brM is 4 buttons
#guardian
iron bane
It is
forest flume
I think you can just taunt it ? It should fixate on you and not attack anyone else if that's the concern
red knoll
Yes i play 4 currently
iron bane
I am not saying it isn't. I am just saying ... I main monk and it is also brain dead
iron bane
Brew is the easiest thing ever
olive hare
You cant seriously say Anni VDH is more complex than no apex bear.
olive compass
every brew ive played with was getting dicked by me in damage
iron bane
Vdh is harder than bear
fathom walrus
No apex bear is significantly more braindead than any other spec out there
And i love it
Zug zug
olive hare
Its squishier than bear, but rotationally its just as dumb, if not dumber. Literally everything you do is peanuts as long as you react to your meta procs properly, amp your spiritbombs and dont waste voidfall stacks.
coral rampart
hey guys, depleted Seat 19 by 1min with only 2 death, dps was a bit low but I think I can also improve the route, that's my current, any suggestions? 🙂
lucid arrow
u do realise complexity of a class comes from rotational decisions and not just changing the positioning of keys you're spamming
like if you just substitute moonfire for raze it's not really any more complex
half surge
hey guys, depleted Seat 19 by 1min with only 2 death, dps was a bit low but I th...
pull 8 is.. very dangerous
i hope u understand that
olive compass
hey guys, depleted Seat 19 by 1min with only 2 death, dps was a bit low but I th...
your first room is very weird
4 & 7 are weird too
you dont need pull 12
olive hare
pull 8 is.. very dangerous
I'd assume its a chain, not all at once
olive compass
hey guys, depleted Seat 19 by 1min with only 2 death, dps was a bit low but I th...
this is what ive been using
lucid arrow
why not add the mobs to the left on 6 so you can skip the chain at 8
should be more efficient
lyric wraith
I think you can just taunt it ? It should fixate on you and not attack anyone el...
it screches if ur out of range
wild charge fixed the problem
coral rampart
pull 8 is.. very dangerous
yeah I link it when the warden is dead, not pulling all at once (I take patrol + warden, then link)
lucid arrow
it screches if ur out of range
you can start running at it before cast finishes
either the cast is overstating dmg duration or one tick deals no dmg
not sure which it is
prolly the latter just pop FR and charge to time it with cast finish rather than starting after it ends
coral rampart
you dont need pull 12
no issue in PUG with aggro during boss?
olive compass
no issue in PUG with aggro during boss?
not so far
i dont "like" it but most pugs in 20s+ wont even start the key if you have that pull
lyric wraith
wild charge is enough, it just charges u right in
after 3rd boss, do people do the wild charge little jump in deer form?
for skyreach rp
or do you wait to fly to your ally's position in human form?
atomic glacier
i dont "like" it but most pugs in 20s+ wont even start the key if you have that ...
I feel like more and more groups in high keys have started doing pull 12 lately
mostly because at least in my case 80% of depletes are because of 3rd boss
and timer is kinda chill
more space on that boss
coral rampart
4 & 7 are weird too
4 I chain into boss during boss fight, 7 I have the DK grip the caster for a bigger pull into warden but yh it's kinda weird
lucid arrow
after 3rd boss, do people do the wild charge little jump in deer form?
charge if you're first
coral rampart
this is what ive been using
thx for sharing!
lyric wraith
more space on that boss
thats what ive been doing
lucid arrow
jump to ally if not
lyric wraith
the pull next to 3rd boss that everyone avoids
coz every single 20 ive done has bricked to 3-5 deaths on 3rd boss
forest flume
it screches if ur out of range
Ye, I always just taunt then charge, prevents the random melee hit on anyone who dares going too fast - any boss that you have to get out of melee like that taunt is your best friend, forces boss to hit you no matter what
coral rampart
this is what ive been using
- how do you skip from pull 13 to pull 14?
- is pull 14 not too dangerous with triple weaver?
red knoll
Some of yall have the wildest pulls
olive compass
- how do you skip from pull 13 to pull 14?
- is pull 14 not too dangerous with t...
gate or evoker
olive compass
that is standard in high keys
coral rampart
Some of yall have the wildest pulls
what's yours?
red knoll
Standard in keys that dont have idiot pugs
olive compass
just high keys
red knoll
You can rescue 4 people?
olive compass
you've really never done this ?
he rescues 1
then he gets on mammoth or yak
and you just jump on it to climb
its like most standard tech of the season since warlocks arent meta anymore
red knoll
I havent pushed in weeks tbf but how are you living pull 1
olive compass
also like half the classes in the game can just jump tbh
olive compass
I havent pushed in weeks tbf but how are you living pull 1
its free ?
you're lusting
might be the easiest pack in the dungeon
lasts maybe 50s
red knoll
4 charges 1 shot you
atomic glacier
if you gather it fast they dont charge
olive compass
how would you get charged
atomic glacier
and you can survive 4 charges
olive compass
only time ive ever gotten charged and died was when my aug got double knock without stunning
atomic glacier
For the first few seconds when they enter combat they just run towards you like normal
They only charge after it's been like idk 5 seconds maybe
red knoll
Maybe my dps been slowing them then
Idk
I always get charged by left pack on my monk
red knoll
Ive never had a healer able to keep the group up
atomic glacier
on monk I like pulling this instead
red knoll
And me
olive compass
Ive never had a healer able to keep the group up
group isnt taking damage
red knoll
Even at 17s
atomic glacier
it's easier with the aggro being a bit wonky after the newer changes
olive compass
you are
atomic glacier
tanking it on X
olive compass
90% of specs
red knoll
Youre taking at least 1 group of chains
olive compass
can dispel their own chains
you overlap the first 2
and you dispel both at once
after that healer is in lust so he just heals for free
red knoll
Yes? And then the 2nd wave happens and people die lol
olive compass
how would they die
red knoll
Happens every time
olive compass
they have defensives
red knoll
Idk
olive compass
ive done this in 20/21s several times
no one has ever died
maybe dont invite frost mage to your key or smth
if you play standard aug/dk/dh they wont die
lucid arrow
they have defensives
people dont press them in lower keys
red knoll
Well
lucid arrow
by 'lower' i mean it takes a lot of people till 17s to realise they should put their defs on their hotbars
olive compass
I play with a frost mage
yea dont
earnest chasm
what is easier to play elune or claw ?
olive compass
comp obviously matters
in 17s it really doesnt
but like
obviously if you're playing with garbage players
having them play the unkillable specs help
red knoll
The orbs this week have been super buggy
rustic kestrel
having them play the unkillable specs help
i like inviting uhdk and dh just because they are tankier so if my pugs are more braindead they have a higher chance of living
fleet cargo
Playing a tankier dps spec IS technically a defensive, lol
sleek lintel
after I clear WRS of loot it's MT next
latent badger
Is it possible to use /stopmacro with forms? If I want certain macro not to work if I'm in bear form?
rustic kestrel
they also do 2x as much damage as the other specs but
Sshhh
olive hare
they also do 2x as much damage as the other specs but
Twice as much as Aug and Demo? 
fierce ether
Hey guys do anyone have any idea how to hide mangle proc from base ui ?
olive compass
Twice as much as Aug and Demo? <:bearThinking:259291466277322752>
demo too squishy to be played rn and aug doesnt count
doesnt do damage if the others dont either
olive hare
doesnt do damage if the others dont either
moot point, the performance of a single spec is largely affected by the performance of the group, always.
