beta-ptr-spoilers

[rain cave]

Yeah, so pick two specs from different classes that work together for a fantasy

E.g. blademaster arms warrior and ww monk

[ember blaze]

its still bad

[rain cave]

In your opinion

[ember blaze]

no

for example

the current tier sets

[sullen dawn]

Id rather see blademaster as a cosmetic swap for monk

[rain cave]

I just want fun, you're forgetting about the fun in the video game...

[ember blaze]

theyre hero tree based

[sullen dawn]

You could do a lot there

[ember blaze]

but one works better for pres than aug

gameplay wise

[rain cave]

'Current' being the operative word

[ember blaze]

its an example of forcing two specs to share something

[rain cave]

See if you just do that you muddy up the monk fantasy potentially and piss off arms warriors

I see the logic

But if blademaster will exist it needs to be for arms first imo

[ember blaze]

and the hero tree also focuses on your filler.

like it works for both sure but its very lackluster

[rain cave]

Personally I think there's a lot of cool things they can do with hero talents now that everyone has 2 basic ones

More extreme ones shared between certain classes specs sounds like it could be interesting and fill the niches left by the fact that some fantasy is inherently multiclass or doesn't fit the other specs in a class

Void hunter like alleria can be both mm and the new dh spec for example

Ret and disc could get specific hero talent trees for a mixed void/ light thing

[sullen dawn]

Well in game its be treated as a different class. Its just the abilities do the same effect/damage functionally

[sleek solar]

I wish metaporphse could be permanent,like give it more strenth but less agility for example, ez tank spec

+customizable

[rain cave]

Just watching the cinematic again. The flash of light and more human looking paladins that help liadrin definitely indicate arathi

There's a flash of light, like the one that transported the ones we met in tww to beledar

And we already know sunwell can be used as a portal

That and the big focus on hope? I could definitely see them sort of reframing the light as having a hope side to it. The arathi got teleported to beledar because they hoped to get out of the storm

The new arathi in midnight could have been teleported because liadrin hoped for them. Also this is the start of the mythical battle they've been hoping for

[sleek solar]

I kinda hoped That the cinematic would end on a bad/ sad note

[little hound]

I just saw a bunch of humans in Warfront weapons/armor pop through the sunwell so..

Thats fun.

[tulip sun]

We dont know who they are

If theyre even human

[little hound]

No, but considering their armor and weaponry? Most likely Paladins from Stormwind under Turalyon's leadership.

[tulip sun]

We see no stormwind heraldry

[little hound]

I know.

I'm just saying.

Warfront Armor + Weapons from the 7th Legion.

IS a pretty big clue on its own

[granite flame]

Could be alliance, could be arathi

[rain cave]

We don't know if that even is warfront stuff

It's very vague

[little hound]

Literally compared their models, that is VERY MUCH Warfront armor..

[granite flame]

Not sure if we got a good enough view of their legs to rule out draenei, even

[little hound]

All their feet were just flat boots from the view.

Like..That mace, Shield, and shoulders..

[rain cave]

I don't see it

[rain cave]

Specifically the armor

[rain cave]

The armour doesn't look like the warfront stuff

I'll concede the weapons

[rain cave]

But the tabards and armour seem fairly neutral

[remote shuttle]

It’s probably just the known paladin societies of Azeroth arriving to answer the lights call.

[little hound]

Yeah, hoods/Tabards seem neutral.

I'm assumine.

[rain cave]

Tyrguard maybe

[little hound]

They might be Arathi that joined the alliance.

Tyrsguard/Arathi from the Alliance.

Most likely.

No hooves what so ever.

Literally all humans.

[rain cave]

I mean hell maybe the magister of silvermoon just opened a portal to let the alliance help

Like turalyon and co

[little hound]

Most likely Turalyon, let me check

[rain cave]

And it wasn't even the sunwell that was the portal

[remote shuttle]

I think it’s more a case of everyone- the light not discriminating, but cinematics had to obviously for budget do a bunch of copy pastes. Reckon in game it will be humans, dwarves, Draenei, Tauren, Zandalari, Earthen etc. “the light users have answered.”

[little hound]

Turalyon's Gauntlets do have knuckles on em.

[rain cave]

Something that's interesting to me is that, the march of queldanas is being very hush hush

But one of the other mini raids seems voidy

March is very orderly, no?

What if its light forces deciding to take the sunwell off us for safeguarding or something

[little hound]

Anduin's gloves do not have brass knuckles on em, unless he gets another model

[rain cave]

E.g. the light emperor of the arathi being evil and giving that order

[little hound]

Because the Sunwell was purified by the heart of a Naaru that WE Saved. And it offered itself willingly to purify it.

