Israel-Hamas Conflict

[stuck brook]

both yall gonna sit out for a while

[dark latch]

I don't have a strong opinion on this but personally I think calling it a truce between both countries would save many lives

I don't support both countries and what they're doing. It's been going on before any of us were even born and I hope one of these days the conflict ends.

[obsidian hare]

Means more children dying of hunger, and water who can barely speak or understand what's going on........

[obsidian hare]

https://vt.tiktok.com/ZSNY82Qg2/

[sage zephyr]

We’ll Hamas fault

Well*

If they will stop the war we will return the water

[obsidian hare]

Definitely no fault of Israel for displacing 750,000 Palestinians since day 1 (Nakba), occupying Palestinian land and butchering Palestinian children, women etc since 75 years of Independence and definitely no fault of Israel for killing hundreds of thousands of Palestinians since its creation

Making innocents die of hunger and lacking of water due to a militia group - those who were just minding their own business living in a 'literal hell on planet Earth' (as said by UN secretary)

The fact that you control their water, food etc making them malnourished says a lot about your mindset

"The abused becomes the abuser" is so real

[granite saffron]

I think what you all forget is that more Palestinians will die than Israelis anyway, Hamas takes over their houses when we attack them, Hamas kills their own people too

regardless of who kills them, they die

[whole grove]

Sorry but using tiktok for news 😭😭

[glossy haven]

i mean it's not the best but it's kinda all you have at this point

[topaz raptor]

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/world-news/2023/10/10/israel-hamas-terrorists-grandmothers-murder-posted-facebook/

[topaz raptor]

https://www.thejc.com/news/israel/hamas-terrorists-murdered-40-babies-including-beheadings-says-report-2fdcCmtBjFvAcCCf5MDwKU

[granite saffron]

yet people will say that this is our fault

[glossy haven]

i had a video saved from someone and now it's taken down .......

[obsidian hare]

TikTok aint controlled by governments... Also, I get videos of both pro-apartheid and pro-Palestinians including some Palestinian children showing how they live so this aint that bad as compared to biased media

||no wonder US government was trying hard to ban it||

[topaz raptor]

“TikTok ain’t controlled by governments”
LMAO DO YOU EVEN KNOW WHERE TIKTOK IS FROM 😭

[obsidian hare]

Headquarters located in Singapore

But afaik TikTok has very less one sided content unlike medias having agendas

You can view both type of contents, pro-israeli or pro-palestinian on tiktok

I see very less media news which has an unbiased opinion

[topaz raptor]

And which company owns TikTok

[obsidian hare]

Therefore, news is definitely not my thing. I dont want to hear a biased opinion and fill my mind with such stuff

[topaz raptor]

Ah yes because Tiktokers are the peak of objective unbiased investigative journalism

[obsidian hare]

Better than state controlled medias with agendas ;-;

at least I get to see two sides of the situation

If you want to hear a biased opinion - one-sided, you're free to watch news at your TV channels ot whatever

I don't like the fact that media is usually only one-sided and biased therefore I look for other sources where REAL ppl experiencing oppression share their views

it is what it is

I dont believe anything unless I see real captured videos of the scenario i.e soldiers dragging children etc. I did not even believe Hamas attacks until I saw videos of Israelis hiding in their bomb shelters

[sage zephyr]

That Biden speech!!!!

[south basin]

nate buzz defended israelis STEALING palestinians' homes, his opinion should not even be considered

my country is literally being threatened if we helped palestinians

ofc we never want to see civilians killed, but where were all the people claiming to tell the truth for the past 75 years? suddenly you care bec israelis are attacked?

[obsidian hare]

PREACH!!!!

[topaz raptor]

His opinion? He's sharing a video of an incident

[obsidian hare]

it is what it is 👊

be on the right side of the history

even that bird wants an end to the 75 years of occupation and apartheid

[topaz raptor]

I ain't taking history lessons from someone whose primary source of information on a conflict going back centuries is fucking TikTok

Pipe down

You're embarassing yourself

[obsidian hare]

XDDDDD

better than bbc

I hear from real Palestinians living in Gaza

Not some western guy living thousands of kilometers away

[obsidian hare]

If supporting an end to apartheid and 75 year of occupation means embarassibg yourself, I would take it every day

[topaz raptor]

Occupation of what? Go learn some history before you spout of bullshit

Palestinians have never owned that land

[obsidian hare]

It's like Russia taking over the US and giving land back to Native Americans while making Americans live like Palestinians

Not all Jews had moved to Europe

Some converted

Who share Palestinian identity

[obsidian hare]

That land is shared between Jews, Muslims and Christians

All of them have lived here at some point

You cant jusy "iTs jEwIsH lAnD"

A Christian converting to Judaism living in nyc automatically reserves a spot for himself in Israel

Like whatttt

[topaz raptor]

Where have I ever said it's Jewish land lmao, stop arguing with ghosts

[obsidian hare]

average apartheid supporter ^

[topaz raptor]

The fact that you are 17 is so clearly evident here

Incapable of making arguments without resorting to insults and strawmen

But it's my fault for expecting depth of logic from a 17 year old TikTok obsessed pop stan

[obsidian hare]

Oh no age attacks

At least I dont support the modern N@zis even though im 17 😂

[topaz raptor]

I am going to stick to hearing from primary sources

[obsidian hare]

You can find thousands of videos like this of Palestinian families

[topaz raptor]

Where have I ever disregarded the suffering of Palestinians?

Why are you being so moronic right now? Am I not capable of sympathising with Israeli civilians in the moment of their suffering while also sympathising with Palestinian civilians?

Hamas is a problem that needs to be eradicated once and for all

Hamas literally paraded the bodies of civilians they killed and raped through the streets of Gaza, and people spit on their brutalised corpses

[obsidian hare]

bro

[topaz raptor]

You will ignore that and go straight to calling for the destruction of Israel, not having the slightest bit of critical thinking ability to realise the destruction of Israel means the genocide of every single Jewish person in the region

[obsidian hare]

Oppressing was not like a myth before Hamas creation

just understand it..

Hamas did not come into being out of nowhere

conflicts, clashes, oppressings, suppression, displacing, Nakba etc

[obsidian hare]

No, I support two state solution. Let there be an Israel and a Palestine (Jerusalem an internation city controlled by the UN)

[topaz raptor]

Palestinians literally did not support the two state solution

That was literally the proposed plan that was accepted by Jewish leadership

back in 1947

[obsidian hare]

I'm sure a normal Palestinian wouldnt deny it anymore

[topaz raptor]

Palestinian leaders rejected it

[obsidian hare]

Only choice they have

[topaz raptor]

60% of Palestinians reject the two state solution

66% of Palestinians in the West Bank, and 56% in Gaza

But ok

[obsidian hare]

would change drastically after this conflict

this situation is unlike other small fires

anyway

I hope

Civilians who are just living stay safe

and ppl who have been oppressed and displaced soon experience peace

anyhow

[gilded solar]

it's literally so stupid to fight over land istggg

are they thick

[feral trellis]

I went to school today and a lot of people wore Palestine badges and wore the colours of the Palestine flag

[true kindle]

these are the takes that I can get behind; any of the reactionary 1 side or the other is just a no from me

[true kindle]

I mean... every war like ever has been a fight over land

throw into context the afformentioned meaning behind said land there... and yeah. it's not surprising

[dark latch]

Palestine as a country I'm not in favor of but in terms of the Israel Palestine conflict, it's a tossup on which side to stand for

I've done research on Palestine as a country and they are an extremely homophobic country

It is considered a crime to be in the LGBT in Palestine and in Israel, it's not considered a crime to be in the LGBT

Both countries are not innocent in this by any means however. I just hate war

[topaz raptor]

https://www.memri.org/reports/hamas-and-palestinian-islamic-jihad-gaza-strip-residents-do-not-evacuate-areas-about-be

[south basin]

BBC literally had a 1 hour talk about an Israeli woman who was killed, and they NEVER report on Palestinians getting killed everyday

Palestinians had no problem welcoming jews to their land, but you cross an obvious boundary if you start calling the land yours and attempt to erase the original people of the land and treat them like shit

[topaz raptor]

This is such blatant historical revisionism lmao

Crazy

[south basin]

so you think they should get killed bec they dont agree with your views?

[south basin]

literally look at the statistics for the occupation. what's happening to israel right now is nothing compared to what's been happening to Palestine for decades. so if you don't defend palestinian rights the way you defend israeli rights, you're not the ally you think you are or the humanitarian

[topaz raptor]

You are literally changing historical events to try to fit your extremely biased worldview

Stop trying to conflate that with current death tolls when I never brought it up

Instead of trying to deflect as soon as you are called out on your bullshit historical statements, have the balls to admit you are fabricating shit

[south basin]

LOOK IT UP FR

israel existed in 1948, before it, who owned the land?

[topaz raptor]

Britain

And before them, the Ottomans

[south basin]

OCCUPATION

[topaz raptor]

Shouting doesn't make you more right. Learn to talk like an adult if you are going to engage in conversations

[south basin]

then Britain promised a land that does not belong to them to the Jews

[topaz raptor]

Jewish people were buying private land well before the state of Israel ever came into being

As did Arabian people

[south basin]

so it means they owned it?

some people in palestine are older than israel fr

[topaz raptor]

They bought the land, so by the very law they owned it

[south basin]

not the whole country

[topaz raptor]

And?

