beta-ptr-spoilers

[rain cave]

E.g. what if the reason the black blade is so similar to mourneblades and even remornia is because it IS from the same source. We know the void invaded the shadowlands

And the old gods look very similar to maldraxxus, even their minions are mirrors of the house is spiders

It would also be interesting if Xal turns out to be from that original planet that sargeras destroyed for being void corrupted, after the dreadlords convinced him to

In fact what if that's what voidstorm is

[uncut vault]

We already have the strong implication that Telogrus was that planet

Nether-Prince Durzaan says: Even shattered as it is, this place echoes with the whispers of the great ones who were slain... and the hatred of he who broke this world.

[austere gazelle]

Yeah but at the same time we have a void elve on K'aresh that spoke of Telogrus saying that they wanted to prevent another Telogrus by stopping Dimensius , so that was very weird

[uncut vault]

They were referring to the Shadowguard there, and the attack on Telogrus from 10.2.7

[austere gazelle]

Ah yeah, context matter

Make sense now

[rain cave]

The void elves are so corny

Yall really chose to settle in telogrus rift? Of all places?

[rain cave]

Now that I look into it, could both be the same planet

Here's a quote from the velf npcs in telogrus

"The Voidstorm is growing. It might even consume the big island entirely."

Perhaps telogrus is just part of the planet, since the planet would have been cleaved into many parts

[little hound]

Ngl when it comes to "Trophies" on the Wall for Housing, i'd love it if like..

Boss Heads for example.
LFR: Standard Boss head on the Wall.
Normal: Same with a slightly fancier trophy stand.
HC: Boss Head with some animations on the Head, glowing eye or smth.
Mythic: Animated effects on both the head and trophy stand.

[deep pawn]

That sounds like more work than needed

[little hound]

Not really, they did say that some Housing Decor would take effort and time to obtain, some for more of the hardcore players too.

[little hound]

How? Slapping effects onto objects and items isn't hard at all 😄

Besides, housing is a feature that'll grow with every patch and expansion going forwards, it'd be dumb if they didn't give it massive amounts of attention to detail.

[pulsar minnow]

Could make a cool AotC reward for each tier

Or just some sort of trophy themed after them

Like maybe a Salhaadar crown from voidstorm that you can put in your house

[opaque pewter]

They did say that some rewards will be only obtainable from high level play. Whether it's only an alternate, more glamorous version of an item or a completely different one, we don't know yet
Then again, that kind of decision can flip flop over time

[little hound]

Or a Saladbar

[pulsar minnow]

Kinda just realized that we’ve gotten two different allied races related to the location of the expansion in the world soul saga

Now we’re going back to northerend… and we already have earthen so…

https://encrypted-tbn3.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRvZJOF7maSp6l8ybtjee0CHVUI5OUBUvgEGct6IIRfrS2sKpHPI0iO98qa85VDFDa7yGqG48A7Jas3bABX340omZO0hL_Th3hWhqhrgA

Pls blizz just do it

[rain cave]

Tuskarr bard for tlt

Lol

Or tinker, depending

[rain cave]

honestly if they do TLT and launch it with basically a handful of azerothian races that were previously unplayable, with the idea being this is the grand culmination all hands on deck style expansion

that would be sick

because EVERYONE has a stake in the TLT story. Orc and draenei want to know what happened to sargeras, the titan that influenced their races path. Human, dwarves, gnomes are all titanforged and want to know about their "creators", The elves will get their story in midnight primarily, but Illidan would be returning in TLT's story I imagine, and the titans ordering of life is something that will be important for the night elf elune story. Keep going and you realize that basically every race has ties to the northrend + titan story going on

the nerubians on azj'kahet even, they have history in northrend with the other nerubians.
the tuskarr live in northrend, they want to defend their home
trolls have the frost trolls
the dragons obviously hav e wyrmrest
there's the remnants of icecrown and the scourge there, that could tie in a lot especialy with the new forsaken and calia. What if the wild scourge are an issue? or will they get a new leader?
No dalaran means we'll need new hubs, it would be interesting if the hubs and starting areas were split like before. With horde starting in the tundra and alliance on their side again

I doubt they'd do a hard faction split obv but it would be interesting to see an expedition using alliance and blood elf resources, landing on the side with the frost trolls and world tree, and then the new amani allies and harranir help us recruit frost trolls into the fold.

[clear apex]

Id honestly like to see the gnolls playable

[proper palm]

Night elf paladin, pleaaaase xD

[glass flicker]

Mechagnome shamans pls.

For no other reason than the fun factor. Built-in flamethrowers? Rock cannon? Pressure cutter?

[austere gazelle]

they can go lazy road and give us Vrykul

[pulsar minnow]

I mean that would also be sick tbh

Vrykul are awesome

[ember blaze]

ah yes, from body builder humans, short hairy humans, to fat humans, and then finally giant humans as separate races.

[pulsar minnow]

you say this as though I didn't start off by suggesting Tuskarr lol

[rain cave]

this expansion I pray

it would work narratively

"hello fellow elves we're here. With the army of the light.. at the sunwell... wait a minute why didn't we think of this? What do you mean there's already anight elf paladin?! get her in here training some new guys!"

[pulsar minnow]

They could genuinely just take ash’adar and make it a normal night saber and boom you have your Paladin mount too

[little hound]

Nah, pixel horndogs already fumed enough about this being "Spectral Tiger copycat, our TCG Mounst arent special anymore."

[pulsar minnow]

i DID say make it a normal nightsaber and we wouldn’t have this problem

[clear apex]

They still need to update the thalassian charger 8|

Belf pally is the only one with an awful looking class mount

I know theres the legion horse but they did stuff for others

[pulsar minnow]

They have to. Especially with it being a belf/paladin expansion? What a miss if they didn’t

[granite flame]

Don't humans still use the vanilla horse too?

[clear apex]

Unsure.

Don't play one

Though the legion horse arguably is very human horse replacement

Like they upgraded the human one with the legion class mount in a way but other races also got it.
Dwarves and other races seem to have upgraded ones. My Dwarven and draenei pally mounts seem so much nicer

[deep pawn]

Blizzard has said in interviews implied that it will be a horde class that makes sense after completing the story

So my first guess would be Blood Elf druid

Since it's supposed to be something that balances out Void Elf DH

[ember blaze]

and why wouldnt the answer be... dh

nightborne dh require the least work

[rain cave]

Orc paladin

Lol

[deep pawn]

If it was just gonna be Nightborne DH I don't get why they'd hide it

[lavish raptor]

troll pallies

[ember blaze]

if its a new "feature" they will

[deep pawn]

I just think they would say if it was Nightborne, so it has to be something more interesitng

[rain cave]

Nightborne paladins that learned from the blood knights and are enlisted to help defend the sunwell

[lavish raptor]

tauren evokers

[clear apex]

Love the idea of nb paladin

[rain cave]

arcane-light fusion

[clear apex]

Makes as much sense as belf paladin imo. Magic and light

[rain cave]

nightborne armour with gold instead of silver, some red from the blood knights but still in the nightborne style. Manasaber that's still purple but with the light shimmering around it

[clear apex]

Plus it's an allied race like velf

[rain cave]

like in all its runes

[novel zodiac]

https://x.com/BaalTheWarlock/status/1961248551788306433 this would be so good if true

Baal Samael Thanasphos Secjuuts (Very Dangerous) (@BaalTheWarlock) ...

Aight, this is partly speculation, partly what I would like to happen, partly AU/Head Canon:

The premise:

The Arathi Empire is not from the main timeline.

X · Aug 29, 2025, 2:04 AM

shame it will never happen

[ember blaze]

i cant see the rest of the post, but that sounds dumb

https://x.com/codymal234/status/1961419118285832302

dukecastle (@codymal234)

@KayaMichiyu @BubblepunkAD It's lothraxian cause there's literally a quest to talk to him if you pause during one of the midnight trailers lmao

X · Aug 29, 2025, 1:22 PM

anyone catch this? 🤔

[deep pawn]

I still don't think he'd be surprised to be called

[tulip sun]

Yeah that's the thing. He wouldnt be surprised

Im sure hes there. But hes not who theyre referring to

[lavish raptor]

i still think its illidan

and him getting poofed back is what accidentally frees sargey

i just think itd be funny if he kills the mommy naaru because He Is His Scars only for prophesy to sit his ass back down on Azeroth to do Light things

[ember blaze]

no lol

we know he's coming next expansion

[lavish raptor]

where was that stated

idr

[ember blaze]

metzen

and it's kinda a given if the titans are coming back he would be back

[lavish raptor]

hmm looking at it again, it doesn't give pronouns in the bit or state its a person. so it could be a giant murloc.

