RenoDX: Wuthering Waves

[stark topaz]

i mean, he also mention high FPS, does it really look better with high FPS if motion blur is properly applied ? cuz bad implementation is on thing, but add the need for high FPS ? eh i never had that in my games for years XD

i can do it now with a proper PC build

[stark topaz]

oh yeah is like night and day holly hell

[umbral granite]

its equivalent of giga increasing motion strength

just like most things, an excess of something isnt good

but subtle implementations

[stark topaz]

agree, this looks so much better

[stark topaz]

but way do they still make this mistake then? do they wanna players to always hate Motion blur XD

[umbral granite]

🤷‍♂️

One reason is because different users will have different framerates

so I dunno, they want to keep it consistent

so they use the lowest common denominator

which is 30

that or since it is the default UE settings they just leave it as is

[stark topaz]

right, i was wondering way the FPS requirment, i guess they have yet to make it adaptive or something to make motion blur not look like ass dispite FPS differences

[frank heart]

low fps motion blur is also decent

but then again

depends on the person

if you dont like it

you dont like it

i love that shit

gimme all that CA and grain and blur and fake camera scratches

[umbral granite]

Dis you?

[frank heart]

yes

[stark topaz]

ok, grain i just HATE that! whats the purpose of it in a bloody game?

i can understand it in movies

[umbral granite]

Helps with debanding

Also adds noise to stop the presentation from being 'clean'

Same reason why noise is used in music

Since the early days of music recording, everything was done to remove unwanted noise

Once we got to the Digital age, we completely removed all perceivable noise

But people quickly started to dislike the 'clinical' sound of Digital audio

The imperfections of old e.g noise add 'character'

[subtle warren]

40-50 perf loss over default rt or no rt?

[umbral granite]

Over the highest default RT

That was partially because whoever made the ini used Lumen.ScreenProbeGather.DownsampleFactor=8

Changing that to 24 brought the delta closer to 20%

And I can't notice a difference

Overall the only thing out of the RT commands that makes a noticeable difference to me is r.Lumen.Reflections.SmoothBias=1.0

It's what is adding those extra reflections on the stone wall on the left

RR in this game doesn't do much other than eat perf

[subtle warren]

ill try tht config

[umbral granite]

I haven't played a lot of this game but from what I can see, an update this year completely destroyed draw distance

Even with the increased draw distance commands

NPCs are still pop in 10 metres in front of me

Shadows are also popping in randomly

[subtle warren]

that drove me nuts, its been like that since 1.2, me, a motion blur lover

@umbral granite is motion.blur max=5 the maximum value?

[umbral granite]

yep

Trey posted these for Oblivion Remaster

I use it in every UE game

Depending I might change the MotionBlur.Amount

to 0.25 to simulate 90 degree shutter angle

[subtle warren]

I put it at 0.90 instead

[inner path]

This game's RT shadows have a lot of noise, but it's much better after turning on RR

But the performance overhead is also quite large, with frame rates dropping by about 20fps

And the CPU bottleneck is quite severe; my 9700x often can't fully utilize the 4070s

Are there any ini codes to alleviate the CPU bottleneck caused by enabling RT in this game?

[autumn jetty]

RT is kinda broken in this game, the reflections and GI can look nice tho

but not everywhere

[subtle warren]

@umbral granite that motion blur setting is so good thanks🤌🏿

[umbral granite]

Now we wait for FG fix

[frank heart]

Its always been like

That

[subtle warren]

I mean the motion blur missing on characters

[frank heart]

yes motion blur has always been missing on characters

jianxin's BALLS were the only things getting motion blurred since 1.0

[subtle warren]

im gonna show you a recording i recorded 1.1 update

i been keeping track of motion blur since 1.0

https://youtu.be/hbibriE5gdc?si=_kR55ixsjy2dnlxy

@frank heart

1.2 update

Completely gone🤬

[stark topaz]

Oh

Damn, how dare they rob you of Character motion blur :3

Jokes aside, i don’t get way that decision was made?

[subtle warren]

Same, maybe they thought characters could get more motion clarity or something? I don't even know

Even npcs

Everything was perfect

[frank heart]

Interesting

If they can remove it then they can add it back

go ahead and find what variables they used

[subtle warren]

we did try to find it but brandy says its not worth it since almost no one in the group use it

[frank heart]

nag him more

[subtle warren]

Exactly what i did a while ago and he told me to stop

But I'm gonna try ask in the group again

[autumn jetty]

Because of the screenshot competition

they didnt want the characters to look distorted while taking screenshots

[naive delta]

Yeah I know. Every Chinese game except wuwa uses lua to call blueprints because it's many times faster to develop. But I'm not directly interacting with their lua. Uevr hooks the blueprint/c++ API and gives us a lua/c++ scripting API that can do all the same things so it's kinda pointless to mess with it. I would like to get their unencrypted lua scripts for analysis but the stuff I found in GitHub does not work lol

I'm making pose tools

UUU already has great pose tools but it has to be injected by its own tool or the mod never activates

[stark topaz]

Damn, now that kinda makes sense? Not but i guess some wanna have a screenshot with the Character not in blur but everything else in blur? And if they do not wanna blur at all just disable, i guess that can make sense!……..then way not add 2 blur options? How hard is that to do XD

[stark topaz]

You could try to find some one does the same thing as Brandy with the config >.> and ask them to find the line for it

[subtle warren]

Where do I find someone like that tho?

[stark topaz]

Yeah, i know, but better that getting kicked out of the server by Brandy XD

OR you could try to bribe pay him

:3

THAT might actualy work

If your that dedicated to it

[subtle warren]

I proposed him money but still refused ain't no convincing that guy fr, i gave up lol

[stark topaz]

WAIT way !

Its money

T^T

Not like he does it for free

[subtle warren]

Like... it's coding and stuff worse than money

[stark topaz]

Oh

[subtle warren]

?