My grandpa is Indian and he is older than India

The very fact that you are separating Jews and Palestinians tells me how little you know of this region lmao

Inb4 Swiftie realises Palestinian Jews are a thing

[south basin]

i literally live next to the region lol

[topaz raptor]

Inb4 Swiftie realises most Israelis in Israel are descendants of middle-eastern Jews who've been in the region as long as Palestinian Muslims

[topaz raptor]

And yet you know shit all about it, so it seems like geographical proximity doesn't correlate to actual historical knowledge, eh?

[south basin]

my country is being THREATENED with bombing if we decide to offer basic human empathy

[south basin]

but the land belongs only to Palestinians, and they have no problem with Jews living in their country (bec its not about religion) however living in a country and owning it are two very different things

Hamas would never attack if Israelis treated Palestinians as humans

[topaz raptor]

Why are you intentionally discarding history saying Palestinians have no problem with Jews living in Israel?? That is so blatantly false it is hilarious

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Farhud

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1936–1939_Arab_revolt_in_Palestine

[south basin]

they steal their homes (ever saw Jacob saying 'if i dont steal it someone else is going to steal it') and claim as theirs (these homes existed for like a hundred years and israel existed since 1948

[topaz raptor]

Yikes, literally defending Hamas

[south basin]

'against the british adminstration' where are jews in the equation?

[topaz raptor]

Jesus Christ, go read about the actual events instead of sniping out a single sentence and pretending to know it all

was a popular nationalist uprising by Palestinian Arabs in Mandatory Palestine against the British administration of the Palestine Mandate, demanding Arab independence and the end of the policy of open-ended Jewish immigration and land purchases with the stated goal of establishing a "Jewish National Home".

It was a revolt literally targeting the Jewish people migrating

[south basin]

and youre defending an illegal occupation that has defied basic human rights???? we never want to see civilians die, but dont pretend to be a good person if you defend Israelis but not palestinians

[topaz raptor]

So clearly you were lying about Palestinians being okay with Jews existing

[topaz raptor]

So you admit to defending Hamas, great

[south basin]

i defend people who just want to free their country

[topaz raptor]

No point talking to a history-denying rabid supporter of animals like the Hamas

Go to hell

[south basin]

Israel is way worse than Hamas

i dont think anyone has a right to offer their opinion if you haven't been occupied for 75 years and being treated like animals in your own country

if you defend israel so much, give them your land

[topaz raptor]

Jewish people bought the land when they came to Israel

Cope about it

Killing and beheading babies is not fighting for freedom

It's barbaric animals doing vile things

Raping women and parading their corpses around town and having people spit on their brutalised corpses is not standing up for injustice

[south basin]

where were you when the same exact thing and worse happened to palestinians?????

[topaz raptor]

So much for feminism when you literally defend a group of rapists and murderers who would sooner have your head on a pike

Your ideas are all tainted by your actions

[topaz raptor]

On the streets protesting, unlike you who loves to defend Hamas's actions

[south basin]

i dont defend them, i dont think what they're doing is not right. however, if youre going to condemn Hamas for it, why dont you condemn Israel too?

[topaz raptor]

Unlike you, I never ever justified IDF's violence

You are a disgusting and vile person, truly

Your heart is rotten to the core

[south basin]

lmao thanks

you dont know me

yet you formed an opinion

cool

[topaz raptor]

I know enough about you to know how much of a rotten person you are

[south basin]

at least i dont defend an illegal occupation

[topaz raptor]

All I needed to form an opinion on you was to see you defend Hamas

[south basin]

that has murdered hundreds of people for no reason

[topaz raptor]

Anyone who defends Hamas doesn't deserve an ounce of respect

You can try to preach on feminism and western liberal values all you want, I can see your heart truly lies with defending the vile animals over at Hamas who would happily behead babies

[south basin]

I never said i defend them, but they do have a right to defend their country? not by attacking civilians tho.

[topaz raptor]

They were defending their country when they fucking paraglided into a peace music concert and killed hundreds of innocent men and women, and raped and brutalised them??

They were defending their country when they went into an old lady's house, murdered her, captured it on video and put it on her Facebook wall for her granddaughters to see??

I come from a culture that actually fought against occupation and colonization against the British

[south basin]

i dont agree with the methods they used, i would never. but Israel has been killing Muslims peacefully praying in Al-Aqsa Mosque during Ramadan

literally every Ramadan and Eid, we watch palestinians get killed in a mosque

[topaz raptor]

It's fucking disgusting how you are simply incapable of bringing yourself to criticise Hamas without adding in a "But Israel!"

[south basin]

literally youre ignoring every word i say

[topaz raptor]

"But Israel!"

First the shameless historical revisionism and now the defending of Hamas

[south basin]

no one wants to see civilians get killed, i agree Palestinians have a right to defend their country, i would never say i agree with their methods

how is that defending Hamas

[granite saffron]

Instead of ‘getting your facts straight’, go on Wikipedia, watch news channels from both sides, form full opinions, I don’t defend Hamas but I think that Palestinians have the right to be free

On the other side, 1.2k Israelis have been killed and 3k injured

Also, we didn’t start this war, Hamas surprised us on Saturday in the early morning.

Hamas has been killing babies, kidnapping women, children, elderly people

they’ve been releasing graphic footage on social media

they don’t care about their people, they are a terrorist organization formed by Iran to kill Israel and its people

that’s all.

This conflict was caused 75 years ago by the Brit’s and the UN when they made Israel the Jewish state

we have settlers in the West Bank which I agree is really bad and our people shouldn’t live there. I don’t think Hamas should be using violence of this level and escalate it as far as it’s become

Before getting news from TikTok, a company owned by China (LMFAO TO WHOEVER SAID IT ISNT LNDAOFOAOFOALMFAOOOO), watch channels like CNN and Kan 11 and i24 News, I think all 3 have online streams

[obsidian hare]

i24 is Israeli channel

so definitely no to that

https://www.facebook.com/QudsNen/videos/171374006015368/?mibextid=76zNZb

(Palestinian girl shares bit of her life in Gaza)

[glossy haven]

How the fuck do i find anything that's reliable and not pushing one sides agenda

[obsidian hare]

Hear from real people living the situation

Instead of those living thousands of kilometers away

I think is the best option - hear from real ppl experiencing the oppression to know the truth.

[winter quartz]

And ppl from both sides will be suffering

How do you even get a hold of them

[obsidian hare]

yes

both sides are no saint

But Israel is wayyyyy worst

[granite saffron]

if you think we are worse than a terrorists organization made to kill us then start thinking again

[obsidian hare]

bro Israel literally gave birth to Hamas

[granite saffron]

and where did you hear this

Iran made Hamas??

[winter quartz]

was gave birth the best choice of words there

[granite saffron]

LMFAOFOKO

Iran made Hamas, sent them into Gaza to kill us

and so far aren’t successful

[obsidian hare]

If ppl were not living under occupation and Nakba had not happened, ppl were living freely I dont see a reason for Hamas creation

I aint blaming Israeli civilians

[granite saffron]

Iran never wanted Israel to be a country in the first place, Hamas would’ve existsed

[obsidian hare]

But your politicians are the reason millions of ppl including Israeli and Palestinians are in fear right now

[granite saffron]

correct, they’ve been sitting there doing shit for 5 days

[obsidian hare]

You guys literally control their WATER, FOOD......

[granite saffron]

We do that because it was our land in the first place 💀

[obsidian hare]

What else is occupation

[obsidian hare]

Our how

So this is Jewish land?

[granite saffron]

anyway you seem to not really know much as you called Israel worse than a terrorists organization so bye 🔥

[winter quartz]

i mean i don't think palestine could install their own system of getting water/food to them

[granite saffron]

If the Arab world never got their way, yes

[winter quartz]

their only port is gaza

[obsidian hare]

They control the amount of water REACHING to Palestinians not give them infrastructure lol

[winter quartz]

so a... dam

[granite saffron]

we control a dam big whoop 😭

[winter quartz]

yk countries building dams have been controversial to other countries lately

[obsidian hare]

Jews, Christians, Muslims all have lived in this land at some point

You cant just say it is Jewish

[glossy haven]

i'm just a bit confused here. Has Israel not been shitting on Palestine for 75 years ?

[obsidian hare]

Just because it says in your scripture or whatever (god promised)

[granite saffron]

they all live in guess what?? Israel, also i never called it Jewish land, its Israeli land.

[granite saffron]

nope, we’ve been shitting on each other for 75 years

[obsidian hare]

You earlier said, 'it is our land' -_-

[glossy haven]

fair point thank you

[granite saffron]

‘our land’ literally means Israel

not the religion

[glossy haven]

Where are you from?

[granite saffron]

I’m from the UK but I live here in Israel

[obsidian hare]

You said that as response to Israel controlling Palestinian nutrition....

[granite saffron]

now I know everyone here has it so please go and google the situation a bit more as you seem to be confused

[winter quartz]

how would palestine get food/water into it tho

[granite saffron]

they wouldn’t

[obsidian hare]

If Israel allows trade

[winter quartz]

they have one decent port

[obsidian hare]

Removes blockade

[granite saffron]

you really take the Palestinian side and are very close minded about this whole thing, search up the Israeli side before making opinions girl

[granite saffron]

and when do you think this will happen

[glossy haven]

please please try to stay safe 😭

[granite saffron]

we are never removing that fence because of the terrorists, not because Palestinians are terrorists, Hamas are

[obsidian hare]

Hamas has already started removing the seperation line

[topaz raptor]

Please don’t expect critical thinking from someone who gets their news from TikTok

[topaz raptor]

These people have absolutely no idea how bad things were before that fence got built. There used to be suicide bombings in Israel literally every single week

[granite saffron]

Yep, on buses, in bars etc.