[clear apex]

Didn't it say "creature"

[lavish raptor]

yeah

creatures

itll be the whale shark from cata

[rain cave]

see I think this can work as an idea but not how they outline it

especially with beldar, being simultaneously very light themed but also apparently a part of azeroths blood

azeroth the reality titan/ firstone/worldsoul or whatever she is

because if a part of her got light infused, that would mean its reality would be light

and the light dominated reality we know of is the AU draenor one

[mighty wolf]

on "what the... is all that stuff on my screen?" moment theres questlog with quest from Midnight with "- 0/1 Lothraxion"

I bet it's quest in Voidstorm

[sleek solar]

I think they are saved for a new Yrel story

[sleek solar]

Yikes hell naw

[rain cave]

I imagine we can use the vindicaar there

if it's a portal in the sky

I feel the army of the light on the vindicaar have the experience for that

ain't there first rodeo in the belly of the beast

[tropic trail]

Wait who’s that?

[rain cave]

who

[tropic trail]

The lady in the picture

[rain cave]

just a player character I imagine

[sleek solar]

How do you not know? That’s Jane Warcraft

[tropic trail]

😂

[novel zodiac]

its pvp paula

[rain cave]

This is so sick

I hope this is what thalyssra is wearing nowadays

[uncut vault]

Well, she does have a recolored variant of her outfit with those colors already

and an in-between one, if the ywant to keep the nightborne purple vibes

[little hound]

I'm glad we're getting some nice recolors for Legion Remix, fuck MT Appearances, i'd prefer something new ❤️

[pulsar minnow]

random question- Thalyssra is just using npc outfits right? She's not a unique model?

[little hound]

Think she's just using NPC Outfits, not avalible to players.

[uncut vault]

Correct, she's just one of many NPC Nightborne variants

[austere gazelle]

https://tenor.com/view/xalatath-warcraft-spaghetti-world-of-warcraft-gif-12070578727197966411

[austere gazelle]

They are from the main timeline. They are not on our main continent though. The fact that for them Thoradin's wall and the Arathi Highlands are mere legends of the past is an indication of that

They are probably long time expedition that went lost into the eastern forbiddin sea and ended up on Avaloren or on islands nearby beyond the stormy seas and founded their empire there

Rumor said they probably found some source of holy power or whatever. Maybe the Light Titan that went missing 🤷

[ember blaze]

ai will doom us all

[crude sigil]

no feet ? Can't be Xal'atath

[clear apex]

There's a side quest with a mage that almost takes you to avaloren (avalorn?).

[ember blaze]

and he got what was coming to him

[clear apex]

Lol what?

[ember blaze]

a mage that cant teleport? pathetic

[clear apex]

He wasn't taught yet.

He tells you that

[crude sigil]

Everything already explained by Arathi themselves ... No alternative "timeline" or something like that.

[clear apex]

He was younger when they arrived

[deep pawn]

They document their history well. The light told them to go across the Storming/Forbidden sea.

They probably have more accurate records of the Empire of Arathor than we do.

At least up until they left

[pulsar minnow]

Yeah that's what I thought. Thankfully the armor is varied enough where its not as noticeable but it would be nice for her to finally get a unique model

[ember blaze]

anything new discovered about the flying guardian around beledar? 🤔

[sleek solar]

My Archmage was standing next to him, yet I couldnt help

[clear apex]

That's because the bad guys wanted to stop you.
He says that you have to visit the place first to be able to teleport. So he was the only who could take us there.

[sleek solar]

Yes but i could have taught him how to make a portal instead of letting him figure it out

[uncut vault]

All your mage could really do is teach him how to create portals to locations you know, is the issue

your mage doesn't know the incantation to make a portal to the Arathi Empire

[upper pasture]

And that he was also murdered

[ember blaze]

noob, should have casted arcane shield

[deep pawn]

I still fully believe Jaina and Oculeth could make the portal off of Steelstrike's memories but that'll only come up when we want to visit.

But that's always the issue with powers that can solve issues, but aren't in the story are around

The Vindicaar could survive Argus, it can handle a storm

Or literally fly above it

Cause we know the empire gets lots of sunlight

[novel zodiac]

instead of a portal or finding a way to traverse the storm i think it would be better if the storms dissappears when we kill Aman'thul or Odyn cause one of them put them there

[ember blaze]

just take an axe to take em out of the story

id love to see some single player games for wow

seems very limited with multiplayer game that also demands you shove in the player character

[sleek solar]

True, but iirc he didn't understand how to make portals at all, so if we could have taught him how to make portals in general, perhaps he could have made it sooner

At least, his experiments gave me the sense that he was trying to make portals at all (hense the short range experiments)

Quite a nice story imo

[rain cave]

Could also traverse the coreway or the roots

[austere gazelle]

I don't think so, I think Avaloren protected itself from titanic incursion and put itself into a veil like the Dragon isle. Nobody can find it with intent

The only way to find it will be to be guided by an Arathi navigator there somehow

[rain cave]

still convinced the arathi will play into the dreadlord story

[rain cave]

I don't think it's a normal storm though

seems magical

[sleek solar]

I hope not

I hope the Arathi will either be antagonistic

Or semi good

[rain cave]

I think the emperor will be a dreadlord or their puppet

[deep pawn]

or the Naaru they follow isn't totally benevolent

[deep pawn]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BwvuBvM7XJ4 Crap audio but I guess he got tired of waiting

11.2.7's main focuses are housing and the updated new player experience

which feels not great if you aren't the type to immediately preorder

[clear apex]

I'm glad they're finally releasing these interviews

[little hound]

Okay so 11.2.7 coming December.

And i like that he says at eeeh..

23:50, "Let's give them a moment to do that, a couple months ahead of time".

I feel like that's saying: "Yeah, Midnight in Late January / Mid February"

"While there will be Decor that comes from high skill accomplishments". Good! ❤️

[deep pawn]

Yes, the timeline has been consistent in that regards.

[upper pasture]

yes and no, if you have zero interest in housing then sure but 11.2.7 brings in being able to collect housing stuff for all

[deep pawn]

I have an interest in housing and will likely preorder by then for Beta Access, but if you don't preorder I would call locking the major feature of any patch behind that problematic. It's not liked allied races were the only thing in the last legion patch for example.

There surely is something else, but if it's just a short questline and housing, oof. New player experiences aren't that big a deal for current players.

[upper pasture]

housing isn't a major feature for the patch, adding all the collectables is a main feature of the patch. non preorder accounts will still have access to collecting housing stuff but not able to use it until they preorder OR when they buy in midnight

[deep pawn]

collectables where 90% are achievements you've already completed isn't a feature either though. Imagine collecting transmogs you couldn't use for another 2 months haha

[little hound]

Overall, Housing is a major feature. Adding the items is PART OF THE HOUSING, But it'll be more major for those who Pre-Ordered.

[upper pasture]

they could always prepurchase ANY midnight bundle and get access to it immediately. players who are that sold on housing OR that upset about not being able to use it will likely be playing in midnight regardless so what's 40$ now or later?

[little hound]

That still goes under the label of "Housing", as it belongs TO "Housing".

Seperating Decor from Housing sounds like just another reason to make an unreasonable argument/debate.

[upper pasture]

sure thing bud

[little hound]

"Sure thing bud", damn, guess facts must be like an allergy to you.

[deep pawn]

It's just my opinion that making a content patch for TWW dependent on preordering Midnight for the meat of the content and then calling that the highlight of the patch means it shouldn't be called a TWW patch. It doesn't feel great, I know why they're doing it and it's gonna make tons of money, but I just wish there was something else besides housing that was enough to be called the highlight of the patch.

[little hound]

I mean, why not ? TWW Is basically over anyways.

Ty god for Remix, having content draught until February would be such a bad rash. And Housing ofc.

[upper pasture]

naw, it's just like any time i say literally anything you always seem to butt in and say "SeEm LiKe AnOtHeR rEaSoN tO..." it's just tiresome.

[deep pawn]

it'll still be the current expansion until prepatch in January or February so yeah, I wouldn't mind a little extra TWW content vs getting Midnight content half finished early.

[little hound]

Just like you always making debates/discussions over the most minor thing, every time i see you yap that mouth of yours. Block buttons do exist, least i'm able to have a discussion without whining.

[little hound]

I'd agree but seeing as Housing has been in Development since the end of Shadowlands, i'd still keep hopes that it'll feel great once it releases, even in 11.2.7 despite endeavors and some other housing things being saved for Midnight.

[upper pasture]

says the person who constantly tries to dismiss anything i say as "unreasonable"

[little hound]

Block button is still an option, Sweetie. Feel free to use it if you can't have a conversation without pulling out the attitude.

[upper pasture]

but you're right, the block button does exist, i hope you have the day you deserve

[little hound]

Its 22:30.

[deep pawn]

I don't like people saying that because I had issues with the DF content patches at times means I can't feel like TWW has delivered less.