olive compass
your group can do zero damage
and your uh or devourer will still be doing 1m on big packs
aug wont
olive hare
Your tank could do 50k dmg. Uh and Devourer will explode, aug will live 🤓
olive compass
how would they explod
olive hare
threat
olive compass
press taunt
olive hare
okay, they'll explode after 8 seconds, thats something
olive compass
but you're being ridiculous on purpose so this conversation is over
olive hare
I was just making fun of a hyperbole, you made it a ridiculousness challenge
Btw that tank does 50k dmg and dps just explode is very real in pug keys....Thought it was impossible, but the wave of pug bear alts is massive and yep, they still struggle with threat. Fotm rerollers never cease to amaze me
red knoll
I only struggle with warriors who charge on gather and bladestorm now
olive compass
thats crazy
i dont think ive lost threat on guardian yet
but on brew dh collapsing star during gather is my nightmare
red knoll
Its just until thrash comes back up
But still
Long enough for warrior to maybe die
Also thrashing on stairs
Sometimes doesnt hit mobs in range
Super awesome
olive compass
Sometimes doesnt hit mobs in range
yea thats a take a quick backstep and move forward again angle
olive compass
spam mf
rustic kestrel
Hey guys do anyone have any idea how to hide mangle proc from base ui ?
settings > spell alert opactiy > 0
warning: this will also hide GG and Gore, and will also hide procs all all of your other toons without an addon
fallen isle
does this apply to thrash
red knoll
Soothe huge
hollow onyx
Btw that tank does 50k dmg and dps just explode is very real in pug keys....Thou...
Thrash-> Swipe/MoonFire->Thrash->Ironskin
Remember Swipe resets Thrash so does MoonFire Dot
So it is benifical to have MF on eveything
red knoll
Wut
red knoll
Motherfuckers in here unironically advocating pressing swipe
hollow onyx
turbid night
but you're being ridiculous on purpose so this conversation is over
he actually made perfect sense, you're assuming everyone is playing well to say those two specs can do their max dps, but then you give a case of where aug can't do their damage properly (which btw is contradicting your own statement in a case where the other dps are the two you were talking about)
he offered the same idea to you that the other players performance can affect their damage, just like you did, and you dismiss him as being ridiculous
hollow onyx
I never use Maul and hardly use Mangle becaue MF hits just as hard IMO
quaint pond
you might want to re-read that spell
hollow onyx
If you are using space bear tree
olive hare
you still hit maul in single target, yes.
hollow onyx
not realy it doesn't change dps much for me. I have not worked it in much but have not had issues with aggro
olive compass
he actually made perfect sense, you're assuming everyone is playing well to say ...
that's incorrect, if you play frost mage bad and uhdk bad then uh will still do more damage at equal levels of skill
one is just better than the other in terms of raw numbers
obviously a good mage will probbaly do more damage than a terrible dk, thats common sense
hollow onyx
Either it does or it doesnt
I just have not ran the numbers
turbid night
that's incorrect, if you play frost mage bad and uhdk bad then uh will still do ...
now you're just changing what the conversation was about. it was about aug
olive hare
Lets just bury that ridiculous debate. No need to move the goalpost to make unreasonable considerations appear more reasonable.
olive compass
:kekw
turbid night
Lets just bury that ridiculous debate. No need to move the goalpost to make unre...
ngl I'm curious if he has a response about aug but probs better to forget it
olive hare
Tbh it was never intended to become a serious debate 
Saying udk and dev doubling other specs dmg in m+ is the captain obvious of hyperboles. I was just pointing towards two specs which are about as busted (demo) or even more busted (aug).
trim plaza
Tbh it was never intended to become a serious debate <:happybear:555713201879253...
everyone gangsta until u check dungeon logs and aug is on top
hot take, delete this spec already
olive hare
But there are offmeta specs which come really close to the performance of the current meta ones, like arms or feral, ofc given the right comp as well.
olive compass
But there are offmeta specs which come really close to the performance of the cu...
i'd consider those meta
they're the pillar of melee cleaves
olive hare
lets say special meta
trim plaza
But there are offmeta specs which come really close to the performance of the cu...
sadly feral heals bosses with their shiet single target dps
turbid night
yeah I kinda also have a problem with people saying stuff like that, bujt then when they started talking about demo being squishy when the original point was damage, was kinda silly too lol
olive hare
And also hilarious by itself, WL maybe not as tanky as udk, but its still very tanky and selfsustainable for a caster. Thats always been one of WLs strong points.
olive compass
yeah I kinda also have a problem with people saying stuff like that, bujt then w...
i mean if you're dead you can't do damage, thats as obvious as it gets but i wont try to make you understand it
turbid night
if they change apex talent to be more useful for tankiness outside of cds (it's not like you can hold ironfur until incarn is done), would that be much better?
hollow onyx
you might want to re-read that spell
welp I did and your right I am dumb. It only reset mangle. Thought it said thrash too sorry for the misinofmation
turbid night
not that bear is struggling with tankiness, but I was thinking why apex is not as good
hazy mural
warlocks as o damn useful as well
turbid night
i mean if you're dead you can't do damage, thats as obvious as it gets but i won...
oh dang, that kinda directly acknowledges the guy's point actually. you both agree on this
rustic kestrel
Incarning one pack, then using apex Ravage shields + frenzied regens on the next pack easily helps you get to the next incarn
olive hare
oh dang, that kinda directly acknowledges the guy's point actually. you both agr...
dayum he got you @olive compass didnt see that opening
sleek lintel
oof, every armor recraft takes an infused hide? rough
turbid night
just feels bad to have to hold your things that you usually are trying to rotate cleanly, until after it's done, ya know? feels like it should be a different way
rustic kestrel
its super flexible that way
you can send it in incarn for a ton more burst
or use it so you have extra outside of incarn
hazy mural
man that would feel so icky
rustic kestrel
thats why the apex is so fucking cool
hazy mural
having to not use the apex till after incarn
rustic kestrel
I do that shit all the time
red knoll
not that bear is struggling with tankiness, but I was thinking why apex is not a...
Apex is just as good if not better when used properly
turbid night
point is, if it was maybe a different button (not asking for this, just an example) THEN it would be flexible. as it is right now, it's limiting because you can't use just it and save the stronger one for later'
olive hare
Same, always good to get that incarn cd rolling early and saving the wigu burst for when it makes a difference.
rustic kestrel
its not limiting though
you can hold it for 2 minutes before you hit WiGu
unless you want to hold a cooldown for 4 minutes for some reason
hazy mural
my smooth brain dont like it 
forest flume
(jk kill me now)
rustic kestrel
Oh yes sorry 1 button press every 2 minutes
hazy mural
me get big power, me use big power
rustic kestrel
I just know the apex rework is going to be some tragic rng proc and thats sad
hazy mural
with great power comes great haste to use said power
turbid night
I guess incarn is not really that defensive so maybe this makes it an amazing defensive press too
sleek lintel
I guess incarn is not really that defensive so maybe this makes it an amazing de...
eh?
hazy mural
I just know the apex rework is going to be some tragic rng proc and thats sad
I cooked up the perfect apex
red knoll
Incarn is amazingly defensive
hazy mural
forest flume
I cooked up the perfect apex
when you press incarn your character gets swapped to a monk?
sleek lintel
Incarn also buffs your hp by 30% and lets you spam Thrash lol
forest flume
i know how you operate
red knoll
People just be saying shit today
olive hare
Bulok did you read my apex idea yesterday? I ~~stole ~~took your S2 tierset prediction and turned into a 12.1 apex idea
hazy mural
when you press incarn your character gets swapped to a monk?