[stark topaz]

Ok i guess the amount of money will not had been enough

XD

[subtle warren]

I just told him I'd give him money, he didn't even ask me how much lol

He doesn't care

[stark topaz]

Yeah

Oh well

I guess you could try to learn how to find it ? Get some idea were to look for it and do it yourself

That is kinda the only thing you can do at the moment

Or pray kuro gives you the character motion blur back

OR get some one lese

XD

[subtle warren]

No cvar can fix that tho, they messed with the skeletal mesh probably

[stark topaz]

Aaaaa

[subtle warren]

We just gotta hope they fix it

Unless it was intentional

[stark topaz]

See i kinda now understand way brandy won’t wanna bother with it, way to complcated

[subtle warren]

Probably

https://youtu.be/zicNbn3s_jE?si=Vyt10DBommM6Ad4c

Jinhsi's moves looked so clean with motion blur

Now it does not give that impact anymore

[stark topaz]

4k monitors are cheap now a day, what is NOT cheap is the bloody 5080 or 5090

T^T

[stark topaz]

Does that make motion blur in wuwa not worth it ? Cuz i was thinking on try thous settings you guys use for Motion blur

[subtle warren]

You should use it tbh, it looks good on those settings, too bad no character is under its effect

[stark topaz]

r.MotionBlurQuality=2
r.MotionBlurSeparable=1
r.MotionBlur.Amount=0.33
r.MotionBlur.TargetFPS=0
r.MotionBlur.Max=5

is this ones no?

[subtle warren]

Yup

[stark topaz]

Do you use the same amount in motion blur?

[umbral granite]

Based Motion Blur Off chad

[stark topaz]

I got the motion blur values from the config you send, way do you have Quality to 2 and not 4?

[umbral granite]

🤷‍♂️ that's what Trey posted

I didn't experiment with the values outside of Blur.Amount

[stark topaz]

Should try 4, no reason to set the quality that low, what matters from looking on the internet is the amount of motion blur you set up, and the FPS target

4 being max :3

[subtle warren]

I put it to 1.00

What y'all can you is spam this issue through wuwa support via email

I sent an email

But no response

[frank heart]

Fill it out in survey

But its likely they excluded motion blur for skeletal meshes

And its hardcoded in the build

I looked at some variables related to velocity and vertex deformation but none work so u just need to spam 100 surveys bud

It could be a kusogames exclusive

If you have logs from 1.1

I can take a look

and check what variable changed

[dull flame]

nc kusogames

[subtle warren]

Where do I see the logs?

[subtle warren]

I'll try that

[umbral granite]

@frank heart any clue what r.NGX.DLSS.DilateMotionVectors=0 is doing?

Saw it mentioned on Optiscaler git

for UE titles

I am not finding anything on the streamline FG implementation page for what this does

[naive delta]

Hi 👋

you want to mess with config stuff?

I can unlock the in-game console for you

[frank heart]

For opti's XeFG and Output scaling

Scaling

Needs on undliated motion vegotors

Motion vegetables

[frank heart]

Thats a step but he wants the solution

[naive delta]

You just want motion blur added to the character meshes?

[frank heart]

Yeag

Thafs what he wants

Basically

[umbral granite]

So this whole time inspector wasn't changing the FG factor for some reason

Forcing it via the the NV cope app works

[frank heart]

Reno dix fg reshade out yet homie

[umbral granite]

I am just testing it

https://tenor.com/view/flickering-power-outage-gif-10762113

Game does look like this atm

[frank heart]

LOL

Premier FG™ experience

[peak geyser]

Will look like that till Reno upgrade.

[frank heart]

He's testing it

[peak geyser]

LS works tho if you just want to play with FG.
Obviously there are limitations with that method. But it's the only way to use FG with Reno atm.

[peak geyser]

Oh. XD

[umbral granite]

Doesn't happen with RTX HDR 😌

[peak geyser]

Preaching to choir then.

[subtle warren]

Alrightt

[peak geyser]

Suppose that makes sense since they are both Ngreedia techs. XP

[subtle warren]

Ciao

[frank heart]

I dont have VRR right now

[subtle warren]

Exactly

[frank heart]

So im stuck with LS

[umbral granite]

Indeed True_HDR doesn't have these problems, unlike ReeNoo DeeEggs

[subtle warren]

Are you able to or? @naive delta

[frank heart]

I dont think id be play any fixed refresh monitor these days

Without LS

Cheat code

[peak geyser]

I assume you are talking about adaptive mode?

[frank heart]

Yeah

[umbral granite]

Just cap at 30FPS and enjoy

[frank heart]

With VRR non adaptive is fine

Transformerslop still looked smooth and responsive with non adsptove frame rate

[umbral granite]

What Jensen needs to do is fix the disocclusion with transslop

On characters

[frank heart]

Make transslop adaptive

[umbral granite]

Bro

I don't care

I cap to a locked framerate anyways

[frank heart]

I cap too

But frame rate drops are inevitable

[umbral granite]

I don't need your fluctuations zoom zoom

[frank heart]

With my am4slop

I dont have am5x3dslop sadly

[umbral granite]

https://tenor.com/view/megamind-gif-26070434

No X3D?

[frank heart]

Dont even have a monitor

Doing reno dix testing on 14.5" laptop OLED

[umbral granite]

Neuralink?

Neuralink with Reno MFG flicker would go hard

https://tenor.com/view/cat-gif-8549582021312950181

[frank heart]

Check output

"Is he having a stroke"

"No thats just renoslop flickering"

Do you know even ultrabooks have VRR now

I was born in the wrong generation

[umbral granite]

Born too early to experience chad CRT

Born too late to experience full AI neural rendering on MicroLED

Born just in time for #40385034 remaster, no VRR and stuttering alongside Reno flicker

[frank heart]

Id take VRR

3 months after i buy my lenovo slop

They come out with the same screen

But with trueblack 600 insyead of 500

And 15-120hz vrr

[umbral granite]

TB1000 when?

With pulsar

And whatever other jank Jensen can come up with

[frank heart]

We already have it?

