🕹・game-discussion

[pale wolf]

thunk does 🦓

[wicked sequoia]

Simply built different

[eager lance]

ghost deck most fun deck?

[wicked sequoia]

yes

it lets me do silly stuff

[terse vale]

that and painted for me

[pale wolf]

I've always said that if there had to be a single deck in balatro I would pick ghost even though it's not my personal favorite

[wicked sequoia]

what's your fave

[eager lance]

what is ur fav

[pale wolf]

atm blue

[eager lance]

painted is nice too

[wicked sequoia]

blue is good

📘

[pale wolf]

blue is fun and also the strongest so i have double good

[eager lance]

exactly what i would expect a non-endless player to say lol

[eternal pumice]

[pale wolf]

You mean a balatro player

[wicked sequoia]

I like green a lot

[eager lance]

ngl i find it annoying that you have to consider saving discards

[eternal pumice]

I don’t think you should like me anymore:c check off topic

[wicked sequoia]

very fair

[brittle temple]

i love it

minmaxing for money my beloved

[wicked sequoia]

Got pretty far considering the circumstance

[pale wolf]

when I first started the game Green was my favorite for a while

it is a lot of fun but it ruined my economy habits cuz I played it exclusively for like 2 weeks

[eager lance]

well cant u not do that on green deck

[eager lance]

yeah well ive only done a few games on green deck

[long zodiac]

Yellow deck made me struggle with econ on any other deck for a good while

[eager lance]

how

[long zodiac]

Because I almost exclusively played yellow deck when i first started

[pale wolf]

I've never liked yellow deck 🫣

[eager lance]

oh

[eager lance]

y

[wicked sequoia]

how often do yall play erratic

[pale wolf]

not sure, just don't like playing it

[long zodiac]

Eh i play it every once in a while

[eager lance]

i got really lucky on erratic

[long zodiac]

Nebula is like the one deck that I never play for me

[eager lance]

for everyone

[novel nymph]

guys can anyone explain me if this voucher is good and how to use it / what that exactly do

[long zodiac]

i am not looking forward to a grind to gold stake with that deck

[eager lance]

i wanted the discard 5 jacks at once joker unlock so opened up one erratic game and did it on first round

then same thing for four 7 of clubs

i didnt have to restart run at all

[pale wolf]

it reduces the immediate scoring requirements, gives you three extra rounds

[eager lance]

ill probably do that deck last

[pale wolf]

once you are in ante 6 it's hand-positive

[eager lance]

wdym

[novel nymph]

i'm so newbie at this game can u explain what that means

[pale wolf]

You gain more total hands in the run than you lose from your Max going down

[eager lance]

how does that matter

well ig for something like green joker

[pale wolf]

so you know how the scoring requirements you need to be each round go up? glyph Acts like you went back 3 rounds so you are playing against the same scoring goals as last ante

[pale wolf]

It's a pretty direct measure of the resources you have in the blind

[eager lance]

yeah and the skips and boss blind stay the same tho

[pale wolf]

It's how far you have to dig in your deck, it's how many times you can scale hand scalers, it's how much of value you can get from value generators

[novel nymph]

oooooooh

that means like the scores will be the same that was at the small blind big blind and boss blind

that i recently played

instead increasing

is that it?

[pale wolf]

they will match whatever the previous ante was

[novel nymph]

ok ty

[dreamy perch]

is the joker placement good ?

[spark kernel]

Very funny game

[eager lance]

Wait i didnt know that cards u get from a standard pack wont show up in an arcana pack in the same shop

[spark kernel]

HOW DID I NOT GET A 3OAK ON PAINTED DECK

[pale wolf]

yea this is true

[brittle temple]

can i get a mime already

im dying

[eager lance]

honestly would be better if it wasnt like that

[pale wolf]

the card order set to appear in packs is predetermined and doesnt include those additions (and also tries to avoid repeating cards between packs in the same phase(which is why double-tagged arcana/spectral skips brick the run if you exit the game during))

[eager lance]

wdym by last part

during what

[cloud sinew]

how would you feel about heiro and petro just not having downsides

[pale wolf]

second one is unrelated

[eager lance]

is it because the cards are predetermined so if they are destroyed they cant show up?

[pale wolf]

wait first one also is 🥀 trust me more than half of these are about the double tag softlock

[knotty zodiac]

way too OP

[cloud sinew]

how

[pale wolf]

My best guess is that the game does not remember that it isnt on the first part of the cycle, and attempts to draw cards that were already previously marked as undrawable
and so you just draw no cards and are stuck there forever

[eager lance]

having a full ante to scale???

and extra shops

money

everything

[cloud sinew]

okay

[knotty zodiac]

significantly easier a1-7 in exchange for a slightly harder a8 IF you dont find anything during the extra ante

[cloud sinew]

but that doesn't explain how it's OP, let alone "way too" OP

[pale wolf]

why would you ever not take them

but I guess that doesn't make them unique

I guess the question is, should handy have a downside

[eager lance]

it does

[cloud sinew]

it explains why it's good

[cloud sinew]

exactly

vouchers being an almost always take isn't really a problem, look at overstock and handy for example

[eager lance]

i feel like if didnt have a downside u basically get a free win

[cloud sinew]

or if it is a problem, then those should too

[eager lance]

But thats not the case with something like overstock

[cloud sinew]

1 extra ante isnt a free win

[cloud sinew]

1.5x better rerolls is incredibly strong

[pale wolf]

im biased bc i play blue deck which is affected the least by heiro

[knotty zodiac]

it'd be better than grabber. grabber is 1.25x scoring. hiero is essentially 2 xmult early, 1.5xmult mid, and 0.75 xmult a8

[eager lance]

it is if u play well

[cloud sinew]

how is it 2 xmult early

you get put back an ante, sure, but you still have to beat the same final ante

[brittle temple]

madness yummy

[brittle temple]

random seed?

[knotty zodiac]

your scoring req goes from ex. 3200 in 4 (800) to 1000 in 3 (333)

[rain adder]

Yes

[cloud sinew]

"you get put back an ante, sure, but you still have to beat the same final ante"

the scoring you need to actually win the run is the same

[knotty zodiac]

yes, like i said, a1-a7 way easier in exchange for a harder a8. but very often the extra ante allows you to find xmult during the mid runs so its not even a net loss in a8

[pale wolf]

its 1.125x ante tho!!

[brittle temple]

you get 3 extra shops to get a joker that can get you the 2x mult

[eager lance]

what

[pale wolf]

it go 8→9

[brittle temple]

it makes the game 1.125x harder by making you play longer

worst voucher

[pale wolf]

anyways, i think the glyph vouchers should stay as is

[cloud sinew]

at the very least i think they should be swapped round

[knotty zodiac]

im not opposed to grabber coming with a downside

[pale wolf]

-1 discard first would be a major boon

[rain temple]

''here, win''

[cloud sinew]

hands are a more important resource, losing a hand first is a worse trade.
also, blue stake rework.

[eager lance]

i was thinking of that but arent the second versions of vouchers supposed to be better

[cloud sinew]

not automatically

[crystal topaz]

Red

[cloud sinew]

theyre not, as a rule, "better" than their T1s. most of the T2s just apply the same thing as their T1s again.

[brittle temple]

why did i just get petroglyph right as its being talked about

[eager lance]

if white stake its not worth it and if higher then maybe

[brittle temple]

talk about antimatter

[eager lance]

lmao

[cloud sinew]

ah

[eager lance]

💀

[cloud sinew]

me when i use archaic language, and people don't understand it

[eager lance]

yeah ig but some like recton are

[pale wolf]

mfw i read book and thats how i learn english bc school was inept

[eager lance]

the second one is either the same or better

[cloud sinew]

only 5/16 are "upgrades"/"better" versions of their T1s

[viral mountain]

Are we saying Boon is some deprecated word of ancient english or something

[eager lance]

yeah but are there any that are worse than the first ?

