#▫️Silent Hill 2 Remake

frame spikes???

or flickering

both

there is a LOT of variability in the draw calls ... 6ms to 14ms

okay wow

i'm going to try forcing DX Flip presentation

isnt it already on normally?

not really, no

it's not really documented. it's kind of "adaptive"

i wouldnt even have vrr without flip discard, no?

correct. it will allow tearing and use a flip buffer. is it DX Flip presentation specifically though? is it UE's implementation? i don't know, they don't talk much about it

but you can force it, which does seem to change things for people

i meant to say ***Nanite

i'm tired

i wonder how big the GPU scene upload is

nanite max verts it can process per frame is 16 million .. max polys is 8 million. is that a lot? ¯_(ツ)_/¯ it sounds like a lot

the problem with things like nanite is devs just don't bother running UE's diagnostic and optimisation tools any more. they just import a whole bunch of bought or created assets and wheeee let's go. because nanite

#1293113206687928322 message this is with DX Flip forced and some optimization of frame timing and the RHI thread

yeah, i can see what's happening. if you turn the fog off with r.VolumetricFog 0 you can see quite clearly what the problem is (i don't know about problems without U+, probably several)... whenever a new mesh is drawn, there is a hitch as its surface is filled. presumably due to RT "something". normally, you would fix this by limiting r.RayTracing.Geometry.MaxBuiltPrimitivesPerFrame to, say, 1024. a very simple fix, so that RT work can be spread over several frames, preventing the RT build hitch.

however, rather excitingly, in this game, r.RayTracing.Geometry.MaxBuiltPrimitivesPerFrame is broken. the game crashes when setting it to anything other than -1 ( = unlimited). so that's not an option

i don't think this is U+ related, it's also not specifically HDR related. it's just "engine stuff". i also don't know your work well enough to know whether it helps to know this. my work is diagnostic. i'm not simply copying Engine.ini values from Reddit and "hoping something works", i'm disabling parts of the frame to do root cause analysis.

my goal is not to overtake HDR threads, it's simply that the fastest way to halt the progress of science and engineering is to silo information...

in any case, now that we know this, i'll post future results in my thread, so if this is actually useful/helpful, you might want to look there 😊

just a quick update, issue is diagnosed and reproducible. here i'm causing a deliberate frame time spike every 60 seconds

it's fixed. i can turn the frame spikes on and off affirmatively (see FT graph)

New build coming soon? 🙌

https://discord.com/channels/1161035767917850784/1293113206687928322 😊

hey we can adjust skylight strenght 😊

Who else keeps drinking their health meds trying to open the map! Fml 😆

Dark looks wayy too scary

hahaha

i just turned off fog and saw a creature lurking around a corner in the fog. i don't think i can cope lmao

i'll just test this area 😂

https://tenor.com/view/ice-age-no-thanks-i-choose-life-gif-7420641545504759461

game feels technically more fucked than jedi survivor

stutter hell

i don't really understand why it gets a free pass on steam, where are all the complaints

jedi survivor was at least much better if you turned off raytracing

here even that doesn't help

i can't honestly recommend the game in its current state. it's literally nauseating to play with this stutter (and the bonus vrr flicker)

i'd refund if i bought it through steam. though i'm past the 2h mark and the real shitshow starts at the apartments level

One bloobillion dollars

What's the verdict here on all the mods I've seen floating around to fix stutter?

Do reg edits to increase CPU priority actually work for a lot of people? (YMMV of course)

Likewise is this Ultra Plus mod all its cracked up to be across multiple hardware configurations? Is there video supporting this showing before and after?

Appreciate the work you're attempting to do Sammi, I am intrigued to try it, just would be nice to have definitive proof that it is improving the situation. Btw you might want to add a description on your pictures on NexusMods, the one image I was totally confused as to what you were showing, its only here I realized you were forcing frame time spikes and then turned them off halfway through your graph on the image

+1 to the VRR flicker issue too, it looks really bad on my OLED at times

i've looked at several engine.inis and they were all copied off reddit, with dozens of commands that don't even work in this game

no, registry edits don't help. they might help a handful of people if they have problems

Yeah I figure the priority CPU fixes might work for people with weak CPUs

take a look at my notes under the performance tuning sticky. most people forget these things, and i can tell you Unreal when tuned well pushes the PCIe and GPU very hard, so these steps are important

https://www.nexusmods.com/silenthill2/mods/24?tab=posts

i'm not experiencing large stutters, it's definitely playable

I will give your mod a shot this week and see if it improves stutters in the same areas where I've been having an awful time in the vanilla game

I like that it's fixing the black point as well

I have a Gen 4 pcie ssd that can write like 7gbps so if your mod can push that I could see it helping with traversal stutter

it will push it, but don't neglect the things in the sticky too. hopefully yours is already okay, but i often hear those things improve several games

Noted, thanks

is resizable bar that important? I had really large frametime spikes (100ms or more) in all games from time to time (every few minutes), and disabling it fixed that

Sure it is not placebo and a warm shader cache?

