I /headpat my steward each time I summon them
#beta-ptr-spoilers
tropic trail
paper veldt
I think 10.0 will explain what broke the arbiter not sl
distant folio
why are even still speculating about who disabled the Arbiter and caused the drought
it's clearly said throughout the Revendreth campaign, and in the finale when you finish all zones, that Denathrius is the one responsible for the drought
Prince Renathal says: The drought was his doing. He stole the very lifeblood of our realms, starving his own people... and yours as well.
Prince Renathal says: When his lies were exposed, Denathrius unleashed his vast coffers of anima into the Maw... to fuel the might of his true master.
distant folio
well it does, doesn't it?
- the drought is caused by the Arbiter not sending souls to their afterlife anymore and letting them all go to the Maw
- the drought is caused by Denathrius
so Denathrius knocked out the arbiter
orchid lodge
question is - HOW
he maybe planned it, not mean how he done it
why he done it now
dense plover
why did he do it now? Because the bargain with sylvanas, now warchief, had been established, and helya's plans were also in motion
orchid lodge
and why he needed sylvanas and all this for it? only azeroth have such amount of souls?
dense plover
azeroth had easy access, and an attachment to the realm of death through the helm of domination
orchid lodge
then it was preplanned long before and still no answer why
dense plover
because the jailer wants to break free?
because he was locked away
and none of the people working with the jailer are okay with death being what it is
they want to tear it down and redo it all
this is like - a super obvious why
its stated when sylvanas destroys the helm
its stated when we first go to the maw
its in the wow cinematic with anduin and sylvanas
rigid drum
hello and when will be unlocked all WoW: Shadowlands content to official PTR servers please ? -))
-))
👍 😩
dense wren
anyone know the timer for famu the infinite?
dense plover
hello and when will be unlocked all WoW: Shadowlands content to official PTR ser...
never
ptr isnt a free version of wow
you need to buy the expac to have access
frozen stratus
mr peach do you know how much the soulkeeper upgrade does?
frozen stratus
okay thank you
dense plover
it increases such that you will be able to get the rank 4 upgrades after a few weeks at the last level
tropic trail
@icy valley @cunning fossil
||Other than basic physical similarities (has a busted mask, physique, voice actor), the Runecarver is a master smith thats created numerous porful artifacts and has taken responsibility for making Frostmourne and the Helm of Domination. Playing through the leveling campaign of Maldraxxus, you empower the Runeblade that the Primus left in the challenge stone, and Heirmir goes on to say how they learned everything about forging from the Primus, so the Primus is also clearly a master craftsman. With the warning he leaves to be taken to the other Eternals, and the many references by the Maldraxxi and others as to how he was a master tactician and planned for events ahead of time makes him an obvious enemy to Zovaal the Jailer and an excellent candidate for memory removal. And who do we find locked away in his own section of Torghast than a master craftsman with his memories extracted and wiped away? The Runecarver||
icy valley
||I did have the initial thought that, yeah, the Primus is the Runecarver when I first saw stuff, but I'm not sure. It's certainly possible. I'm just very interested in what the Primus meant with the Sepulcher and why Zovaal musn't reach it.||
tropic trail
||The Jailer doesn't seem like the type to just yeet away an asset as useful as the Primus. Seems way smarter to just remove him as a threat by taking away his memories and locking him up while still using him to craft shit for him||
icy valley
||You'd think he'd ask about the Sepulcher before wiping his memory though..||
cunning fossil
Perhaps he was stubborn and the Jailer said "Ugh fine." and decided to extract memories in order to breach it himself
icy valley
Perhaps.
I wonder, if the raid formula will be the same as in Legion and BFA..
We're getting zone raid (Revendreth), lvl 60 zone raid (Maw), new bonus zone raid (???), new realm raid (???)
And a bonus side raid, somewhere in between
I hope that will be a Broker raid
I really don't trust those fellas
tropic trail
Well there's that empty podium next to the portal to Oribos on the first floor of the portal room in Org
I don't think it'll be connected to the Shadowlands
icy valley
It might. I don't trust the Arbiter either.
And 'The Purpose'.
It's just too single-minded.
Like the Light.
Or the Titans.
cunning fossil
I think the Arbiter for the most part is alright? We know little about her tho.
frozen stratus
I dont think so tbh
cunning fossil
possibly
icy valley
So far, a lot of stuff has been single-minded. Titans, Bastion, Arbiter, Light.
cunning fossil
I feel that the Jailer is too chaotic. Let him have his way and the entire universe is hit play ground
icy valley
Sylvanas and the Jailer look to break that single-minded ness.
I would gladly side with them.
But I can't.
Where's my Maw Covenant 😠
cunning fossil
It's clear that there are issues with the single minded ness. but that doesn't mean conpletely tearing it down and "rebuilding" is a good idea
frozen stratus
the jailer is evil though
cunning fossil
fuck sylvanas ngl
icy valley
To us, he looks evil.
frozen stratus
icy valley
But they just want a different System of Death.
icy valley
I'm starting to dislike that Azeroth is the only planet that's important.
I know, she's got a titan soul.
But, meh..
I just feel too special.
Maw Walker, Champion of Azeroth.
Too much, man..
tropic trail
She's got a HUGE Titan soul, mentioned multiple times to be potentially more powerful than any one member of the Pantheon
frozen stratus
yeah
icy valley
I get it, but it just feels a bit off..
frozen stratus
I mean we've been kicking around for almost 2 decades
icy valley
Also, if Azeroth does break free, what happens to our planet
frozen stratus
of course we're going to be pretty powerful
icy valley
Do we just lose it?
tropic trail
Nah, she just moves out of it. Planet still stays there
frozen stratus
we dont know do we?
tropic trail
Well, theoretically
frozen stratus
argus was still kinda in tact.. but that was the legion
tropic trail
I don't think Titans yeet themselves out of their planet-eggs like the Hulk in a tight Hanes t-shirt
icy valley
I don't expect the planet to be super stable afterwards though.
frozen stratus
I mean it depends really
if azeroth falls to corruption or other forces
we're doomed
tropic trail
Nah, that's why the Titans built so many of their works on Azeroth to maintain its stability
cunning fossil
Maw Walker, Champion of Azeroth.
