you can basically skip through the upper half its just the mesh creation in blender
#"HIRE" - Heatshield Integrated Retractable Engine
frigid relic
one tiny thing that's not related to this is that I see you disabled your gimbal object
that's probably not wanted
umbral lion
true
thge reentry material is there and the texture is the heat map
the three meshes are there and the hierarchy is correct
the LOD Group is on the parent object and the three LOD meshes are set correctly
the reentry mesh module is assigned to the lod_reentry object too
i've applied all overrides and disabled the visibility of lod_reentry object
and theres nothing more in the guide
thats it
maybe i need to rebuild my adressables bundle?
frigid relic
jesus my dumb ass just spent like 10 minutes trying to debug why the mod is not loaded by SpaceWarp
since I couldn't find it in the mod list
it's called Sample Mod and not HIRE
🤦♂️
lmao
frigid relic
nope, it's the unique identifier for the mod
display name is below it
alright so I see a spam of this when flying it
so there's definitely something funky going on with the reentry stuff
umbral lion
the Unity Explorer only shows me the collider
umbral lion
HOW??!
frigid relic
and it's not midnight yet
lmao
these were missing
I think @marsh prawn may have forgotten those in the guide
I just randomly tried assigning them and it worked
umbral lion
AHHHH I ASKED Safarte and he said i dont have to do anything in there
wait
its in this channel
umbral lion
"Ahh i'm curious do i need to put the three LODs in the reentry mesh script module? like lod0 for element 0 and lod1 for element 1 ???"
6:25 PM
I even posted this image
frigid relic
but it's possible it works without it and it was just not done in the exact correct order
umbral lion
alright well if it's necessary then this info should definitely be added to the wiki
🎉
frigid relic
see now if they are enabled and I add the component, the fields get automatically filled
so technically he was right
but yes, we should still definitely clarify that those need to have the values assigned, whether automatically or manually
umbral lion
i swear unity wants to drive me crazy... there are some ghosts in this program
frigid relic
you're definitely not the only one lmao
I've enjoyed a fair share of Unity insanity
especially in 2020.3 that was used before KSP2 0.1.5
2022.3 at least feels a bit more stable and less random
but most importantly, you made the deadline! lmao
umbral lion
see now if they are enabled and I add the component, the fields get automaticall...
i just tried the same thing and it doesn't add those automatically
frigid relic
that's really weird
did you remove the component, apply overrides, and then add it?
umbral lion
can you tell me if theres something in the reentry group data on the bottom?
frigid relic
can you tell me if theres something in the reentry group data on the bottom?
nope, didn't touch that, all empty
frigid relic
you do have the lod_reentry object enabled right?
umbral lion
ahh shouldn't it be disabled?
frigid relic
ahh there's the issue
basically, it needs to be enabled when you add the component, so that the component sees it
and can use its meshes
and then it needs to be disabled
umbral lion
how the hell should one know that it only autofills when the object is enabled
frigid relic
like everything we do in KSP2 modding - trying and failing until we get it right 😆
but yeah I will add a notice about that to the step in the wiki guide
to make it totally clear
is this better?
umbral lion
i'm just glad it works now ... i barely have any space left on my display to add more notes
much better
frigid relic
i'm just glad it works now ... i barely have any space left on my display to add...
if you feel like it, you can make a wiki account and add details that you feel are missing or not exactly clear
we'd greatly appreciate any help on the wiki
there's very few people who contribute to it
umbral lion
well yeah ofc i'll do my part
tomorrows task is getting some plume and sound effect. I still want to beta release this thing tomorrow
the active cooling works
i added some electric charge input being necessary ... since the cryo fuel must be pumped through the system to work
when the engine is running it produces electricity again
frigid relic
it does make sense
though in its real life counterpart, I think they said that the pumps are actually powered by the converted heat from the reentry heating
umbral lion
hmmm... so the cooling pipes are under pressure constantly?
Oh i just noticed i need to add a fairing so the whole thing is covered when something is attached to the bottom node
frigid relic
hmmm... so the cooling pipes are under pressure constantly?
same timestamp as before 😆
they say that they do need to spool up the turbopumps first, but then they are kept powered by the reentry heat
so it's a combination of both
umbral lion
alright.. so no electric charge needed at least during reentry
looks so cool
i could even make the gap between the heatshield and the reentry shader mesh a bit bigger
frigid relic
and as a teaser, the plumes could look something like this
for the individual nozzles
and then slowly turned into more of a unified aerospike-ish shape with decreasing pressure
umbral lion
WOAAAHHHH
frigid relic
I can already tell it will be a pain in the ass to update them when you want to make changes though
😆
since I had to create a plume for a single nozzle, copy it, position it under the 2nd nozzle, copy those two, position them under another 2 nozzles, copy those 4 and position them again, etc
umbral lion
the geometry is pretty much set in stone.. if anything changes its the texture
well thats the small part with 24... the medium will have 36 engines
frigid relic
haha now that will be fun
though it wasn't that terrible
took me like 10 minutes to get the copying and positioning right
umbral lion
i need to learn how to do this
would like to try to get a aerospike like cone as a secondary effect below the heatshield
frigid relic
definitely!
umbral lion
like this
frigid relic
and then slowly turned into more of a unified aerospike-ish shape with decreasin...
that's exactly what I meant here
umbral lion
oh i just watched the video clip on repeat for the past minutes.. didnt read
frigid relic
hahaha
frigid relic
oh yeah
@quasi pike might be able to tell you more, I think he has engine shrouds working?
I think something like this could work for the vacuum plume
umbral lion
that looks amazing
frigid relic
not great, but I think it's a good start
showing the plume at various throttle levels and pressure levels
the pressure transition could be smoother than just fade in/fade out
quasi pike
<@402620630585049088> might be able to tell you more, I think he has engine shro...
I do have shrouds working. @umbral lion Are you looking to have a shroud be automatically constructed between some part of your engine and the decoupler below it?
umbral lion
I do have shrouds working. <@100082075725484032> Are you looking to have a shrou...
YES!!!
quasi pike
It's not terribly difficult, but it is picky. Let me find some examples for you.
umbral lion
Woah the medium part will be huge compared to the small one
umbral lion
It's not terribly difficult, but it is picky. Let me find some examples for you.
That would be awesome
quasi pike
Woah the medium part will be huge compared to the small one
It doesn't necessarily scale the same in all axes I think.
umbral lion
nah i need to remodel the whole thing sinze medium parts use 36 faces
the previous small model had 24
but yeah the heatshield looks kinda off.. probably need to adjust this
quasi pike
That would be awesome
Here's an example on a size XS engine.
umbral lion
Here's an example on a size XS engine.
excellent thank you!
quasi pike
Here is the nearly same thing scaled up to size-sm
umbral lion
i pulled the core part values from the terrier small engines base shroud
quasi pike
And here it is for a size-md engine
The thing to notice is that nearly all the information is the same regardless of the size
frigid relic
all modules definitely need to go on the prefab
quasi pike
Like that
I don't know that the order is important, but in my engines the fairing is the last thing in the list of components
frigid relic
shouldn't matter
quasi pike
Two of the fairing parameters that do change with engine size are Base Radius and Cross Section Height Max
umbral lion
i see the fairing module has it's own bottom node
quasi pike
The Fairing Thickness may or may not change - depends on what you need.
umbral lion
well base radius most likeley relates to module size.. either 1.25 diameter for small and 2.5 for medium and so on
frigid relic
i see the fairing module has it's own bottom node
I think you just need to provide the name of your top and bottom nodes
quasi pike
well base radius most likeley relates to module size.. either 1.25 diameter for ...
Exactly
I've just used diameter/2, so a medium part has a base radius of 1.25, and so forth
The Cross Section Height Max is from the top of the decouper (at the floating node I believe) to the point on the engine where it should meet. IIRC, this part is picky and getting it wrong may mean the fairing is a no show.
