs say this.

[distant stag]

Also, I completely ignored this request and just now remembered lol
Well now that I am working on Imperium all the time, I do less wiki work but I still try to do my part and go over recent changes and admin stuff somewhat recently
But feel free to DM me about the modding wiki, I'd be glad to help

[bitter compass]

The modding wiki is a bit community maintained and has a few guides on it, I'm just lazy otherwise I'd update it with more guides xd

[distant stag]

AHAHA I love this, this is amazing!
I should really add more easter eggs myself, I haven't added...that many, so far

[distant stag]

Yeah, I used it plenty of times, especially for the netcode stuff it was really helpful!

[distant stag]

The only problem I see is that the wiki recommends to use DevTools aka. the default debug tool by zeekerss for debugging

[manic ember]

well as long as its not the actual easter eggs falling on my head as i load the game, im curious to see what easter eggs get found xD

[bitter compass]

Lol, DevTools includes stuff not just by zeekers

Imperium should def be the new recommended, but for simplicity I still use DevTools

The creator of it uses zeekers debugging tools and adds a few of their own, nothing huge like imperium's, but I havent had a need to switch uet

[distant stag]

You clearly haven't seen the minimap yet

But I didn't actually know that it adds more things, interesting

I have only ever really used dance tools, which was also the inspiration for Imperium

[bitter compass]

Yeah dancetools always been buggy so i never touched it lol

DevTools let's me do things like automate my position on game join, and what spawns etc so I can immediately test

[distant stag]

[bitter compass]

And also-

Not on the public release, but I can do weather magic stuff so I can test my weather out immediarely

[normal trench]

Speaking of quickstart, being able to speed up the ship/skip the cooldowns with it's movement would be neat

[bitter compass]

Not really a needed feature in imperium seeing that

Yknow

I'm the only custom weather developer

[distant stag]

You can do realtime adjustments to the weather in Imperium but only for vanilla weather unfortunately, back when I implemented it, I wasn't sure how to dynamically get the weather so it's still hard coded

It just uses the enum, right?

[bitter compass]

Icic, the weather effect enum

Alternatively I think just enabling the uh

Weather itself

Works

[distant stag]

Hmm, I will look into it, but if I manage to implement it, it will be possible to change the weather whenever, even after landing

but I assume devtools functions do that already anyways

[bitter compass]

Yeh lel

Is there an instant leave in imperium?

Like

Yoy pull lever to land

And u can pull lever immediately

Instead of waiting for ship to land

[distant stag]

You mean the landing and leaving animation?

[distant stag]

so it just leaves again immediately, while it's still in the landing animation?

[bitter compass]

Yeah

Cuz if I'm testing my weather on moons

[normal trench]

Also the delay between changing map and being able to pull the lever

[bitter compass]

It sucks waiting like 30 seconds to land

Then leaving again

Just to see if stuff like blacklisting the weather on specific moons etc working

[distant stag]

Yeah, tell me about it lol, could def use this myself
A side project of mine is to re-write the render pipeline and add more realistic and diverse vanilla weather and I spent way too much time already just waiting for the landing

[distant stag]

Yeah, that sounds like an interesting idea

It shouldn't be too hard to just skip the landing and leaving animation altogether

[bitter compass]

Vanilla weather code... sucks

[distant stag]

A lot of vanilla code sucks

I can't stop being mean towards zeekers, I actually love the game, its just that some stuff is really annoying lol

[distant stag]

Are you doing it manually or are you using LLL? LLL has a very nice system to add new weathers with the bitmasks

I haven't really spent much time on adding new content to the game as I was mainly focused on Imperium work so far

[bitter compass]

LLL? Has weather stuff?

I use LethalLib to register my weather lol, then ofc write the code for it etc

[distant stag]

Oh yeah, it was indeed lethal lib I was talking about

but LLL works on top of lethallib anyways, I think

[bitter compass]

LLL depends on LL so it can disable some LL functions lol

[distant stag]

I absolutely love how all the weather stuff is based on animations as well

I mean it makes it easy to just change the time of the day in Imperium and have all the weather effects adjust accordinly

[bitter compass]

Really? I haven't gotten into that, I really wanna figure out how to make my own skybox and sun with LL weathers

But I don't think LL allows for that and I'm not good enough of a coder to figure out patches etc for that lol

[distant stag]

yeah, skybox and sun disc is all dependent on an animation, I believe each weather, or at least type (eclipse, stormy, clear) has it's own animation

[bitter compass]

Yeah those do, I use eclipse for my weather but I'd have loved making my own

[distant stag]

the time scale for the animation is just the time of day lol

[bitter compass]

Lol

[distant stag]

you probably can with an asset bundle

and replace the animation with your own in the animation controller

[bitter compass]

Yeah but wouldn't thay break like custom moon animators etc?

