#Theoretical Biggest Score

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ashen elbow
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Here we will try to calculate the theoretical biggest score

weak pike
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i had previously brought up a problem that you can generate infinite planet cards with perfect luck, if you emperor -> fool -> emperor infinitely

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so you'd have to decide how you want to handle that

ashen elbow
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Yeah the way we are gonna do is

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Everything that scales up infinitely will be a VARIABLE in the counting

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such as x and y

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and at the end

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we'll just do a grath

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with some of the values changed

weak pike
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that's a cool approach

ashen elbow
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Math lover here B)

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The thing is that

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We already have 2 variables

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The amount of upgrades of the hand, and the amount of planet card used

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If we get more it might get messy

weak pike
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kxra is the other person i know of who seriously wants to figure this out - their chosen approach is to find the average of that, balancing the payout of the emperor/fool combo with the odds of each step actually happening

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i think both approaches are cool

vital ferry
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too make it even harder you could upgrade cards with hiker, but its your choice if you even want to include that suffering in as well

weak pike
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at the very least that still has a limit

near grove
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oh hi

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just found out about this thread

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i am gonna give yall a hint

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my calculation involves increasing chips, but not with icecream

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🤫

harsh tiger
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hikerman

weak pike
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lol

near grove
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i wont approve or deny

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😉

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very not spoiling image

SPOILER_image.png
weak pike
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||very nice and important||

harsh tiger
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hiker is the only uncapped chip adder available right now, no?

near grove
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yes

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wait

weak pike
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there's also runner but that's probably weaker

near grove
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wdym uncapped ?

harsh tiger
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so it probably cant be anything else lol

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uncapped meaning you can keep adding chips indefinitely (until you reach the end of the game)

near grove
harsh tiger
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all others are limited by how many cards you can play in one round (except for runner which i forgot about)

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so actually it probably is runner because getting +10 per straight is stronger than getting +5 per hand using those specific cards

weak pike
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there's also blueprint and dusk to think about

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i wonder if blueprint makes runner double stack or if it just copies the chips

harsh tiger
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oh yea hiker applies the point to the card then can be replaced later, while runner has to stay as a joker

weak pike
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yeah that too

near grove
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try and not spread this 🤫

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(200+(30x14)+(10x5x3)+(20x5x3))x(((20+(5x14))x((2x1.5)^15))x4x(1+(14x0.1))

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13trillion 265billion 278million chips

unborn frost
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what hand/ joker combo are you caclulating?

copper gull
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I feel like, with the fact that planet cards exist. Means if we assign literal perfect rng we can go to the moon

unborn frost
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with perfect rng you can literally go infinte

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well almost

copper gull
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I estimated with perfect planet luck, assuming 2 shop rerolls each round, you can get 7x17 planets

near grove
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blueprint, dusk, scary face, loyalty card, constellation

weak pike
near grove
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with polychrome glass cards

weak pike
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then the other emperor card be high priestess for random planet

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so you have to decide how you want to handle that

devout moth
weak pike
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fool gives the emperor you just used

devout moth
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oh

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right

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brain dumb

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forgot you could just use fool first

near grove
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that is why i think of scary face cuz even tho joker activate after glass cards, chips are aight to be added last

copper gull
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So 119 planets. Which assuming your luck is even crazier, and every single one of those is a 5 of a kind, that gives you a starting chip of 3175, and starting multiplier of 367

devout moth
weak pike
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why not flush house

copper gull
near grove
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why are we talking in HUNDREDS ?

harsh tiger
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is it a bit above expectation to be able to obtain so many planets after the first or second round? where does all the $ come from to be able to do that

copper gull
unborn frost
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i think we should ignore planets becuase it just keeps going based on luck

near grove
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i have no ide if someone is responding to my message...

devout moth
# copper gull ^

perfect luck would be (emperor -> fool + high priestess) infinite times

weak pike
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probably some shenanigans with hermit and temperance

harsh tiger
unborn frost
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i think we need to calculate if scary face is worth the slot

devout moth
near grove
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200+10x15 chips

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vs

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200+(30x14)+(10x5x3)+(20x5x3)

copper gull
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Yeah buying a single one. And spending 9 on rerolls each turn is not impossible.

near grove
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the second one has included a lvl 15 flush house, MB*

unborn frost
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with joker luck for negatives and foils high value temprence helps cyclye thorugh shops an insane number of times

weak pike
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kxra said they'd handle the infinite emperor/fool luck with an average payout, multiplying the payout with the odds of hitting it at each step

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azurii said they'd handle it by adding a variable like X to represent any number of planets you want

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both i think are good approaches

copper gull
devout moth
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and we are going for theoretical, no?

near grove
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lvl 15 flush house with scary face CHIPS: 200+(30x14)+(10x5x3)+(20x5x3)

unborn frost
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well yeah but im justing talking about high temprance value

near grove
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lvl 15 flush house without scary face CHIPS: 200+(30x14)+(10x5x3)

copper gull
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Yeah. Id say we should calculate theoretical, but also limit the things that have a chance of occuring that are worse than dream's speedrun odds

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So all negative jokers, infinit planet cards etc are not allowed

devout moth
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why only calc one of them?

near grove
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if unlocking ceres is possible on 2nd round

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and getting telescope in first or second shop

devout moth
near grove
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there are 15 shops