[granite saffron]

If they think they’ll get good news from TikTok, they won’t 😭😭

[topaz raptor]

Cafés were the highlight. Somehow they absolutely loved targeting cafés

[topaz raptor]

Wait till they realise TikTok literally creates an echo chamber based on their views so they are more likely to stay on the app

And it’s not at all an unbiased source of information

[granite saffron]

They never will, they believe TikTok is where ‘un-biased news is’

[glossy haven]

i got a warning at the bottom of mine that say "china based government"

[granite saffron]

LITERALLY

it’s run by a government who is the modern day USSR

[topaz raptor]

The IDF are no angels, yes I agree. They’ve done some heinous shit. But to say Israel is worse than Hamas requires straight up brain damage

[granite saffron]

I’ve said this so much, our army is not the best, no. But calling us worse than Hamas is just plain horseshit

[topaz raptor]

The IDF isn’t beheading babies and paragliding into music festivals to rape and murder women, then drive their bodies around town for people to spit on

Hamas is literally preventing Palestinians from escaping right now

They want to hide behind civilians like the coward animals they are

[tulip reef]

Also, I suggest having a look into the Hamas-Fatah conflict that took place back between 2006-2008 after Israel disengaged and withdrew from Gaza in 2005.
ETA: wording.

[granite saffron]

‘Opening the blockade’, not happening, Hamas doesn’t care about their people like people think they do

[topaz raptor]

If Hamas cared about Palestinians, the leadership wouldn’t be chilling in hotels in Iran and Qatar

[granite saffron]

and they wouldn’t be sitting on piles of money from Iran and Qatar not doing shit with it, not helping the Palestinian public

They are only there to kill Jews and kill off the Israeli public, that’s all

[topaz raptor]

But if they help the Palestinian people with that money, how will they afford the 500 rockets to throw at Israel everyday 😭

[granite saffron]

RIGHT? the money they get all goes into rockets and paragliders and terrorists

not food, water, gas

nothing for the Palestinians

[topaz raptor]

People in here do not realise that if Israel seized to exist, every single Jew there would be at the risk of genocide

[granite saffron]

This is why we are defending ourselves the way we are, it might not be the best way but we are in no way worse than terrorists

[topaz raptor]

It’s a bunch of westerners who have simply no concept of what it’s like to be surrounded on all sides by people who want to exterminate you

Just want to mention that Palestinian and Arabian leadership have repeatedly rejected any two state solutions

And a majority of Palestinians do not want a two state solution

[granite saffron]

That’s what I’ve also said before, I’ve then been told ‘No, that never happened’

[topaz raptor]

They want the Jewish people to stop existin

[topaz raptor]

The historical revisionism here is absolutely mental to witness

[granite saffron]

Also just wanna add that Hamas teaches kids from a young age to hate Israel and Jews

[topaz raptor]

Someone here was saying that Palestinians would be happy to coexist with Jews in the same state

[granite saffron]

Except for the fact that if it happened, it would go down as a disaster

I bet people in here later will reply with all the lies under the sun as a way to make it seem like we’re lying

without ever researching

1.3k messages in this thread and more than 50% has been about lies

[topaz raptor]

They get really mad when presented with the reality of the history of the region

Israel literally wanted to give Gaza to Egypt

Egypt refused to take it

[obsidian hare]

From Palestinians on TikTok*

You really are a big dumbo

I told you I heard from real Palestinians on TikTok

I have Palestinian friends too who are worried about getting bombed any second

I dont watch news on BBC or CNN who rush reporting any Israeli death but ignore thousand of palestinian deaths

[topaz raptor]

Bro said dumbo

Jesus that is cringe and embarrassing

[topaz raptor]

Yes because Palestinians on TikTok have absolutely zero interest in fabricating stories and claims and are always 100% objective in their narration of events

It’s not like a majority of Palestinians in Gaza literally voted Hamas into power

[obsidian hare]

Omg

Now Palestinians are lying

Good job 👏

[topaz raptor]

You think all western and Israel media is lying but Palestinians are always 100% truthful?

Check your bias lmao

[obsidian hare]

Western aint livingin Gaza

palestinians are

neither are Israelis

[topaz raptor]

You are literally no different than my crazy anti vax aunt who does her research on Facebook and claims to know better than everyone else

[granite saffron]

the way you think that Palestinians will always be truthful just cause they live in Gaza, you don't know if they are actors from Hamas which shocker!!, exists

[obsidian hare]

Oh no thank you, I shall do my research watching BBC next time who rush to report Israeli deaths but neglect the thousands of Palestinians dying at the same time

[obsidian hare]

i dont think 6y/o children crying and showing their rubbled house are actors....

[topaz raptor]

You are clearly a lost cause mate, you have all the hallmarks of growing up to becoming the QAnon crazy of your neighbourhood. I have no intention of wasting my energy to convince you otherwise 😭

[granite saffron]

I'm not talking about children, I'm talking about the adults on TikTok always talking about the Palestinian women and how they get hurt

[topaz raptor]

Bro when he learns of propaganda films involving children which have existed for almost a century:

[granite saffron]

honestly giggling

[obsidian hare]

I mostly see Palestinian childrens videos on social media

Adult videos are rare

[granite saffron]

like propoganda can't use children

they can

and they do

all the time

[obsidian hare]

you are literally denying the reality here

are people losing houses not real??

[granite saffron]

who said it isn't??

[obsidian hare]

are all Hamas actors?? pfft

[granite saffron]

stop switching it onto something else trying to bait me

[granite saffron]

Yes, on Channel 4 news 2 days ago, Hamas literally said that they haven't killed any Israelis

that's not acting??

[topaz raptor]

Alex please, Hamas is so uwu they would never lie 🥺

Please don’t be mean to Hamas 🥺

[granite saffron]

Oh my god yeah true!! Terrorists would never lie <3

[topaz raptor]

The Hamas defenders in here are CRAAAAZY

[granite saffron]

A lot of them say they don't defend Hamas then say that Israel has to remove the blockade etc.

[topaz raptor]

When Hamas paraglides into a peace festival and rapes and murders: I sleep
When Israel retaliates and blockades them: REAL SHIT SO MEAN LET HAMAS LIVE 🥺

[granite saffron]

When Hamas sends 500 rockets into villages everyday: snoring
When Israel retaliates and sends rockets back: OMG NO STOP BEING MEAN LET HAMAS LIVE!!

[topaz raptor]

Hamas:

(We promise we care about Palestinians and are totally not using them as meat shields 🥺)

[granite saffron]

Cowards.

If Hamas cares, they'd let people evacuate

[topaz raptor]

But if Palestinians survive, how will they use the dead bodies as propaganda tool against Israel? Won’t you please think of poor Hamas 🥺

[granite saffron]

This is the reason that the IDF kept the dead bodies in the villages when they let reporters into the scene

they needed to make sure that the world knows the damage Hamas has caused so far

[topaz raptor]

Yes. Because the accusations of beheading babies is just so wild people would immediately distrust it. They had journalists from multiple publications come and see the bodies for themselves

And that is how it’s a peer reviewed fact that Hamas did in fact behead babies

[granite saffron]

And they made sure those reports were broadcast, so that people knew that we aren't lying

[topaz raptor]

I wish my country grew a spine and stopped treating terrorists with kiddie gloves

This cycle needs to end, and the only way to ensure this cycle ends is to completely annihilate Hamas and integrate Palestinians into society in Israel properly

[granite saffron]

Correct, the only time we will start intergrating Palestinians into our society is when Hamas is dead.

[obsidian hare]

Remember these words if the IDF erases Hamas this time ^^

[granite saffron]

I will, we won't send them away, we know they are innocent and deserve lives <3

[topaz raptor]

Yeah, 42% of Gazas population is under 15 years old. They need to be given every opportunity to thrive in civil society away from the violence

[granite saffron]

A lot of their population aren't even teens yet too, they need to be given a proper life, which the IDF and our government knows

[topaz raptor]

Ending Hamas won’t be as simple though. As long as Iran’s regime exists they will keep finding terror groups to go kill Jews

[granite saffron]

It's even been said, this could take months

[topaz raptor]

Years

Iran’s regime needs to go if Israel is to find peace

[granite saffron]

We want peace, we've tried getting peace before

yet Iran, Lebanon and Gaza never agree to anything

[topaz raptor]

They want an Islamic state where Israel exists

Of course they would never negotiate peace

[granite saffron]

If you think the BBC is biased to Israel, you are WRONG. They have expressed so many times that they stand with Palestine

[topaz raptor]

Not a fan of the CIA at all but come on, if you can topple all the good social democrat governments in South America, please just go and topple Iran’s regime already 🥺

[granite saffron]

THIS ^^^

[topaz raptor]

The BBC is about as neutral as you could get in journalism

I mostly get my news from state funded publications because they are reputed for being neutral and objective in their reporting

[granite saffron]

Actually not, I'd give that to CNN, they report about both sides all the time and know that both sides suffer

[topaz raptor]

My primaries are Reuters and AP

And also German publications but well most people here don’t know German so

[granite saffron]

Honestly that's good

[granite saffron]

Just a reminder that Israel nearly looked like this, the Jews agreed to it, the Arabs didn’t

[granite saffron]

This is plain history, anyone choosing to deny it is insane

as taylor would put it, 'fucked in. the head'

[worn berry]

There is no easy answer to that. There is no siding with one or the other. BOTH sides have killed innocent women and children. BOTH are in the wrong.