Atleast I know a proper weather api is in the works

So it'll be more possible soon

[distant stag]

there is this sun animator boolean that holds the trigger for the transition to the weather animation, I believe you should be able to add your own animation and transition with your own trigger

so you wouldn't have to replace anything

[bitter compass]

Hmm adding the animation is what I'd struggle with lol, isn't the sunAnimatorBool using a predefined animation controller and I'd have to replace said animation controller?

[distant stag]

I mean...maybe, I thought you might be able to add an animation to an animation controller at runtime

But I am not sure about that, just an assumption

So far I made the experience that its possible to do basically anything at runtime somehow with Unity

[bitter compass]

Maybe, I don't think so sadly though

Well

Unity and code aint my expertise hehe

[distant stag]

Are you more on the modelling / animation side of modding, then?

[bitter compass]

I'm uh

Jack of all trades?

I make enemies, scrap, weathers, enemy replacements, umm

And I've done all sides of the coin lol

Modelling, animation, rigging, coding, unity

But I've only been doing this for a few months

So I'm pretty bad lol

[distant stag]

That's cool! I am kind of heavily focusing on coding and Unity internals

[bitter compass]

We definitely need people like that, it's very cool

[distant stag]

But yeah, I am also a kind of a rookie with Unity still, this is my first mod that I ever made for any game

I have had some experience with unity before but that was like 5 years ago when Unity was a lot worse lol

[bitter compass]

Also I think animation overriding is actually a bit of a big problem in this game lol, since item mods are starting to more and more make grab animations but overriding rather than adding (I was only able to override, but it was done so that it only overrides whole holding the item so its okie)

[bitter compass]

You're doing super well as far as I can see

[distant stag]

Hmm, interesting, I haven't really looked into animations yet

[distant stag]

Thanks! I try to mainly focus on user friendliness, as I have background in UX design

I am also planning on extracting the UI framework I built for Imperium into it's own mod so other people can build on top of it

[bitter compass]

It shows, just a lil bit XD

[bitter compass]

Oooh like a mod menu api?

[distant stag]

I really think a solid and easy to use UI framework is missing for Unity modding

[bitter compass]

I agree, unity is weak in that regard

[distant stag]

I guess you could call it that, just a framework that allows you do easily add a UI for your mod with predefined and event-based components

[bitter compass]

Oooh that'd be sick actually

[distant stag]

For maximum developer and user friendliness

[bitter compass]

Not sure what I'd use it for but I love UI's

[distant stag]

True!

I am of the rare kind that uses Linux but still appreciates nicely designed UIs lmao

usually people just go console only

[bitter compass]

Lol I know some super neat freaks that go to Linux to customise stuff insanelt

[distant stag]

Haha yeah, well it is nice for that

I just don't like to overuse console for everything

[bitter compass]

Fairs, I'll never understand the Linux mindset lol

I've worked a bit with other OS's back when I was slave labour for my Robotics club

But it was only minorly for like raspberry pis

[distant stag]

Sounds cool tho!

Haven't touched my Pis in so long, I just don't find any usecases anymore

[bitter compass]

Oh the only usecase was some arcade machine they wanted me to make lol

They had it almost completely setup, was supposed to take maybe like a couple days

Turns out it was assembled incorrectly, the software wasn't installed right, and the hardware wasn't connected properly lol

So after like 4 months I managed to make it work, was fun ig

[distant stag]

Haha oh god

Peak debugging experience I'd assume

[bitter compass]

Oh 100%, the amount of deep digging I had to do online for the software issues lol

Some silly hardware issues my dad would point out like the pin needed rotating 180* for whatever reason

[distant stag]

hahaha lol

btw, I just checked out your mod, giant specimens and it looks so cool! I definitey have to try this

Unfortunately I haven't properly played this game in a bit too long now as I have been so busy with coding lol

[bitter compass]

Lol same

300+ hours and last played is like a month and a half

[distant stag]

feel that 💀

do you use blender to create assets?

[bitter compass]

Hmm

Sometimes?

I used blender to model enemies and sfufd

Stuff*

But I cant model objects

So Ive started using unity store assets lol

I'm also like a horribly uncreative human lol, so I rely a lot on reference work to copy paste

[manic ember]

i know that feeling.. im probably the most uncreative in an "art/design" point of view out of anyone xD

[bitter compass]

Lol I'm probably worse, my imagination is soooo empty

[distant stag]

haha its the exact opposite for me, I always have to ask my friend for character models and animations

I mainly do environment and abstract animations, but I haven't had any motivation recently to do anything in blender sadly

[bitter compass]

I'm jealous, I'd love to do more items and maybe even moons and interiors but I just can't model environment and items 💔

Stuff like textures are baaaad for me too

Had to look for a long time online for good textures for my meteors lol

[distant stag]

Yeah, I haven't really looked at game assets at all

I usually do my materials in blender with nodes, but I need to bake that when I want to export it to unity and I haven't really done what before lol

and Blender sucks at baking, so I probably want to use substance, idk its just a lot of work lol

how do you do it?