[little hound]

Really? What about DF Bothered you? In my own experience, I thought DF was a blast most of the way through. I just didn't like Dreamsurges, they were a lame addition.

They were "Popular" for like a week or two for the catchup gear, then it died.

[clear apex]

i felt DF had a few too many world content stuff

so much to do and that got repetitive

[deep pawn]

DF got a little repetitive with the fill the bar, kill the boss world events but TWW has continued the same.

[clear apex]

you had the incursion things, the soup, the archeology, the dream surge...what else

[little hound]

Time Rifts.

[deep pawn]

Dreamsurges needed to reward better gear than they did

it was literally the same ilvl as Time Rifts and Fyrakk Assaults

[clear apex]

yeah TWW has an issue with that too and everything starts at the top of the hour so im stuck waiting

[little hound]

I rarely ever touched Incursions or the Soup Time.
I did Archaeology only for the Transmogs.
I didn't TOUCH Dreamsurges at all 😄

[clear apex]

'ok did the nightfall, time to wait another hour so i can do this other things"

[deep pawn]

there's a mix of things at :00 and :30, it feels fair enough.

[clear apex]

what starts at :30?

[little hound]

My OCD Is at serenity peak at the moment, lmao.

[clear apex]

plays, nightfall and some other stuff start at the :00

i dont mind delves but i feel like i keep seeing the same story and its hard to get all 3 or 4 storylines quickly?

i had branns day out 3 days in a row

[upper pasture]

surge pricing started on the half hour but that's not current anymore

[clear apex]

ah see i never got that completed cause when i finally went there no one was doing it

we got like 5% done

[upper pasture]

but it seems all the other things start at the top of the hour

[deep pawn]

there's no set time that I've seen for the spawned stuff in K'aresh for the anima weeklies

[upper pasture]

i do think we had less hourly things in TWW or atleast worthwhile hourly things

[deep pawn]

if there is at least one of them is around :30

[upper pasture]

yeah those i think just spawn every 20ish mins or so

but it's not concrete like the hourly things

[glass fulcrum]

I remember DF had Time Rifts rotate nicely with the other events

[deep pawn]

even then things eventually overlapped

you could do a cycle of like researchers, time rifts, and fyrakk assault in an hour.

[clear apex]

That's the issue with tww world activities. If i want to do the play then i have to wait 50-40 minutes for the next thing. And if i miss an event it feels bad

[deep pawn]

it was the same in DF

did you just feel like you missed less?

Did you want more on the :30s?

[pulsar minnow]

I think part of the problem is literally just the fact that delves exist. They take like 10-20 minutes and throw off player cadence in the world

[deep pawn]

that's surely not it lol.

[pulsar minnow]

its definitely a factor for people doing world content only

before they were pretty much just sitting around for an event- now they have more to do so its harder to keep track of these 5 minute long events that happen once an hour

[clear apex]

More at the half hour would be nice then i think there would feel like less waiting.
I usually will do a delve or 2 to fill the time instead.
With events being barely 10 minutes, missing out on one at the top of the hour can mean waiting hours if you're not paying enough attention.

Another thing is the flight time, sometimes it's going to make me late unless i try arriving 5 minutes early. Hallowfall especially feels massive to fly around

Better to have this "problem" than not i suppose

[deep pawn]

There's only 3 timed events, unless you consider dark Beledar

there's 2 at :00 1 at :30, it's about as even as it can be.

[ember blaze]

hour gaps are lame

[lone mantle]

I hope it will not be the case that one must purchase house decorations from the Blizzard store.

[deep pawn]

some will absolutely be on there

[ember blaze]

they already said they will put some there

[deep pawn]

Literally have items in the heroic and epic editions rewards

[rain cave]

Gathering node house decorations in the cash shop when

[lean yew]

yall ready for legion remix updates today hopefully

https://i.imgflip.com/a4r757.gif

[rain cave]

It's coming out today? Or ptr updates

[lean yew]

the ptr

i assume its being updated today

[deep pawn]

PTR is updating today barring tech issues

[deep pawn]

Blizzard slacking on the alpha blog posts, give us more info! Haha

[lean yew]

did it update today

i cant log in b/c itll convert my character if remix isnt restarted

[deep pawn]

no notes yet

[zealous sedge]

At this point it’ll probably be tomorrow

Maybe in the morning though that would be nice

[novel zodiac]

we just got a bunch of posts

[zealous sedge]

idk if we had full version of this before

[ember blaze]

where

[ember blaze]

the large midnight logo up there ruins it lol

[novel zodiac]

wowhead

[ember blaze]

besides dh what else is there

[deep pawn]

Blogs at 5pm, damn Blizzard

[ember blaze]

nothing we didnt already know tho

and that dh blog had nothing in it lol

[deep pawn]

yeah

the UI update stuff is exciting

[zealous sedge]

the UI update stuff does look really good

[zealous sedge]

true

I just know not everyone is gonna be satisfied with whatever is put out by Blizz. Especially when they pull perms for addons

It only works if boss fights are designed correctly to not require the extra stuff

I think raid designers will need to return to a sort of easier baseline when they finally pull the trigger and then gradually ramp up instead of making them too hard and having to nerf

[ember blaze]

i think the current raid is a good direction

[deep pawn]

I am a big supporter of blizzard's addon plans

standardize the combat

[zealous sedge]

100% totally in agreement

[novel zodiac]

so im guessing that they'll ban addons like DBM and WA for Midnight?

[little hound]

They'll limit what people can do i think with certain addons, making some API's unobtainable.

Its majorly addons like WA/DBM/Big or LittleWigs that are going to be mostly affected.

"Addons that basically tells you everything" or "Plays the game for you".

They are implementing those changes once Alpha starts, so whoever gets alpha are most likely going to find out from the start what is / what cannot be done with the future of Addons.

[deep pawn]

That's not officially confirmed .

I do think it's going to happen eventually

But to take Blizzard at their word that they want to restrict the API is "speculation" to some haha.

[little hound]

Yeah my point is that, those are the addons that are most likely going to be heavily affected.

They don't care about UI Addons or Nameplat stuff, anything with only cosmetic adjustments haven't really done muc hbut make it smoother for people's tastes.

[deep pawn]

But to say DBM/BigWigs is likely to not work much the same at all raises some ire. 😛

[little hound]

I'm saying they are likely to be the most affected, not that they aren't likely to work much the same..

How affected? Nobody but Blizz knows what's in store.

[deep pawn]

If they turn off addon access to the combat log, at best they can only repeat the info the built in boss timeline tells them and at that point, why use it

[little hound]

I look forward to seeing what changes they make, i doubt they'll outright ban those addons.

[deep pawn]

I don't think it'll be banned, it'll be made superfluous and then "broken". How people feel about that can differ.

[little hound]

Yeah, i can imagine some will riot.

[deep pawn]

Maybe they reorganize around replacing the base notification sounds and graphics.

but that's a lot slimmer of an addon regardless

[little hound]

I'm all for raiding being abit difficult again, I use BigWigs and such, but i feel like they make it abit too easy.

[deep pawn]

I don't think raiding will be any more difficult.

[little hound]

I'm all for support addons being left alone, and UI Stuff like ElvUI and Plater.

[deep pawn]

Plater won't be able to tell you what information is important anymore based off what they said

[little hound]

Blizzard spoke about it like: "It doesn't feel right when people think addons are needed to raid, or play".

And that i agree on.

[deep pawn]

Blizzard is going to decide what is "important"

[little hound]

Yeah, that part scares me abit.

Seeing as how half-assed their "Important" is, their decision isn't really notorious there. Half of their devs aren't even dedicatedly gaming at this rate.

So how an Office employee is going to tell a team of raiders: "Oh, you don't need this, it isn't important.." How would they know? They don't even play 😄

[pulsar minnow]

Well tbh I think the whole idea is that it puts people on the same playing field

[little hound]

I guess, although nothing ever stopped people from getting addons either.

[pulsar minnow]

sure but they determine what information can be made into addons

[little hound]

yeeeh

[deep pawn]

it'll just be a flag for which spells get the important graphic on nameplates so maybe it'll be based off feedback from players.

[little hound]

I'm sure things will work out for everyone eventually.

Its a scary change right now, because nobody knows HOW MUCH They'll limit.

And seeing as they aren't releasing any of that info until Alpha launches later this month, nobody will know, so its currently just very unstead.

[pulsar minnow]

don't think it's that scary

its not like these devs dont use these addons either lol

[deep pawn]

the only place I've even seen that alpha may have limits is one random discord post from someone who's supposedly a WeakAuras dev talking about a chat they had with Ion at one of the dev signing events.

And even that is speculation from him.

I think 12.0 is too early with just a few months of beta to test

I'd rather season 1 be too easy than anything.

[little hound]

True.

[deep pawn]

oh it feels so good to give all my complaints about patch 11.1.5 in an official survey.

[little hound]

11.1.5?