Since you're modeling the shape in Blender (I assume you are) then you should be able to tell precisely how much height you need.
umbral lion
ahh i see... does the collider mesh obstruct the fairing? i mean does it need to be smaller in diameter than the fairing base?
quasi pike
Also, at the bottom of those modules here's what they all have
umbral lion
Since you're modeling the shape in Blender (I assume you are) then you should be...
yeah thats a huge advantage
quasi pike
Which is a fat load of nothing
umbral lion
thats the best load
quasi pike
You can export stock engines with fairings as json files to look and see what they do for their fairings, but you won't necessarily be able to easily measure their meshes.
That's how I worked it out - just looked at stock and fiddled with things until it worked on my engines.
It was a pain at first, guessing and loading the game and seeing nothing there.
umbral lion
preach it brother we've been fiddling the past three days
quite a steep learning curve coming from ksp1 modding to ksp2
well thank you very much for all the insight.. i will let you know if i get it to work tomorrow
damn it's already 2:30 am here.. i will head for dreamland soon
quasi pike
I gotta say I'm really looking forward to these engines!
frigid relic
meanwhile, fiddling with LFO, I realized it's stupid in how it does many things
umbral lion
I gotta say I'm really looking forward to these engines!
thats much appreciated... just check back tomorrow and there might be a beta release
frigid relic
and it makes my life harder when trying to do this specific plume
so I might have to rewrite the core of it yet again
umbral lion
any other fuel type better?
frigid relic
😆
frigid relic
when the Antimatter mod for plumes drops, let me know
umbral lion
haha the real world thing uses liquid hydrogen
quasi pike
haha the real world thing uses liquid hydrogen
Screw that wimpy liquid crap! We can get way better density with metallic!
umbral lion
i also heard about hydrogen paste
quasi pike
No, seriously though, this will be a very cool engine. Presumably it does need a cryogenic fuel though.
Woops, pun
umbral lion
stable at room temperure and much higher hydrogen density
quasi pike
so I might have to rewrite the core of it yet again
LOL, it will be brilliant!
It would be nice if LFO was even easier to use.
frigid relic
alright, the plume should finally be set up to be tested in the game
fingers crossed
this was painful
I need to add some sort of capability to LFO to only need to create a single plume type and then be able just have it automatically copied under all specified objects, or something like that
instead of copy-pasting everything 24 times everytime I want to make a change
umbral lion
I need to add some sort of capability to LFO to only need to create a single plu...
that's what it was like in ksp1.. you had a specfic effect and just added offset coordinates to use it multiple times
umbral lion
THAT IS BEAUTIFUL!!!!
frigid relic
it looks better in vacuum than I expected
umbral lion
i love it
damn... need to get some sleep... so exciting feels like the day before christmas when everything comes together
frigid relic
haha
I should too
but I still have uneaten dinner in front of me
and I'm in the same time zone
at least it's Sunday tomorrow (well, today)
umbral lion
i only ate breakfast today... had no time for food
frigid relic
🙈
umbral lion
awesome! i'm so "stoked" about this haha
because you know stoke space
alright.. i'm off. Good night everyone see you all in a few hours
frigid relic
now all it's missing is a few more textures (metallic, normal and emissive, in this case)
and I think it will be basically finished
oh and audio
umbral lion
yeah i'm on it already... hopefully i can get it finished tomorrow
indigo relic
alright.. i'm off. Good night everyone see you all in a few hours
Good night!
umbral lion
09:00 or more like 10
umbral lion
why sleeping when you can mod
exactly thats the spirit
indigo relic
kebab delivery is one of the most beautiful thing humanity invented
quasi pike
instead of copy-pasting everything 24 times everytime I want to make a change
Ahh, I see the pain - that would be tedious.
marsh prawn
I think <@192177564800909312> may have forgotten those in the guide
Sometimes they get assigned automatically by some dark magic sometimes they do not, I'll add a step to make sure they're assigned
marsh prawn
is this better?
Thanks for the edit!
umbral lion
I just had the biggest brunch ever! And now it's time to get to work. I'll start by adding the base shroud
Oh and i have an idea how to make the medium part visually distinct and unique without changing too much of the overall goemetry.. well a little bit of geometry change... because its bigger and more powerful
frigid relic
ah, if you haven't already started the shroud, then I'd like to merge the plumes into your project first
it will make it easier to do it now
umbral lion
yeah sure
can you do that from your end or do i have to do something?
i plan to add the retract animation post release in an update but i have a cool idea for the mechanic already designed on my tablet
it wont change the position of the engines in the extended position so don't worry about your beautiful plume
frigid relic
alright, so, here's a pull request: https://github.com/Jebbedia/HIRE/pull/1
umbral lion
merge complete
frigid relic
Alright, so now, you'll need to open GitHub Desktop and use the fetch/pull button at the top
to download the changes from the online repository to your local one
umbral lion
ahhh i made some changes yesterday without fetching does this now undo the merge?
frigid relic
you only need to fetch if there are any changes in the online repo
but I think you mean without pushing?
frigid relic
well, depending on what changed in the prefab, if you don't mind overwriting the changes to get the version that's currently online, you can discard/stash the changes
and accept the ones from the remote (online)
umbral lion
i just changed some values for the engine.. reduced thrust etc
frigid relic
hopefully that won't be too much work to redo, then
umbral lion
yeah i think it worked
umbral lion
hopefully that won't be too much work to redo, then
all good..
frigid relic
usually, when working with code, if there are merge conflicts like this, they can be just resolved by choosing which changes to accept from which version
but with these Unity objects it's not that simple
so one has to be extra careful to make sure everything is pushed and fetched+pulled
well then, now when you open the project, and open the SampleScene, you should see the engine with plumes
hopefully my changes didn't mess with your ThunderKit settings or something
you might have to update the game exe and mod folder paths at the bottom of KSP2 Unity Tools window
umbral lion
frigid relic
unless we have the same paths
frigid relic
awesome!
so, an important thing to note is that the object that's in the scene is not your actual prefab
it's a prefab variant
umbral lion
do i need to add the LOF as dependency?
umbral lion
😉 my brain works today
frigid relic
if you open Packages below Assets, you should see LFO Editor there
otherwise the plumes wouldn't be visible
umbral lion
yep LFO Editor Tools is present
frigid relic
great
umbral lion
is that the mod id? LFO Editor Tools?
frigid relic
that's just the name of the Unity package
umbral lion
ahh ok
frigid relic
it's separate from the actual mod that's used in the game
and it mostly contains the editor tools
the ID is "lfo" I think (of the mod)
and current version is 1.0.0
if you want to add it to dependencies
well, you should
umbral lion
frigid relic
looks good
you probably also want a dependency on com.github.x606.spacewarp
since it's needed to load the mod in the first place
umbral lion
but the id is "Space Warp" or is it "com.github.x606.spacewarp"?
frigid relic
it's the long one
umbral lion
alright
frigid relic
we used to have IDs like that but then we switched to the simpler syntax later on
but it's not a good idea to change the ID once it exists
so SpaceWarp is stuck with that
umbral lion
yeah might confuse the patcher
frigid relic
and also, all mods that had a dependency on that ID would suddenly complain that the dependency doesn't exist
umbral lion
xD sounds like a real clusterfuck
frigid relic
for SpaceWarp, you can probably just use 1.9.0
there's no real need to keep compatibility with older versions, everyone should be updating it
at least for now while we're in early access
and for the maximum for both dependencies you can use *
which just means any version (greater than or equal to the minimum)
umbral lion
the module list gets bigger and bigger
frigid relic
haha yeah
the Throttle VFX manager is needed for plumes to work
but there's no settings in it that we need to change
oh a sec
I see you're adding new modules
that's what I wanted to mention next
what you currently have open is not actually your prefab
and it won't make it into addressables
umbral lion
ahh ok
frigid relic
it's a Prefab Variant of your actual prefab
what that means is that it automatically inherits everything that's in your prefab, plus you can add extra stuff
that stuff being the plume configs in this case
since plumes shouldn't actually get saved to the prefab itself
instead, we add their components to the prefab variant, and then use the "Save plume" button to generate a JSON file, which then gets added to addressables
and then LFO uses that JSON to create all those components directly in the game, instead of reading them from the prefab
it's mostly so that the plumes can be edited (or patched with Patch Manager) without needing to have access to the original Unity project
so you can either just remove the HIRE125_Plume.prefab object from the scene and drag and drop your original HIRE125.prefab in there, or you can make a new scene where you'll add your original prefab
frigid relic
so you can either just remove the HIRE125_Plume.prefab object from the scene and...
