#KSRe

1 messages · Page 3 of 1

limber light
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rocket science is just the base game science but it doesnt get spent, it lasts forever

hybrid tartan
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right

limber light
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and it has categories

hybrid tartan
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so if I gain +2 rocket science, is that both +2 rocket science and regular science?

limber light
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yup

hybrid tartan
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and vice versa, if I get some science experiments done, that's rocket science I guess for whatever category that falls under

limber light
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ye

hybrid tartan
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ah cool

limber light
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u can repeat the experiments now too

hybrid tartan
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ye I saw that but how does that work? Won't it be easy science or is there a limit in some way

limber light
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try it :p

hybrid tartan
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fair lol

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gonna brb for a bit, but will be back to test more things

limber light
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thx for this, it helps a lot, take your time

hybrid tartan
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np :) glad I can be helpful

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wait is therapy a legit thing btw for kerbals

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I just noticed lmao

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more so I lost a guy because it didn't let me undo and now I'm seeing therapy on my kerbals

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I also notice if I press 'attitude' a few times, they turn blue and explode, I presume I'm.. reprimanding them or something? Like making them quit? Or it's a bug lol

limber light
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yeah therapy is real

hybrid tartan
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dang

limber light
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they get "upset" if kerbals are lost

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oh they're supposed to turn grey not blue

hybrid tartan
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oh might be just me lol

limber light
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idk, they were definitely blue for a while LOL

hybrid tartan
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oh lmao

limber light
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but i thought i fixed it

hybrid tartan
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is it them getting low in mood?

limber light
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but yea if u keep like harassing them they get mad

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u can ask the kerbals in your agency anything but the other ones dont like it

hybrid tartan
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is there a reason to harrass them lol? Or is it just a thing you can do for some reason

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o

limber light
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yeah u can find out what kind of damage they have taken, and what their resistance is

hybrid tartan
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ah okay

limber light
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the idea is to use another kerbal to interact

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for the ones outside the player agency

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the social mechanics are barebones rn but theres something at least

hybrid tartan
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so if I just use diagnostics with only the one kerbal is it like the player talking to them?

limber light
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exactly yeh

hybrid tartan
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kk

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only thing I'd say is it isn't that clear, but since it's barebones at the minute not really essential

limber light
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if u control one and do it on another kerbal nearby they are like talking

hybrid tartan
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makes sense

limber light
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yea thx

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all of this is great bc it tells me what i need to put in the tutorial

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i covered most of the stuff i told u but will need to add this

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its not rly a huge deal tho until u get further into space

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i swear this stuff almost makes u go crazy, i seem to fix things and then they break again

hybrid tartan
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ah

limber light
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the weirdest bugs show up in the redux update that were never there before

hybrid tartan
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for tutorials, would it be possible to get a tutorial the first thing the 'thing' happens?

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like let's say a mood of a kerbal drops, have a tutorial play telling you to check them

limber light
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good idea yeh

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i'd like to replace the cadet orientation with a modded one

hybrid tartan
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same with parts if a part gets busted for first time, get player to check it, just lil things like that

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o ye

limber light
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ya thats the ideal solution

hybrid tartan
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I think main issue for me is if it's all crammed into one tutorial, I'll remember some and forget others, but if it shows up when I need it I'll remember it

limber light
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or these days if some content creator enjoys it, they would make vids

hybrid tartan
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ye

limber light
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right true

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the tutorials are maybe information overload already

hybrid tartan
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it might be just me tho, but I just find it that I learn better when I get to do it

limber light
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yeah for sure

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my idea is that players can discover and figure out everything, but i think i overestimated this

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its bc i already know all the mechanics, so i forget how much there is to figure out

hybrid tartan
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yee

limber light
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tried to simplify it as much as possible tho

hybrid tartan
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I think it starts to make sense once you have some knowledge how things work

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like just knowing the basic ui, the general need for repairs, that kerbals have emotional needs or so on, the others sorta come naturally to experimenting

limber light
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oki cool

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most of this is from tutorial 1

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so i think i roughly covered it

hybrid tartan
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ye

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overall this mod is like a bunch of mods put together lol

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like it has so many elements to it

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so it's bound to take some time to get used to everything

limber light
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yup, its a total overhaul

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ideally it would be modular and separated, but everything has to work together

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and i have to prioritise the bare minimum to even get it done

hybrid tartan
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makes sense

limber light
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trying to resurrect an abandoned game :p

hybrid tartan
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honestly there's a good amount of mods of KSP1 that are just too complex to me, when comes to realism or such

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but this mod doesn't look like that to me

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it seems pretty balance on the gamified part of realism

limber light
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awesome

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i never played most of those as they dont appeal to me, i wanted something simpler but more comprehensive

hybrid tartan
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yee

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there's a middle ground between more complex than vanilla but not too complex when it's unwieldly I think

limber light
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ya thats the goal

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definitely let me know if something is too complex

hybrid tartan
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will do :)

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btw dunno if I'm misunderstanding, but engineering says [+75%] Level 3, but haven't got engineering level 3 requirement for research, so do I need it above level 3 or something?

limber light
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o right

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can u screenshot the tech tree?

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and press G to show the app inside r&d building

hybrid tartan
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o useful

limber light
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aw man other resolutions ruined the layout

hybrid tartan
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ah

limber light
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those are supposed to be on tier 2, o well

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this is odd

hybrid tartan
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yeah wasn't sure if it was me or not lol

limber light
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ya it looked even worse for the redux dev

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im not on widescreen lol

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can u check the PAL tech "giant leap"

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its the first one on the left

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center of tree

hybrid tartan
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screenshot it?

limber light
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oh just see what it says

hybrid tartan
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I don't have lvl 2 impacts

limber light
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hmm maybe aviation utility at the bottom?

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i think this is one of those things again, it definitely used to work

hybrid tartan
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as in what requirements I need?