[deep pawn]

Yeah

Turbo Boost, Dastardly Duos, and Horrific Visions revisited

I said I only enjoyed corruption enchants that patch.

[little hound]

Turbo Boost - I diidn't care about it.
Dastardly - Biggest failure of the year.
Visions - Meh.. OK Cosmetics.

[deep pawn]

Turbo Boost I didn't enjoy massively increasing the crest grind

I get its a naked engagement grab but still.

[little hound]

I do too many +10s anyways so i didn't mind, i cap anyways.

[upper pasture]

turbo boost was great, helped let alts get good gear on par with myth track and didn't feel bad "missing out" on mythic vaults since hero 8/8 was myth 6/6. DD was just a bad event all around. HV was fun wish we could play with the enchants for longer but eh

[deep pawn]

It didn't help my alts get good gear until they drastically increased the crests gained from delves and higher keys.

but that wasn't a turbo boost change

that was more overcharged and a general system change

it demotivated me to play alts by increasing the grind

[upper pasture]

huh, strange i never seem to hit a wall, but i make sure i get the accountwide crest discount before working on alts

makes getting 10 per upgrade alot easier to swallow than the 15 it normally would have been

[deep pawn]

It wasn't a wall, it felt like too long a grind to bother.

at least too long to do more than once.

[ember blaze]

honestly buff the crest amount on top of discount

[upper pasture]

They could just buff the discount at that point tho lol

[deep pawn]

It existed purely to get people to keep playing after mid season

[austere gazelle]

Legends of the Haranir (Harandar): Step into the forgotten past of the Hara’ti Tribe using magical paintings to embark on bite-sized lore-rich journeys. Each adventure reveals more of the Haranir’s mysterious history.

Question for my fellow english bro

Do you pronounce Hara'ti and Arathi the same ?

Cause I don't think blizzard made two similar tribe name by mistake , that would draw confusion between both, unless both ends up being tied somehow...

( In french we pronounce both the same way )

[glass fulcrum]

Very similar but not the same it really is just like sticking one letter in front of the a name to be different

[rain cave]

Don't tell bro about the two different hakkars

[austere gazelle]

yeah but obviously they wouldn't repeat the same mistake twice... in a shorter span.. no ?

[upper pasture]

Am I tripping but they don’t pronounce the same, sure they are both 3 syllables

Hara’ti should pronounce with a “tee” and arathi ends with the “thee” sound no?

I suppose like you said possible with other languages it’s different but from an English standpoint they should be different enough to not cause confusion

[austere gazelle]

.wth

[lavish raptor]

that's my wife

Sometimes she wants to be an Earthen

[worn crown]

So, I'm feeling kinda stupid right now and need some help 😛

The new blog post about Devourer DH says:
"With the introduction of a new specialization, Demon Hunters also gain a new Hero Talent tree—Annihilator. This new tree is shared between Devourer and Havoc Demon Hunters. Devourer Demon Hunters will also gain access to the Scarred Hero Talent tree (formerly called Fel Scarred)."

So it means that Havoc DH in Midnight will have access to Annihilator and Aldrachi Reaver?

[lavish raptor]

They keep giving confused info so it's not your fault

Blog post contradicts some PowerPoints

Idk which one Is accurate

But the picture makes the most sense to me

Speak of the devil

They updated the blog post

[worn crown]

Perfect timing

[rain cave]

No they get felscarred and aldrachi

Which annoys me because it means veng loses fel scared

And aldrachi has a bit of a weird fantasy mix with veng imo

Even if its named after their artifact

I feel annihilator and aldrachi would work well with devourer to let you swap between a more caster or melee weaving playstyle

Idk it's weird

Because won't it be awkward if devourer is proccing the fel scarred explosions? Like how arcane has to go into melee for arcane explosion

[ember blaze]

magical paintings huh

https://tenor.com/view/clair-obscur-gustave-what-huh-no-clue-gif-17965705031950798618

yet another thing to tie back to that one dreamer/painting mount

painter/dreamer class confirmed

[clear apex]

Painter/art class would be fun

[deep pawn]

I was thinking more of a situation like Shadowbringers haha

[ember blaze]

idk what that means

[deep pawn]

Squishei, at the very least the survey is asking about autofilling groups based on your criteria. It's unclear if that'll just auto filter people applying or what.

I did admit in the survey that I don't lead my own group for either not wanting to risk my key or the stress of filtering applicants haha

[lean yew]

is the ptr down yet

are we not getting a ptr build til tomorrow

[ember blaze]

bold of you to think we're getting one this week

[lean yew]

they said we were

[ember blaze]

dont even have class tuning

[lean yew]

why would we not

the team working on ptr builds

[zealous sedge]

they said they will be doing another week of remix testing this week

[lean yew]

is not the team working on class tuning

[zealous sedge]

its only noon on the west coast

[lean yew]

yes it def still could happen was just hoping theyd be down by now lol

[zealous sedge]

yeah kinda weird how they aren't down yet

[lean yew]

i havent logged in

b/c i dont want my remix characters to migrate

so i dont know if they are or arent

[zealous sedge]

i mean maybe they don't need the servers down too long just to push an update

[ember blaze]

why?

[lean yew]

so i can use them

to test remix

[ember blaze]

just re copy?

[zealous sedge]

you can't copy characters into the remix testing

[ember blaze]

thats lame

[zealous sedge]

it's either fresh or the ones used last round of testing

how is it lame?

it woldn't make sense to copy over a pre existing 80 into remix

also the technical limitations of that alone

[ember blaze]

or create a max character whatever

[zealous sedge]

it's a completely different mode entirely

that doesn't make sense either the whole point of remix is to create a new toon

[ember blaze]

the whole point of the ptr is also to test

this isnt the live game

[lean yew]

yes and you test by levleing them

[zealous sedge]

yes testing also involves playing the game

and leveling

[lean yew]

thats arguably one of the most important parts of remix

which as it was before the changes

was doodoo

[ember blaze]

which most ppl arent going to do, which is why u can generally copy or create templates

[lean yew]

yes but thats not the same for remix

its just not apples to oranges

you can do raids while not at max level

[zealous sedge]

what are you talking about. The whole point of remix is to test the progression and you can't do that by copying over a character

[ember blaze]

id test end game stuff, but im not gonna go on ptr to level with 0 stats and powers lol

[zealous sedge]

or creating a template max level

[lean yew]

yes but thats the entire point of the ptr

its not for you to log on and have fun

[ember blaze]

the point im making is to have an option for both

[lean yew]

But it doesnt make any sense for remix lol

becoming OP

is the point of remix

[ember blaze]

this has nothing to do with the point of remix, but about testing 🛌

[zealous sedge]

https://tenor.com/view/confused-no-nope-gif-5413974953753901704

[upper pasture]

that''s the point of this PTR cycle tho, to test remix

[zealous sedge]

we are literally testing remix, it has everything to do with remix

[lean yew]

okay this isnt like retail

[ember blaze]

yeah let me hop in there and go into a +25

[lean yew]

thats pointless

do you know why?

because right now, as it stands, you're NEVER GOING TO DO A 25 LMAO

[zealous sedge]

testing a +25 is pointless

[lean yew]

Because we tested

and you cant get OP enough

to do a 25

[zealous sedge]

they dont even have the other phases unlocked in remix

literally only through suramar iirc

[lean yew]

It was a hot mess express

[ember blaze]

this makes me very confident about how it will release /s

[lean yew]

Well if it were up to you

we'd all be doing +25s on the ptr

and when it launched

wed be going

"how the fuck are we supposed to get to the point of doing +25s"

because no one tested the process of getting OP

[ember blaze]

idk how youre coming to that conclusion

[lean yew]

god

[ember blaze]

the point is to have both options is all im saying

[lean yew]

i dont have the strength in me

to continue this conversation

[ember blaze]

just like how a new expac releases, u can create a template or you can level a character yourself

just because u have a template doesnt mean leveling gets 0 testing

[zealous sedge]

alright im out lol

[ember blaze]

im just offering an opinion on how to test things, theres nothing to argue about lol

i just personally wont ptr test if i gotta level

[upper pasture]

i think the point is remix is unlike any other testing because you can do like 99% of the content at any level and most of it isn't gated by being max level

if they can't get the power curve to a reasonable and obtainable set then we can never do the higher content that they expect us to be able to do. if people only test template max level characters, they won't know if it takes us weeks or months to get that strong and we will be forced to farm frogs again.

[glass fulcrum]

The only thing you can do at max level you can't in leveling is M+, and M+ didn't need testing

[ember blaze]

i hope it comes out okay lol

[deep pawn]

ptr was down, build is likely some time today

[carmine birch]

new developer note just dropped, sounds like instead of letting player secondary stats scale infinitely they are just nerfing all enemies?

