😔
#balance
jaunty blaze
elfin beacon
Sorry for the dumb question, but why is everyone using Starweaver? On every sim I run, that build performs worse for me. Since on M+ keys I’m doing AoE most of the time, I don’t really care about the free Starsurge — I’d rather have Starfall hit harder. Am I missing something? 😄
jaunty blaze
Procs are fun
elfin beacon
thats it? xD
jaunty blaze
Yes
tawny nest
I think it’s better in single target or smth
And gets benefit from tier set
jaunty blaze
You can argue it's better prio damage
elfin beacon
xD
tawny nest
Just feels a lot better to play too imo
elfin beacon
ok I'll try this. thx 🙂
delicate perch
Sorry for the dumb question, but why is everyone using Starweaver? On every sim ...
I don’t even want to ask what sim’s they are but this made me laugh thank you
round field
Very susge
livid jay
idk i really got bored of these weaver procs and reacting to them got quite annoying now
just playing rattle in keys now
round field
i too hate when my spec is more fun and interactive
livid jay
its not more fun bro
staring at a proc icon every global and alternating between two spenders instead of spamming one is just more effort but not more fun imo
sure can be nice because its something different than what we had for ages for a couple dungeons
but not in my 8 weeklies i gotta bang out on a tuesday evening
round field
this just proves the average player just prefes a braindead 1 button rotation and blizzard will keep nuking class design until every spec is classic frost mage
ruby badger
I just don't like pressing starsurge in big target counts / munching that proc
In raid though love starweaver
elfin beacon
weaver on dragons feels ass
I completely agree with you
livid jay
i liked frenzy
round field
ur lying
jaunty blaze
livid jay
bis boomkin was tww prepatch with new talents so we had pulsar which triggered syzygy
that was some dopamine
round field
True
Frenzy pulsar
Should have kept it in game and just tuned the numbers down a lil
And youd have the most fun spec in the entire game
jaunty blaze
Can't have fun in this god forsaken videogame
round field
Fun detected 
livid jay
it was absurd amounts of damage 😄
but i think it would have also been fun wiht less damage
too hard for nowadays philosophy tho
livid jay
timing pulsar right in keys and if u wanna line all that up adds some difficulty
and yea not being afk aswell
but youre right on top of that there wasnt much to it
pressing the right things at the right times in frenzy was solved by wa back then
but can just use brain
fickle grail
I just don't like pressing starsurge in big target counts / munching that proc
i like seeing the solstice buff going up with the procs
hollow mist
no way bloodtalon bar died after 5k hours
we try again
fossil hemlock
Real peak gameplay was moons with pulsar
Felt good to get the rhythm down to minmaxing moons during pulsar windows
daring magnet
Please excuse my ignorance.
But why are we taking Starweaver over Rattle of the Stars in M+??
round field
ignorance not excused
jaunty blaze
You can play either
livid jay
Sorry for the dumb question, but why is everyone using Starweaver? On every sim ...
same question was asked here
maybe the following messaged help you
royal zenith
the following msg's literally tell you jackshit wdym
weaver is better for several reasons; prio damage, proccing free damage (starfall/starsurge), hail of stars, movement, etc.
in extended or larger AOE pulls rattle will probably be better
mental zephyr
Hey guys i got 6 Sparks left for crafting isome ppl say Haste/mastery/crit some say crit haste mastery.. i wanna craft a ring and neck or wairst or smth can some1 help me pls which stats i have to prio and caps and stuff? i didjnt find any good guide for stats cap
livid jay
have you used raidbots before?
mental zephyr
not yet just icy veins wowhead and archon
livid jay
Ok. So nowadays there isnt really a stat priority cause it heavily depends on what gear you already have. Mastery, Crit and Haste are all good for boomkin. What we do to figure out what to craft is use raidbots to simulate our characters in a raid encounter.
mental zephyr
simc version on weekly? or latest
livid jay
Doesnt really matter
mental zephyr
how do he tell me what to craft
livid jay
Use a topgear sim, in topgear you can add custom items in the top and then add embellishments to those items
then you choose all of them and it will simulate and find out the best combination of all items for you
mental zephyr
okey i gonna try that thx man
livid jay
as a hint: its easier if you add for example a crafted belt at correct ilvl, add embellishment with the + icon (unselect original item so it doesnt use sim iterations/combinations) and then you can change the stats of the item with the + icon aswell to have multiple different versions of it going into your sim
craggy sonnet
okey i gonna try that thx man
Mahra forgot to mention that you can import your own character and stuff in bags by using the simulationcraft addon and typing /simc ingame. That produces a string you can paste in the box on the top gear page on raidbots
livid jay
yea u cant even do topgear without that it just comes up with explanation when u press topgear
dense steeple
Better than a green boy
livid jay
quite a lot above average = bad 
round field
correct
ionic surge
Very true
craggy sonnet
yea u cant even do topgear without that it just comes up with explanation when u...
fair. havent actively read any of these disclaimers in a while
livid jay
saaame i was gonna say he needs to do that but then saw its not even possible wihtout
pliant tiger
is there a way to macro hotw with bearform?
livid jay
not in one button press cause bear form triggers a global cooldown
pliant tiger
not in one button press cause bear form triggers a global cooldown
ty
celest rampart
are we just not using convoke at all now in raids?
livid jay
using it on mythic bird
celest rampart
going through lorrgs.io and none is taking or use convoke like t all
thats it yeah bird
livid jay
yea everything else has cringe add pad
celest rampart
why on bird, what makesi it useful on bird?
celest rampart
ahh yeah ofc
livid jay
burst*
celest rampart
so we just taking elune to padd dmg on adds
livid jay
nah
adds dont live ling enough
its cringe keeper weaver add pad with sometimes taking the talent that makes your starfall tick faster
jaunty blaze
You can also play ethical convoke on saladar
livid jay
if your orbs are dying sure
jaunty blaze
Dunno got bored competing for orb dmg
jaunty blaze
Ethical raid
lofty depot
so we just taking elune to padd dmg on adds
Elune's doesn't mean you're only padding on adds. You can do that just fine with keeper.
celest rampart
Elune's doesn't mean you're only padding on adds. You can do that just fine with...
its just better than convoke for every fight in Cosmos raid?
round field
theres nothing to do in the raid other than pad anyways
lofty depot
its just better than convoke for every fight in Cosmos raid?