[cloud sinew]

not objectively

[pale wolf]

idk i guess its not used often anymore but i didnt think it was obscure

[eager lance]

also blue stake needs to be fixed 🙏

[viral mountain]

I come from the land of Fire Emblem Dipshits and we use Boon and Bane all the time over there

[cloud sinew]

is going to be

[knotty zodiac]

illusion can be somewhat worse than magic trick bc card cost doubles, which is annoying for hologram

[eager lance]

yeah

[brittle temple]

yeah make it completly delete discards

[pale wolf]

medieval larping actually makes a lot of sense yea

thats prob why im used to it, fantasy

[eager lance]

yeah but mostly it is better

[viral mountain]

It makes sense until we call every spear a Lance

And then call Halberds a kind of Axe

[cloud sinew]

yes

[eager lance]

💀

[pale wolf]

i call them halverds

[knotty zodiac]

i would say the incremental benefit of recyclomancy over wasteful is less, same with the hand vouchers

also the tycoons are usually unwanted

[pale wolf]

halberds are a poleaxe, thats kinda close enough

[eager lance]

true

[viral mountain]

I would call them much closer to Spears than Axes given the two options

[cloud sinew]

that's only because the relative increase is smaller, but the absolute benefit is still the exact same.

[pale wolf]

necessarily they're partially poleaxes at least

otherwise it wouldnt be a halberd

[knotty zodiac]

relative benefit is everything in this game where we are measuring % increases

[brittle temple]

axe with big stick

[eager lance]

that also applies to the heiroglyph and petroglyph

[eager lance]

exactly

[cloud sinew]

wdym "where we are measuring % increases"?

[pale wolf]

anyways uh

[knotty zodiac]

petro is interesting. the downside is also smaller in exchange for the benefit being smaller

[pale wolf]

overstock+ isn't better than overstock

[cloud sinew]

arguably it is

[pale wolf]

overstock is a +50% increase while + is only +33%

[cloud sinew]

the more slots you have, the more things that block each other, making the odds of getting any 1 ideal card better

[brittle temple]

4 looks better than 3 so point invalid

3 looks better than 2 actually point may be valid

[eager lance]

the total decrease of hands+discards is marginally more when you use petroglyph compareed to heiroglyph

[pale wolf]

wdym

[cloud sinew]

the relative decrease in digging power is greater with petro than with heiro

[crystal topaz]

Black stake

[brittle temple]

serpant just crashing my game 🥀

[knotty zodiac]

yes, but discards have less utility than hands when you play the meta (pairs without on-score)

[pale wolf]

its necessarily equal or less in volume, isnt it? because you have to see petro later

[brittle temple]

meta 🤮

[cloud sinew]

so NOW you look at absolute values...? 😭

[brittle temple]

full house my beloved

[pale wolf]

when didnt i

[eager lance]

then it could be worth it

[pale wolf]

overstock+ also has to come after overstock

so necessarily equal or less

[eager lance]

true

[cloud sinew]

right but in the overstock example youre comparing relative increases

while with petroglyph youre comparing absolute decreases

[pale wolf]

because both are relevant

[eager lance]

say you have 4 hands and 2 discards so 6 total
a decrease from 4 hands to 3 hands makes you have 5 total
which is a dcreease by 16.67%
and if you use petroglyph you'll have 4 total
which is a decrease by 20%

[pale wolf]

theres an immediate effect and a long term effect

[cloud sinew]

then sure, but the relative decrease in deck digging is higher with petroglyph than with heiro

[knotty zodiac]

in balatro we allocate money and joker slots to improve our score.

ex. 100 chip joker is way better early than late, why? usually bc we have other chip sources that make its % contribution to our score lower than say, xmult

ex. we stop worrying about discards as much as grimbo approaches 30 +mult. why? bc each marginal hand is a smaller improvement than before

same goes for constellation mult, etc

[cloud sinew]

that doesn't necessarily apply in all instances

[knotty zodiac]

in short, the absolute changes are less interesting and relevant than the relative changes

[pale wolf]

ah ye fair

[cloud sinew]

with consumable slots for example, the more slots you have the better each extra slot gets because of how much your odds of getting any 1 desirable card from blocking increases, even though adding 1 consumable slot gets less and less significant when looking at the relative difference in # of slots.

[eager lance]

yeahh thats what im saying

[brittle temple]

idk i like seeing big number

[pale wolf]

deck fixing is the act of devaluing deck digging

true or false

[eager lance]

false

[brittle temple]

deck fixing is the act of getting a billion 9's for cloud 9

[eager lance]

true

[cloud sinew]

no

that is an effect of it, but that isn't what deckfixing fundamentally is

[brittle temple]

wait wouldnt this mean getting extra hand size is deck fixing

[ocean current]

How does the game work? I kinda don't know even tho a guy explained it to me one time

[cloud sinew]

u should play the tutorial

[brittle temple]

enter game, play poker cards, buy jokers for higher numbers

[pale wolf]

https://balatrowiki.org/w/Gameplay_loop

[eager lance]

good advice

lol

[brittle temple]

theres blue (base) and red (mult) you want them both as high as possible

[cloud sinew]

blue (chips)

[knotty zodiac]

being able to hold both outputs from emperor and priestess is way better than 5% better tarot blocking and planet blocking going from 5/9 to 6/9

[brittle temple]

base

chips is just the name

[cloud sinew]

???

[cloud sinew]

yes

and so thats what we will call it

[brittle temple]

its basexmult

[cloud sinew]

because we call it by it's name

[brittle temple]

im just telling him the math not the terms

[cloud sinew]

what

[brittle temple]

also just wing it

[cloud sinew]

u said blue (base) red (mult), why not just say blue (chips)

[brittle temple]

you discover the features as you play

[cloud sinew]

why say a name that isn't relevant at all

[brittle temple]

base is a thing you multiply

its not a name

[eager lance]

fr

[cloud sinew]

just call it chips

[eager lance]

best way to play when u start

[cloud sinew]

because that's what it's called in-game

[brittle temple]

i love 20 message long arguments about terminology thats ultimately just misunderstandings

[cloud sinew]

it's not a misunderstanding

[knotty zodiac]

it can be avoided when ones uses the standard game naming convention 😉

[cloud sinew]

you're just using the wrong word which risks confusing someone because that's not what it's referred to in-game

[pale wolf]

theres blue(ballast) and red(fuel)

[brittle temple]

theres blue(number) and red(number, but cooler)

[cloud sinew]

like if i just started called stuntman "biker boy", it would not be at all surprising if someone was like "who the hell is biker boy"

[knotty zodiac]

it's clearly gang colors. cripps x +bloods x xbloods

[shell dagger]

red button or blue button

[brittle temple]

im reffering to the math terms of base and mult, not the ingame names of chips and mult

[cloud sinew]

why

[shell dagger]

base has many meanings in maths

it’s pointless

[knotty zodiac]

rabbithole pill x blissfulignorance pill

[brittle temple]

i mean when its paired with mult not really

[knotty zodiac]

isnt it base and exponent?