[dark latch]

Of course not. I stated that I dont side with either country. Innocent people are dying

Both countries are in the wrong for killing innocent civilians

[worn berry]

This is very tiny in terms of what's going on right now. Yea, it's shitty. But what's fucked all the way is the innocent women and children being murdered on BOTH sides

[dark latch]

Indeed

But I'm seeing people supporting Palestine and then putting the LGBT flag next to it thinking the country supports the LGBT 💀

They'll have Palestine 🇵🇸 🌈 in their bio

[worn berry]

Oh, yea. I've seen that. It's wild that those people seem to genuinely have no idea that if they went there at anytime and showed them who they were that they would be stoned to death for sure

[dark latch]

Indeed

Of course it doesn't excuse the killing of innocent civilians on both sides

But it's the ignorance of some people that just hurts my brain

[worn berry]

For sure but it shows how ignorant some are. Their heart is in the right place but to everyone around them...it shows how misinformed they really are

[dark latch]

True, I'm not entirely sure where they assume that Palestine supports the LGBT but they do have their heart in the right place

[granite saffron]

it's probably because they think that Palestine supports everything, nope

[dark latch]

Israel supports the LGBT a lot more oddly enough out of all middle eastern countries

[granite saffron]

we are the only democary in the middle east sadly

[dark latch]

Compared to Pakistan, Saudi Arabia, Qatar, etc.

[topaz raptor]

Pakistan is not in the middle east

It's south asian

[dark latch]

Whoops, my bad

I'll replace that example with Iran then

or Yemen

[winter quartz]

they have overthrown iran once

but the people revolted

[kind lotus]

Wishing you saftey Alex. I am thinking of you 💗

[granite saffron]

Thank you Em 🫶🏼

[glossy haven]

oh god you'd be surprised

[glossy haven]

i've seen this film before and i didn't like the ending

[granite saffron]

there’s no point talking to him, close-minded and believes everything he sees and hears from the Palestinian side is correct

[south basin]

like you believe everything israel and the us say?

https://www.aa.com.tr/en/middle-east/israeli-army-says-it-does-not-have-confirmation-about-allegations-that-hamas-beheaded-babies-/3014787

the israeli army said itself they have no evidence whatsoever for beheaded babies by hamas

[topaz raptor]

Not you being incredibly dense again. That article is from before journalists from all over the world went over and saw the beheaded bodies for themselves.

[south basin]

literally show me the evidence

[topaz raptor]

You want to see pictures of beheaded babies?

[south basin]

if they did that btw, there is no possible justification for it

and yes, they should absolutely be punished for it

before anyone claims i 'defend' hamas now bec i would never say that

[rough elbow]

Everyone needs to realize that Palestine and Hamas are not the same thing

People who stand with Palestine do not necessarily stand with Hamas and their horrific actions in Israel

On the same token, not everyone who supports Israel necessarily wants all Palestinians to die

[odd falcon]

I can stand with Palestine while also believing Hamas needs to be eliminated entirely.

[rough elbow]

This is how I feel

[south basin]

exactly

[odd falcon]

Hamas committed crimes agaisnt humanity in Israel, that's not secret.

[rough elbow]

Yes

And Israel is committing crimes of humanity against Palestine

Furthermore, various people calling each other banes and calling in the mods when someone simply expresses a different opinion is both ridiculous and useless. Unless someone attacks and dehumanizes one side completely, there isn't need to do that.

It's a nuanced situation and neither side - Israel and Hamas - is perfectly moral in their actions over the past few days.

[topaz raptor]

There can literally be no nuance when it comes to Hamas

They are objectively animals and need to be put down for their crimes

[rough elbow]

Yes, Hamas should be eradicated. However, many Palestinians will pay a price they don't deserve to and Israel will likely treat Palestinians and Arabs as a whole even worse as a result. Not all Palestinians are Hamas, and the bast majority of Palestinians who aren't should be treated better by both the Western world and Israel.

Israel is not innocent here

[topaz raptor]

"Vast majority of Palestinians"
I think you're forgetting that Hamas was democratically voted into power by a majority in the Gaza strip. And a majority of Palestinians do not want a two-state solution, and want Jews to cease to exist

The innocent children, and the men and women (after having their backgrounds checked for Hamas links) should be evacuated from the region

[rough elbow]

How are they supposed to be evacuated during such a brutal siege? Do you really think Israel's total warfare includes a humanitarian corridor?

[topaz raptor]

Israel should allow civilians to flee. But the question is flee to where? No country is willing to take them in

[rough elbow]

Furthermore, elections that are supposedly democratic may not be in reality, and even if it was in 2006, there's a high chance that a large portion of those who may have genuinely voted for Hamas if it was a democratic election are dead by now due to the constant conflict and perpetually horrific situation in Gaza

[rough elbow]

This is another problem with the Western world. Even if Israel allows them to flee (which I personally doubt right now) no one will come to save them.

The UN can only do so much

[topaz raptor]

Why is it always the western world

Not a single country in the Muslim world is willing to help them

[rough elbow]

True

But countries like the US and those in Europe could do a lot more to help

[topaz raptor]

Egypt, Lebanon, and Jordan had taken in a huge number of people from Palestine in the past. The only thing it caused was two massive civil wars in Egypt and Lebanon because the Palestinians thought the governments weren't extremist enough. And they tried to assassinate the Jordanian king four times. Based on this, I would rather not have my country freely take in hundreds of thousands of people with unknown backgrounds, causing internal instability

That's why, btw, when Israel had offered Egypt control over the Gaza strip, they refused to take it

[rough elbow]

Furthermore, while Israel is not responsible for Hamas, they control all water, food, fuel, and power in the area along with entrance and exit from the strip and could have done more to prevent the living situation for Palestinian civilians from deteriorating as much as it did between the wars. Also, Israel should be stopping the settlement programs in the West Bank. On the Palestinian end, they need to gain more freedom but must also except a two state solution. Doing what Israel is doing to them to the Israelis would be just as bad at what Israel has done to them. However, innocent Israeli civilians and foreigners that Hamas killed and/or tool hostage should not pay the price for the government's actions like innocent Palestinians should not pay the price for Hamas' terrorism.

[rough elbow]

If you believe that innocent Palestinians should be spared but no outside force should spare them, what solution do you propose to this situation?

[topaz raptor]

The countries that have been so vocal in their support for Hamas (Iran and Qatar namely) need to stick by their actions and help the refugees if they truly care for Palestinians

The best course of action for Israel is to limit the indiscriminate bombings and send in ground troops to specifically terminate Hamas targets. This would minimise the civilian loss of life

[tulip plume]

This reminds me of Syria and ISIS, they are not the same, even if isis say they are

[rough elbow]

I agree with both of those actually but I also think that more countries should help Palestinian refugees (maybe establish something akin to Ellis Island here in the US but for the modern age to ver out extremism while also holding them in a safe location so they all don't get massacred) and that Israel shouldn't cut food or water to Gaza. Power and fuel I understand though.

[tulip plume]

Im Syrian myself but no way at all i support ISIS ever

I kinda just hate taking sides for anything tbh, all i want is no innocents dying thats all

Politicians fighting or governments fighting each others army is whatever

Just leave the people who are barely getting to eat sleep every day

Thats all they want, good sleep, some food, and family

Like targeting ravers who probably never even held a gun before is monstrous and not “defending ourselves” but also to respond to that by killing other innocents does not fix the issue

It just pisses me off seeing the governments of each come in, fuck up everything then hide and let “their” people get fucked and die

[rough elbow]

Same

[dark latch]

AOC kinda wack ngl

Countries need to stop taking sides and instead work together to stop this conflict

[glossy haven]

Wack standing up for palestine??

[glossy haven]

yeah they've tried that for many years how do you think we got into this mess ???

[vagrant folio]

CNN is kinda democratic tho

[granite saffron]

Yes but they are one of the only news channels who actually decided to report on both sides, actually being neutral

[topaz raptor]

It's indeed been confirmed now that Hamas did indeed behead babies

[glossy haven]

as an American you can't trust a word that comes out of his fucking mouth

the fact that he doesn't even know what to say because it's a lie ? "i never thought i'd.. anyways Other countries are gonna help"

and it's on fox news the biggest bias news you could pay attention to besides CNN

[topaz raptor]

I’d like to see what kind of human wouldn’t be at a loss for words after having seen literal pictures of beheaded babies

Have the slightest bit of common sense to realise he was clearly going to say “I never thought I’d have to see pictures of babies with their heads cut off”

Quit being a political partisan hack at the expense of lives of literal babies

[winter quartz]

It's Biden tho

[topaz raptor]

Multiple foreign journalists and world leaders have confirmed the babies incident

[winter quartz]

He struggles a bit with making sentences

It isn't a lie

[topaz raptor]

I don’t give a shit

[winter quartz]

Like the babies thing is true

[glossy haven]

i'll take my sources from the people on the ground and relatives of those on the ground. not a government that blindly doesn't give a fuck about war crimes as long as the jews are okay!