Just stream from your oled ipad pro

[umbral granite]

I don't use appleshit

[frank heart]

I havent had a chance to try

Those chyna phones

with 6000 nits peak

[subtle warren]

There is no log of 2024@frank heart

[naive delta]

Might have to do a little digging but yes I am looking into it. I can basically do whatever to this game as far as executing code client side

[naive delta]

Well I mentioned the console because Brandy's whole thing is configs and I can just do that live

Plus they force reset some values at startup

There are a couple cvars that seemed promising, one to enable per bone motion blur and one called shearanim but the second one made my characters disappear lol

the world motion blur is too strong to see if perbone motion blur was enough

There's a patch in like 2 days? so if I don't figure it out quick I'll just wait until then

[frank heart]

Does the per bone one work

video would be nice

Do with the motionblur.targetfps=0 for auto proper shutter

[languid dome]

We should probably talk about IN on DMs but...
Through the power of patching IGCSClient.exe and manually injecting UUU myself, i think i got it working?
It failed to find a required function for the pose tools tho

[stark topaz]

@frank heart tomorrow after work i will be able to do the shader dump, so what area in WuWa will you do the shader dump?

I won’t be able to do the 2.6 area, since i wanna take my time enjoying 2.6 :3

[tough ember]

Coordination

[stark topaz]

:3

[tough ember]

Not that anyone needs to, but I feel with how many shaders this game has and how frequently they’re updated, we might benefit from a spreadsheet that has a description of the shaders we have to get each update and their current hash

[stark topaz]

How much does it matter if i do not have as many characters? I got some one to lend me his acc so he has more limited 5 stars

Yeah a good idea :3

[tough ember]

There aren’t that many characters with specific shaders and some are shared between others

[stark topaz]

I only have 2 limited characters XD so i take the safe bet and gonna use that borrow acc

Oh, damn, i forgot, what if like you said, some shaders are shared! Won’t i end up getting the same sharer dump ? Like is there a way to know when i have the shared shader ?

[umbral granite]

Gatchas really went from this

To this

[autumn jetty]

AAA quality environments character animations, sound design

[umbral granite]

I havent played any gatchas other than ZZZ and Wuwa but the general quality is 100% tier for F2P titles

[autumn jetty]

the story is usually weak by normal game standard, even in wuwa

[frank heart]

i taught him how to do it so I can kick back and sip a martini

[tough ember]

Oh, that’s fine - there’s no harm in dumping the same shader twice. You’ll know because they’ll have the same name. Them being shared only makes things easier.

[tough ember]

YAHOO!

[stark topaz]

after the update, by name i will see the shared shader, but after another update the name changes?, that is nice :3 at least per update we can differentiate the shared shader

[stark topaz]

will you be doing shader dump tomorrow? cuz i wanna know if so what area should i do so we can cover more area :3

[tough ember]

Yes, unfortunately the name does change with each update (the names are what RenoDX uses to replace them), so then we need to re-discover the new names and I need to patch them again.

[frank heart]

No

Because it wont break

https://tenor.com/view/copium-meme-pepe-frog-gif-26117735

[frank heart]

update hit

I'll launch to see

if the shaders cahnged

oh yeah baby

that's it

@stark topaz time to work slave

@tough ember NEW LUTBUILDERS

AND NEW OUTPUT SHADERS

it's all ORIGINAL

[tropic oyster]

😭

[languid dome]

Probably a cbuffer changed

For every shader to break, that's usually the reason.

[languid dome]

No new ace lmao

[frank heart]

they did add FSR and updated xess and updated mfg

[languid dome]

That by itself wouldn't have broken the tone mapping shaders

They probably did other changes behind the scenes

[frank heart]

probably

the game does look slightly different

when I booted it post patch

[peak geyser]

Why is this game so cursed?.....

[frank heart]

it is what it is

[tough ember]

Nothing new about everything being new 💀

[umbral granite]

We wait now

[tough ember]

I wish there was a definitive way to know if there’s any point in not cleaning out shaders from previous patches so they don’t needlessly clutter the addon files.

[umbral granite]

and we wait for FG fix

[peak geyser]

This plugin every WuWa update...

[umbral granite]

could always play in SDR

[peak geyser]

Me playing in SDR:

[frank heart]

Im gonna kick back

No 24h patch

https://tenor.com/view/drinking-martini-olives-sitting-alone-gif-22183783

[tough ember]

RIP 0x271E my GOAT

Last seen in SM5

[peak geyser]

That didn't take long. lol

[tough ember]

I’ve not looked at the code for dumping LUT shaders, but I wonder how hard it would be to instead have similar logic but instead dump the last X shaders affecting the render, like 3 for example would catch probably 99% of what I end up patching

[frank heart]

Last 1 shader after the lutbuilder

Should almost always work

Do you need the activation condition

[tough ember]

there are those weird ones where it'll be like lutbuilder -> radial blur -> character-specific ult

[tough ember]

when you dump?

[frank heart]

Yeah if I give you a random shader could you match it with the old shader if i dont tell you how i got it (like using a specific move)

[tough ember]

yes

i've got a good grasp on the different variants now, so just spitting the files out in here will be fine

[frank heart]

KK

actually this will be a better way to do this

@stark topaz you can dump all dx11 shaders bud

[autumn jetty]

unrelated but https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fO8CXkQL68A 8+ hours long livestream

"livesteam"

[stark topaz]

sure :3 you just need to wait 11 hours, and after work i will do it

will you do dx12?

[frank heart]

yes i do dx12

[frank heart]

huh

i should zip this

and these two dumps

need these before I start dumping anything else

[frank heart]

nevermind

I lied

every relevant sm6 output shader up to now

thats gotta be a record

[autumn jetty]

they changed something

DLSS ghosting is really really horrible now

this is next level bad lol

something is definitely not right

ahh no

it's the RTGI

they messed up the denoiser to be "faster"

@shy bison Hey! Can you help? What can we do to fix RTGI in UE games ? 😭

they completely ruined RTGI in the lastest Wuwa patch

[subtle warren]

Isn't it the the ambien occulution cvar doing that?