M'uru i think.

[rain cave]

Btw I'm thinking dreadlords will be present in some capacity

[little hound]

Yeah, M'uru. After we kill him in the Sunwell raid, Velen takes its heart and purified the Sunwell.

[rain cave]

Idk what that has to do with what it's replying to :P

[little hound]

I doubt the Light would betray something it willingly purified.

[rain cave]

Who says they're betraying the sunwell

[little hound]

I hate the Light stuff in general, its so one-sided.

[rain cave]

In their eyes they're just taking control of it because they know better!

Just like xera knew what was best for illidan

[little hound]

Soooon.

[rain cave]

Just let us help you!

Alternatively. Who else might want to march on the sunwell for the void...

Azshara anyone?

Difficult to march on an island unless you're coming out of the water

[little hound]

Azshara's found some other apparent power she's gone to claim.

[rain cave]

Heavily hinted to be void

[tulip sun]

If it was anyone notable I would suspect it was shown

Imagine being just eating dinner and suddenly the light transports you to a void-sieged silvermoon

[rain cave]

I mean who's to say they didn't expect it

The arathi knew that day was coming eventually, if it was then they'd rally quick

[tulip sun]

Thays if it is arathi.

Thats*

[elfin eagle]

Is there gonna be more information on midnight in gamescom

It’s beautiful but it’s not the same without everyone announcing and showing off all the cool new ideas

[tulip sun]

Deep dive is tomorrow

[pulsar minnow]

Concept art of the knights seen in the cinematic

They’re referred to as just “Paladins”

[little hound]

Gloves look very "Bastion Order Hall"

On the left one

[pulsar minnow]

Because they are

As are the boots

[little hound]

And legs.

[pulsar minnow]

They’re like 99% supposed to be just player characters

[little hound]

Yeeeh, shoulders are 7th legion.

Rest is literally just arathi hoods, blank tabards and recolors of the Bastion armor

I remade it as well as i could 😄

[clear apex]

They looked a lot like human of some sort
Couldn't see any ears

And the body.

Plus a lot of white and blue looking stuff

[rain cave]

I'd find it funny if one of them gets dehelmed and they're just pure light in there like enchanted armour

[pulsar minnow]

Really hard to see but there’s Arator and Turalyon in the Sanctum of the Light

If only the light could fix arator’s haircut 💔

[rain cave]

Are you sure it's arator?

I saw a different angle that looked like lorthremar

The way he's standing it even vaguely could be mistaken for kt human skeleton but its too blurry

[glass flicker]

Interesting. We get a waterwheel. :D

[pulsar minnow]

He’s got no sleeves on and small spaulders. That is 100% Arator.

Lor themar has giant black sleeves

Lor themar’s skirt is also red the whole way down

That one is mostly black with red trim like the judgement set

[little hound]

Yeeeah, that's 100% Arator.

you can see the tattoo

[rain cave]

I can't see it

It just looks too grainy and nondistinct

If anything I see a troll hunched over or a kt human model

[clear apex]

It is way too blurry to be 100%
Does it make sense? Yes.

[tulip sun]

Thats certainly Arator. Matches everything we have seen

Half a second I thought it might be a new model for halduron but nah

Definitely sword there

[rain cave]

How so though

New arator has exposed arms and head

I see a helmet and armour on the arms there

The pose doesn't even look particularly blood elf skeleton

I'm not denying it might be him or likely is him I just can't make any details out xD

[tulip sun]

Those are definitely bare arms with tattoos

[clear apex]

Yall must have really good eyes to make out those details.

Plus you can't even tell if they're blond

[tulip sun]

Arator isnt blonde anymore

[clear apex]

?

That's blond-ish/platinum blond

It makes sense if that's him by his dad, but it's not clear enough to be 100%

"He's not blond" what are you smoking

[sullen dawn]

TLT predictions?

World tier difficulty system, glpyh system rework / class skins, order halls return with continuous class quests added, tinker/artificer, some allied race

[upper pasture]

But we just got midnight news now yall want to talk about TLT?

[sullen dawn]

Lmao im half joking :p

[little hound]

I guess half-blind people can't accept a fact without making a massive debate Thank shit i'm avoiding politics at this point like a raid mechanic.

[tulip sun]

That color is not distinguishable from lor'themars white are

What are you smoking

[clear apex]

I see no hair cause it's too blurry

It looks like a mass of red

[upper pasture]

The hair definitely looking red

[little hound]

...