[brittle temple]

vibes

[cloud sinew]

why would using a math term rather than a balatro term be more intuitive when we're talking about someone learning how balatro works

[shell dagger]

mult also isn’t a maths term tbh

[pale wolf]

if you ever want to be infuriated click this button

[shell dagger]

like you’ll never see someone write mult in a paper

[cloud sinew]

i tried at like 1 hour in, i didnt like it

[knotty zodiac]

boss blind- randomize the position of this button and disable scumming

[pale wolf]

try it now that its in your blood

[cloud sinew]

god

[brittle temple]

exponent is ^, which means multiplying a thing by itself a number of times (2^4=2x2x2x2)
mult is just x, which is adding itself to itself a number of times (2x4=2x2x2x2)

[brittle temple]

just a shorthand for multiplication

[shell dagger]

again mult isn’t a maths term

which never gets used in maths

so

[knotty zodiac]

right, im saying ive heard base and exponent but never base and mult, is that standard math terminology?

[cloud sinew]

and "glubget" is a shorthand for exponentiation.
-# if you make things up for your argument

[brittle temple]

thankfully im not writing a maths paper

[pale wolf]

im crying

[knotty zodiac]

multiplication is commutative so it doesnt really make sense for there to be a mult

[shell dagger]

so let’s use balatro terms not maths terms 🙏

[brittle temple]

drink some water to hydrate

[cloud sinew]

no

[pale wolf]

you meant + on the second one but its jus funy

[cloud sinew]

i have taken math at college, as has RT iirc, it is not standard math terminology

[brittle temple]

oh yeah

[shell dagger]

erm actually balatro scoring follows the same properties as a commutative ring

let’s talk in ideals instead

[crystal topaz]

Do I go green or buffoon here?

[brittle temple]

multiplication is just another word for exponent

trust

[cloud sinew]

ermmm what would your ideal update be :)

[crystal topaz]

I think buffoon right?

[knotty zodiac]

grimbo

[shell dagger]

hopefully one with maximal content

[pale wolf]

balatro "order of operations"
O O Ps

[crystal topaz]

Green?

[pale wolf]

🦓

[ocean current]

Oh I’ve never played Balatro lol wouldn’t know where to start

[pale wolf]

you should play this wonderful game

it's made of cards

[cloud sinew]

thunk should increase the character count of seeds to 64, got it.

[pale wolf]

no man's sky exploration be like

[cloud sinew]

7e98 seeds 🔥

[brittle temple]

when are we planting the seeds into tree's

[novel nymph]

chat which deck is better, blue or red

[knotty zodiac]

blue

[crystal topaz]

I prefer red

[novel nymph]

for sure?

[cloud sinew]

blue

[brittle temple]

that one

[knotty zodiac]

hands are just discards that give you money and score

(with few exception)

[brittle temple]

yucky score

[novel nymph]

But from what I understand, the more hands we have, the more money we make, right? In that sense, wouldn't increasing disposal be better?

I mean, thinking about it, don't the two practically amount to the same thing?

[spark kernel]

The balatro update will never happen

[cloud sinew]

1 hand is equivalent to 1 discard for deck digging

[crystal topaz]

Thats fair actually

[brittle temple]

i wonder how hard it is to get the exact winning score on every round up to ante8

[cloud sinew]

+1 hands means +$1, discards dont.

[crystal topaz]

Maybe I should be doing my run through on blue instead of red

[hasty harness]

well sometimes discards are better then hands

[pale wolf]

red is better on seeds that give you early yorick

[cloud sinew]

incredibly difficult

you need to do a lot of math

and be very good at math

[shell dagger]

and get very lucky

[cloud sinew]

the highest ive gotten with it is ante 4 boss blind

[novel nymph]

But in practice, having an extra hand doesn't yield the same result as having an extra discard, generally speaking. Because from what I understand, there are cards that combo with discards but also with more hands. So aren't the two "equal"?

[novel nymph]

and sometimes hands are better right?

[hasty harness]

yeah

[novel nymph]

so aren't they the "same"

[cloud sinew]

hands are usually better

[cloud sinew]

no.

there are more situations where hands are better than where discards are better

[brittle temple]

theres the diffrence that hands can make you win the round before you get the gold/lucky cards you were looking for if you have good jokers

[novel nymph]

oh i see

[cloud sinew]

especially considering the base case is that unused hands give $1, discards do not

[cosmic sun]

More people should use their hands to dig for value in their deck

[hasty harness]

discards are mainly better for when you're too strong and a single hand will win and you want to dig for specific cards

or having jokers like rebate

or purple seals

[brittle temple]

yeah

[hasty harness]

because you cant get value from those without at least 1 discard remaining

[brittle temple]

omw to spend 3 hands looking for a purple seal with 1 discard left

[pale wolf]

all the time

[serene forge]

I <3 yuri

[brittle temple]

yaoi better

[serene forge]

i miss my girlfriend...

[pale wolf]

hey fork

[ocean current]

what do you want to talk about in Balatro

zebra

[pale wolf]

trans rights

[cosmic sun]

Doomed fork and outlet yuri

[brittle temple]

are there metal supports in those pants or does he just have long legs

[cloud sinew]

Red Joker

what would it do

[knotty zodiac]

a few other cases where you might want a discard over a hand

you drew a bunch of face cards and you have bus
you want to proc a purple seal
you want to proc mail in rebate
you need to set the correct hand for mouth
you need more digging and youre close to winning

[pale wolf]

we have like 3 or 4 of those

[cloud sinew]

no

we have jokers that are red

we do not have a Red Joker

[brittle temple]

hueshift your screen to be 10% redder

[hasty harness]

you have delayed grat early econ joker 🥶

[cloud sinew]

twin

[knotty zodiac]

yeah, and banner, and castle, a few more cases

[cloud sinew]

why is blackboard the only joker that's green

[gloomy valley]

whats a good build for new players with 0 wins i currently in this run early ante 2 have king dude for the 1.5x

[brittle temple]

2 individual green joker slots?

[hasty harness]

hit the road as well actually just remembered

[hasty harness]

baron isnt that good early on

[brittle temple]

look at the second joker

[hasty harness]

only when you have the deck fixed does it get strong

[gloomy valley]

got him from a pack

ooo ya

so should i try and lean to him?

[cloud sinew]

that's Green Joker. the other jokers that arent "[colour] Joker" in-game are the jokers that simply are that colour

[crystal topaz]

I'll start again at white stake but with blue deck this time

Let's see if that's much easier

[hasty harness]

i mean if you're a newer player and don't have a good sense on how to balance econ and deck fixing yet I wouldnt

[brittle temple]

nah you need to be lucky or have another joker carry you for a while for baron to be good

that a while being until ante 5-7

[cloud sinew]

but there's more than just blackboard who's green, but they arent on that image

[gloomy valley]

im currently doing well so if i need i sell him im not full inv yet

[frank grove]

also the image in general i just confusing

only one purple joker? i can think of a few

[cloud sinew]

like fr though why do you not have any of the other green jokers

[cosmic sun]

let's be realistic is there anything to learn by using baron?

[cloud sinew]

yes

[solemn tapir]

https://i.imgur.com/qyx4KJp.png

[cosmic sun]

Deck fixing is not exclusive to Baron tbh

[solemn tapir]

finished up nebula for my c+ finally

[cosmic sun]

Nor is the trigger effect

[brittle temple]

wdym

[cloud sinew]

it doesn't have to be exclusive to it to learn from it

[gloomy valley]

so if i wanna builds for boren i think i want to make sure i can add up my multi before it kicks in

[hasty harness]

well baron is easier to deck fix towards compared to other jokers like idol

[knotty zodiac]

in general the easiest path to a win is to play flushes early while looking for a way to transition into playing pairs

eventually a joker lineup like

• mail in rebate (for money)
• square joker (for chips)
• green joker (for scaling mult)
• blackboard (for xmult)
• driver's license (for more xmult)

along with blue seals to help increase your planet levels

[hasty harness]

yeah

[mental bloom]

green and rebate are opps tho

[gloomy valley]

im really knew like started 2 days ago so i doubt i got them

[cosmic sun]

nop

[knotty zodiac]

i think grimbo is a bit easier to use than ride the bus or red card for a beginner

[mental bloom]

is it ok to discard a bit? I see I see...

