one that he ragequit
#balance
wooden obsidian
haha
how is your damage profile compared to other dps? I find myself lacking a bit on KoTG in 10's to 12's compared to other dps. Maybe I'm ass. I tried EC and did generally lower damage than KoTG
round field
idk i play purple class
round field
shit dies way too fast in 10 to 12
wooden obsidian
I can get equal or sometimes higher damage in big pulls but other than that I tend to lag behind. Maybe because I don't have 100% uptime on eclipses.
round field
ur probably just doing something wrong
lucid olive
you should reconsider how you approach your spec if you think total uptime on Eclipse is the reason you're doing bad
wooden obsidian
hmm, seems like it. I got some good help here earlier when pugging Dreamrift week 1 which vastly improved my dps but yeah maybe I should watch canexx to get some pointers
it's my trinkets (cope)
prime saffron
does it make sense to run my keys first, bonus roll and then take vault?
lucid olive
depends on your vault, but yes
generally holding your vault for reclear or keys first is good
i am not taking my vault until after our reclear tomorrow
prime saffron
thx
grim mirage
go watch canexx do m+ or something
does he have a YT channel ? 🙂
lucid olive
I can get equal or sometimes higher damage in big pulls but other than that I te...
It is impossible to have 100% or close to 100% uptime on Eclipse.
You want to use Eclipse/CA when either of the spells are sitting at 2 charges to prevent capping the cooldown, otherwise you make sure to use them when you have high amount of resources (Astral Power, procs, other cooldowns available for overlap etc).
Instead of thinking about it like a binary "I should always be in Eclipse or I am bad" problem, you should instead think about it like "I will do more dam for the next 15 seconds so I should make sure I spend these seconds on as many good globals as possible"
lucid olive
does he have a YT channel ? 🙂
probably but not for M+
dwilkz uploads some m+ runs to youtube, you can look at them
grim mirage
Sad, twich only so ?
grim mirage
dwilkz uploads some m+ runs to youtube, you can look at them
Ty
Also, maybe it's just a feely vibe or i miss a cast but when i'm in eclipse with foe casted just before i have to hard cast my last starfire without starlord buff which doesn't feel right. Should i go a little more haste to counter that or it's just missplay ?
wooden obsidian
It is impossible to have 100% or close to 100% uptime on Eclipse.
You want to u...
ah I see, thanks! I felt like a bad player when I didn't have 100% uptime on eclipse so I've probably flunked the buff by spending time building up AP instead of immediately spending them and rebuilding it with wrath/starfire.
So for aoe situations, is it 3+ = lunar eclipse?
grim mirage
I usually just follow my sims for gearing don't even know my stats right now (and i do not change it between raid and MM+ which is probably my mistake)
grim mirage
ah I see, thanks! I felt like a bad player when I didn't have 100% uptime on ecl...
To my knoledge, in raid always solar (except vanguard where you play EC). For MM+ always lunar no matterwhat
digital berry
ah I see, thanks! I felt like a bad player when I didn't have 100% uptime on ecl...
if youre playing kotg in m+ you go lunar on 2, if youre playing ec you dont have a choice
in a raid scenario, there isnt really a situation in which you have 15+ seconds of aoe where starfire hits at least 2 targets so lunar is not really an eclipse you'd want
twin jewel
Hey guys, I got the Chimaerus trinket from the Vault but it's not simming that well. Could anyone shed some light on this? It's driving me crazy.
https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/gGwY7KeiG7ixFKf197PLao
digital berry
how are you simming 20k below your ilvl
twin jewel
Simmin only for 1 target, i guess?
digital berry
no, a 280 st sim should be at the very least 100k
twin jewel
What i am doing wrong then?
digital berry
youre missing one arcanoweave
twin jewel
That doesnt give you 20k
twin jewel
You're right
digital berry
are you simming without lust and all the other buffs?
lucid olive
What i am doing wrong then?
no buffs
twin jewel
Yep, i normally only use my own buff
round field
but why
twin jewel
That doenst explain why the trinket is simming that bad
lucid olive
well i added the buffs
and the trinket sims good
so
and yeah, get a 2nd embellishment
you can do 2x arcanoweave lining
given your gear you should probably craft gloves and catalyze your chest
yeah thats what i thought
twin jewel
Very helpfull as always
Thanks you very much all of you
I will follow all your suggestions 🙂
grim mirage
I mean it's not same hero talent between sims could make a lot also
lucid olive
I mean it's not same hero talent between sims could make a lot also
They're the same talents simmed, the top result just changed with diff settings
grim mirage
ok but felt like it wasn't when this first showed on my screen
lucid olive
I saw that one
Acting as if this wasn't true way back when as well
Had to teach people what extra action button did on Ultraxion..
gentle tangle
i cant wait to send my bonusrolls in npx and get dogshit <3
drifting nova
I really like how top guilds have virtually no change with the wa bricking
digital berry
WA / addons or not, the first couple hours of the last 2 bosses are literally alawys a shitshow like that
lucid olive
Dogshit designed boss
jolly delta
I have no clue how people even fail
gentle tangle
i enjoyed beloren (i clicked lightning bolt)
jolly delta
soak your color and run out with the soak
what is there to explain
like I get lura
drifting nova
are they not simplified mechanics tho
wow would benefit greatly from not having dogwater coloured mechanics
esp not purple on purple
eager raft
I have no clue how people even fail
You can reduce any boss down to this if you want to
It’s hard because of tuning
the mechanics are simple but everything hurts
jolly delta
bro that guy is talking about heroic
drifting nova
jolly delta
but like
drifting nova
visibility being bad is across all levels
jolly delta
even in Mythic, I think it's mechanically very simple
eager raft
It’s a very poorly designed figh
jolly delta
Like there's not a lot to understand
eager raft
Meant to be a 3rd/4th boss difficulty
jolly delta
vs for example L'ura
eager raft
That they panic changed into an end boss last second
By dealing all the damage numbers up by way too much
Can’t press defensives otherwise you just die if you get chosen for soak
drifting nova
what defensive?
