The Tarot Weaver 2.0!

[strong viper]

Hey so chaotic resonance

thats uhhhh

hella overpowered

my face when crit fireball

my face when prismatic spray but it crit

[atomic wolf]

Would something like half damage be more reasonable?

I have Destined Echo which is Roll a d6. On a 5–6, the spell repeats on the same target at its lowest level. so i can change that pretty drastically tbh

[atomic wolf]

maybe roll a saving throw and if they fail half damage? *or take 1d6 psychic damage

[strong viper]

make it single target and its okay i think

[shadow fractal]

agreed, something that specifies the damage of the spell is only doubled for one target of the spell (so AoE spells don't scale absurdly)

[atomic wolf]

"Chaotic Dissonance: An enemy within 30 feet must succeed on a Intelligence saving throw (DC = 8 + PB + CHA) or take 1d6 psychic damage and have disadvantage on their next attack roll before the start of your next turn."

is that okay?

[shadow fractal]

much more scaled back, effectively a free vicious mockery, I think very balanced

[atomic wolf]

siiiick i will update it

[limpid ruin]

holy there is so much going on with this class

[atomic wolf]

i wanted a fun complex class :D

[atomic wolf]

just to ask, does it just look like alot or did you skim/read it and determine it was a lot?

[limpid ruin]

Originally I just skimmed it and it looked like a lot and looking at it again a little more in depth it still looks like a huge amount. Its not only a full caster with good spells but also has so much going on with its class abilities and the tarot deck. It feels like each class ability also has its own resource attached to it (1 per short rest, prof bonus per long rest etc) which could get confusing fast. It also looks like there is a lot of rolling and lookup with all of the tables involved. And you get a magic item that has a bunch of text and is very DM dependent. I am sure the class fits a niche in a specific type of game, but, as it is, it would be very clunky for any table I've played at in the past. This class is also impossible to compare to any vanilla class (like look at wizard or cleric in comparison) at all as it blows all of them out of the water with the sheer amount of text and utility the Tarot Weaver gets. Playing multiple of this class in a party could be really difficult as well and should be taken into consideration. Idk it just seems like I would need a lecture to understand the abilities of my character, and its really hard to gauge how powerful each of the class abilities are especially the Tarot Invoke ability.

[atomic wolf]

Most of the resource attachment was for balancing which can change. This class is meant to play with physical cards but you can roll as well if needed. The tarot deck isn't any more dm dependent than an intimation tactic or pickpocket attempt like normal roleplay based encounters, the item itself comes from expanding the roleplay side and if needed can be treated as optional.

The build is based off bard for progression and warlock for spellcasting which I thought was pretty normal to do in the sense of making a homebrew you're building something new so comparability no matter what would be hard. I get having more utility than vanilla classes but again I thought homebrew tended to do that and more complex classes in vanilla expanded have more utility as well. That is a strong point of if multiple people would play the class, I hadn’t fully considered how that would play out in practice, so I’ll revisit that balance.

Maybe because I made it I'm biased but it just kinda makes sense to me no more than a cleric or warlock build.

[proven storm]

[atomic wolf]

is this any specific utility that feels too much? I tried to line up progression with bard :<

[proven storm]

Hot reading (pun intended) PART 1:

• Only 5 skills present in the least ? That's the lowest along the cleric but the cleric only choose 2 of them. It might make the various tarot weaver feel a bit samey. (Performance and Deception are also glaringly missing)
• I do not understand the equipement. There's one in the quick build (which say "take a rapier" when the tarot weaver don't have profeciency in those) and one in the equipement section ?
• I do not understand the spellcasting table either ? Is it a pact caster ? Why does the level 1 tarot weaver know 2 spells but don't have any slots ? (I do like the idea of having lots of cantrip tho, but maybe less, I don't think there'll ever be a situation where I need more than 10 cantrips)
• I do like the lack of component stuff, that's pretty good ^^
• You mixed up Divine Influence's order with Daily reading ^^ (Also put the subclasses at the end of the class for easier reading)
• Also avoid scaling feature with PB, so it doesn't get stronger if a player choose to multiclass
• The explication on the Divine Influence feature should also be put in the Tarot Invoke feature, I did not understand you had to draw a card at first ^^ Also... I am sorry, I love the concept, but that's way too much. Especially you get most of those table at level 1, some of them scale with PB, the duration is confusing (what are the sustained effects ? how do you differentiate them from others ?) and the reversed Justice give you vulnerability to one damage type : Who chooses that damage type ? And, sadly, to balance them you made the effect pretty weak so at higher levels they stop being meaningful.
• Daily reading is just the bard's "song of rest" and it doesn't really fit the whole "Prophet/manipulator/Gambler" feel of the class
• Tarot Divination is great actually^^ But Guided hand would need a limit of distance or "that you can see"
• Veil of fate : Way too powerful, way too many stuff and it doesn't really fit the class.