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so aviation utilities says I need level 1 landing gear but idk where to get that

limber light
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ya just see if its available

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ok its in the science menu

hybrid tartan
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oh ok sry

limber light
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u should def have level 1 landing gear by now, i think

hybrid tartan
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presumably the plane landing gear? cause I don't have any research like that I don't think

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aside from ly-05 if that's it

limber light
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oh u used the rover wheel

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basically im just trying to see if theres any other techs where u met the prerequisite level but its not available to research

hybrid tartan
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level 2 life science - aquatic sciences

limber light
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k

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damn

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do u mind sending the log again

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or just checking if theres errors

hybrid tartan
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and level 2 space propulsion - monopropellant drive

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and sure

limber light
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yup ok its bugged

hybrid tartan
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I presume none of the rocket science is counting for research?

limber light
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11mb o my

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yea it seems its not registering it

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the techs u unlocked didnt have the new prerequisites, i think

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also the first 2 techs vanished on the screen somehow

hybrid tartan
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oh

limber light
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oooo fresh errors ty

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ok this will be fixed in next update as well, just gimme a bit

hybrid tartan
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oki no worries :)

limber light
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i think u hit the tech cap for non-bugged ones

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so might have to release the update after this

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so u can continue

hybrid tartan
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tech cap?

limber light
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yeh well there arent many techs left

hybrid tartan
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oh right yeah

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p much

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only step forward is having a rocket n only such much I can do with seperators lol

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but no rush I'll be playin something else until then

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pretty much what I'll do if I run into a cruical bug lol just glad I can help

limber light
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thx so much for this

hybrid tartan
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np!

limber light
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ill have the update out today 🙂

hybrid tartan
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awesome, like said no rush though!

limber light
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oh did u notice any bugs with the app?

hybrid tartan
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if I hit right arrow too many times I had it appear blank

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so I had to switch scenes to fix

limber light
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oki, do u remember which button

hybrid tartan
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company/agency change button

limber light
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oh right ty

hybrid tartan
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np

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btw is it recommended to be playing on 100% science? rn I'm on 80% but just realising I might not have enough for solid fuel lol

limber light
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first time yea i wouldn't reduce it

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but its a personal thing rly

hybrid tartan
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kk fair

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it seems like science is more balanced than vanilla, I was just playing assumption at first it was gonna be similar

limber light
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i mean the end techs are hitting 10k science

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u can reduce if u want but i wouldnt lol

hybrid tartan
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damn sounds fun

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like legit, I like goals hehe

limber light
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it might be ok in the beginning but mid-game u will want the science i think

hybrid tartan
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sure

limber light
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its definitely not super easy like the base game

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but theres also a lot more science out there

hybrid tartan
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yee

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is most the requirements locked behind rocket science levels now or is there mission requirements still for later on?

limber light
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oh yeah its all rocket science, i removed the mission requirements from redux temporarily

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as i added this system a year or two ago

hybrid tartan
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alright

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I hesitantly suggest that there could be goals to reach a certain planet or moon to be able to progress further in research tree in the eventual mid/late tree but up to you really

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or a rocket science that improves with the amount of different biomes, moons and planets you been to, if not already a thing, having that be a requirement for late game

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but again just ideas, current system might already cover all basis lol

limber light
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ok, sort of yes

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basically there are milestones now, u might have discovered them already

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so when u go to different planets and biomes u earn science from the milestones

hybrid tartan
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ahh ye that works

limber light
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but generally with the rocket science, its related to the technology

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like u can unlock the first landing gear normally, but if u want more advanced landing gear, u need those levels in rocket science from using it

hybrid tartan
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right, makes sense

limber light
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so as u test those parts it leads to more advanced versions of the parts

hybrid tartan
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sounds cool :)

limber light
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ya

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i think it makes more sense

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rather than like doing all the temperature scans on the mun to unlock a bigger engine, u have to use smaller engines a bit more

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its still a bit flexible tho, hopefully

hybrid tartan
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yee

limber light
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ok can i ask

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when u first loaded into the vab, that vessel

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are there like 12 parts in symmetry or something

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or just some idea of what the vessel is like

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maybe sepratrons?

hybrid tartan
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most recent vechicle I presume?

limber light
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i think i have it, its the sepratrons

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the first one

hybrid tartan
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what do you need?

limber light
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oki nvm sorry lol

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fixed it already

hybrid tartan
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oh okay np lol

limber light
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this might even fix the load freezing

hybrid tartan
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o nice

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one question, just reading thru tumblr,
'ignition failure' I see that's higher and lower depending on fuel, trying to work out what that is, is it like it'll stop mid fire or just won't fire at all? And is it based on other things like part grade or?

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sry if dumb question, just smth I've not come across

limber light
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ok yeah if ignition fails the engine doesnt fire

hybrid tartan
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and can you just attempt to start it again?

limber light
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well yes

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how to explain without spoiling

hybrid tartan
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kk, then I presume it's mostly just an issue in multiple engine setups

limber light
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when u ignite the engine it takes damage

hybrid tartan
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ohh okay

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makes sense

limber light
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if it fails and u keep trying to relight it, it keeps taking damage

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then boom

hybrid tartan
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gotcha

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me when the nuclear engine explodes because I reingited it 10 times over

limber light
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OOH

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how did i never think of that

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if a nuclear engine explodes the whole vessel should probably explode too

hybrid tartan
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yee or something catastrophic

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added: radiation damage to kerbals

limber light
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kerbal chernobyl

hybrid tartan
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lmao oh no

limber light
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radiation damage isnt implemented yet :p

hybrid tartan
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oh boy yet

limber light
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its definitely planned

hybrid tartan
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sweet

limber light
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oh yeah also with ignition, there is ullage

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so if u try to light the engine in zero g it has a much higher chance of failing ignition

hybrid tartan
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ohh

limber light
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like with that spacex starship flight

hybrid tartan
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if you can't tell I really don't know how stuff works in the real world pfff so it's all a learning curve for me

limber light
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perfect

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u r exactly the type of player i needed to test this lol

hybrid tartan
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great :P

limber light
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the mod is designed to help u learn this stuff

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like ksp is with spaceflight, but taken to the next level

hybrid tartan
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yeye

limber light
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and also to annoy veterans less bc its not so unrealistic :p

hybrid tartan
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lmao

limber light
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(the base game annoys me endlessly with this)

hybrid tartan
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that's fair

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I think just general lack of life support in anyway in base game would be for me

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just adding food adds that bit more to it

limber light
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o yea, agreed

hybrid tartan
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otherwise kerbals are just glorified probes

limber light
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this has food and water atm

hybrid tartan
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yee

limber light
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respiration is planned, it was just more complicated

hybrid tartan
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ohh mann

limber light
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pressurized cabins, airlocks and oxygen consumption

hybrid tartan
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dang

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hopefully it won't go over my head when it comes lol

limber light
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naw

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i had that in the ksp version of the mod