drifting nova
homogenise defensives already aaaa
eager raft
Cuz you can just bear hotw the circle
lofty depot
The only one u can reasonably die to is the first soak in p1.2
eager raft
But if I use UR on anything other than soak I die to soak thru external
lofty depot
Skill issue
eager raft
I mean yeah kinda
More so knowledge issue
I assumed max dark pact shield would be enough
But in bird p2 it is not
lofty depot
Ur dying to soak 2 or 3?
eager raft
2nd one in 2nd bird phase is the one I died to without DR with only pact shield
but I might have also not gotten pain sup
not 100% sure
lofty depot
Without Dr smh
eager raft
yeah I panic hit DR at the end of p2 cuz I was low and orbs were gonna hit boss
But that’s prog right
lofty depot
Press health pot and soak it
eager raft
Lesson learned won’t use it there again
I’m sure you can assume I’m not an idiot man….
lofty depot
Sometimes
drifting nova
idk you play druid
digital berry
he doesnt tho
drifting nova
lofty depot
Also those orbs at the start of p1.2 feel like u just need to assign more people to doing it
eager raft
Also those orbs at the start of p1.2 feel like u just need to assign more people...
We are very light on immunes
gleaming belfry
Has anyone managed to get a lot of mileage out of fluid form in keys? I feel like I’m shifting a lot for mobility/snare removal/defense and could save quite a few GCDs by swapping back automatically.
lofty depot
I mean I always take it
lucid olive
I haven’t played Druid in like 2+ years man
Like 13 maybe
digital berry
after spending half a key without moonkin form
drifting nova
wake me up when its a class passive
lucid olive
Undermine was March 24
lucid olive
Has anyone managed to get a lot of mileage out of fluid form in keys? I feel li...
I never take it
jolly delta
hopefully never
Cringe opinion tbh
jolly delta
You're just trying to gatekeep
jaunty blaze
else whats the point
jolly delta
there should be exclusive high level content
Sure
Can we make skill a requirement?
Instead of a guild and 19 other people with the same schedule as you
jaunty blaze
idk man its just how it is
formal crest
Don’t see a point in a mythic lockout. If I want to hop in a mythic raid for fun and I’m locked out. Let me idc
jolly delta
Don’t see a point in a mythic lockout. If I want to hop in a mythic raid for fun...
the official point is to prevent boosting
jolly delta
idk man its just how it is
nice argument
formal crest
Prevent it in other aspects of the game first before you use that lame argument
lucid olive
the official point is to prevent boosting
That sounds made up
gleaming belfry
Problem solved, as we know, mythic boosting never happens
lucid olive
People boost regardless
jaunty blaze
some things are better when they are not available at any given point
sleek trellis
should i max out a mythic set item?
jaunty blaze
sure why not
slim stone
guys why the ppl is swapping to haste-crit not maste-haste ?
jaunty blaze
you should sim your character and not blindly chase any given stat
eager raft
Undermine was March 24
Oh ya then yeah you’re right
13 months
Little less ig since I did stix prog as bamkin
drifting nova
the only reason its stayed in its archaic form is bc blizz still foolishly believes its deserved yet is getting easier and easier to do in a pug
a much easier solution to the conversion issue than whatever the flex 15-25 is going to look like
stable frigate
Since its nature dmg is it better to be in nature eclipse and pop them or in lunar eclipse and pop dem with instant starfire ?
lofty depot
Ur spending them in incarn it doesn't matter
If ur talking about later in the fight, I'm never in lunar
I and it's not to do with mushrooms
ionic surge
well well well, look who i have here
lofty depot
Did u tell him ur a big fan
ionic surge
am not so no
dense steeple
Chest gloves boots weapon 
lucid olive
am not so no
Damn, @fleet thorn thoughts on your tank not being a fan?
grim mirage
Is omnicd working again ? 😮
lucid olive
Is omnicd working again ? 😮
No
grim mirage
Which addons is it so ?
lucid olive
One of many M+ tracker add-ons that came up past month or so
wooden obsidian
Chest gloves boots weapon <a:Prayge:991821972021461183>
yep yep yep
lucid olive
Whether the add-on is accurate or not is another topic
grim mirage
One of many M+ tracker add-ons that came up past month or so
Oh ok though they were all dead
dense steeple
Damn, <@111196794796441600> thoughts on your tank not being a fan?
Damn nit only pinged him but name dropped
lucid olive
You can do the same things now as you could before this expansion
tawny linden
Is there an addon to track other player's CDs?
lime pebble
what does CA stand for?
tawny linden
Celestial alignment
jaunty blaze
celestial alignment
lime pebble
oh thank you
I'm a mythic+ enjoyer and i'm trying to figure out when to cast FoE properly. I can see reasons for casting it right after eclipse but i can also see a point in casting it right before, considering when you enter eclipse the damage amp does work on it
Seems like casting right before nets me an extra GCD inside of eclipe and losing only 1.3ish seconds of damage amp on it
jaunty blaze
you ideally always want to cast it before eclipse or ca because otherwise you waste a gcd inside your window
lime pebble
Great, so im not crazy
lucid olive
Seems like casting right before nets me an extra GCD inside of eclipe and losing...
Yeah, if both are available at once then casting before is better
if you're using Lunation though you want to just use it off CD
You can hold for an Eclipse if you know for sure that FoE won't be ready when you wanna enter Eclipse
wooden obsidian
how do I use raidbots for simming? I might be blind but it didn't give me any options on gear, talents, instance etc. I could quick sim what I have on atm though
loud kettle
jaunty blaze
you add items via the search bar there
craggy sonnet
or import via a string from the simulationcraft addon that adds all of your current gear + stuff in bags
(which is usually the first step)
wooden obsidian
not seeing any search options on "top gear" ? Maybe the simulationcraft addon is essential
lucid olive
Yes it is
thorny wagon
get the addon then ingame /simc
lucid olive
The simulationcraft addon grabs your current gear and talents and provides the "baseline"
thorny wagon
copy and paste in topgear
lucid olive
all other options on raidbots are to supplement the original addon input
wooden obsidian
if youre playing kotg in m+ you go lunar on 2, if youre playing ec you dont have...