[cloud sinew]

it's okay to discard quite a lot actually

[frank grove]

yeah

[hasty harness]

grimbo and rebate dont conflict each other too much just dig with hands and once you're one away from winning then u discard what rebate is asking for

[brittle temple]

i usually use up all my discards by the time a round is over

[cloud sinew]

even in an extreme case where you have like 3 or 4 discards, you're very likely still keeping green joker at the same mult between rounds.

[mental bloom]

facts

[cosmic sun]

I mean at that point, say you have a Yorick, you will not be crying too hard over Grimbo mult

[pale wolf]

the 2 reasons to not use up your discards are to save time and (nonexistent concern) garbage tag value

[iron vigil]

Gains +1 mult per discard used, -1 mult if no discards are used

[cosmic sun]

And if it genuinely does stay too low you could easily find anything else or start hard throwing to slowly scale Grimbo

[naive frigate]

Yoo i unlocked anti matter or whatever you get for 10 blanks

[hasty harness]

nice

[knotty zodiac]

it doesnt have to be these specific jokers, just giving you an idea of what a winning setup looks like. you can use other jokers that fit the same theme

[naive frigate]

What does it do

[cloud sinew]

garbage tag might be a ridiculously tiny thing to consider, but it's not nothing

[gloomy valley]

ok is this good so far

[hasty harness]

+1 joker slot

[cloud sinew]

baron is not the direction for this build

[pale wolf]

the baron doesnt actually multiply the spare trousers bc its in an earlier phase of scoring

[cloud sinew]

spare trousers is an incredibly good mult scaler

[pale wolf]

you can watch it happen realtime

[novel nymph]

I thought that having an extra discard would be equivalent to having an extra hand.

For example, consider two scenarios:

Blue deck: 5 hands and 3 discards

Red deck: 4 hands and 4 discards

If you use one discard from the Red deck, you're left with 4 hands and 3 discards.
If you use one hand from the Blue deck, you're also left with 4 hands and 3 discards.

Since both situations end up with the same number of hands and discards, I assumed they would be equivalent.

that was my logic

unused hands in BOTH scenarios that i said above: we gain 4 extra dollars right?

[knotty zodiac]

so here, the pants are great long term, scary face is fine, and you want to find xmult and money

[naive frigate]

Thats op

[pale wolf]

you cant win with a discard though

[novel nymph]

oh

mb

[frank grove]

yeah discards dont score?

[solemn tapir]

😭 why are we assuming all decks are equal

[gloomy valley]

ok imma now try and use 2 pairs often to stack up

[pale wolf]

new joker idea???

[hasty harness]

i mean you need to get blank first in a run and then get anti-matter

[knotty zodiac]

baron is "xmult" but its pretty hard to set up bc it's tough to get that many kings in your hand, and it goes before the pants. usually youll prefer xmult that is not "held in hand" or "on score" related

[hasty harness]

anti-matter cant show up til you get blank first

[cloud sinew]

discarded cards are also scored

[hasty harness]

so unless you're going for deep runs you probably won't see anti-matter

[naive frigate]

Worth it

[hasty harness]

for sure just saying

[serene forge]

outside of synergies 1 hand is just always better than 1 discard save for 1 boss blind

[pale wolf]

I shall call it... Rift (Rare)

[cloud sinew]

it's worth it if you arent struggling for money, there's nothing else in shop you want to buy with your money, and you're $10 or more above interest cap

[cosmic sun]

Rift (Raff)

[cloud sinew]

doesn't feel like a rare

feels like an uncommon

[serene forge]

rift of the necrodancer

[cloud sinew]

shortcut, smeared, 4fingers...

[pale wolf]

because it RUINS obelisk

[cosmic sun]

🍽️

[cursive crater]

how many hours do yall have

[cloud sinew]

over 1k

[pale wolf]

20

[knotty zodiac]

no idea, but i have about 200 wins and i play slow

[cursive crater]

damnnn

[pale wolf]

nah it says 215h for me

[frank grove]

Yeah across steam and mobile easily over a thousand too

[cosmic sun]

Only 400 on PC and a bit on other platforms so like, idk over 500

[pale wolf]

my winrate is pretty healthy

[cloud sinew]

source

[pale wolf]

50% past 20 attempts

🦓

[knotty zodiac]

u did gsg at some point ya? it has to be a min level of healthy to get there

[red plover]

bolatro and things

[pale wolf]

no

[red plover]

balatro

[knotty zodiac]

oh thought u did

[pale wolf]

kanjikun did

[cloud sinew]

zebra hasnt attempted gsg at all iirc

[cosmic sun]

goldship gay

[pale wolf]

ive done runs in the order but I wouldn't say i was attempting something I'm not capable of

[cosmic sun]

that's totally what it stands for

[cursive crater]

whats gsg

[cloud sinew]

gold stake gauntlet; 15 wins in a row at gold stake, 1 win on each deck

[knotty zodiac]

beat gold stake on every deck without losing

[pale wolf]

global smash grankings

[cursive crater]

ah

[knotty zodiac]

sequential is not required right?

[terse dock]

A house divided among itself cannot stand.

[pale wolf]

not necessarily

[knotty zodiac]

not going black first would be a huge waste of time

[frank grove]

plasma first is probably better right?

[pale wolf]

i think they go plasma first but idk why

[cosmic sun]

This is a Balatro reference because full house is ass

[cosmic sun]

To rip off the bandaid right?

[frank grove]

i know gsg speedruns are done on plasma first

[cosmic sun]

I mean if you lose that gauntlet at plasma it's probably better that way

[pale wolf]

idk why instead of black i mean

[cosmic sun]

Would black not be next?

[pale wolf]

i assume black is lower % than plasma but maybe theres like, a time advantage

[frank grove]

but gsg alone i have no idea why plasma would be first over black i guess they're kinda equally annoying

and i guess plasma runs are faster? whilst black can very slow

[pale wolf]

if you spend fewer doomed first attempts in Black maybe you're more likely to play through

makes sense

[frank grove]

yeah

[pale wolf]

@ balatro what do you think

[cosmic sun]

What you want

[knotty zodiac]

i assume the time splits are harder to nail on plasma bc the scoring plays differently?

[frank grove]

Also it’s a good deck to speedrun on generally so you get a good headstart if other runs are a little slower

I should do more gsg attempts

[dry nimbus]

bean bug shenanigans

🥹

[crystal topaz]

What do I remove for smiley?

I'd almost say rocket

But that'd cost me so much econ in the long run

[knotty zodiac]

when was the last time u tried?

[patent sail]

⛽

[frank grove]

A week or two ago, last time I tried I was doing it in order but that was silly but got past black once

[errant hull]

Merry Christmas

I can’t wait to play Balatro

[regal cave]

When I did mine I started black/plasma and nebula the 3 bad decks.

[errant hull]

I haven’t played in weeks

[terse imp]

why is balatro on an ultrawide lwk kinda fire

[torpid notch]

should i switch swash or flash card for photo?

[humble gulch]

Swash

[torpid notch]

swash is at 49 and flash is at 58

[humble gulch]

Both

Take that sly

🗣️

[torpid notch]

got him now what?