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but first one is impossible to randomly unlock/get ceres

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so 14 possible ceres cards

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that makes lvl 15 flush house

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in first shop you have to get tarrot cards that allow you to unlock ceres in second run

copper gull
near grove
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calculate that brotha

copper gull
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Ive personally gotten a level 12 deck

devout moth
weak pike
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there's also fool cards you can get to dupe ceres

copper gull
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So like, a level 15 being our rng locked limit is kinda overkill

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Id say we can say level 20 is within a reasonable, but very lucky run

near grove
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we need to state

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how much insane rare rng are we gonna account for

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how much of rng is able to be pulled of by a SEED mechanics

copper gull
near grove
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i played a seeded run tan had a lot of wheels of fortune, and i never gotto upgrade my jokers, its like IMPOSSIBLE

near grove
copper gull
near grove
copper gull
near grove
copper gull
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Ahhhhh so flush house is just simply hands down better

near grove
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my spreadsheet mechanics guy just made a good table

unborn frost
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link?

devout moth
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how on earth do you handle ceremonial dagger

unborn frost
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you dont becuase its almost useless

devout moth
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i mean for calculations if allowing all negatives

unborn frost
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i mean i think highest reasonable theoretical

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we also only have 16 rounds max

near grove
# near grove

but that is without using any other jokers than blueprint and dusk

weak pike
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find the most expensive special edition joker to feed it every round while also building up eggs along the way to sacrifice

near grove
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man

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i dont understand this shi*

image.png
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i just gave some calculation andi was afk from my spreadsheet and a guy just comes and creates a table

near grove
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that guy only seen this

image.png
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mine*

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and he made this

image.png
weak pike
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lmfao

near grove
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you wont believe

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all those lines

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are made

near grove
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i told him that its possible to get 50 level hand as a joke

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and he made all this

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every single combinations of levels up to to 50 and all hands with using blueprint and dusk

unborn frost
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does poly or glass trigger first?

near grove
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glass

weak pike
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they're both Xmult right?

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should be the same either way

unborn frost
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yeah

near grove
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not really HMM

weak pike
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x2 x1.5 = x1.5 x2

near grove
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(2x1.5)^15 = (1.5x2)^15

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using blueprint and dusk

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all 5 cards trigger 3 times

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so 15 triggers of x2 and x1.5 mult

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same with scary face

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20chips x 15

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btw last hand, 5face cards, blueprint, dusk, dusiness card goes hard

vital ferry
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blueprint should be on buisness card instead of dusk, if you are doing it for the money

near grove
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everything triggers 2 times so 10, basically 2 business cards, so 10 cash

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everything triggers 3 times so 15, one business card, so 15/2=7.5

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HUH

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cool

vital ferry
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2x2 > 1x3

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im 95% sure its compatible with blueprint

near grove
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what about the 5% ?

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👀

unborn frost
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it is blueprint compatible

vital ferry
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thought i played a game with that exact scenario, blueprint and buisness card, but wasnt 100% sure so just said 95%

near grove
near grove
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maximal chips before beating boss, and minimal chips for beating the boss

image.png
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all cards must be worth 10 chips

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no jokers used

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in middle its a level of hand.

unborn frost
near grove
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no

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MB

near grove
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no card chips added

unborn frost
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actually wait imnot done with that

near grove
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wdym hand multiplier

image.png
near grove
near grove
unborn frost
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the mult you earn from from the polycrome glass is the hand mult

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it might make more sense to call it card mult

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need to add chips

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from the cards themselves and joker chips

near grove
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now ill just add more hands

SPOILER_image.png
near grove
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now i just need to add each scaling numbers

near grove
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i think i got it

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a link to a math, taken down for a while cuz it was leaking personal information*

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this is what it took me

image.png
weak pike
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using google as a calculator?

near grove
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yeah

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pretty organized and looks good imo

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also i had help from people of spreadsheet discord, they were teaching me how to do all kinds of functions and mechanics with google sheets

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the explanation cells are long tho 💀

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you have to download it to be able to change chips

near grove
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@empty oar check out my calculator for a set jokers scenario

near grove
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you have to download it, open google spreadsheets, create new blank sheet and upload it there

safe trellis
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Theoretical Biggest Score

near grove
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does it look good? the math ?

ashen elbow
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I can bet u didnt calculate it right

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Ill check later

weak pike
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lmao

ashen elbow
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Oh u did something to calculate it

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I'm searching for the biggest THEORETICAL possible score (any infitely scaling value will be a variable in the final function)

unborn frost
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a poly flush house , dusk, blueprint, loyalty card, constellation : things to consider: any negative joker can enhance the build: ideally blackboard, stencil, or scholar for 3 poly glass aces or Fibonacci on poly glass aces and 8s , steel cards will add some benefit, however the biggest value comes from hand level beacuase that is then multiplied by 14348907 which is the value for the poly glass triggers

weak pike
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if you have scholar or anything that affects specific cards, the mult gets added between some of the poly-glass procs

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so like +4 x3 +4 x3 in that order

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so it wouldn't be a clean x14348907

unborn frost
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yeah im just saying the prinicple there end up being alot of small things that can change

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putting the aces first so the multi procs earlier in the chain is better in the case of addition

ashen elbow
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Get as many jokers as you can

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all negative

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as long as they help

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then keep 5 jokers with 1.5 mult

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blueprint dusk

unborn frost
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yeah but its not really feasablie to get anymotre than one or two negatives in a run

ashen elbow
unborn frost
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the theoretical are only fun if you can use it for actual runs

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becuase you could just sayt infinite hand level

ashen elbow
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That's a variable

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in the function

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Same for the number of planet cards used

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for the card that adds mult for planet cards

unborn frost
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you could just say every joker in the game but that is never going to happen in the demo

ashen elbow
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In a world where an infinite amount of people play for an infinite period of time

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It will happen

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That's called theory

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Here I'm just trying to figure out a cap

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But maybe

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There is a way it's simply...