Presumably when u said elune's u meant Incarn?
fossil hemlock
Elune's doesn't mean you're only padding on adds. You can do that just fine with...
They mean incarn, not the hero tree
royal zenith
maybe english is not their first language
round field
tbf
royal zenith
any other insult is just w.e.
round field
the average dutch person has better english than the average american
royal zenith
been born and bred on the internet...
lofty depot
Bred online 👀
fossil hemlock
Gotta make money somehow
lofty depot
Make money breding 👀
craggy sonnet
Elune's doesn't mean you're only padding on adds. You can do that just fine with...
Didn't you play ec incarn on belo?
Unless I'm stupid, wcl says that 100% played convoke
lofty depot
I played convoke
craggy sonnet
Oh
lofty depot
There's a few degens playing incarn
royal zenith
it's better damage..
craggy sonnet
Wth, not even following your own sim
royal zenith
but probably movement kinda ass
round field
if its better damage why is no one in top 100 with it...
lofty depot
Wouldn't try that shit
royal zenith
if its better damage why is no one in top 100 with it...
if the sun is good for you, then why do we use sunscreen?
round field
because its bad for u...
lofty depot
Also, need to figure out how did 9.5m on a bunch without pi and then got pi and neve hit above 9
Gotta cope about that a little
royal zenith
if working out is good for you, why does it wear out your body?
round field
no it doesnt
royal zenith
yes, it does
round field
it only does if ur built like a lil bitch
craggy sonnet
?
royal zenith
lofty depot
If u use fire to cook your food to make it edible, why does it hurt when hot
celest rampart
Presumably when u said elune's u meant Incarn?
yeah sorry
lofty depot
There's some uhh weird temperature thing
celest rampart
Presumably when u said elune's u meant Incarn?
yeah no one is taking convoke, I thought it was still the main raid spec we use
DOH
round field
convoke kinda dookie poopoo with how much aoe is in the raid
lofty depot
Funny wowhead talents said convoke and 1m and no one looks past that to see actual fight talents
Down with the wowhead writer
celest rampart
Funny wowhead talents said convoke and 1m and no one looks past that to see actu...
tbh Ive not had much time to play at all, just sorted my UI now finally
and now looking into specs we are playing
lofty depot
When people come in here post logs and I see 1m convoke, at least ik they did no looking at logs they just copied wowhead
round field
but why is wowhead spreading misinformation then..
craggy sonnet
cause who cares about padding add dmg in heroic
lofty depot
Its not like the build doesn't do damage or u can't do damage.
lucid olive
but why is wowhead spreading misinformation then..
It's not
celest rampart
When people come in here post logs and I see 1m convoke, at least ik they did no...
Its hard to know what spec to actually play
lofty depot
So it's not misinformation, it's just an easy indicator that they didn't look at logs
celest rampart
Like where do we stand
fossil hemlock
Sorting through the logs to see which ones only did high damage because they bribed the rest of their team to ignore adds is not a fun activity
royal zenith
there's no one-size fits all this tier
lofty depot
U go to warcraft logs and u copy the build for what ur doing
lucid olive
there's no one-size fits all this tier
Yeah it's this more than anything else
celest rampart
cause who cares about padding add dmg in heroic
padding add dmg is mythic is just terrible as well no?
celest rampart
the word padding is negative no?
royal zenith
it's literally called padding
fossil hemlock
Define padding in this case
lofty depot
Propaganda man
royal zenith
thoughts
livid jay
padding is negative imo cause imo it means u do damage thats not needed to up your number
celest rampart
wait ill define it
fossil hemlock
Why is it negative
Padding means "making something small look bigger than it is"
lofty depot
padding is negative imo cause imo it means u do damage thats not needed to up yo...
So if u don't kill the orbs on saladbar u die
But its padding
livid jay
no its not padding if its needed
royal zenith
it's still padding
livid jay
ok
lofty depot
Ok so what's padding in the raid if it's not needed
celest rampart
this may be wrong, but to me "padding" is doing damaege that isnt needed to PAD your own dps numbers
royal zenith
cause your spec is SHIT at killing the small orbs
fossil hemlock
Padding is just going out of your way to overkill something that passive damage could have killed
lofty depot
this may be wrong, but to me "padding" is doing damaege that isnt needed to PAD ...
Ok what adds don't need to die in raid
celest rampart
so as an example doing dmg to adds when your class is bad at it and its not needed
royal zenith
if you have one balance druid focusing all his efforts into the small orbs, you'd be done tomorrow
with killing the boss
thoughts?
lofty depot
so as an example doing dmg to adds when your class is bad at it and its not need...
Our class isn't bad at doing damage to adds
livid jay
im padding on dragons cause im prestarfalling, running a talent that makes my starfall tick faster and playing shrooms to maximize add damage meanwhile destroying everyone elses logs cause they cant keep up with the aoe burst
celest rampart
Ok what adds don't need to die in raid
they all need to die, should we be the one to do it tho?
if other classes lose less dps than us or gain dps
royal zenith
im padding on dragons cause im prestarfalling, running a talent that makes my st...
your group can't kill voidorbs
lofty depot
What makes u think I do less damage?
royal zenith
so that kinda proves my point
if we were good for killing smallies, we would get stacked this raid
thoughts??
celest rampart
What makes u think I do less damage?
