Ridiculous rewards in PVP after 2.5 patch

[tight zodiac]

CONCLUSION:

BIAV is making pressure to and punishing its main customers, AKA PVE players, who don't want to play a bonus mode, AKA Traphase, FOR NO REASON, while lowering the attractive of the bonus mode.

FACTS:

1. Expiring rewards is a disguised form of punishments which exploits the human nature of people hating loss.

2. it's reasonable for Games, using such punishments to pressure players to play more, therefore players possibly pay more.

3. PVE is the SOLE PRIMARY MODE, which the business model of Morimens is based on.

4. There are few monetization point‌s in PVP mode in Morimens. Thus "PVP is a BONUS MODE", which is the very first sentence in its rules.

5. After 2.5 patch, BIAV removes emotes rewards which really works in PVP.

6. After 2.5 patch, BIAV puts rewards what are valuable only in PVE mode.

[pliant vigil]

I'm kinda having a tough time following what are you trying to convey, because you tagged this thread as bug report and games suggestions?

You need to make a statement what are you trying to say and what is your proposed solution, all these facts you wrote down are not facts and are opinions, you need to separate them to be more convincing and make your message clear

the reason why i say this, is because a quick counter argument to your inquiry dismiss what you are trying to convey and that is:

rewards are for your efforts, not because you created an account, you don't fret over rewards that are out of your reach or events and opportunities you missed, so why should it apply for the bonuses on PVP?

People are not forced to play PvP and PVP is a dying game-mode with no players, even eng community guides for it stopped being updated

Also meaning there should be more rewards for people who make an effort to go out of their way to play and try that game mode despite not being mandatory and for fun, it gives incentive not pressure because you also get ranked accordingly

[woven hound]

While their arguments aren't the best organized it is pretty clear they feel the devs are putting PVE rewards into PVP with the express purpose of trying to force players to engage with PVP.

As for a solution they imply the way it worked before was fine with PVP being entirely seperate mode with limited PVE rewards and the main rewards being the emotes.

[pliant vigil]

"force players to engage with PvP"

is misleading and disingenuous

there is incentive but there is no force making them engage with PVP

To add to this, for all-pick, you would also need to unlock the characters to be used in that queue,

while draft mode allowes people to get a taste of a character design and playstyle to an extend, explore something totally different

The rewards are better and make sense in a way to add an incentive that benefits both PVP and PVE, but i would argue to increase the incentive because the game mode is really a low amount of player pool for such a new take on the game, like it is a different game itself

[woven hound]

You are the one being disingenuous. Putting rewards that only effect PVE and not PVP behind a PVP mode that is entirely different from the PVE game is clearly an attempt to use FOMO to try and boost the PVP playerbase. Why would PVP rewards not be related to PVP? Obviously, a signifianct amount of the playerbase has no interest in PVP as there have been many post sabout disapointment in the 2.5 changes.

[pliant vigil]

can you clarify what is the rewards that only effect PVE?

[woven hound]

Soulforce mats from ranking are PVE only. Sure, you need to technically pull to unlock all charcters in PVP but you only need 1 copy so the amount of pulls needed is far less that what is needed for PVE account progression.

[pliant vigil]

and also, im not here to name call and berate each other, we are here to solve and give constructive feedback to their team together as fellow players,

Act professional, i have never worded attacks against your character which is why i quoted your words and not you

[woven hound]

I'm sorry but that is not name calling and is no different then you calling my argment misleadeing and disingenuous. Your intial comment came across as dismissive of the various FOMO tactics that are too often used in gacha games and saying players aren't "forced" to do something is a common way to dismiss these tactics while ignoring the inherent purpose of them.

[pliant vigil]

For new players, like myself, the rewards they give are beneficial because they are sided in helping with, what we both stated, unlocking characters with the Silver rewards

from what i can see to support your argument, the rank placements dream shard and dream spark are PVE focused, but they give very little compared to what the Limited Events on the basis of "effort and value" it is terrible and not worth the grind in comparison

otherwise i would have to respectfully disagree and say there needs to be more incentive for people who go out of their way for this dying game-mode and i would say replace the PVE focused rewards with silver

[pliant vigil]

it is the fact of the matter trying to obtain the rewards is optional and you dont need them to enjoy the game; it is not dismissing the issue and you are playing with yourself and contradict your statements and even backtrack to what you said a response later, im not going to bother to respond to you no more, you can't even bother to think before you type, you can doom post and fear monger more it won't help your lack of persuasion and genuineness especially to the people and the devs who take their time of day to read your statements coming off as a weak-compliant instead of something to work off

[woven hound]

Yes, I don't think we are going to see eye to eye on this so best to end it here.