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Impossible

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The amount of seeds is.

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Limited

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Still a lot

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But we are talking ASTRONOMICAL ODDS

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THINGS THAT MAYBE COULD'T HAPPEN OVER MULTIPLE DEATH OF UNIVERSES

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Maybe there is simply

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Not a seed for that perfect game

unborn frost
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with the limited amount of rounds and variables i personally dont think you can do it

ashen elbow
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8 characters for a seed

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26 letters + 10 numbers

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8 ^ 36

unborn frost
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i think max jokers at 7 or 8 is reasonable and hand level 20

ashen elbow
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3.2451855e+32

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I don't think that's enough seeds

weak pike
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you can also have seeds less than 8 characters

ashen elbow
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so lets count a blank character

weak pike
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including an empty seed

ashen elbow
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37 characters

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8^37

weak pike
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you can't put spaces between them

ashen elbow
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2.5961484e+33

weak pike
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it'd be 36^8 + 36^7 + 36^6, etc

ashen elbow
weak pike
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try it

ashen elbow
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It just shows up differently

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For exemple

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UHI OP is the same thing as U HIOP

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Cuz the game will just make it UHIOP

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With the blank at the end

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Cuz it compresses

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Anyways

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With odds as big as what we are talking about

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it may not be enough seeds

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I don't think it's enough at all

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Unless

weak pike
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but then those are the same seed, so counting those as separate doesn't work

ashen elbow
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That amount of seeds

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Is enough for every possible suit of events

weak pike
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also you got the base and the power mixed up. it's 36^8 not 8^36

ashen elbow
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2.5961484e+33

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Nope

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3.5124795e+12

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Yes

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Around this

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We keep a reasonable margin we going fast for now

near grove
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yall trying to calculate possible seed count ?

weak pike
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one of us is trying

ashen elbow
near grove
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i think there are 29017130480 possible seed combinations
1+36+36^2+36^3+36^4+36^5+36^6+36^7+36^8

weak pike
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i think you had a bit of a rounding error there

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that should be an odd number

devout moth
weak pike
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yeah i think their calculator goes to 10 digits lol

near grove
devout moth
weak pike
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yes but 10 is 10^1 and has 2 digits

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uh, actually

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did i miss the point? lol

near grove
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i better use that next time i guees

devout moth
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i couldnt find a calculator that went big enough, so i just grabbed numbers for 36^8, 36^7, and everything else then added them manually

near grove
devout moth
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wait im only off by a single digit so ig i forgot a 1 somewhere

near grove
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manually ?

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on paper ?

devout moth
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manually on digital paper

unborn frost
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For ideal seeds you need an 8 ball in the first shop a blue print in the second , and a multi in the third shop poly Crome by ante 3

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Or something similar

near grove
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what is the final scenario supposed look that would give the BIGGEST score ?

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like what jokers

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planet cards

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tarrots used

devout moth
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all of the jokers, whatever the max planets is ig, infinite tarots

unborn frost
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a poly flush house , dusk, blueprint, loyalty card, constellation : things to consider: any negative joker can enhance the build: ideally blackboard, stencil, or scholar for 3 poly glass aces or Fibonacci on poly glass aces and 8s , steel cards will add some benefit, however the biggest value comes from hand level beacuase that is then multiplied by 14348907 which is the value for the poly glass triggers

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plus any negative shenanigins

devout moth
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also permabuffs like hiker

unborn frost
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yeah

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however its very negligable in comparison to multipliers and hand level for pratical runs

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and ultimatly an abritray variable

devout moth
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when you dont have infinite luck with negatives, planets, and tarots, then chip value plays a non-zero part

near grove
devout moth
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id use ice cream

unborn frost
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yeah i think is worse

near grove
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+20chips x 15 lol

weak pike
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scary face with blueprint dusk triggers several times and works with flush house, where scholar benefits 5oak most

unborn frost
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20 x 15 is 300 which is less than double of a level 4 flush house base ships so in a 5 joker hand blackboard is better

devout moth
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is blueprint compatible with blueprint?

unborn frost
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certainly it helps alot

weak pike
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can only get 1 of each joker in the demo

devout moth
near grove
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does scholars mult activate after glass cards ?

devout moth
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is blueprint compatible with ice cream?

weak pike
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write that on a list of things to test

near grove
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is there ANY joker that adds mult before glass cards ?

devout moth
unborn frost
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yeah but why?

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it is always going to copy dusk

devout moth
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unrelated question tbh

unborn frost
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fair nuf

near grove
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i like how localthunk is in the ''online'' board

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can never know if he is watching 👀

devout moth
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theoretically best hand would be like A A A 10 10 all glass poly flush, right?

unborn frost
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depends on jokers

devout moth
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well i mean yeah

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but theoretically

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every joker can be active at once

weak pike
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i think we can agree on the 3 aces

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not sure about the other 2 though

unborn frost
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3 aces for sure

devout moth
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why not sure on 10s?

near grove
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why aces?