well I used monk's apex as the base
turbid night
right I'm glad you guys are saying that. so it's better if we can keep the superpowered ironfur and f regen for outside incarn right?
rustic kestrel
let me go look, everything in this discord has been a blur for 2 weeks
hazy mural
when u thrash u have a chance to proc a TnC
turbid night
thats my point, lame to have to avoid pressing it at all
hazy mural
when u Bark u get a free TnC
when ur out of combat and go into combat u get a free TnC
turbid night
I absolutely love that everyone jumped on that rofl
sleek lintel
it's actually nuts how strong matted fur is this expac
hazy mural
it's actually nuts how strong matted fur is this expac
its sleeper for sure
olive hare
rustic kestrel
but you dont have to avoid pressing it
olive hare
there you go
rustic kestrel
You have INFINITE flexibility
hazy mural
saw SR... DELETE THIS
rustic kestrel
not horrible
turbid night
but you dont *have* to avoid pressing it
that is true honestly, I am thinking of it in a wrong way, you have to press the cd again to get the superpowered ones
rustic kestrel
I made one yesterday too, put a lot of thought into balancing between hero specs, thematics, and paying homeage to the current one
hazy mural
I use SR cause cba... but if apex made of SR, im out
rustic kestrel
that is true honestly, I am thinking of it in a wrong way, you have to press the...
yea
and you have 2 minutes until incarn is off cd to press it
turbid night
my mistake, I was being very dumb
turbid night
it is usually about 1 min cd off incarn during active play with proper rage dumping?
rustic kestrel
yeah average incarn is 2 mins
you cant track it while apex is sitting there, so you dont want to get too close to it
I have heavily thought about making an addon that predicts your incarns cd
I could get relatively close
turbid night
that's something they gotta give a proper change for in cdm
rustic kestrel
yeah
Without killing blows I could make a guarenteed tracker
but killing blows complicates things with the addon restrictions
green kayak
Apex should not encourage being forced into a specific talent in the capstone of the tree, we already dealt with those pain points from EC and lunar beam before
olive hare
I use SR cause cba... but if apex made of SR, im out
dont hate it 
Think of the possibilities. Does something for raze/ravage builds just like for thrash centric builds while also making good use out of dotc's bleed stuff, ultimately turning SR into a biiig button which might even be worth getting the cd reduction for. Thats what I'm missing while playing bear currently, we lack a decent short offensive cooldown. Okay LB sorta qualifies for EC, but still, something like a deathbringer bdk's reapers mark.
rustic kestrel
I love Sundering roar, I just wish it was better
And that the animation wasnt turbo garbage
sleek lintel
I'm just having a blast cause the last time I mained bear was SL
rustic kestrel
it makes me feel like im lagging as my bear slowly stands up
green kayak
Double sundering roars duration and suddenly it would be broken because you could actually benefit from tend and tear stacks for a while
rustic kestrel
I was playing with it as dotc yesterday
stacking up to 10 rnt stacks for ravage echoes
can get ~4 ravage echoes in the window during incarn
olive hare
yeah the short duration plus that it doesnt contribute to those thrash stacks at all made it a fairly dead choice outside of no apex nonsense.
rustic kestrel
I think it also needs another section, if you use it at 5, it lets you go to 10, if you are below 5, it should set targets to 5
so You can use it as a damage cd, or a defensive cd on pull
olive hare
Good idea yeah
sleek lintel
I still have 5 more bonus rolls I can use
I'm actually to the point I'm debating if I even care about Embellishments cause you don't get crest discounts on those suckers
rustic kestrel
typically embellishments are worth more than the 4 ilevel on cloak/wrist
hollow onyx
I am glad I joined this discord. I am learning a ton sheet. Gonna go look at my build closer still more to improve on.
sleek lintel
yeah, but it's the extra 80 crests over drops that sucks when grinding them out
Cause for whatever damn reason Blizzard can't make crafted gear get discounts
rustic kestrel
I am glad I joined this discord. I am learning a ton sheet. Gonna go look at my ...
when people aren't yelling at each other its a great place to learn
hollow onyx
So no one uses swipe at all?
hazy mural
when people aren't yelling at each other its a great place to learn
NO, UR WRONG! 
rustic kestrel
You use it as dotc, very few specific cases to use it as ec
sleek lintel
you can use swipe, but it's about equal to just spamming moonfire with no apex
so just spamming moonfire is easier
hollow onyx
yeah I never picked the apex tree up. wish they just added it to your tire set.
hollow onyx
so just spamming moonfire is easier
Yes I spam that crap all the time.
and dump most of my rage into IF
brave cedar
anyone defaulted back to raze with the nerf a few days ago?
or is it just not worth it without apex
olive hare
you can use swipe, but it's about equal to just spamming moonfire with no apex
I seriously doubt filling with swipe is anywhere close to filling with moonfire for no apex, especially since its biggest upside - the high chance for gore procs in AoE - doesnt do anything. Dont underestimate the extra LB uptime.
hollow onyx
My thought is swipe till everything has MF dot.
MF isn't on GCD correct? I am spamming that like every sec till thrash is off CD
but back and forth Swipe-MF
brazen tinsel
it absolutely is on the gcd
halcyon jackal
how many stacks do you swap for myth imperator ?
hollow onyx
so like less than a sec gcd? Guess my haste is great!
turbid night
normal gcd
imagine off the gcd, holyy
weave in between buttons, sounds crazy though
jovial turtle
anyone wanna look at some bear m+ log?
grand plinth
I can
grand plinth
I seriously doubt filling with swipe is anywhere close to filling with moonfire ...
Yeah in nopex spamming moonfire is better
grand plinth
For dotc I'm still testing but I think the value of swipe is better than mf situationally
jovial turtle
hold tf up arent you the brybear 😮 dotc god?
grand plinth
Yeah
violet holly
double agent
jovial turtle
thats pretty cool
rustic kestrel
There was a time when if the phrase dotc was even whispered it was linked to me
now im washed
rustic kestrel
hazy mural
There was a time when if the phrase dotc was even whispered it was linked to me
ARENT U THAT ASS MANGLER!?
rustic kestrel
Once an ass mangler, always an ass mangler
hollow onyx
Whats your story @grand plinth do I need to pay money or something to take advise from you?
violet holly
about the echo from wg, if my target dies before the final echo, can I swap and have like the other target be hit by the 2nd echo?
rustic kestrel
it unfortunately fizzles
rustic kestrel
If you arent in range when an echo is supposed to hit it will be skipped
but the series of echoes will continue
So if you move out at the 4s echo, you can still go back in for the one at 8s
violet holly
I think I had that happen a few times
grand plinth
Whats your story <@147626714258866177> do I need to pay money or something to ta...
Lol no I'm just here to help out
rustic kestrel
Lol no I'm just here to help out
time to paywall
hollow onyx
Lol no I'm just here to help out
Ok I didnt want to upset the godfather if that was your title.
violet holly
Ok I didnt want to upset the godfather if that was your title.
pay up or be gone
for UI string
weakauras
red knoll
I dont
hazy mural
Unironically Bulok is goated tho
he likes playing with bugs tho 🤢
rustic kestrel
I keep telling myself
I wil not bugtest the next patch
(i 100% will do it again)
red knoll
I would never have a big mouth
hazy mural
dw, in 2 yrs time, Catha will make u do the theorycrafting and finally take a holiday
then suddenly ur the TC for years 
copper hornet
You can stop whenever you want
rustic kestrel
I can barely change the ironfur stack line in the apl
I tried to change a maul line the other day and somehow nothing changed
hazy mural
I can barely change the ironfur stack line in the apl
can bearly do it? 
hollow onyx
i just have a big mouth
As long as you acknowledge it. Like I posted earlier entirely in the wrong. I took the time to learn though. Awesome discord for me so far.
rustic kestrel
I deleted an entire line and nothing changed?????
olive hare
yeah I would never take that job
Cmon doing the laundry for gas wouldnt be that bad, just like taking Kele out for a walkie walkie occassionally
copper hornet
Thats just lack of practice, its not bad once you mess around with it a bit
copper hornet
I deleted an entire line and nothing changed?????