[terse imp]

anyone know how to get 5k support on balala

[hasty harness]

anyone know how to fix?

ive fixed this before doing the same thing but now it says this

[wraith slate]

gotta love when your high card alone beats the blind

[crystal topaz]

Alright onto blue deck red stake

[naive frigate]

W anaglyph

[primal grotto]

square joker and red card have to be the worst jokers in the game

[naive frigate]

How does one come to that conclusion

[primal grotto]

the packs almost always have something more valuable than +3 mult and +4 chips is too little to limit yourself to small hands

[naive frigate]

If you have good eco it's not a problem

Skip celestials without your most played hand

Skip useless spectral or tarots

[primal grotto]

matador and luchador are both kinda nothing but red card and square joker are actively detrimental in >99% of cases

obelisk too

[naive frigate]

Mf said obelisk is useless

😭

[regal cave]

Skill issue on the obelisk as for red card and square they are far from the worst jokers in the game

[naive frigate]

Sorry that you can only play pairslop

[regal cave]

You still have much to learn young padawan

[naive frigate]

And not other hands

Square and red got crazy scaling

[wraith slate]

scaling faster than the blinds with just burnt joker is so funny

[naive frigate]

Thoughts?

[primal grotto]

hit the road is another stinker

[naive frigate]

oh shut up everything that doesn't make your pairslop score 153 billion on ante 1 is bad

Purest ragebait ever

[primal grotto]

i like green joker and ride the bus

runner is cool too

[naive frigate]

Good for you?

[regal cave]

Nah, xmult can never be bad, even flower pot.

You clearly have never been so desperate for xmult that seeing hit the road makes you almost tear up ie you probably don't play gold stake

[naive frigate]

Oh cool you got the c+ achievement want a cookie?

If you've never been in the described situation the fact that you got c+ doesn't disprove the statement

[compact gazelle]

low elo bait
activities of the unskilled :3

[naive frigate]

Now they're going to say that we fell for the ragebait and it wasn't just stupidty

[compact gazelle]

i cant believe you dont have c++ i guess you must just be bad at the game huh
all right everybody settle down you can freely ignore all of this persons takes now, because they havent stickered diet cola or whatever

[primal grotto]

i have been desperate for x mult but not to the point where I'm gonna sacrifice a joker slot for a non guaranteed 2x

[regal cave]

Grind some more then and you'll understand.

[naive frigate]

Do the golden gauntlet

[compact gazelle]

this person has bong in their name. i think its fair to give them the benefit of the doubt and say theyre probably high and thats making them not dumber but more vocally idiotic than usual :D

[naive frigate]

I am high on balatro

[shy tangle]

Cracking open that Buffoon Pack

[primal grotto]

what do you think are the worst jokers if not red card and square?

[compact gazelle]

so hypothetically which jokers could you uh
inhale in the drugs sense

[shy tangle]

The consumables

[regal cave]

Showman probably in a regular run or paraedolia

[compact gazelle]

genuine answer: ask any player worth their salt and the answers are showman idol seance and a few other bottom tiers
deeply profoundly unserious but still not the worst answer: baron and photograph and bloodstone

(baron is a pretty good candidate for the top list of genuine answers as well)

[primal grotto]

yeah they're up there but I think they're useful more often than red card and square

[regal cave]

I have won with regular baron on gold stake a few times, as rare as it is and I have alot of hours in the game so not the worst as much as it rots the brain of people.

[brave goblet]

Dagger gaming (I fed two perishable mega bananas to it)

[compact gazelle]

yea exactly
its not actually the among the absolute worst but its pretty bad and endless mode brainrot is real and dangerous

[brave goblet]

you literally just win if you have red card and/or square

[cosmic sun]

Entire sentence was wrong even pre obelisk

Gotta be ragebait

[brave goblet]

mf said red card and square are "detrimental" ong

[regal cave]

Red card is great and square is meh but having chips is pretty nice at times.

[primal grotto]

oh yeah I forgot seance that one sucks but I'd rather have a joker that does nothing than a joker that limits my hands or makes me skip packs that mostly contain things that are okay

[compact gazelle]

detrimental is a pretty meaningful title for a joker to have we cannot just be handing that label out on a whim

[brave goblet]

with red card, you only take things you would take whether or not you have a red card

[regal cave]

Yeah, the only really detrimental joker is showman that fucks with your packs.

[brave goblet]

if things are just okay, then you judge whether it's worth +3 or if it's worth taking

[cosmic sun]

People only dislike red card cause they overvalue shit in packs

[brave goblet]

and square doesn't prevent you from playing 5 card hands, you can just not scale it for a hand

[cosmic sun]

In general people overvalue too much random shit over consistent strats

[brave goblet]

oh boy! I can't wait to choose between the lovers, the moon, and the star

[compact gazelle]

"limits my hands" "makes me skip packs" ok
ive never heard of these jokers holding you at gunpoint and saying "use all your hands to scale me. now."
not like that would matter much anyway :> since you ought to do that regardless and its worth the $1
but yea you have free will in balatro

[cosmic sun]

Or some weird overfixation on some mechanic like how hands give extra money so it must mean they should never dig for anything using hands

[compact gazelle]

moons too good for speculative blackboard you gotta say sun instead

[brave goblet]

sheeeit you right

speculative bloodstone

[cosmic sun]

Or they focus on the fact that Campfire resets every ante so it must be "bad"

[regal cave]

To be fair, trading 1 gold for 4 chips is legit a bad trade.

[compact gazelle]

"obelisk is bad because if i play badly it goes poof"

🗣️ 🔥

[brave goblet]

who cares about that $1, just use an econ jonker

[cosmic sun]

That's short sighted if those chips add up to good scoring.

[compact gazelle]

bull being a good joker begs to differ

[cosmic sun]

Which you do very consistently with Square

[regal cave]

My bad I'm gonna manifest it in the shop, I forgot I had this power.

[regal cave]

Bull has a good rate of gold/chips.

[brave goblet]

a single gold card in hand nets you $3 which you'd need to use more than 3 hands to dig before it becomes a "loss"

[cosmic sun]

Also in your average run you can still make money while hand scaling things

Not even factoring in the value generators you get over the run

[brave goblet]

bull also actually prevents you from spending money

punished for spending

[compact gazelle]

bull has a rate of 2 chips/$ with the difference being you can spend that money at will

[cosmic sun]

Not limited to econ jokers btw

[primal grotto]

if I have a scaling joker I wanna make it work but I also wanna play flushes and straights and if I open pack with something good I'll think "oh no I missed 3 mult" like that's not a fun way to play imo I don't get why I'm getting this hostility

[cosmic sun]

Devils and purple/blue seals

[zinc sigil]

Wtf

[brave goblet]

wanting to play flushes and straights does not equate to a joker being bad

[compact gazelle]

youre not getting any hostility this is just what i do here :3
and yes
you are just bad@game.

[regal cave]

Yeah but with interest money makes more money, starting with a bull is way way better than starting with square.

[zinc sigil]

Do I keep one of the legendaries for temperance value

[cosmic sun]

I'm not even gonna call them bad I'm just gonna explain why their statement is wrong 🦅

[brave goblet]

where are you gonna get the money to power up your bull if you start with a bull

[zinc sigil]

I have to play for trib no

[brave goblet]

you have to save money to make bull score, and you can't save money cause you probably wanna spend it for other stuff early on

bull builds do NOT rely on hand money to get money lmfao

[cosmic sun]

I don't really wanna scale Bull as much as others tho tbh, and by that logic you would just want blue joker

[regal cave]

Once I get myself a +mult it is all set or even an econ joker. square joker is way more restrictive.