[autumn jetty]

disabling RTGI fixes it

but not sure

the game is literally unplayable with RTGI atm

[shy bison]

it depends on what the implementation is

can you dump the RTGI cvars

[autumn jetty]

it seems to be region depended too

[autumn jetty]

is there a safe way to do it?

it's an always online game with anti cheat

[shy bison]

oh

ugh

does it let you use an engine ini

[autumn jetty]

yes

[shy bison]

if you had a dump of the configs from fmodel in both versions that might indicate something

but generally r.raytracing.globalillumination.screenpercentage 100

...denoiser 1

r.raytracing.globalillumination 2

but if that have a custom implementation a lot things can be rather different

[autumn jetty]

and it's UE4 btw 😄

it's kinda weird, because the newer regions look fine, no RTGI issue

Thanks I will play with these settings

[umbral granite]

UE4 with a lot of stuff bsckported from UE5

They had a talk back in 2023

The game accepts Lumen commands for instance

[umbral granite]

Are the regions where it happens typically heavier in perf?

the shittification continues

First they gimped draw distance

Now RTGI is rip

Wonder if it will be rip on my side with my engine.ini and RR as well

[autumn jetty]

nope it's just the main city in the first region

GPU is at 50% usage or something

[autumn jetty]

I have to try RR

that has the potential to fix the issue

[umbral granite]

That's the only area I've been to

[autumn jetty]

newer regions are fine

[autumn jetty]

; Lower values reduce ghosting from characters when near a wall/foliage for RT GI but increase flickering artifacts
; Default - 0.05 (Low & Medium) | 0.03 (High)
r.Lumen.ScreenProbeGather.Temporal.DistanceThreshold=0.005

; Use async compute for reflections, may improve performance for some GPUs
; 0 = Disable (Default), 1 = Enable
r.Lumen.Reflections.AsyncCompute=1

; 0 = Disable, 1 = Enable (Default)
; Turning this off fixes SSR-like problems (e.g. blocky character/object shadows) but some objects do not get reflected anymore
r.Lumen.Reflections.ScreenTraces=0

[tough ember]

thank you boss, i'll get to this today

[umbral granite]

Screentraces is awful,IT的是了个av的角度看地

Umm

My keyboard just went chinese

Screentraces is ass

It does provide some better reflections

By including more stuff

But the amount of SSR block artefacts is wild

The trial area where you could test out the octopus girl with umbrella

All reflections near here, under her and near her octopus companion would just be a shimmering block

So which exact settings solved the problem?

[solar path]

By the way ladies and gentlemen, since kuro updated both SR and FG to dlss 4, does that mean we have to downgrade FG back to 3.8.10 ? To avoid clamping problems ?

Or does the native support for dlss 4 FG settle de problem ?

Didn't get the time to launch the game yet.

[umbral granite]

Yes, the problem isn't native FG support, it is the lack of native HDR support

Until frame slop fix is out from ShortFuse to enable FG to be processed before Reshade

[proven oasis]

Okay, I've changed the FG version of the game back to v3.8.1 from DLSS swapper.

Other than more stutters, I don't really see any performance or display differences since the new update.
I haven't visited the old regions yet and people say the old regions are problematic -- so maybe it's too early to tell for me.

[autumn jetty]

none of them

the overall performance is worse in 2.6 so far

the shader pre-compilation is not good enough

[dull flame]

fake F2P

[umbral granite]

https://tenor.com/view/cringe-gif-24107071

We get Amazon warrior mommy with greatsword

And this is the price we have to pay

[autumn jetty]

Augusta is truly OP

she is one of the best single damage dealers in the game without her BiS teammate lol

and Iuno is going to "double" her damage

[umbral granite]

First time I downloaded I couldnt play because of RT crashes with Reno

Second time I downloaded I couldnt play because of FGslop flickering

Third time I've downloaded and now RTGI is borked with worse stuttering

[dull flame]

newer characters will become more and more powerful

its just how those combat based gatcha games work

[proven oasis]

Absolutely right Polly. Slight powercreep is already onsetting into the game with "premium" Teams and characters just getting more numbers per release.

[autumn jetty]

the powercreep is not that bad yet

you can clear content with 1.x charaters

[dull flame]

its a trend

[autumn jetty]

I mean people want stronger characters 😄

as long as you are not forced to pull it's fine

[dull flame]

genshin is a mid game, but in the first three years, there was bascially no powercreep

ya

[autumn jetty]

1.x characters especially DPSs are going to feel weak in a year or two for sure

[dull flame]

its not as bad as honkai star rail

like nowhere near lol

2.x characters are unplayable now

game is at 3.5

[dull flame]

do you play zzz

[frank heart]

if RTGI is breaking

try different variables

RTGI uses lumen vars

[umbral granite]

I haven't checked on my end yet

[harsh cloak]

Any updates?

[umbral granite]

MPaul just reported that it's borked for him

[frank heart]

chill out

[autumn jetty]

I was a day one player but I dropped it

[frank heart]

its not been a day yet lol

[autumn jetty]

only at 1.x locations

especially in Jinzhou

maybe it's related to the new fly ability

[umbral granite]

So this u by design? Oof, I've barely played ZZZ or Wuwa. Whenever I try the trial characters they have WTF tier abilities compared to rover

[autumn jetty]

rover is just basic 4 star with 5 star title

[dull flame]

its much better now

[autumn jetty]

I didn't like the characters animation/art style

[dull flame]

i was talking about honkai star rail

[dull flame]

the characters animation for later characters are better than wuwa

i dont the art style either

[autumn jetty]

it's not about the animation quality, ZZZ's animations are the best atm, it's the comic book/cartoon style that I don't like

And I really dislike human/animal hybrid characters

[solar path]

Am I the only one having it's game brightness set by UI brightness ?😅

[dull flame]

well if you are talking about abilities then yes

[umbral granite]

Based slop 🅱️ urries

[dull flame]

later character generally will always have WTF tier abilities

though in ZZZ miyabi is still the most powerful character

shes from 1.4, game is at 2.1 now

[umbral granite]

That the blue gremlin with horns?

[dull flame]

no

[autumn jetty]

please try to moderate yourself lol

[dull flame]

this

she is basically vergil from devil may cry

[autumn jetty]

the fox lady looks cool, but she is probably the only character that I like design wise haha

[solar path]

No one ?😭

[umbral granite]

The Reno hasn't been updated

[dull flame]

id agree that day one characters in zzz are pretty bad

[solar path]

No pb ! Just checking !

[autumn jetty]

yea 1.x areas are broken with RTGI

it's really annoying

[dull flame]

ya that almost killed the game

haha

chinese hate those

[frank heart]

chill

out

its been less than 24 hours

[solar path]

How the hell is RTGI breaking HDR 😂 ?