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why not face cards

devout moth
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bus stop

near grove
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ooh

unborn frost
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if you have Fibonacci and even steven 8s are better

near grove
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have you heard of a term, joker activate after glass cards ?

devout moth
weak pike
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scary face was a good idea but the 300 chips vs high level flush house argument makes sense

devout moth
unborn frost
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if it does provide more than double it is not worth to sac a non negative slot

weak pike
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jokers that affect individual cards activate between glass/poly procs

unborn frost
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mainly becuase we have no chip mults

weak pike
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i just don't know if a single card goes mult -> Xmult or Xmult -> mult

near grove
weak pike
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Xmult = chip mult

near grove
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i think hes gonna do it

weak pike
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multiplying 3 numbers is the same no matter which order

unborn frost
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eh maybe

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but the additions the mults change the idea

near grove
devout moth
weak pike
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i thought dev said they didn't want Xchips

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but i could be wrong

unborn frost
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i think it sort of ruins the idea of chips

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and indirectlty devalues all the other jokers the favor mult

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unless its like a legendary or somthing

devout moth
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infinite combos really do mess with the whole discussion huh

weak pike
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yeah you have to choose how to approach those

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there are ways

devout moth
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cuz like, it's possible for dusk to not be the best blueprint

unborn frost
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which is why they should be difined as max reached in actual run

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no its not

devout moth
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whats the one that gets better each planet used

weak pike
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constellation

devout moth
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blueprint const

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after a bunch of planets

near grove
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does a seed where EVERY single shop has spectral pack matter to this ?

weak pike
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the reason dusk is the best is because you can get polychrome glass cards, which are x3 mult every time they're triggered

unborn frost
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ok well using like 200000 planets maybe

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but thats silly

weak pike
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blueprint dusk means another 243 Xmult

devout moth
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idk what the point is exactly

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but

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it exists

unborn frost
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i dont think the expolration of the but what if we go infinite argument is reasonable

weak pike
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i suppose it would be around the area of a 243x+ constellation since that's what you're removing by moving it off dusk

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which means at least 2420 planets

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good luck lol

devout moth
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which, while practically impossible, is a non-zero chance and thus is theoretically possible

near grove
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ima try and play catian kings seed

unborn frost
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still saying infinty is no fun

devout moth
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yes i agree

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im just mentioning that how it's handled should be solved at the start, not at the end

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because the way it's handled can play a factor in the rest of the decision making

unborn frost
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i think 20-25 as hand level

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and 4-7 for constelation

weak pike
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i think you need a good reason to pick any particular number

devout moth
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picking a number arbitrarily doesnt help

unborn frost
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based on what me and barrel were able to schive in the seed

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not abitrary

devout moth
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what one run was able to accomplish shouldnt dictate what the theoretical biggest should use

unborn frost
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yeah but highest actual is a good metric

devout moth
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how do you know if that's the highest actual?

near grove
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i found out about a mechanic, when you buy both jokers in first shop and than buy overstock woucher, then the shop refreshes and it will offer jokers that WOULD appear in second shop

weak pike
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yes that also happens with rerolls

unborn frost
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unless you want to do reasonable theoratical claulation based on avegare ideal luck

weak pike
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everything offered in the shop is on a single line and every new item in the shop just goes one further down that line

unborn frost
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it does change when you sell jokers

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and a couple other things

devout moth
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what are the odds of getting two specific tarots from emperor

weak pike
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if you're looking for exactly 2 then 2/420 or 1/210

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you can't get emperor from emperor and i've never seen it give duplicates so

devout moth
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actually ig exactly 2 isn't needed

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now that i think about it, you only need fool consistently

near grove
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if my wheel of fortune didnt work like 10 times in seeded run than its impossible to activate it ?

unborn frost
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yes and no you need to identify what rng value it uses then advances it one by one

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but without advancing it it doesn't change the outcome its determined by seed and not when you activate it

vital ferry
weak pike
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whoa

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so you can't hold a fool and get a second fool from arcana?

vital ferry
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exactly

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so if you hold temperance (give money equal to sell value joker) to let egg increase in value, it might just be better to sell it

weak pike
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that changes things for my own play lol

vital ferry
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since holding it means you cant get another

unborn frost
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unless fool

vital ferry
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you need to use a card to create a copy with fool

unborn frost
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yeah use temp grab fool and then you get another temp

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but still

near grove
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tarrot cards in pack or shop change

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when id getpack first, i get temperance, but if i refresh whop i get temperance and than in pack i get wheel of fortune(which never triggers)

unborn frost
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you do it with superpostion tarotmancer and 8 ball but this is irellevant to the over disccusion imo

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oh im not sure what advances wheel rng

near grove
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if i get temperance first from pack and than refresh shop than i get wheel of fortune in shop

unborn frost
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or it might be like glass breaks and fixed on start of seed

near grove
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its crazy

unborn frost
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read the dlb doc

near grove
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are some +mult jokers better or 5polychrome glass cards ?

unborn frost
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?

weak pike
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why is this an either/or question?

near grove
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which of those scenarios are better ?