Im not saying you, im saying as a class
lofty depot
I am my class
celest rampart
Like I don't know anything really about what classes are good at what
livid jay
if we were good for killing smallies, we would get stacked this raid
cause the smallies are usually mega overkilled and not needed
celest rampart
we lose single target when we aoe, and other classes, gain dmg or lose less
livid jay
ye
celest rampart
so they should be killing adds
royal zenith
and arctic is wrong
lucid olive
I am my class
thats the most cringe shit i ever read
royal zenith
royal zenith
truee
lofty depot
im padding on dragons cause im prestarfalling, running a talent that makes my st...
Go look at ur boss damage and then compare to the "non-padders" and then explain to me how ur number is higher while doing "pad add damage"
celest rampart
and if we dont have the dps to kill adds then more less efficent classes should do it
livid jay
i jumped into this convo and im gonna jump out agian bb
drifting nova
real council fight when
lofty depot
thats the most cringe shit i ever read
Kek
royal zenith
"hey guys we can pad without losing the minimal boss damage we do, isn't that epic?"
good argument bro
lofty depot
I don't see a wrong part of that statement so get mad
celest rampart
good argument bro
Im not making an argument, Im posting my understanding, which is poor
livid jay
I am my class
arent u a mage
lofty depot
No
livid jay
😄
royal zenith
Im not making an argument, Im posting my understanding, which is poor
no dw Im talking to arctic
you are gucci
I'm just baiting him..
drifting nova
you are gucci
pretty sure he's grimzzy
royal zenith
truths
lofty depot
Yea deux is wrong so he baits
drifting nova
need to get your eyes checked
royal zenith
no I have to fill my last 20 minutes of the work-day
livid jay
im on my last 3 minutes
lofty depot
Out of context is great
livid jay
speed this up pls
lofty depot
Ezpz reply speed
livid jay
no I have to fill my last 20 minutes of the work-day
last 20 minutes of the work week 
drifting nova
idk if he can hes in the caribbean
lofty depot
and if we dont have the dps to kill adds then more less efficent classes should ...
Think u misunderstand our damage but to each their own
royal zenith
no...
celest rampart
Think u misunderstand our damage but to each their own
I have no idea about our damaege
which is why im posting here
lofty depot
Well u have preconceived assumptions for some reason
royal zenith
poor grimzzy
lofty depot
U assume we're bad at it
lofty depot
And idk why
royal zenith
I don't think he's assuming anything he's just trying to understand
celest rampart
Well u have preconceived assumptions for some reason
I assume other classes are better
not that we are bad
I guess its the same thing
royal zenith
is god
drifting nova
with moons floating around us
royal zenith
oh
fossil hemlock
Arctic do you use meteor storm on dragons?
drifting nova
and we can manipulate them
crude cargo
can i get an amen
fossil hemlock
Meteor storm is the definition of a pad talent
lofty depot
I assume other classes are better
Why do u assume that tho
fossil hemlock
You lose boss damage to do add damage faster
drifting nova
meteor what now
fossil hemlock
This
celest rampart
Why do u assume that tho
IM regarded maybe?
royal zenith
sorry I meant meteorites..
lofty depot
You lose boss damage to do add damage faster
Why do I lose damage to boss with it?
drifting nova
tf you mean pad talent
starfall without it
is giga dog
14 business days to do damage
if anything it should be passive
lofty depot
Theoretically u could gain damage if u press starfall at 5s remaining on incarn, a normal Starfall would lose 3s of time outside of incarn
That's maff
fossil hemlock
Theoretically u could gain damage if u press starfall at 5s remaining on incarn,...
Now you're grasping at straws
drifting nova
Theoretically u could gain damage if u press starfall at 5s remaining on incarn,...
rather cancelaura again
(not that I did)
lofty depot
if you play meteor storm
Yea but those are movement globals on a hard fight
Mmhm mmhm
fossil hemlock
That's maff
More like meth
celest rampart
Why do u assume that tho
can you clarify for me, what are we good at, what are we bad at?
royal zenith
is that why you play manual shrooms too
lofty depot
Good at padding
royal zenith
cause there's sooooo much movement
fossil hemlock
can you clarify for me, what are we good at, what are we bad at?
He's just arguing because bored
lofty depot
is that why you play manual shrooms too
Yea mmhmm mmhm
lofty depot
Well there's tether right
So I need to move back after wild charginf
Mmhm mmhm
A lot of movement, hard fight
lofty depot
So my DK can grip them silly
celest rampart
He's just arguing because bored
Im asking the question still tho as I have no idea
fossil hemlock
Can't believe we're entertaining Arctics excuse for wanting to pad
If you want to pad, just pad
lofty depot
🙂
lucid olive
i read tether and thought alleria
lofty depot
I do and I will
lucid olive
why are we talking about a 3rd boss
lofty depot
i read tether and thought alleria
Smh
lucid olive
its the 2nd month of the tier
lucid olive
yeah lets minmax the boss you kill in 3 minutes
lucid olive
worry about killing lura instead
lofty depot
I am, with wild mushroom
mint cosmos
does solar beam kick all three adds on mythic lura?
lucid olive
does solar beam kick all three adds on mythic lura?
no
mint cosmos
thank you
royal zenith
If you want to pad, just pad
if Im honest
drifting nova
so boomie beam is useless
always has been
royal zenith
even though Im against padding
lucid olive
so boomie beam is useless
no
royal zenith
this tier it matters so little for balance druid
lucid olive
it's the same usefulness as all the other kicks are on that boss
fossil hemlock
this tier it matters so little for balance druid
The term padding also depends entirely on how few hands you have between all your dps players
lucid olive
if you're assigned a kick and nobody steals it you have kick back up for next round of the mechanic
fossil hemlock
If your raid doesn't have hands then bursting down adds on saladbar or dragons isn't awful
lofty depot
can you clarify for me, what are we good at, what are we bad at?