That's why I'm so happy they call us Mortals
Also, Maw Waler isn't a special title it would seem. Since they say "A Maw Walker" not "THE Maw Walker"
frozen stratus
we are special here
we're fucking tied to azeroths soul in no way a mortal has ever been
its why we can use the first ones shit afaik
icy valley
I just hope we don't become Champion of the Universe.
frozen stratus
I just hope we don't become Champion of the Universe.
too late
tropic trail
Yeah, like, other worlds have been claimed by the Void already otherwise we wouldn't have Void Lords to begin with. If it was a regular Titan soul then rather than deal with all the trouble trying to take it they'd just go worry about another planet
cunning fossil
but it's not just 1 person. It's multiple people. they said in the end of campaign cinematix "EVERY mortal must xjoosea covenant"
meaning your character isn't the only one that exists
frozen stratus
Yeah, like, other worlds have been claimed by the Void already otherwise we woul...
well if they even got 1 titan soul it could be the end of the cosmic war (at least how they have put it in what ive seen)
yes every mortal when they die
we're not dead
tropic trail
@frozen stratus nah, because you need Titan souls to make Void Lords and there are already Void Lords, meaning they must have already claimed other Titan souls. We even see in multiple raids and instances visions of worlds the Void has already consumed
frozen stratus
hmm
tropic trail
Yeah, there are numerous references to other mortals being Maw Walkers already. Hell, we set up portals to Azeroth canonically as soon as we get to Oribos just to bring more people with us
cunning fossil
Why would they say "Every mortal must chose a covenant." if they meant dead souls, that literally are being sent steaight to thw maw. With 0 way to "choose" anything
So yep. Every mortal. We're not that special. We're more so an asset
frozen stratus
that seems like just shit story telling
cause the jailer even says it at the end of the scenario
none of the other chuckle fucks can open the gateway
but we can
tropic trail
It feels more like you're not understanding the story as provided
Tbh
Well yeah probably because we have massive exposure to Azerite
cunning fossil
^^
cunning fossil
But it's still a WE as in actual plural people
frozen stratus
yes the player
cunning fossil
Not just You but out of game We
cunning fossil
Not just the player. Multiple PLAYERS
In SL, every mortal "Each og our characters", are assets
tropic trail
All of the adventurers have more exposure to Azerite than the leaders do. They weren't going around trying to deal with it. Hell, I'll bet even a goblin drudge working in the Bilgewater Bonanza would have the exposure to Azerite to open that waygate if they tried before Jaina or Thrall could
frozen stratus
well no one else had the heart of azeroth
the players are special compared to every other mortal on azeroth is my point
we have something not even the most powerful mage in the world has
or the most powerful shaman
tropic trail
Yeah which is why it's great that we're being called a Maw Walker, a mortal
frozen stratus
yes
frozen stratus
I mean jaina, thrall, anduin, baine etc would all be dead w/o us
tropic trail
But a dedicated murloc who sat around and ate a bunch of Azerite rocks would have more exposure to Azerite than Thrall or Jaina would, is what I'm saying. It doesn't need to be the Heart of Azeroth letting us do it
frozen stratus
I think it is our bond with azeroth itself
cunning fossil
Idk about dead. If that was tje case, they could've been killed numerous times.
tropic trail
Bruh
frozen stratus
but I doubt it just lets you fucking use first one shit
frozen stratus
No we dont
tropic trail
Just feels good to be one of many again
frozen stratus
but we know sylvanas was exposed to a lot of azerite
tropic trail
No we don't
frozen stratus
and I dont see them just popping into oribos
cause I mean why not?
just pop into oribos and kill everyone lol
tropic trail
🙄
cunning fossil
You have the literal blood of an incredibly powerful soul in your hand. In the realms of death. You basically have a godlike touch.
Sylvanas was not close to azerite
she juat said "Make me Azerite bombs"
And fucked off to do Jailer stufd
pardon thy French
tropic trail
Do we know why the leader of revendreth decided to help the jailer
dense plover
not exactly?
power?
its not directly specified but the cutscene implies that he would have a lot more power, which is clearly something denathrius wants
tropic trail
Ok
dense plover
we will likely get more info with the raid and additional cinematics
distant folio
Sire Denathrius: The only power that will emerge from this torrent of change is Death.
Sire Denathrius: Death, and those who shaped its victory.
basically he wants Death to prevail over all
he's been sabotaging the other cosmic forces (Void, Light etc.) for eons
all the cosmic forces are always in a constant war against each other
Denathrius is basically the main agent of Death, fighting so that Death wins
fervent sky
Do we have any confirmation on what broke "the machine of death"?
I think consensus is leaning towards Argus, but haven't seen any evidence other than "Argus is red... the Arbiter was hit by red energy"
dense plover
actually the going theory here is denathrius
at least among a few of us
watching the cinematic, you can see the red zoom straight towards her, it doesnt swirl around like a soul
fervent sky
I could see Denathrius... but how does he tie into Legion?
dense plover
it happened during the timeline
it didnt happen DURING legion as in someone in the expansion
it happened while legion was happening
fervent sky
interesting
dense plover
and since ysera and ursoc were some of the last souls, argus would be a bit too late in that timeline
fervent sky
I am hoping for greater tie-ins.
Like Denathrius used the dreadlords to lure us to Antorus and kill Argus.
dense plover
i dont think so
titans arent supposed to go to the shadowlands
shadowlands is mortals only
there is absolutely a tie in with the nathrezim somehow
fervent sky
I was thinking Xavius could be a possibility
dense plover
and denathrius's blade is taken prisoner by the covenants after the raid, and it can talk, so the storyline doesnt end when we kill him
again, i dont think its a soul
watch the video
it doesnt move like a soul
it flies straight in - its an attack
oh the sword thing is based on existing quests
denathrius' sword and a corresponding quest show up in the database
"<Energies of death and innervation struggle to free themselves from the blade and consume you to your very core.> <The bonds of warding placed on this blade by Prince Renathal will not hold for long. It should be taken to Sinfall where more permanent arrangements have been made for this prisoner.> "
fervent sky
So could the red energy hitting the arbiter be Denathrius's sword?
dense plover
it could
in the cinematic with denathrius and renathal, we see the blade fly around as a red blur
but it could also be an energy attack of some kind somehow
and the questline is titled "peering into darkness" and appears to have other quests
fervent sky
So I'm liking the Denathrius + sword theory
But it doesn't close the loop on Legion mysteries
I'm still wondering why Sargeras stabbed Azeroth
dense plover
the nathrezim stuff is likely coming later
he tried to kill her
thats the entire point of the burning crusade
to destroy all life
to wipe all planets
and to prevent a world soul from being corrupted by the old gods like azeroth was
because a void titan would be unstoppable
but he failed
because he was captured in time
barely
sargeras has literally ALWAYS wanted to destroy azeroth
from the beginning with azshara
to the end of legion
fervent sky
Ugh...I was hoping there was more depth to it
dense plover
its unrelated to the shadowlands storyline completely
i mean - the entire wow storyline evolved from sargeras and everything
several expacs
idk why we need "more"
the death of argus is relatively insignificant
fervent sky
But does being a "Death titan" mean anything?
fervent sky
Shouldn't a Death Titan have some relationship with the Shadowlands, the realm of death?