that way you can just switch between the two scenes depending on if you want to work with the original prefab, or with plumes
umbral lion
ok i'll make another scene then
so the plume prefab i should only use if changes to the plume are necessary and all the other stuff do on the original prefab?
frigid relic
exactly
and the plume prefab will automatically contain all changes made to the original
umbral lion
ok but for builds i use the plume prefab then or the original? or do i use the one i made changes to?
umbral lion
and the plume prefab will automatically contain all changes made to the original
ahh ok got it
frigid relic
if you made any plume changes, you'll go to the Plume object in the plume prefab and click Save plumes there (plus Apply overrides on the plume prefab)
for everything else, Apply overrides and Save JSON from the original
umbral lion
alright i wont touch the plumes haha.. but i will keep it in a seperate scene
but just to make sure... i save now the scene with the plume with a different name to make a copy and then open that one to change the prefab to the original one?
or do i save the current one as the plume scene
frigid relic
you can also just right click the Scenes folder and create an empty scene
and then rename the current scene as PlumeScene or something
no wrong answers here
(mostly)
😆
umbral lion
ok i have the new scene and now i just copy all the objects there?
sorry for all those dumb questions but the unity editor still feels slippery
frigid relic
just drag the prefab from the Assets into the scene hierarchy
umbral lion
my original prefab
frigid relic
yup
umbral lion
ok.. haha ok i think it makes sense to me now
frigid relic
the scenes don't actually mean anything when it comes to mods, they're only used to display things on your screen within the editor
so you can make however many you want and put whatever you want in them
and it won't change anything
the important thing is the prefab itself
and the scene is just the most convenient place where you can edit it
you can also theoretically put all your prefabs into a single scene
but it makes things like positioning more difficult
I think the way LuxStice was making SORRY was just having all the prefabs in a single scene
and working on them simultaneously
umbral lion
yeah no thanks it's already a headache to keep all the causalities in mind
umbral lion
woah now i have a strange problem... i wanted to test the engine fairing but when i launch the program with my mod it starts without loading screen and no buttons in the main menu and no sounds ^^ just the animated background
frigid relic
sounds like something went wrong before/during the initial loading
umbral lion
ahhh you said i can go back to a previous state with git right?
frigid relic
what's in the logs?
frigid relic
ahhh you said i can go back to a previous state with git right?
you can, but let's first try to see if this can be fixed
umbral lion
ahhh.. i forgot the * in the maximum version for the dependencies
all good now
just need to dial in the node location but the fairing seems like it should fit perfectly
and it only appears when somethings added to the bottom node
frigid relic
alright, that seems like a good start!
honestly, I think you might not even need the full length fairing
just this would be enough I think
since the top part already is the same width
umbral lion
you're right.. didn't think of that... it just needs to hide the heatshield part and should sit flush on the thruster ring
quasi pike
This is a great result! Now you can see where your settings are placing the fairing. By tweeking them you should be able to get it where it needs to be. I believe that if you adjust them in a way that it would clip with the part the game may not show the fairing at all - at least that's what I recall happening back in 0.1.5.
Ideally, the fairing goes from the top of the node to the bottom of your part where you want it to meet the part. Are there more than one nodes below the engine? Is it intential that there be so much space between the engine and the next stage down?
umbral lion
almost there just need to decrease the fairing length
umbral lion
Ideally, the fairing goes from the top of the node to the bottom of your part wh...
no i just used spaces to see if the fairing is big enough
voilà perfect
@quasi pike i changed the local up axis from -1 to 1 ... struggled with thinking upside down
looks very nice and flush
frigid relic
Sweet!
quasi pike
voilà perfect
That's gorgeous! Love it!
You, sir, have a truly beautiful and quite distinctive contraption here! This is going to be lots of run, and a great addition to the game!
frigid relic
You will need to install Wwise
A separate program (that also integrates with Unity)
I've never worked with it myself though
umbral lion
Sounds like a new mission for me
@quasi pike do your fairings also show up when you attach the engines to a tank? Or did i mess up some of the config
frigid relic
What happens if you separate the engine and put something on the bottom node?
quasi pike
The fairing is a part of the engine, so when you attach your engine to something and then attach another part to the bottom node, you should get a fairing
umbral lion
The fairing is a part of the engine, so when you attach your engine to something...
yeah but i also get the fairing if i only attach something to the engines top node
quasi pike
yeah but i also get the fairing if i only attach something to the engines top no...
OK, the nodes may be messed up. It shouldn't do that
Can you post what you've got for the nodes on the engine itself?
umbral lion
OK, the nodes may be messed up. It shouldn't do that
and when i attach something to the engines top node and then something to the bottom node and then remove the stuff from the bottom node then the fairing is gone
quasi pike
You should not need to employ that kludge, but this is what it should look like when there's just a part attached on the top node
Let's see what you've got for your node info in the part itself, and then look again at the fairing config
umbral lion
Can you post what you've got for the nodes on the engine itself?
you mean the nodes in the core part info?
quasi pike
Yep, that. Now to find my magnifying glass...
OK, those look fine. Let's see what you've got in your fairing config!
umbral lion
thats my fairing data
i only changed the local up axis to being up and checked the Aerodynamically Shield Components to true
and used my own values for cross section height ofc
umbral lion
hold on
same behaviourwhen something is attached to the top node but it it clips into my booster
and leaves a gap to the top
quasi pike
The position and clipping can be solved, but that doesn't address the odd behavior of it being there when it shouldn't
umbral lion
maybe the default construction checkbox? or the default fairing enabled toggle checkbox?
i'm testing those checkboxes
quasi pike
I don't think those will be it as I've got the same settings on my engines.
Would you mind moving the floating node position to be -0.275 in Y? I'm curious if that moves the fairing up with it's local up axis set to -1 in Y
umbral lion
Would you mind moving the floating node position to be -0.275 in Y? I'm curious ...
doesn't change the position of the fairing at all
and it clips the same way into the booster as before
quasi pike
Well nuts... So much for that theory
umbral lion
how did you offset the fairing position when the local up axis is set downwards?
thats what i meant before when i said the reason i changed it to upwards is i don't have to think upside down
quasi pike
I didn't need to do that for some reason. My info just looks like this
umbral lion
alright since the only difference between yours and mine is the aerodinamic shielding i'm gonna switch that off and see what happens
umbral lion
I didn't need to do that for some reason. My info just looks like this
lol?
quasi pike
When you make your part in blender is the engine facing up or down? Mine face up so the nozzle is at the top and would catch rain water, then I flip them in this transform
one this part of the prefab
Perhaps that's why you need your local up to be what it is and why mine is reversed from yours.
umbral lion
When you make your part in blender is the engine facing up or down? Mine face up...
my mesh in blender has the same orientation as it would have in the VAB (downward)
umbral lion
Perhaps that's why you need your local up to be what it is and why mine is rever...
yeah thats probably it
quasi pike
Ahh, that's probably why you need your local up set as it is. Best to leave it the way you had it then - I don't think that's the problem
umbral lion
well aerodynamic shielding wasn't causing it
quasi pike
I didn't think it would - but it was worth a try.
umbral lion
ahhh since your's is upside down maybe i need to change the floating node tag to top?
quasi pike
Hmmm... that could be it!
quasi pike
But hold on...
Yep, check this...
My top node has a position of (0, 0, 0), and my bottom node has position (0, -2.2, 0). Yours are the other way I think with your top at (0,0,0)
So... it may very well be that in the fairing config you need to change from using the bottom node to using the top.
umbral lion
haha guess what it doesn't change anything at all haha
quasi pike
If WHEN we get this sorted, we need to document this for the next engine build tutorial
did you change only the Fairing Node or only the Floating Attach Node Tag?
umbral lion
both
quasi pike
OK, so flipping both results in the same effect then. So, try flipping only one and then only the other
There are only 4 possible states, and it's stupid that we need to guess to figure this out, but we can figure this out!
umbral lion
YES!!!
both set to bottom works
the node attach id is bottom and the floating node is bottom too
now it behaves as usual
umbral lion
is there a "how to set up engine fairings" wiki page?
quasi pike
For now, I'll put this into my parts pack production procedure to try to capture the info about if you build your engine this way, then build your fairing this way and vice versa.
quasi pike
is there a "how to set up engine fairings" wiki page?