Perhaps that line never mattered
rustic kestrel
As long as you acknowledge it. Like I posted earlier entirely in the wrong. I to...
keep watching, we could break out into some stupid fucking argument on a whim
hazy mural
I think DOTC is cooler than EC Nosex
hollow onyx
Lol sounds like the military.
rustic kestrel
NOSEX
hazy mural
olive hare
Its apesex.
rustic kestrel
ono
hazy mural
it fell out of favor a few days ago 
copper hornet
EC virgin build
hazy mural
Apesex and Nosex
olive hare
Join the wild side. Only a couple of seconds every two minutes. But those are worth it 100%.
rustic kestrel
Nopex bears are literally physically smaller than apex bears
so you know who the real apex predator is
torn depot
ive always been an apex believer
hazy mural
can just do a long gather and have a long foreplay? 
rustic kestrel
Oh my god when they rework apex theyre going to forget about the size increase and we're going to lose it and ill cry
hazy mural
Oh my god when they rework apex theyre going to forget about the size increase a...
its not the size that counts... its how u use the apex =/
olive hare
thinking about it, if apex is apesex, is delaying the wigu charges basically....tantric suppression of the climax?
grand plinth
I'm gonna work on a video I think
hollow onyx
Nopex bears are literally physically smaller than apex bears
wuht? this a joke? I have noticed some bears are bigger than me 
grand plinth
With my DOTC thoughts
rustic kestrel
wuht? this a joke? I have noticed some bears are bigger than me <:mocking:366335...
that means they have apex
hazy mural
wuht? this a joke? I have noticed some bears are bigger than me <:mocking:366335...
apex literally makes u a bigger bear
rustic kestrel
it has a hidden size increase once you take a point in the 2nd talent
grand plinth
Like i understand that lots of top bears are still playing EC but all the logs I've looked at still suggest DOTC is the play for your timer
olive hare
It must be intentional, to represent that mastery amp.
hollow onyx
Freaking crazy
torn depot
rustic kestrel
It must be intentional, to represent that mastery amp.
probably a dev who loved the increase from rots and didnt want it to go to waste
hollow onyx
Then EC needs to float at all times!
grand plinth
I have been wondering if thats worth trying again
torn depot
i'd say its burstier and more consistent than dotc apex
olive hare
Like i understand that lots of top bears are still playing EC but all the logs I...
Can definatly see that in highkeys. Last UDK rework added some serious funnel to the spec, the DK really doesnt mind you letting the shitters live a little longer.
torn depot
dont have to rely on ravage rng, just drop lunar beam and apex
but dotc apex feels really good for the big uptime on the bleed/dr thing
red knoll
Like i understand that lots of top bears are still playing EC but all the logs I...
It is. People are just following the leader per usual.
grand plinth
It is. People are just following the leader per usual.
Right its less that and more that I do think those leaders are probably smarter than me
red knoll
EC tends to pad a lot and kill funnel classes
grand plinth
And theres something they know that I don't
red knoll
I legitimately think its just ease
hollow onyx
Like i understand that lots of top bears are still playing EC but all the logs I...
I just like the space bear theme is all 
ashen ether
current EC feels much tankier than dotc did before the thrash changes though. What are you losing going back to dotc?
grand plinth
Can definatly see that in highkeys. Last UDK rework added some serious funnel to...
Also my team just does insane ST and being DOTC helps. We had a like 2:44 boss kill on Skyreach last boss 21
Absolutely blew it up
red knoll
Ec being tankier is completely false
red knoll
It might feel tankier to some people who dont use dotc properly
red knoll
Numbers wise dotc should be slightly tankier
torn depot
EC has more self heal, but Dotc has actual damage reduction
red knoll
Vs all but specifically arcane damage?
grand plinth
I tried Seat as EC and the tank buster was nearly one shooting me
torn depot
dotc also has 6% magic dr vs all, instead of 3%
grand plinth
If I didnt have something up
red knoll
Yeah
lyric wraith
is it a placebo or are the regrowth procs actually pretty good when cast on dps/heals
red knoll
I think ec is only tankier specifically against arcane damage
rustic kestrel
NPX first+2nd pull
olive hare
I legitimately think its just ease
Its 100% simplicity. The current R1 bdk is playing San, which largely outperforms DB in terms of damage throughput, and also has a superior profile. But in this case you didnt see people hopping onto the hypetrain, because San is WAY harder to pull off decently than DB is.
red knoll
Im not saying everyone playing bear at the top level is a bad player, but some of them are not good bears
hollow onyx
At what key do you see a diff between dotc and EC?
red knoll
Or arent putting in the work needed to optimize, which the ec build doesnt really need
Like they can get by just being a good tank and knowing how to play at that level and the routes
grand plinth
At what key do you see a diff between dotc and EC?
I would say even at the top level its doesnt super matter and you can play what you want. Most keys this season you can time easily by just playing safe
red knoll
Without optimizing the spec and class
grand plinth
If you start running into the timer being your brick condition than its time to start optimizing
red knoll
I need some routes cuz the method ones are starting to be unoptimal at the 18 range
ashen ether
I have had to change a ton of routes that pugs keep fucking up
rustic kestrel
Also my team just does insane ST and being DOTC helps. We had a like 2:44 boss k...
I had a 2:45 first boss of AA on 20 two days ago
never seen it that fast
grand plinth
Yeah I think people dont realize that bosses are half your key
hollow onyx
I would say even at the top level its doesnt super matter and you can play what ...
I agree
grand plinth
ST matters a ton still
rustic kestrel
usually around 3:10, 3:20
ashen ether
AA feels like a huge st dungeon
olive hare
I had a 2:45 first boss of AA on 20 two days ago
That UDK probably realized he shouldnt use epidemic on add spawns in a moment of mental clarity
rustic kestrel
I was also playing dotc so I didnt giga pad the ads
grand plinth
AA feels like a huge st dungeon
Its basically a 5 boss dungeon
grand plinth
I was also playing dotc so I didnt giga pad the ads
Keeping the funnel alive is crazy
Actually OP
oblique moat
Holding their cds for no reasonb
sorry i'm saving for next key
rustic kestrel
how else will they dick down the tiny insignificant bird pack
red knoll
Insane work
olive hare
Dps griefing the timer on the miniboss
thats SO true.
hazy mural
Its basically a 5 boss dungeon
my fav is when im like 2nd damage as holy priest on that miniboss 
violet holly
If I have a tier proc does the echo consume it?
wild kite
anyone find that waking nightmares is kinda useless in the moonbear thrash m+ build?
does such a insignificant amount of damage that it's likely worth shifting it into another talent, moonless night maybe for more ST or a second point in reinvigoration
hushed harbor
is there a brain dead build for raid too or regular one?
rustic kestrel
does such a insignificant amount of damage that it's likely worth shifting it in...