We are actually really good at killing a lot of shitter adds. We do lose damage, but ur not being brought for your boss damage. You're being brought cuz u don't have a bear or resto, and feral is beans
lucid olive
solar beam is just as useful as any other kick on that fight
honestly probably more useful since its among the only kicks that shows your team a visual that you pressed it at all
celest rampart
We are actually really good at killing a lot of shitter adds. We do lose damage,...
so our priority should be, killing shitter adds, and spec accordingly to kill shitter adds without destryoing your single target
drifting nova
If your raid doesn't have hands then bursting down adds on saladbar or dragons i...
which surely raids should rotate pad weeks
celest rampart
We are actually really good at killing a lot of shitter adds. We do lose damage,...
honestly this would be a useful summary to have on wowhead and dreamgrove
lucid olive
so our priority should be, killing shitter adds, and spec accordingly to kill sh...
dont listen to the chief padder
arctic will mental gymnastics for hours to justify being unethical
fossil hemlock
honestly this would be a useful summary to have on wowhead and dreamgrove
Assuming arctic is right because he has a funny colour on discord is not it
lucid olive
do not engage
celest rampart
dont listen to the chief padder
can you answer the question then, what are we good at, what are we bad at?
drifting nova
only white names speak sense, orange and green are fake
celest rampart
technically we are not really good this tier
yes I know
drifting nova
really doesnt help rotato is booty
fossil hemlock
Are you still mad about eclipse being a button?
lucid olive
Are you still mad about eclipse being a button?
are you asking kekkers
fossil hemlock
Yes
celest rampart
Ok so we are good at spread aoe cleave and we should lean into that on fights with spread aoe cleave
lucid olive
just ignore kekkers posts
fossil hemlock
Realest and truest advice
royal zenith
Ok so we are good at spread aoe cleave and we should lean into that on fights wi...
ye we should
lucid olive
Ok so we are good at spread aoe cleave and we should lean into that on fights wi...
yes, but also what fights have spread aoe cleave
it's salhadaar and then what
some moments on Alleria
royal zenith
dragons on mythic is also just not spread cleave
fossil hemlock
Dragons when your DKs and Vengeance DH is on vacation
royal zenith
ye..
tawny nest
You can hit both sides of adds on voracious
royal zenith
that's true
lucid olive
not if you're targeted by one
tawny nest
Just don’t be
fossil hemlock
You can hit both sides of adds on voracious
I'm not gonna lie, Vorasius is so free on the adds that I just stay full ST on the fight
royal zenith
meld it off
lucid olive
and not on the first set
fossil hemlock
Send a few cheeky starfalls and keep hitting boss
lucid olive
cause the first set should ideally die all the way back
which is more than 80yds apart and out of your range
celest rampart
yes, but also what fights have spread aoe cleave
second boss and salhadaar
lucid olive
not that it matters anymore when the boss is a walkover
celest rampart
Convoke is just a bad raid talent then and we should only take it for egg phase dps on beloran
drifting nova
its the only good raid talent
celest rampart
convoke is good
no one is playing it on Lorrgs top 50 apart from on Beloran
lucid olive
no one is playing it on Lorrgs top 50 apart from on Beloran
does that make it bad
lofty depot
so our priority should be, killing shitter adds, and spec accordingly to kill sh...
Well ur suppose to do both
lucid olive
its also not true?
celest rampart
does that make it bad
if the best players arent using it? probably
lucid olive
recruitie plays 1m convoke every boss
royal zenith
Recruitie kinda mid
lucid olive
if the best players arent using it? probably
best players can be just as stupid as everyone else
craggy sonnet
top 50 lorrgs only tells you what nets you the most overall
vale pebble
recruitie plays 1m convoke every boss
big nob?
royal zenith
Doesnt even reroll to devourer..
craggy sonnet
that doesnt mean it is the best at helping your raid kill the boss
celest rampart
best players can be just as stupid as everyone else
then how is it a dumb pleb like me meant to decide what to play xD
craggy sonnet
or the best for the average player to perform on that boss
lucid olive
then how is it a dumb pleb like me meant to decide what to play xD
don't overthink it
just take some shit
see what works
trial and error
lofty depot
recruitie plays 1m convoke every boss
Yea but he's a degenerate
lucid olive
who cares if you swap talents around every pull when your team is still wiping to the first 2 minutes worth of mechanics on a fight
celest rampart
who cares if you swap talents around every pull when your team is still wiping t...
true
lucid olive
on any hard boss the first day of prog is earmarked wiping to the first phases worth of mechanics
and theyre not a damage check
lofty depot
then how is it a dumb pleb like me meant to decide what to play xD
Ur minmaxing around like 3 talents that only effect a few presses instead of learning what u would prefer
lucid olive
so why not just change talents around and find out what works best for that fight and your team
royal zenith
there's only a few talents you actually swap
(manual shrooms goated btw, dont tell anyone else)
royal zenith
i spec out of foe miore and more
lofty depot
Mushroom more dam
royal zenith
cringe gcd
lofty depot
Pew pew
celest rampart
Ur minmaxing around like 3 talents that only effect a few presses instead of lea...
I mean Im not a good player so convoke probably as its so easy to play
royal zenith
on EC it's nice tho
lucid olive
Moonkin has like a ton of viable builds that can all perform close to each other
and the players go crazy cause there isnt a binary 1 choice fits all
its so funny
royal zenith
any tips on how to get this down 2 points..
lucid olive
since having actual choices is a good thing
celest rampart
its so funny
its just lack of knowledge
craggy sonnet
lofty depot
any tips on how to get this down 2 points..