Not as such, modding documentation is a bit scattered
@frigid relic, where do you suggest we document this?
umbral lion
I think we should start a seperate wiki guide for this topic
hmmm i just realised i can not get rid of any modules in the VAB.. dropping them on the bin or inside the part manager doesn't work
just places the part inside the VAB behind the part manager menu
^^ haha it just never ends
quasi pike
Does selecting them and pressing the delete key work?
umbral lion
you mean backspace?
quasi pike
Also, you can try turning your camera view and then dropping in the bin
quasi pike
you mean backspace?
I thought it was the DEL key, but maybe it's backspace?
umbral lion
I thought it was the DEL key, but maybe it's backspace?
backspace works
but not the usual drag and drop part deletion
quasi pike
I've found that if there's another part that the bin is over, then dropping parts in the bin doesn't work, but if you change your camera view then it can work
umbral lion
nope just tried that with a blank VAB.. just selected one starting part and can't drop delete it
frigid relic
<@366972069440913418>, where do you suggest we document this?
Well, on the wiki, where everything else is, ideally
Or rather, should be
quasi pike
Well, on the wiki, where everything else is, ideally
OK, what about the parts pack production procedure? Would you like that to be there as well?
umbral lion
i think he meant if theres an existing page that suits this topic.. but i guess setting up a seperate "how to create engine fairings" guide would be best
quasi pike
I'm thinking it would be a little bit of work, but it could be organized better there and be more easily maintained as well
It's a bit complicated as there are interrelated aspects. Like if you built your engine facing up (as it clearly should be) or down... 😜
umbral lion
It's a bit complicated as there are interrelated aspects. Like if you built your...
well if you work hanging upside down from a tree i guess this is the appropriate part orientation yes 😉
quasi pike
The parts pack production procedure (a word doc) starts you from zero and takes you to a mod with multiple parts in it - with some added details for if they are engines
umbral lion
You will need to install Wwise
for adding existing engine sounds i need Wwise?.. or is this only for creating my own sounds?
quasi pike
I don't believe you can add existing engine sounds.
umbral lion
isnt there a unity editor sound module that i can add to my prefab?
quasi pike
I've never bothered with engine sounds as my only engines are super quiet stealth-mode electric engines
umbral lion
😩
umbral lion
I've never bothered with engine sounds as my only engines are super quiet stealt...
even those need a humming sound
umbral lion
well
quasi pike
Plus, I'm chronically lazy
umbral lion
this i can relate to
quasi pike
But you are right, there should be a humming sound or maybe a hissing sound. The stock Dawn ion engine has a tiny amount of sound.
umbral lion
but you know people who describe themself as lazy usually aren't really lazy at all
quasi pike
This is an area where we need further modding work!
Indolence is the mother of invention?
umbral lion
Indolence is the mother of invention?
indeed
quasi pike
haha
We do need some work on custom sounds for KSP2 mods, though
Engines, obviously - but also actuated stuff like deployable solar panels and such
Hmmm... Do the KESA solar panels have deploy sounds? Maybe @void ridge has some of this solved and some useful examples?
frigid relic
Kesa engines all have sounds
umbral lion
what's up with every program i want to download i need to create an account
keen stream
your reactors need a geiger counter sound schlosrat :p
quasi pike
what's up with every program i want to download i need to create an account
They're farming your info
umbral lion
drives me crazy every software provider does that now
quasi pike
your reactors need a geiger counter sound schlosrat :p
LOL! Yes! A nice ticking sound for something nuclear and bomb shaped. That will set everyone's mind at ease!
What's this count down display for? It's getting close to zero...
keen stream
why did my craft explode?
quasi pike
Yeah, and where are the parts, anyway? Shouldn't there be debris?
keen stream
why is the KSC a crater?
quasi pike
All I see is this rather hot expanding ball of plasma...
Well, there have been calls for weapons... I'm not inclined to answer those calls, but yeah
quasi pike
They fall into Other...
umbral lion
ok so only thing that stand between now and first release iteration is getting some rocket engine sounds on my part. Not sure if i can make it before monday
quasi pike
There have been engines released without sounds, but certainly with would be preferable.
I wish I could help you with that part, but I'm totally ignorant. What I will promise to do is to try to put some stuff in the wiki while it's still fairly fresh in my mind.
umbral lion
I wish I could help you with that part, but I'm totally ignorant. What I will pr...
That's ok i am used to path my own way through the jungle
Release without sounds is not a valid option for me.
but for those who like to try the current build feel free
quasi pike
but for those who like to try the current build feel free
Awesome! A pre-release for Early Adopters! How very Kerbal of you!
umbral lion
It's GPLv3 licensed so feel free to use it as you wish as long as you don't try to profit from it
oh and maybe let me know if it is my mod that causes not being able to drop delete parts in the VAB
frigid relic
I don't think it would be, the bug seems to happen quite randomly
umbral lion
I don't think it would be, the bug seems to happen quite randomly
btw i can see some static plume trails during reentry did you also notice this?
umbral lion
oh and the aerospike plume is invisible when you face it from the bottom
frigid relic
yeah that's just how all LFO plumes work
umbral lion
but yeah those are minor inconveniences
frigid relic
I wish I knew how to easily fix that but it's literally how the system is designed
umbral lion
yeah that's just how all LFO plumes work
oh really? never realised that
frigid relic
the shader renders the plume on the surface of a cylinder (which has no bottom surface)
I think that if you tried it with a cyliner with a bottom surface, it'd look really bad
though a better custom shape could probably be modeled to use as the plume mesh
for your specific use case
umbral lion
ahh ok yeah that makes sense
damn i need to stretch my legs a bit... will watch a Wwise tutorial on my tablet
void ridge
Hmmm... Do the KESA solar panels have deploy sounds? Maybe <@1066645941026820166...
Yep schlosrat, they have sound for deploy/retract.
wwise
quasi pike
Excellent! And you've got sound on your engines too?
frigid relic
if you don't mind, could you give a quick overview of what to do to add sounds to engines?
void ridge
KSP Part Engine Audio (script)
i need few days to finish my code and after, i can write a full wiki for sound
wwise + parts
frigid relic
thank you!
void ridge
thanks to you, i've just discover that the fresh install with UI template and my parts import have lost all sound references in engine 😦
frigid relic
oh no, I'm sorry about that, it didn't even cross my mind that the references to Wwise would break
void ridge
No problem, that's my fault
I've duplicated wwise project to keep first unity project. That broke references
Audio in part deploiement are in animations, not directly in parts for solar panels
For info
that's wwise sound events (first timeline) and on the right, this is the last sound event details
time to diner with family, see you
frigid relic
awesome, thanks for the help
quasi pike
@wraith wraith , if you're still having issues with your fairings then this #1202213563188650014 message may be a clue. We discovered today that the settings I've shared previously are particular to the engine being made in Blender with the nozzel bell facing upwards. If you happen to make yours with the bell facing down, then you'll want to be sure that the Fairing Node is set to bottom.
Also, see the writeup here: https://wiki.spacewarp.org/wiki/Parts_Pack_Production_Procedure
Speaking of which, I would not mind a review of what I've got there!
indigo relic
What a wonderful update, you guys are really the best in helping us!
frigid relic
one tiny thing
your "main" mod folder is actually Assets/plugin_template
that's where stuff like localization goes
KSP2UT copies the contents of that folder into the built mod
quasi pike
your "main" mod folder is actually Assets/plugin_template
Is that not particular to the new template? I thought the new template wasn't made to work with a codeless parts pack.
quasi pike
Ahh yes, I see I've already update SPARK accordingly.
Though I don't see localization there. If I put that there then KSP2UT would pick it up, right?
frigid relic
yes
basically, this folder (without the .meta files) will become your mod folder (+ the built addressables will be added when copying it)
quasi pike
So, in the guide something like this?