People make me want to step on LEGO

[upper pasture]

The model looks like Arator but the hair is red /shrug

[little hound]

If you see RED Hair, i'm questioning if you're color blind, no offense.

Its darker due to the lighting, yes. Its pale/Blonde, but it sure as heck ain' RED 😄

[clear apex]

Some housing stuff

[upper pasture]

Bruh, you can see turalyons hair color and your saying the platinum blonde is “darker” cause of lighting?

[little hound]

Yeah they had a whole showcase on stream about it.

Need this as an animated screensaver 😄

[clear apex]

Yeah I'm watching it and sharing pics

[little hound]

I love that you can ADD and REMOVE Rooms, and pick what shapes and sizes they are ❤️

[clear apex]

I agree. The preset shapes is fantastic

Plus multi story houses

[little hound]

I will have a octagram-shaped room for ritualism >:3

[clear apex]

Living my witchy dream 💅

[little hound]

Bout to summon Diablo.

:)

[rain cave]

I'm going to try make a cosmology house, one room for each force

[clear apex]

Oh fun

[rain cave]

The center is azeroth themed

[clear apex]

I think I'm going to have a common area, library, kitchen, bath and a bedroom for each of my "main" alts

[rain cave]

Corridors from life and death rooms will be dream and sl inspired

[clear apex]

Maybe try for a conservatory

Looking at the beds options, mostly saw generic human and orc then undead and nelf

Of the 18 shown

Hope they'll add in other races soon

I want my cool draenei bed

[rain cave]

Sleeping on your back with whooves must be weird

And digitgrade legs

[clear apex]

Not wrong

[tropic trail]

What’s that?

[little hound]

screen effect when entering the manaforge raid

[obsidian karma]

Did they give us a look at horde housing zones

[rustic cliff]

Has anyone tried making a chair upside-down and seeing if it actually seats the character upside-down?

[little hound]

Ooo

Those Mana Wyrms look awesome.

[granite flame]

Eh, just get a knee cushion and it should be fine

[autumn dagger]

Any cool screens from the housing showcase?

Aside from the blueprint system

[little hound]

You could just watch the housing panel from today.

Itss on youtube

[clear apex]

I'm just watching the livestream playback. It's from the start and about the first 3 hours at least

Faction pride, fav expac theme and free build

[clear apex]

Dye system

It's very eso/gw2 style
Best outcome imo. Love the dye stuff

[little hound]

Wish we could also dye armor.

[clear apex]

Sorry for the crappy pic though. Watching on TV

[sullen dawn]

Itll come. Probably only for new mog tho

[little hound]

Yeeeah.

[clear apex]

They said they've been working on housing since DF so maybe those armor onward have the ability, just not ready to show yet

Like, the system exists

Maybe

Oh wow there's rooms that look 4-5 story

Like tower rooms

Still not showing some racial style furniture, but said they'll be adding stuff over time.

Biggest focus is: panda, human, undead, nelf or nightborn, belf and orc so far

Missing everything else

[sullen dawn]

Yeh i would expect it to work backwards a bit

Maybe to like SL gear or something

[clear apex]

Id rather have hd remakes of old armor first though

They were doing those one dresses and stopped

[sullen dawn]

That'll have to be a gradual project

Too many to do in one go

And they do do it sometimes. Like the t2 remakes

Plus a lot of basic stuff via trading post

[clear apex]

Lmao this guy made a pot growing room for his free theme

[lavish raptor]

Based

[clear apex]

Oh is that a player house

[sullen dawn]

Everyones gonna want this spot

[sullen dawn]

Ye

[clear apex]

Eh, i want spooky

[sullen dawn]

There is spooky

[clear apex]

Where that screen from?

[clear apex]

I know there's spooky, and that's what i need

[sullen dawn]

Xbox stream

[clear apex]

Or, I'll get a autumn-ish

The housing dev did mention being able to choose your house exterior

I imagined that was the case, but nice to hear it

[little hound]

Aah yes, the Emo Neighbourhood

Addams family vibe

[sullen dawn]

Yeh but only 4 racial options to begin

Human,orc,belf,nelf

[clear apex]

My guess is those were the easiest to work with first.

Newest assets

[sullen dawn]

Waiting on tauren, pandaren, and kul tiran 🙁

[clear apex]

I just need draenei.

[sullen dawn]

Well also the 4 most popular races

And most iconic

(Not my favourite btw, just statistcally)

[novel zodiac]

so this means no more races?

[deep pawn]

it's probably just charges

[novel zodiac]

huh?

is it not the same?