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give more score

unborn frost
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the fice poly crome glass

weak pike
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yeah x243 is incredible

unborn frost
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addtion vs multiplcation

near grove
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i think weneed a seed where we could do flush house in second round

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get telescope

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consistently level up flush house

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get polychrome on card

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make it glass

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copy with blueprint,dna or death

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have tarrot card that ranks up 2 cards

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use it at the end

unborn frost
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you lose out on massive amount of value focusing on flsuh house with telescope

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becuase other hands become most played if you are using 8 ball which is the only thing that allows for enough economy and ultilty

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dna also is not the best without hanged man becuase it leads to to much deck bloat sorta

near grove
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how about just blueprint dusk business card

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i find it pretty op combo for money

copper gull
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Could get up to like 50 dollars per round just from face cards. That was also the run where I managed to get like a 4x multiplier on my constellation, on a rerun of that seed

unborn frost
#

I think we had the discussion earlier that blueprint should copy business card for 4 procs vs 3 procs for and average of 20$ a hand of face cards

unborn frost
#

To initiate some high score seekers

forest crypt
#

alrighty

forest crypt
#

Does steel cards activate before or after regular cards.

unborn frost
#

After

vital ferry
#

Steel card goes before jokers and after cards so if you are using glass dusk strat its prettt much useless

copper gull
#

I mean everything counts when going for max

raw jolt
#

WUTINUCI this seed might be pretty good? mess around a little bit if youd like

unborn frost
#

imo unless you have poly and 8 ball/dna by the end of second ante it shouldnt be considered

#

with those you can make a good run

#

and you have to able to find blue print and dusk in the joker rotatation

forest crypt
#

are we using logic (ie max money you can gain to use) or can we just-

vital ferry
#

this demo?

#

or with cheats i assume

forest crypt
copper gull
vital ferry
#

emperor cant give emperor

#

it can give fool, which gives the tarot card last used

#

which coincidentaly is emperor

#

so in that sense the infinite cycles is possible, but in reality there just arent enough seeds

weak pike
#

sometimes there's a quirk of seeding that accidentally ties some RNG together to create a real pattern where it would otherwise be random

#

some of minecraft's seeds create repeating terrain

#

in the first combat of Slay the Spire, if the enemy is not a cultist, your next ? room is guaranteed to be an event

#

so an infinite combo could be possible

vital ferry
#

good luck finding it tho

weak pike
#

lol

copper gull
vital ferry
#

infinite money=infinite rerolls=infinite level poker hand=infinite score

#

but yeah for getting a score in the trillions you definitly dont need that much

unborn frost
#

I think ignoring hand level and just finding optimal joker combo is the important bit

weak pike
#

then you have to ask about constellation

unborn frost
#

What’s the highest someone has got in the demo then?

#

And the highest hand level achieved so far

weak pike
#

i remember a screenshot from drspectred getting high card to level 47, if im not mistaken

copper gull
#

Assuming you can snag 10 other planet cards that arent your main

unborn frost
#

you do run into the issue of flush house being your most played hand is required for that to work and that means you cant farm tarots with 8 ball or superpostion etc

weak pike
#

there's only 15 shops in a run, which only accounts for 30% of the level 50 hand

#

drspectred's method (oversimplified) values econ and tarot generation a ton in order to find the rest

unborn frost
#

i would imagine he used reroll glitch

#

you can get an average of 5 planets a shop with it

weak pike
#

oh, maybe

vital ferry
#

if we are talking about negatives there is alot more to be calculated

copper gull
#

And if we do, its worth it to only have 4 polychrome cards, just so we can use sketch

#

We can fairly easily get (1.
5^4)(3^15)(2^2)(4)(5)(whatever chipd we are calculating from the hand+750)(whatever multiplier we get from hand)

#

Assuming just a 25 level flush house... the chips are actually a lil lower from ace synergy

#

But you could get a pretty easy 130 base multiplier, and 1000 base.chips

#

Or 7.17 x 10^16

#

So 70 trillion. I think? Maybe thats 700 trillion

#

But theres a decent bit more precise you can get

weak pike
#

10^12 is trillion

#

you're looking at quadrillions

copper gull
#

Oh wow

#

I think all of my math is solid though. (Its assuming a x5 constellation)

#

And rushed math

copper gull
#

And that is a LOW estimate. Without wanting to do the complex math required to see how multipliers effect things in between each glass/poly trigger

ashen elbow
#

Im still doing the math everyday and have to restart

#

Cuz each time something new comes

weak pike
#

lol rip

copper gull
ashen elbow
#

Single one

#

If something can scale infinitely

#

Than just add it as a variable in the final function

copper gull
#

jesus

forest crypt
#

Alright so the possibility of infinite money means that we can get all the jokers in one round if we are lucky enough, so that means we need to calculate the entire set of jokers and glass cards as well with the best hand (flush house) along with the theoretical max amount of planet cards you can get (technically infinite) but we dont know if there is a bit limit on this game.

#

Using Cheats i've discovered that it also uses Xe+Y calculations within the game as well.

#

So the theorectical limit is the mathmatically the max number that using that method can use.

#

I know that cheats are frowned upon but this could be nessacary in order to find the number limit in balatro.

#

Well, using cheats i've found something, at a certain point the score will just turn Inf

ashen elbow
#

Inf.