Where I assume the Assets\plugin_data folder was probably created (empty) by KLSP2UT - or at least without a localizations sub-folder
quasi pike
Fixed!
We should probably not be hijacking this thread. I was here mainly to call Isa's attention to the discovery about fairing configuration that was made earlier in this thread (apologies to @umbral lion!)
indigo relic
As I said, this project shoud be pinned cause (other than being awesome), it become a nice reference 😄 I should admit I lurked and tried to learn too..
wraith wraith
<@689957575458160697> , if you're still having issues with your fairings then th...
thanks, but the main issue is the part has loading issues (displays a red cylinder on load)
but then its fixed if i launch and revert to vab
so many issues bruh
quasi pike
bummer!
umbral lion
Oh no... wwise integration into my unity project is done but now all the ksp scripts don't load... package manager still shows the KSP2_x64 as being installed but when i try to add a now component it doesn't find any KSP scripts
umbral lion
No problem, that's my fault
I've duplicated wwise project to keep first unity p...
is this what you talked about?
umbral lion
We should probably not be hijacking this thread. I was here mainly to call Isa's...
All good... whatever helps the modding community is fine
warm viper
this is an amazing idea! i can’t wait to see it in completion great work
umbral lion
Sneak peak of the extend/retract animation of the engines
void ridge
is this what you talked about?
Hy Rafael. Not this problem for me. My parts had audio reference from old wwise project, not the new one copied (certainly references was broken)
umbral lion
Hy Rafael. Not this problem for me. My parts had audio reference from old wwise ...
Damn.. ok so your ksp scripts didn't break on your prefab?
frigid relic
Have you tried running Reimport on the KSP2_x64 package?
umbral lion
I have no idea how to solve this.. only thing i can do is delete the whole project folder and pull from my git repository
umbral lion
Have you tried running Reimport on the KSP2_x64 package?
hm?
umbral lion
ahh not in the package manager?
in the assets drop down menu? the reimport all?
ahhhhh
frigid relic
Reimport should be enough
frigid relic
Reimport all will reimport all packages 😆
umbral lion
still looks like this
ok i reimported all and still all the scripts can't be loaded
nah i think i'm just gonna model the medium part in blender and wait for the wiki guide on how to integrate wwise into unity
frigid relic
Another thing you can try to do is to create an empty C# script in the assets folder
From the right click menu
That's basically how we were solving this issue before ThunderKit was fixed
It should cause a domain reload
Also, definitely check the console
Because there may be something else causing the issue
umbral lion
YEEEESSSSS! my god thank youuu
frigid relic
But this is concerning that it's appeared again
I haven't seen it since TK was updated
umbral lion
everything as it was just because ot that new empty c# script
Great well then i stop working on the medium part and get the small one finished
void ridge
Damn.. ok so your ksp scripts didn't break on your prefab?
Sometime, it happened. That needs reinstall of thunderkit or import KSP2 libs ... honnestly, each time, i spent long time to test to find the solution ... i never used and C# unity before KSP2 ... it costs me hours sometimes 🙂
umbral lion
Sometime, it happened. That needs reinstall of thunderkit or import KSP2 libs .....
same
What do you guys think about instead of having 36 engines you only get 32 and in the four remaining pods you get integrated landing gear too?
so retractable engine pods and gear in a heatshield?
i could add some cool landing lights on the bottom of the gear pods
btw the gaps you see between the engine pods will get some extra shielding like this
@void ridge btw did you make two different engine sounds depending on atmosphere and vacuum or does ksp muffle those sounds themself?
frigid relic
What do you guys think about instead of having 36 engines you only get 32 and in...
oooh that sounds cool
umbral lion
oooh that sounds cool
Alright i'm thinking of an industrial looking piston ... still searching the internet for some ideas
void ridge
<@1066645941026820166> btw did you make two different engine sounds depending on...
same sounds for my engines. I'm not sure but KSP seems to use RTPC Mapping for modify sound.
Damned !!!!!
NullReferenceException: Object reference not set to an instance of an object
LFO.Shared.ShaderEditor.FloatParam.ApplyToMaterial (System.Single curThrottle, System.Single curAtmo, UnityEngine.Material material) (at ./Library/PackageCache/lfo.editor@d424e4c284/Shared/ShaderEditor/FloatParam.cs:40)
LFO.Shared.Components.LFOThrottleData.UpdateVisuals (System.Single curThrottle, System.Single curAtmo, System.Single curAngleVel, UnityEngine.Vector3 curAccelerationDir) (at ./Library/PackageCache/lfo.editor@d424e4c284/Shared/Components/LFOThrottleData.cs:81)
LFO.Shared.Components.LFOThrottleDataMasterGroup+<>c__DisplayClass21_0.<UpdateVisuals>b__0 (LFO.Shared.Components.LFOThrottleData a) (at ./Library/PackageCache/lfo.editor@d424e4c284/Shared/Components/LFOThrottleDataMasterGroup.cs:62)
System.Collections.Generic.List1[T].ForEach (System.Action1[T] action) (at <eef08f56e2e042f1b3027eca477293d9>:0)
LFO.Shared.Components.LFOThrottleDataMasterGroup.UpdateVisuals (System.Single curThrottle, System.Single curAtmo, System.Single curAngleVel, UnityEngine.Vector3 curAccelerationDir) (at ./Library/PackageCache/lfo.editor@d424e4c284/Shared/Components/LFOThrottleDataMasterGroup.cs:62)
LFO.Shared.Components.LFOThrottleDataMasterGroup.Update () (at ./Library/PackageCache/lfo.editor@d424e4c284/Shared/Components/LFOThrottleDataMasterGroup.cs:82)
building addressables failed. LFO editor reinstall not solving this error
umbral lion
😮
void ridge
same for me ... problems 🙂
umbral lion
summon the munix i can't help with LFO editor
void ridge
yep
umbral lion
yep
Ahh another question regarding animations.. did you animate your solar panels in blender? And if so how did you tie them to your prefab in the unity editor??
umbral lion
haha it was a how
umbral lion
both, it depends
ok i just wanted to know if the animations made in blender carry over into unity with the fbx file
void ridge
both, it depends of complexity
for simple animation, i use unity
for complex, blender
blender, you can use armature which permits complex animation, with inverse kinematics
if you just need rotating pieces (for example), unity can do it
umbral lion
blender, you can use armature which permits complex animation, with inverse kine...
Yeah it's a bit of a complex animation... but when i export it as fbx and bake the animation then every part of the armature is gone as soon as i import it in unity editor
void ridge
i bake animation and export it on fbx
on unity, mesh property -> tab for animation and tab for armature
you check armature on export fbx property ?
umbral lion
ahhhhh ok
well let me check it again maybe i missed that
armature has the chebox add leaf bones
umbral lion
ok i left out setting the scaling to FBX Units Scale and Armature FBX Type Root... maybe it works now i'll test it
Still.. left image is from Blender and right image is how the model looks in unity ^^
thank you anyway.. i think i need to watch some more tutorials
void ridge
model don't have to change 😉
umbral lion
model don't have to change 😉
hm?
void ridge
on the screenshot i sent, there are parameters for scale. Don't change 😉
fbx units scale
1
umbral lion
yeah
void ridge
normaly, you need to apply rotation, scale of your pieces before exporting, for better results
object -> apply rotation (and/or) scale on blender
umbral lion
object -> apply rotation (and/or) scale on blender
oh no... ^^ when i apply rotation it looks like this
god damn
ok almost finished with repairs
void ridge
sorry, you need to do that before linking parents and anims
umbral lion
all good .. i applied all rotations and scales .. it didn't break animation... just need to align them
void ridge
ok
void ridge
a long way 🙂
void ridge
they are on hierarchy, on the left side of the screen ?
umbral lion
they are on hierarchy, on the left side of the screen ?
yeah
void ridge
check Mesh Renderer ?
void ridge
nice !
void ridge
select your mesh in windows project
on inspector, there is a tab Animation
Anim Compression -> Off (Unity don't recalculate animation for optimization)
then, on windows project, open your mesh
umbral lion
can you show me a screenshot?
void ridge
on the project windows, on the left, you can see Scene on my open mesh ?
select it and CTRL+D
it will copy the animation and you can use it as an object
umbral lion
Ahh ok my armature and the animation isn't in the hierarchy hold on i think in know how to fix this
indigo relic
Out of curiosity: how does one “trigger” the animation for a KSP part? does it requires a custom module and some standard Unity methods? (sorry if asking here @umbral lion !)
void ridge
you add a module animator on your partwhere you set your animator controller object. on animator controller, you build schema with animations and transitions
this is your question ?
indigo relic
Yes it was exactly this, thanks @void ridge !
umbral lion
Out of curiosity: how does one “trigger” the animation for a KSP part? does it r...