itl do like 5-7% overall for one point
its decent
also Moonless night wont do anything for you without raze/apex
wild kite
itl do like 5-7% overall for one point
i've not been seeing it get that high, is it's mini thrash adding onto our thrash damage on details?
hollow onyx
Thrash isnt direct
Then I have to keep swipe in my rotation
hazy mural
i've not been seeing it get that high, is it's mini thrash adding onto our thras...
it is 2 lots of damage on logs and adding em together is usually around 6pct
hollow onyx
I pick up Moonless
rustic kestrel
i've not been seeing it get that high, is it's mini thrash adding onto our thras...
look at logs, not details
it will have 2 seperate numbers
Moonless only deals damage off of Maul/mangle
sorry and auto attacks and starsurge
If you arent razing, its a useless point
red knoll
Ill raze u
violet holly
I guess no one likes raze anymore
hollow onyx
Moonless only deals damage off of Maul/mangle
dim gulch
sorry and *auto attacks* and *starsurge*
Thrash has 50% chance to trigger starsurge
oblique moat
rustic kestrel
Thrash has 50% chance to trigger starsurge
yes, but uh, moonless night is not going to do much from those
it is certainly not worth the point
violet holly
starsurge dmg is so low it even hides under thrash dmg in logs
jagged light
sundering roar is just such a weird cooldown
trim plaza
yep it feels just so bad to use, even if its small dmg upgrade
outer cave
Think blizz will announce more tank tuning today?
vernal fog
I’d like to see dps spec tuning and healer tuning more
outer cave
sonic quest
So it’s been a few days since the bear nerf. is it still any good?
outer cave
Think its still the best tank atm
brazen tinsel
So it’s been a few days since the bear nerf. is it still any good?
yes, the nerf doesnt matter much
you just do a little bit less dmg
sonic quest
So If I managed to live the first three seconds the survivability should be pretty good still?
outer cave
Why ppl say bear squish early on? With barkskin and surv instincts should be able to live?
edgy merlin
well, you use them because you are squishy early on into the pull
you are missing 15% dr from thrash stacks and 12% from moonfires and dont have that many ironfurs
you take more than double dmg without those
compared to later into the pull
frosty herald
What is the new rotation for EC no apex M+ and EC Raid ST max dps?
lone flare
gang what the hell is causing these stupid squares and circles around my UI X_X i barely use addons
it's not there all the time
if i open edit for Ui it goes away
hollow onyx
I have heard this from someone else. What do you all think of removing timer from Mythic up to at lest 15s? Then they come back into play.
hollow onyx
gang what the hell is causing these stupid squares and circles around my UI X_X ...
Have you disabled all adds? Then enable them one at a time?
lone flare
it's not there ALL the time
hollow onyx
Could be addons
lone flare
it's only there SOME of the time
so i haven't been able to identify the addon
often in combat
and not all teh time in combat, something triggers it
and then it goes away randomly too
hazy mural
it's not there ALL the time
Aliens are trying to contact u
hollow onyx
XD
oblique moat
i would guess whatever addon the bars it's over are from
hazy mural
i don't want them, they can go away
but they come in peace
lone flare
sensei class resource bars
hazy mural
how often does it happen in combat?
buoyant dagger
can someone tell my tank thats watching that darkmoon card blood isnt a good trinket
lone flare
idk honestly, relatively often
buoyant dagger
plz
lone flare
can someone tell my tank thats watching that darkmoon card blood isnt a good tri...
darkmoon card isn't a good trinket
outer cave
I use ayjicdm its ok i started with it because I imported kira tank profile.. I ended up having to reconfig it lol
hazy mural
u could do a heroic dungeon and try to remove an addon at a time till it never appears
outer cave
But that just my personal preference
hazy mural
can someone tell my tank thats watching that darkmoon card blood isnt a good tri...
with how easy it is to get decent trinkets, its certainly not a good idea to use DMC
hollow onyx
can someone tell my tank thats watching that darkmoon card blood isnt a good tri...
I think if that is what he wants to play. No. He will go looking for info if you poke him enough.
lone flare
how often does it happen in combat?
I can't even reproduce it on a target dummy, it's only in instances, dungeons, delves
hazy mural
I can't even reproduce it on a target dummy, it's only in instances, dungeons, d...
heroic dungeons for sure
I use em for route cooking and it will allow u to edit addons etc ooc
hollow onyx
Or solo delves
hazy mural
Or solo delves
yh but dungeons are cool!
hollow onyx
lol point taken
lone flare
lemme have a look through a heroic one then
IT'S PART OF THE PRIMARY FUCKING COOLDOWN BAR but it's only sometimes
hazy mural
do u have any addons that work with that? I know sensei uses edit mode, but could be others too
lone flare
centered cooldown manager
hazy mural
maybe try turning that off and see if it still happens
guessing its an addon messing with it or else more ppl would have problems if it was just on blizz side
lone flare
I'll go see the repo for cooldown manager centered
or whatever the addon is called
cus it's driving me insane
hazy mural
heavy mauve
best aglethar buff for guardian?
lone flare
haste or vers
hazy mural
best aglethar buff for guardian?
u could sim statweights of ur current setup and see which u lack the most
lone flare
I've started picking up vers the higher I go
heavy mauve
vers then
hazy mural
I like haste cause its fun
hazy mural
but no idea on the best cause to be 100 pct sure u need stat weights
and also depends on build
bet apex still likes crit for example
hazy mural
IT IS BLIZZARD'S FAULT
so it happens without the addon too?
lone flare
apparently, as long as you have it hide out of combat and show in combat
it's whatever, I'll set it to always visible in blizzard's edit mode, and control the visibility via the addon instead
hazy mural
one day they will give up and weakauras will properly be back, I 
lone flare
it's fine I guess, the addon has good options
hazy mural
I use Arc UI and its a pain but it works for what I need
only way I've been able to have true shiny auras
lone flare
I'm quite happy with the base cooldown manager, so I've only felt a need to do small tweaks to it via the cooldown manager centered
but I value a clean UI generally
okay well, mystery solved
sullen quest
In m+ with the no apex build, do we ever press mangle? I've been looking at some logs in high keys and the bears just spam moonfire as a filler in downtime
trim plaza
what u like pretty much xd
spamming mf nets a bit more aoe dmg cause lunar beam cdr, mangle gives some extra rage
but nothing crazy
sullen quest
Ok thanks 😄
onyx sonnet
I just hit mangle when it procs, or for on demand rage if I need to heal or something
trim plaza
i just press mangle just cause its satisfying, only reason xd
halcyon jackal
is Heart of Wind better than LCG ?
brazen tinsel
what the heck is lcg
halcyon jackal
what the heck is lcg
oblique dagger
so FF gives combo points right? is there any need to press Rip or FB or is that a waste of a GCD?
like do we gain any damage from it
brazen tinsel
https://www.wowhead.com/item=249344/light-company-guidon?bonus=13335:12806
you can just sim it but it'll probably be close
brazen tinsel
like do we gain any damage from it
no, you immediately go back to bear after pressing hotw
finite ginkgo
In a single target situation, if you are EC+Red Moon, is Thrash higher priority than Mangle at max stacks?
and if so, I'm guessing mangle takes priority during red moon?
trim plaza
EC trash is prio always, if u are DotC im pretty sure its more worth to use mangle that point
actually
im not 100% sure
ionic jewel
Hey does top end damage matter? some of the dungeon 2h weps have a narrower range of damage (lower top end)
daring mortar
Does bear form not suffer from back or side hits? The way I watch some YouTube shorts pull I’m curious
rustic kestrel
Does bear form not suffer from back or side hits? The way I watch some YouTube s...
you cant dodge from behind
violet mulch
Does bear form not suffer from back or side hits? The way I watch some YouTube s...