[bitter compass]

I just bake with image texture and save the image as a png lol

But im also like, automatic UV, bad colours, etc

I'm glad I got people who do substance around me (only one person who's usually busy though), otherwise I'd be far behins

[distant stag]

Alright, alright

Maybe I should give Blender baking a chance, I have only heard about it being bad and wonky but I have never actually tried myself

Last time I used it I was really into geometry nodes, absolutely love that addition

[bitter compass]

Lol, yeah I'm no blender expert but I totally agree

[distant stag]

idk I use blender forever and there are still so many things I have never touched

I wish sometimes I had more motivation to just do stuff with it and get better at it

but I mean coding is also fun, especially c#

[bitter compass]

Mhm

Agreed

[pseudo sable]

yeah, a player is considered to be "in elevator" when the ship is their parent transform I believe

(although both things are probably changed by a trigger at once)

[distant stag]

yeah, I think so too

there are two sets of triggers, the outer ones and the inner ones

you should be able to see it with Imperium freecam and since yesterday also with dedicated visualizers

I had a screenshot somewhere but I can't find it anywhere now

[pseudo sable]

yeah, I think those show up with UnityExplorer free cam too if I remember correctly, although it's very crowded with those visible so it's hard to tell clearly which is which lol

[distant stag]

yeah, true

yeah, i think UE freecam is kinda crowded too, thats why I tried to make it a bit less overloaded

[cursive wren]

client side?\

[manic ember]

when i was in the ship imperium said "in ship (alone)", when i was on the ledge outside the ship i was in "elevator (alone)", so i thought elevator was the ledge.

[pseudo sable]

the player's state isn't mutually exclusive enums, so that's not how it works really

since they're three booleans, you can possibly be in an invalid state of in factory and in ship, or in ship but not in elevator

treating those as mutually exclusive means that some of that information is lost in the visualization, but normally it doesn't matter and you can assume that if the player is in the ship they are also in the elevator

it doesn't set in elevator to false when you enter the ship room

[manic ember]

yeah, i figured it was a case of multiple booleans, just didnt realise so many existed. i only noticed "elevator" about 2 hours ago for the first time.. so only just now realising (from what your saying) that.. Ship is in Elevator, which is in "outside".

[distant stag]

yeah, I made it so it's ship > elevator > factory

which covers pretty much all practical cases

[pseudo sable]

yeah, it's probably the most reasonable way to do it unless you abbreviate them and make checkboxes or something

even that could look a little overwhelming

might be nice in the current visualization to have it detect unexpected states though, since it can happen with mods

[distant stag]

yeah, I guess that could be an advanced version or something

[cyan granite]

uhh idk if this is intentional or just a bug with modded moons, but is the pause timer option supposed to be just completely inaccessible?

[distant stag]

even after landing?

[cyan granite]

yes, even after landing

[distant stag]

hmm, that's not intentional

are you playing in singleplayer?

could you maybe provide some logs?

[cyan granite]

yeah sure, just give me a minute

and yes im playing in singleplayer

[cyan granite]

yeah nevermind about it

for some reason loading into a save file twice seemed to fix it

[oak venture]

But yeah, feel free to open a pull request to add Imperium as a recommended mod! I've also thought about adding it to the page, but I've not actually really used Imperium since I've not done LC modding so I've not done it

[distant stag]

Cool, thanks!

[distant stag]

Well, the original intention was to make a mod to observe and test vanilla functionally for the Wiki but a lot of people wanted to use it for mod testing sooo

I guess it can be used for either, now that it actually works well with a lot of other mods

[oak venture]

Oh, that's interesting! And btw I'm the developer of DevTools, and that tool is really just a tool to make developing custom enemies faster lol

[distant stag]

Ohhh, I see

I thought I've seen your name before

I might take some inspiration for some future features of Imperium if you don't mind

We talked about the faster landing and taking off feature earlier

I haven't got the chance to try it out myself yet

[oak venture]

I absolutely don't mind! :3
But also, DevTools is a horribly designed software, I've got a new API that's a million times better at what DevTools did lol (dev tools was kinda like an API, it didn't have the functionality)

[distant stag]

Is that out yet or is it still WIP?

[oak venture]

But yeah I was also thinking of this, but I don't really know how the ship movement works. I'd guess it's an animation in unity

[distant stag]

Yeah, I will look at it tomorrow, I'll let you know!

[oak venture]

partly out, but I don't wanna release the API publicly because I still have some design desicions I'm not 100% sure about, but it's here: https://github.com/Hamunii/ModMenuAPI

[oak venture]

okay! :3

[distant stag]

Ohh I see, this looks interesting!