[topaz raptor]

as long as the Jews are okay

Jesus Christ, you’re a disgusting person

[glossy haven]

i'm disgusting ? that's the american government ???

and trusting the american government is a wild thing to do these days

[obsidian hare]

That journalist who made the claim later tweeted that she was told by the solidiers that the solidiers 'believed' babies were beheaded

She did not see for herself

:/

[granite saffron]

I can confirm that the babies thing hasn't been reported on Israeli news

but if it ever is true

then wow

anyway Hamas killing 1.3k Israelis happened

talk with the wall if you think that isn't bad

[dark latch]

Standing up for Palestine is not any better than standing up for Israel

Palestine is a shitty country that has stoned LGBT members for existing so there's absolutely no way im gonna support Palestine but I am debating if supporting Israel is the right move

Also, if the beheading babies incident is true, fuck Palestine

or more specifically, fuck Hamas

[granite saffron]

'fuck Palestine' is a remark that i just don't agree with

fuck Hamas, of course

[topaz raptor]

And if the beheading babies incident is somehow not true, then...no fuck Hamas? Even if somehow that incident is not true, they've done far more horrible shit which they've literally livestreamed

Regardless of beheadings, we have confirmed proof that they went in and killed babies in their cribs. We have tens of pictures of bloodied cribs and such

The girl on the right was shot in the back by a Hamas terrorist, the man on the left is one of the terrorists, both of them are being treated at an Israeli hospital

Don't ever be stupid enough to say Israel is somehow worse than the animals at Hamas

[glossy haven]

lack of support for palestine is actually wild and sad

[granite saffron]

people support plaestine, the support for hamas is wild

anyway i'm gonna leave this thread cause instead of debates, it's arguing

so, bye suckers

[topaz raptor]

Western liberals claiming to be feminists while supporting Hamas confuse me so hard

[obsidian hare]

A war crime is a war crime

doesnt matter done by which party

The doer must be held strictly accountable

[granite saffron]

stop adding me back here

[obsidian hare]

No innocent deserves to die

[granite saffron]

i am done arguing with idiots

[crystal sedge]

NO LITERALLY

[crystal sedge]

If you are following the chat it will pop up whenever someone talks in the chat /gen /nbr

You don’t need to call people idiots

[topaz raptor]

The Geneva Convention does not apply to Hamas because Hamas is not a signatory of the convention

[obsidian hare]

well then someone should step in

[topaz raptor]

Israel is stepping in to eradicate Hamas

[tulip plume]

Why is israel attacking syria what

[crystal sedge]

Idk

[tulip plume]

My “home” country 😆 idk how its always brought up in every issue

[crystal sedge]

I can just hear 2022 me being like “I told you so!!” 🥲

[obsidian hare]

Syria is literally not like a country

It's like a group

that gets in every fight lol

[topaz raptor]

Syria is literally still in the midst of a civil war

And has no single government

[obsidian hare]

yea

[tulip plume]

Yeah ik

Its been in one

Forever

Its literally not a country

[topaz raptor]

The airports were being used by Iran to transport weapons

That's why the runways got bombed

[tulip plume]

Also fun fact syrian passport is second to worse to have internationally 💀

[topaz raptor]

An Iranian government jet was literally in the middle of landing at the airport before it got bombed, it made a u-turn back to Tehran

[obsidian hare]

Every passport loses its value if there's a civil war in the country

[tulip plume]

Agh i used to go to syria 15 years ago

[tulip plume]

Ye its been that way since i was born

It fucking sucjs

Always got the “random” testing

Would be treated like shit everywhere i went

[obsidian hare]

are you not a US citizen yet?

[tulip plume]

I am now

Like very recently now

Like two weeks ago now 😂

Passed that test 🫡

[obsidian hare]

just managed to get out of the mess XD

[tulip plume]

mmhmm it only took me and my fam like 20 years and lotssss of money

But its worth it cuz it sucks

[obsidian hare]

I saw some videos of Americans returning to US getting behaved rudely by the staff tho

US may just have a very strict policy

[tulip plume]

I mean yeah rude officers are everywhere but we always had to go to airports 5 hours before because every single time we get questioned in any airport in the world

[obsidian hare]

US immigration system is messed up

[tulip plume]

US, saudi arabia, UAE, malaysia, hong kong, paris, all of em treated us badly

[obsidian hare]

The Arab countries.......

The saddest thing is

you cannot choose your passport 💀

except later in life

[tulip plume]

Even then we wouldnt have gotten US citizenship if my dad didnt have money for it

Its so expensive

[tulip plume]

I blame ISIS for all of this, made syrians look horrible

[obsidian hare]

at least you got the worth

[tulip plume]

When we dont claim ISIS at all

[obsidian hare]

Is ISIS still alive

[tulip plume]

No one knows

They say they are

[obsidian hare]

I thought their leader was killed smth

[tulip plume]

They claim lots of the terrorist attacks

Yeah but usually whenever terrorist attacks happen they come out and say “we did this” but like no one can prove if its real or they want clout

[obsidian hare]

Damn, it would take Syria at least 40-50 years to get back to pre-war situation

[topaz raptor]

Hamas digging up water pipelines that were supposed to provide water to gaza and turning them into rockets. And now they complain of a lack of water...

[tulip plume]

I feel like we should seperate palestine and hamas

Imo not the same

[obsidian hare]

definitely

[tulip plume]

Hamas terrorism, palestine most of them just want peace and are citizens

[obsidian hare]

Standing up for Palestine ≠ Standing with Hamas

[tulip plume]

But i wish people didnt forget everything israel did too, like we shouldnt take sides here and genocide one side or the other,

[obsidian hare]

both sides have done horrible acts

[tulip plume]

Yeah but ofc who gets hurt normal citizens

[obsidian hare]

always stand with the citizens

[tulip plume]

Meanwhile the people causing horrible shit come in, throw a rocket, then run and hide and watch their people die

[obsidian hare]

this old ppl and their fight for land when they are just a few years near to death bruh

[granite saffron]

I unfollowed it, I get pinged and readded

[tulip plume]

Frrrr 😭😭

[crystal sedge]

Oh

[tulip plume]

Also ik this is never happening ever in humans life but gosh i wish the entire earth is one land for all

Who tf cares

[obsidian hare]

they should be asking for forgiveness 💀

[tulip plume]

Like imagine if all this money spent in history for wars and shit was spent on medicine, mental illnesses, stopping crimes

We would be in heaven rn

[obsidian hare]

bro we would have been 100x more advanced..

I read somewhere, since the start of humanity, almost a billion people died due to wars all around the world till today

[tulip plume]

The amount of innocents who died who possible coulda been a noble prize winner, or a scientist or even a big pop star is insane to think abt

[obsidian hare]

I wish wars were a thing of past in 2023....

[tulip plume]

Yeah unfortunately thats never a thing with humans

Ngl humanity line should end sometime before 2100 and start a new specie or sthn

Idk let the bunnies take over

Or chickens they r funny

[obsidian hare]

lmao

dont worry

With the current weapons, we are just few hours away from every human wiped out

[tulip plume]

Yeah the rich 80 year olds wanna escape and live life for like another two years 💀

[obsidian hare]

wild

[crystal sedge]

Of course it just has to happen the day every theater across the country is going to be packed. Please secretly carry pepper spray with you or a loud pin alarm in case something happens and you can immediately alert people to something happening https://www.tiktok.com/t/ZT8rvWqf9/

[topaz raptor]

I don’t have TikTok. Can I get a TLDR

[crystal sedge]

Hamas is calling for global Jihad tomorrow

Jihad means Holy War

They are also calling for a blow to America

Please please be safe

The nation will be on high alert tomorrow

[topaz raptor]

Oh yeah that

I am in the countryside right now, came here two days ago

Praying everyone stays safe tomorrow

If I had a ticket I really would just cancel ngl. Just watch another day

Avoid major population centres

[winter quartz]

Stay safe everyone!! Taylor won't mind if you go another day for caution, be as safe as you can

[tulip plume]

i better hope they dont even target kids here :(

[crystal sedge]

I’m honestly scared but I’m still going to go because chances are nothing will happen but at the same time anything could happen it’s America

[tulip plume]

im going saturday, i rlly hope nothing bad happens ill be in IMAX too so its even bigger

:(

[crystal sedge]

I’m going official opening night (tomorrow) which is the day they are calling for Jihad

[tulip plume]

man, problem is theatres dont have good security

and its a little too late to like figure out good security

pls pls pls check for suspicious backpacks all the time

[crystal sedge]

Any other day you should be alert (as you should be going to any crowded place in america) but you should be fine

And suspicious looking people!!!

