Changes to VoIP/proximity chat

[coarse pine]

Instead of just having VoIP/proximity chat, can we have multiple channels and an additional keybind for channel selector.
So quite a few times I have sqaud'd up with a rando, but if we chat it is also proximity (everyone else around can hear) so often resort to messaging (which has got me killed a couple of times).
My suggestion (taken from Arma 3 actually) is to have the following channels:
• Global = This would be the proximity chat (anyone can hear you) for those occasions it's needed.
• Squad = Only squad members can hear it.
• Faction = This is to interact with fellow faction members in the field without using proximity.
Faction chat probably should have a radius, otherwise every man and his dog will be shitting down the channel for attention (this happens in Arma 3 & Ref)
This would also lend itself to us carrying actual radio's and the fun gameplay they could bring.

[tepid bronze]

I am opposed to any voice system that sends chatter to a squadmate/teammate that isn't also audible to enemies in the area. It's unrealistic and can be too easily turned into a gamey aspect of an otherwise realistic implementation. I'd love to have radio items like Reforger has at some point down the line, but until those get added the current system works fine IMO.

[frosty wolf]

Definitely second this reforger perfected the radio aspect

[dreamy wharf]

While I don't necessarily disagree with the philosophy behind this stance, I think a completely reasonable counterpoint is that there are a lot of people that will coordinate and chat via external tools like discord and that means they have a distinct advantage over players that are required to use in-game tools that project comms to the entire area.

In effect, if you're not using external tools, you're discouraged from using VOIP at all.

[nocturne juniper]

Id be all for different radio bands, as long as it also spoke in proximity at the same time. At no point should you be able to talk in game on the radio and not have your voice be audible to people nearby

[weak totem]

I think if you have a mic plugged in and its detecting audio that it should be put into voip. This would stop people from cheating using tools like discord since it would still be projected. The sad reality is the noise polution would be abysmal though so it wont ever happen.

[nocturne juniper]

that would lead to us just hearing people yelling in the background and just all sorts of issues.

[weak totem]

Exactly what I said. Thank you for highlighting that!

[nocturne juniper]

i did miss your last sentence there, but yeah, thats why it would be bad lol

apologies there

[weak totem]

No all good lol

I thinks selective voip has been such an interesting topic. There are tons of games that suffer by people just using discord instead sometimes really destroying the communication for those that are part of the team but aren't in the discord. Example being hell let loose. Gzw pvp im sure really is an interesting situation as there is such an advantage to not using voip.

Arma 3 using TS for TFAR and ACRE did it right imo

[dreamy wharf]

Players absolutely should have control over which apps have access to whatever audio devices they see fit and it's wild to suggest anything to the contrary.

On top of that, framing discord as "cheating" is one of the crazier hot takes we've seen in a while.

[weak totem]

If individuals are using voip which allows for enemy players to hear but others are using an outside program to circumvent that it's the same as cheating. If this idea challenges your views than I suggest you think on the logic and we can chat more on it!

[weak totem]

You literally described how it gives them an unfair advantage here. We call unfair advantages cheating.

[tepid bronze]

that is... certainly a take

games releasing into a post-Discord world (and, if you cast your memory even farther back, IRC, Skype, etc) must reckon with its existence. framing it as cheating is kinda wild, because it literally isn't, it doesn't provide any awareness or skill by its own merit. it's simply a fact of gaming that games should recognize exists while they're setting up the fundamentals of ingame communication.

[dreamy wharf]

ventrilo

[tepid bronze]

oh god ventrilo

[weak totem]

I completely agree that games must now take it into account. The pure fact though is that if people are using a tool like discord to bypass the fact that if they talk to each other in game than the enemy can hear them its on the same lines of cheating.

My comment originally was aimed at the only way to combat that is to make it so that no matter what if there is an input device than the game transmits it as voip. I also identify how terrible that strategy would be as you would get so many people that dont play in a quiet environment or have their mics so sensitive it picks up their mouse clicking.

Either way its a tricky situation. I personally love the idea of immersive voip that everyone can hear. One of my favorite parts of Arma 3 is the use of mods like ACRE and TFAR.

[dreamy wharf]

It's way worse than "people not in quiet environments" because tons of rigs have MANY audio inputs.

Almost every webcam comes with an audio input. Tons of headsets come with audio inputs. Laptops typically have audio inputs. As do some weird monitors. And those are just the "built-in" ones and don't count people that have actual dedicated microphones.

If you fed audio into the game from every audio device, it would be a cacophony of chaos.

Even if you ignore the fact that people should 100% have agency to decide exactly what telemetry they send to which services, it's a completely unworkable suggestion from the ground up.

[weak totem]

True, even if you only fed the default device then people would bypass it by muting their default devices mic hardware and then using a different mic for discord. The issue always will come down to humans unethically bypassing systems to gain an advantage. Sad but it is reality eh

[dreamy wharf]

You're exactly correct re: default audio inputs.

But a lot of people use Discord because it's more convenient for them and that's what they're comfortable using. For most folks, they're not trying to cheat the system at all.

This is ultimately why I don't think it makes sense to have AI respond to in-game audio - because some folks will always bypass it (no matter the reason for their intention) and I don't want to see adhoc squads be penalized just because they happened to meet each other today.

[high pine]

did not read any of these comments at all but take a system like Squad (local, squad channels/keybinds) and allow everyone to see who is in what squad and who the squad leader is - squad leaders have a dedicated vc/channel to coordinate - ofc all these have the option to mute any asshat that is blasting music at 200db or similar

[latent hamlet]

That's a good way to drop into a discussion, "didn't read anything, but here's my take, read it."

[high pine]

thanks

i try my best

😁

I agree with most of the points here, except that instead of making players 'heard; in voip when speaking into a radio, have it that they can be heard, but its also much quieter with a shorter range, to 'simulate' speaking into a radio instead of a radio hearing you speaking. This would slightly balance out the 'disadvantage' of using a radio and being heard in local but not give anyone else an advantage by making it able to be heard miles away.

sadly theres not much games can actually do about people using discord other than make in game alternatives attractive/viable (no grainy sound, accessible controls/features, etc)

[final juniper]

Hard agree. Reforger perfected the voice chat/radio system. Should be the gold standard for any tactical shooter imo

[wild vortex]

i like the current voip, but radios would be a nice add. it keeps the realism and tension up for me knowing that everything I say will be heard by OPFOR. Even if radios were added, I like the idea that enemies can still hear me like they would IRL. Much like ArmA and DayZ

[coarse pine]

If GZW is to have voip/radios then to overcome apps like discord (nothing wrong with using it) /or other apps that effectively silent comms then GZW needs to add a mic detection system like in Antidote so no matter what comms you use its heard in game. But I can imagine all the dickheadery noise whilst in base so noise cancelling needs to shut that shit up too