Also, when is single target AP spender better instead of aoe AP spender? 2+ enemies as well?
wooden obsidian
all other options on raidbots are to supplement the original addon input
okay thanks 🙂
lofty depot
U Starfall on 2t, u surge if u have a weaver proc in aoe
wooden obsidian
ah okay, but not raids usually where ads/trash die too fast it seems, like Dreamrift and most others? So you wrath/starsurge and cleave will help with the rest?
ruby badger
If a 2nd target will be alive for the duration of starfall, press it
It's very useful on:
Averzian
Vorasius
Saladbar
V&E (your main spender)
LBV (your main spender)
Alleria
Belo'ren and L'ura it gets used as well
Oh and Chimaerus
lofty depot
ah okay, but not raids usually where ads/trash die too fast it seems, like Dream...
There's plenty of times ur pressing starfall in raid
Every boss specifically u can Starfall at points
wooden obsidian
Especially on free procs I guess 😄
lucid olive
It's very useful on:
Averzian
Vorasius
Saladbar
V&E (your main spender)
LBV (you...
theyre called dragons and paladins
wooden obsidian
Take the adds phase (first) in dreamrift for example. Is it correct or wrong to assume I can solar eclipse for wrath on the big ad but use starfalls? (otherwise starsurges to burst it down)
lucid olive
Take the adds phase (first) in dreamrift for example. Is it correct or wrong to ...
Correct
Which Eclipse you enter is decided on how many targets Starfire can hit and for how long it can hit them
sleek dirge
does raidbots do that too?
yes, in TopGear.
You select different trees you want to compare
ruby badger
Take the adds phase (first) in dreamrift for example. Is it correct or wrong to ...
Yeah there's not really any opportunity outside of Paladins this tier to lunar eclipse
lime pebble
Thanks
ruby badger
Nothing lives long enough + is clumped enough to warrant a full lunar
lofty depot
belo mmhm mmhm
cerulean agate
hey guys someone have a good plater nameplate profile or a link for a good balance or player with a good plater specially for multi dot spec
ty
lofty depot
Jundies
celest rampart
@lofty depot does this style of macro still work?
do you have one for this expansion I couls steal
lofty depot
I could make one lol I just haven't lol
lucid olive
/use item:245898
/use item:241308
/use item:245897
/use item:241309
this should work
idk if thats the same one btw
i just yoinked it from guild discord, someone sent it weeks ago
celest rampart
```
/use item:245898
/use item:241308
/use item:245897
/use item:241309
```
cheers, do you have any other ones you guys use for anything else?
lofty depot
Assuming the numbers are the different order likely means urs goes fleeting r2, r2, fleeting r1, r1
celest rampart
Assuming the numbers are the different order likely means urs goes fleeting r2, ...
Gamz macro does that order
digital berry
there really arent many macros right now that are super useful, cast on cursor Trees, an innervate macro and a bear form HOTW macro maybe
digital berry
log out macro that logs you into a DDH
indigo barn
royal zenith
lucid olive
there really arent many macros right now that are super useful, cast on cursor T...
give it a few hours
young ravine
https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/wC1JKtWZFaRND4MG?fight=last&source=8
Im starting to understand how to read logs. And by far my most common issue is wasting astral power. Do you guys have a rule on at what point do you start using your spenders? 70-90 astral power? You go to eclipse at nearly full astral power obv.
Mi CPM are very low so im trying to improve that.
celest rampart
there really arent many macros right now that are super useful, cast on cursor T...
could you share your HOTW macro? I dont have that one
young ravine
Also i play with a latency of nearle 200ms home and 200 ms world idk if that can make it hard for me to reach a decent CPM
celest rampart
While in eclipse, u spend to not overcap
presumably 3 x asap for starlord then spend to not overcap?
normal pilot
latency doesn't matter for casting, since it's mitigated by spellqueue
lofty depot
Ur either pulling 2 mobs and running to the next pack or not dotting enough
In which case if it's the first, u shouldn't be incarning that early
If it's the second, u should be dotting more
U then sent 2nd incarn 10s left on the first one
Which is also giga bad
young ravine
Yikes yeah... need to adjust that
Do you use 2 incarn back yo back or go incarn eclipsex2 incarn. ?
On big pulls like the 1st one of academy?
digital berry
god wow players never cease to amaze me
first time tank, healer and aug in a 14
the aug was dead on average 2x per pull
royal zenith
god wow players never cease to amaze me
real
they even complain about 14's and pugging
the classic
drifting nova
the aug was dead on average 2x per pull
duh, most boosted spec in universe
it is infact canon
ripe magnet
is crafted gear just shit now? or am i simming this wrong. hero hear to max crafted worth 0.1%
jaunty blaze
did you add an embellishment
ripe magnet
did st belo'ren build just to make it simple. https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/1iJpkHANKpFKpSMxDg3ouN
ripe magnet
did you add an embellishment
no i have 2 already
jaunty blaze
ye i see
ruby badger
is crafted gear just shit now? or am i simming this wrong. hero hear to max craf...
Did you try different secondary stat iterations?
exotic perch
if you are going 276 to 285 on a bracer slot yeah .1% makes sense
ripe magnet
Did you try different secondary stat iterations?
i tried haste/mast mast/crit and even crit/haste
exotic perch
thats the lowest budget thing in all of your gear
jaunty blaze
its not a very huge upgrade
exotic perch
just hold the crests and wait for a myth item
ripe magnet
so being that low is normal 🙁
ruby badger
Yeah not all slots are made equal, .1% sounds a little low even still but not absurd
exotic perch
youll get plenty
ripe magnet
yea i'll save for OH when i get mythic MH
lofty depot
Crafting gear in shit slots do be shit
ripe magnet
👍
lucid olive
Dropping some info
The application of the Ascendant Stars buff from your Apex Talent are slightly delayed compared to similar effects, meaning that if you add the line /cast Starsurge to the end of your CA/Incanation macro (needs to be cast after the CA) you can enter cooldowns with 1 stack of Starlord and Harmony of the Heavens, meaning that your 3rd buffed spender from your Apex Talent will land on a fully stacked Harmony of the Heavens.