I haven't done extensive testing; I also haven't tested it with this game

I had those issues in all games, even well optimized ones without shader comp stutter

tried basically everything under the sun and thought it was just ram instability, even though mem stress tests came up with nothing

disabling rebar in the bios helped. and from benchmarks I've seen rebar always causes lower 0.1% fps in games

doesn't play nice with SK

https://www.nexusmods.com/silenthill2/mods/2
Lmao

i didnt even realize how much this murdered my 4090

im getting 60-70 FPS in the apartment

maybe the FSR3 mod would help

FG mod by ImpureBright

people just willingly take the ragebait

and how to enable this in game?

drop into win64 folder

open reshade ui

this will also work on 30xx series or its only for 40xx?

it's dlss FG what do you think

ok ok, I was thinking maybe is already moded to work with 30xx series

I wondering if it will work with mods

what mods

thats allow works FG on olders cards

you can try yourself

should be possible to put one of those on top of it

to use FSR FG

whle retaining DLSS upscale

there's probably guides out there

Have a direct link to the mod page itself?

Why do you think that?

Oh yeah? Impurebright == PureDark?

https://tenor.com/view/the-office-michael-scott-i-hate-you-why-are-you-the-way-that-you-are-gif-16413561

Is that the case @warm pelican ?

@tough scarab Is it indeed a mod behind a paywall?

I didn't pay anything

So no

I meant, the original source, does the modmaker hide it behind a paywall? And where did you get it?

I got it from ImpureBright

Have a link to the public mod page?

Directly with permission to share?

He gave it to me in an envelope

inside a floppy disk

I removed it; while I hate modders putting things behind paywalls, lets not try to circumvent those anyways to at least respect the author's questionable wishes....

They go after servers that act like hosting hubs for paywalled mods

And the information Olek gave me is too vague to prove otherwise.

But I was just personally sharing a mod from ImpureBright

Never heard of PureDark

sounds like a shitty guy

The information you provided is lacking to prove the author didn't put it behind a paywall normally or even gave you the permission to share it

Next time just link to the Discord message or mod page containing the mod, avoids all this

if you want I can just post an external link so it's not hosted on the Discord

Yeah, if it leads to a public proper mod page, sure

Please

Without providing a public non-paywalled source, please don't share or offer mods if they aren't of your own making

https://tenor.com/view/waynes-world-gif-9423140

Please respect it and supply the proper public info then next time

amen

why don't I just enable FSR3 FG

since it takes 5 minutes

slowmo video

vrr just goes completely nuts

can't play like this 😄

i dont have that issue, something must be up

with ur system

i had to turn ray reconstruction off to improve frametimes

but i dont think it was ever that bad

mostly noticeable when walking, standing still it seemed mostly fine

what is that software that microsoft made that tracks VRR hz?

guess what

i just removed sk

it's not doing it anymore

the game is now randomly resizing other open windows of course

this is now much more sane. the flickers are from the camera, aside from the big one in the middle. that's still happening ofc

https://tenor.com/view/surprise-wow-i-cant-even-surprised-shocked-gif-16276620

first time i'm hearing about one 😄

well it's still terrible while moving around

at least standing still doesn't freak out anymore

rtss plugin for displaying vrr hz: https://www.forum-3dcenter.org/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=593443

yes sorry, but it might help if you can't find the MS tool.

https://apps.microsoft.com/detail/9nkbpxwf3rwr?hl=en-US&gl=US

what the f is that... 🤔

the video is an excellent help, thank you

it's actually preset E + ray reconstruction that's causing the terrible frame times

preset A doesn't do it

preset E is using some sort of shader

that's just special K

causing it?

the second one is without it

oh thank goodnesss 😂 i had no idea what might cause that inside UE

it's still stuttering, mind you. just SK was adding bonus stutters

even that second video has this flash of vrr disengaging in the middle

at 0:13

hmm i have an idea

yes i've introduced some stutters by using too much async dispatch

just fixing that...

it's interesting, FSR3 FI has its own RHI swap it uses, which completely replaces UE's... it's SO much smoother. like insanely smooth

you know what i find really interesting? sometimes debugging these really problematic games like Survivor (or this one), trying fairly random settings changes is one of the most useful tools to actually bisect problems... with that in mind, having 2 different packs each with a different approach, and then trying one, then trying the other, can be really useful. it's like basic software genetics.