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its just that the ksp2 part UI in flight is completely different so i gotta redesign that

hybrid tartan
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yee

limber light
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and other stuff is easier to implement rn

hybrid tartan
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that's fair

limber light
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its rly just the UI

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ksp had a multi-slider so i could display oxygen, co2 and inert gases all together

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so the cabin atmosphere is dynamic and contains a mix of gases

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not just oxygen

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and u can do a pure oxygen cabin or just like normal air, with different pressures

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anyway yeh its easier to use than it sounds

hybrid tartan
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aight that's fair

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I'm afraid I might just have to ask a bunch of questions if I get stuck >:P

limber light
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sure

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i try to make every mechanic as simple as possible

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but together they become a pretty huge thing

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ok the 11mb log file is mainly due to a small piece of code which i have no idea why is even there or how it got there

hybrid tartan
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lmao okay

limber light
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i swear this update its like someone else coded it

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[WRN 19:58:31.381] [Simulation] [ResourceDefinitionDatabase > AddOrUpdateDefinition(...)] cannot add Recipe Kerolox when database is frozen

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there may be an issue with orbital survey freezing

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might wanna test without that for a bit to narrow it down

hybrid tartan
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alright

limber light
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theres also definitely some type of issue with the sepratron

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did they work alright in game?

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alright im at the r&d bug

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this log is massive

hybrid tartan
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sepratrons seemed to work fine

limber light
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ok ty

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ill just ignore it and test them thoroughly later, tho sepratron debris could be the freeze issue

hybrid tartan
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alright

limber light
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i just cant work out what is causing that error

limber light
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maybe the unity update changed how some linq is handled

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stuff that shouldn't have worked before did work but now it doesnt, with null refs

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or probably more likely the project using newer .net version

hybrid tartan
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ah

limber light
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thats where u can see the science from the mission

vague mica
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I like

limber light
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looks ugly bc its placeholder but functional

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thats what its meant to look like

hybrid tartan
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ahh

limber light
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i laid it all out carefully but the variance in resolutions ruined it lol

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it fits at 1920x1080 at least

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[LOG 10:44:19.410] [KSRe] Felipe Kerman :alien:

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wtf

vague mica
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what prereqs???

limber light
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my linq is absolutely horrid, never gonna contest that

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ya thats a bug with the prereqs, i just fixed it

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but basically u need that level in rocket science

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open the app and check in the science menu of your agency

vague mica
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oh got it

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genuinely how far away do you need to go to get out of the KSC and into the beach 🥀

limber light
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oh its a long drive

vague mica
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gaaaaaaa

limber light
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like 10 min

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well

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if u go south anyway

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i never tried north

vague mica
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yeah, or 15 seconds if you use the teleport menu klueless

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wheel still managed and break and he's taking a surface sample of the air but ok

limber light
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1 foot on the ground still counts

vague mica
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also your mod is breaking the rever tbutotn I think

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it works fine without your mod

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so idk

limber light
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starting to suspect it yeh

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is there debris there tho?

vague mica
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is there a way to cheat my crews back

limber light
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i mean yea

vague mica
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oh it looks like a new guy just spawned in

limber light
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sandbox or exploration?

vague mica
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exploration

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and it's only broken after a disaster

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I think specifically after the root part breaks but not sure

limber light
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oooh

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thats sounds logical

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can u send log when it breaks

vague mica
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will do that next time it happens

limber light
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thx

vague mica
limber light
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lol

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i like how u put effort into making it stable with the wide wheelbase

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and the game just said "nope"

vague mica
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never gonna believe it

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adding another pair of seps fixed the issue

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lmao

cyan dawn
vague mica
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ah shit I blew it up but yeah it's broken

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oh no the log is too big to upload

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hold on

limber light
crude pilot
vague mica
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so big it's even lagging out notepad

limber light
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its the string.format bug

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i dont even know how that got there

vague mica
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yeah it is

limber light
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let me do another update first

vague mica
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notepad is dying but here

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it's just this over and over again

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the log is 225 MB wtf lifesupport

limber light
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i dont think that bug should even have compiled

vague mica
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what if u just

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didn't code bugs

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changed the fuel amount in the SRBs and it's flipping again lol

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I suspect that it's just too light so the suspension is flipping out

limber light
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ghost bug

vague mica
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retard kerman

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lost like 7 pilots but whatever I got the science and that's all that matters

cyan dawn
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also if you turn sideways with wheels you get a sideways boost for some reason

vague mica
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drifting

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KSP is not a serious game bruh

limber light
#

lots of therapy for those kerbs

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do u just keep waiting for the vets to respawn

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so many fixes

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finally i can test that new feature i was trying to implement lol

limber light
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apparently stage numbers in this game are not designed to be tracked

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every time u separate the stage just becomes stage 1

vague mica
#

the vets are not spawning fsr

vague mica
limber light
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proof that i can actually play the game

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flies gud

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okay my log is error free time to update

vague mica
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can you send the bug-free build pls

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pweeeeas

limber light
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no bugs on my end

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ur turn

limber light
vague mica
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no they didn't quit

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they were vaporized

limber light
#

okay

vague mica
#

no need for a new save files right

limber light
#

let me see if i can fix this "bug"

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naw updates shouldn't ever break saves

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some may need vessels to be recovered, but thats rare

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i used to have this massively long method that would auto-update saves for new updates, fortunately it is now gone

vague mica
#

surviving fine with helmet off...?

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past 70 km

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that's definitely a bug of all time

limber light
#

is damage enabled?

vague mica
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default "normal" difficulty settings

limber light
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thats such a good screenshot tbh

vague mica
#

if you say so lol

limber light
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ya

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im kind to my kerbals

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th way the eyes are popping out of the head

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k i didnt add space exposure damage for the eva seat yet

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when not wearing a helmet

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also dont think there is high g-force damage for kerbals yet

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as for the heating i would expect some explosions, maybe

vague mica
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by the way, yes, the bug is fixed

limber light
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which 1

vague mica
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revert bug

limber light
#

wonderful

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i didnt even attempt that one

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now the bugs fix themselves

vague mica
limber light
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the base game is sneakily resetting the kerbal spawn cap somewhere

vague mica
#

uh oh

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new crews are not spawning in anymore

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oh I lied

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I've observed it several times, where are my levellllls

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I need the dunker

limber light
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the what

vague mica
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the dunker science experiment

limber light
#

marine lab?

vague mica
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also you can break this window by scrolling too far on the space center option thinfgy

vague mica
vague mica
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also tracking station is not in the low-level KSC but you can still access it from the [esc] menu

limber light
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ok right

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marine lab should be just level 2 biology

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can u replicate the app going blank

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and yeh ik about the tracking station

vague mica
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I just got it to level 3 and it's still locked

vague mica
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scroll too far on this one

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either way works

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yeah the level tech stuff is totally broken lol

limber light
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still?