Back hits for sure, if your aren’t facing the enemy you’ll get chunked
cloud pebble
Back hits for sure, if your aren’t facing the enemy you’ll get chunked
It doesn’t seem to affect the bear much, does it? Or am I wrong?
violet mulch
It doesn’t seem to affect the bear much, does it? Or am I wrong?
I mean I’ve seen myself get chunked, I haven’t died, but I attribute that to healers oh shit healing me
past olive
Does bear form not suffer from back or side hits? The way I watch some YouTube s...
Bear is a giant meat ball
Because our mitigation comes from raw armour, absorbs, big HP pool, self healing and CDs like barkskin and Survival instincts we don’t really care about where a mob hits us
We have dodge from crit, which cares about which way we are facing(have to face the mobs), but it’s not our main form of mitigation, it’s a secondary bonus mitigation
Which ends up with us just being able to be a giant meat ball of armour, HP and absorbs barreling through the bad guys however we like
past olive
Oh yeah very bad habit to form
Will kill you on any other tank in an instant
But I answered the question of bears and if they care about backshots
cloud pebble
I’ve recently started playing as a Guardian and have been playing as a tank since the start of the season; so far, my highest score is +15, but for some reason I’ve always thought I could tank with my back to the enemy, which is exactly what I’ve been doing , oh god
past olive
Back hits for sure, if your aren’t facing the enemy you’ll get chunked
Facing vs not facing doesn’t change how much damage you take apart from your dodge chance
past olive
I’ve recently started playing as a Guardian and have been playing as a tank sinc...
??????? How do you do any damage
cloud pebble
Facing vs not facing doesn’t change how much damage you take apart from your dod...
And, as far as I'm concerned, the block shield
trim plaza
im pretty sure bear cant get critical hits behind back like every other tank right?
but still never tank mobs without facing them
cloud pebble
??????? How do you do any damage
Thrash deals 360 damage 😄 and mf as well
hardy echo
298 Puzzle Box or a 285 Heart of Wind? Anyone? = Bear OS but wondering if it is worth farming for the Heart of Wind trinket or nah
past olive
im pretty sure bear cant get critical hits behind back like every other tank rig...
Tanks can not get critical hit in modern WoW
Trust me I looked in to it extensively in TWW S3
past olive
And, as far as I'm concerned, the block shield
There is no shield on bear
past olive
Thrash deals 360 damage 😄 and mf as well
Ohhhhhh
I’m still pressing raze and melting shit
trim plaza
Tanks can not get critical hit in modern WoW
Trust me I looked in to it extensi...
well things has changed then xd, has not been checked this in a long time
covert stone
I don’t get why people prefer going belt/wrist crafts over cloak/wrist.
You lost less stats by going cloak
Is there any other reason?
normal flower
Any trick with puzzle box ? Pretty long cast and a bit annoying to get used to after using cursed idole for so long.
trim plaza
Any trick with puzzle box ? Pretty long cast and a bit annoying to get used to a...
i just cant stand it in m+, using it only in raids
trim plaza
Is there any other reason?
mby they are simming better with those crafts
violet mulch
Any trick with puzzle box ? Pretty long cast and a bit annoying to get used to a...
I use it right before a pull in m+ or in certain situations where there’s RP
mossy sundial
how do i survive 20 sky reach stair pulls
those adepts will quad stack you while gathering in bark and frenzied and one shot you
formal stream
hi, which enchant should i use for +15/16 max (3k4 rating) ? speed or leech ?
trim plaza
Speed is the king for tanks
formal stream
got it, thanks
hollow beacon
does no raze still do more dps?
covert stone
mby they are simming better with those crafts
I dont see how, you are losing more agility
grand plinth
I don’t get why people prefer going belt/wrist crafts over cloak/wrist.
Belt was better early
So some people(me)
just still havent switched off
But I am this week for example
abstract raven
Belt was better early
And people like me using Loa ring :S Coz simes the best
grand plinth
yeah like its all context dependent
I was using loa ring
But then I bonus rolled both nexus rings
so now I'm swapping off
abstract raven
But then I bonus rolled both nexus rings
Yesh my ring set is hero still so probs will do what you did at some point if I get void side on mythic
grand plinth
Bonus rolled in their twice and got both lmao
fathom lotus
rustic kestrel
whatever your sim says
main pelican
loa ring was great for me but i wouldnt have crafted it early on if i knew we'd get guaranteed NPX ring set lol
sleek lintel
I mean who would have guessed how friendly the void forge would be after Blizzard said this type of targeting was too strong
blazing wagon
Hello! Just wanted to ask if there is a method to the madness of tanking corewarden. Was doing a npx yesterday and we kind of got blocked off from the corespark circle by lines and as it was coming out our mw wasn’t able to hit the boss and said he wasn’t able to heal off the absorb. I just wanted to know if there is a better way to go about that.
https://www.twitch.tv/shweaterzz/clip/HotSmilingPotatoTTours-gS-opoYxzemSMvf0
The lines blocking us off from the corner came out right as the circle came out so wasn’t sure if maybe we should’ve held a clear that we used instantly? Or if that’s just something you have to deal with and play around
mossy sundial
mw should have sheilunes spam
but there is a trick
@blazing wagon
- you want everyone to be melee
- you want the last marker to save
- you then want to clear the closest beams during cast then all stack to the edge of arena so people arent baiting so wide
blazing wagon
<@227959200901365760>
1. you want everyone to be melee
2. you want the last ma...
So those lines came out as the corespark was happening. That’s the set u want to save for?
mossy sundial
yes
blazing wagon
We were trying to be in the corner but we were going to be blocked from lines
Okay
fallen isle
why does frenzied regen sometimes not work? i have rage and im spending a gcd on pressing it
mossy sundial
em spread into sheiluns spam for one
fallen isle
and it doesnt even go on cd
blazing wagon
Okay thank u
mossy sundial
sqw @fallen isle
/console SpellQueueWindow X
100+ ping
will lock in your next ability alot later into your gcd reset window
for faster paced classes or masher players
fallen isle
makes sense
mossy sundial
yea
youre ms is high so youre probably wasting alot of gcds
sqw for you would be 370
fallen isle
i do have it at 400
mossy sundial
yea but your ms is so high its locking in a previous button
lyric wraith
is there something I'm doing wrong here that is tanking my parses https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/gPDRAMnBLGwvmt12?fight=29&type=damage-done
lament dock
Pull bigger
oak fiber
yo quick question what dungeon best for bonus rolls ?
i thought about 1 bonus roll on chimaerus myth and the rest idk
lyric wraith
Pull bigger
this is the route i did for that parse
but i guess maybe i need to chain more
lament dock
is there something I'm doing wrong here that is tanking my parses https://www.wa...