[ember blaze]

that seems like a terrible choice

[dense plover]

i mean, thats an extreme simplification reading through the patch notes

there are massive changes to enemy scaling, artifact tree scaling, and artifact tree costs

not to mention the drop rates of the various epochs

i dont think youre entirely wrong about secondary stats - i think blizz is worried about them growing too quickly and making even heroic an immediate joke and i dont know if they know how to handle that

[deep pawn]

I wouldn't care.

Let us get our cosmetics and then break for christmas.

[ember blaze]

did anyone beg blizzard to make the next remix not a joke when it comes to clearing content? 🤔

[lavish raptor]

are you saying you want it to be harder

because most people are crying that they cant kill raid bosses in 5 seconds

[ember blaze]

thats what im saying

i dont recall anyone telling blizz they wanted to "prog" anything

the expectation was to go fuck shit up with 100% crit and haste

[lavish raptor]

there was someone on the secrets discord saying that

[ember blaze]

and i assume the dev on there just responded how annoyed he was and dismissed the feedback?

[lavish raptor]

no everyone else did that

[glass fulcrum]

No, the dev for remix has been in there and has been extremely chill with feedback and will comment when able

[clear apex]

I'm a bit confused. Isn't 70 max level? Why would you need exp?

No wait, 80 is max even on remix. I was still thinking about mop remix when it was 70

[deep pawn]

it's been a fast year I know

[clear apex]

[ember blaze]

https://tenor.com/view/so-old-gif-27277116

[lean yew]

Im breaking the five-fire alarm on legion remix

In MOP remix you could get legendary spool of eternal thread and get 1080 stamina or 540 random secondary or primary. Here in legion remix, you kill a raid boss and you get 1.6 main stat worth of infinite power at 36/36 infinite knowledge.

its dogshit

[lavish raptor]

Didn't they increase the thread drop later in remop

[lean yew]

yeah, so that wouldve been a great starting point for here, instead they threw it all away and went all in on the infinite trait

[rain cave]

I'm curious how the different direction will go, but I do think they're missing a bit of the point by adding so much competition to it

Instead of it just being blind fun

I genuinely think it's been turned into a fake season 4 so they didn't have to make one and could focus on midnight

[lean yew]

I think they were fine avoiding s4 just due to the release schedule

10.2 launched in November for an August xpac. It was too long so they needed a S4. But now this go around midnight will prob launch in February. Which will be 6 months after 11.2

Theyve done a really great job of staying on track for the patch cycle. And remix is a good event to have during the end of the last season. I just hope they make it more fun like mop

NGL I’d enjoy BFA and Shadowlands remixes.

[lean yew]

I also think based on the feedback of DF S4 that they needed to back off doing them. Shadowlands s4 was welcome. DF not so much lol

[worn crown]

Me 2!!!

[rain cave]

A shadowlands remix where the covenant and soulbinds are amped up like the legion remix artifact trees, and you can get torghast perks for everywhere

[upper pasture]

SL remix unlimited torghast, my only real want from SL remix

[glass fulcrum]

Beta torthast before they nerfed it

[rain cave]

And the maw is turned into an actual hellsccape with tons of world events constantly that use the world tierssystem

Some cool tmog they could add as well, like bwonsamdi armour, or sylvanases maw look

Anduins dominated armour and mourneblade

Hell even some of denathrius' stuff

[clear apex]

The maw was really disappointing

Visions look a lot more hellscape.

[sleek solar]

Did we ever find out why the Dracthyr visage is so unique/ weird?

[little hound]

Nah.

[sleek solar]

Sigh

I only just got reminded by it because I made a new evoker

[pulsar minnow]

While not explicitly stated the theory is because they’re lab experiments

They’re not full dragons so they can’t accomplish full visages - but again not actually explained because DF writing be like that

[deep pawn]

They speculate there might be a secret destiny

could come into play in TLT

[ember blaze]

who is they

[deep pawn]

wrathion or ebonhorn

[ember blaze]

wasnt that before they learned about their father by the end of sark? 🤔

[deep pawn]

no?

I mean it was but it wasn't changed by what they learned of Neltharion haha

[ember blaze]

🤔

cant remember it too well

but i thought all that stuff got settled by then

[deep pawn]

no, the meaning of their visage form never got solved

Neltharion planned for a lot

it's possible that he made them to fight the titans too

[ember blaze]

i still dont get how raz soloed neltharion and a billion dracthyr

wow characters need a training arc

[hard axle]

So, what's this about 2H Scythes for Devourers?

[lavish raptor]

its just aesthetic

[hard axle]

In what way? I'm guessing it's different from transmogs?

[lavish raptor]

there is no 2h scythes fr dh

its just how the spell looks

[hard axle]

Oh, so like Vengeance Demon Hunters drop their weapons in favor of claws during Metamorphosis?

[ember blaze]

some janky animations with casting and glaives

[dense plover]

bud

do you want to get banned?

<@&299347348847329281>

also why are you responding to a post from february?

the hell is wrong with you?

[upper pasture]

seems to me he's likely a salty private server player come to make a stink, best to not engage

[dense plover]

theyll likely be banned

[austere gazelle]

not yet. But I think it'll come at one point in one form or another

[hard axle]

Is there an article on wowhead about this "Hooded Supplier" and the player's comment that they look familiar?

[rain cave]

I've seen a few hooded suppliers around my town..

I try not to get into aggro range

[deep pawn]

It's just a joke from last remix

It's probably the lead for Remix's own character as the one supplying all the goodies

[rain cave]

It would be funny if elisande in remix realises she's in a fake timeline

[lean yew]

how do you feel on remix

[dense plover]

Why are you replying to that text with this question?

Idk - haven’t tried the changes yet

Was disappointed before

[dense plover]

ok checking it out - momento droprate is massively buffed

almost every enemy drops at least 1 now

they also made it so you can get jewelry immediately

so no waiting on the cool stuff for 10 levels

they fixed the jewelry daily (weekly? idk its blue) giving you a max ilvl piece

it now just gives you a significantly buffed item

so my ilvl is 18, the one i got is 35

instead of like 675

they added this - one of the main requests with them adding the timewarped herbs and ores

you no longer lose your timerunner's hearthstone after setting it

[deep pawn]

at this point my plan is still to wait til all phases are out

I don't think I'll enjoy a "compressed expansion."

especially if replacing gear each phase is a thing

[dense plover]

not sure it will be tbh

[deep pawn]

sounds like it

it's implied your ilvl will go up each phase

and you don't upgrade gear you have to farm pieces to replace it one by one and at slow ilvl jumps each time.

[dense plover]

its not really farming if you replace gear constantly and very easily

[deep pawn]

Maybe I misread but at 80 it's like 1 drop at a time and 3 ilvls at a time.

Constantly is still a grind that sounds unfun to me.

especially if repeated each phase

[dense plover]

heroic world tier no longer has the level recommendation

so you can do it after getting your artifact through your class campaign

[lavish raptor]

itll be funny when the people waiting for the argus phase realize they might not be able to poopsock long enough to get enough bronze

[upper pasture]

They will then cry how it’s “not fair” and demand that blizzard increases bronze drop rates by 500% so that they can get everything in the last week

[dense plover]

i mean, thats probably actually planned considering the last phase is meant to be crazy

[upper pasture]

¯_(ツ)_/¯

i still wouldn't bank on it

[ember blaze]

u could do it in mop

some people even spammed alts which took 5 minutes to max for the quest turn ins

[upper pasture]

again, i'm saying I WOULDN'T, we've already seen they plan to make legion remix different, heck the whole expansion isn't out and content isn't gonna be designed in such a way that lets you solo 99% of it. at a certain point in MoP remix I didn't need anyone else except to get past the 2nd and 5th boss in SoO

if you wait until the last week of the remix event to do anything you'll likely be faced with being super undergeared/underpowered AND the possiblitly of having noone doing the M+ stuff so you likely aren't getting the 25s timed

[dense plover]

heroic tier still feels very meh

and the mod that summons demons is still busted af

you get more xp, but the amount of time some mobs take to kill probably still means this isnt worth it

idk what they want heroic to be, but it isnt fun

[ember blaze]

we'll see

ill check it out on live and depending on how it is i might ignore it for a couple weeks

with the expectation it gets buffed or gets easier

sometimes a working formula doesnt need to be changed

[lean yew]

Feels like a test for retail

I don’t know the point of it though. Like it’s never gonna give more than what veteran gear? I just don’t see the point of more challenging world content when it’s limited in what it can give

[glass fulcrum]

500% xp bonus

[lean yew]

That’s not meaningful for retail tho

Leveling is such a short period

[dense plover]

unlikely - it sucks

its not fun

its just slow

[glass fulcrum]

It could be. Could have it be an option for leveling in retail in the future with its own rewards and challenges

[lean yew]

Lemix is a big miss in general for me

A ton of improvements

[dense plover]

if it actually had rewards maybe

[lean yew]

None of matters if I’m weak

[lavish raptor]

its not even out yet??