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did u update

vague mica
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yes

limber light
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hm, it worked on my end

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do u know how to send the save file

vague mica
limber light
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thx

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your feedback has been great btw

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idk why i didnt add g force and space exposure in eva seats yet but ill try in a bit

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sometimes i just forget

vague mica
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also you should add a thing where kerbonauts can only have their visors up in the sun for a certain amount of time before they get sunburn

limber light
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would be cool but visors arent rendered 🙁

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getting the helmets and jetpacks working was difficult for how simple it should be

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and they're still buggy af

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also, u might wanna uninstall shoemaker mod

vague mica
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errrr

limber light
#

oh now its clearing out the old vessel events

vague mica
#

oh nvm it's inside patchers and plugins

limber light
#
          {
            "name": "kys",```
vague mica
#

kys

limber light
#

kerbal yeeting simulator???

vague mica
#

yes

limber light
#

time to figure out how to hot-swap save files

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copy paste the data into mine i think

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weird, didnt work

limber light
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found a bug

limber light
#

ok fixed

limber light
#

forgot i already added tox production to kerbals

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just not the full respiration formula

limber light
#

had to do up a hotfix for that science issue and 1 other thing

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techs should unlock now

hybrid tartan
#

awesome :O

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yerrpp I can research now pog

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oh and the research tree resolution is fixed now ig?

limber light
#

it is?

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may have been some other bug causing it if so

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i even think the save freezing was caused by something completely unrelated, this game can be unusual like that

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basically the milestones were being triggered when a vessel is first loaded into flight scene and throwing errors

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anyways glad its working, the feedback has been great so far

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hopefully now the testing has helped get the mod into a more playable and enjoyable state for most players, so i can go back to adding new features

hybrid tartan
#

nice, yee hopefully

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only bug can mention so far is still some buttons of the life app will lead to empty app if you press too much times, but it's not detrimental

hybrid tartan
#

confused on repairing tho

#

attempting to repair something, starts repairing supposedly, have the repair bits n no errors, but then nothing seems to happen

hybrid tartan
#

it looks like it flashes between 'new' and the old status (like worn) but doesn't get any benefits (like it breaks shortly after despite the repair)

hybrid tartan
#

okay I've realised now that it just takes a longg time to repair, but then running into issues of kerbals getting tired after just repairing a single wheel? Plus the time it's going to repair wheels, and considering automated rovers aren't going to have crew, I gotta wonder if repairing is gonna cause issues in future or if it gets easier with later game stuff

hybrid tartan
#

need help to figure out ignition failure though.. using hypergolic fuel but engine refuses to ignite in vacuum so how do I get this to work

limber light
#

ok

#

when the app goes blank can u check the log and just paste the error? probably the easiest way for that

#

repairs yeh they should take up to an hour in-game time i think, so u will need timewarp

#

but if the part isn't damaged enough it won't repair, i should add better feedback for that

hybrid tartan
#

ah okay

limber light
#

i think a kerbal shouldn't be getting completely fatigued within an hour tho, unless they already in bad health

hybrid tartan
#

how do you un-fatigue? Would going back into seat do that or nah?

proud tendon
#

guys how i can have 75m/s with only cube and that i want to cry

limber light
#

depends on the crew part, EVA seat doesn't give them rest

proud tendon
#

on the ground*

hybrid tartan
#

ah okay

limber light
#

u need good wheels 🙂

hybrid tartan
#

some seperatrons with the second level of rover wheels should be all you need

proud tendon
#

i have only that please

limber light
#

they can rest in piloting parts if u enable hibernation basically

hybrid tartan
#

ah oki

#

ty

limber light
#

as for ignition failure, hypergolic engines shouldn't fail ignition - does it give a notification?

#

it might be missing fuel

#

with the wheels, check the impact tolerance, going too fast will destroy them

#

but for 75m/s its much easier with the fixed landing gear or the larger rover wheel

hybrid tartan
#

it did say failed ignition

#

but I'll have a look

limber light
#

o.O

#

okay

#

with the radial twitch?

hybrid tartan
#

would same thing pop up if incorrect fuel or nah?

limber light
#

naw without the right fuel nothing will happen

hybrid tartan
#

hmm ok

limber light
#

check delta v in the vab

#

if u got the fuel right it will show up

proud tendon
#

i gonna try this...

limber light
#

it will wobble 😛

#

u can at least lock the wheel steering

proud tendon
#

ok

hybrid tartan
#

btw got this annoying bug where delta v doesn't show until launching then reverting back to vab, but might be a ksp 2 bug in general

limber light
#

hmm i guess it is kind of a big jump from 3m/s to 75m/s in the missions

hybrid tartan
#

^ can be hard for first time, at least took me a bit until I learnt more about progressing research first

limber light
#

true

#

thx for the feedback, ill rebalance it

hybrid tartan
#

np

#

either rebalance or someway pointing the player towards researching more, not sure

limber light
#

i mean the primary missions are meant to be a challenge

#

it kinda goes from being near impossible on those parts above, to being easy on the other wheels, iirc

hybrid tartan
#

mm yee

#

that's why I kinda wonder if it's just about needing more explanation to getting the second rover wheels

limber light
#

but even if u try and fail u will gain rocket science and then can unlock the parts

hybrid tartan
#

ye

limber light
#

i mean this is the game basically

#

set a goal, try to reach it, fail a few times, figure it out, repeat

#

as long as each goal is within reach

hybrid tartan
#

that's fair

limber light
#

and the secondary missions are meant to sort of lead up to the primary ones as well

hybrid tartan
#

I actually find the beach one harder lol

#

still haven't done it yet, wheels always break before I reach with A grade wheel parts