Yeah thats exactly what i tried to figure out too.. but i was so tired i couldn't concentrate so i went to sleep
frigid relic
when you look for example at the JSON data of stock solar panels, you can see that the PartComponentModule_SolarPanel has a Data_Deployable entry
and inside it there's configuration for the animation
it belongs in there because Module_SolarPanel extends the Module_Deployable class
as for engine animations, like the stock deep-space methalox engines, I could only find "DeployedModeAnimationStateShortName": "OPENED" in the JSON file in the Module_Engine's data
and "RunAnimationOnActivateDeactivate": true
umbral lion
I finally found the animation tab i was searching yesterday for far too long
and all four animations are there. but first of all i need to refill my coffee mug brb
umbral lion
you add a module animator on your partwhere you set your animator controller obj...
do i need to put the animator controller on the mesh itself or the prefab?
@frigid relic i modeled a landing gear yesterday only to find out it doesn't extend far enough to actually reach the ground xD
frigid relic
oh no 😆
umbral lion
i vastly underestimated the increased dimensions between small and medium parts
void ridge
do i need to put the animator controller on the mesh itself or the prefab?
Just drag and drop in animator module field which ask for controller reference
void ridge
<@366972069440913418> i modeled a landing gear yesterday only to find out it doe...
Landing gear is complex. I made ont part, not another 🙂
umbral lion
Multi Stage Piston Landing Gear Preview
With this the module has enough ground clearence when landed while keeping a small form factor when the landing gear is retracted
frigid relic
Nice!
umbral lion
I am currently searching for rocket engine sounds that i can use for my mod... downloaded 8gb of sample packages in wwise but not a single rocket sound.. the closest thing was firecrackers. If anyone knows a sound library that is free to use for rocket sounds please share.. I don't make money out of this so i can only offer mentioning in the readme and mod description. If i don't get any sounds within the next three days i will release the first part without sounds.
indigo relic
What about NASA sounds? https://www.nasa.gov/audio-and-ringtones/ I think they are released in the public domain, and I don't think this falls into commercial use neither https://www.nasa.gov/nasa-brand-center/images-and-media/
karmic sand
It's GPLv3 licensed so feel free to use it as you wish as long as you don't try ...
I just noticed this and I much appreciate you releasing under the GPL, but keep in mind that the GPL does absolutely allow commercial (or any other) use of the licensed code, as long as the the source code is made available when distributing products based on said code to other people.
See for instance https://www.mend.io/blog/top-10-gpl-license-questions-answered/#4_Can_I_sell_GPL-licensed_software
And sorry if you were already aware and I just misinterpreted your statement.
keen stream
Id suggest something like CC-BY-SA-NC if you want something non commercial
Especially since yours is all art assets and no source code
And that keeps the same kind of viral licensing that gpl does
umbral lion
Woah so many replies sorry i was completely drawn into getting the mesh for the landing gear ready
here is a sneak peek of the current state.. i separated the bottom of the gear housing and made a foot pad with an ankle that is fully modeled but not animated at the moment... i'm just happy how flush it closes up.
tomorrow i should be able to put everything together and get the medium part into unity for testing before mesh polishing and texturing
umbral lion
What about NASA sounds? https://www.nasa.gov/audio-and-ringtones/ I think they a...
Thank you! i will look into it tomorrow! very appreciated
umbral lion
I just noticed this and I much appreciate you releasing under the GPL, but keep ...
yeah i know about the GPLv3 that's why my project has this license .. open source makes the world strong
umbral lion
Id suggest something like CC-BY-SA-NC if you want something non commercial
are those abbreviations licenses? must look them up
frigid relic
it's one of the many types of Creative Commons licenses
umbral lion
I found engine sounds on free databank on internet
yeah idk i think google hates me... the stuff that the search engine returns is unusable
frigid relic
umbral lion
Also two images of the medium part... the engines can fully retract and the red dots mark where the landing gear will be.. the second image is still an early prototype of a part designed to hide the gaps andmoves with the engines.
Want more thrusters? xD
frigid relic
it's looking great!
umbral lion
Can't wait to see other people have it ingame and make awesome rockets and landers with it
keen stream
it's one of the many types of Creative Commons licenses
The one I thought fit the closest to GPL with the non commercial requirement specifically
umbral lion
yep GPLv3 is what i have chosen for my git repository
frigid relic
what Cheese is saying that GPL does allow anyone to take it and sell it
while the CC-BY-NC-SA license doesn't
umbral lion
huh? i wasn't aware of that
frigid relic
(also, from a technical standpoint, licenses like GPL, MIT, MPL, Apache, etc. are mostly concerned with source code, while CC licenses are geared towards art and other assets)
frigid relic
huh? i wasn't aware of that
basically, with GPL, anyone can sell it, but if asked, they have to provide the source code
I think even providing the source code can be for money
umbral lion
ahhh ok.. hmm i see.. good to know
frigid relic
of course, this is just my layman understanding of the license, but it's what I gathered from reading about it
this is not legal advice
umbral lion
😆
well then i probably should change my git repository publish license
That might not even be possible.. from what i read i will need to delete the repository and make a new one.. changing the license is problematic since whoever downloaded it will not be aware that the license has changed
frigid relic
basically, the way it works should be that the version that is currently in your repository (and all the previous ones when the license was GPL) will be under that license, and any new versions you put out would be under the new license
but if you want to remove the GPL-based versions, then yeah, the easiest way would be to remove and recreate the repository
umbral lion
Just had an awesome idea how to finish the gaps... that blades covering the gaps even though looks like it would collide with the mesh when retracting doesnt ^^ different pivot points make it possible... i'm super happy with the result. No geometry clipping.. everything works flawlessly
retracted state looks super smooth and aerodynamic and on the other side while extended those thrusters are kinda like an airbrake in itself haha xD
umbral lion
but if you want to remove the GPL-based versions, then yeah, the easiest way wou...
yeah i mean for the first small part i don't care but i got big plans now that i know how to make landing gear and complex folding mechanics... i don't want to spoiler anything but those HIRE modules are just the beginning. Better redo it now before the next commit. but first i need sleep. good night!
indigo relic
Just had an awesome idea how to finish the gaps... that blades covering the gaps...
this is really cool!
void ridge
<@1066645941026820166> like https://freesound.org/?
Yes like this one
umbral lion
Alright i got a soundfile from my wwise soundbank in unity editor and added the event to the "KSP Part Engine Audio" component of my prefab.. hope this works
The soundbank itself is put on the WwiseGlobal object... at least that's what the youtube tutorial told me to do. I'm open for any advice on improvements. If this works then i'm going to create a few more sound files for engine cut off event and flame out (out of fuel) event
umbral lion
integrating the landing legs today... will remodel the foot pad to match the gear pod bottom following the lines of the blades that are covering the gaps between each segment
this is the current foot pad shape
and this is the shape it needs to have to fit... also looks much cooler imo
open for suggestions if they arrive in time
quasi pike
and this is the shape it needs to have to fit... also looks much cooler imo
Why would it keystone like that where it appears to be narrower on the outside edge than it is on the inside? Referring here to the second image with the red boarder around the shape.
quasi pike
this is the current foot pad shape
I like the look of the second image, but what would the purpose be of the raised bits inside the foot tray? These presumably fit into the space above, but why fill that space?
I agree they look cool, just wondering what the "purpose" would be other than to be there and look cool?
umbral lion
Why would it keystone like that where it appears to be narrower on the outside e...
it comes from those blades
quasi pike
Ah, then I think the blades are wrong. When they are retracted, where would that wedge between the engines go?