[deep pawn]

it is, you just don't see vigor anymore

the two one vigor abilities will share 6 charges

the 3 vigor will just be a CD I guess

[pulsar minnow]

Wasn’t it listed under new player accessibility

It might just be that way for leveling

Nvm- you’re right

Also this is 100% our “place that you run in circles while waiting for M+ queue” of the expansion

[deep pawn]

it's a gorgeous city

though so many are angry at any hints of blue or gray.

that could be market square and that's the AH

looks like the Rostrum on the right?

[pulsar minnow]

Ive seen it too I don’t understand why people are so pressed it looks great

Silvermoon isn’t really all about fel anymore

It hasn’t been for like a decade now

[autumn dagger]

they'd rather it be green or gold

but tbh I love how they integrated the red tones with the blue and the grey

besides with the nightborne being so close to the blood elves there's bound to be blue/grey

[dense plover]

theres nothing wrong with color variety

it makes your eyes not hurt

[deep pawn]

I imagine either Eversong or Void Storm will be a elf wartime unity renown.

[pulsar minnow]

One of the descriptions said we’d find mysterious/unexpected allies in Voidstorm- really curious what the hell that could be

[deep pawn]

Shadowguard who break free? Demons?

Kael'thas and Sylvanas?

[upper pasture]

Void entities that aren’t inherently evil?

[deep pawn]

Maybe but their whole thing is consume

Hard to be good with that

Maybe we find some very myopic ones like 14's Ea.

[lavish raptor]

What if it's the nathrezim

Very trustworthy

[deep pawn]

So I'm going to enjoy the setting and probably level up questing a ton, dungeon settings seem cooler than TWW. I'm still massively worried about no new system announced for instanced PvE.

[warm topaz]

we didn't get one in DF and everything was fine

we have Delves, M+ and Raids, why more actually?

[upper pasture]

We’re getting prey I guess it’s not an instanced pve content but it’s a PvE update

[warm topaz]

it's an unistanced pve content

[upper pasture]

Yes I’m aware

[warm topaz]

which, if done well, it's better imo

[granite flame]

Eh. Blizz did well with delves, but torghast and island expeditions weren't really the saving graces of their respective expansions

[pulsar minnow]

I mean we got the talent revamp

[warm topaz]

which is really weird it's that we're getting a new 40vs40 and that didn't appear on the gameplay video

the first one since Ashran?

[zealous sedge]

I’m curious what the panel will reveal tomorrow

[deep pawn]

Talent revamp was huge

Most specs got to mix multiple abilities they never could before

[deep pawn]

First intended 40v40 since Wrath

Wintergrasp and Ashran are reworked world PvP events

Ashran and Wintergrasp to this day are wonky

[warm topaz]

If Housing hadn't been announced a year ago, would you be so worried?

genuine question

[deep pawn]

Honestly yes, if they described housing the entire time as an optional side content

To not even have a blurb about "extended and refreshed hero trees" feels like a messaging miss.

[warm topaz]

i have the feeling that we will know a lot more about all that in the next couple of days

[deep pawn]

There's never been an expansion without every spec getting at least one new toy or DF mixing old toys together

Like if prey is the PvE system highlight there's gonna be hell in 6 months

At least announce the system changes you're gonna test in 11.2.7

[zealous sedge]

I think the whole marketing around midnight was a huge miss so far. Can’t blame the developers for that one in this case. The marketing team definitely got gutted/ pushed into the Microsoft umbrella imo.

But glad we are going to hear more details tomorrow

[glass fulcrum]

legion remix housing NPC is no longer marked as a vendor and has dialogue saying his shop isn't open

no longer has a "Housing Vendor" title or whatever it was

[ember blaze]

we are?

oh boy let me q up for insane lag

[deep pawn]

The supplier is basically the Remix teams lead self insert

[deep pawn]

Probably because you can't collect stuff before 11.2.7

[glass fulcrum]

yea just meant it wasn't marked anymore

[ember blaze]

https://bsky.app/profile/keyboardturner.bsky.social/post/3lwu4nuqfxk2m

Ellie - might post spoilers-ish 💙 (@keyboardturner.bsky.social)

new dwarf hair color? i think this might be the first sign of player customization

Bluesky · Aug 20, 2025, 7:05 PM

[tulip sun]

What the hell am i looking at 😂

[deep pawn]

Purple beard

"but muh fantasty! Purple is only a color used by leftists!" Lol

[tulip sun]

I didnt even see his head i was so confused

[rain cave]

all these "woke" dwarves nowadays with their purple beards.