#

but now I get repairing it might be easy

limber light
#

yeah the beach is confusing

#

its bc the ksc region is so big, idk if i can fix that

hybrid tartan
#

ah

#

I swear I'm going crazy

#

so I have spark engine, with right ratios of fuel

#

it works fine

#

I reset back to launch, attempt to launch, suddenly all the tanks have oxidizer instead

limber light
#

ohhh

#

that would be v-swift

#

the part switcher

hybrid tartan
#

so is it a bug?

limber light
#

idk yet

#

will have to look into that

#

i think revert in general is sketchy, or was in base game anyway

hybrid tartan
#

ah oki

limber light
#

ohh i think i remember now

#

u gotta revert to vab, not revert to launch, iirc

#

the redux ppl aren't working on mod support yet so it might be a while before any v-swift issue could be addressed

#

but ill have to work out whether its my configs or v-swift first

hybrid tartan
#

gotcha

#

yeah vab works fine

limber light
#

ok yep, thats what i always did

#

the base game revert to launch was always just too buggy

#

i hope the rocket vehicle start is overall fun for ppl tho

#

i think its a nice way to ease into the mod and the game

#

since everyone knows how a car works, but not necessarily a rocket

hybrid tartan
#

alrighty

#

it's def taking me some goes to try work out how to get these low tiers to work enough

#

I think I might just farm more science until I get better thrusters tho

limber light
#

ya

#

science farming is definitely encouraged 🙂

#

every launch should give up some

hybrid tartan
#

every progress is progress, even in the state of failure just like real life I guess

limber light
#

ye exactly, its meant to be like that

hybrid tartan
#

yee

#

until funds eventually come.. then suffering

limber light
#

crashing can even give u more science from impacts

hybrid tartan
#

but until then

#

o right

limber light
#

as long as u recover the debris :p

hybrid tartan
#

and if there isn't any then no science?

limber light
#

a lot less yeh

hybrid tartan
#

interesting

limber light
#

i wanna balance that better tho, so u always get some

hybrid tartan
#

sure

limber light
#

rocket science from part destruction

hybrid tartan
#

yee

#

oh also

#

I had problems with parachutes, or so, they kept being destroyed with a slow/very slow descent, after a while

#

I'm guessing it might be intentional and might be something I'm not understanding

limber light
#

yup, chutes take damage when deployed

#

but this was the last thing i added last year before taking a break, so it may need more balancing

hybrid tartan
#

kk

#

I imagine part grades effect it too?

#

and if so, if a parachute breaks on a mission, does the part grade change at all or does it need to come back in one piece?

limber light
#

yeh u need to recover parts to increase the grade

hybrid tartan
#

rough

limber light
#

its like, returning them to the manufacturer with data on how they performed

hybrid tartan
#

right

#

and does it stack if I have many of the same parts all get recovered or nah?

limber light
#

but i guess recovery shouldn't be required

#

ya more parts means more data

hybrid tartan
#

oki

#

only issue I have really is that parachutes were dying after 10k or so drop

#

but I might find a solution for that

limber light
#

okay it might be a bit high

#

the goal is basically, if you deploy a bad quality parachute at maximum altitude and it takes 10 min to descend, it will probably break

hybrid tartan
#

I'm fine if it's just cause the grade is really bad tho, I guess it depends what higher grade is like

#

ah okay

#

I don't mind it too much then

#

just requires figuring out how to upgrade your stuff

limber light
#

yea, u can just deploy them lower

hybrid tartan
#

ye

limber light
#

parachute faults are kinda awkward tho i guess, due to how they are used and take damage

hybrid tartan
#

out of interest do part grades effect egine speed or thrust or anything or is it more about durability?

limber light
#

rn its just durability, in the future im planning to alter part stats as well

hybrid tartan
limber light
#

good idea

hybrid tartan
#

like me having 4 parachutes actually made it worse because it was going slower

limber light
#

yea chutes are more about speed than time

hybrid tartan
#

so it broke earlier

limber light
#

true, right, i got u

hybrid tartan
#

ye :)

limber light
#

tons of good feedback

hybrid tartan
#

awesome

limber light
#

also need to add drag damage, like max q

#

some stuff just isnt implemented yet

hybrid tartan
#

gotcha

#

do part grades effect ingition failure btw?

limber light
#

not rn

#

zero g is the main factor, if ur in space already

#

(ullage)

hybrid tartan
#

oki

#

obv no where near there yet, but with cryo engine, would it be about attempting to light it until it works, and repairing it in between if it refuses to light?

limber light
#

yea

#

failure isnt that high if u approach it right

hybrid tartan
#

oh?

limber light
#

the first ignition is almost guaranteed, but in zero g, and as the part takes damage, the chance lowers drastically

#

i mean first stage ignition

#

also multiple relights lower it

hybrid tartan
#

ah I see

#

mm okay found a new problem I'm running into lol, so after a while of falling my craft just immediately implodes? I guess the whole thing is taking damage?

limber light
#

interesting

hybrid tartan
#

I'm using a solid fuel booster as my base so maybe I just need to upgrade its grade?

limber light
#

can u check the flight report

hybrid tartan
#

essentially I was using two parachutes, I use one to slow down, then when it gets destroyed I use my other one, this worked until the whole craft just exploded into nothing

#

looks like the control piece gets destroyed e.e

vague mica
#

it's better when you don't do that

limber light
#

is the drogue attached to the probe

hybrid tartan
#

no, the flea booster

limber light
#

oh that would do it

hybrid tartan
#

oh?

limber light
#

oh right, i added the log for this

#

if u check the game log it gives a full damage report when a part is destroyed

#

im pretty sure i know what is happening but might as well use that

#

just ctrl+f stabilizer_0v_flybywire_aircraft

#

also the flight report changes make this so much easier lol

#

but i think there's a bug assuming the booster ignition was the first stage, not the parachute

hybrid tartan
#

this maybe?