[frank heart]

expect the patch to break

[autumn jetty]

I switched back to inverse tone mapping for the time being

it's good enough for now

[frank heart]

i switched back to real life tone mapping

as in I wont turn on the game until there's an update 🤣

[umbral granite]

RTGI is borked because of the update

[autumn jetty]

nah I can't afford to loose astrites

[umbral granite]

Not because of reno

[frank heart]

I broke my streak even with a monthly card

I've moved on from fomo

[umbral granite]

I play because nice areas

And pretty characters

[meager token]

Based

[umbral granite]

And RT

[dull flame]

"pretty "

[autumn jetty]

I paid for the sub and it only takes lik 5 mintues/day to do the daily stuff lol

[dull flame]

:gigachad:

i have a friend who spent more than $5000 in this game

[frank heart]

yea I don't even feel the need to do it anymore if I have something else going on

[dull flame]

probably more because this was the number i asked him about 2 months ago

[solar path]

Hey no pb ! Juck checking I havn't fucked it up all by Myself ! I'm pretty sure last time I complained, it was actually my fault ! Something in my Nvidia control panel killed my performance last time, and it certainly wasn't the games fault, nor yours !

[frank heart]

there were 2-3 days period

[umbral granite]

they're enjoying it

[frank heart]

where i didn't log into arknights zzz and ww

[autumn jetty]

ugh I would never spend more than $5-10 on gacha games/ month

[frank heart]

that's like

15$ of monthly cards right there

[autumn jetty]

Wuwa is the only gacha game I play tho

[frank heart]

[dull flame]

the number of those people are probably bigger than that of F2P/monthly card players

[autumn jetty]

this is totally broken

[dull flame]

ya and wuwa is not the only gatcha game he plays

[autumn jetty]

say hi to RTGI line of shadow

[dull flame]

he probably spent more than 20k in those games

[frank heart]

hmm

can you disable AO?

[autumn jetty]

in-game?

[frank heart]

it might be that they enabled RTAO

[autumn jetty]

or in the engine.ini

[frank heart]

previously they were using RTGI only + still relying on SSAO

to add shading

[autumn jetty]

for the 1.x regions?

[frank heart]

turn off capsule AO in-game

[autumn jetty]

it changes nothing

unfortunately

[dull flame]

wait

is renodx broken in this game now

[frank heart]

yeah

lol

[autumn jetty]

obviously

lol

[frank heart]

they changed all shaders

[dull flame]

[frank heart]

I dumped all of it

lightspeed

but you'll have to wait

for wino to patch

[autumn jetty]

you can switch back to inverse tone mapping until wino patches reno

[frank heart]

Autohdrslop

[autumn jetty]

better than sdrslop

[dull flame]

i dont play games in sdr/itm

[autumn jetty]

#1383049193186136216 message this is inverse tone mapped

it's really weird, the RTGI range around the character is super small

like 5 meters?

lol

[umbral granite]

Mobile optimisation

That seeps into PC

Downgrade

Reeeee

[autumn jetty]

it's probably some screen space stuff that messes up RTGI

on 1.x maps

[dull flame]

tbf though

[umbral granite]

They beta testing some remastering of 1.x areas?

[dull flame]

wuwa are mainly focused on pc version compared to other gatcha games

[umbral granite]

Rip, so the likelihood of a SP based or MP but not gatcha style game with design like this is slim

How egregious is the monetisation in Wuwa

Can I farm all the characters

Albeit it might take me a decade

Are there energy blockers and mobile style nonsense

If I can play through the story as is in the game atm with it's art design, that will be more than enough for me I think

[dull flame]

no

[dull flame]

mid tier

[umbral granite]

Because they're locked behind monetisation?

[dull flame]

its not as bad as genshin

but its also not that "generous"

[dull flame]

they amount of resources for pulling is limited per day

and those characters have a limited time for pulling

so you are not going to get all of them

[dull flame]

and there is

[umbral granite]

Limited pulling? What there is fomo in new characters after which you can no longer obtain them?

[umbral granite]

What does this affect?

Can I still play through the story

[dull flame]

resources for character build

those games are all about end game play

and you will need that

but if you just want to playthrough the story then you dont need anything

because they will provide you characters that are strong enough to beat the main story

[frank heart]

WELL

limited but not really

[dull flame]

ya

[frank heart]

they just rerun all the time

[dull flame]

they will return

after like half a year normally

[umbral granite]

I am trying to gauge how it is compared to Warframe which I have played a lot of

[umbral granite]

Warframe primes do the same so I am used to that

[frank heart]

actually its sorta low tier

[dull flame]

nah there are games that are not combat focused

[frank heart]

gacha games usually move towards offering more later

[umbral granite]

My big suprise with Warframe was when I redownloaded it back in 2016. I thought Primes were the 'premium' currency upgraded characters.

When I learnt that you can not only farm for them but trade for their parts

I was pleasantly surprised

[dull flame]

that allows you to get all characters for free

[frank heart]

as its harder to attract players when everyone's got a gacha

something like endfield is gonna be less "predatory" simply cuz they need to balance out attracting players vs monetization

the older the gacha the more predatory it is

cough FGO cough

[dull flame]

games above are mostly not combat focused

[dull flame]

FGO basically has no gameplay lol

[shy bison]

async compute on reflections are a disaster in some games btw

[frank heart]

i mean back then it was gameplay

but standards change

[shy bison]

is is HW lumen or RTGI

[frank heart]

this game is software lumen

[shy bison]

some games have lumen and also use traditional RT like wukong

[frank heart]

this game is software lumen

[shy bison]

then why did they say RTGI

[frank heart]

from all the lumen variables it is using for both RT reflections and RTGI

[frank heart]

because it is RTGI?

lumen is RTGI but not all RTGI is lumen

just a method to achieve RTGI

[dull flame]

anyway in wuwa if you dont pay anything you should at least get one character each update/version

[shy bison]

SW lumen is fairly limited to screenspace in many ways and does not interact with any RT variables

[dull flame]

but you can only get two if you are lucky

@umbral granite

[frank heart]

yes but we're not discussing RT variables

[umbral granite]

Yes

What is up

[frank heart]

he showed lumen variables

which is what it should affect

[umbral granite]

I am home now so I can test slop

[frank heart]

you can also check the scalability files

and see what lumen var they used for each preset

[shy bison]

SW lumen is pretty easy to improve, yeah ive never looked at this game

almost every game has awful default lumen

[dull flame]

ya almost every game has pretty bad lumen

just like bad hdr

[shy bison]

is largely why I mod literally every new UE game

[umbral granite]

Lazorr were did you learn this gift?