dense plover
¯_(ツ)_/¯
he could maybe tap into it
we dont even know if he actually was a death titan
that was all internal names
he was never called the titan of death in any canonical source
fervent sky
Then again, I guess Yogg-Saron is the god of death too 💩
dense plover
"god"
eonar is the titan of life
but she doesnt go to the emerald dream when she dies
she went to elunaria
which was probably the planet she used to be
fervent sky
I strongly suspect Eonar is the Winter Queen's sister
fervent sky
I read somewhere that Eonar created Ysondre
fervent sky
yeah, ysera
dense plover
she gave ysera access to the energies of the dream
but she didnt make the dream
the dream is elune
the sister the winter queen is talking about is 100% elune
and elune is clearly some pantheonic being of the emerald dream
similar to the winter queen being a pantheonic being of the shadowlands
fervent sky
I'm suspicious Elune is a first one, or at least, greater in scope than a Pantheon
People worship Elune throughout the WoW universe
dense plover
well
fervent sky
I don't know if the same is true for the Winter Queen
dense plover
kinda?
elune is the spring and summer to the winter queen's autumn and winter
she is birth and life and dreams, the winter queen is death, and sleep, and rebirth
sharp ember
who is the loa of death mezula or bwomsandi
dense plover
yes
loa are spirits that people believe in
they are both loa
muehzala is a far older more primal loa
bwonsamdi was clearly a troll once
muehzala - its unclear. he was probably around and because trolls believe in him, began to look like them?
we dont know a lot about him
same with bwonsamdi
but theyre both death loa
loa arent traditional gods and they can share domains
its all about who believes in them and their powers
muehzala is definitely above bwonsamdi - he is the "boss" bwonsamdi mentions
but theyre close in power level
at least based on bwonsamdi winning in "De Other Side"
tropic trail
Didn't the sandfury worship Muehzala
uncut vault
the hotfix today was a nice addition for necrolords
dense plover
you can mount it inside the hall?
awesome!
"The Hearty Dragon Plume toy now has a 15 minute cooldown (was 5 minutes)." - BOOOOOOO
"Increased the respawn rate of the Crates of Salvaged Explosions for the Maldraxxus World Quest “Gettin’ Even.”" - thank fuck
plain vigil
The ploom is useless without a shoot up toy too
frozen stratus
he could have named changed
tranquil steeple
I'm sorry to confirm Kata's still here
frozen stratus
@worn sand
frozen stratus
Cause i want his opinion on covenants now that its live and we can all play
strange falcon
you know his opinion already
strange falcon
fronk the one that kata posted every day
the one who relentlessly shit on wow 24/7
that fronk?
frozen stratus
Lol
Tbf down below he still talks about the issues of covenants
Which are still present lmao
strange falcon
down below e.e
strange falcon
can you recover the picture
of the guy with a suit in the front
and bdsm gear
in the back
keen mulch
Now hes on the loading screen with Jailer and Denathrius
So i can only assume the big dude with the axe in maldraxxus is not only alive but will eventually be a raid boss?
strange falcon
not everyone on the loading screen is a raidboss
made the meme as requested @frozen stratus
keen mulch
No but Two of the three people in that group are raid bosses
frozen stratus
Its just some main characters from each covenant
dense plover
Isnt krexus dead?
Didn’t vyraz kill him?
Pretty sure raid boss after denathrius is gonna be Kelthuzad
Naxxramas 2.0
dense plover
Oh yeah I guess we already had naxxramas 2
dense plover
Booo. I wanted this to be Naxxramas 2: Shadowlands Boogaloo
sharp ember
@dense plover so shouldnt mezula not exist because bwonsamdi said everyone stoped beliving in him
frozen stratus
I believed in ihm
dense plover
They don’t maintain their existence on belief. It’s just one of the ways they can first become a loa
sharp ember
whats mojo
misty tiger
Can't speak to Koros for "you may speak to koros to recruit this companion". anyone know what to do?
cunning fossil
uhmmm
worn sand
No
plain vigil
Posting this in here cause possible spoilers, the more I play Shadowlands the more I think the leaked image from last year is real
But let's break it down
We know from Dev interviews that Bastion and Ardenweald were part of the same continent. Just as Xiros and the black forest hub are in this pic
We also know that Oribos acts as a central transit between the zones, just as" Ny'alotha" does here
On top of that Morbara has a very Romanian sounding name, as well as being entirely themed around blood.
But what really struck me, and the only real reason I bring this up is the Devourers
Originally we thought they came from Ardenweald as they're similar in design to the gorn
But in Ardenweald the anima Devourers clearly come from rifts as well
I'm wondering if "Alnir rift lands" is one of the original desings of patch content in earlier development
Now don't get me wrong, i'm not a fan of leak culture. But it has started to get apparent to me that this may be the pitch map of shadowlands when they were trying to figure out which expansion they were going with. Which is why a lot of the style/theming we see now in game is missing from the map, such as the Celtic theming in Ardenweald
frozen stratus
maybe an extremely early prototype
idk its hard to say really without a blizzard dev actually speaking on it
plain vigil
Yes absolutely true
frozen stratus
some stuff just kinda doesnt make sense on this map imo
plain vigil
But it may give us insite on what the next patch(s) could be about
frozen stratus
I doubt it tbh
even if it was a prototype its so far off what we have now
like by early prototype im talking from like 5 years ago
easily
plain vigil
I would agree with that had the rifts not been added to live
But as we found out this week there's a world quest where we close elite rifts for 250 anima
frozen stratus
where are the rifts?
plain vigil
There are a few quests, such as the revindreth one, and then occasionally world quests spawn where you have to close rifts to stop anima devourers
frozen stratus
probably just an evolution of the rifts on the map
like this stuff changes a lot over time lol
plain vigil
plain vigil
Right that's my point I think the rift lands evolved from a continent to patch content
The world quest btw is called "what devours the devourers"
strange falcon
It was a 750 anima wq,but USbabies complained so it was squashed to 250 overnight
plain vigil
That's... Not what happened
Noone complained it was unintended and EU kept bragging
It popped today for US
tranquil steeple
oh no not the shadowlands leaks again
plain vigil
Cry me a river ✌️ just pointing out observations
foggy abyss
What the fuck are you talking about lmao
silent urchin
It was obviously way out of whack with every single other WQ. Even at 250 it's pretty weird. It was only 750 for like an hour on EU before it got nerfed
storm marsh
But let's break it down
btw there are also Stygian Depths - aka Stygia from the Maw
plain vigil
Someone mentioned that but I don't see it on the map
storm marsh
Oh, didn't see someone said it already. It's in the lower left corner.