Play better
craggy sonnet
why bother with foe
royal zenith
its just lack of knowledge
what are you trying to understand anyway
like do you want to know how specific talents work
if one hero talent is better than the other
what scenario you play what build
Like I said, it's not a one size fits all
you have to be specific
if you ask a blanket question "is convoke better?" you will get a blanket statement/answer
aka "depends"
lucid olive
LF anyone wanting to sit down and write talent explanations for compendium 🙂
lofty depot
LF anyone wanting to sit down and write talent explanations for compendium 🙂
👀
I play meteor storm for adds cuz Starfall is like an a-10 warthog.... Brrrrrrrerrrrrrrrttt
celest rampart
if you ask a blanket question "is convoke better?" you will get a blanket statem...
yeah deffo, will make sure im clearer with my questions
lofty depot
Grimzzy if u saw this. Would u think that dh was padding
The only ethical people here are the locks prob
celest rampart
Grimzzy if u saw this. Would u think that dh was padding
no idea how DH work
is the boomkin starfalling
lofty depot
Yes
celest rampart
if so then yeah hes a filthy padder
lofty depot
One is boss one is adds
celest rampart
The adds need to die before castbar go off
Logically, you assign the classes who gain dps from killing the adds, or lose the least
and you go down in order till they die
having as few people as required to kill them consintantly
lofty depot
Logically u kill the adds and change ur talents when they stop being a problem
Move pots around
Boomkin has CDs for every set
celest rampart
Boomkin has CDs for every set
so yeah maybe boomkin would be high on that list of people that lose the least from it
so they should be doing it
I have no fucking clue
becuaase how do you know that
lofty depot
I can also move my pot to either first set or 2nd and still have up for lust p3
lofty depot
becuaase how do you know that
Well true, but is about looking into the fight. Like hunters playing mm
celest rampart
Well true, but is about looking into the fight. Like hunters playing mm
how do you mean looking into the fight?
lofty depot
Looking at logs of classes and kills that are similar comp structure and then seeing what people do and how they play
@dull dust u think preheat was playing fire cuz it was better ST or
lucid olive
Logically, you assign the classes who gain dps from killing the adds, or lose th...
That makes sense, but also the overall dmg check on the boss is nonexistant outside of Phase 1
vale pebble
<@241331846338576387> u think preheat was playing fire cuz it was better ST or
it was for adds mate
lucid olive
so why not just have people sac some ST and make sure adds die consistently
lofty depot
it was for adds mate
vale pebble
ye i mean its good for that
we are swapping a bm for mm cause we dont have add dmg
so for sure something u can do me thinks
vale pebble
id tell my mage to go fire but insecure and carrying seed and thats ok
comfort on seed better
vale pebble
Jeez chicken always changing roles
vro leave me alone
lucid olive
id tell my mage to go fire but insecure and carrying seed and thats ok
Fire is naturally good seed holder cause of caut or?
Not saying it's worth for your guy to go fire tho just a blanket question
vale pebble
Fire is naturally good seed holder cause of caut or?
eh
yea but u have like
2block 2barr
on frost
but yea on paper yes
caut goog
lucid olive
Yeah more on-demand defensives for frost for sure
lofty depot
Gonna propaganda cotti into playing wild mushroom
lofty depot
Was gonna ask is it just a comfort/mobility thing
Like most mages haven't played frost in years
Fire more mobile easier to play maybe
@dull dust ask mage person
Allo please respond
royal zenith
I dont think you struggle with mobility spamming ice lance
vale pebble
Like most mages haven't played frost in years
yea but uve played frost the whole tier?
in bust its easy fb pyro
out of bust is more esoteric
frost more mobile in general
?
XD
what is this btw
royal zenith
🙂
royal zenith
Yezzir
lofty depot
yea but uve played frost the whole tier?
Sure I played fire all of undermine eventually learned sure
vale pebble
yea same
lofty depot
I also didn't look into frost mages million cast icelance so now it doesn't make sense lol
lofty depot
Back to don't understand just swap BM to mm territory
vale pebble
i mean yea thats why hes the only guy
that plays it
he was also arguing
caut gooder
but yea its just arguable
inner plover
Hello question, on Myth Beloren, do you SFall birds and eggs or you just ST your one ?
lofty depot
Starfall generally
lucid olive
I just Starsurge one of the eggs so the bird doesn't push early
but you probably do more overall dam if you Starfall when birds or eggs are up
inner plover
So basically depends on timers
lucid olive
eh sure but also not really
you're always gonna end up stopping DPS on that fight
think guilds play some different timers on when they push into 2nd egg phase
by now most people probably do 2m push instead of 3m
royal zenith
I think you still want 3min
lucid olive
that stretch is the most stressful part of the fight imo
lofty depot
3m would depend on having an ele sham no?
lucid olive
yeah maybe
lucid olive
youd also have to probably send some more CDs in p2 to make the 2m phase
which could be less dmg on egg depending which CD it is
lofty depot
Sure, just implies every guild 300+ has an ele
Eventually they probably swap to 2m asc
lofty depot
Wonder when someone will 1 phase
lucid olive
we were discussing doing 2m phase when we were like 40 pulls in or something
royal zenith
And 3min only ever really matter in a situation where you have ele
lucid olive
idk how much it wouldve changed things tbh
if ele goes 2m then we'd send PI on someone else
royal zenith
So it shouldnt be part of the discussion if you move the goalpost
lucid olive
and maybe make back dmg
but wasn't rly worth trying it in case it failed when 3m was more of a sure thing
golden narwhal
which settings do you use when siming on raidbots for higher dungeons? i want to avoid going through specific routes with guru
lofty depot
well u would want to use a route on guru to sim dungeons
theres not some default setting to sim dungeons
golden narwhal
i see. im back to boomkin after a far too big break and im not familiar with guru
copper gate
Do you guys ever wonder if simc and raidbots is what Paul Atreides was warning us about? Thinking machines ruling over us with an iron fist…
lofty depot
i see. im back to boomkin after a far too big break and im not familiar with gur...
ur not familiar with it but knew what it was?
golden narwhal
ive never used it to sim, only to grab routes
golden narwhal
ty!
lofty depot
but wasn't rly worth trying it in case it failed when 3m was more of a sure thin...
whats my bis omnium folio rune
lucid olive
whats my bis omnium folio rune
probably one that gives crit effect or mastery
lofty depot
Sheesh, watch them all be defensive
craggy sonnet
All open world only
sleek trellis
do i use my bonus rolls on nexus?
lofty depot
It says against void, so if the sporefall boss isn't void,.....
lofty depot
do i use my bonus rolls on nexus?