[LOG 21:52:35.050] [Physics] Destroying Joint: parachute_0v_radial_drogue.prefab_cec4ded6-1256-4e8d-9298-0773ae0e0103 (UnityEngine.GameObject) -> booster_1v_solid_flea.prefab_5c41bfe0-d0da-4ca0-91a0-56cd96b462c6 (UnityEngine.Rigidbody). Owner: 9bd3deed-d455-4fea-8162-c8cc349fc1e0
[LOG 21:52:35.050] [Simulation] Destroying ViewObject: parachute_0v_radial_drogue.prefab_cec4ded6-1256-4e8d-9298-0773ae0e0103 (KSP.Sim.impl.SimulationObjectView)
[LOG 21:52:35.050] [Flight] Destroying SimObject cec4ded6-1256-4e8d-9298-0773ae0e0103
[LOG 21:52:35.051] [Simulation] Attachment Node >cec4ded6-1256-4e8d-9298-0773ae0e0103>srfAttach detached completely
[LOG 21:52:35.053] [Simulation] [Staging]<9fc1e0>:  Partowner Parts Updated - 1 parts removed
[LOG 21:52:35.053] [Simulation] [Staging][CommandEntry]<9fc1e0>:  RemoveStageAt(index 0
[LOG 21:52:35.155] [KSRe] stabilizer_0v_flybywire_aircraft Damage Record | Engineering_Age= | Flight_GeeForces=1.57 | Flight_Collateral=110 
[LOG 21:52:35.156] [Physics] Destroying Joint: booster_1v_solid_flea.prefab_5c41bfe0-d0da-4ca0-91a0-56cd96b462c6 (UnityEngine.GameObject) -> stabilizer_0v_flybywire_aircraft.prefab_6758ab96-33a1-49f4-8aa2-37913cfcaa5d (UnityEngine.Rigidbody). Owner: [NULL]
[LOG 21:52:35.157] [Simulation] Destroying ViewObject: stabilizer_0v_flybywire_aircraft.prefab_6758ab96-33a1-49f4-8aa2-37913cfcaa5d (KSP.Sim.impl.SimulationObjectView)
[LOG 21:52:35.157] [Flight] Destroying SimObject 6758ab96-33a1-49f4-8aa2-37913cfcaa5d
[LOG 21:52:35.157] [Simulation] Attachment Node >6758ab96-33a1-49f4-8aa2-37913cfcaa5d>bottom detached completely
[LOG 21:52:35.157] [Simulation] Attachment Node >6758ab96-33a1-49f4-8aa2-37913cfcaa5d>ReinforcedConnectionJoint detached completely```
limber light
#

nice

#

yeah the collateral damage needs some work lol

hybrid tartan
#

ah

limber light
#

did u want me to explain it, idk if u want spoilers

#

the chute must be parented to the probe

hybrid tartan
#

up to you I don't mind

vague mica
#

...spoilers?

hybrid tartan
#

guessing to do with mechanics

limber light
#

the probe took collateral damage from the chute being destroyed

#

but its way too high lol

hybrid tartan
#

oh like it hit the chute or something?

limber light
#

well like if an engine explodes it would damage the attached fuel tank

#

so cascading explosions can occur

hybrid tartan
#

but should parachute be doing that?

limber light
#

probably not that much

hybrid tartan
#

alright

limber light
#

its based on the part explosion potential, from the base game

hybrid tartan
#

I guess it just surprises me that parachute has potential to damge other parts like that

#

engines make sense to me, explosion n all

limber light
#

oh yeah it doesnt make sense for parachutes

hybrid tartan
#

ah kk

limber light
#

its also way too high for some reason

hybrid tartan
#

man this is rough

#

I'm only able to go about 1-2k until parachute explodes

limber light
#

its highly randomized

hybrid tartan
#

how big of a difference do grades make?

#

like is max grade gonna feel close to vanilla?

limber light
#

well thats random

#

some parts at max grade wont fail

#

at minimum grade, some parts will fail on rollout

#

im gonna rebalance chute damage tho

hybrid tartan
#

alright

#

I'll try timing it real close to see if I can get some success

vague mica
#

pls fix the science levels not working bug thingy plsss

limber light
#

its meant to be roughly realistic, i think they are failing a bit too much

#

the science levels should be working in the hotfix

vague mica
#

cool is it on Spacedock?

limber light
#

ya

#

0.37.2

#

im still unsure how that probe took that much damage from collateral, it must have been the booster that exploded from the parachute

#

the booster explosion just wasnt in that section of log tho

hybrid tartan
#

o

limber light
#

your testing is giving so much good data, thx for this

vague mica
#

happiness

lusty laurel
#

G

limber light
#

nice

#

widescreen also looks less bad, at least

vague mica
#

you should make the background scroll half as much so that it doesn't loop back around

hybrid tartan
#

yay I made.. a tiny bit of progress

vague mica
#

also please for the love of jebediah kerman please put a non-rover probe core earlier in the tree

limber light
vague mica
#

yay

limber light
#

the first tier is radial / surface parts

#

tier 1 is XS / 0.625m, all the tiers are just bulkhead sizes

#

i'd move stuff but thats the rule lol

vague mica
#

then make a scaled-down stayputnik that can't do SAS and has no battery storage

limber light
#

i guess stayputnik could be an exception

#

ik its difficult to fly initially with these parts

hybrid tartan
#

new question sorry if I'm asking too much lol
let's say I use a parachute for 100 seconds in a flight, will part grade be less effected than if it was used for 300 seconds

vague mica
#

yeah mach 2 in a truck, great idea...

limber light
#

the longer the chute is deployed, the more damage it takes rn

#

ill fix it to be more speed-based

hybrid tartan
#

okay, but basically I'm asking is if it's used for longer will the part grade be upgraded more?

#

obv if it doesn't break lol

limber light
#

yes, if u recover

#

but also higher risk of fault

hybrid tartan
#

oki

limber light
#

basically, if u wanted to make like a parachute test vehicle, put a bunch on a vehicle and do a brief flight

#

something like this is the idea

#

then u could also repair them on landing as well

#

to see how damaged they are

vague mica
#

it's time to make a rocket seat

hybrid tartan
#

oo does repairing give bonus to grade improvement?