[glass fulcrum]

Its on PTR

[dense plover]

500% xp doesnt feel like it makes up for how slow it is

[glass fulcrum]

People been playing it

[dense plover]

it should give more artifact power

[lavish raptor]

yeah that doesnt mean we've seen it

[lean yew]

I have 36/36 infinite knowledge - it does nothing

[glass fulcrum]

????

[lavish raptor]

in its entirety

[dense plover]

wuh

[glass fulcrum]

I mean it is worth doing heroic world tier off rip for a little bit anyway since theres a few starting achievements that give power boost (Kill 5 rares, do 20 quests, etc)

[lean yew]

It’s so disappointing

[dense plover]

dude - its disappointing

[ember blaze]

the point is people asking blizz to let them take longer to kill stuff in outer world

[dense plover]

it shouldnt be

[ember blaze]

some ppl dont like one shotting quest mobs

[lean yew]

36/36 N EN boss gives me 800 infinite power

[dense plover]

you dont do that off heroic tho

[lean yew]

Just a total joke

[dense plover]

because the remix power level is way weaker

[lean yew]

I have MAX infinite knowledge

And a single boss kill

[lavish raptor]

(as of now)

[glass fulcrum]

Idk I like heroic world tier, though I'm not looking for a 6th power leveling event so it isn't a bg deal for me

[ember blaze]

yeah i just mean if they introduce it to live

[lavish raptor]

(they might increase the cap in other phaseS_

[dense plover]

THATS WHAT WE ARE SUPPOSED TO GIVE FEEDBACK ON

[lean yew]

Gives me 800/50000 for 130 main stat

https://tenor.com/view/kitty-puke-puke-vomit-kitty-vomit-cat-vomit-gif-10902081098279086080

[glass fulcrum]

I got almost all my alts I intended to level to max during MoP remix & the winds of xp event

[dense plover]

the fact that the current phase sucks doesnt make "the other phases might be better" acceptable

[glass fulcrum]

idk how people want more spped leveling so soon

[lean yew]

You can’t even get max infinite knowledge in phase 1 either

It’s so bad

[dense plover]

i honestly couldnt care about leveling speed

but it doesnt feel fun

[crude sigil]

yeah, so it's a legion classic weirdly modified with timegating

[dense plover]

it isnt blasty

it isnt OP

[lean yew]

It’s dogwater

[dense plover]

its boring

[glass fulcrum]

i will say remix missing legon legendaries is silly

[lean yew]

As it stands

I will get my cosmetics and leave

[dense plover]

im not even sure ill really do this

its not fun

its a slog

[lean yew]

Yup it’s a chore

[glass fulcrum]

I mean its worth collecting all the sets since they're armor specific now

instead of class locked

[lean yew]

It’s pretty painful to play tho lol

It plays like weaker retail

[crude sigil]

Why they just don't keep overpower like MoP Remix ? with some small improvement but not slower the process ... Making phase can be cool but give us power :

[glass fulcrum]

You're also missing tier sets tbf

[dense plover]

no clue

[lean yew]

I’m supposed to be op

[dense plover]

its a great question that they seem unable to answer

[lean yew]

Not comparable to retail

[ember blaze]

yeah if it goes live like this im ignoring it till it gets buffed

[glass fulcrum]

I will say I get not liking the power level atm but it isn't like MoP had no changes while it was running

MoP remix had SEVERAL buffs/nerfs

not counting frog stuff

[dense plover]

but MoP was still OP at the start

even off heroic, stuff takes a while to kill

feels like it takes longer than on live at equivalent levels

[lean yew]

Great so we get the cycle of “huge feedback in ptr cycle that’s ignored, launches broken, overwhelming criticism, fixed over the course of 4 weeks, yay they listened!”

[crude sigil]

I think I know the answer but it's ridiculous ... The first person who build up MoP Remix leave Blizzard since Mop Remix ...

[glass fulcrum]

im not saying you shouldn't mention issues or feedback

they totally should adjust stuff now

[lean yew]

I’m kind of sick of it

I’m sick of testing for them, providing feedback and it being ignored

[dense plover]

unlikely

[lean yew]

It’s frustrating

[ember blaze]

im sick of all the talent at blizzard leaving or getting fired

[dense plover]

i think its just a true misunderstanding of what people liked about remix

[crude sigil]

yeah ...

[dense plover]

im not upset about the phases or the gearing

but i feel weak af

heroic can feel hard without being boring

[lavish raptor]

that's what happens when feedback contradicts other people's feedback and also the feedback given by the dev's bosses

[dense plover]

and regular leveling should feel OP af

[lean yew]

They genuinely took the fun out of the mode lol

[dense plover]

^^^^

[lean yew]

There’s no better description other than they removed the fun

In MOP remix you could get legendary spool of eternal thread and get 1080 stamina or 540 random secondary or primary. Here in legion remix, you kill a raid boss and you get 1.6 main stat worth of infinite power at 36/36 infinite knowledge.

https://tenor.com/view/clown-clown-meme-clown-makeup-clown-makeup-meme-gif-24590297

I’m boo boo the fool for testing it tbh

[dense plover]

the lack of secondaries is definitely a chunk of what is broken here

[glass fulcrum]

for sure

[dense plover]

but the epochs only giving artifact power and not permanent buffs most of the time is definitely part of it as well

[glass fulcrum]

Logging on and just having versatility gone was crazy

[dense plover]

idc about the XP buff stuff

[lean yew]

I’m also boo boo the fool for thinking they’d listen to my feedback and make changes. They made it so the infinite trait doesn’t get weaker but then increased the cost by 5x

Just absolutely tone deaf and out of touch

[dense plover]

leveling taking longer is whatever, but the lack of stat increases is 100% the tone deaf stuff

[lean yew]

The artifact powers are so weak

It doesn’t matter which you take

They’re all trash

[dense plover]

1000%

theyre weak and dont scale outside of your level

which means theyre weak always

they should scale off a separate stat

[lean yew]

I’d rather just get s3 tier bonuses

[dense plover]

we had cloak ilvl for this before

[lean yew]

And there’s people defending blizz in the game

The white knights licking shit off of blizzards boots and begging for more

[dense plover]

its gonna bomb as is currently

people will play and within hours will quit

[lean yew]

Yeah

[dense plover]

because its a fucking slog

[lean yew]

It’s gonna be a spectacular shit show

[dense plover]

yup

[lean yew]

I hope it bombs and never recovers

[dense plover]

even if they patch it after launch, it will be too late for a lot of people

they need to make changes before it launches or it will fail

[lean yew]

Blizzard deserves a lesson

[dense plover]

ideally they fix it before that and learn the lesson on PTR

[lean yew]

I fear it’ll kill future remixes but if this is what future remixes are? I don’t want them

[lavish raptor]

[lean yew]

I’ll just reminisce about mop forever

And I’m going to blizzcon next year. I never try to ask a question. You better believe I’m gonna ask about remix if I get a chance

If they even do a QA

They prob won’t

Honestly I was so excited

I’ve been waiting all year

[dense plover]

i mean - hopefully they fix it

[lean yew]

Ever since the roadmap reveal

[dense plover]

the forum feedback is also not good

so hopefully they make more changes

its not launching for several months

[lean yew]

It’s launching in a month

10-7

[dense plover]

thats enough time

[lean yew]

I suspect the changes they make will be tepid and lukewarm

[dense plover]

most of these changes could be made in hotfixes

[lean yew]

They could just fix it by making epochs give other secondaries

[dense plover]

yes - very easy fix

[lean yew]

And infinite trait cost less and give more

Would literally fix the entire mode in one change lol

[dense plover]

hopefully they do that

[lean yew]

Completely fixed in one hotfix

[dense plover]

we will see

[deep pawn]

Like I said before, I have little desire to suffer the early phases based on what I'm seeing. I'll play the complete remix after Argus is out and fixed

No one wanted "season of remix" we wanted MoP remix in Legion.

The phases feel like a transparent engagement metric requirement the same way turboboost felt regarding the crest grind.

11.1.5 must not have kept people playing long enough

[clear apex]

agreed, i want all of Legion from the start, but ill likely play the day it opens regardless.
Overall just want to smash through things like we did in Mop remix

i wonder if the timegating is to keep players since MOPR you were forced to stay the 3 months? And with Lemix you get to leave when you want?

[little hound]

Its not even released yet and people are moaning violently. Ofc they’ll tune things across the phases, doubt they’ll just tune it for launch and leave it untouched until the end

[little hound]

I touch grass too often. So i’ll afk on tha road

Lowkey Housing has me 10x times more hyped than Remix. Hehe

[zealous sedge]

I’ve honestly lost the hype for remix just because of all the negativity surrounding it. Not because I agree with the haters tho.