EDIT: Doing this is not a damage gain since your first Starsurge inside CA/Incarnation is not buffed by your apex spender, and any free spender you may have banked up does not extend Solstice.
lofty depot
eager raft
Sounds like cheating…
lucid olive
intended gameplay
lofty depot
Sounds like cheating…
Exploit early and often
lucid olive
The funny part is that Star Cascade procs in EC also benefit from your apex talent without consuming them
So I guess its technically optimal to do Macro -> Spender -> Spender -> Starfire to fish for proc -> Spender
assuming you have the AP for it
digital berry
all of that for a 0.1% dps increase smh
lucid olive
Or you can do Macro -> Spender -> Spender and then spam Starfire until your CDs run out but that's very likely worse if you don't chain proc, considering Starfire cast time
lofty depot
Or you can do Macro -> Spender -> Spender and then spam Starfire until your CDs ...
So u wrath cast cuz less asp gen and cast time
Mmhm mmhm
lucid olive
there really arent many macros right now that are super useful, cast on cursor T...
this is what i meant with give it a few hours btw
you said not many macros are useful 
wooden obsidian
just a quick question. I'm in the 10-12 range in mythic+ keys and I wanted to know if Lune's Chosen would do significantly more damage, or if it's a preference thing until much higher keys? in general
lucid olive
Potentially more damage? Yes
Significantly? No, the output on both depends on your route, how proactive and prepared you are and general skill level
Is it recommended that you try out different builds to better learn the spec? YES
The concept of "higher keys" also depends a lot on the player. What is a high key for someone can be a weekly rat key for others
lofty depot
U can play either at that level
wooden obsidian
ah okay
wooden obsidian
Potentially more damage? Yes
Significantly? No, the output on both depends on yo...
well in general I meant higher keys where ads/trash live longer, and I've read online that for those situations Lune's Chosen is better because of throughput whereas KoTG is more oriented towards buff windows
lucid olive
"Higher keys" is still subjective
if I zone into a +8 where everyone else is 210 ilvl the adds won't die quick
likewise if I zone into a +10 where everyone else is 285 ilvl but they are complete drones the adds still won't die quick
wooden obsidian
yeah that makes sense
lucid olive
So, if Elune's Chosen is better at "higher keys", and the breakpoint for what is considered a "higher key" is subjective (and not something you can 100% determine before actually starting the key) and you are therefore not struggling with timing the key (if the adds die too quick = key is timed) then why would you not play Elune's Chosen?
Is the most important thing to look good on the meters or to improve overall?
I think a bunch of players have different answers to that
lofty depot
Isn't looking good on the meters improving (my) overall
wooden obsidian
fair point, I do like being high on damage but I've been comparing my damage to others and finding that I generally do lower damage. Might be a skill issue and nothing to do with choosing the "correct" spec.
lofty depot
It's usually a skill issue / playing incorrectly
wooden obsidian
could be as easy as not keeping uptime on dots or not dotting everything as well
but in general I should dot everything? I sometimes feel like I could've used valuable abilities while dotting things that may or may not die too fast anyway
lofty depot
That is 1 of the 4 options usually yes
If u think u could be using valuable spells instead of dotting ur likely dotting too slow
wooden obsidian
ah I see. I dot while the tanks round up the mobs, no point in waiting until the tank has gathered them all I suppose. Just sometimes I get aggro, yikes
light seal
from no alnseer or locus and hc vaelgor to mythic alnseer and vaelgor with extra stats in one day. with no bonus rolls
lucid olive
take a socket
dense steeple
what the
myth track platinum star band
myth track dragons cape i can understand being meh
but the ring?
https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/kWxBbnxA1RPSuSFCj5DWJF now it says take the cape and put on boots in my bag 
lofty depot
https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/nqvA6UZpZCqMuqVSfs415F
Get worse gear
lucid olive
https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/kWxBbnxA1RPSuSFCj5DWJF now it says take ...
no
this still says take socket
you just havent added a great vault socket for it to take
lucid olive
myth track dragons cape i can understand being meh
should start adding incremental crest upgrades
and change your myth track budget to your current crests + new weekly caps worth
dense steeple
should start adding incremental crest upgrades
yeah thats the plan from here on out
lucid olive
doesn't take a rocket scientist to realize 279 random ring sims worse than 276 combo rings
289 random ring vs 276 combo rings is another story
but even then it might be better to send the crests on something else as well
you also have bonus rolls you can spend before taking out of your vault at all
dense steeple
i was actually considering belt after seeing what bonus rolls got me this week
now that we've recleared and ive spent one i'm more considering whether or not i go roll an AA for the ring instead of nxp
lucid olive
why
dense steeple
ring good
dense steeple
arguably i'm 1/3 for the ring i want
if i roll there again
but i could also just get useless gloves and im back here at square one
lucid olive
Compared to 1/7 in AA????
dense steeple
my odds of being disappointed are inversely proportional to how good my chances are
molten hollow
Does smb know, in new system (after 2 weeks) for upgrade weapon and trinkets, will 2H weapons be upgradable for 1 token or 2? if 1 - there is no reason to not wear 2H
dense steeple
aight but when i go loot gloves dont say i didnt tell you so!
lucid olive
think i said over 3 weeks ago you probably shouldnt craft neck either but lots of people still did so
dense steeple
it was like a 3k upg to craft it 
lucid olive
i bet you were simming 285 crafted neck vs 266 neck and not another crafting alternative
dreamy cove
alternative maths
lucid olive
no i was simming it against the 276 neck i was wearing
can probably crank that number up more with the other meta gem
since you're 1 socket away from max
dense steeple
only 30 avail crests 🙂
thin sky
Do balance druids pair poorly with augmentation evokers in higher (18+) keys? I feel like whenever I'm in a group with an aug evoker, even if they're doing well, we lack priority add damage and just general dps. Am I delusional or is that an actual thing?
lofty depot
Delusional
thin sky
Sadge
lucid olive
You want a mixture of AoE and priority damage in your comp
and Aug doesn't really have a damage profile other than enhancing your other 2 DPS damage profiles
and Balance damage profile is AoE and not very much priority damage
idk what spec you can pair with balance+aug to fill in the cracks tbh
devourer maybe?
thin sky
I just pug keys anyway and dont have a fixed comp, but maybe just easier to avoid augs instead of trying to build a very specific comp
lucid olive
idk, don't think it's worth avoiding any particular spec
except for the bad ones like moonkin
lofty depot
I'd assume DK or dev would be good
exotic perch
aug bad
lofty depot
Aug then steal your damage after
high vapor
would like to ask, if I fight 3+ enemies and enter Lunar Eclipse.. then some enemies dies and only 1-2 are left alive but I still have lunar eclipse up, do I use Starfire or Wrath?
lucid olive
would like to ask, if I fight 3+ enemies and enter Lunar Eclipse.. then some ene...