plain vigil
Yeah so that kinda seals the deal from me that this was a legit predevelopment leak
silent urchin
Stygia isn't exactly a unique name
plain vigil
Also a word that's uncommon
Tbh I thought wow made it up
The Ny'alotha transit is the craziest part to me though
cunning fossil
Yeah fucking dissapointing
BUT yes, that should be a disclaimer at the very fucking start
frozen stratus
I mean surr but who wants to play a weak ass class lmao
All the tanks look fine atm
But that isnt necessarily the casse for some dps
frozen stratus
Nah im just saying if there was a weak ass tank id totally support anyone who want to play a real class/spec
strange falcon
Implying weak means its not "a real class"
Dyre pls just stop talking
Altogether
Thank you
frozen stratus
Yes everytime i go on my dh im like "man i wish i was playing a real class with more than 3 buttons"
strange falcon
That's a DH design problem both when they were ridiculously broken OP and now
It doesnt relate to being weak
And yet you still mained it in bfa
frozen stratus
Its weak in terms of design
strange falcon
Despite it not "being a real class"
strange falcon
"It having 3 buttons and not being a real class " does not change at all whether they are the top dps spec for all content or a weaker not broken op spec
So your argument that because its weak,its "not a real class anymore" has no value
frozen stratus
I mean when i have to fight just to beat kyrian veng dhs in dmg cauze i picked the raid covenant it sure does feel like its fake lol
marble nova
keen mulch
do we know if LFR denathrius will drop Deadliest Coil dor unholy dks?
dense plover
its assumed but we dont know for sure b/c lfr isnt out yet
it WILL drop
the question is whether its still 100%
frozen stratus
nothing
upper lantern
I wonder if there's gonna be a ptr update before new year
uncut vault
Probably not sadly, early January seems likely since Blizz seems to be winding down for their employee break this week
dense plover
^this
Also, they won’t be actively working on new content for a few weeks - would be ineffective to put out a ptr and then abandon it for a few weeks
austere gazelle
I'm betting the devourers are an ancient force the First Ones fought long ago, and the FO created the shadowlands and reality this way to keep them from devouring it.
The simple fact that they are coming back when balance is going south is a proof that they will be important in patches to come
I'm pouring them all in the " Crooked Serpent " category who is maybe linked with them / is the biggest one of them all
From the space that is everywhere and nowhere ( the in-between? ) the Crooked Serpent feasts on stars. ( some devourers are called " World Eaters ") . It has no eyes to see, but it dreams of infinite ending and beginning ( oribos ? )
keen mulch
So are we resurrecting the Primus or is putting his armor on his statue more a symbolic thing?
tropic trail
hello and when will be all content from new pc game WoW Shadowlands on official and original PTR server please ??
-))
👍 😆
dense plover
hello and when will be all content from new pc game WoW Shadowlands on official ...
Potentially never. You need to buy the expac, they fixed ptr being free expac
uncut vault
PTR update 👀
small, but still
beta too, odd
guess theyre getting them all to a same build for updates, maybe?
normal trail
guys what's the latest lore that has been datamind?
im still at the clip of us (players) stalking jailer and sylvanas
sullen dawn
sylvanas and jaler walking and talking about anduin
thats latest
apart from syndragosa model
kelthuzad/maldraxxus is likely 9.1
strange falcon
young latch
||https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/750006670033158276/788825506249310248/u...
that line was so interesting to me
i loved the gay unicorn lmao
the story of their planet was cool too-- I kinda understand why he's mad about it
which is a huge deal since he was her speaker
strange falcon
you could talk to them
before the whole campaign
they were in ardenweald where the giant bear is
young latch
Hibernal Hollow?
cedar sundial
Any idea how?
ionic sphinx
A few quests later
dense plover
you can believe in a god and also disapprove of their actions
plain vigil
Wait so it the bear in hibernal hollow not Ursol?
strange falcon
i think that bear is droman aliothe or something
digital estuary
^ sounds right
also azeroth is realativly new in the universe to my understanding; so more likely ursoc is based off them
plain vigil
I thought Droman Aliothe was a cover. Some amnesia type beat
young latch
i think that bear is droman aliothe or something
who?
strange falcon
The blue bear in hibernal hollow
young latch
ohh, duh
also can I just say: the part with the token of lost love was really touching
because ||ysera didn't even consider that she would fit the bill||
plain vigil
Otherspoilery topic: chi. Is it any different from anima? And are the Sha somehow connected? We've seen in bastion bells act similarly to bells in Pandaria where they release negative energies into inky creatures. Makes me think the Sha isn't neccisarily a product of Y'shaarj, but rather something Y'shaarj activated in Pandaria
eternal root
A few quests later
||even atheists will sometimes say "thank god"||
uncut vault
Otherspoilery topic: chi. Is it any different from anima? And are the Sha someho...
Chi is the same as spirit, which seems to be more of an elemental thing, while anima is just something that builds up as more of a potential energy until the moment of your death
plain vigil
Hmmm
I'd argue then that Anima is the proper name for spirit
Cause they function the same
The only exception being we haven't seen elementals directly tied to anima/shadowlands
dense plover
they definitely dont function the same
uncut vault
anima doesnt actually exist until you die, its gathered as potential based on your actions and impact, whereas the spirit of life is an active energy in reality
that influences the four elements, and world souls
plain vigil
Ahhh I see now
tropic trail
thinking bout making a deathknights any thoughts
sharp wave
only make 1
dense plover
thinking bout making a deathknights any thoughts
why post in the ptr spoilers channel?
what does this have to do with ptr OR spoilers?
bronze shoal
oh shit you're right i post it in wrong section my bad and sorry
keen mulch
what world boss is coming out on tuesday do we know?
keen mulch
a 50/50 shot of getting my leggo lol ty
brazen trellis
||even atheists will sometimes say "thank god"||
Lmfao
Oh wait that message was like 2 weeks ago. Sorry for the ping
eternal root
Oh wait that message was like 2 weeks ago. Sorry for the ping
°blinks sleepily° no, more like 5 days 😉 and don't worry, phone was on silent, just coincidence I woke up a few minutes ago
eternal root
Yep, CET
brazen trellis
3:25 AM here. EST lol
eternal root
Well off to bed with you then! 😂
brazen trellis
Merry Christmas everyone!
austere gazelle
strange falcon
what's that first image from
silent urchin
I like how ardenweald is represented by a single fucking tree
austere gazelle
@strange falcon you know very well were it has been found since its fairly shared on another common discord server 😉
strange falcon
<@!94886929169920000> you know very well were it has been found since its fairl...
i dont read every message in the lore discussion channel
too many msg
austere gazelle
^^
plain vigil
Where's that photo from?
jade basalt
It's a concept art by Jimmy Lo, but that picture is making a lot of assumptions, for example that's not where the idea for Ardenweald came from
https://www.artstation.com/artwork/bKzVlm
uncut vault
Yeah the “torghast is the original judgment point” theory has a lot of merit but I don’t think that art means too much
The Oribos /torghast concept art itself has a lot more weight
“A central infinite tower that souls travel through when they arrive. I did these concepts in a style reminiscent of old explorer photography and drawings, as if an traveler discovered this place and made a record of it, only now to be rediscovered!”