I just want to play the game mode without everyone going reeeee

[lavish raptor]

im gonna do leave /2 when i first enter lemix on live

[little hound]

Same

[upper pasture]

this is why i usually just wait to play it myself than listen to "influencers" bitch and cry about every little thing, there's a solid chance that legion remix can still be okay

[zealous sedge]

Yeah I don’t even listen to the influencers at all it’s just all the randos on different discords or in game chat

I know I should just ignore them lol

[upper pasture]

i mean it's okay to listen to them and hear what they are saying but to form your own opinion through your own experience is invaluable

[zealous sedge]

Absolutely

[deep pawn]

It might just be what players want and what devs were told to create are just a gulf apart.

[novel zodiac]

i wonder what goes in the mind of a dev that does something almost perfect the first time, then fixes it to be perfect, and then they make it utter

did the dev in charge of Remop left?

it is ego?, they want to "Improve" something that's already perfect?

all they had to do was copy Remop and transfer it to Legion

[upper pasture]

Didn’t the dev that originally pitched remix leave? The new people probably think this is an improvement over the last one, hubris and what not lol

[novel zodiac]

its World Quests all over again, they perfected them first try, and every iteration after was worse than the previous one

[rain cave]

I mean, in the mind of a lot of designers there isn't a purpose to doing the same exact thing again

Remix doesn't have to be the same thing over and over just with different expansions, it's a space for them to try out ideas and wild new systems and gather data as well as providing new fun stuff for people to do

The issue this time around is people have already latched on and want that over the top feeling from mop remix

But you can see things they did in mop remix echoed in later design changes in the main game imo. The siren isle ring was similar to the slotted effects in mop remix. We also have the gear purchasing from killing raid bosses. Improvements and fast tracking the leveling experience.

In legion remix we have the world tiers and raid rollout over weeks, something they're toying with in midnight in different forms with Prey and the multiple raids on launch

[deep pawn]

Cyrce's Circlet is just a repeat of the Onyx Annulet which predates MoP remix

You're looking a bit too deep into it.

We've also had tier launches like Midnight long before as well

[dense plover]

to add on to the point about the circlet

the dragonflight one was just an evolution of the mechagon trinket

so its absolutely independent of MoP Remix

[rain cave]

Maybe

[uncut vault]

I feel like of any place for devs to experiment instead of copy pasting, the entirely optional mode detached from any current xpac content is a pretty fair place to do it haha

[deep pawn]

Gotta listen to people if they say it doesn't look fun, which they're trying but I always figure the design team is restrained some by corporate demands

[rain cave]

To be fair, it's not always the best thing to do to immediately cave to user demand

[deep pawn]

Maybe but I would question anyone who thinks a "Season of Remix" or compressed expansion run through just 2 months into an active season has to question what the hell do they think is going to happen

Like crests may not even uncap by the time this is out

[rain cave]

Designers and players can have really big differences in opinion on what's best, just always comes back to what ends up being more important, "professional opinion" or customer demand

[deep pawn]

It's a big damn ask to have you level barely faster than retail and to slowly regear and ask you to regear again every 2 weeks

Hall of Fame may not even be done by the 6th haha

If it's meant to be a fun overpowered romp through old content to collect cosmetics, it has to be that.

The fact the exp bonus is tied to completing every single zone meta, oof

And then the easiest way to gear at 80 appears to be to not do any quests at all and save them for 80 lol

Supposedly they're trying to get approval for a blog post explaining their goals for Legion and why they differ from MoP

[clear apex]

Leveling in remix should be fast though. The point is more farming cosmetics than anything, so why not get us to max fast?

[novel zodiac]

they said Turbo boost will come later in 11.2.5, so Lemix will come first

[deep pawn]

Part of turbo boost is with 11.2.5 immediately

The extra 7 ilvls will be with patch drop

[deep pawn]

Probably so you finish all 4 zone metas on one char

[little hound]

Can't say i care so much for 7 extra Ilvls, its just for minmaxers. It'll be replaced once HC Dungeons open in Midnight ezpz anyways.

[deep pawn]

I know

it's mostly to keep the "I want to finish my char" types grinding another couple hundred crests

[little hound]

Yeeeah, wish they'd given some proper mini-patch content rather than 7 ilvls. I'm hyped for Remix, but would love something for retail too

[upper pasture]

i think the extra itmlvls are more important for people trying to push harder content and helps them get over it more than people "maxing" their character.

also at the point of TB people will already be sitting on a pile of crests they can't use anyways

so it wouldn't really be farming crests as much as having somewhere to put them

and didn't last time TB come at the same time as crest cap removal? so people will also have hundreds if not thousands of crests to trade up too

[deep pawn]

This time they're opening upgrades earlier

those crests don't add up to as much as you think unless you run lots of m+ or mythic raid

[little hound]

I do mostly 90% Keys.

[ember blaze]

it's ridiculous imo

this isnt legion classic, why would i play a mode i expected to be fast and fun and feel no different than my live character?

[deep pawn]

who knows

my default answer is corporate demanding engagement metrics to justify everything

[uncut vault]

I mean there is an entire talent tree for new gameplay lol

[rain cave]

I don't think corporate would meddle in how legion remix is being designed to that extent

it might be that they just want to make it more challenging, and by extension that's caused a slower cadence and gameplay

because if they wanted things to be challenging but kept us mega powered, our power would feel pointless and things would be insanely tuned

[zealous sedge]

I think the opening quest line in remix is rough . I understand it’s very important to the story but the weapon storylines should’ve been skipped or given an option to skip. Also if I wanted to have an off spec like healer so I could get quicker queue’s I have to do the artifact weapon storyline for that weapon and it becomes tedious. Just let me get the weapon and let me go quest and what not.

That’s like my only complaint for the whole mode.

But once you started getting into the main quest line of a zone it feels good.

[rain cave]

by effectively shrinking the ceiling of power the design space for more targeted difficulty and then satisfaction through beating difficult content isa easier to aim

whereas in mop remix you'd have a couple people doing 80% of the dps sometimes

and the stronger you got, the easier it was to get even stronger since harder content dropped better stat rewards

whereas in legion remix from what I'm seeing/hearing it's more like they want to reward you for engaging regardless, and let you build more at your own pace towards tackling the harder content

so it's not a race

while there will undoubtedly be people turned off by it not being as wild, you could also argue that the new direction incentivizes players who DIDN'T play mop remix much because they felt like they fell behind, to keep playing

[zealous sedge]

Yeah they definitely made the curve plateau instead of shoot up like a vertical line with this remix once you get to that part of the progression.

But also we still don’t know how power will go with phases.

[rain cave]

so maybe blizz has internal data showing a lot of the engagement falloff was from characters/accounts who joined later or didn't play a certain no. of hours below the more dedicated players

and they just want to squish those together

something I do think a lot of people forget is that the average wowhead discord user is not the average player by a looong shot

we are impassioned fans of the franchise/game and we enjoy talking about it and discussing, but there are equally players who just.. play

and their voices can only be heard through blizzards internal tools for finding player demographics and analyzing their patterns

[zealous sedge]

Also remix is launching in the middle of a new raid tier and season 3 and people will still want to do the turbo boost event. Mop remix was during season 4. I know plenty of people who don’t know how they are gonna fit in legion remix time but some of the changes like banking the infinite research quests up to 6 days worth is great for players that still want to engage in season 3.

[rain cave]

yeah that's another thing that people can use remix to get new toons up to max

don't have to wait to bring them out

[zealous sedge]

I think the timing alone is definitely a major reason why they made remix more of slow burn

[rain cave]

if levelling was super lightning fast there's potential cheese there maybe

[zealous sedge]

Yeah you can convert anytime you want

I think once you level one character fully the xp bonus will be pretty good. Especially as more phases unlock and presumably you get more xp bonuses for completing that content

[clear apex]

another thing is, housing will be coming out during Lemix too, so maybe theyre accounting for people who will go play dollhouse

[zealous sedge]

Oh I will definitely be spending way too much time making the perfect house

I hope there is 11.2.7 PTR testing for housing but I doubt it haha

If anything maybe just stress testing but that might be during beta because we don’t get neighborhoods until midnight

[dense plover]

we dont?

how can you have housing without neighborhoods?

[deep pawn]

you just can

we're only getting interiors in 11.2.7

interiors are totally separate from exteriors

so 12.0 we just get to hookup the interior to a plot in a neighborhood

it's not like ff14 where you gotta pack all your stuff to move.