[tulip plume]

especially in cities like LA, chicago

[crystal sedge]

We should probably go to a different chat

[tulip plume]

NYC

[crystal sedge]

10000%

[tulip plume]

i hope its just protests

and nothing bad

[crystal sedge]

I’m hoping it’s just an empty threat, but this is america, let’s be realistic

[tulip plume]

i mean there are terrorists everywhere who probably been planning something for a while, this only gives them more motivation

[crystal sedge]

Exactly

[tulip plume]

and i can see how hamas can view taylor swift as a villain to them

[thick fog]

People actually stand with Israel-

[crystal sedge]

That’s not important right now

But yes there are people who stand with Israel

And there are people who stand with the Israeli citizens

[thick fog]

I believe both citizens are innocent

[crystal sedge]

Exactly

They are

The governments aren’t

[crystal sedge]

Start here if you came from a diff channel

[tulip plume]

looks like they are asking for protests and such, so hopefully peaceful-ish

[glossy haven]

yes lol

[topaz raptor]

message of rage
part of battle

Doesn’t sound very peaceful

[tulip plume]

yeah its like very vague, in a way they are asking for violence, but they arent directly saying it to not get blamed for the attacks if any happen

[topaz raptor]

I am fucking off to a village of 500 people

Not taking risks here

[glossy haven]

they don't care about children, including their own

[topaz raptor]

Hamas supporter hoping his kid gets hurt by Israel. This is the kind of animalistic behaviour Hamas represents

[glossy haven]

is this from twitter

[obsidian hare]

disgusting

This is so trueee lmao
https://youtu.be/8tIdCsMufIY?si=i6kcrTTYv3OyQnbZ

[odd falcon]

So Syria got bombed because Iran was supplying weapons to Hamad and using that airport? Am I understanding this correctly?

I mean I figured it wasn't for no reason, that would make sense imo

[hoary flare]

@topaz raptor this is just sum serious level anti Palestine shit

like sure you're supposed to be loyal to your country but Israel has literally been colonizing Palestine

[topaz raptor]

Anti Hamas is anti Palestine?

[hoary flare]

You said FUCK Palestine so yeah

[topaz raptor]

Where?

Bro's making shit up

[hoary flare]

Oh shit you're the wrong guy

[tulip plume]

seperate the governments and organizations from the people and citizens

[hoary flare]

The ppl support and elect the government

[topaz raptor]

By that logic, Hamas was also elected by Palestinians in Gaza

[tulip plume]

at this point they kinda dont tho

u think people had true democracy there

[hoary flare]

You can't just stand there and watch Israeli influencers make fun of Palestinians in gaza who have been cut off of electricity food and water

[tulip plume]

oh dont get me wrong im not defending israel

[hoary flare]

I think that's bc they thought hamas was the only way they could gain freedom

I mean beggars can't be choosers

[tulip plume]

i just hate how every1 taking sides meanwhile the innocents and children there dgaf which side it is they just wanna sleep normally and eat food and live

[hoary flare]

I've always been neutral in these situations but recently I dug into it and seems like there was major flaw in the beginning

But one things for sure it's the Europeans and brits who decided to just get rid of the Jewish ppl by dumping them on Palestine

[topaz raptor]

That’s an insanely stupid take

More than half of Jews in Israel are of middle eastern descent escaping anti Jewish pogroms in the Arab state

[hoary flare]

the beginning bruh the beginning

[topaz raptor]

The birth of Christ??

[hoary flare]

Where did the white ppl come from

[topaz raptor]

How far back you wanna go LMAO

[topaz raptor]

Jesus Christ…

[hoary flare]

2nd ww

[topaz raptor]

European Jews moved to British Palestine and bought private land to settle on

[hoary flare]

Were white ppl in middle east then?

[topaz raptor]

They weren’t “dumped” there

[hoary flare]

Bought from the Brits

[topaz raptor]

And?

[hoary flare]

They did commit ethnic cleansing

[topaz raptor]

That’s bad how?

[topaz raptor]

By buying private land?

You are clearly way in over your head

[hoary flare]

No by massacaring villages

[hoary flare]

Thats some bs

[topaz raptor]

Israel has literally always been open to a two state solution

[hoary flare]

Israel wants to give Palestinians gaza and wants Jewish settlements in the west bank and wants to demilitarize Palestine

[topaz raptor]

Bro is stupidly denying objective historical facts

[topaz raptor]

Wrong again. Bro go educate yourself before you embarrass yourself. This plan was accepted by Israeli leadership and rejected by Palestinian leadership

[hoary flare]

They were bought from non Palestinians

[hoary flare]

That's 1947

Are you from Israel

[topaz raptor]

They bought public land from the government. Exactly how it works in every single country on this planet

[hoary flare]

The British government

The colonisers

[topaz raptor]

And before the British it was the Ottomans

Before the Ottomans it was the Crusaders

Before that the Romans

[hoary flare]

You're telling me jews have been buying land since?

[topaz raptor]

Since the times of the Ottomans

[hoary flare]

Land that wasn't theirs to give away

[topaz raptor]

Lol

Bro has no conception on history

The Ottomans conquered the land

[hoary flare]

Why did the Holocaust survivors even come to Palestine

[topaz raptor]

It was theirs

[topaz raptor]

Because it was their decision?

Should Europe block all middle eastern refugees

[hoary flare]

Umm so does that mean you can randomly lol into a country like that

[topaz raptor]

Yea?

I could go to any country on this planet and buy land right now

[hoary flare]

Sure as soon as Europe gives them their wealth and land back

[hoary flare]

That's just some great logic you have there

[topaz raptor]

So you’re saying I couldn’t move to anywhere on this planet tomorrow and buy up land?

[hoary flare]

Everyone didn't buy lands. Are u high

They stole lands

Who do think settlers are?

[topaz raptor]

They bought land from the government in power

[topaz raptor]

You are waffling. One moment you are crying about the British and the next you are talking about 21st century settlers

[hoary flare]

Exactly colonisers

[topaz raptor]

Absurdly stupid

You can’t even stick to a timeline

Go read a history book

[hoary flare]

You're ignoring the fact is that Israel commits war crimes and massacars

[topaz raptor]

You literally sound like someone who reads a single Wikipedia page and thinks they’re an expert on one of the most complex land disagreements in history

[topaz raptor]

I never fucking did that. I’ve always criticised IDF violence. You trying to bait me is shameful and embarrassing

You are clearly not worth talking to

Again, pick up a book instead of crying on Discord

[glossy haven]

If you're denying the fact that the british didn't take all of the jews and drop them in Palestine to get rid of them you haven't a clue what you're talking about, because that's quite literally what happened

[topaz raptor]

??? This is so funny

What the fuck are you talking about lmao

Do you legitimately believe the British just went around every European country to pick up Jews, put them on a ship headed for Israel?

The British literally limited Jewish immigration to British Palestine, and introduced yearly quotas.

[glossy haven]

Balfour Declaration

you can look that up you seem to be a bit lost

[topaz raptor]

And? Show me your sources on this:

If you're denying the fact that the british didn't take all of the jews and drop them in Palestine to get rid of them

This is what you said

Has nothing to do with the Balfour declaration

[glossy haven]

that's quite the whole point here isn't ? the british pushed people i to someone else's land and they have been quite literally fighting for their life since then

[topaz raptor]

Show me where and how and when the British "took all the Jews and dropped them in Palestine to get rid of them"

[glossy haven]

i just did ? the Balfour Declaration

[topaz raptor]

Do you know what the declaration is?

[glossy haven]

which led to nakba

[topaz raptor]

It literally just announced support for a Jewish state

[rough elbow]

THIS

[topaz raptor]

Show me where they "took all the Jews and dropped them in Palestine to get rid of them"

[glossy haven]

yeah but they had no where for them to go ? correct ?

where did they end up ? palestine

[topaz raptor]

Stop deflecting

[glossy haven]

it's not a deflection at all

[rough elbow]

Israel has bombed a refugee camp now

[topaz raptor]

You made a claim. You said the British took the jews and dropped them in Palestine to get rid of them

Back up that claim

[rough elbow]

Of Palestinians, killing 45

Just so you know

Further proof that neither side is innocent here

[topaz raptor]

I don't think anyone ever has claimed any side in this conflict is innocent

The IDF have done horrible shit

And they need to be controlled

[topaz raptor]

I think you clearly struggle with reading so I am going to make this very simple for you.

Your claim was this: The British took all the Jews and dropped them in Palestine to get rid of them.

I am asking you to back up this claim with numbers and sources. Show me when and where the British "took all these Jews". Where did they take these Jews from? Show me when they were literally dropped in Palestine.

[rough elbow]

One of the IDF generals essentially implied the Palestinian civilians were less important than the lives of Israeli civilians on American news last night, got called out, then backtracked.

And now today they bombed a refugee camp

[topaz raptor]

I am not asking about the Balfour Declaration. That merely announced support for a Jewish homeland. That's completely independent of the question being asked here. That is for you to prove that Britain "dumped these Jews in Palestine" as you so eloquently put it.

[glossy haven]

right one sec

[rough elbow]

And there will be no response from the US bc Americans here are too blinded by hatred for Arabs thanks to a grudge after 9/11 to see reason

[glossy haven]

Americans are only interested in supporting israel and the money

[topaz raptor]

I love when people make these bold claims, and when they are unable to back them up with facts, they just disappear into thin air

[real blaze]

is it dangerous to go to the movie tomorrow in NYC ?

[topaz raptor]

I think if there was any serious credible threat, the FBI would've informed the American public of that

But, the FBI is still human and humans make mistakes. You're more than likely going to be completely fine and it is up to you if you feel comfortable and safe enough to go

[patent sigil]

I believe The Mandate For Palestine aka The British Mandate is what you're looking for. The mandate required the British to put the Balfour Declaration in effect and they did . They oversaw the whole thing for three decades.

[real blaze]

thanks

[topaz raptor]

The British literally did the opposite. They LIMITED immigration to British Palestine with quotas.

They arrested illegal immigrants

Nazi concentration camp survivors who illegally migrated to British Palestine were infact arrested by British authorities

[patent sigil]

Part of overseeing immigration would be to have a controllable amount come in slowly. Having quotas is just being organized. This is literally nothing to argue about. Google is free.