Wrath on 1 target
but you also should probably have entered Solar instead to begin with
round field
i think
this spec
is complete dogshit
ever since they changed starfire cast animation
its so disgusting 🤮
exotic perch
amen give me back that chunky one
wooden obsidian
for mythic+ with KoTG I saw that "Soul of the forest" is a "never take" option? I just wonder why? It seems very good on a surface level
royal zenith
the spec is shit tho
royal zenith
for mythic+ with KoTG I saw that "Soul of the forest" is a "never take" option? ...
isn't the problem literally thinking surface level here
it's just a game of numbers
wooden obsidian
because of talent points economy then? 😄
royal zenith
it's always because of talent economy
that's what a build is
some talents do more deeps, some do less
depending on tuning
eager raft
Hey deux
royal zenith
hello
eager raft
how’s it hangin
wooden obsidian
how’s it hangin
name doesn't check out with that question LMAO
eager raft
HOW
lucid olive
whats disrespectful in asking how its hanging
eager raft
paid actor
lucid olive
hey respectable is a very understanding and cool person
i might feel different tomorrow though
wooden obsidian
aight aight I'm only bantering
dense steeple
free next week for myth achieve for sure right?
eager raft
free next week for myth achieve for sure right?
I think ring and boots to 289 should get you there
Can math it out
But vibes are telling me you got it next week
lucid olive
free next week for myth achieve for sure right?
i guess you rolled the ring
dense steeple
dense steeple
nice bait
dense steeple
I think ring and boots to 289 should get you there
theres not enough crests for that
eager raft
Alright u didn’t answer so I hope ur doin well ducks
eager raft
theres not enough crests for that
Math hard for a guy like me
royal zenith
small talk is cringe
dense steeple
Math hard for a guy like me
100/20 = 5 upgrades
eager raft
please don’t
royal zenith
eager raft
If it’s gonna hurt my feelings
nice well thanks man that makes me feel really great about myself
See ya later
royal zenith
ask gamz how he is
eager raft
We were just chatting in DMs a few mins ago
lucid olive
because of talent points economy then? 😄
SOTF generally exists in the bucket of less-than-0.05%-talents, but lost some value this season specifically in Starweaver and AoE builds so it's fallen out of favor compared to other talents in the same bucket.
Generally, the talents in the less-than-0.05%-talents bucket are Radiant Moonlight, Sunseeker Mushroom, Umbral Intensity, Nature's Balance, Umbral Embrace, Power of Goldrinn, Fury of Elune, Nature's Grace, Meteorites, Twin Moons, Astral Communion, Denizens of the Dream and Elune's Guidance.
There are situations where one talent choice is better than other, like in EC builds you want to Fury of Elune etc
but the definitive answer for which talent you take out of the bucket for your build can usually be visualized better in a top gear sim
wooden obsidian
used wowheads mythic+ talents for KOTG for a while and I see some very telling differences from that and this community's talents/IcyVeins which seems to mirror. hhmMM interesting
royal zenith
that would be kinda interesting
considering the writer for wowhead and dreamgrove is the same person...
wooden obsidian
um
lucid olive
what's interesting is taking the KOTG talents for m+ when the EC ones have the exclamation mark
anyway I just updated that wowhead KOTG build
wooden obsidian
check mythic + keepers of the grove here https://www.dreamgrove.gg/blog/balance/compendium and tell me I'm not crazy because wowheads is actually different
oh
lucid olive
should be better now thanks
wooden obsidian
well I stay in the 10-12 range in keys and haven't played much around with elune's chosen but maybe I should
lucid olive
yeah dont be afraid of changing talents
wooden obsidian
considering the writer for wowhead and dreamgrove is the same person...
well wowhead has umbral intensity and SoTF talented while dreamgrove.gg marked them as "never take" for mythic+. Just curious lol
lucid olive
yeah SOTF was assumed better than reality before expansion came out
and that KOTG build hadn't been updated since then
wooden obsidian
got it ^^ thanks
lucid olive
but Compendium was written 2 weeks after release before the season started
and going back to change every tiny piece of irrelevant info after updating Compendium to double check both say the same thing
is very tedious
wooden obsidian
main source for most updated talents would be dreamgrove?
lucid olive
sure
lucid olive
yeah I'm not saying the complaints aren't valid
if I was an end user and saw two different things in two different guides then I'd be curious as well
lofty depot
main source for most updated talents would be dreamgrove?
Most updated talent builds, warcraft logs
Mmmhm mmmhm
lucid olive
and I think it's extra rough since the best explanation and answer to the question is convoluted
because having to explain to someone that in any build there are only 5 talents that actually matter
and the rest are all filler
are then followed up by "but which talents matter and when and why"
royal zenith
well it used to be the other way around, and we've been communicating the dreamgrove guide for about 4 to 5 years now
dull dust
cant u just make a heat map thing
royal zenith
`wowhead being more up-to-date is something people will have to get used to
dull dust
royal zenith
just giving you ways to make your 'job' easier
lucid olive
yeah I know
lucid olive
especially considering wowhead has SEO stuff that DG doesn't
like bis lists and stat spreads
i'm considering just yeeting the trinket list in DG as well
wooden obsidian
I just want to make sure I use optimized talents since I do enjoy being the best version of myself in game. Hope I don't pester you guys too much ^^
lucid olive
that spell has so much aura
play devourer and cast collapsing star instead..
royal zenith
I just want to make sure I use optimized talents since I do enjoy being the best...