[zealous sedge]

Yeah I’m guessing it’s different instances - curious if they will act like delves with no loading screens when entering house from the neighborhood and vice versa

But we know it’s a loading screen to get into the neighborhood/ house from elsewhere

[upper pasture]

I think it’s we aren’t getting endeavors or whatever the neighborhood group activity is

But we will have the neighborhood plots to choose what plot you are getting

[clear apex]

they will have neighborhood and house but no endeavors, afaik. Basically no neighborhood activities

Houses exist in neighborhoods, so it seems like poor wording

[clear apex]

Oooh is that what they meant? I dont think they said we couldnt decorate the exterior yet but idk

Either or

[deep pawn]

hmm, the impression I got was 0 neighborhood stuff

[clear apex]

My only reasoning on neighborhoods existing but no endeavors is; hard to find a plot youd like if you cant see what the exterior will be

like your yard/environment

[zealous sedge]

I guess we’ll have to wait and see. Not trying to complain but this is the problem with the information being delivered in a fragmented way

Hard to keep track of all the details lol

[clear apex]

yeah totally. its been a hot mess

I partly blame blizz and partly blame microsoft for how it was handled

[deep pawn]

I personally don't think it'll be fun if you have neighborhoods where lots of people are locked out, even if its easy to move.

[clear apex]

I just want to get what plot i want. I'm still curious how layering will work with that

I don't want to wait for a neighborhood to fill up

Say 10 people want plot C

[deep pawn]

they already said you'll get the plot you want no matter what

at least in public ones

[hard axle]

Has anyone done a Transcription of the MrGm-Ion Fireside Chat from Gamescon?
I cannot handle this crap audio
I listen for 2-4 seconds, then I pause, try again 30 mins later, repeat
Yeah, it ain't happening

[rustic cliff]

im pretty sure youtube has a transcript you can read. it's not perfect, but it's still pretty good

[lean yew]

do you think we wanted to reee about it?

Ive been looking forward to legion remix this ENTIRE YEAR

Ive quite literally been waiting all fucking year for it, ive been so fucking excited

ive been talking about it nonstop to all my wow friends

so to log onto the ptr and it missing the main thing that made mop remix such a hit, was an absolute gut punch when youve been sitting here hyping it up for a literal year

so what did I do? I made a constructive forum post, praising them about what is right and what is wrong

and then they said they listened, and were addressing it, and then they doubled down

Im sure there are plenty of people who want to ree about everything

but I can assure you that I, someone who actively tests wow in every ptr/alpha/beta cycle and provides feedback/bug reports, is not someone who doom posts about everything

and the reason we are reeing is because we want changes made BEFORE launch, not 2-3 weeks into it

because we want it to have a shit ton of players, not be desolate after a week b/c they missed the mark

those of us passionate about this topic aren't bitching for the sake of bitching, we are providing crucial feedback so the mode can be a bigger hit than mop remix and we have tons of people to play w/ the entire event

so to devalue all of that into a bunch of "reeing" and telling us to go touch grass is completely misreading the room, similar to blizz on what made mop remix so fun

The worst part of it all, is that one hotfix would make it all better, it would entirely fix it all

[clear apex]

Tbf a lot of people do just whine without giving constructive feedback and moan without saying what they want changed

You can look at almost any wowhead post full of people just saying "wow L blizz" "wasted dev time" "legion doa no MT"

Those don't do any good.

[zealous sedge]

For the record I was really only talking about the low effort comments and reeee.

I share most if not all of the concerns you do.

I hope they hit the mark as well because I don’t want the game mode to be desolate after week 2. I also want them to hit the mark because I couldn’t stand the initial storm of complaints back at the beginning of MoP. Not because they were wrong, but because of the sheer vitriol.

I agree with you in that I don’t want to see massive changes 2-3 weeks into remix like last time. It sucks for everyone. I also think PTR should’ve had all the phases and gone on for a month uninterrupted. But for some reason they limit the amount of time to test.

At the end of the day I wish we had a blog post with the developers expressing EXACTLY the way they expect the mode to go this time. I know this is something they are trying to put it out but expectations should have been set from the beginning.

But also I do believe people remember MoP remix solely in how it ended, and not how it began and evolved. And that is also part of the issue.

[zealous sedge]

Also I’ve been playing PTR quite a bit and at this point I think you should set your expectations for a week 3 hotfix to actually address the mass revolt that will happen. Because it is going to happen regardless.

At this point this is the expectation. Blizzard has consistently missed the mark on where to start with a lot of things because they always aim too low in the grind curve. I.E. plundercoin, MoP remix bronze and power acquisition, cartel tokens, dinars, etc. There’s a huge list of features that always get hotfixed to increase progression speed in all sorts of different gameplay systems.

It’s a tug of war between the requirement for engagement metrics/ subscriptions, player satisfaction. And usually the people at the top or in other departments that don’t actually play the game (finance and compliance comes to mind) won’t be convinced until they actually see real time player feedback/ metrics when it actually goes live. They don’t care about devs opinions, they only care about real time metrics. Yes, it seems like they haven’t learned their lesson yet after all these years but it will continue to be so as long as people keep playing the game and accept that the first few weeks will always be subpar.

[novel zodiac]

how did they doubled down?, im not too into it but i thought they were changing things

[hard axle]

MANY THANKS!!! HUNDREDS OF THOUSANDS OF THANKS!!!

[glass fulcrum]

They didn’t. They addressed feedback from first PTR round. It wasn’t too well received, and they have acknowledged it wasn’t enough and would have more to say soon, again.

Like people can dislike remix but to say they aren’t listening isnt accurate. They just didn’t get the tuning right first try. Or second go. They have time.

[deep pawn]

Not really

release candidates are probably just a couple weeks away.

there'll be hotfixes after but the core of the event likely isn't changing much more

[zealous sedge]

Are we gonna get any more blogs this week you think?

I’m curious about alpha too. Maybe the week of the 22nd?

[ember blaze]

class blogs are taking too long

i do not care about housing news anymore

[deep pawn]

Everything about Blizzard feels slow right now

you can feel the layoffs.

[pulsar minnow]

The July layoffs only really hit the social media team no?

[deep pawn]

I'm assuming some of that was CMs too even if tangentially.

[austere gazelle]

All of the news will be AI generated soon

[rain cave]

To be fair this is a social media blog post we are waiting for

[rain cave]

Please god no that'll be the death of information

[pulsar minnow]

Well yeah but I was responding specifically to the “everything about blizzard feels slow now”

[rain cave]

Fair

[little hound]

Lowkey hoping for more housing news / Alpha News soon.

[deep pawn]

everything news related then.

[little hound]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S7mfpmsQH2Y

[clear apex]

Too bad they've said your house exterior will have to be horde

[little hound]

Yeeeh.

Idc too much about exterior, i can make that work quite nicely anyways.

[rain cave]

To be fair if you had a night elf house in a horde neighbourhood they might burn it down

[grim saddle]

As a Horde main, can confirm, this is very possible. Especially if there's a tree anywhere around it. Or near it. Or it even slightly looks like a tree.

[warm topaz]

https://us.forums.blizzard.com/en/wow/t/the-war-within-patch-1125-development-notes/2149725/7

[upper pasture]

Those seem….better? Ignoring diminishing returns AND hard caps?? Oh lala

[dense plover]

those are the two things we really needed

infinite versatility, and secondary stats being worth WAY more

theyre now linear instead of logarithmic with no cap

[upper pasture]

That’s better than mop remix?

Cause mop had the hard caps still

[dense plover]

this should help with some of the slog

im a bit concerned this doesnt say empowered enemies

and they still really didnt fix the "spawn demons" heroic affix

that thing is deadly af

[dense plover]

not exactly

not unless the %secondaries on remix gear go higher at higher ilvl

the nice part is you can now get the ilvl cap before the last phase

so you dont have to wait for each phase, you can keep playing

[upper pasture]

Do we not have a stacking method like in OG remix?

[dense plover]

dont think so?

thats still the thing kinda missing i think?

[upper pasture]

Lame

[dense plover]

epochs (the thing replacing threads) only give stamina and main stat and sometimes +XP

maybe they added secondaries to it and didnt mention it?

otherwise the infinite scaling makes no sense

[upper pasture]

Well uncapped vers is gonna make up for some of it since it’s a straight damage buff and reduction

But not as crazy as say no hard cap on SS

“Which you could push infinitely”

[dense plover]

again, i suspect they may have changed something there, possibly tied to removing the ilvl cap

if this doesnt fix it, then they need to add secondaries to epochs like you had them through threads

assuming they didnt already implement that

i do understand part of the goal with avoiding that

they dont want to encourage a timeless frogs situation

they could tie the secondaries to boss kill epochs or something like that which would help somewhat

or cap it weekly though thats less fun

[upper pasture]

Yeah let’s hope, I wasn’t a frog farmer but I did end up getting to the top of remix power just from logging on and playing and it was super fun. Hopefully they get this on the same sorta level again

[dense plover]

time to see if these changes matter

they added chapter info for legion zones to the legion campaign summary

its not fixed

its still fucked

there is still no way to get higher secondaries EXCEPT now you can for versatility

its still a slog on heroic

they need to add a secondary stats grind or this shit is still DOA