[strong nest]

how are new players like myself supposed to complete this mission now that we can't unlock new emotes from PVP wins?

• mission category: "Getting Started"
  yeaaaaah, okay

[hallow galleon]

The emote change is something they messed up on that’s true

[karmic night]

Get high rank and get tickets for emotes

[crisp nebula]

You can just ignore this mode. I feel no pressure to play it.

[tight zodiac]

Sorry for replying you so late, I was too angry about these and didn't use discord until today.

[tight zodiac]

About the facts I wrote:

1&2. "Expiring rewards is a disguised form of punishments which exploits the human nature of people hating loss." That's an existing theory, not something I made up. You may search the term "Loss Aversion" for more and see how it works in game design. I won't debate more if you take a theory as an opinion.

3. "PVE is the SOLE PRIMARY MODE, which the business model of Morimens is based on." That's a simple fact, just calculate how much a player should pay to get all PVE contents.

4. "...few monetization point‌s in PVP mode in Morimens. Thus 'PVP is a BONUS MODE'..." Also a simple fact, how much should a player pay to get all PVP contents? And 'PVP is a BONUS MODE' is in the rule box, you can read it in game.

5&6. Aren't they facts? They did remove emotes, and they provides material for upgrading characters. Does Upgrading works in PVP mode?

I really did take another look at what i wrote, and i don't know why you said, quote "all these facts you wrote down are not facts and are opinions"?

[tight zodiac]

It's totally fine when PVP players get rewards, the more the better, but the rewards should works only in PVP mode.

Imagine they add a Xiangqi (Chinese chess) mini-game in Morimens, and you need to compete with all other players to get what you need for you PVE progress and some fancy looking for Traphase. Is that a decent idea to you?

[hallow galleon]

Except the rewards aren’t just locked to pvp
Literally every other game mode now is giving you the same rewards

[brazen bluff]

I just came across this post recently, as a player who played Traphase for quite a long time by now i can say this:

• New leaderboard is quite FOMO, a lot of players used to hate that leaderboard rewards for a reason, this is why there was a drama related to someone in the CN community bragging about 37k points for Pdive and there was a breach into the non-written rules of not going above 36k points in Aequor + Ultra realm leaderboard ( people could still technically go above 36k but just don't brag about it, it would have been fine ).
  36k points was easily reachable for newbies and veterans alike btw. The other people from the CN community were very chill about letting everyone farm there and it was fine for a long time too btw.

After the revamp of the leaderboard they went into roses currency + tickets to randomly get emotes on the leaderboard rewards and it was still shared across Pdive + traphase.

• Currently it doesn't reward players for their hardwork in PVP too, it's just Helot team meta, there is a reason why people hate PVP and it's because of meta team one shoting everyone else without much thinking, you must think the devs just need to nerf some stuffs to balance things out and make it fair to play PVP right? There was not a real single nerf over the past year against helot, in fact they kept buffing her despite multiple complain and evidence of helot team being brain dead and winning, now with Arachne's release it's just impossible to win unless you RNG diff them ( they generally kills you in 2 or 3 turns btw, the video gives you the proof, it also now counter rewind posse + barrier + shield + any death related wheel with arachne's exalt ).

[brazen bluff]

It's true but the problem is that we kind of need to look at current leaderboard on other gamemodes

Pdive is just whale lvl 90 gmurphy + tawil to 3 turn kill the bosses

HSR is another gmurphy whale comp

You're fighting against whale in order to get a decent rewards

[hallow galleon]

That’s true…

[brazen bluff]

Traphase need to own the unit / wheel / posse in order to be able to play the team

It's slightly better but not by much

[tight zodiac]

Yes, they should make Traphase better, istead of making PVE players losing their progress.

[celest swift]

Since they changed to 150 cards played, it's not so bad.
But "not so bad" still quite bad for anyone that got into the game thanks to PVE and hates PVP, so I'm here to say what I've been saying many other times:

-We just need something akin to a "shared reward pool" that we can pick our favorite mode (or modes) and play it to get rewards. This way whoever likes Traphase can keep playing it and getting rewards while the other part that want to avoid Traphase doesn't have to suffer.

(Rank rewards also need to change, but that's another talk...)