Torghast flat out was what Oribos is now in the early concepts
dull flame
i dont like looking at these concept designs
coz turns out they are 10 times cooler then the actual shit ingame
strange falcon
coz turns out they are 10 times cooler then the actual shit ingame
well yes,game is old
engine holds it back
if you look at the mawsworn designs
they look right out of dark souls,but then you see them ingame,and they're really not
brazen trellis
I like how ardenweald is represented by a single fucking tree
Yes.
storm marsh
moving it to screenshots
brazen trellis
Aight
plain vigil
engine holds it back
I wouldn't even say that. It's clear the engine could handle this stuff. It's more likely the ability of the artists, designers, and limited manpower
plain vigil
Shadowlands uses a lot of adaptive facades could have been used to make the concept art to a T
I disagree with that too
strange falcon
The concept art of the mawsworn looks out of the demon souls remake with super high res
The ingame rendition even if it is 1:1
Does not strike the same beat
I'll post it if i find it
plain vigil
Ardenweald clearly takes advantage of the art style and still builds a complex shilluette
strange falcon
https://wow.zamimg.com/uploads/screenshots/normal/1002518.jpg?maxWidth=1350 https://wow.zamimg.com/uploads/screenshots/normal/1002508.jpg?maxWidth=1350
dense plover
i mean
they cant reach that level of polygons in any MMO
not without isolating the userbase
languid yoke
FF14 1.0 flower pots
plain vigil
Looks about the same to me. The shoulders are a bit larger on the models though
The heads on the concept art are also unproportionately small
strange falcon
Looks about the same to me. The shoulders are a bit larger on the models though
the shape and the model is the same
but the ingame model falls flat on its face
compared to the concept art
it's like comparing demons's souls the original and the remake side by side
plain vigil
The color is greener in game but these don't seem all too different. Keep in mind 3D renders are never accurate because the fov is different than IRL. Similar to how the moon looks large in person but tiny in a phone photo
dense plover
and again, concept art is always more detailed
ingame literally cant match up even with a brand new engine just because of the amount of stuff and number of players
its the reason games like destiny 2 are actually capped to 16 players when out in the world
cedar sundial
Is there any balance patch on PTR? Pvp is awful right now
dense plover
nothing on ptr
and thats not what ptr is for
hotfixes and balance changes go straight to live
and theyre not working right now
they get the week of christmas/new years off
plain vigil
Is there any balance patch on PTR? Pvp is awful right now
Tbh it's either gear vendors or gear balance. There's no in-between. If spells need balancing that would be across the board and less so PvP specific. The PvP community has made it clear that vendors is their preferred form of balance (tbh it's a lot more fun cause there's more variability.) I could see them implementing Ilvl balance where it let's certain # of people from each Ilvl bracket into dungeons, although that would increase queue times for people with extremely low or high item levels. But this would also not apply to arena as Ilvl + skill defines ranking (as you increase rank you face less variation of difficulty as there's less of a Ilvl gap, and where Ilvl gaps exist skill fills its spot)
cedar sundial
Well pve gear outranks pvp so I would hardly say vendors are a balance solution
plain vigil
So PvP gear mainstats versitility (atleast for my class) so each piece of PvP gear focuses on direct damage done. On top of that you can upgrade PvP gear this expansion. There is a small time gate based on your covenant progress, but that's inherently based on questing and anima earned (which can be earned en masse through pvp) as the coming weeks happen higher Ilvl of PvP gear will become available and you'll be able to unlock more conquest gear. As you rank up you can also get high quality gear weekly. So over time those with high-quality PvP gear will far outrank high-quality PvE gear in a PvP setting. The issue is it's the beginning of the expansion so there's no midbracket between endgame content (raids for example are a lot more difficult as you have to grind up gear whereas next raid tier those who have a full set of mythic gear will already have normal gear outranked. This applies to PvP conquest gear as well)
dense plover
has anyone posited the theory that the stone statue IS the primus?
like the one inside the seat you put the pieces on
and that once all the pieces are back
he can awaken?
strange falcon
has anyone posited the theory that the stone statue IS the primus?
Yes,i think i had the idea myself too
cedar sundial
So PvP gear mainstats versitility (atleast for my class) so each piece of PvP ge...
No they won’t, because the stats on 50% of the pvp gear become useless, not to mention the amount of stat on pve drops is higher.
For example I have a fully upgraded 184 honour ring and a m0 ring, both have Stam/vers/mastery which is the only stats I’m after....the m0 ring has 30% more stat overall
Also the top pve’rs are going to easily out gear high end pvp
strange falcon
the only gear that's higher in ilvl than high end pvp
is stone legion general mythic and denathrius mythic
which drop 233
the rest on mythic drop 226
the same as elite pvp
plain vigil
No they won’t, because the stats on 50% of the pvp gear become useless, not to m...
Huh?
All rings have those stats... That's the point of rings. They're secondary stat boosters.
uncut vault
has anyone posited the theory that the stone statue IS the primus?
I’ve seen a similar one, that the Primus is inside the runeblade ala souls inside Frostmourne, and that he split himself similar to Uther
austere gazelle
has anyone posited the theory that the stone statue IS the primus?
I am under the impression that the primus found a lead to Denathrius treachery, he began to expose it but then Denathrius became aware of this and cursed him to stone before he could act. A spark of his soul can still speak throught the mourneblade but is weakened
After all, there is only in revendreth that being from stone are turned to flesh and vice versa
dense plover
That actually makes some sense
austere gazelle
I think the Runecarver and the Primus were the "first" beings created by the First One from scratch that were put in charge of the Shadowlands.
The Runecarver had a function that would be close to those of the Arbiter, or was the hand of the Arbiter and carved memories and logs of souls passing by.
The Primus was put in charge of Maldraxxus as a key covenant of the Shadowlands to protect it
austere gazelle
That would explain why the runecarver possess a lot of memories and knowledge about things
dense plover
I think the primus is something else
austere gazelle
Well, at this point we can only speculate anyway xD
uncut vault
a lot of stuff does imply that maldraxxus and whatever the maw used to be are the 'original' state of the shadowlands
the other three zones have stuff talking about being shaped into being, while maldraxxus had to be conquered
mushrooms in ardenweald existed before ardenweald and the winter queen came about
guardian of the sepulcher is a maldraxxus magic Maw guardian
terse patrol
I still think the Runecarver is the Primus. They’re the same voice actor, correct?
dense plover
i dont think so? they definitely arent the same voice
also the runecarver has been in the jailer's tower since at least frostmourne was made
and the primus was still in maldraxxus at that time
the machine of death only broke during the legion timeline
the runecarver has been trapped by the jailer for much longer than that
they do apparently share a voice actor, but that doesnt mean much
Runas and lore walker cho are the same voice actor too
uncut vault
theyve got thee same voice actor in another language, but theyre very different in english
other language is probably just because they only have so many localized booming old man sounding voices during COVID
plain vigil
also the runecarver has been in the jailer's tower since at least frostmourne wa...