[shy bison]

unhealthy amounts of time banging my head against broken games and UE

[umbral granite]

Just saw that UE stuff is bad and said I'll improve on it by reading documentation

[shy bison]

I started on stalker which is the most broken of all....

[umbral granite]

don't remind me

I haven't played it since launch

[shy bison]

and spent like 500 hours learning via working on stalker

[frank heart]

cant fix these if ur on consoles

[frank heart]

this game is frankensteins' favorite

[autumn jetty]

idk what the issue with RT global illumination is but it's bad 😄

[frank heart]

backported lumen from UE5

[autumn jetty]

and it was fine in 2.5

[shy bison]

[autumn jetty]

and it only affects early 1.x version areas

maybe some kind of shader issue?

[frank heart]

RTGI high?

[autumn jetty]

idk

[autumn jetty]

yes

low-mid-high are the same

no difference

[shy bison]

post the scalability files

[autumn jetty]

where are those?

[shy bison]

in the games paks

if you just open the game folder in fmodel and load all the paks

there will be two items, under each has a config folder to dump

[frank heart]

or you can just

[autumn jetty]

everything is encrypted

[frank heart]

send a bug report

to kuso games

crazy i know

[autumn jetty]

I did actually

I even posted the issue on reddit lol

[shy bison]

you can decrypt by dropping the exe on AESDumpster probably

which will give the key

[frank heart]

r.Lumen.ScreenProbeGather.DownsampleFactor=16
r.Lumen.ScreenProbeGather.RadianceCache.ProbeResolution=32
r.Lumen.ScreenProbeGather.RadianceCache.NumProbesToTraceBudget=300
r.Lumen.ScreenProbeGather.TracingOctahedronResolution=8
r.Lumen.ScreenProbeGather.ScreenTraces.HZBTraversal.FullResDepth=1
r.Lumen.Reflections.ScreenTraces=1
r.Lumen.Reflections.DownsampleFactor=1
r.Lumen.Reflections.WaterDownsampleFactor=1
r.Lumen.TranslucencyReflections.FrontLayer.Allow=1
r.Lumen.TranslucencyReflections.FrontLayer.DownsampleFactor=1
r.Lumen.ScreenProbeGather.Temporal.DistanceThreshold=0.005
r.Lumen.ScreenProbeGather.Temporal.MaxFramesAccumulated=16
r.Lumen.Reflections.SmoothBias=1.0```

try in engine ini

part of this is 2.5 RT High defaults

with some extra

if 2.6 changed it

then this will bring it back to 2.5 settings

[shy bison]

smoothbias 1 seems a bit high, though it depends on game

and art style

[autumn jetty]

alright lets see

hmm people reported on reddit that 2.x areas are affected as well

[latent hazel]

does hdr fail to work in 2.6 ?

[autumn jetty]

nope, it's just as bad with these settings

[frank heart]

then its a bug

or they added something new

[autumn jetty]

yea probably

turning off RTGI is like going back a generation

😩

[umbral granite]

Doesn't happen to me

Let me post vid

MPaul were should I go

To test

Time of day

Blah blah

[frank heart]

i havent turned on my game after dumping all the shader

but

i dont notice anything

[autumn jetty]

to here at 12:00

noon

[umbral granite]

🤷‍♂️

[autumn jetty]

you are not really going to notice it in direct sunlight

[umbral granite]

RR doesnt help

it is ogre

FUKKKKKK

[peak geyser]

Cooked game

[umbral granite]

Cooked

Now I will have to wait another 3 months for fix

before something else breaks

and the cycle repeats

I will never be able to play 😭

[umbral granite]

CNN RR be like

back to oil paint mode

This is what all those anti UE5 / Lumen / RT videos showcase

Now I am seeing it in real time

[autumn jetty]

it's broken everywhere actually

nice

xD

[frank heart]

im bored

lets check the logs

https://tenor.com/view/it-gute-nacht-not-gluten-nacht-gluten-nacht-gute-nacht-gif-11419817225655515471

[subtle warren]

That's the same thing I had, I had to remove the ao cvar from Engine ini

[autumn jetty]

I'm all ears haha

[subtle warren]

Cause my rtgi don't have any kind of bug now

[frank heart]

vids

@languid dome also funny thing, apparently the new patch laxes the AC detection

dxgi.dll works when it didn't before

[autumn jetty]

what's the line that you added to the engine.ini?

[subtle warren]

I removed AmbientOcculution=100 I didn't add anything

Did u have that before

?

[autumn jetty]

no

[subtle warren]

Wait, I'm gonna send you my Engine ini

[autumn jetty]

the engine.ini is almos empty by default

[subtle warren]

You gonna try it

[autumn jetty]

did you test the game at that location at 12am ?

[frank heart]

:no one did

[subtle warren]

But the thing is when I removed Engine ini that bug was gone, and I then found out it was the ao cvar

[subtle warren]

🤔

[frank heart]

not even a part of defaults set by the logs

[subtle warren]

Oki, give me a few mins

[peak geyser]

btw. Is the Global Filter thing still broken?

[frank heart]

it was fixed a looooooooooong time ago

lol

[peak geyser]

Ok. ty. I accidently opened the filter menu and had a panic attack thinking I'd have to delete the database again.

[frank heart]

yeah

just wait for the patch to get things unclamping again

[peak geyser]

Guess I'l use Auto HDR in the meantime...

[subtle warren]

This part?

[autumn jetty]

#1383049193186136216 message this

[subtle warren]

Nvm, it's there, we never had a chance to meet😂

[subtle warren]

I think it's just an exaggerated ao

[autumn jetty]

"exaggerated" it's the worst example of AO ghosting in modern gaming

rofl

[echo jackal]

anyone try new driver for wuwa yet

[autumn jetty]

no

I'm staying on 580.88

[subtle warren]

Yea

But everything is the same

[stark topaz]

.> hope I'm not the only one that has this ?