#

like finding the fault or something

vague mica
#

jeb... jeb..... jeb where are we goin with this 🥀

hybrid tartan
#

lmao

vague mica
#

wonder if I cuold land it on the VAB roof actually

#

yeah or you could just fuckn do this

#

oooh new bug

#

when you revert to launch, your tanks change fuel.. somehow

#

(my mono is gone, replaced by ox)

hybrid tartan
#

ye it's broken from redux modding support or something like that

#

gotta go reset from vab for now

vague mica
#

ohhh yes it's working

#

the thinginator

hybrid tartan
#

kerbal engineering

lusty laurel
vague mica
#

for science

#

what is this laggg

#

whatever it's almost capable of 70 km

#

it's okay let's just use more seps

#

oh the lag

#

and wobble 💔

#

this was a bad idea

hybrid tartan
#

btw I presume the blank here is a bug

#

I don't have bio fuel level showing up so I wonder if it's glitched

#

will attempt doing more stuff with engines to see if it does show up tho

vague mica
#

what even is bio fuel

hybrid tartan
#

well

#

you mix biofuel and oxidizer for one of the basic propellents

#

3:2
Oxidizer:Biofuel to run the lower tier engines like spark and swivel

#

but rn I'm tryna work out why biofuel isn't appear in rocket science when using biofuel engines

vague mica
#

yes but what is biofuel made of

hybrid tartan
#

the remains of our fallen comrades

#

but eh idk

vague mica
#

oh my

hybrid tartan
#

there's a reason there's no kerbal graveyards :)

vague mica
#

alright seriously where is the bulldog truck thing in the tech tree

hybrid tartan
#

I saw it somewhere but it depends if you've got enough science for it to show up

#

but I would presume you have

vague mica
#

I have 519 rocket science

#

ooh what I need rn is data science levels

#

oh nvm the node is literally right there

#

it's called "space truckin" 🥀

hybrid tartan
#

ye lol

vague mica
hybrid tartan
#

ksp 2 the future

vague mica
#

I do not understand how you upgrade this level

#

I just took a new surface sample from the mountains and got diddly squat more levels

#

even though I had not done that biome before

hybrid tartan
#

so new surface sample works, but also just any, you can redo old ones

#

idk if you need to use the arm to get sample data or if kerbals do it just as well but yeah

#

couple surface samples of same place should work

#

I think that's what I did

limber light
#

ok had to watch the artemis briefing, lemme catch up

vague mica
#

thought son my staging? klueless

#

oh it's freezing even before I hit the space button

hybrid tartan
#

more POWER

vague mica
#

it's working yayaa

#

just a few floating parts

hybrid tartan
#

lmao

#

I imagine a slideshow

vague mica
#

4 fps

limber light
#

bio fuel is methane btw

#

liquid fuel is kerosene

vague mica
#

ah I see

#

you should, uhh, name them that

limber light
#

not exactly but close enough, for simple fuel ratios

hybrid tartan
#

ohhh yeahh got the reliant now

#

feel like I'm getting somewhere

limber light
#

nice

limber light
vague mica
#

btw the science reward thing is wrong

#

like here

#

the last one it said was 20 but then the reward gave me 50

#

oh looks like running that many separatrons farmed me rocket science...

limber light
#

basically if u find this part of the save file, thats all i need

vague mica
#

got some ideas for a science farm klueless

limber light
#

with the full list of rocketScience

limber light
hybrid tartan
#
      "SaveData": {
        "$type": "KSRe.RePlugin+ReSaveData, KSRe",
        "modVersion": "0.37.2",
        "lastDailyUpdateUT": 21601.0,
        "agencies": [
          {
            "name": "Kerbal Space Agency",
            "rocketScience": {
              "Engineering_Assembly": 71,
              "Control_Region": 100,
              "Control_Launch": 173,
              "Control_EVAGround": 5,
              "Psychology_CrewObservation": 13,
              "ScienceData_SurfaceSurvey": 7,
              "ScienceSample_SurfaceSurvey": 43,
              "Engineering_Age": 51,
              "Flight_Impacts": 167,
              "Electrical_Wheel": 178,
              "Command_Missions": 236,
              "Engineering_Repairs": 12,
              "Engineering_Faults": 121,
              "Propulsion_SolidFuel": 130,
              "Flight_Collateral": 52,
              "Biology_Data": 9,
              "Biology_Sample": 34,
              "Aeronautics_Data": 39,
              "Aeronautics_Sample": 46,
              "ScienceData_MarineSurvey": 6,
              "Flight_GeeForces": 7,
              "Propulsion_SolidFuelBooster": 19,
              "Flight_Heat": 1,
              "Aeronautics_Parachute": 51,
              "Control_Landed": 18,
              "Propulsion_Methalox": 168
            },```
limber light
#

in that category

limber light
hybrid tartan
#

ty :)

limber light
#

for now the solid fuel level will be a bit low

vague mica
#

also for fuel ratios

#

is 1 fuel tank for each of the same size viable

#

or do I need to do like 2 for 1 type and 3 for another etc

limber light
#

the ratios are different for each fuel

#

thats hypergolic

vague mica
#

ah shucks okay

#

looks like wings attached to the fleas also get shrunk down

limber light
#

every tank container size is standardized so u can use any tanks for any fuel, just need to work out the ratio

vague mica
#

what is the bio fuel ratio?

limber light
#

3:2 by volume

#

so 3 oxygen tanks and 2 fuel tanks, or 1.5 oxygen and 1 fuel

#

and yea the flea bug is known, it usually resolves on launch

vague mica
#

cool

#

woah I have enough tech for an orbital launch lmao

#

toy kerbin

limber light
#

yea orbit is much easier to have the parts for, if u use a small probe

#

the nosecone probe and flea has heaps of delta v

#

the challenge is just finding the parts i think

vague mica
#

the feal scaling bug also applies to the gizmo

limber light
#

ya ik its a bad bug

#

idk how to rescale parts

#

best to use simple designs with the flea

#

tho, often they are just visual and resolve on rollout

hybrid tartan
#

welp got my first orbit

#

can't say it wasn't messy but I did it

#

the whole deactivating engine thing is something I need to get used to

#

frick.. the engine didn't light up in space

#

welp

limber light
#

:p

#

u can use action groups for the engines

hybrid tartan
#

was thinking about that

limber light
#

or just toggle the throttle unlock and use throttle cutoff key

hybrid tartan
#

o

vague mica
hybrid tartan
#

rip

vague mica
#

crazy that this is all you need

#

and I still have like 1 km/s left over

hybrid tartan
#

dang

limber light
#

ye

vague mica
#

ummm

#

ignition failed??

hybrid tartan
#

so yeah my spark engine is what failed me in the vacuum of space

vague mica
#

hold on lets revert klueless

limber light
#

getting enough delta v should be easy now

#

the other challenges are where u may struggle

hybrid tartan
#

interesting

limber light
#

(also this fits the 2.5x planet scale mod, when we have that for redux)

#

basically i recommend hypergolic engine at first due to reliable ignition

#

or just the puff

hybrid tartan
#

ah okay

#

is that until you can repair midflight?