We don't know how long the Primus has been gone. But we know it was before the machine of death broke
dense plover
not long before
considering the end of the house of plagues is a recent occurence
actually
its unclear
but still, its definitely after the lich king stuff
it hasnt been long enough
plain vigil
Seems fishy that they would full send the runeblade lore being from maldraxus then
dense plover
what do you mean?
leaden crystal
So with the special text from the Archon upon their death, I am almost 100% positive the Runecarver is the Primus. It seems that if one of the zone 'leaders' die, so does the zone.
dense plover
eh
that text might not be intentional - it might be leftovers from planned and cut content
and even if it is intentional, that may not be true for every zone
especially since maldraxxus had to be "conquered" unlike the other zones that were forged into what they are
leaden crystal
What if the text is intentional and the Primus isn't the leader of Maldraxxus? What if Maldraxxus was a fallen being? For example everything is made of flesh/bone/sinew and that being had to be 'conquered' before the zone could become what we know it as now. I am thinking along the lines of Ymir from Norse Mythology. As an added bonus to this theory, I will go a step further and say the being that became Maldraxxus was female. We descend into the depths of the zone during Theater of Pain. What if the map is accurate and that is a uterus? Ok, I have run out of tin foil now
austere gazelle
So with the special text from the Archon upon their death, I am almost 100% posi...
Its probably a mechanic to explain why we die if she is not healed, not a lore moment.
Probably some mechanic removed from the fight
leaden crystal
@austere gazelle Agreed, but isn't speculation fun?
austere gazelle
It is and Im the first to threw wild speculations here
But this particular event does not seems to be associated with any point of lore, that s the feeling I got
Usually something of this magnitude , if true, would have been said in quest dialog or presented as fact before it would happens
Ex : we kill denathrius, his essence is swallowed into Remornia. But not once Renathal said that Denathrius possible death would have killed them all
Moreover , we also know that the winter queen , for example, wasnt the first ruler of Ardenweald, so realm arent linked with their eternal one
unborn glacier
Moreover , we also know that the winter queen , for example, wasnt the first rul...
? Thats not what I have seen/read/heard. She CREATED Ardenweald and not with the intention of it hosting any souls. She was surprised when the first soul ever arrived in Ardenweald.
austere gazelle
The mushroom king states another story ;)
dense plover
Yeah ardenweald is a big unknown
But that’s intentional
It’s reminiscent of seelie lore
uncut vault
that probably feeds into the maldraxxus stuff
'maldraxxus' likely encompassed a much larger area of the shadowlands in the past
whenever the winter queen came to be, she likely took a patch of it and shaped it into ardenweald
hence mushrooms being around prior, because mushrooms come from maldraxxus
jade basalt
The art book implies the First Ones created Maldraxxus, or alternatively, shaped it
plain vigil
what do you mean?
Them putting runeblades as a maldraxus thing doesn't make sense if it all comes from the maw. Having the Primus (who is known for runes and made a runeblade a key) who randomly dissappeared not be the rune Carver, who is known for making runic weapons and armor, makes 0 sense
digital estuary
It's more likely the runecarver was a teacher or something of the Primus
dense plover
^this
the runeblade is definitively flawed
it isnt powerful on its own
it regularly needs to be charged
frostmourne is MUCH more powerful
also unlike frostmourne, its a runeblade, not a mourneblade
bold granite
I thought all runeblades were mourneblades
uncut vault
we dont really know what a mourneblade is, other than frostmourne is one
strange falcon
||https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/750006670033158276/793898792940077056/unknown.png special dialogue if you're highmountain||
Nfae campaign spoilerss
bold granite
Is that if you hm cows?
strange falcon
yes
bold granite
Sorry didn’t see the first black box
dark silo
any news on fury warrior buffs?
dense plover
wouldnt be ptr
since ptr isnt up
and blizz still isnt back at work
anything here will likely be in #latest-news first
proper flint
When does Season 1 end?
dense plover
¯_(ツ)_/¯
we dont know
whenever 9.1 releases
which will be announced at blizzcon in feb. probably
proper flint
ok ty
dense plover
well
i did NOT expect another cutscene
uh
i dont know what to think yet
but it looked cool
dense plover
i dont think so
i think its just making her motives clear
why she gave anduin a choice, what that means to her
mossy meteor
good point
dense plover
i think theyre giving an out to the "we fight anduin but he didnt choose to be a villain" that appears to be coming later in this expac
mossy meteor
it does seem to continue the theme of her 'finally' revealing her plans after she gets angry
like when saurfang injured her and reminded her of the failures, she exposed herself
brazen trellis
p
worthy tartan
icy valley
Holy fuck, that cinematic is getting me so hyped
young latch
It feels weirdly teasy to me? Because we're all expecting her to force anduin into whatever plan she has.
I think this scene works much better if we pretend BFA didn't happen? xD
uncut vault
all of her shadowlands stuff does
this feels like a character coming right off of stormheim
BtS and BfA sylvanas dont fit this in the slightest
young latch
I mean the most predictable way this could go is "SEE? SEE? SHE'S ARTHAS NOW!"
Which would be consistent with BFA. But that would make the foreshadowing here feel super ineffective.
But if she decides to waiver now it makes her very much at odds with her BFA depiction.
So it really does feel like a writing team is playing tug of war with the script. That, or I'm just putting way more thought into this narrative than its writers are.
Regardless, what a cliff hanger, lol.
dense plover
i mean - she kind of is paralleling arthas in a lot of ways
she has a master telling her what to do (the jailer), like arthas did (kelthuzad)
she is corrupting an object of power (the blade) to forge a stronger weapon (anduin) - similar to how arthas corrupted the sunwell to resurrect kelthuzad
i feel like the writing here is excellent and they just didnt have the control they needed during BfA
if we think about sylvanas paralleling arthas, in retrospect, you can absolutely see that through BfA
her fight against the faction she leads - similar to uther and arthas being at odds
her snapping moment at ogrimmar - similar to arthas separating from uther at stratholme
hell, she even went to icecrown and released a threat (the shadowlands), similar to how arthas putting on the helm released the scourge/made him the lich king
BfA was muddied by trying to tell the story of like 8 characters
when they really needed to focus on 4
anduin, jaina, sylvanas, saurfang
the expac probably wouldve worked a lot better if it was JUST kul tiras
since kul tiras has a sour history for the horde, and for the alliance
young latch
i feel like the writing here is excellent and they just didnt have the control t...