10 seems to be chained according to the replay I watched of the run?
lyric wraith
yea
i did first 2 and then chained once casters died
and then chained once the lich died
lament dock
I have had good success pulling last pack before Glacieth straight onto him. There's only one caster and it's an easy kick to get him gathered, for what that's worth
lyric wraith
i could do that, was just afraid of someone dying to jumps
lament dock
Pull 7 and 8 could also be cleaned for speed. I'd have to look at my route but that's the only thing I see
lyric wraith
i was thinking of grabbing the winged thing and the graveblade with 7
would that be what you had in mind?
lyric wraith
usually those are the last to die
past sleet
Im' sure you're annoyed by the FOTM guardians. But it appears wowhead guide has not been updated since March 7th. Where can I go to get latest rotation?
past sleet
Thanks
restive panther
i cant tell if he has HOTW or not
hushed oriole
I love this game sometimes 🤣
oblique moat
warlocks have no excuse anymore they get a talent that just gives them the interrupt even with another demon out
void magnet
warrior kicks far more attrocious there that wl was petkicking
elder pier
if u meant the grimoires, that no longer is an interrupt and is a purge now
void magnet
that default warrior icon is the wl kicks no?
elder pier
yes
void magnet
so what is that real warrior doing 
cinder anchor
as a semi-fresh gdruid, what is the best dungeon to use bonus rolls? i got 8 of em
oblique moat
if u meant the grimoires, that no longer is an interrupt and is a purge now
isn't it a choice node?
elder pier
other choice is a dispel
oblique moat
buh
bitter storm
as a semi-fresh gdruid, what is the best dungeon to use bonus rolls? i got 8 of ...
Windrunner Spire and Maisara Caverns both have pretty good pieces for us, personally WS is best because both trinkets are great and the weapon isn't half bad either
oak fiber
as a semi-fresh gdruid, what is the best dungeon to use bonus rolls? i got 8 of ...
I guess most people would just answer with WS
just spend 6 in WS and the other 2 in chimaerus
bitter storm
Or do that yeah, mythic Chim isn't too bad by mythic boss standards
stiff phoenix
warlocks have no excuse anymore they get a talent that just gives them the inter...
Did they revert the previous changes to fel guard
oblique moat
Did they revert the previous changes to fel guard
yeah so apparently i was wrong they got rid of the interrupt talent
idk about fel guard
sleek lintel
Destro and Aff wouldn't let Demo have two kicks
Demo kick stuns so it's not liked unless the add is gathered
It's not a huge dps loss to run Fel Hunter if needed
cinder anchor
ty homies
oblique moat
It's not a huge dps loss to run Fel Hunter if needed
oh really i thought demo was locked into felguard
red knoll
arent they running imp rn
fallen isle
im trying to do mage tower. why does it sometimes just say the mage tower crackles as time stops
twilit drum
How advised / reckless is it to pull the entire tree room of AA in one go?
I have maybe a 80% success rate with it, but that pull alone has also ruined a few keys.
abstract raven
How advised / reckless is it to pull the entire tree room of AA in one go?
I hav...
That's what your meant to do
Can skip 1 skitterfly pack till boss but apart from that
It's pull it all
sleek lintel
They had been but fel guard is gutted this expansion
sleek lintel
im trying to do mage tower. why does it sometimes just say the mage tower crackl...
that sounds like one of the allies died.
noble ledge
Cookie has shown up
Cookie is using circle of heavens
):
Still a good cookie
rustic kestrel
cookie may need a bit more time in the oven
late sleet
hey guys
am thinking of starting tanking and everything I found online suggests I start with bear since it's the easiest to get into
but I wanted to ask about the state of the spec at the moment and also as a bonus if its considered fun to play
daring nymph
am thinking of starting tanking and everything I found online suggests I start w...
Okay step one of friendly tank advice
Don’t think about that
Every tank is easy to get into, but hard to master. Bear is also like this
As for the state of the spec, it’s good, it’s meta, it’s very strong rn
It has 6 builds a simple 2 button build and a better fun build that utilizes all your strengths
The spex in my opinion is extremely fun, funner it’s been in years actually
chrome storm
for wep chance in fault form chimerus is better to have 2 bosses for 1 slot or 4 for 2 but more dilution?
bright rain
I would say 2 bosses for 1 slot +bonusroll on him
olive hare
are the hero talents fun?
Both have their niches. EC adds a lot of power and cooldown reduction to lunar beam, which you wanna center your burst damage around and also amplifies your thrash damage, while dotc gives chances to turn your maul into ravage, which does better damage and adds a hart hitting bleed which also causes you to take 15% less damage for its (high) uptime. Dotc Tree leads to some extra decision making on your rotation, like saving a ravage for the next pull or your next apex burst. Or adjusting your fur stacks to wether you have the bleed applied or not. And adds some power and selfhealing to mangle, which makes gambling for gore resets a fun minigame. While EC is more straight forward, passive power. Its biggest skill check is to always empower your thrashes, hotws and wigu charges with lunarbeam.
crisp fable
any1 buy any chance know why my BCDM drags over my bars mid fight?
my offset is fine i dont get it
bright rain
When i look at the top druid tanks in m+ their embelishments are so different. Is there just no real big different?
reef ledge
yo guys am i tripping? or am i not getting any procs anymore on my bear?
regrowth procs i mean
ah nvm i saw the talent just now^^
lone flare
any1 buy any chance know why my BCDM drags over my bars mid fight?
hm, is it not just toggled in combat/some other scenario, I don't see why it would mvoe at all
sleek lintel
When i look at the top druid tanks in m+ their embelishments are so different. I...
Embellishments are generally pretty close and lots comes down to preference.
What embellishment are you seeing a lot of that surprises you
lone flare
When i look at the top druid tanks in m+ their embelishments are so different. I...
kind of preference based, though generally can't go wrong with arcano
open light
is haste/vers still the stat focus? see alot of haste/mastery now?
slim cargo
Watching a (new) guardian druid almost wipe a key because they cant combat res -
because they macro'd Thrash and Iron Fur - Literally just now. 🙂
I asked them to manually click mangle and then try 😄
grand plinth
DOTC supremecy once again
We literally would have had the fastest AA 21 NA
if my team didnt die three times to actual air on last boss
slim cargo
DOTC supremecy once again
GG!
stiff phoenix
DOTC supremecy once again
I think I’m gonna go back to playing it. The EC Thrash is kind of sleep
Is dotc much worse
grand plinth
No its better I think
If you look at overall dps in 21 aas
I think I have the highest post nerf
Cause all the ones above me are un nerfed
Like people can disagree with me all day long but my team always puts up insane times
and we have some of the fastest boss splits NA pretty consistently
and I think DOTC is a small part of that
round geode
question - how valuable is ironfur usage on L'ura?
grand plinth
The dungeon boss or raid boss
round geode
Mythic Raid
I'm seeing most tanks ignore the button until like 4-5 minutes into the fight
then they're using it a bunch in P3
stiff phoenix
and I think DOTC is a small part of that
Is there log to check build I can see, I can find myself just checking if it exists
grand plinth
WClogs is super buggy today
But this should be it
I kinda fucked my crawth big time
By being too greedy
jovial turtle
If you look at overall dps in 21 aas
Is dotc hard to play?
grand plinth
Ok I don't think it is
But people tell me it is
But its literally just the same as the two button shit
except for you mangle instead of moonfire
and press ravage when you get the proc as long as you make sure you're above 60 rage
stiff phoenix
It’s just like bear has been IMO besides the 60 rage proc stuff
wise apex
Hey, what is the maintained guide for guardians atm?
stiff phoenix
Bears never really been hard, undertones at times but difficulty isn’t huge I don’t think
wise apex
@still locust a birdie whispered me you are a knower of things
wise apex
jakey told me to ask you about guardian guides
still locust
wise apex
oooh yeah
well basically i just want to know which one you guys recommend as being up to date
As the wowhead one hasnt been touched in a while
still locust
The pins are up to date I believe
As a good default
But we have like 6 different viable builds
Oh I think https://www.dreamgrove.gg/blog/guardian/compendium has also been updated
wise apex
okay ty
still locust
okay ty
Pins and Dreamgrove.gg should both be up to date, but dreamgrove.gg is usually more in depth while pins is a quick survival-guide
whole linden
Do we play with raze no right ?
elder dove
this true? anyone know? Can literally be unlimited after you unlocked 4p?
tulip thistle
I had like 8 of them on my hunter
olive hare
Yeah you can farm an uncapped amount, but only have 8 at a time.
olive hare
Do we play with raze no right ?