If u don't have vaelgors prob not
edgy quarry
Hi guys ! I hope you are doing well
Just a quick question! I look at WL for build on belo Mm I saw lot of EC + convok seem good !
I wanted your opinion about that
Wish u a beautiful day
dense steeple
ec big dam in egg window
edgy quarry
Yeah we have 2 incarn + 1 convok
During try when I do it correctly I can do first incarn + concovok in and 2nd incarn
Between egg I feel less powerful 🤷♂️ but egg damage are more important
dense steeple
thats fine
egg damage is all that matters
p1 is mechanical failure
p2 is dps race
do the mechanics, burst the dps
EC is the choice for that here
edgy quarry
I see … thank you !!
dense steeple
the real fun part is, if you dont want to, you dont have to
you squeezing out an extra 10% dam minmaxing will not be the cause of you killing the boss or not
round field
but what if boss lives at 0%..
dense steeple
then someone in your raid needed to just play better
round field
dense steeple
probably the devourers
drifting nova
just crit more
exotic perch
get more ele shamans really
royal zenith
make innervate balance druid only
steel fulcrum
Question about vanguard talents: Is there a reason to take Stellar Amplifcation over Nature's Grace?
Nvm that's assuming they will be grouped all the time I guess
rain orchid
Could someone please help explain Starfall? Do you spam it?
lofty depot
Question about vanguard talents: Is there a reason to take Stellar Amplifcation ...
Ng kinda beans
lofty depot
Could someone please help explain Starfall? Do you spam it?
"stacks multiple times"
rain orchid
Ah so its a spamable ability. Thanks alot!
dense steeple
Could someone please help explain Starfall? Do you spam it?
yeah so basically Starfall Calls down waves of falling stars upon enemies within 40 yds, dealing [9 * (25.3% of Spell Power)] Astral damage over 8 sec. Multiple uses of this ability may overlap. [Aetherial Kindling: Extends the duration of active Moonfires and Sunfires by 3 sec]
rain orchid
yeah so basically Starfall Calls down waves of falling stars upon enemies within...
Thank you kindly!
covert coyote
is this correct in raidbots? crafted items will upgrade to 295 and not 294?
dense steeple
is this correct in raidbots? crafted items will upgrade to 295 and not 294?
yeah probably
covert coyote
thanks team
lucid olive
crafted items go +10 and other items go +9
you probably dont have any crafted items to spend it on whenever the system comes out tho i think
maybe if you use off-hand with hunt instead of 2x arcanoweave
but unsure whether hunt scales off ilvl
i know arcanoweave does but only weapons and trinkets are eligible to upgrade anyway
eager raft
Week after next
lucid olive
talk to decimus and he says how many more things he needs to make the hammer
exotic perch
takes 4 weeks ye
eager raft
Wait
lucid olive
presumably when the hammer finishes you start getting the voidcore items from any content
exotic perch
decimus is really slow at blacksmithing
lucid olive
but who knows
eager raft
May 13
exotic perch
didnt spend any of his KP
lucid olive
everything was untested anyway
maybe using one of the items actually makes it scale to manaforge ilvl numbers
exotic perch
i wouldnt be surprised
lucid olive
saying same thing i said for bonus rolls, this shit is untested so you could be better off avoiding interacting with it until the bugs are fixed
exotic perch
this entire patch was vibe coded
eager raft
when do we get upgrade shit actually?
Hey deux may 13th just in case you didn’t see my message before
royal zenith
🥹
eager raft
you don’t have to thank me I’m just doin my job
inland sleet
Hey fellas birdo. Is there a way to input "fully stacked AP" on raidbot ?
clever heart
Is there a way to sim what buff to take in Algethar Academy?
lucid olive
Is there a way to sim what buff to take in Algethar Academy?
https://www.github.com/simulationcraft/simc/wiki/ExpansionOptions if there are it's in here
dry heron
hey, so i'm just messing around with an alt boomie, i havn't touched it since I used it for splits. Has the recommended rotation on the compendium changed since then? I could have sworn it said to - in a KOTG opener - go into an ecipise first and spender your asendant stacks before going into incarn, but what i'm seeing here seems way simpler, just to kinda dot and go
did it change or am i completely misremembering what I read at the start of the season
lucid olive
hey, so i'm just messing around with an alt boomie, i havn't touched it since I ...
it's changed mostly because doing a 16 step opener is not something you can do for every boss
and its annoying
dry heron
ok, thats fine, i'm not griping, i just wanted to make sure I wasn't misremebering something important
lofty depot
Hey fellas birdo. Is there a way to input "fully stacked AP" on raidbot ?
druid.initial_astral_power=100
Depending on what ur doing that number can change, that's not 100% it's 100asp.