The Shadowlands writing is good but it doesn't allign with BFA's atrocious writing is the bigger problem.
dense plover
oh well?
cant retcon what just happened
so dont use it if you dont have to
because it sucks
young latch
It kinda becomes a lingering problem when they have to jump through hoops to still make it make sense.
dense plover
i dont feel like they are
young latch
They have to adopt the forced arthas parallel and they're doing the best they can with it, I think.
dense plover
i dont think it feels forced
young latch
"I still have psychological hangups about my stolen free will in terms of anduin but not so much the thousands of elves in that tree" is I think the only thing here that's not clicking together.
It does feel like they're trying to fix it at the very least and that's really the best you can do in this kind of situation.
young latch
I dunno, I don't feel she respects human leadership moreso than nelf leadership necessarily.
But I think porter pointed this out before where it feels like BFA is her point of no return but the shadowlands stuff is going out of its way to humanize Sylvanas' thought processes, and even showing instances of doubt, wheras she had none whatsoever during BFA.
dense plover
I dont see it as humanizing her - just explaining her actions
young latch
Well anduin's reasoning is that the reason she is going out of her way to give him a choice is because she's still resentful that Arthas didn't let her choose-- and we can see from her facial expressions that he's right.
So she's still just a person with feelings and the banshee queen itself is more or less a facade she puts on to compartmentalize the atrocious things that she has to do to make her ideological goals possible.
And I think that's a cool reading of her but it's a very different character than folks got in BFA.
(It's the reading I always preferred FWIW-- it's just going to annoy a lot of people who still have very set ideas about the character who felt they were proven correct in BFA.)
uncut vault
the issue is that if you want to have her realize that she is paralleling arthas, yes please, perfect thing to address
... but why the hell did delaryn and derek exist if you werent gonna do it with them
I think that "Im invading an elven homeland for my evil death plans, and am confronted with an elven ranger who refuses to give up and is basically wearing my outfit" shoulda been a big moment for that
if shes so concerned with taking away peoples will and forcing them to do stuff, which she totally should be
where was that when she raised and tried to mind control derek?
something lilian specifically points out as contrary to her usual ideals
dense plover
im not saying you are wrong - BfAs writing was bad
but they cant go back and change it
young latch
well... sometimes they do. xD
It just usually leads to even more ???
strange falcon
So,we know arthas is in the maw,and that blizz doesnt want to give him a big role to not upset the lore fanatics
Now sylv is doing an arthas crossover
Are they going to meet
young latch
i kinda hope not, but i also think they will
mossy meteor
upper lantern
So I guess this wraps up the campaign for 9.0
uncut vault
it does, yeah, sets up the escalation towards maw stuff, jaina basically confirms the covenants are ready to be rallied now
bolvar gives the easy "end of patch" dialogue at the end
dense plover
surprised that Kelthuzad stuff is still just hanging
guess thatll be part of the 9.1 campaign
maybe for 9.2?
uncut vault
9.1 is probably more likely, necrolord have the most hanging stuff by far
vyraz, kelthuzad, the primus
they cut some of it, but the quest dialogue for the first sylvanas cinematic should still be there, that peering into the maw unintentionally is helping the jailer, and loosening his bonds more
and that by the end of the questline, the maw is on the verge of beginning to break open
which will likely mean maw invasions in the zones
dense plover
yeah
i predicted that at expac start
the invasion system works
and since first patch doesnt have a new zone, diversifying the zones means maw invasions
and with all the enemies from torghast
i fully expect torghast to move between zones
its a floating tower and the chains breaking would be a literal evocation of the jailer unchained metaphor
uncut vault
all the zones also have relatively unused areas and flat places for invasion quests to take place, bastion and ardenweald especially, zones definitely feel like theyre made with potential patch stuff in mind this xpac
dense plover
which is good
losing an existing area to an invasion like in legion and bfa sucked ass
and with areas in each zone already being set up as endgame only
invasions focusing there will prevent quest interference
im still hoping we also get the opposite for the maw
assaults by the covenants on the maw itself
with the jailer freed, covenant npcs shouldnt be trapped anymore theoretically
dense plover
i havent finished listening to the audio but im assuming the plan is to use anduin to break the jailer free since anduin can call on the light from the shadowlands, which ya know - isnt a thing most can do
uncut vault
We don’t know quite yet, the cinematics themselves are Bolvar peering into torghast
So their cutoff is when us learning of his plans ends
sonic flame
i have to find the message
at some point before sl hit live, i said " imho we will see 2 lich kings at the same time at the end of SL "
and everyone laughed at me
and now the cinematic
YASSS
dense plover
i mean
arthas is still dead
and theres so far no evidence we will see him again
if we do, itll probably be as a prince, not the lich king
tropic trail
anybody knows if we will have 2 legedaries equip throughout the addon ?
dense plover
first new build in a few weeks - baking in the hotfixes from the past day or two
stiff vector
past month*
dense plover
so - canonically, we just got no more lies
im guessing we will get the datamined render cinematic next week or the week after?
mossy meteor
@dense plover nah, we get it this week but
it's locked behind a denathrius kill
which kinda sucks for non raiders
uncut vault
it absolutely wonjt, but that means february is probably the time to start looking out for 9.1 to release
likewise after next week is probablywhen we should look for PTR release, since covenant campaigns end next week
its the official "no more story content" point
tropic trail
can i still complete covenant campaigns? or do you just mean the story is wrapped up next week and we move on>
worthy hinge
tropic trail
ah okay thank you
i have a torghast question: how do i know when fractured chambers comes back? it's where my legendary memory is 😦
dense plover
theres no way to know!
tropic trail
Yeah that's what I thought but comments on the wowhead article say it's a bigger rotation that people first thought and also possibly a random selection from a pool or something @mossy meteor
dense plover
i think its random with a limit
in that if a wing hasnt been in rotation for X weeks, its in the next rotation
mossy meteor
Yeah, they definitely have a cycle
I think a specific wing appears once every 3 weeks
Since there's 6 wings, and 2 are up every week
thick saddle
Any idea when 9.0.2 goes live?