nah they're common questions dw about it
ask away
royal zenith
collapsing star feels so satisfying
dull dust
full moon my beloved
alpine dagger
Isnt Collapsing Star how Full Moon used to be
what do you mean
dull dust
I wonder if we can get gas to make builds with moons just apply a 15% dmg aura
quiet drift
Actually scales in AoE
alpine dagger
i miss hard casted full moon into convoke full moon from shadowlands
drifting nova
no it doesnt
lofty depot
At no point has FM been that good no
quiet drift
How was it in Legion
drifting nova
it should do aoe
lofty depot
As stated, not collapsing star good
drifting nova
but it barely does
alpine dagger
pretty sure in legion it was full aoe, that was before they introduced capped aoe etc
drifting nova
what I think is legion release
alpine dagger
that is more like what i remember
drifting nova
real ability
astral not arcane
aoe and 4x the spell power modifier
and was FREE
no wasted points
royal zenith
finally something kekkers actually knows??
lofty depot
astral not arcane
It's astral still
void jacinth
kekkers knows nothing
drifting nova
I thought for the longest time it did aoe
lofty depot
Cosmic prob
royal zenith
its devourers genki dama
drifting nova
It's astral still
it is infact arcane
royal zenith
do you understand now?
lofty depot
O
jaunty blaze
Full moon but better and cooler
void jacinth
full sun
royal zenith
and V O I D
drifting nova
waht now
lucid olive
Someone go pay premium and look for FM damage
send a log
drifting nova
premium what
lucid olive
i can check
lofty depot
send a log
Uhh one sec
craggy kernel
Hello i was hoping someone can give me some advice, my guild recently killed Dragons mythic but my mushroom damage is pretty low even tho im trying to get the mushrooms out on orbs. the problem im having is that the orbs are getting obliterated before my shroom can do anything. Is there any tips or something that can help get the shrooms out quicker?
drifting nova
find blood dks
royal zenith
tell your other dps to cool it
drifting nova
and kaboom
lucid olive
press the button quicker
royal zenith
target on that's in the middle or high hp
lofty depot
Hello i was hoping someone can give me some advice, my guild recently killed Dra...
Are u playing with 2 dks
drifting nova
dont myth ones everyone spawns an orb?
royal zenith
the orbs get obliterated cause they dont play with dk's
lucid olive
dont myth ones everyone spawns an orb?
everyone spawns an orb on every difficulty
royal zenith
drifting nova
yeah but they dont move on myth or?
lucid olive
on mythic the orbs dont move after you CC them
royal zenith
it shows..
drifting nova
rather scrape my corneas out over doing raid
craggy kernel
Are u playing with 2 dks
2 dks and they are gettin gripped in, but they die so quick i cant get any good shroom damage. i look at the logs and see the difference between my shrooms and others i thought maybe there was a trick to it lol. but i guess its jst go quicker noob XD
royal zenith
look at voidorbs damage specifically for like the good logs
you will see other dps just way lower
craggy kernel
ahhh right i see
royal zenith
if you have 2 devourers that actually target voidorbs you're already behind by a bit
royal zenith
add fury warrior, add windwalkers, etc.
drifting nova
add fury warrior, add windwalkers, etc.
fury? ew arms all day
quiet drift
Just ask people to not hit them if u want a log
craggy kernel
ok thanks 
wooden obsidian
thoughts on umbral intensity + umbral embrace + meteorites VS fury of elune + radiant moonlight + Astral Communion? Is it consistent damage over time VS buff windows/burst? (KoTG mythic+)
lucid olive
thoughts on umbral intensity + umbral embrace + meteorites VS fury of elune + ra...
I think just try both versions out and make a choice what you enjoy more
lofty depot
i dont think ur running rm with keeper
also dont think UI is particularly good for it either 😛
would prefer wild mushroom to any of it
ac probably fine
wooden obsidian
I think just try both versions out and make a choice what you enjoy more
will do 🙂
real flax
goofy ass spec buff it blizzard for fucking sake
delicate perch
skill issue
gritty hatch
does anyone feel they do low dmg in 15s?
lofty depot
not really no
wooden obsidian
For KoTG mythic+, should I ideally use force of nature with every CA? is it natural to wait 1 min after using CA before using the next CA, to align force of nature+CA together? (and fill in with eclipses between)? this is the talents without convoke the spirits btw
I think some of my lacking damage may be CD timing
lofty depot
yes
no but kinda depends on flow of the dungeon (its part of the reason keeper is less fluid with cds)
keeper a little more strict than just being able to have foe for every pack
alpine dagger
I've not tried kotg in m+ yet as I see everyone playing EC. Is it somewhat viable or mostly reserved for people who really hate EC
lofty depot
its likely fine to a point
alpine dagger
What is the issue with it fundamentally in m+? Just numbers? The whole 15 sec wiggle room on CDs seems especially good in m+ where it doesn't always make sense to press on CD
lucid olive
What is the issue with it fundamentally in m+? Just numbers? The whole 15 sec w...
EC is better at stacked cleave since it plays off Fury of Elune giving dmg amp to every target its hitting + Starfire cleave doing uncapped AoE
hollow bobcat
floral copper
Ive been questing and doing ritual sites, and my convoke is 45 seconds CD...is there somehting im missing?
sorry if this has been answeeed
wooden obsidian
What is the issue with it fundamentally in m+? Just numbers? The whole 15 sec w...