Also it resets to 50 if ur running NB
royal zenith
you now have to spend 2 eclipse charges and at least 14 wraths...
inland sleet
```druid.initial_astral_power=100```
Thank you vm
dull dust
<@241331846338576387> ask mage person
allo
preheat played fire because his item craft bugged out and what he had left was better for fire
and he figured it it felt p good for adds so he just kept playing it
lofty depot
Lol
wheat crown
when are they going to buff boomkin
wheat crown
just a little bit to starfire and wrath would be nice
hits like dry noodle
not even wet pool noodle
lofty depot
wouldnt u wrather ur spenders do damage
wheat crown
i would, but also that may be like asking santa for a PS5 and the new Xbox
ask small... get 30% to builders
enjoy
wheat crown
u know... i dont like you
lucid olive
ask small... get 30% to builders
spec is fun? 
spec is good?
spec is S tier? 
buff builders by 30?
spec is fun?
spec is good?
spec is S tier?
idk why youd wanna take the fun away
craggy sonnet
but unsure whether hunt scales off ilvl
always resorting to QELive for this .. and at least according to that, it does not
dull dust
u dont like it?
exotic perch
dreamburst should just proc on starsurge too
craggy sonnet
yes
craggy sonnet
but waaay way back i was trying to make the sim force spend all dream burst stacks
even if you get a proc
lucid olive
dude .. remove dream burst
no i have idea for redesign
craggy sonnet
idk about better
dull dust
make the treeants autos proc the explosion
lucid olive
and if you look at specs across Midnight they seem to love procs that change icons and spell IDs of some spells
craggy sonnet
feral
lofty depot
gonna make dremasurge get proc'd by surge and then were gonna be surging at 8t again
lucid olive
why isn't dream surge "using force of nature transforms your Starsurge into Dream Surge, making it do additional Nature damage to nearby targets capped to 5"
so like
basically same as it does now
but is consumed by spender instead of builder
craggy sonnet
lowkey would like it to be some kinda payoff tho
lucid olive
Honestly should just remove Force of Nature as a damage CD or make it a cycling proc ala Diabolist warlock
craggy sonnet
like the manaforge tier set
lucid olive
thats asking for too much
craggy sonnet
instead of just here is another deterministic dmg thing
lucid olive
i want my damn trees to cast spells
they cast moonfire
lofty depot
i want my damn trees to cast spells
they do cast spells
craggy sonnet
but detaching it from builders for sure better
wheat crown
mine just run in and slap lol
craggy sonnet
that window is far too congested / contended
lucid olive
mine just run in and slap lol
they still cast moonfire
its not as noticeable anymore i guess since it doesnt gen AP
craggy sonnet
speaking of .. can we riot that they bricked twin moons working for trees?
lucid olive
yeah i guess it doesnt hm
i could've seen the 4th moonfire and assumed it was twin moons
but its bounteous bloom treant
craggy sonnet
that makes sense, yeah
lucid olive
might have been intentional when they made the moonfire not give AP
probably more modifiers taken off it
hm
craggy sonnet
at least they never said so anywhere
lucid olive
need to double check if treant moonfires give shooting star
craggy sonnet
and i feel like its part of the appeal for kotg in aoe
lucid olive
at least they never said so anywhere
yeah they just said about the AP stuff during beta
dull dust
why isn't dream surge "using force of nature transforms your Starsurge into Drea...
ngl i like pushing one hero talent towards prio damage
makes the choice interesting
lucid olive
if shooting stars wasnt on piss random targets the starweaver prio dam would be good
dull dust
true
lucid olive
okay treant moonfires proc shooting stars
craggy sonnet
and star cascade
but like .. you are saying you like one of them being more prio
only you want it on the one you like to play
hmmm
lucid olive
lunar calling is a mistake
dsune's word still ring true
2 years later
"what are you gonna do? just Starfire all the time?"
guy is an oracle
also crazy to think the first version of Lunar Calling was 40%
and by end of TWW it was 160%
dull dust
royal zenith
new hero talents when
lucid olive
is moonkin among the specs who have gotten the least changes to their hero talents
royal zenith
not sure
lucid olive
i think it is but i'm not well versed enough in all the hero talent choices..
royal zenith
but it would be more fun if they completely do new hero talents but yeah
evergreen content ecksdee
lucid olive
yeah for sure
give me druid of the flame
insane we killed tindral and then ignored his whole schtick
craggy sonnet
if you consider that ours were one of the first
and didnt get much iteration early on
probably?
lucid olive
i think they only replaced 1 talent from our hero trees between blizzcon and tww release
and it was the only spender point in keeper
craggy sonnet
they locked that shit in real early
lofty depot
ur gonna delete hero talents and were gonna just as shit dont worry
drifting nova
cant wait for the last titan
to have no real changes to hero talents
and we'l get uber talents
ontop of apex
was surprised to find out apex talents arent a 3rd talent
delicate perch
we'll just get super hero talents 
drifting nova
wonder which if any hero talents got the most changes
lucid olive
i think they reworked rogue stuff at least 3 times
dark ranger as well for hunter got a bunch of stuff iirc
delicate perch
everyone but druid is a safe bet
drifting nova
is the 4th branch new?
I cant even tell
warrior didnt get shit
no way sporefall flex loot is randomised
vers/crit bracers enter the room
celest rampart
what trinkets are people using for mythic plus, I have a Heroic final stare and a heroic Locus walker, but thinking Locus could be really bad in M+ as the buff falls of between pulls, does anyone know if it is worth keeping or would you targeting a different trinket
fathom nebula
Am i bad or are we squishy on Paladins? I feel really squishy
lofty depot
it might feel that way at the start of ur healers figuring out how to press their buttons
but no
hotw 2:24 and 5:04... bark for fun
fathom nebula
Were on reclear 😄 Without a defensive on some sacred tolls im dead and because Avengers shield hates me it usually means bear form often
lofty depot
tell your healers to press their buttons better
fathom nebula
Barkskin is enough but its on CD often
lofty depot
ur on reclear and they cant heal not poggers
celest rampart
can also farm a hero trinket until u get h/m gaze
what would you target farm over heroic Locus-Walker, I guess just heart of wind
lofty depot
prob
celest rampart
cheers
lofty depot
ur not using resto hotw dawg
lofty depot
u can sit in hotw bear form if ur scared
or u can pre hotw the hit and go back to dps
drifting nova
sort of wish frenzied regen worked out of bear
already have the bear tax going into it
nimble tangle
Will 12.0.7 have a tuning? I don’t feel there will be one
lucid olive
tuning probably not, but class changes might be
they didnt really do any class changes in .5 or .7 patches in TWW outside of 11.0.5 and some visual stuff iirc
normal pilot
ya it's just power creep + single boss
lucid olive
and the 11.0.5 one was just stuff they didnt have time to push in beta, like hail of stars etc
normal pilot
12.1 for new stuff
lucid olive
can also argue the 12.0.5 stuff we got last week were also just class changes they didnt have time to do in beta
nimble tangle
So we are where we stand right now and will be like this until 12.1
Can’t be worse anymore
lofty depot
why do u think were bad
copper gate
We’re in a good spot
nova ocean
I can't wait for them to buff devourer in the next major patch
glacial oar
nova ocean
Also we are in a good spot for the current raid design we could be bad if it's more st focused next tier which is likely
lucid olive
only issue is you'll be playing convoke
i guess 1m convoke is a little more fun than what we did in the past tho
dense steeple
craggy sonnet
if were allowed to just spec st
did i hear ec?