[topaz raptor]

Yes Google is indeed free

Following the war, Berihah ("escape"), an organization of former partisans and ghetto fighters was primarily responsible for smuggling Jews from Eastern Europe through Poland. In 1946 Poland was the only Eastern Bloc country to allow free Jewish aliyah to Mandate Palestine without visas or exit permits.[38] By contrast, Stalin forcibly brought Soviet Jews back to USSR, as agreed by the Allies during the Yalta Conference.[39] The refugees were sent to the Italian ports from which they traveled to Mandatory Palestine. More than 4,500 survivors left the French port of Sète aboard President Warfield (renamed Exodus). The British turned them back to France from Haifa, and forced them ashore in Hamburg. Despite British efforts to curb the illegal immigration, during the 14 years of its operation, 110,000 Jews immigrated to Palestine. In 1945 reports of the Holocaust with its 6 million Jewish killed, caused many Jews in Palestine to turn openly against the British Mandate, and illegal immigration escalated rapidly as many Holocaust survivors joined the aliyah.

The British had literally no hand in bringing Jewish immigrants to Palestine

They came by their own choice, escaping persecution in Europe and Arabia

[patent sigil]

You're just showing how they did a shit job of it not that they didn't do it. They signed public international mandates and declarations and carried them out

[topaz raptor]

...

If you can't follow the conversation, it's not my fault

The original implication was that the British put them on ships and put them in Palestine

Which is a baseless lie

[patent sigil]

The Jews weren't only in Britain or just in Britain's colonies so that would be impossible. But they did control Palestine at the time and they oversaw the migration of Jewish people to Palestine. Not only that but they formed the deal that resulted in the migration in the first place.

[topaz raptor]

No, what resulted in the migration was the ruthless persecution of the Jewish people in the countries they migrated from

[patent sigil]

Those very same Jewish people were divided on even forming a state. The religious leaders saying that god exiled them and they shouldn't return until he returns them. And it could not have happened if the state that controlled Palestine (Britain) didn't let it happen. I am Jewish. And I'm Ethiopian. There are Canadian Jewish people, Austrian and on and on. These scattered people wouldn't have been able to form a state going against the strongest empire at the time; the "Great" Britain. Idk what you're trying to achieve by distancing them from this atrocity, there's plenty more on their hands

[topaz raptor]

You really need to read the context of this conversation

The other person claimed this:

If you're denying the fact that the british didn't take all of the jews and drop them in Palestine to get rid of them you haven't a clue what you're talking about, because that's quite literally what happened

This is flat out historical revionism and lying because no, the British did NOT just "take all of the jews and drop them in Palestine"

Jewish immigration to Palestine started well before the Balfour Declaration, all the way back in 1880. To say something as silly as "The British took the Jews and dropped them in Palestine" is removing all self-determination and authority from Jewish people, and is quite anti-semitic

Jewish people chose to immigrate to the Palestine area

There were a massive number of Jewish groups that funded ships and papers for Jewish refugees from Europe and the middle east to escape to Israel

[modern ruin]

I am sorry but I have severe inxziaty and I can not watch that, it makes me too scared

[crystal sedge]

That’s completely understandable!

[modern ruin]

I hate just hearing people talk about topics like these

[crystal sedge]

Well you don’t have to be in this chat /gen /nbr

[modern ruin]

every year when 9/11 comes around i always derad coming to school that day because I know for a fact that it will come up and when it does my stomach drops and my legs feel like jello and I also ocasionally feel like I will faint

[crystal sedge]

Oh

[modern ruin]

yeah...

[mortal coral]

a canadian was killed 😭

same

thats ridiculus

[topaz raptor]

That's a wild assumption to make when you are not even familiar with the history of India-Israel relations lol. Israel has been a key Indian ally in multiple wars before. Provided weapons and ammunition and intelligence during the Indo-Pakistan wars in 1971 and 1999. India is the largest client for Israeli military sales, and Israel is India's second largest supplier of gear. They've been close ever since the two countries were formed.

I really wish people here would stop and think and educate themselves before speaking on topics they are woefully misinformed on

[crystal sedge]

Holy shit https://www.tiktok.com/t/ZT8rwRLGP/

[topaz raptor]

Same everywhere in the west right now

https://news.sky.com/story/two-uk-jewish-schools-close-in-interests-of-the-safety-of-our-precious-children-12983327

[crystal sedge]

Atp, if I see or hear ANYTHING out of the ordinary tomorrow when I’m at the eras movie I’m getting my friends and we’re leaving I’m not going to take any chances

Even if my ear starts ringing or some shit I’m OUTTA THERE

[crystal sedge]

It’s so heartbreaking

[violet pollen]

israel and india have been great partners throughout the years that’s why. please don’t be so quick to judge

[tulip plume]

its almost october 13

im kinda scared :(

bc not only of the attacks

but the hate crimes that will begin to both jews and muslims in the US and around the world

[glossy haven]

just stay really aware and try to stay home if you can

[finite tide]

Why did the un give Israel land in the first place? Wasn't it Palestinian land?

[tulip reef]

The region was under the Ottoman Empire rule from 1541 to 1917, when thre British Mandate began - effectively taking over for both Jewish and Arab populations. The UN 1947 partition plan was suggested as part of the steps to end the Mandate. The plan was to create two independent states.

That, obviously, didn’t pan out

[finite tide]

What I'm saying is why was Israel formed there when there already was another group of ppl living there?

Also Why everyone here is talking about unnecessary stuffs when there's an ethnic genocide happening in Israel?

[obsidian hare]

europeans just wanted to get rid of the Jews

[finite tide]

You misunderstood 😭im talking about the ethnic cleansing of Palestinians

[topaz raptor]

It was British land

[topaz raptor]

Jews have also been living there…????

Why do you all think Jews just magically appeared in Israel post WW2

Jews had been moving back to Israel since 1880 when it was still Ottoman

Hamas supporters in the UK taking down posters of the people kidnapped by Hamas

[finite tide]

It was never British land. Just like you can't call pre 1947 india British land. They're colonisers.

[finite tide]

this is horrible.

Extremism will never bring a solution to this matter

[topaz raptor]

You are mixing legality with morality. Legally it was literally British land because they were the government and so had control and ownership over all public land. Jewish people bought their land from the British state, just like Arab people did

[finite tide]

You said that Jews were living there since the Ottoman era. So wouldn't that make them Palestinian Jews?Also I asked about Israel. Not Jews. Why was the nation formed there when Palestinians already lived there?

Oh wait you already explained the end part

[topaz raptor]

Jewish people were literally driven out of all Arab lands and forced to move to British Palestine. Why do you think the surrounding Arab states have literally zero Jews living in them? Because they were ethnic cleansed from those areas and forced into Palestine. This is why close to half of the Jews in Israel are of middle-eastern descent. Even in Palestine, the two groups - Muslims and Jews were constantly clashing with each other and burning each other's villages down. This is why a two state solution was proposed for both groups in the area to live peacefully. This two state solution was accepteed by Jewish leadership and rejected by Palestinian leadership

[finite tide]

That actually does make a lot of sense

Anyways I personally think the Israeli government is shit, terrorists are shit, the idf are shit. Give ppl their homes and lands back. Free Palestine so they can have their own country. Israelis live in peace and Palestinians live in peace. Half the world's problems are gone

[topaz raptor]

Palestinians don't want a two state solution

When they say from river to the sea, they mean they want the entirety of the land to be Palestine and for the Jews to be driven out of the area

[finite tide]

They want the whole country which is not ok. But they'll have to accept it otherwise this cycle of violence won't end

[finite tide]

You and I both know this won't come true. They need a proper leader

And Jewish ppl deserve their own state

[topaz raptor]

Hamas seek total authority over Palestine and if there ever was to emerge a leader who might threaten their absolute control, that person would die the very next day

Hamas seeks the genocide of all Jewish people

They state so very clearly in their charter

https://avalon.law.yale.edu/20th_century/hamas.asp

[finite tide]

Both sides want to obliterate each other and commit ethnic genocide

And in the mean time hamas attacks Israeli civilians and idf has been bombarding gaza innocent ppl. God's land God should figure out these.

[topaz raptor]

Israel at least seems willing to work with a two state solution, seeing as they unilaterally withdrew from Gaza back in 2005, and let them do their own governance

[finite tide]

How much area did that cover

[topaz raptor]

All of Gaza

[finite tide]

Eh they will never agree to that

[topaz raptor]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israeli_disengagement_from_Gaza

[finite tide]

At least the west bank and half of Jerusalem needs to be given to them

[topaz raptor]

Most of the two state solutions I have seen involve putting Jerusalem under UN mandate

That would be the best course of action

[finite tide]

Would that mean Jerusalem is like free of them and both sides can live there?

[topaz raptor]

This was the two state solution proposed back in 1947 that the Palestinian authorities refused

[topaz raptor]

It would mean that neither Israel nor Palestine would have authority over the city and people irrespective of religion or origin would be free to go there

[finite tide]

That's perfect

[granite saffron]

it is, the palestinians never agreed to it though

[finite tide]

I can't read maps which one's west bank

[granite saffron]

the right orange side

[topaz raptor]

The one in the east next to Transjordan

[finite tide]

Honestly I can't blame them. They want their homeland too. But they have to be logical

[granite saffron]

which they were literally gonna get

both sides were gonna get homelands

yet they denied that solution

so here we are 75 years later

[topaz raptor]

Seems like you have trouble reading

If you're going to be wilfully ignorant and ignore the multiple polls done in Palestine by various organisations which all independly concluded that more than half of Palestinians desire a one state solution, you are blind

?? Bro we got a Hamas apologist here

That's crazy

Not slayqueenhumpmededdy trying to justify for Hamas and denying the kidnapping when we literally have it all on video

You call paragliding into a music festival and murdering and raping women and killing people fighting??