Been using KoTG for delves and raids and overworld so I'm comfortable with it, then I got the impression that EC was better for keys where things live longer but KoTG is better for lower keys. Tried EC once and did ass dmg compared to KoTG but if EC is that hot I guess I might have to sink some hours into it and get good with it
delicate perch
Ive been questing and doing ritual sites, and my convoke is 45 seconds CD...is t...
you're taking two different talents, one makes it 1m the other gives you cdr for up to 15s while certain abilites are available
floral copper
i figured it out, control of the dream, nice!
delicate perch
drifting nova
I cant tell if I'm dumb or
but what even is the uptime on augs abilities
like wtf do I need to wait for
to do DAM
the bronze dragon one
or
if I blow my cds before he's found the end of his nose to hit one button so I do 20% more
my bad I guess
wooden obsidian
I wonder if its true that kotg is generally safer and better for pugs or if it doesn't matter as long as I'm playing properly? Or if EC is generally better for coordinated groups that pull big etc
lofty depot
i dont think either of those matter
ive done 15s as both did top damage in both with shit players and good players
meager storm
lucid olive
edited the latest pin
meager storm
obsidian mesa
hello all...rly new to balance and i come with a sily question....in elunes chosen m+ build do we ever use wrath?
drifting nova
no
lucid olive
hello all...rly new to balance and i come with a sily question....in elunes chos...
press wrath on 1 target when outside of eclipse/ca/incarnation
drifting nova
only jeff knows why they arent hero locked abilities
inland ore
Did the meteorite buff change anything or are we still not taking it? In keys that is
lofty depot
didnt change anything
jolly delta
drifting nova
if I speak ,big trouble
jolly delta
Kekkers has starfire on space
drifting nova
might help my fingers tbh
jolly delta
fuck
Ok tbf
I'll be the Kekkers this time
Spacebar is a prime keybind
who tf needs jump
drifting nova
how you gonna 360?
jolly delta
maybe this guy is onto something
drifting nova
oh he's on something already
lofty depot
Spacebar is a prime keybind
R IS A PRIME KEYBIND
jolly delta
R IS A PRIME KEYBIND
sure
that doesnt invalidate what i said
maybe we bind jump to Z thoughts
drifting nova
but thats for bear
jolly delta
bear is 4
drifting nova
did you write that reddit post?
molten hollow
What am i doing wrong?
lofty depot
bear is not 4
digital berry
Some things are just not meant to be changed
It goes against nature
Space bar is for jump
wild dune
my boomie is shift-t 
drifting nova
just reminding me I need to move half my letters from the right 2 bars
lucid olive
I still run with the natty c1 c2 c3 c4 for shapeshifts
rough flax
Bind bear and cat on scroll wheel
jolly delta
Holy fuck im watching the Taliesin interview this is so bad
jolly delta
"For many players the PTR is seen as early access instead of a place to report bugs, so maybe this also requires a shift in mentality from the community"
My sister in christ
drifting nova
me, thinking about every beta since like legion
exactly how blizzard has viewed it
jolly delta
Do you want a spreadsheet of how many bugs were reported months ago and are still not fixed
Or what
lucid olive
"For many players the PTR is seen as early access instead of a place to report b...
maybe the PTR forcing you to interact with the content in order to test bugs like the voidcore system is a bad thing
drifting nova
to think some people still have copium blizzard will admit defeat (on anything)
lucid olive
like who wants to do a 3 week questchain on PTR
in order to feed the guy enough junk to test voidcores
jolly delta
maybe the PTR forcing you to interact with the content in order to test bugs lik...
No they specifically said that the voidcore bug wasn't something that was testable on PTR
And I do believe them
drifting nova
I dont
jolly delta
(your point still stands)
drifting nova
skip the first 2weeks, test the 3rd final
lucid olive
yeah it was working on PTR since they have less realms or whatever
drifting nova
which is precisely where the duplication came
jolly delta
kekkers
lucid olive
but that kind of thing is always with PTR
drifting nova
jolly delta
i will not say anything
lucid olive
to test crafting items you need to level the profession through the vendor guy and who bothers doing that when you can test dungeons instead
lucid olive
so systems that are impactful to gearing go untested more often
drifting nova
ardent supporter of that for 3xpacs now
jolly delta
to test crafting items you need to level the profession through the vendor guy a...
well i mean thats not really true
lucid olive
cause the environment around testing them is not good enough
jolly delta
i know many people that do professions and did a lot of testing
sure less people engage with it so you'll have less testing
and i agree that maybe it makes sense to make it easier
but also well
lucid olive
i mean stuff like crafted items disappearing
jolly delta
the more you make the system "not as in game"
lucid olive
which has happened after both patch releases this expansion
jolly delta
the more bugs you risk missing
drifting nova
smh you're going to make me listen to t and e aaaa
lucid olive
yeah i guess
jolly delta
just because you didnt test that stuff when you simplified it
to be clear, the current QA is non-existant anyways
drifting nova
and by that you mean
lucid olive
let me kill boss and get item at set ilvl
lucid olive
yes
jolly delta
I genuinely wonder how the fuck did they end up breaking hundred of unrelated things
lucid olive
professions go back to making AH consumables
drifting nova
ok then bosses would need to be..well harder and/or have deeper loot pools
drifting nova
my war has had the appearance of a 2nd fury wep for a week now
..with 1 wep equipped
elder remnant
what the @carmine vigil lfg
drifting nova
you know that is a thing right
its also been a temporary bug since tww
but is clearly now an extended one
its evolved
same as half the other tmog appearance bugs
I made it 2mins in this vid, thanks for wasting my time, vinter
eternal drift
can sommeone look at my logs and tell me where im fucking up? im swaping from feral and im a little lost
jolly delta
Sure
jolly delta
incorrect opener and order of operations
too many sunfires
you're not synching cooldowns
jolly delta
you're not synching cooldowns
like at all
eternal drift
so it is bad bad got it
jolly delta
This is how it should be
This is yours
I recommend opening https://www.dreamgrove.gg/planner
Setting the talents and playing around with the timeline
To see and understand how stuff lines up
jolly delta
Have you read the compendium?
