Planetarium Joker (rare)

[scenic narwhal]

Effect: +0.2x Mult for each non-repeating hand type. Resets if the same hand is played twice in a row.

Cousin of the obelisk but requiring much less micromanagement as long as you can remember what you played last. Also requires a bit more diversity in your build to support 2+ hand types

Planetarium Joker (uncommon)

[scenic narwhal]

@tardy silo may I ask why the Nope?

[tribal sapphire]

Way too strong. High Card with the score of a Straight Flush is just absurd. The high tier hands are meant to be difficult to achieve.

[covert slate]

Why level up anything other than straight flush then

[static olive]

This joker gives leveling up straight flush in the early game use.

Straight flush is now good!

[sacred pebble]

Idk how to feel about this

[royal trellis]

Name checks out

[tardy silo]

Because i don't think it's a good idea

[oak basalt]

It would be more balanced if it was rare, there should also be some kind of draw back like you can't actually play the hand that it copies anymore or something like that.

[scenic narwhal]

Planetarium Joker (uncommon/rare)

[scenic narwhal]

Part of the drawback is like telescope/observatory won’t really help you much in leveling up your highest hand — you might be playing a ton of High Cards and Pairs but trying to level up straight flush, 5oak, etc. so mostly depending on random planet card draws and maybe Burnt joker

And the fact it takes up a joker slot to use

[round whale]

What if we made high card even better?

[scenic narwhal]

Planetarium Joker (rare)

[scenic narwhal]

truuuuu

[sacred pebble]

Yk qhat high card needs

A new rare joker

Call it the tedium

[round whale]

yeah, the whole reason that high card doesn't use neptune is because of the risk of playing straight flush

this joker just removes that whole system, and says to pick the planet with the highest number

[sacred pebble]

This is fine but how it should work is it can only demote hands

Not premotr

"HC is always HC, pair can score as pair or HC, etc

Wait no

Same issue

Nvm

[scenic narwhal]

Exactly ! I think it could synergize in interesting ways with some of the other mechanics and isn’t that op, the fact you need to hunt down the right planet cards / burnt joker hands and take a joker slot seems like a limit to its power already

[scenic narwhal]

I’m not sure we’re talking about the same thing — my suggestion isn’t that a HC would count as a straight flush or 5oak or whatever, it would still be a HC. just chips and mult are copied

[sacred pebble]

I suggested making it so that it only works if the chips and mult if the hand is higher on the lidt

That way High Card only scores as high card, whereas pair can score as itself OR high card

[scenic narwhal]

but that’s a completely different mechanic, no?

Unless your high card has the highest chip / mult value of your hands, I’m not sure I follow

[sacred pebble]

It is the inverse of the exact same mechanic

[scenic narwhal]

Can you elaborate?

[sacred pebble]

Your wording in the original is "any played hand"

[scenic narwhal]

Yeah, so let’s say you grab this Ante 1. You haven’t leveled up any hands yet. You play a high card — it’s scored High Card (100x8) because straight flush is 100x8

[sacred pebble]

Yeah I don't think i could without being rude (I genuinely dunno how to reword this without dumbing it down intentionally)

[scenic narwhal]

No please go ahead LOL

[sacred pebble]

My variant would make it so that it can only do that for things below it

Look at the habd list where you view levels

[dull plume]

ah yes, make high card scale at +40/+4 per level. this is balanced

[round whale]

while it might synergize with other cards, these synergies won't lead to interesting play

[dull plume]

i guess this makes blue seal worse but like

[sacred pebble]

My variant is it works but only for hands that are lower in value compared to the OG hand

[dull plume]

+40/+4 is literally 4 plutos worth of scaling

for one planet

[round whale]

this joker effectively limits your options

[dull plume]

theres basically no reason to not play high card

[round whale]

when you get this, you level straight flush

and if you don't have a hand yet, you're playing high card

doing literally anything else results in less scoring and more risk for no benefit

[dull plume]

imagine a straight flush build but you can play 4 of them per round if not more

that level of power and consistency can normally only be achieved with insane deck manipulation

[sacred pebble]

Average four fingers run

[scenic narwhal]

the played hands don’t BECOME straight flushes, it only copies the chip and mult

[zenith ivy]

just rework the joker 😭 you get full value by just playing high card every round

[dull plume]

four fingers alone doesnt get you 4 strushes per round

[sacred pebble]

Not with that attitude

[dull plume]

doesnt matter, the chips and mult is all it needs to be absurdly strong

it starts at 100x8 which is already roughly as strong as a level 9 high card

and gains 40 chips and 4 mult per level

which is 4 plutos worth

[scenic narwhal]

Yeah

[dull plume]

just get card sharp and you win

two jokers

[zenith ivy]

maybe instead of copying the highest level planet card it could become more powerful the more different types of hands you’ve levelled like satellite

Also fits the theme of a planetarium better

What’s the point of going to a planetarium if you’re only gonna look at one planet

[dull plume]

true

[scenic narwhal]

Like +.25x Mult per unique hand played? Only thing is that caps at 3x depending on the starting Mult, which is far worse than constellation