9.0.2 has been Live for 1.5 month now
violet flume
Oh then 9.1 or the next big patch I guess.
thick saddle
9.1 is probably the next big one, with a possible 9.0.5 before that. I'd wager we'll find out more around Blizzcon on February 19-20.
dense plover
we will probably see 9.1 on ptr before blizzcon
but itll probably be extremely bare bones/unplayable until blizzcon
sullen dawn
Late Match for 9.1 seems appropriate
Presumably there won't be new zones in addition to maldraxxus content, but i hope so1
only thing i dont like about SL is that it feels tiny zone/world wise
strange falcon
if it didnt feel tiny you'd see a lot more people complaining about no flight master's whistle
😂
sullen dawn
yeh but f those people
death to flying, death to whistle 😛
this is an MMO not diablo 😛
strange falcon
death to flying, death to whistle 😛
they tried that in WoD,but then their replacement(the train) never came due to time cuts
so you know how it turned out
OMG ITS SAS :O
elder otter
Massive refers to the number of players, not necessarily the size of the world. 😛
sullen dawn
more old school like boats from ratchet to booty bay etc..
i much prefer that style of immersive travel
also flying fecks world pvp
sullen dawn
i know but its not the same
id rather they disabled flying in WM
increase the rewards/add more WM exclusive content to compensate
then people who wanna skip over the world/get to their callings etc.. can do WM off
strange falcon
increase the rewards/add more WM exclusive content to compensate
increasing the rewards was a gigantic mistake that we're only now seeing the effects of
tranquil steeple
and disable the ability to gain quest based rewards from WM related quests while in raids
sullen dawn
I do agree it's not the best approach dafire
strange falcon
and turning off flying means that 99% of people with WM wont turn it on
specifically because oof no flying
tranquil steeple
'cause fuck giant ass squads of raids just running through every zone
sullen dawn
thats why WM needs its own 'hooks'
strange falcon
the hook is worldpvp
sullen dawn
maybe deepend the hnour system, add exclusive content to WM
yes but it needs more support/resorces fromblizz
if open world is ever gonna be taken seriously as end game content
strange falcon
if open world is ever gonna be taken seriously as end game content
its not gonna be
sullen dawn
a territories system would be cool. bfa would be good time to add
sullen dawn
for now
strange falcon
a territories system would be cool. bfa would be good time to add
would be worst idea ever
strange falcon
yes,you would have raidgroups permanently defending a zone
and you can never take it back
ever
ever
strange falcon
youre making a huuuuuuuge ammount of assumptions
man,people made 40 man raidgroups to kill a rare with a 3% chance to drop a mount,that reflected all non-aoe spells and ALSO had 99% dmg reduction
sullen dawn
going from highlevel idea to very specific implementation. teres many many ways to prevent that
strange falcon
it took 2hrs+ to kill
with 40 ppl spamming
im NOT making assumptions
im stating facts
sullen dawn
yes you are
you're assuming it would be implemented without consideration for those issues, and based on prior designs
those are facts but theyre also irrelevant. well not irrelevant but those issues canbe designed around,
you act like games have never had good world pvp systems before
strange falcon
you act like games have never had good world pvp systems before
i didnt say the system wouldnt be good
just that there would be one overly dominant guild
or faction
that hogs everything
sullen dawn
theres ways around that
strange falcon
you have it "unable to be captured by same guild twice in a row"
then you just have 2 guilds passing it between them
nothing cchanges
sullen dawn
cycling times, 'against overwhelming odds buff', multiple bases to hold, mercenary systems
and those are just initial ideas. with thought theres a lot more
sullen dawn
yeh but it was crap
strange falcon
was strongly dominated 24/7 by one faction
sullen dawn
theyre just flags
yer merc system is needed to help with world pvp faction balance
and probs ability to go neutral
strange falcon
as i said,pvp and anything related to it,is the lowest priority on blizzard's list if we count 16 years of wow
so i really do not believe
sullen dawn
agree but thats changing
sullen dawn
hey i agree
if theyre gonna implement as they have in past dont bother
but WM philosophy seems right - theyre slowly going down right track. and ion has said they want the world to become a focus/pillar of the game again
beyond just instanced content
tranquil steeple
and probs ability to go neutral
this is called "not toggling warmode"
sullen dawn
i know that dafire, thats very obvious
but world pvp and the world are linked
and my argyment was not just about pvp
also @tranquil steeple no 😛 im talking about more nuanced political/faction system
strange falcon
also <@225748769428340737> no 😛 im talking about more nuanced political/faction...
too much devtime
scrapped
sullen dawn
well the team needs more cash tbh
tranquil steeple
yet it's very likely they won't even bother with that if what everybody cares about is what they get out of it in the game
sullen dawn
acti strangle them for resources
strange falcon
well the team needs more cash tbh
underpaid devteam that cant even pay rent
scrapped
sullen dawn
a LOt of players care about the game beyond loot/raids/M+
i do agree though its been a low prio in past
tranquil steeple
yes, of course
strange falcon
a LOt of players care about the game beyond loot/raids/M+
the collectors care about achievements and mounts/tmog
not pvvp
scrapped
sullen dawn
but i can see their philosophy changing
tranquil steeple
but the point is that the people that care about something that doesn't give rewards in-game
are in a majorly severe minority
strange falcon
are in a majorly severe minority
its less than the ppl who actively do petbattles
😂
sullen dawn
they arent. maybe of max level/multi char players
tranquil steeple
in this day and age more or less everything "needs" to give some sort of reward in-game to give players and incentive to do it and care about
sullen dawn
but the long tail of the userbase, and potential customers theyre losin (have tried to bring a lot of friends in but they wanted to play an rpg not spam dungeons)
tranquil steeple
and that's not just WoW
strange falcon
but the long tail of the userbase, and potential customers theyre losin (have t...
your 1-3 friends dont reflect the entire playerbase
sullen dawn
i think were at a breaking point for that trend
dont be so dismissive you prick
ive seen it beyond anacdodle evidence
strange falcon
if twisting corridors didnt give the NUMBER 1 TOP OF THE LIST THING ppl have been complaining about regarding the maw(the mount)
an insignificantly tiny portion of ppl would do it
*only
sullen dawn
yes there is an unhealthy relationship between players and rewards
strange falcon
yes there is an unhealthy relationship between players and rewards
there is an unhealthy relationship between TRIPLEAAA companies and greed too
but conversations not about that
sullen dawn
but the skinnerbox model is at the end of its lifecycle imo
strange falcon
but the skinnerbox model is at the end of its lifecycle imo
lootboxes have only started dying because laws are being made against them
sullen dawn
yes thats one trend
strange falcon
dlcs stopped being prevalent because lootboxes were more profitable
sullen dawn
but laws are being mad against them public sentiementrose against them
its never going to be the corporation that ends it lol
strange falcon
but laws are being mad against them public sentiementrose against them
well yes of course,nothing happens without public sentiment
we know ppl in parliament dont even know what games are
¯_(ツ)_/¯
sullen dawn
theyll just stop when they cant justify it anymore
depends on government official. but yes they only made a big deal about it because journos and public outcry
a lot of factors come into play when pivoting industry practices
strange falcon
the same journos that are bought and paid for to shill for game companies
until it suits them
strange falcon
look at last of us 2 only receiving backlash ffor its story AFTER it made a clean sweep of 95% of the game awards
strange falcon
non gaming press also covers only the most hot press
sullen dawn
but last of 2 has a fantastic story?