limber light
#

well repairs wont help yet

#

i mean they might, but u r dealing with ullage

hybrid tartan
#

so what can fix that?

limber light
#

ullage motors irl, here u can just use RCS

#

so basically thrust forward with RCS so you're not in zero g when lighting the engine

hybrid tartan
#

OH

limber light
#

to settle the fuel in the tank

hybrid tartan
#

so I could use the current spark engine with a mix of rcs?

limber light
#

yup

hybrid tartan
#

hype

limber light
#

hypergolic is just simpler bc they never fail ignition

hybrid tartan
#

pssshh I need to suffer

limber light
#

lol

hybrid tartan
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I mean spark will be more efficent right?

limber light
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for sure

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but it may fail ignition, and u gotta add rcs tank + thrusters etc

hybrid tartan
#

oki

limber light
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hypergolic is almost unlimited relights

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ill let u find out anyway

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trying not to spoil it all lol

hybrid tartan
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for those that are harder to ignite, does it mean you need more thrust or?

limber light
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its just ullage, they have high rate of failure in zero g

hybrid tartan
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so in theory if you aren't in zero g it should be chill

limber light
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yup

hybrid tartan
#

oki

limber light
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but what i recommend is using an engine test stand to investigate engines yourself

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test them on the pad, take a kerbal and inspect the damage

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it gives science and u should be able to figure out how the damage works from that

hybrid tartan
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ah ye

limber light
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particularly when relighting engines multiple times

hybrid tartan
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did some engine pads just to get some research

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I saw after a few reignites that blows shit up

limber light
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ok cool

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but yea the inline main engines are more efficient but there are those tradeoffs now

hybrid tartan
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makes actually perfect sense

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less big number need bigger, more intellectual planning so that it doesn't all fall apart

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since for most part was just delta V that I worried about vanilla

limber light
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exactly, its just one of many challenges realistically, and stock parts were way too heavy

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now its a bit too easy on stock solar system

hybrid tartan
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o

limber light
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the orion upper stage engine is hypergolic btw

hybrid tartan
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oo

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I see

limber light
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its just that in the game i could only make radial engines hypergolic

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they're useful on stages where throttle is needed and multiple restarts, perfect for landing

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i def recommend twitch over the spark but its up to u

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kinda hard to explain all that to new players lol

hybrid tartan
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o I haven't got that

limber light
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mostly bc u wouldnt even think of these engines as a veteran

hybrid tartan
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ah

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I don't look too closely at meta stuff I just try to figure out what works lol

limber light
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ya

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i think ppl will always choose spark

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propulsion is probably the biggest challenge now

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so dw if it takes a while to figure out

hybrid tartan
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ah

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hmm confused

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my rocket like splits in two when I hit 60k altitude

limber light
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ok, u can check flight report

hybrid tartan
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ye, so my decoupler is what's exploding it looks like

limber light
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ok

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can u check log for decoupler_1v_inline damage record

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this might be that decoupler bug again

hybrid tartan
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[LOG 00:28:18.481] [KSRe] decoupler_1v_inline Damage Record | Engineering_Age= | Flight_Heat=76.12 | Engineering_Faults=82.53 
[LOG 00:28:18.481] [Physics] Destroying Joint: fueltank_1v_inline_methalox_1x8.prefab_d0f9957c-e713-46bd-9f18-e737d998017a (UnityEngine.GameObject) -> decoupler_1v_inline.prefab_38ba2ca9-0347-46ab-900c-785f55de0c9a (UnityEngine.Rigidbody). Owner: [NULL]
[LOG 00:28:18.482] [Physics] Destroying Joint: decoupler_1v_inline.prefab_38ba2ca9-0347-46ab-900c-785f55de0c9a (UnityEngine.GameObject) -> engine_0v_methalox_spark.prefab_44b66470-6393-48f8-b475-856a5e611a50 (UnityEngine.Rigidbody). Owner: 51e9cfda-1a9e-45d4-8287-a759b7f944c1
[EXC 00:28:18.482] ArgumentNullException: Value cannot be null.
Parameter name: obj```
limber light
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ooo

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i dont think this is a bug

hybrid tartan
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I'm missing something then?

limber light
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hmm

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how was the ascent

hybrid tartan
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umm

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I presumed it was fine but maybe too fast?

limber light
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i guess what i could say is that part heating is a lot more significant now

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and the indicators aren't shown any more

hybrid tartan
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ah

limber light
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so yeh if u go like 5 gees off the pad and burn through the atmosphere, stuff will probably melt

hybrid tartan
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so slower ascent?

limber light
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idk what the rocket looks like

hybrid tartan
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hmm alright

limber light
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but yea generally slower means less heat

hybrid tartan
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oki

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ty

limber light
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it could be a bug but idk, and i dont wanna spoil the gameplay for ya

hybrid tartan
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fair enough

limber light
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so basically if u want to investigate damage, the best way is the pal upgrades

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then u can use the diagnostic app and see if a part is overheating, etc

hybrid tartan
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so can that be done without kerbals with the pal upgrades?

limber light
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yup

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right

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the pal upgrades mostly provide additional data in the diagnostic app, when u have a probe core

hybrid tartan
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ah cool

limber light
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i def need to think on how to convey some of this in game tho

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heating in particular

hybrid tartan
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yee

limber light
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ill probably switch stuff over into the flight report from the diagnostic app

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makes it more visible at least

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i guess the balancing factor is how to make early campaign barebones without not providing enough data to solve these problems, and providing upgrades that help

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u need some kind of overheat indication, but also the pal upgrade that is worth investing in

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the report said 3.9g max, i mean if this is in lower atmosphere then yeh it could heat like that

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might have to do some testing

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if u can send a screenshot of the vessel or workspace it might help

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but nbd

hybrid tartan
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alright

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gonna have a break for now

limber light
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np, thanks for all the feedback

hybrid tartan
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np :)

vague mica
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yk what screw orbit

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reliant engine has been acquired

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will play more tomorrow

limber light
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nice

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figured out how to change the r&d background scroll rate

terse crest
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why does the tire company hate me in their 4 wheel sidequest?

limber light
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ah the beach is further away from the ksc

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u gotta drive for a while

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im gonna try going north actually, it might be closer

terse crest
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it just says launch a vessel with 4 wheels D:

limber light
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oh i thought it was the drive on the beach one