Is it magically absorbed?
umbral lion
no
they have different pivot points than the thruster pods
i will try to make a short video of it... just havent rigged it up with bones to make the proces short enough for a quick screen capture
quasi pike
If the blades had a T shape where the top of the T is the blade wouldn't that make more sense? They would be lighter if made real for one, and there would be more room for the engines and landing legs.
umbral lion
maybe this explains it better
the blades pivot point is on the outside
they fold in and up
the thruster pods have their pivot point on the inside
in the closed state the tip of the blades slightly touch the intersection between thruster shroud and heatshield
wraith wraith
you should enable autosmooth
umbral lion
you should enable autosmooth
i will during poslishing.. for modeling i want to see the edges
quasi pike
An animation might help, I'm still not quite getting it. To me, visually they are reminescent of the blades around an afterburning get engine nozzle where they serve the purpose of allowing the nozel to expand and contract - but presumably that's not their purpose here
wraith wraith
i mean you can see them in edit mode, plus you can model while making sure your normals wont be messed up
but sure
umbral lion
i mean you can see them in edit mode, plus you can model while making sure your ...
yeah but it helps me in the process to smooth it at the end after modeling.
umbral lion
An animation might help, I'm still not quite getting it. To me, visually they ar...
actually thats exactly what they are here for
this is the mechanic expand and retract
just the blades are missing to hide the gaps
quasi pike
Each engine has it's own contained nozzle where the plume emerges before interacting with the heat sheild to form an aerospike, so I'm not at all clear on what these are doing or how they would contribute. In the expand/retract animation the parts that are folding out are the engines and their individual nozzles, right?
umbral lion
yeah 32 engines and 4 landing legs
quasi pike
just the blades are missing to hide the gaps
What function do the blades actually serve other than to be decorative?
They will hide the gap between individual nozels, but to what actual purpose?
umbral lion
What function do the blades actually serve other than to be decorative?
well aerodynamics
quasi pike
The individual engines each have nozzles that essentially terminate at the circular exit for their part, so these blades are behind them and cant really effect the exhast flow.
umbral lion
the real world thing doesn't have the funtion to retract their engines
ahhh.. this thing is for reentry
quasi pike
Does it have anything like these blades or a skirt around the nozzels? I don't recall it having that
umbral lion
yeah for lift off they wont do much
umbral lion
Does it have anything like these blades or a skirt around the nozzels? I don't r...
no.. it could in fact extend some nozzles out of the pods once they are out but i havent modlesd them
quasi pike
For lift off this second stage is all behind a fairing skirt so yes, there would be no effect from the blades
umbral lion
well for reentry and breaking burn i imagine having a lot of gaps in between the thruster pods would create more vibrations than if they are shielded.. but yeah we'll never know since the real world thing is smaller and doesn't have that mechanic
i just wanted something to fill those gaps
quasi pike
During reentry, when the engines are not deployed the blades would have little or no effect I think. When the engines are deployed they are generating thrust so there's a lot of flow out there and it would seem the blades have not effect. They don't extend down tar enough to be part of the engines nozzels, and the air stream around them would be highly turbulent with some flow up due to the descent and soem flow down due to the exhaust.
quasi pike
It there are vibrations (and I'm sure there would be) then the blades being there will give the engines something to whack against - which doesn't seem ideal
umbral lion
i can make two versions one with them and one without them and see wich one is more desired
quasi pike
so you mean they should be bigger?
I think they look cool, but would be very unlikely to ever be found on a real engine as they add weight and complexity without providing any benefit I can see
Ultimately, this is a game - and there's much to be said for looking cooler
Maybe if they flipped out like grid fins to help steer... But then you'd expect them at the top of the stage and not the bottom or they'd induce an unstable torque and flip you upside down.
umbral lion
maybe they could act as some sort of air brake?.. when extended it would increase drag?
quasi pike
That would be the grid fin approach, but then they're at the wrong end of the stage for stability.
Actually, I'd wonder if this engine might not be one a craft that has grid fins as well - but those would be separate parts.
umbral lion
yeah stoke space will use grid fins
quasi pike
Makes perfect sense that they should!
I do think the blades look nice, but I think if it were my part I'd make them either a T shape to allow more room for the engines and legs or make them flat (in the visible part of the shape).
umbral lion
i also thought about a module with one centered engine in a shiedshield
quasi pike
You mean where Stoke Space has their engine turbine exhaust?
umbral lion
yeah
the engine nozzle is built to withstand almost seven times the heat that it needs to manage during reentry
quasi pike
Would you get enough thrust? In the single engine scenario we see Falcon 9 burning one relatively larger engine at times, and burning more at other times, but they fill the bottom with engines to cover the use cases for that stage.
umbral lion
Would you get enough thrust? In the single engine scenario we see Falcon 9 burni...
well just make it larger
big hole in the middle and heatshield around.. maybe even a mechanic to close the hole
quasi pike
I like what you've got now better, but that could work
umbral lion
@quasi pike how about changing the hinge of the thruster pods from the inside to the outside? then they would look something like this
the blades would still be necessary for the gaps but they wouldn't stick out anymore
have to try that in a seperate copy of the mesh
but then the thrusters would be facing slightly inwards
quasi pike
What if the hinge point for the engines was at the centerline for the engine axis? What if, when extended, the nozzle faces are not canted in or out so that when tucked in they might be at an odd angle but you wouldn't care because they aren't operating.
umbral lion
problem would be more gaps at the top where it connects to the upper plate if the pivot point would be centered along the thrust cones axis
the engines nozzle faces need to be canted because the heat shield has a smaller diameter. if they would be same as the floor then you would either get awful gaps during the rotating transition or have the mesh magically disappearing into the heatshield
but if you like i can send you the .blend file and you can see for yourself
umbral lion
@quasi pike so this is with the other thruster pod geometry.. you can spot the difference on the gear housing
advantage of this is that the gap covers wont need an overhang because the pivot points are both on the outer edge
actually i like this even better.. now i don't need an ankle at the landing gear since the bottom is already slanted in the right direction.. so if the gear piston slightly rotates outwards it gives a much sturdier stand and the foot pad doesn't need an extra joint or animation
wouldn't have thought of that possibility thank you @quasi pike
umbral lion
reworked version looks much cleaner and and sturdier
umbral lion
Wiki is done 🙂
https://wiki.spacewarp.org/wiki/Sounds_for_parts_with_Wwise_and_...
Medium sized part is done ^^ ... Thanks for the Wiki.. perfect timing
umbral lion
slow motion of the machanism if someone wants a closer look
i already have some ideas for the large version.. ^^ it will be pretty cool part
frigid relic
Damn this looks so cool
indigo relic
I’ll surely download this ❤️
umbral lion
@wraith wraith i enabled auto smooth just for you 😉
wraith wraith
🔥
umbral lion
I would love to add some landing lights and flood lights. Never done that before.. will probably come with a future update.. i want to get the first two parts out.
alright time to fetch something to eat. peace
finite oracle
Just came up to date with this thread, and it looks awesome! I am so looking forward to beta testing this when it is available!
warm viper
i cannot wait to have this in game to play with
umbral lion
Alright big day ... the two parts transitioned from blender into the unity editor as the 2.5 meter module modeling is complete
Now the first problem is the little doors covering the upper end of the landing leg piston when rotated outwards are invisible.. but just from the outside... if i look at the mesh from inside the model then its visible... no idea what went wrong here but i should be able to fix that by remodeling them in blender real quick
and while i'm at it i can also do the mesh for reentry effect and a better mesh for the collider since unity editor only offers a cylinder at best
but the real problem that i don't know how to fix at the moment is the landing gears collider since it must move and transition with the animation. if anyone know how to go about this then let me know
@void ridge you did a landing gear once right?... how did you make the collider move with the animation?
ahhh i'm stupid... create a mesh in blender and include it in the animation?
yeah i think thats the solution.
void ridge
<@1066645941026820166> you did a landing gear once right?... how did you make th...