Ignore the name it can be anything lmao

[sacred pebble]

My pitch was this ability but it can only target hands lower than it

So if you're 3oak is crazy high level, all your flushes, 4oak, etc can profit off of it

But yoy can't spam low tier hands to seek that value

[dull plume]

that sounds pretty weak

[sacred pebble]

This makes it more of a pivot Joker, and more uncommon than rare

[sacred pebble]

As a rare yeah, overall it's pretty powerful in the right builds

[dull plume]

if you’re playing one of the higher hands uou want to be leveling it as much as possible

i think its weird to give players incentive to level up hands they dont use

but guess constellation does that

to an extent

[scenic narwhal]

If we’re going in a new direction — something like +2 mult per next unique hand played, resets if you play the same hand twice in a row

[dull plume]

obelisk if it was bad

[scenic narwhal]

Ok lemme rework

+0.2x mult instead of +2 mult, same rules

It’s like Obelisk but requires much less micromanagement of played hands, just don’t play the same one twice in a row

[dull plume]

i think that’d be op

[zenith ivy]

This sounds more balanced and less boring I suppose

[scenic narwhal]

Ehhh, I mean you can definitely get stuck playing a few high cards in a row esp early on before deck fixing

Also means you have to keep two hands in play at least, as opposed to a high card or flush build

[zenith ivy]

I think this rework is fine

Way better than before for sure

[dull plume]

i think making a joker thats just obelisk but better is a bad idea

[sacred pebble]

I mean it takes it from an OP scoring rare to a decent pivot Joker

[sacred pebble]

I tuink they meant my version

[dull plume]

and i dont mean your version

[zenith ivy]

Maybe make it like a small combination of chips mult and xmult so it dives further into the theme type shit

like +5 chips +1 mult and + X0.1 (or 0.05)

[sacred pebble]

You were seemingly responding to what they said, ans if you weren't then you've already made that statement before :)

[dull plume]

i dont see why you’re telling me this

but okay

[sacred pebble]

Are you a goldfish?

[dull plume]

no need to be rude

[sacred pebble]

Stupid games get stupid prizes :p

[dull plume]

what

[zenith ivy]

I mean tbf he said “obelisk but bad” when it was just mult then “obelisk but better” when it was xmult

[scenic narwhal]

Additive mult I think would be too weak here if you wanna take this joker far, right?

[zenith ivy]

[sacred pebble]

"I think making a Joker that's just obelisk but better" was disjointed from the original statement in both context and timing lol

[dull plume]

yes i believe so

[dull plume]

sorry?

[sacred pebble]

And this is interesting

But how would you word it or phrase it

[zenith ivy]

I mean in general flat mult for not being able to constantly play what is probably your strongest hand is not a lot

Which is why I think the 0.2 or the small amount of everything is justified

[dull plume]

i dont think a joker should cover all 3 bases of chips mult and xmult

[scenic narwhal]

yeah agreed

[dull plume]

it kinda just goes against the game’s design

[zenith ivy]

Boooring

[dull plume]

thanks for providing a real argument

[zenith ivy]

it is though

You should be allowed to go against the games conventions sometimes

[sacred pebble]

Boring is a valid argument for specifics, not for overall game desigm

[dull plume]

in mods for sure

but this is suggestions

not mods

[sacred pebble]

Chicot being boring is an 100% fair argument, but then I back it up with why

How is this boring? How would changing it make it unboring

[sacred pebble]

And idk if one Joker giving all 3 is neccesarily so bad

Especially if it rotates between which it gives

[dull plume]

well

thunk said he tried to make it a point to not make jokers too complex or give them multiple effects

[scenic narwhal]

10-4 gives chips and + mult but not x mult but I think that isn’t really necessary here for the joker to be useful

[zenith ivy]

isn’t the point that like most jokers are unique from each other what’s the problem with having a joker that does a little of all

[dull plume]

the issue is that it serves a purpose you’d usually use multiple joker slots for

it does depends on how fast it scales but

[zenith ivy]

I see what you mean but I’m inclined to disagree

[dull plume]

like the game is built around joker interactions iirc

[scenic narwhal]

To some extent that would probably also lessen the usefulness/satisfaction of getting joker enhancements if lots of jokers did everything but I think we’re getting off topic

[zenith ivy]

It presents a new way to play where you opt more into utility jokers while leaning on that and a flexible joker for all your scoring, risk reward

[dull plume]

thats not entirely new

sometimes you can run straights with just utility and xmult

but thats because of how good straights leveling is

[zenith ivy]

Well either way I’m not gonna force him to pick which way to go with his own joker concept these are just ideas idk why I’m arguing for them lol

Good chat tho

[round whale]

The problem with this is that if you have a joker that handles everything, you don't NEED the utility

Sure, i could reroll to get more jokers, but if i get this, why do would i need them. This give me everything i need

and without needing other jokers, every run with this joker feels the same. You alternate between high card and pair and wait.

If players can get good at fully utilixing this joker, it will give them everything they need, so when you find it, balatro becomes entirely dedicated to this minigame.