#

At what point

open meteor
#

i have no idea how to read this however so far ive got this for the teoretical biggest score using only 5 jokers

#

negatives: scholar
polychromes: dusk, blackboard, blueprint, joker stencil
(in that order)

play a all glass card flush house on your last hand, making sure your resulting hand leftover is all clubs/spades

with no planet cards it should be

350 chips * 69984 mult

#

it could probably be hire with bus or egg and dagger to stack a huge mult but those would take time to get but

#

ik people have gotten into the trillions but with that setup it hits 24,494,400

open meteor
rich pawn
#

we can agree that it is at least 7

open meteor
finite solstice
open meteor
#

i didnt know that

#

ive never gotten a score in the millions

#

my highest is 98,400

finite solstice
#

I dont think 1e100 can even fit on a screen.

open meteor
#

isnt that a googl

finite solstice
#

Yea

fast sage
#

Ooh has anyone gone over 18 trillion?

unborn frost
#

i dont belive so

#

And i dont think its likey to be beat with reroll glitch patched

copper gull
#

To be fair, with not terrible luck, they couldve had aces instead of nines, allowing them to use odd todd/the ace joker, as well has having loyalty card, giving them an additional like 10x score in total

tough comet
#

I feel like the more interesting number to me is a "within reason" demo score

#

Like if we just do 5 jokers. Assume like a level 10-15 Planet score, constellation around 5

tough comet
#

Yeah so a "Reasonable" cap is around 120 Trillion, we're approaching it pretty fast

crude cedar
#

yknow

#

I've been kind of wondering about certain things

#

namely

#

what are all of the possible factors you could try

gilded burrow
vital ferry
#

is polychrome card required for seeded wr if you have 2 dusk or 2 blueprint from white whale bug?

gilded burrow
#

You go from x27 mult a crd to x64 mult with that

vital ferry
#

2x2x2x2=16 and 3x3x3=27 so i think it would be required

#

where did you get x64 mult?

gilded burrow
#

2 times 2 times 2 for the first blueprint dusk

#

Then three more 2s for the second blueprint dusk

#

2^6 = 64

vital ferry
#

each extra blueprint/ dusk would only be a extra trigger

gilded burrow
#

There’s still the original trigger

vital ferry
#

no blueprint and dusk= 2x,3x if poly

gilded burrow
#

Wait did I forget original trigger on polyglass

vital ferry
#

dusk=2x2,3x3 if poly

#

blueprint+dusk=2x2x2,3x3x3 if poly

gilded burrow
#

Yeah and you asked if double blueprint double dusk just glass

#

Oh so it would be 2^5

vital ferry
#

double blueprint and dusk or blueprint and dubble dusk=2x2x2x2, 3x3x3x3 if poly

gilded burrow
#

Huh

vital ferry
#

2^4

gilded burrow
#

Oh you’re not saying double blueprint and double dusk anymore

#

Brev

vital ferry
#

i thought either double blueprint or double dusk

#

didnt think you meant both at the same time

#

then it would be ^5

gilded burrow
#

Yeah I just can’t read

#

Never learned

#

Would double blueprint work though?

vital ferry
#

yes

gilded burrow
#

Oh

#

I wouldve though blueprint cant copy blueprint

vital ferry
#

saw it in the previous playtest from a video if i correctly remember

gilded burrow
#

Ah

#

So yeah just a copy of one isn’t enough

#

You would still need polyglass

vital ferry
#

is there a seed which can consistently get the white whale to appear?(and contains polychrome from aura)

gilded burrow
#

I only know of two and neither

#

Plus mine got white whale so early no chance of dusk

vital ferry
#

white whale on ante 5 seems like its prefered over earlier ante's

gilded burrow
#

Does anyone know the bug even works though?

weak pike
#

in theory it's getting patched anyway so i don't think it makes sense to calculate with 5 dusks in mind

#

that said, 5 dusks with glass poly cards and nothing else is a x205 trillion Xmult

gilded burrow
#

Theoretically you should just get 6372 negative dusks smhmhm

#

I love thé “i don’t think it makes sense to calculate this” immediately calculates it

weak pike
#

i did only part of the calculation

vital ferry
#

if your run doesnt end with 24 hours of animations, you arent even trying

near grove
#

😂

crude cedar
maiden cloak
#

(sending a message to join the thread)

crude cedar
#

for the sake of what I wanted to try

#

first off, a lvl 20 flush house hand

#

cards are 3 glass polychrome aces, & 2 glass polychrome 10s

remaining cards in hand are all black suits

#

now, what I want to ask first is

#

what are yall’s opinions on negative jokers being used for this recipe i’m tryna cook up

gilded burrow
#

Well obvs yeah

#

Also it doesn’t have to be set on 10s for the second card

#

If you have odd Todd do 9s, fib do 8s

crude cedar
#

oh

#

right I just remembered Fibonacci exists

crude cedar
#

make that instead 3 glass poly aces, and 2 glass poly 8s

crude cedar
#

the jokers in mind

#

negative jokers
blueprint
dusk
Droll
Zany
Even Steven
Odd Todd
Fibonacci
Scholar

gilded burrow
#

Droll and zany ain’t doing shit

#

Odd Todd would be better than those, but also scholar

crude cedar
#

:ogey:

#

fukc i forgot scholar

gilded burrow
#

And then all the xmult

crude cedar
#

those are gonna be polychrome ones

#

which, you already know

#

Stencil
Blackboard
Loyalty Card

gilded burrow
#

You forgot the best one

crude cedar
#

:ogey:

crude cedar
gilded burrow
#

Constellation

crude cedar
#

oh

#

what mult do I even set it at

maiden cloak
#

Just go for 5x

crude cedar
#

eh good point

maiden cloak
#

That’s a pretty reasonable realistic upper limit

crude cedar
#

so

gilded burrow
#

Assuming you’re blueballing with burglar, you could probs get it near 7/8

#

Cause high priestess/fool op

crude cedar
#

polychrome jokers
Blackboard
Stencil
Loyalty Card
Constellation(set to 5x)

crude cedar
#

what do you think

gilded burrow
#

I mean if it’s theoretical you can make every blue ball give you high preiestess and fool and go into double digits

crude cedar
#

oh

crude cedar
#

how many do you think per round could be done

#

(without any blind skips)

gilded burrow
#

Handy + bluegler is 11 hands

#

And with a gold seal that is very achievable

#

For the first ante you probs want high priest + hermit then get the extra consumable for ante 2 and strat getting high priest + fool

#

With each high priest giving a ceres

umbral snow
near grove
#

cool graph!

#

straight, straight flush and 5oak are the one of the best trio/couple i see

umbral snow
#

Flush house though

devout moth
#

neat to know that at 22 planet cards, straight is better than straight flush

weak pike
#

the straight flush planet on the chart is inaccurate

#

it's +4 mult +40 chips

#

got buffed when straight did

umbral snow
#

will update soon enough

copper gull
#

well nevermind im dumn

#

*dumb

#

my brain disregarded quadratic

devout moth
#

straight > 5oak if 26 or more planets. interesting

#

also interesting that straight flush > flush house at 92+ planets

cloud rune
#

The sum of all powers of 36 from 36^0 to 36^8.

#

That's almost 3 trillion seeds.

cloud rune
#

You could cycle through the Tarot cards faster that way.

gilded burrow
#

If you can just get a talisman right away then death right after that’s a lot easier

#

Both need a spectral

#

But this way you also only need 2 lucky rather than like 8

cloud rune
#

Try this:
Constellation, Astronomer, Blueprint, DNA, Dusk, 8 ball, (Fibonacci, Even Steven, Ride the Bus, are all optional), Blackboard, Loyalty, & Stencil all at once.

#

That should drive the luck factor through the roof.

#

You'll need a lot of money makers.

gilded burrow
#

You forgot like 1 of the most important jokers

cloud rune
#

Which one?

gilded burrow
#

Also DNA isn’t needed if you have blueball

gilded burrow
cloud rune
gilded burrow
#
  1. that’s not an issue with seeded runs
  2. no you don’t cause you’ll get more than enough death to not need DNA
maiden cloak
cloud rune
#

Have you used the seed search for this before?

gilded burrow
#

No

#

I don’t do anything seeded

cloud rune
#

@modern lily should be able to help.

gilded burrow
#

I mean this entire thread is more based off a perfect seed that doesn’t exist

#

Or a modded seed

#

Where you can manip tarot pills, planet pulls, every lucky, aura, talisman, jokers, and everything else

cloud rune
gilded burrow
#

Def not

#

What are the odds of only having ceres for the first like 100 planets and only high priest and fool for the first like 100 aswell

#

And that’s just 2 of the rng strings

#

And after you get the jokers you need, every shop would need to be ceres/high priest with a ceres in the high priest

#

Or fool high priest with a ceres on both

#

And with the amount of money from every lucky would mean you go through so many rerolls

cloud rune
#

Those chances are extremely low, yes. You can hold on to Planets/Tarots to manipulate the RNG.

gilded burrow
#

Theoretical doesn’t manip the rng

#

It has the perfect seed that doesn’t need manip

#

Also not to mention the 41 negative jokers cool

#

And so many other things I missed

#

Unironically hiker right away woukd get +150 chips in a gold sealed card

#

Ish

#

And then this all goes out the window if we allow the white whale bug

cloud rune
#

I'm just here to see what the highest possible score could be.

#

White Whale Bug? WTF is that?

gilded burrow
#

Duplicate jokers

#

A secind dusk and blueprint would just shatter everything

#

Not to mention double blueprint 8 ball now giving 3 tarots

cloud rune
#

Is it possible in the current demo? If so, how does one pull this off?

gilded burrow
#

Yes it’s possible, no one knows how it works

#

Not even lovalrhunk

#

Even copying seeded runs where it has happened doesn’t have 100% certainty if it happening again lol

cloud rune
#

How was it done?

gilded burrow
#

It’s been done a few times

cloud rune
#

HOW?

gilded burrow
#

Again, No one knows

gilded burrow
cloud rune
#

What was done before triggering it?

gilded burrow
#

Nothing special

cloud rune
# gilded burrow Again, No one knows

I've discovered a glitch in Bejeweled Twist that allows 64 gems of one color to be on the board without using CheatEngine/HexEditor and even I don't know the exact reason why it works; however, I just went with it.

cloud rune
gilded burrow
#

My theory is it’s like gen 1 Pokémon where 100% accurate moves have a 1/256 chance to miss

#

(This is definitely wrong)

cloud rune
#

100% accuracy means it doesn't miss by definition.

gilded burrow
#

Know sholthink

#

No

cloud rune
#

I'm not interested in how it works. I'm interested in how to get it to work.

gilded burrow
#

No one knows how that works

maiden cloak
gilded burrow
#

Like literally

#

What else am I supposed to say at this point

cloud rune
#

I'm not surprised.

gilded burrow
#

I’m gonna write a bot that just replies “no one knows how it works” to every message ever sent dogesmile

#

By anyone

weak pike
maiden cloak
#

no one knows how it works

cloud rune
#

What's the difference between how something works and how to get something to work? To me, there is a difference.

maiden cloak
#

heres how you get it to work. you play the game and sometimes it happens

cloud rune
#

So, you might not get it to work?