Some builds do, some dont. Bear is not the type of spec which has one cookiecutter build for M+ and one for raid. There are options 👍
whole linden
Is bear btw better to push with then brew?
elder dove
Yeah you can farm an uncapped amount, but only have 8 at a time.
ive got 0/8 atm, used 4 on set bonus and several more converting certain pieces like belt/boots/bracers based on sims for better stats, haven't gotten another one in a while. maybe it becomes DR after a while
olive hare
Just a bad luck streak, happens
elder dove
normally i wouldn't care BUT while using bonus rolls in the same dungeon for bis trinkets ive gotten two myth track pieces that can be converted to tier in like head and shoulders lol
olive hare
Is bear btw better to push with then brew?
Uh both are tanks, both are fotm, I think they're even in that regard.
In terms of individual performance I'd say bear is ahead currently. Does better damage (but at the cost of prio dps) and is a fair bit tankier
In the end its still a matter of comps. Have a rsham or mwmonk? Bear works better with those. BRM really likes rdrood healing.
whole linden
Ok thank you if i didnt win weapon with bonus rolls i do craft one right ?
olive hare
Just started a a fresh bear and have all rolls avaiable?
In that case -> guardian lootspec and spend every single roll on windrunner. You'll get a weapon, just like 2 good trinkets, a decent neck and some tier armor.
stiff phoenix
I’ve mostly played healer Druid this season and shift is really to monk healer so bear is more sought after
But I think both equally good rn
round geode
For anyone who progged Mythic L'ura on bear - how often can you use barkskin?
tooltip CD says 1 min, but I'm seeing people use it sooner
round geode
So 33s cd
is this number a flat amount?
there's no spending resources to reduce cooldown or anything
it's just a given?
high path
Ye just flat
high path
Idk if hope still exist
still locust
Genuinely can't remember if symbol was removed
high path
Idt so
round geode
no, i just want to make sure that it's a set CD before I make any comments
round geode
the bear in my guild has very inconsistent usage of CDs for P3 in L'ura, so I'm trying to figure out the exact CD timings
high path
But basically assuming on cd you should have roughly between 1.5 to 2 per minute
round geode
@high path what's the CD on frenzied regen, and ELI5, how important is Frenzied Regen to use?
high path
Depending if you run sotf or not
high path
<@387391302490390534> what's the CD on frenzied regen, and ELI5, how important i...
Cd is haste dependent, but roughly 25-30s
still locust
Cd is haste dependent, but roughly 25-30s
It was reduced, remember
sharp gale
Genuinely can't remember if symbol was removed
wait did symbol of hope reduce cds for everyone
high path
In raid you kinda don't use it that often tho
still locust
wait did symbol of hope reduce cds for everyone
Defensive CDs yes
high path
Oh true
sharp gale
huh
high path
20-25 then
still locust
It's 26 baseline now, reduced by haste
high path
But regardless you don't really press it on cd (unless you run NR)
round geode
you don't use frenzied regen in raid much?
the reason I ask is because I'm comparing to other bears
still locust
huh
Back in SL when we had the "get berserk on barkskin" tier set, symbol hadn't been nerfed so you could get an extra like 8 seconds of berserk if you reacted fast enough to the massive CDR
round geode
who are using it a fair amount
still locust
you don't use frenzied regen in raid much?
I mean it's "free" healing
sharp gale
huh
round geode
meanwhile my bear looks like this
still locust
But it's never really required
sharp gale
i didn't rly play during SL, especially bear, so til 😄
round geode
I'm looking at Tet and Dratnos, and they have significantly more uses
high path
But rather when you need it
round geode
I assume you use it with every Heaven's Lance
still locust
After every tank mechanic is a safe bet yeah
high path
On tank buster is closer to what would happen , unless you run natural resilience then you press on cd for the shield
still locust
Not really on CD, just having 1 charge always recharging
Small but important difference
round geode
also, is there ever a point to layering Bark and SI together
still locust
Only if you're getting ABSOLUTELY dicked
round geode
SI is such a strong CD that placing barkskin on top is pointless right?
still locust
Which never really happens in raid
round geode
our guy is misusing tf out of his CDs and just randomly dying
then complaining he cant focus on mechs because his hp is yoyo'ing
high path
Can you show the build he runs ?
still locust
You gotta have a plan for when to use defensives yeah, even if it's just "On this mechanic I use this defensive, on the next one I use this" and ignore them inbetween
round geode
but pull to pull, his CDs are never consistent, and his frenzied regen usage is in the single digits over a 6-8 min fight
idk shit about bear, but i'm learning by reading other peoples' logs and from u guys
I also notice, a lot of bears dont bother pressing Ironfur until P2 or P3
high path
Bear on lu'ra shouldn't really have issues
still locust
Ironfur doesn't do anything to heaven's lance, the tank buster
high path
Since the damage is mostly just tank buster shenanigans
still locust
And you're never really in danger of the melee hits
round geode
Barkskin has 14 second duration?
sharp gale
iirc bark and SI aren't rly additive either so you shouldn't layer them, they won't bring u to 100% damage reduction
brazen tinsel
no defensive in the game is additive
sharp gale
yea
high path
Barkskin has 14 second duration?
With talents potentially
still locust
That would be wild if they were lmao
high path
Generally that's overkill tho
round geode
that's the issue, they pressed bark+SI together on one pull
on other pulls, it's all over the place
still locust
Usually barkskin is 12 seconds long
The first +4 seconds is free, the other +2 is less free
And usually not needed
high path
Bark plus si is 60% dr it's only worth for specific shenanigans
Like saladbar last tier
merry quest
Playing devils advocate here, on the second memory game in p1 I press bark as soon as the symbols start to show since I’m inputting and that’s when I’m most likely to get a glaive sneaking up on me. Usually Ill press SI after the input part since the buster follows immediately and if I have took a sneaky glaive I wouldn’t live both
But that’s still not every pull
And if he’s not the one inputting then zero reason to anyway
arctic zenith
Guys I need help:
Im pretty new at Guardian (first ID) but why are these 0.1% guards never use maul? (Keys only) i mean not even in dmg amps like endboss of seat were no dmg is incoming or 2nd boss maisa to break shields etc. 0 useages of Maul overall
still locust
Short answer is they're lazy
arctic zenith
Lazy in +22?
still locust
Yes
arctic zenith
So when im pugging I can use maul in those dmg amps to help my group and farming logs?
still locust
Tanking in keys is very lenient; as long as you have aggro and you aren't dying, you can do almost whatever you want and succeed
arctic zenith
In trash packs I feel more comf with just spamming ironfur cause maul does 0 aoe but i was wondering in those 0 dmg incoming phases
white sentinel
Is there a way to see routes or something in warcraft logs or some other post after the fact logger
still locust
Not on logs, aside from opening up the replay
proper slate
Makes me think they've just taken it off their bars because there's definitely moments where maul makes sense
white sentinel
Seems like showing routes after the fact would be very helpful. No? Wonder why its not a thing