[autumn jetty]

Reno is not compatible with the new patch

wait for the patch or use Inverse tonemapping

[stark topaz]

yeah :3 i was just making sure my pc was not the one doing weird shit XD

[stark topaz]

what is inverse tonemapping?

[autumn jetty]

auto-hdr

like Pumbo's auto hdr shader

or Lillium's

or SK HDR

[stark topaz]

and what does that do?

first time i hear it

:3

[autumn jetty]

it's a cheap way to convert SDR to HDR

RTX HDR is the same too btw

it's not going to be super accurate or super nice like Reno, but it's better than SDR

this is inverse tonemapped

[stark topaz]

thing is i was using Reno in DX11 and from the looks of it, besides the beginning i had not issue with Reno, didn't notice anything weird

guess i didn't play enough to notice anything else

[autumn jetty]

it's broken 😄

[stark topaz]

so what do you use? for inverse tonemapped?

[umbral granite]

tonemapping is mapping color values, luminance blah blah to a format that a display can view e.g tonemapping is used since nearly every game does HDR rendering internally but since SDRplebs exist a process to squash this all down to their spec has to be created (otherwise the whole image will just clip to hell)

Inverse tonemapping is the opposite, you're extrapolating data to increase colour values, luminance, blah blah

So ITM will take the SDR presentation

[stark topaz]

Oho damn

[umbral granite]

and using whatever algo it has

make the image brighter

but since it relies on SDR

[tough ember]

For people who’ve asked, the update is coming this evening. I won’t be able to do anything until then however

[umbral granite]

it cant add details already lost

[stark topaz]

So for now what should i use ? SDR looks like shit T^T

[umbral granite]

Nothing

waitTM

[stark topaz]

Not even inverse tonemapped? :3

[umbral granite]

^

[stark topaz]

Untill patch

I mean

[umbral granite]

https://tenor.com/view/we-dont-do-that-here-black-panther-tchalla-bruce-gif-16558003

Dont listen to MPaul

[stark topaz]

.> damn Paul leading me to a dark path

[umbral granite]

If it wasnt for Reno, we'd all be stuck with AutoHDR or RTXHDR or botched HDR implementations

sorry sorry

True_HDR

[stark topaz]

Agree

Damn! This is gonna be my first time disabling HDR on my Monitor

[umbral granite]

Things would be more brighter yes, but any details lost due to SDR clamping would still be gone

[stark topaz]

Oh wait, wasn’t there a reshade pluging/shader that i can use where i will not need to disable my Monitor HDR?

Dare I say, it doesn;t look that bad without HDR ? XD so i’m not a lost cause when i cant enjoy games without HDR

[autumn jetty]

then suffer in SDR

[umbral granite]

suffer? I have POE2 tomo

so I will suffer

[autumn jetty]

that is true

these new tactical holograms are horrible ngl

5 staring them is a joke

like the new one spawns 6 fast moving homing tornadoes

like wtf XD

and you can't see the arena from the effects

I had to cheese with with Carlotta

[stark topaz]

way is RT not in WuWa? i restarted the game 4 times

wtf is going on?

[autumn jetty]

idk?

you need an RTX40/50 series card

[stark topaz]

4070 super

[autumn jetty]

that sould work

[stark topaz]

it did work before

the update

[autumn jetty]

it only works in DX12 mode

[stark topaz]

Ok i really do not like how my monitor looks when i'm in SDR, i remember that there got to be something that i can do in Reshade to keep using my Monitor in HDR while the game in SDR ?

[autumn jetty]

SDR insdie a HDR container is going to look like SDR

do you use SK?

[stark topaz]

wuwa looks weird with monitor HDR activated

[stark topaz]

last time i try it crashed wuwa like hard, maybe if i deactivate Reshade or Reno it won't crash me

let me try

[stark topaz]

OK SK stable without reshade and reno

FUCK ME

It give me not responding

Wtf is going on with SK bruh, ever since i changed my CPU it keeps giving me not responding in WuWa after a min ingame

[subtle warren]

I may as well play in sdr since it looks as good as fake hdr lol, I'm on a qd oled tv

[autumn jetty]

no idea, it works fine for me

[stark topaz]

i manage to get it to work for 1 min this time

but i'm running in DX11 for some reason

that there, it D3D11.4 is DX11 no?

and it even says Direct3D 11

way?

like wtf is going on ?

running the game through the lanucher i do not have the Run game in DX 11 thicked

[raven wedge]

Yes, that's dx11
No VRR and composed:flip though 🤢 something is wrong

[stark topaz]

so even when i run the game from exe it's still runing in DX11

[raven wedge]

add this as custom exe in SKIFC:\Games\Wuthering Waves\Wuthering Waves Game\Client\Binaries\Win64\Client-Win64-Shipping.exe

[stark topaz]

yeah i have that

still DX11

with SK and without

[raven wedge]

you have old cpu/gpu, I think they force dx11 for some

[stark topaz]

old GPU ? 4070 Super?

i had RT as of 2.5 T^T

now it does this shit

[raven wedge]

Just delete any Wuthering waves or similar profile folder in C:\Program Files\Special K\Profiles
So you have clean sk ini

[stark topaz]

that won't change that from wuwa launcher it's still in DX11 >.> i was just able to confirm this with SK

[raven wedge]

you can force dx11 with a launch parameter on the exe, make sure there is nothing after the exe path in the properties of the game in skif

what cpu

[stark topaz]

9800x3d

[raven wedge]

Then idk, use the repair feature in the game launcher
upgrade to latest gpu driver

[stark topaz]

Ok, i just did and it’s done, i hope it works this time, i’m gonna lauch SK and WUWa from the Launcher with DX11 option NOT SELECTED

[raven wedge]

You can always try to restart your gpu driver from skif
I get weird behaviors like getting stuck in composed:flip, if I turn on my main monitor (that use DSC) after the second one

Anyway, waiting on the update for 2.6 support 🙏
I found the discord link in the github 😅

[autumn jetty]

SK update?

but it works fine

[raven wedge]

No, RenoDX obviously

[autumn jetty]

ah

[stark topaz]

25.8.12

[fallen tiger]

wait u guys already have a fix for 2.6?