#

It's all luck?

weak pike
#

there was a malf stream where thunk was able to replicate the issue by playing through the game just like malf did

#

that's the extent of the knowledge about getting it to work

maiden cloak
#

same cards played and everything, yeah?

weak pike
#

yep

cloud rune
weak pike
#

i figured. only said something now because i'm multitasking :3

cloud rune
#

I wasn't interested in "what's under the hood." I was interested in "where are the keys?"

weak pike
#

🔑

cloud rune
weak pike
#

studio laugh track

cloud rune
#

Now, what did malf do?

#

Is there a video for me to watch?

weak pike
#

i do not have the stream/clip link saved unfortunately

#

i don't even remember when it happened

#

thunk is the only person i can think of that might have one

#

unless you do some digging

cloud rune
#

Could I reach out to thunk and get it that way or would that be a big 👎?

weak pike
#

i don't think they respond to pings often but no one's been told off for it yet, so give it a shot

cloud rune
#

@empty oar, do you know how malf pulled of this "White Whale Bug?"

modern lily
#

you could also DM him

weak pike
#

thunk's DMs are closed

modern lily
#

and related to seed searching — even with that you’re not going to find a seed that has absolutely everything possible

modern lily
empty oar
#

I try not to respond to pings in general - not something I want to incentivize unless its clearly warranted

#

sorry!

cloud rune
#

That's okay. I'll keep it brief: do you have a link to malf pulling off this "White Whale Bug?"

weak pike
#

we were discussing ways to replicate the bug, and that was the first time it's been replicable

cloud rune
#

I've seen bugs in action before, some that are too interesting to let slip; heck, I'm working on a fan game that takes some bugs from other games and turned them into features.
Perhaps you could also implement a way to turn this bug into a feature by adding in some kind of on/off switch (but not make it easy to access)?

modern lily
#

There will be jokers in the full game that allow you to have multiple copies of a joker

cloud rune
#

That works for me.

#

I was unaware of that.

#

Localthunk, maybe you could add in a way to reroll packs? It could cost in-game money to do it.

devout moth
#

is the theoretical biggest score now being counted for full game release?

#

guess we gotta add a bunch more negatives

empty oar
#

I don't even know all the Jokers for full release yet

#

Might be a tough calc

devout moth
#

eh, it's probably infinite

#

calc done

#

everyone go home

empty oar
#

Honestly yeah

#

1.8 E308

devout moth
#

i mean there's already a way to go infinite in demo

modern lily
#

If you get inf it just shows up as blank I think

#

Tried that one with save editing

devout moth
#

the blank probably just comes from an error in the save then

modern lily
#

It would process but the value would look blank

devout moth
#

wack

empty oar
#

No it was a crash before, there's a check for inf/nil now I think

modern lily
#

And then reloading the game would cause all time high score to reset

empty oar
#

I'd like to show scientific notation for the super high scores

modern lily
devout moth
#

is there an endless mode confirmed for full game?

empty oar
#

Because after a few 0s it's impossible to read

#

There is an endless mode

#

But I think it's getting a scaling rework too

devout moth
#

oh boy, i hope throwback makes a comeback. infinite scaling instantly

empty oar
#

So it'll ramp up scaling faster than you possibly could after a while

#

That way max ante/round will be meaningful

#

And less of a patience test

devout moth
#

infinite scaling will be found

#

i will simply have too much patience

#

the so-called "endless mode" will have it's end exposed

#

this is a promise

maiden cloak
sour tangle
modern lily
#

probably scientific notation then hover to see exact value would be the best solution

modern lily
#

So with glitch abuse and save editing I was able to show that a 1.1080616696×10⁵² is possible

#

That includes white whale and hand duplication x4, and lvl 20 high card (which is what the game counts it as)

#

96,463,808,185,085,568 (96 quadrillion) was my score with only white whale and lvl 20 flush house

modern lily
copper gull
#

I dont think I would consider this in the theoretical high core category, as it is far to reliant on bugs/glitches/cheats, and at that point, the infinite scaling of hand levels would ALSO be considered possible

modern lily
gilded burrow
#

Theoretically there is a bug we don’t know about yet that allows for infinite hiker stacks dogesmile

#

So it’s infinite!!

modern lily
#

also infinite hand duplication

#

The video uses 4x, but today I was able to get a 5x hand duplication glitch

cloud rune
gilded burrow
modern lily
#

might be referring to the run without hand dupe though

cloud rune
#

It's actually chip count and additional multipliers.

#

With quad Dusk (Blueprint + Dusk, both WW'd), that's +500 chips.