that was a pain. I spent many days to success. I don't remember how and i've decided to never make another landing gear 🙂
umbral lion
that doesn't sound good at all .. i hope this isn't my fate
umbral lion
that was a pain. I spent many days to success. I don't remember how and i've dec...
but you would have needed this also for solar panels or anything that includes an animation and needs it's collider to transform accordingly
void ridge
Sorry Rafael, i didn't well understand your question.
usaly, with each mesh, i create a child gameobject, named col, with colllider on it
it moves with my mesh
that's correct aswer this time ? 😉
umbral lion
ahh ok and when the parent object transitions in the animation then the child object which is the collider mesh does too
umbral lion
you add a module animator on your partwhere you set your animator controller obj...
can you share a screenshot of your animation controller?
when i drag my animations into the controller one of them is always connected to entry.. doesn't that imply the animation is playing as soon as the part is loaded?
void ridge
copy this file in your asset folder
this is an example of controller
with that, you'll how to do
anim connected to entry is the start state
for example, à solar panel retracted
umbral lion
so i need an animation that doesn't animate at all for this
void ridge
for example with a solar panel, 4 animations :
retracted -> deploy -> deployed -> retract
deployed and retracted : only 1 frame
umbral lion
ok i only got the transitions but not the states.. ^^ alright back to blender then
your controller sample is perfect all that i need
void ridge
cool
umbral lion
and if this is set up then theres a "toggle" switch in ksp when right clicking the part?
umbral lion
the controller or the animator component?
void ridge
the controller (like i sent you)
nop
sorry
i have a gameobject with Animator component
on this component, you drag&drop the controller (on the controller field)
umbral lion
ahh yes on the controller field but not on the animator field
alright got me confused for a second+
void ridge
and, you drag&drop this gameobject in the Animator field of you deployable_module
sorry, i wasn't clear
and sorry for my (poor) english
umbral lion
and sorry for my (poor) english
your english is good don't worry. okay so my controller looks now like this
umbral lion
umbral lion
and theres the nasty red cylinder again
umbral lion
and colliders not working but they show up in unity explorer
umbral lion
alright! fixed the collider and the infamous red cylinder is gone too... turned out all it needed was a fresh game
animations are still not working but i will tackle this problem in a few hours after sleeping
in the meanwhile i want your opinion what the large module should have as an additional function. The small part is just a ring of thrusters with a heatshield and a cooling system that lets you convert liquid fuel into ablator (simulating the heatshield cooling of stoke space). The medium module now has all of the above plus an integrated landing legs and of course 32 instead of 24 thrusters. The large module will have all the medium part features but should have one additional perk. I thought about using the large space inside the heatshield for a service bay.. possibly with a ramp for a small rover but i'm not entirely sure if the large part is in fact large enough for this.
So let me know what cool feature you would want to see in the large HIRE module
If we can find another cool feature i would use the rover/service bay for the xlarge module.. it probably has more usage with a bigger diameter
umbral lion
i have a gameobject with Animator component
so the animator component is not on the prefab but a new game object? where in the hierarchy is this game object? in the model?
but the component "module deployable" is on the prefab right?
I currently have both the animator and the module deployable script on my prefab
and this is my landing leg hierarchy for all 4 landing legs.. do you mean i need an animator component in a new game oject for every part that moves?
umbral lion
really need to make those thruster nozzles darker
quasi pike
This is amazing progress!
keen stream
really need to make those thruster nozzles darker
Is it possible to make then paintable?
frigid relic
the rise of the pink nozzle
quasi pike
I would not make the nozzle paintable. Honestly. There are some things that should not be painted by players, and nozzles are definitely one of them.
keen stream
I mean I dont see the issue
Itd make it possible to make the heatshield more flush with the rocket
Its not like this nozzle is like such that on say the swivel engin
Its embedded into the structure
quasi pike
Given that the "nozzles" in this case are encased in foldout boxes, perhaps give theouter surface of the encasing box a paintable surface?
keen stream
Given that the "nozzles" in this case are encased in foldout boxes, perhaps give...
Thats uhh what I was meaning
quasi pike
I'd still not make the base where the exhaust comes out paintable, and I think an argument might be made for why none of it should be. It's going to get too hot for paint.
void ridge
so the animator component is not on the prefab but a new game object? where in t...
On screenshot i sent to you, it is in "model" gameobject
umbral lion
Is it possible to make then paintable?
Yes.. the current colors are just my prototype paintjob to make Individual parts more visible. They all will be paintable to make the spceships, drop pods and landers of your liking
umbral lion
I'd still not make the base where the exhaust comes out paintable, and I think a...
some things one shall not be able to paint
this nights task is getting the animation to work
maybe someone can explain to me the component "Module_Deployable Script"... I'm not sure if i've done this right and since every possible video tutorial out there is focusing on humanoid avatar animations i am a but clueless
i currently have set it up like this with the animator and the module deploayable components added to my prefab
i will now try to make a new game object in with model as parent just for the animator as @void ridge told me.. lets see what that does
umbral lion
alright so putting a new game object with the animator and module doployable and the model as parent didn't work either
i will try again and dump the log maybe i can find something there
Do i need to set up anything in the module deployable script?
indigo relic
Hi @umbral lion ! I'm not an expert here, I'd like just to give you a suggestion (if you didn't already tried it): have you looked in the @void ridge great Kesa mod? downloading it from github I mean and looking into the Unity Project. I don't know if this could help you, but I'd do this https://github.com/JiMKesa/kesa/tree/main/src/kesa.Unity/kesa.Unity/Assets/Mod
umbral lion
yeah i might have to do this anyway i have no idea what i did wrong...
umbral lion
Hi <@100082075725484032> ! I'm not an expert here, I'd like just to give you a s...
same for his main tree
indigo relic
You should have a GitHub Account
but in any case, there is a "Download" button
if you don't have one (even if I suggest you to start using it to track your work)
umbral lion
what they want my account credentials? haha
no my account doesn't work would have suprised me
indigo relic
no my account doesn't work would have suprised me
What I mean is: did you register yourself on github? https://github.com/join
umbral lion
indigo relic
Ah, right! Perfect
umbral lion
What I mean is: did you register yourself on github? https://github.com/join
yeah ... this is my repository --> https://github.com/Jebbedia/HIRE
indigo relic
yeah ... this is my repository --> https://github.com/Jebbedia/HIRE
Immediate star
umbral lion
too kind
@indigo relic do you have any suggestions what the upcoming large hire module should have as a feature on top of everything the medium one has?
for example the medium has landing legs which the small one doesnt
umbral lion
haha it will have more... 44 to be precise
umbral lion
small one had 24 thrusters.. medium 32..
but it could be a four in one
i thought about a service bay with a ramp for maybe a small rover
but i'm not sure if a large part is big enough for it.. maybe thats better suited on the xlarge
indigo relic
i thought about a service bay with a ramp for maybe a small rover
woah wait this is my dream
umbral lion
woah wait this is my dream
but just a minute ago you said you are not sure if the larger module needs something else ^^
alright then a small bay with a ramp it is then.. suited for scientific gear or a little rover
and the xlarge will have a bigger bay of course as well as everything the medium has and one additional feature
but that is tbd ... not gonna spoil everything here
this is the size of the large module compared to the current medium one
indigo relic
huge!
void ridge
Hi <@100082075725484032> ! I'm not an expert here, I'd like just to give you a s...
I put all my sources, you can have a look on everything
umbral lion
I put all my sources, you can have a look on everything
Thats exactly what i do right now 😉 thank you for your help
btw this could be where the ramp folds down making use of the huge space inside the heatshield and being easy accessible from the ground
above is the thruster ring with the four gear pods
umbral lion
with cool industrial looking pistons from the top
and an extending ramp that goes down to the ground
you could pack all your kerbal needs in there for on site exploration
and scientific experiments of course
warm viper
<@434697140833615879> do you have any suggestions what the upcoming large hire m...
maybe wider stance legs
like that stretch wider then they do downward
umbral lion
maybe wider stance legs
this is the current stance. it's as large as the outer diameter of the part
umbral lion
like that stretch wider then they do downward
wider than downward?
warm viper
one sec
umbral lion
that would be more than a 45° angle are you sure?