[brave goblet]

how are you gonna get yourself a + mult

[cosmic sun]

Square is only restrictive to you cause you play big hands or smth

[brave goblet]

can't manifest an econ joker, but somehow can manifest a +mult

:thinkies

[regal cave]

big blind/boss blind easy enough

[compact gazelle]

yeah the difference with bull's 2/$ and square's 4per is bull goes by money youve already accumulated and lets you use that money for everything money is used for
whereas square does not scale retroactively, only uses leftover hand money to scale, and doesnt give you the money

[compact gazelle]

im gonna call them bad :3

[brave goblet]

many bulls will be perishable on orange/gold too, while square can never be

[cosmic sun]

I mean you'd be right tbh

[cosmic sun]

The restriction on Bull makes me pick it far less often than Square lol

Ah yes let me try to scale Bull instead of anything else

[naive frigate]

Holy ahit 😭

[cosmic sun]

The reason why Bull is still relevant is because it's a chip joker and you can at least keep it at a reasonable level like +50

[naive frigate]

Don't worry i will rearange the bp's

[knotty zodiac]

is obelisk doable if you stacked hc or guaranteed suicide?

[brave goblet]

doable

[compact gazelle]

the silly part is chip jokers are few and far between enough to the point that the not so good ones are still good

[brave goblet]

very risky

but doable

[regal cave]

That's actually a fair point, although it doesn't really matter since we are comparing their power.

[brave goblet]

but see, bull isn't that much more powerful than square early on

Bull can go down too, square always goes up

[cosmic sun]

That is a high chance of suicide but you could get lucky, you'd need some deck manipulation to make sure you'd never play a HC outside of being lucky.

[knotty zodiac]

and then i assume suicide if not allowed to play pairs

[brave goblet]

with square you throw away hands, but hands are a resource too

hands can farm to-do list, find gold cards and talismans, play lucky cards, lots of things

[cosmic sun]

Well a pair is more avoidable than hc

[compact gazelle]

also plays well with all the other jokers that
yknow
incentivize burning hands

:D

[knotty zodiac]

i mean not allowed to play pair or hc without resetting

[brave goblet]

ye

[knotty zodiac]

since im on a pairless run..

[cosmic sun]

[regal cave]

Yeah but bull scales way faster.

[brave goblet]

Depends

what if you can't make any money

then it doesn't scale at all

[cosmic sun]

The ceiling for bull is so much less relevant

Compared to Square

[compact gazelle]

square also lets you spend that money more freely

[brave goblet]

square always scales, every time

good ole reliable square

[naive frigate]

Anaglyph too easy

[cosmic sun]

If I'm stuck with Bull that bitch is going down to 50 chips

Every time

[regal cave]

Square scales really slowly be real, you need to play 30 hands to get an ice cream.

[cosmic sun]

Cause I want xmult

[compact gazelle]

the big bad psychic on its way to deny the poor weak square joker of a crucial 16 chips

[brave goblet]

Which is fine, because actually it scales at a perfectly reasonable pace so your bus and grimbo will get really, really big

[cosmic sun]

That is a non issue for optimal play tho

[brave goblet]

otherwise you win too fast and miss out on scaling value

[cosmic sun]

Do I even need to say it

The thing people spam every day

[knotty zodiac]

fuck it we try it bc my streak is at 0 rn and its the perfect setup

[compact gazelle]

say it

[brave goblet]

17 high cards is doable

[cosmic sun]

P*ir

[brave goblet]

here's hoping your deck has been fixed

[knotty zodiac]

no pairs allowed

[brave goblet]

I pulled off a 9 hc run before lol

[regal cave]

Bull does that better.

[knotty zodiac]

i think i need to stack hc more

[compact gazelle]

so
that could be just about anything :3

[brave goblet]

Explain

[cosmic sun]

Ah yes Bull does what any standard non scaling chip source does for the run

Not exactly special

[knotty zodiac]

viewed another way, it's an extra ice cream every 2 antes that doesnt take an additional slot

[brave goblet]

if anything, when you think about it, all the money you "save" to power up the bull is money you're not allowed to use, and by extension, money you spent to keep the bull strong

[cosmic sun]

Again Bull is riding on the coattails of being a chip source lol

[brave goblet]

That's all the money you could have used for other stuff, but you can't cause you're keeping it for the bull

[serene forge]

"juggler fucking sucks, why would i ever use a joker for +1 hand size when i can get +5 instead"

[brave goblet]

square has no such restriction

[compact gazelle]

ice cream goes one way square goes the other way
and shocker
squares good because it grows with the score reqs

[regal cave]

Synergize with any econ joker which you obviously want, doesn't have to burn hands to scale on top of that so you get full value, acommodates every hand type. Once you are at 100g you can roll your shop or continue scaling it which makes it akin to an xmult, overwhelming chips is similar to xmult.

[serene forge]

bull is only useful because the scaling is good

look at bootstraps

it fucking sucks

because having to hold money is prohibitive

[compact gazelle]

and also we are dealing with a juggler that scales upwards vs something that scales down

[knotty zodiac]

an extra handagnostic mercury every round and ppl still underrate it 💔

[cosmic sun]

Ah yes the average run closed out with Stuntman and Bull

[brave goblet]

What's wrong with burning hands

You want to burn hands to find your gold, your lucky, your talismans, your steels, all your value generators

[serene forge]

square joker if baron's biggest hater had to redesign it:

[brave goblet]

If anything when you have too much money bull wins too fast lmfao

[compact gazelle]

"ppl" here refers to a subset of individuals unworthy of being called that

:3

[pallid ferry]

i think that just depends on if you have good econ or not, squareman scaling is incredibly reliable because you can scale it anytime and even if it’s slow, it scales relatively the same pace as something like grimbo or rtb

there’s also the points where square is common, bull is uncommon so it appears less often than square, you’re usually not super rich in money a lot of the time unless you have a really good setup (i think?), blah blah, im not good at balatro in the slightest though please correct me if im wrong on anything or if my points are just bad

[brave goblet]

all great points

[regal cave]

That's an eternal debate, at which point are you willing to burn hands to find them? 1,2, 3 gold cards?

[knotty zodiac]

we need an english word for "ppl with clearly incorrect opinions"

[brave goblet]

absolutely

even just one gold card is a pretty good deal

[compact gazelle]

i use "chud" among others
the language of choice rotates

[brave goblet]

3 hands to find 1 gold card is a net even

[serene forge]

you should almost always be trying to greed your value cards if you have any

[naive frigate]

Hmmm

[regal cave]

The only time I burn hands is for blue seal.

[cosmic sun]

People would probably fight you on rarity mattering but I think if judging by pure practicality then yes you will see Square more often

[serene forge]

that's part of why pairs are so good

you can actually afford to greed that

you can't if you need to assemble a bigger hand

or at least not as hard

[knotty zodiac]

something gentler xD

[cosmic sun]

You'd burn hands for blue seal but not square?

Sounds like one step forward two steps back

[compact gazelle]

thats a foreign concept to me :3

[serene forge]

square joker is like a blue seal

[regal cave]

Personally I wouldn't do it for a single gold or even lucky cards, the odds are really bad realistically.

[serene forge]

16 chips a round

[brave goblet]

Burning hands for blue seal, which is essentially gaining chips but for only one hand, unlike square which works for every hand

lmfao

[pallid ferry]

-# hip hip my first balatrocord paragraphs and i get them right

[compact gazelle]

playing a lucky card is net positive

[serene forge]

skill issue plant doesnt counter photochad

[brave goblet]

tbh he won anyway

that's ante 11

[serene forge]

you're not wrong

[naive frigate]

So now you're not only ripping stuff out of context but making up your own

Ig vro

[brave goblet]

it's surprising but photochad is actually just a chad build

[regal cave]

Maybe I should clarify, I wouldn't fish for a gold or a lucky card if I know I have the ante in the bag. The odds are abysmal if you factor everything.