what would be super cool to solve these issues is basically a computer program that changes random values then launches the game and monitors frame time, then does it again, and again, and again, and breeds the best winners, to eventually arrive at the ideal settings

Time to get this off of SK then

like an AI system? 🤯 😉

kind of. it's not 'AI', it's software genetics, which has been around (though in limited supply) for about 25 years

dammit i can see the frame instability is happening on the RHI thread, but WHERE

OMG found it!

it's occlusion culling

(left) before 1024 privative occlusion packet size .... (right) 128 prims

makin' progress

LowLevelFatalError [File:D:\SilentWorkspace\501T-BL\Engine\Source\Runtime\D3D12RHI\Private\D3D12Util.cpp] [Line: 868] Interfaces.CopyCommandList->Close() failed at D:\SilentWorkspace\501T-BL\Engine\Source\Runtime\D3D12RHI\Private\D3D12CommandList.cpp:284 with error E_INVALIDARG oopsiedasies

so the hdr values are literally defaults from unreal

static TAutoConsoleVariable<float> CVarHDRDisplayMinLuminanceLog10(
    TEXT("r.HDR.Display.MinLuminanceLog10"),
    -4.0f,
    TEXT("The configured minimum display output nit level (log10 value)"),
    ECVF_RenderThreadSafe
);

static TAutoConsoleVariable<float> CVarHDRDisplayMidLuminance(
    TEXT("r.HDR.Display.MidLuminance"),
    15.0f,
    TEXT("The configured display output nit level for 18% gray"),
    ECVF_RenderThreadSafe
);

static TAutoConsoleVariable<float> CVarHDRAcesColorMultiplier(
    TEXT("r.HDR.Aces.SceneColorMultiplier"),
    1.5f,
    TEXT("Multiplier applied to scene color. Helps to"),
    ECVF_RenderThreadSafe
);

it's not custom

@tired mural silent hill is just default unreal aces. so the usual black floor woes are there. do you understand what's going on with unreal aces and whether the defaults aren't ideal? the usual thing is here with raised black floor

how different is SDR from HDR? SDR is "aces matched", but not real ACES so it might go to zero. real ACES HDR is 0.005 floor IRIC

the unreal lut builder should be final output, and another nothing else on top except for maybe film grain

it is more or less similar to sdr

sdr also looks raised

that's probably too much to be anything reasonably inputted into ACES. aces gets really dark. they're either not using Unreal stock ACES or doing something after the lut builder to raise the image

i feel like this is the exact same thing that happens in every unreal game with stock hdr tho. they all look raised

it would have to really raised before it gets to ACES for it to be that high and kinda unnatural

i mean, possible, but that crazy high with ACES usually means they're going custom, like trying to pass an SDR LUT or something

i feel like there might be something fundamentally wrong with unreal's aces

i think hellblade2 is stock

hellblade had unclamped highlights so couldnt be

hmm.

it's probably faster to just look at the SH2 shader if somebody has it

"easily" dumped on PIX

i don't think there's a reason you should be digging through that mess

just look at unreal's source

see the comments full of "this is a hack" and todo

https://github.com/EpicGames/UnrealEngine/blob/40eea367040d50aadd9f030ed5909fc890c159c2/Engine/Shaders/Private/ACES.ush#L1304

that code is fine IIRC

some useless stuff, but mostly fine

i need to check what a blank project looks like

sdr tonemappers usually have the HDR code in there, just behind a cbuffer branch that never gets executed. so i've seen it in like Thaumaturge

but any game that isn't using fixed 1000 nits or 2000 nits from before is custom. so the fitting can be broken, like in cyberpunk

i think variable peak nits ACES was fine. not how i do it, but fine

jedi survivor is custom stretched ACES as well

no idea if it's relevant to this at all, but it defaults to 1000 peak and Musa said if you adjusted that peak value slider it would lower the black levels, too

then it's probably custom. black shouldn't move if you're doing it right

it's probably the 1000 baked ACES and they're trying to fit it

and their math is broken. just like CDPR, just like Sea of Thieves

black level in HDR should be because of the viewing environment, not device peak

well the settings, and the default values match unreal perfectly so i really doubt it's something custom

the peak cvar actually existed in 5.1 (the version they're using) even though unreal seemingly moved on from the static 1000/2000 peak in 5.3. i'm not sure whether that cvar did anything

HDR default settings looks way different

the black floor tho?

sdr actually isn't even ACES. it's unreal's "matched" ACES

sdr is also similarly raised at a glance