dull dust
craggy sonnet
just plant and pump
lofty depot
i'm considering playing it on lura but idk
ec AA gogogoog
craggy sonnet
btw, the character string didnt have the crit dmg enchants .. hoooly
lofty depot
btw, the character string didnt have the crit dmg enchants .. hoooly
add crit flask while ur at it
dull dust
could be worse
could be most other specs where one of their hero trees makes u do less then tanks
celest rampart
is there any reason to take a mythic 2h over a mythic 1 h and crafted OH, they sim the same
exotic perch
could be most other specs where one of their hero trees makes u do less then tan...
you mean like the hero tree frost mage vs hero tree arcane mage
dull dust
i crashed out a ton already about it
i just moved onto a diff class where hes kinda stuck
worldly flame
i have 289 feather and 289 stare but no other trinkets (not even heroic gaze) is double on use ever the play ?
it always sims higher lol xd
shadow willow
i have 289 feather and 289 stare but no other trinkets (not even heroic gaze) is...
probably ok in m+ but too much of a headache in raid imo
nimble tangle
But u have to make crit way higher than mastery first
stark trellis
Hey guys! I'm rying to get into balance a bit and ive done some keys and i think im grasping the concept pretty smoothly, but for raid i checked wowhead and there were some more nuance to it there with CD timings and the fact that we play keeper there and whatnot, it's just seemed like a bit much. Am I overthinking it? I feel like it's easy and it should come with time, at least the CD usage part
I always thought balance was straight forward, but i guess there is some minmaxing to it
rough flax
Hey guys! I'm rying to get into balance a bit and ive done some keys and i think...
Check compendium in the channel header might go more in depth the. What you were looking for in wowhead
obsidian jetty
feels so shit in p1
feels good to me, causes dreamburst pops on the adds
and on 3 add sets can rng 2 full moons as well from 1m voke
stark trellis
Check compendium in the channel header might go more in depth the. What you were...
will do, thanks!
rough flax
will do, thanks!
And for keeper the tldr is that you want to align all the cds together. Best to use the planner or copy another good log and have it as a note to get reminded
stark trellis
And for keeper the tldr is that you want to align all the cds together. Best to ...
how im understanding it is you wanna use trees with celestial everytime
yeah ok so trees convoke and celestial together and inbetween those big cds normal eclipses until its all back together so ucan line them again
stark trellis
yeah ok
thats why we're holding 1 charge of incarn for when trees are up again
i assume
makes sense
craggy sonnet
you never convoke without trees and at least eclipse (upgrades to never without ca/incarn if you play 2min convoke)
craggy sonnet
thats why we're holding 1 charge of incarn for when trees are up again
yes. but after the first 3 trees, ca/incarn wont be up again in time .. so you will have to send one with eclipse
stark trellis
yeah basically all cds together, seems fairly reasonable
stark trellis
yes. but after the first 3 trees, ca/incarn wont be up again in time .. so you w...
ah ok
dull vale
So are we still kotg raid EC m+? EC seems to be doing better ST than kotg
lofty depot
So are we still kotg raid EC m+? EC seems to be doing better ST than kotg
seems
we looking at sims and drawing conclusions or
craggy sonnet
❌
jolly delta
i got something for u to make work
the gear compare in simc
eternal drift
can i ask why there is a starfire before incarn on the opener for elunes chosen in the compendium?
jolly delta
can i ask why there is a starfire before incarn on the opener for elunes chosen ...
free damage
eternal drift
ok also @jolly delta im doing better today 😄 thx for the help 😄
jolly delta
Glad to hear! You're welcome
jolly delta
free damage
Just to be clear, since it has cast time it's just free damage that you can send prepull
eternal drift
Glad to hear! You're welcome
yeah went from dead last in damage to top 4 almost every pull
crazy what reading and askign questions can do
lofty depot
can i ask why there is a starfire before incarn on the opener for elunes chosen ...
theres always been that, its precasting for free damage
theres wraths before that too
inland cipher
Im looking at Mythic Keys and see most Bommies running Elune. I've tried a 3 builds and the suggested rotations but i have yet to out DPS the SBA build i got from Davlin
The rotation i've had the best DPS with is "Moon fire, Sunfire, Incarnation, Fury of Elune, Starfall and spaming Starfire
dense steeple
idk what SBA or Davlin is
dense steeple
idk what sba is
inland cipher
Single Button Assist
dense steeple
The rotation i've had the best DPS with is "Moon fire, Sunfire, Incarnation, Fur...
this is almost correct though
FoE before incarn
lofty depot
gj buddy
jolly delta
FoE before incarn
but also if someone is using the single button rotation it doesnt really matter right...
exotic perch
i did my job 16.19m to egg
inland cipher
at ilvl 261 im doing about 68-74K with the Dvalin SBA build. With the build and rotation i got from Murlok im doing about the same, just a tad less. 62-68K. Any suggestions? Thats without popping trinkets
craggy sonnet
at ilvl 261 im doing about 68-74K with the Dvalin SBA build. With the build and ...
If you truly want to improve, you should read an actual guide and probably log your runs and post them to get feedback