[compact gazelle]

also they arent loudly complaining "waa plant countered me"

which is
good! 👍

[serene forge]

wat

[naive frigate]

I didn't say anything except hmmm

[brave goblet]

factoring in the utter lack of deckfixing clearly

[naive frigate]

You said i have a skill issue bcause photochad isn't countered by plant

[brave goblet]

mf makes one gold card and then proceeds to never see it again, ever, for the rest of the run

[serene forge]

that wasnt me that was a macro

[regal cave]

My bad, I will manifest my death cards in my tarot packs.

[brave goblet]

no purple seals, no tarot gen, no 8 ball, no cartomancer, no econ to reroll the shop

[naive frigate]

I had an ok deck

[brave goblet]

No I'm talking about the guy who won't dig for his gold card

[zinc sigil]

This is the third time im first timing a gold stake on a new deck and I insta win it when im stuck for days on blue and purple

5/15

[naive frigate]

Oh ok

[cosmic sun]

I think you're throwing if you do that, if you're in that position then it means you have the ability to dig. Not only does digging not hurt in that scenario but the returns are worth digging for.

[brave goblet]

bro thinks every deck is green deck

[naive frigate]

Not funny

[cosmic sun]

Again it goes back to overvaluing hand money

[compact gazelle]

you may not wanna fish for 1 or 2 luckies but
in your words when you "factor in everything" its overwhelmingly worth every cost to burn hands to search your deck for all of your value generators
because said value generators encompass everything from speculative money-hit luckies to rebate ranks and blue seal gold cards

[regal cave]

It is a matter of consistency. Not fishing is more consistent.

[knotty zodiac]

it's an error not to dig for gold cards once you have 2 unless youre playing green. the expected value of digging exceeds the value of the extra hands

[brave goblet]

define consistent

[serene forge]

you would know

[cosmic sun]

It's the opposite if you look at DrSpectred gameplay

Bro digs like his life depends on it

[brave goblet]

drspectred is inconsistent cause he always gets away with it /s

[zinc sigil]

if that isnt the dumbest thing in this chat and I chat here a lot

[brave goblet]

unbelievable levels of getting away with it

[cosmic sun]

Not digging is just autopilot gameplay tbh

[naive frigate]

Ig we're slopping the pair

[compact gazelle]

no matter your drawing power you should dig as much as you can every round
and the odds are in your favor to come out with a profit to show for it

[knotty zodiac]

there's very few cases where you need to hit a specific money amount in balatro. most of the time, a little variance for much higher ev is worth

[serene forge]

when you're ahead of the curve you need to do what you can to snowball

and that includes digging for value

if you're not doing that your advantage is going to wither away

[zinc sigil]

does bro know about seals

[brave goblet]

With 3 hands you have a chance to get 1 gold card, that literally pays for all three hands, and you wouldn't be rocking exactly one gold card the whole run

[brave goblet]

Yes, he only digs for blue seals

his words

[serene forge]

they dig for blue seal but won't use hands to scale square joker

[brave goblet]

no gold cards, no luckies, nothing, only blue seals

[serene forge]

for some reason

[cosmic sun]

The extra money in the shop has more variance

than digging

[cloud sinew]

nah

[zinc sigil]

whats the point of a 4 chip square joker per round

[serene forge]

I hate Plasma Deck

[brave goblet]

it scales just slowly enough you can maximize your bus and grimbo and supernova value

[cosmic sun]

Bro said per round

[cloud sinew]

you die later on plasma than on black

[cosmic sun]

Per hand

[zinc sigil]

thats an argument I suppose

[cloud sinew]

because of how easy plasma early game is

[serene forge]

why do you think square scales 4 chips a round

[cloud sinew]

its 16 per round typically

[zinc sigil]

read the message before

[cosmic sun]

It adds up, and it practically costs nothing in the grand scheme of a run.

Don't overvalue hand money or you might have a shittier win rate lol

[zinc sigil]

@cloud sinew

[compact gazelle]

like yea if ive got one gold card one hand to spare and 40 cards in my deck im not gonna hunt for it (disregarding what abysmal actions one must have taken to reach that position)
but optimal play involves finding as many sources of value as you can and totaling all that up you get absolutely no reason not to dig
so when i have a couple gold cards and a couple lucky cards and one more 3 for rebate and a purple seal and a blue seal and some more assorted deck value generating cards (TM) im absolutely going to play every hand every round

[regal cave]

Personally I don't dig for much, that's just my playstyle. I think that only blue seal warrants that value.

[serene forge]

i think hand money really is just the bell curve meme

[zinc sigil]

so you dont play for tarot cards?

[cosmic sun]

A lot of weird balatro semantics over how people rate jokers are over something being overvalued

[brave goblet]

planet tycoon man

[regal cave]

What do you mean?

[brave goblet]

bro doesn't know what tarot cards are

[serene forge]

"i know nothing about hand money or econ"
"hand money is important, i must prioritize it"
"screw hand money, scaling is more useful"

[cloud sinew]

hes called astronomer, hope this helps.

[zinc sigil]

purple seals

[brave goblet]

doesn't know what deckfixing is

[regal cave]

2 discards make purple seal pretty bad honestly, even more if you paly big hands.

[cosmic sun]

"Campfire resets every ante so it's bad"

Common one I see

[cloud sinew]

not at all

[compact gazelle]

"but if i fix my deck how will i play 3 flushes of different suits each round"

[cloud sinew]

you dont have to use your discards first yk

[pallid ferry]

sorry if im interrupting anything, should i try to go for baron or keep going for idol?

[serene forge]

what

[brave goblet]

castle is terrible on blue+ opinoin type beat

[zinc sigil]

so let me ask you how many discards and hands you need to win a gs run your deck of choice

[naive frigate]

Holy run

[pallid ferry]

[cosmic sun]

That one always gets me

[serene forge]

baron is better

[regal cave]

Depends on the hand

[cosmic sun]

The reason that one is so funny to me is cause Roffle hates Castle

[cloud sinew]

castle is just okay

[brave goblet]

okay > terrible

[cosmic sun]

Solely because he got an eternal castle on an endless run or something

So he hates it for an illogical reason

[cloud sinew]

fork found in kitchen ???

[regal cave]

Castle is pretty meh

[compact gazelle]

water drop found in atlantic ocean

[pallid ferry]

okay that’s what i thought ty

[serene forge]

roffle looks like such a good player until you join a livestream

[brave goblet]

he hates dagger too I think lol

[serene forge]

😭

[brave goblet]

his main runs on roffle lite are curated

[cosmic sun]

Surely he still picks it up

[zinc sigil]

I think most of his stream is just him being ragebaited

[cosmic sun]

SURELY

[compact gazelle]

must have accidentally assassinated a baron with one

:3

[brave goblet]

tbh he still is a good player, he's just not super consistent, and of course I'm pretty sure he plays for fun

[cosmic sun]

Roffle might be ragebaiting himself with those content plays

[regal cave]

Dagger is bad too

[zinc sigil]

I hate dagger too simply cause I dont get it

[pallid ferry]

i watch some of his videos this is kinda true lol

[compact gazelle]

bell curve meme with delayed gratification

[brave goblet]

what's there to get?