PART 2 :

• Also for Veil of Fate, do you gain resistance to all damage for 1min or just the triggering attack ? If it's just the triggering attack I'd put it separately from the rest of the list
• Arcana Unbound : I do like the idea of Insight Card and Swapped Fate (although fro Swapped fate I'd precise that you draw again rather than choose which card to apply) Chosen destiny is fun, but it feels like a feature on it's own, like something you can do everyday and get a free swap of the card with the chosen card per day. (But once again, the cards effect are pretty weak)
• Tarot Surge, pretty violent side effect and.. I just missed the Weaving Point feature.
• Another table... that is a lot, like really a lot the effects clearly outshadow the card drawing tho, and it scale with your PB
• Fate unfolding a bit complex but I do like the idea
• ThreadWalker decendant. So you draw before each action, that's very powerful and the +2 to basically everything but reaction and bonus action is too much

My overall thoughts on the base class, I won't go into detail on the subclasses right now because the base class has already so much going on^^" :
I love the class but it feels very confused right now, blurry, when you think of a Tarot Weaver, does the idea of your mind is clear or is it "A bard with a deck". Speaking of Deck, this is the strong point of your class and I like what you tried to do but there's a few problems : Too many tables with too many features overlapping those tables. I understand a full table for every card is the point of the class so I won't argue with it, but I urge you to realise two things :

• This is already overwhelming on its own since every player will have to look up to the table each time they draw (no one will perfectly know every results)
• This is a balancing nightmare. Like someone much more experienced than me said to me : "Effects don't work on a vaccuum, you have to think on how they synergise with each others" and that's the problem of the many tables, too many things synergising with too many stuff.

If it were me (someone who only has a passing interest in tarot but like card games) I would : Create one effect for each major arcana + 1 effect for each suit, the value of the card drawn affect the strength of the effect.
And stop there with the new features. Making all following stuff either strengthen the effects, put more effect at the same time, control when the effect happens, choose more effect.
You started that last one by making the player draw a bunch of cards each time, which is good, but they are immediately discarded. How about you let the player have their "hand" of cards that has a limited size per long rest and that grow with the levels, so rather than remembering every effects each time they draw, they just need to memorise the effects of their hand.
( I do understand that this change your tarot weaver significantly from a tarot reader to more of a gambler, but this make the class simple to make and play)

My biggest advice is figure out what you want. Try answering those questions, not right now of course, sleep on them :

• What do I want my players to feel as they play my class ?
• What are some characters in fiction that would be my class in dnd ?
• What do I want with this class ? Publish it ? Play it with friends only ? Making other players play it ?
• What's the theme of my class ? How is it different from any other class in dnd ?
• What's the mechanical niche of my class ?

Here's the answer I got for my fleshweaver class, but they change a lot ^^" :

• What do I want my players to feel as they play my class ?** I want them to feel like mad scientist and monsters at the same time. I want them to take pleasure in physically adapting to their situation.**
• What are some characters in fiction that would be my class in dnd ? **Jared Hopsworth from the Magnus archive, Frankenstein's monster, Singed from Lol, Bane from Batman. **
• What do I want with this class ? Publish it ? Play it with friends only ? Making other players play it ? I want to publish this class and get enough traction for a kickstarter or something
• What's the theme of my class ? How is it different from any other class in dnd ? Body modification to get powers. It is much more physical than casters, more scientific than barbarian and warriors, too horrific for monk or artificer. (Monks would be the closer thematically)
• What's the mechanical niche of my class ? Tank and utility, utility through having the right tools/the right spells for the job no matter how different the various jobs may be

[vernal kite]

That is a great point indeed I definitely agree this is a good idea