But
The tldr is that you use eclipse to cover the moments where you dont have incarn
rough flax
And you dont just press them, you need procs
And AP. But all is written in the guide
jolly delta
And not overcap
eternal drift
ok going to study then apretiate all the help
jolly delta
Sadly its a bit complicated to properly explain the nuance but
If you open the website and try to lay down the casts by following these rules it hopefully will make sense:
- do not miss a single use of any CD (this means that if you play COTD you can hold stuff for at most 15s)
- always align CDs together
- if you dont have incarn use eclipse
- Use eclipse in the downtime as long as you will have a charge for the next time you have FoE/FoN but don't have incarn
inland ore
Pretty much, wrath till starlord drops then eclipse and repeat
karmic silo
does Arcanoweave Lining stack?
jolly delta
Yes
karmic silo
like can I put it on 2 crafted items?
jolly delta
Yes
inland ore
What buff are we taking in AA? I haven’t tried simming it either
delicate perch
Haste
fickle pier
Verse on a decent key level
delicate perch
Real, that tiny dr is gunna be the reason you live standing a bladestorm
jolly delta
ngl the vers in high keys propaganda is
both the funniest and most infuriating shit ever
and it keeps on going its crazy
lucid olive
remember Ataldazar in Dragonflight
moonkin did that key on 23 without adding vers
then see people in here saying "how much vers i gotta get to live key"
delicate perch
Atal was a demon to live too
lucid olive
last boss atal was a bitch yeah
jolly delta
didnt priory kinda require vers
dense steeple
it is i, the top druid
jolly delta
only dungeon I can think of tho
jolly delta
last boss atal was a bitch yeah
loved it
running 30m of dungeon just to wipe there every time
because mages kept invising the dot recasting it on someone else with no defensives and desyncing the timings
good times
idk maybe its just me but all the current dungeons kinda suck in m+
the only good one is AA and it's old
digital berry
they are hella boring
jolly delta
Yeah I suspect it has to do with the pruning of add-ons
I just realised there are zero positional tricks
Each pull is a combination of
- interrupt shit
- press defensives
- dodge stuff on the ground
lucid olive
I just realised there are zero positional tricks
wdym
lucid olive
on the big wyrm mobs in algethar you want everyone to stand inside the mob hitbox so the jump circle goes on tank
the one you used to LOS
jolly delta
the only good one is AA and it's old
.
I think it's only AA and spears in maisara
And spears don't even hurt
Idk maybe I'm missing something but
I can't think of a single pull I would consider fun to play
lucid olive
suspect it might be good to wait for MDI before stating it
but who knows rly you might be right too
jolly delta
maybe
lucid olive
i do agree the dungeons kinda suck
jolly delta
I just remember these things being cooked in dungeons even before MDI
digital berry
alleria lowkey more difficult then id expect a third to last boss to be
jolly delta
But maybe I'm just misremembering
sinful epoch
I'm a new balance druid, did my first couple 10s as balance tonight. Didn't do well throughput wise. On most packs I felt like things were already close to dying before I could get going, is that normal on a 10? https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/hxg9qj1cWBKvJr6t. Thanks!
vital hound
ya welcome to boomkin
digital berry
it is very much normal in 10s
sinful epoch
Ok thanks!
dense steeple
unless someone is afk and you are the most geared youre just not going to do much in 10s
sinful epoch
Makes sense, I'm sure I'll get better as I keep playing it but good to know that's just how it is.
digital berry
yeah tanks in 10s also pull like one pack at a time
lofty depot
I'm a new balance druid, did my first couple 10s as balance tonight. Didn't do w...
foe before incarn
u starfired with max asp
which is bad
moonfire at 57 for fun ig
is a lot of sunfires
same thing with foe here
need to understand u dont need to press incarn the instant its up
u can hold it
specifically during packs that are ment as filler packs
sinful epoch
Got it, thanks!
lofty depot
i need u to stop first global starfiring in eclipse/incarn
shouldve waited out the eclipse
likely til ur foe cd is back up
how does one die on kasreth
sinful epoch
Ok, got it
lofty depot
surely thats a fat finger
that first pack on the right side people like not pulling the right pack or the left one with it
i wouldnt send incarn there unless they pull more than that tiny pack
but its u learning the dungeon
sir were not wrathing on 3t or in lunar
sinful epoch
Many mistakes were made 🙂
lofty depot
idk just feels like a lot of ur sequences are random
the one constant is starfiring with full asp
but everything else
like idk a world were surging here
u spammed 5 surges in that time frame
with 12 mobs alive
sinful epoch
Yeah, that was bad
sinful epoch
Way too long 🙂
lofty depot
30 seconds
idk why were pressing incarn here
why r we afking during boss
1 u press incarn giga early
digital berry
MICRO NAP
lofty depot
but that doesnt mean u just go afk
digital berry
oops caps
lofty depot
also u sent 2 charges of incarn on boss, meaning u now dont have for the big pack after
its close tho
sinful epoch
Yeah, I was horrible at managing incarn over the course of the dungeon
I'll get better at that as I do more dungeons
lofty depot
u ended up holding 2 charges for that whole time after that aswell
until u got down the bridge
main things....
sunfiring too much should do it when theyre grouped
stop starfiring first global of eclipse/incarn, ur likely full asp
foe prior the gcd prior to eclipse/incarn
stop wrathing in lunar
sinful epoch
Appreciate it, thanks! Lots to work on
lucid olive
no it wasnt a damage gain
so doesnt rly change much for players
just cast CA at the end of your previous GCD and you're good
its just some eclipse bonuses being inconsistent in how they apply
normal pilot
maybe next tier when solstice isn't as important
dense steeple
i "fixed" paladins parse
as long as i dont get fuckin rocked by kills tonight im full purple 🙂
lofty depot
fixed?
delicate perch
You heard him
digital berry
he did NOT stutter
dense steeple
the last kill was a green
delicate perch
Not locked in
dense steeple
not til tomorrow 
fair pasture
exotic perch
its just p2 filter
ionic surge
purple andy ...
tawny nest
Is our expected late season bis still a one hander + crafted offhand or has 2 arcanoweave pieces become better / closer in performance, curious if the void forge affected that at all
(Or is this a try to sim it myself and find out situation, my internet is down so I don’t wanna right now)
jaunty blaze
Well you guessed it but its a sim question
tawny nest
Damn
river galleon
Guys, you still run Hunt and Arcanoweave emblish or went for 2x Arcanoweave with mythic track weapon or crafted sparkle?
delicate perch
sim it or
jaunty blaze
Almost like its the same question that has been asked right above
jaunty blaze
So real...
river galleon
Almost like its the same question that has been asked right above
oh
jaunty blaze
Anyways you will need to sim whether its better or not
tawny nest
Seve sim it so I dont have to
livid jay
thats not how it works broski
if it was we'd just tell you
but it depends on your current gear
tawny nest