[serene forge]

he had raised fist and bloodstone in ante 1 once, saw bus in ante 1 or 2, didnt take it, died in ante 4 because he tried playing for bloodstone

[cloud sinew]

"playing for fun" is such a nothing burger. yeah thats what we ALL DO

[cosmic sun]

Not picking up Dagger or Castle can definitely be a hard throw in a lot of situations

[zinc sigil]

why destroy a perfectly good joker for 4 mult

[cosmic sun]

Roffle lite ahhh play

[brave goblet]

no we don't, we play like our lives depend on it /s

[zinc sigil]

or 2 mult most of the time

[serene forge]

nah i think delgrat is pretty universally hated

tbh

[cosmic sun]

If that was on Roffle Heavy though I'd laugh my ass off

[zinc sigil]

I dont understand how dagger is money positive

[cosmic sun]

That is unbelievably stupid

[cloud sinew]

what

[compact gazelle]

from "its ok" to "it sucks and i hate it" to "its ok actually"

[brave goblet]

I ain't using the order on my pair run bruv

[serene forge]

what

[cloud sinew]

why does it have to be money positive

and who said it is

[brave goblet]

contrary to some opinion, most things in balatro cost money

[cosmic sun]

Where the fuck are these Balatro lessons coming from

[zinc sigil]

isnt that what you are looking for

[pallid ferry]

would be better if my gosh darn GLASS WOULD BREAK

[cloud sinew]

no?

[cosmic sun]

I would like to have a word with these Temu Balatro professors

[brave goblet]

What I'm getting is that most people here desperately need to attend balatro university

[serene forge]

i mean even with pairslop people still think delgrat sucks because blue stake just crushes it and getting delgrat value kills your digging ability

[pallid ferry]

i need to start watching more balatro university…

[serene forge]

i would only bother with it with gronkler

[zinc sigil]

Can we stop treating me like a little child and explain how its supposed to work or just leave it be

[serene forge]

or in like

[compact gazelle]

its roughly the same +1/$ as the other scalers with a better average and some caveats including "you need money" and "its uncommon"
andolth explained it nicely once

[serene forge]

super early game

[cloud sinew]

i dont think there is a "money positive" mult scaler twin

[cosmic sun]

They attending them online community colleges that keeps getting spammed in ads

[brave goblet]

it's just the joker version of red card

[cosmic sun]

BNHU

[crystal topaz]

Aight finished red stake blue deck as well, time for sleep

[wintry igloo]

ggs orange stake

time for the mighty gold

[serene forge]

bootstraps is money positive because it is bad and makes you lose and puts you in round 0 where you have 4 dollars

[compact gazelle]

someones gonna say "but bootstraps"

[cloud sinew]

how what is supposed to work?

[brave goblet]

dagger

[zinc sigil]

I get it so you need econ for it to work in the first place so you cant really pick it up early to scale it?

[brave goblet]

sure you can

[serene forge]

you can

[cloud sinew]

you buy jokers and you destroy them to get mult

[zinc sigil]

By being a healthy adult

[serene forge]

it's like red card

[compact gazelle]

its ok because it gives money :D

[brave goblet]

my +86 dagger from my screenshot just now was bought in round 2 lmao

[cloud sinew]

TWIN

[regal cave]

It is bad, don't listen to them, it kills your eco even on gold stake with rentals.

[cosmic sun]

I can but I just wanna know how you came to that conclusion

[crystal topaz]

Okay nah let's give it one try on green stake blue deck

[cosmic sun]

I wanna how how you came to that conclusion as well lol

[pallid ferry]

they’re indestructible only when i want them to break i swear

[brave goblet]

tehre are so many mindboggling opinions here

[serene forge]

dagger is good because this can happen

[zinc sigil]

Buy joker to kill joker to get mult when the first joker might be capable of giving you a weaker effect without the need to destroy

[ebon condor]

i have never had an unorthodox opinion thankfully

[cloud sinew]

how do rentals kill your econ for dagger?
$1 a round for 2 mult is not going to do that

[zinc sigil]

killing jokers is killing money

[brave goblet]

might

[brave goblet]

you didn't kill a joker, you powered up your dagger

get the facts straight

[cloud sinew]

youre trading money for mult, its not killing anything.

[serene forge]

me when i need to spend money to scale my scoring:

[brave goblet]

spenidng money is bad

[cosmic sun]

Maybe when people say "money is king" people really do take it the wrong way

[brave goblet]

spending hands is bad

[zinc sigil]

but is 1$/1 Mult a good trade?

[regal cave]

Need an extra slot to feed it, will kill your eco unless you have an econ joker. terrible as a starting scalign joker.

[cloud sinew]

Yes...?

[zinc sigil]

rtb grimbo take no money for mult

[serene forge]

bull and bootstraps are the only god jokers you dont need to spend money for them 😎

[naive frigate]

I lowk just eralised that suqare joker is good for any build that doesn't rely on 5 card hands

[brave goblet]

yeah they do, they took your hand money lmao

[cloud sinew]

unused hands give $1

[compact gazelle]

its the rate that bus green and nova provide

[zinc sigil]

I see

[zinc sigil]

ur right

I was wrong

thanks

[brave goblet]

you won't need square if you play 5 card hands

[pallid ferry]

just got mime that seems good

[brittle temple]

temperance value yippe

[serene forge]

2nd best dagger usecase

[cloud sinew]

nah

[cosmic sun]

Yet people still take it because it could genuinely be all you have, people still take Swashbuckler Egg even though it takes up two slots but it's a source of scaling.

[compact gazelle]

mamo i love this about you
i dont think anyone else in this server has said those three words before :3

[naive frigate]

Why not tho

[zinc sigil]

wouldve expected this to be bloodstone

[brave goblet]

swash egg got a second side effect (temperance goated)

[serene forge]

bigger hands usually dont need the chips as much

[cosmic sun]

indeed temp goated

[ebon condor]

bus and groker are money positive with an econ joker that gives you at least $1 per hand played

[cloud sinew]

4oak/3oak/two pair have good enough chips scaling that they dont really need square at all

[serene forge]

that includes 3oak/4oak

[zinc sigil]

I mean I really want to learn the game and its mechanics but people attack me for not knowing thinking I ego in here when Im basically new to the game

I dont get it

[brave goblet]

square 4oak 🔥

[naive frigate]

#🕹・game-discussion mfs when they have to scroll up 5 messages

[regal cave]

I'd rather take a common +mult, it will be better for me.

[compact gazelle]

best usecase: knifing bloodstone
2nd best usecase: knifing rental bloodstone
:3

[cosmic sun]

It's cause you said that on top of someone else having a hot take in here lmao

[cloud sinew]

people arent attacking you for not knowing things, theyre correcting you for saying things that are wrong.
"idk" is different to saying an incorrect statement.

[cosmic sun]

People were just wondering how people came to these conclusions

[naive frigate]

True

[serene forge]

its so funny to me when people say they use 2 pair because of square joker

[zinc sigil]

''yes...'' implies im fucking stupid

[compact gazelle]

learning 💖
you didnt do anything wrong people are just passive aggressive with their feedback here

[ancient gyro]

rtb in abandoned

[cloud sinew]

no the fuck it does not twin

[brave goblet]

all on you

[cloud sinew]

if people think youre stupid theyll just say that

[brave goblet]

don't forget just as you may misinterpret others' texts, so can others misinterpret the tone of your text

[cloud sinew]

theyre not shy

[cosmic sun]

Yeah you would, doesn't mean you should never take Dagger.

[zinc sigil]

Its alright, I tend to ask succulent and buscrasher most of the time cause they are super nice most of the time and patient too

[cosmic sun]

There are instances where I take Flash Card even

And very rarely Bootstraps

[serene forge]

i think baron hater just undervalues a lot of things

[regal cave]

See, I love flash card personally

[willow frost]

yeah

[serene forge]

like riff raff