You disgusting piece of shit

They went into homes of families and killed everyone and burned people alive

Killed a grandma and shared the video with her granddaughters

@topaz barn Can we not have these blatant Hamas apologism in this blessed server? What the hell

@topaz barn @stuck brook This is psychotic

[topaz barn]

ah ok

if we can't discuss civily then we can't discuss this at all

[south basin]

Ofc israel wants a two state solution, that's why they demanded that northern Gaza should be evacuated within a 24 hour period https://www.cbsnews.com/live-updates/israel-hamas-war-gaza-strip/

[granite saffron]

of course we want people to evcauate, so we only kill Hamas, not innocent people

we don't want their land

we wanna kill the terrorists in their land

[south basin]

even someone from the UN said it's impossible to evacuate a huge number like this in a matter of only 24 hours

this will lead to the loss of lives of so many palestinians, along with the cutting of of food, electricity and water

[tulip reef]

Would you rather not having any kind of warning? ‘Cause that would’ve resulted in a ton more casualties…

[topaz raptor]

The IDF said they know it will take several days and they are going to wait

They said 24 hours to highlight the importance of moving out quickly

They aren't going to storm into the city in 24 hours

[topaz raptor]

It's the responsibility of the government of Gaza, i.e. Hamas, to provide those supplies to the population. But Hamas is not interested in that

Hamas literally tore out the water pipes to make rockets with them

I wonder why Gaza does not have water

[south basin]

israel literally threatened to bomb egypt if we helped the palestinians, no palestinian should have to suffer for Hamas's decisions

literally all countries are silent as Israel uses illegal weapons (white phosphorus) on Palestinians

https://www.timesofisrael.com/?post_type=liveblog_entry&p=3117182

[topaz raptor]

Why should Israel be responsible for Palestine? Palestine can't simultaneously be independent while also totally reliant on foreign infrastructure for something as basic as water. Where is all the public infrastructure in Gaza? Qatar and Iran have been giving billions to Hamas, yet all they seem to care about is tearing out water pipes to make more rockets

Why would Hamas not build infrastructure to provide it's own people with the basic stuff?

[south basin]

do you even have any idea how many civilians wil die because of this? or do you only care if israeli lives are lost?

[topaz raptor]

Did you even hear what I said

[south basin]

so the good decision is for israel to cut off everything?

[topaz raptor]

If Egypt truly cares about Palestinians, why has Egypt locked it's border and is refusing to let Palestinian refugees in?

[south basin]

our president is shit and is a coward

thats why

[topaz raptor]

Isn't that what Hamas wants? To be completely independent from everything Israeli?

[south basin]

not all Palestinians are Hamas

[topaz raptor]

All Palestinians do not want to be free from Israel? And be a sovereign nation?

You can't simultaneously want to be a sovereign nation while also demanding that the country you are at war with provide you everything

Besides

Israel has made the conditions very clear. The moment Hamas releases all the hostages, Israel will resume supplies

So all they need to do is release all the hostages unharmed

[south basin]

and if they dont do that, all people living in Gaza will just die?

this is like someone hurts someone you know, so you go and kill off everyone they ever knew?

[topaz raptor]

That's not how it works thoughh

[south basin]

it is exactly how it works

[topaz raptor]

What is it that people in Gaza want? Do they want to be part of Israel or do they want to be a sovereign nation?

If they want to be a sovereign nation, they should build their own water supply

Would you expect Ukraine to provide supplies to Russia?

If Mexico started bombing the southern US border towns, would you expect the US to not cut off Mexico?

[south basin]

Israel should only attack people who wronged them and killed Israelis, not go after the entire people living in Gaza

[topaz raptor]

Israel is not attacking everyone in Gaza

The conditions are very clear, and Israel's actions are actually legal according to international law. Israel is performing a seige with a clear military objective in mind. And that is legal

[south basin]

why would you even compare ukraine to israel? just look at the palestinian vs israeli human cost of the war and tell me israel is the victim

[topaz raptor]

The Israeli cost would be just as high if it wasn't for the Iron Dome

[south basin]

who is the real victim?

[topaz raptor]

Can you read?

Did you miss where I said the Israeli cost would be just as high if it wasn't for the Iron Dome inercepting 95% of the rockets Hamas daily launches at Israeli cities

[south basin]

and why the hell would you attack unarmed, defenseless civilians in response to that? No one wants to see civilians die whatsoever, but most of these people suddenly speaking out never said a word when Palestinians continued to die and have their homes being forcibly removed from them, everyone cared when Israelis died.

Israel has a defense system, but Palestine doesn't. This protects a lot of Israelis, but who will protect Palestinians?

[granite saffron]

here's the thing, by international law, what we've done is legal, the second Hamas returns all hostages- unharmed, we will restore everything, they can't be at war with us yet want our food and water, if eygpt really cared, their border would be open.

now start reading before responding

[south basin]

i did read right now. did you see how israel told palestinians to evacuate northern gaza 'for their own safety' then attacked some people as they evacuated? did you know that turkish help arrived to el-arish airport in egypt and was not allowed in gaza? that Israel threatened to bomb egypt if we allowed the help to come in for people in Gaza? that Gaza is one of the most densely populated places on earth, because Palestinians truly have nowhere to go? Speaking of legal, is white phosphorus legal? isnt it internationally banned and considered a war crime to be used on civilians?

Please read this then reply x

[south basin]

'our food and water' so you threaten to bomb egypt if they try to give them OUR (i'm an egyptian) food and water?

[topaz raptor]

did you see how israel told palestinians to evacuate northern gaza 'for their own safety' then attacked some people as they evacuated?

The source for this is Hamas. So...lmao I'd sooner believe the crackhead under the overpass before I believed words out of Hamas's mouth.

did you know that turkish help arrived to el-arish airport in egypt and was not allowed in gaza? that Israel threatened to bomb egypt if we allowed the help to come in for people in Gaza?

I can find zero credible sources of information on this.

[south basin]

again, not all palestinians are hamas. im going to send a video of people being attacked as they try to evacuate.

https://www.reuters.com/world/turkish-red-crescent-says-cargo-plane-with-gaza-aid-arrives-egypt-2023-10-13/#:~:text="The first plane loaded with,on social messaging platform X. these are turkish officials saying help arrived in el-arish

[topaz raptor]

This says nothing about Israel threatening anyone

[south basin]

https://www.instagram.com/reel/CyPHKMauPkp/?utm_source=ig_web_copy_link&igshid=MzRlODBiNWFlZA==

ajplus

Israel’s military told Palestinians to “get out” of Gaza by crossing into Egypt, then bombed the only road out three times in 24 hours. ⁣
⁣
Rafah is controlled by Egypt and Israel and is the only open crossing in or out of occupied Gaza, after Israel announced a complete “siege” and blocked entry of all food, water or fuel. ⁣
⁣
Israel’s airstrik...

Likes

44703

Instagram

[topaz raptor]

Yikes AJPlus?

That's your source?

This is AJ+

[south basin]

https://www.aa.com.tr/en/middle-east/israel-threatens-egypt-on-gaza-aid-delivery/3014394

[ivory plaza]

https://vxtwitter.com/AOC/status/1712691970676580602?t=IOwsubo-VV45gvBQV55xTQ&s=19

https://fxtwitter.com/status/1712628539806138546

[topaz raptor]

Bro literally has genocidal statements in his bio

[south basin]

im sorry, didnt some jews escape from europe to palestine after the holocaust? and then they were granted their own land like they wanted. Ofc millions of people were died and tortured, and that should never happen again. I would never claim otherwise, i was one of the people who made other people hate Kanye west after he said he supported hitler

[topaz raptor]

...

Jesus

[ivory plaza]

https://vxtwitter.com/TorahJudaism/status/1712571675466752239?t=l-zExkmNrNInbqedIHcfuA&s=19

[ivory plaza]

You can lie, but that doesn't make it real 🥴

[topaz raptor]

That statement is literally used to vocalise support for ethnic cleansing the Jewish people out of the region to create an Islamic state

[south basin]

ethnic cleansing? who the hell is doing the ethnic cleansing?

[ivory plaza]

No, it quite literally says that Palestinians should be free from their prison if you can read

[topaz raptor]

It's a motto used by Hamas

[ivory plaza]

Israel

[south basin]

exactly

[ivory plaza]

They're even attacking Israelis who protest for Palestinians and lock up people who refuse to join the IDF

[south basin]

the people who kick palestinians out of their own homes, do you know the events of Sheikh Jarrah in 2021?

[topaz raptor]

That phrase is literally the motto of Hamas and the PFLP. Both of whom, in their charters, explicitly call for the genocide of Jewish people

[ivory plaza]

https://vxtwitter.com/TorahJudaism/status/1712715931057606830?t=9sHWeOGiopMtEEBQ33B0Mw&s=19

[topaz raptor]

lock up people who refuse to join the IDF
Happens in literally every state with a draft. Would happen in fucking Switzerland if you refused military service.

[ivory plaza]

Yes, and that's bad