[autumn jetty]

yea I use this version too

[raven wedge]

What does he mean by "evening" ? This depends on your timezone lol
I guess a few hours

[stark topaz]

welp

[raven wedge]

Same, that's because they use DSC, stream compression, so no MPO
But as long as you use (borderless) fullscreen without any overlay ontop (besides SK/Reshade) it should stay in Hardware: Independant Flip (good)
Though your screenshot above was with Composed:flip (bad). I sometime get this and I need to restart my gpu driver to fix it

[stark topaz]

soooo what do i do ?

[raven wedge]

well is the game in hardware: independant flip or in composed:flip ?
If composed, try to restart your gpu driver by right-clicking the display in skif. Then restart the game without turning off/on any display

If still composed, try another hdmi or displayport cable 🤷‍♂️ idk

Though Wuwa has so much stutters and inconsistent framepacing, not like composed would be that bad in this game lol

[stark topaz]

i got the game to work, but still no DX12

[raven wedge]

You are in "Composed: flip". That's bad.
Also your VRR is not working 😐

[stark topaz]

sorry

[raven wedge]

Reset your nvidia control panel settings.
And make sure G-sync is enabled only for fullscreen apps (NOT windowed). It works with borderless dw

[stark topaz]

when i take screen shot

it says Composde

XD

[raven wedge]

ah you use snipping tool ok

[stark topaz]

it does say Hardware independet flip

[raven wedge]

You see smth like 120Hz in top-right, and hardware: independant flip, that's good

[stark topaz]

yeah

[raven wedge]

I would set the framelimiter below your average fps, smoother.
Like 120 or 90 work well

[stark topaz]

with FG i can reach 165

i just need to get the bloody game to run in DX12

i'ma restart my pc

[raven wedge]

Ah I see, yeah with FG I too don't like framelimiter, but to each their own

[stark topaz]

Plus if i get SK to work, i can use Pace native frames

With FG

[raven wedge]

Make sure you don't have a --force-d3d11 or smth

[umbral granite]

FG fix will include this

Shortfused cooked it up

[stark topaz]

Oooo

[raven wedge]

what is FG fix ?

[umbral granite]

reno flickers with trans FG

so no MFG also

highlights flicker

[echo jackal]

you can also add -dx12 to launch options

[stark topaz]

We are stuck with game old FG

[stark topaz]

I think i’ma gonna do that

[raven wedge]

I replace SR/FG dll with SK, and you can pace native frame
Though I am stuck with 2x (rtx 4080), and I don't like FG anyway
But interesting

I do 4K90 with DLSS perf and RTGI only, in this game
I prefer this than FG making it even more unstable framepacing wise

[stark topaz]

Yeah we can’t use new FG DLL with Reno

[umbral granite]

unless the game is using native HDR swapchain and Reno is just replacing shaders

since that bypasses all these shenanigans

Anyways, once the fix is out

FG will run before Reshade

so proper frame pacing and limiting will be possible

reshade side

and the flickering bs will be fixed

[raven wedge]

use the motion smoothing shit they added in nvidia app 😆

[umbral granite]

[stark topaz]

Fuck that

[umbral granite]

that is last resort

that or LSFG

[stark topaz]

LSFG over Smooth motion ALL DAY

[raven wedge]

yeah
I always found FG to feel unstable framepacing wise
I prefer real 90fps than fluctuating ~130fps

[stark topaz]

HOW IN THE FROZEN FUCK

[frank heart]

You're a shader collector now

where

Are

Your

Dx11 shaders

[stark topaz]

i had issues with my internet and wuwa by 20:00 and wanted to play a little bit wuwa, will do that tomorrow, now i can't even get the game to run in DX12

i wanna go to sleep but i wanna fix this SHIT

like wtf

[peak geyser]

Yeah, I was getting that with the last version too.

[frank heart]

buddy

[frank heart]

why the fuck

are you launching through SK

launch the exe directly....

[stark topaz]

i'm trying to force it to run DX12

i try everything

and it refuses

even adding -dx12 in a copy of the EXE it gives me the same message

[autumn jetty]

rename the Wuthering Waves\Wuthering Waves Game\Client\Saved folder

and try launching the game

[frank heart]

what you need to do

is launch the dx11 version

and start dumping shaders

[autumn jetty]

but Raven wants to use RT

[frank heart]

xd

yeah bro but no HDR now

[raven wedge]

upgrade to win 11 lol

[frank heart]

TRUE

[stark topaz]

yeah i know, but i started late and the internet keep fucking with me untill 20;00 something T^T i wanted to play at least 1 hour before sleep but NOP

[raven wedge]

If you run dxdiag what do you get
Both in system and display tabs

[raven wedge]

https://www.reddit.com/r/WutheringWaves/comments/1n256f7/its_been_fun_boys_kuro_changed_their_dx12_feature/

"Kuro changed their DX12 feature requirements to 12_2 "
I doubt it tbh but look at this thread

[stark topaz]

Huh

I just updated to the new driver

Way is DX12 not updated ?

it shows 12.1

T^T

[frank heart]

update to win 11

[stark topaz]

fuck no XD

[frank heart]

get

fucked

then never play RT again

so yeah

better start dumping those shaders

[raven wedge]

Run windows update, or better yet upgrade to win11
dx12_2 is dx12 ultimate

[stark topaz]

i can force DX12_2 for sure, no way is my GPU that dead

or windows is fucking with me
\

????

[tough ember]

@frank heart @autumn jetty any updates to these presets before i add them as buttons?

[raven wedge]

"While some users on Windows 10 may only see 12_1, games and applications that require DirectX 12.2 can still access those features through a local SDK on Windows 10. For full system-wide support, an upgrade to Windows 11 may be necessary for some users."
Maybe LLM hallucination, idk

[frank heart]

force how?

[stark topaz]

the fuck

[autumn jetty]

nope

[echo jackal]

time to upgrade

[raven wedge]

Do winver and tell what win10 version you have

[stark topaz]

i'm one update behind but this is what i have

[frank heart]

ah

12_2

https://tenor.com/view/feels-good-man-nicolas-cage-gif-5444501

puny 4070