I'm not clan-ist I have a dark iron friend!

[deep pawn]

I have a pink haired human paladin lol

[pulsar minnow]

It looks like it could be a dark iron? Praying for the bright pink flaming beard. Would be so funny

[warm topaz]

you see? I definitely hate the way Blizz managed the Midnight announcement

cinematic with 0 context of gameplay unless you watch 10 yt videos and shorts

and in top of that, you need to wait TWO days to hear more about the expansion in the panels

just make a WoW Direct

https://tenor.com/view/nintendo-switch-snap-gif-22177099

[deep pawn]

Supposedly one exists

[warm topaz]

and the panels aren't even live streaming, well just see the VOD

[upper pasture]

i mean, generating hype across a week over just like 2 hours is definitely a better idea

[tulip sun]

Yeah and since when is the cinematic more than just a cinematic?

Why's that a complaint lol

[warm topaz]

not a complain about the cinematic, cinematic is perfect

complain about not having the feature trailer after the cinematic

[upper pasture]

it's because it's spread across gamescom

[pulsar minnow]

I get COD is a bigger game but man so much time dedicated to that its kinda annoying they couldn't just drop the features trailer right after WoW

[ember blaze]

like ive been seeing stuff from an xbox panel or something

[upper pasture]

and it wasn't *right after the trailer at gamescom because you usually have to pay for that type of stuff

[ember blaze]

but wowhead hasnt posted about it so im clueless

[warm topaz]

yeah it's an interview with Ion and Paul Kubit

[upper pasture]

i mean realistically CoD sells more copies than WoW

[warm topaz]

but just very basics for Xbox players

[upper pasture]

and i don't even like shooters but that's something hard to deny

[deep pawn]

Usually the What's Next panel is right after the reveal at Blizzcons

[warm topaz]

back in Blizzcon we had cinematic and Morgan Day right after it, that's perfect

[deep pawn]

The cinematic is fine, it won't be an all timer, but the issue is there's nothing to be hyped about yet for most specs

[warm topaz]

I disagree on that, the fact of going back to Quel'Thalas, Zul'Aman etc... The history looks promising

i get hype so easy for everything lol

[deep pawn]

As an evoker and shaman main I have 0 things for combat yet to be excited about. Prey seems neat but it's not that repeatable

A what's next was needed yesterday, not on Saturday

[tulip sun]

This cinematic is probably one of the top ones imo

[deep pawn]

Nah, for me it's bottom 3, it just doesn't have any cool moment cause the paladins are way too hidden

It just didn't make me feel anything because it does nothing.

Vanilla has nostalgia, TBC is probably the weakest next to Midnight now

Ironic given setting

[tulip sun]

Interesting

I thought it was quite nice and made me feel things

[deep pawn]

It felt very dark and didn't tell us anything

[sonic flame]

no talks yet about a stat squish?

doubt we can go further than tww stats

we're even past legion atm

[deep pawn]

That was confirmed 2 years ago at Blizzcon

[uncut vault]

It tells us more about the themes of the xpac than Dragonflight's did haha

[deep pawn]

DF at least I felt was pretty, and had an arc with a resolution. And we saw something new and big and gorgeous

Intercession just feels cramped

I honestly like the features trailer more. At least we saw what we're defending.

I just don't think nameless faceless paladins with no explanation felt right. If it's Arathi, why hide that since we'll know the moment Alpha starts

[tulip sun]

Oh hey Porter! Did you see the theories around that one image you posted?

[deep pawn]

If they are just random paladins sunmoned, why no obvious dwarves, Draenei, and Tauren.

[tulip sun]

Saying the one on the right might be Rafaam and possibly the Kaldorei is Elise

[clear apex]

That's an awesome outfit

[uncut vault]

I did yeah, Elise is pretty certain but I dont think that's rafaam tbh

some similar vibes but Rafaam has a distinct look with his red glow

[ember blaze]

eh for me its one of the top ones because 1: it's not boring chatter. 2: you actually see ppl fighting and magic being displayed

[deep pawn]

Cinematics are rarely chatter

[ember blaze]

yes they are

[deep pawn]

If anything this one has more dialog that many

It has no narration which is unusual for a WoW cinematic

[ember blaze]

even more than TWW?

[deep pawn]

Maybe I just don't trust the light enough to appreciate the end

[ember blaze]

like even legion the first minute is watching varian write a letter

Probably a hot take specially in a wow disc, but I still think League style cinematics is what they should look more like

dont need all the music in the background

[deep pawn]

Varian was showing character growth. Intercession shows no growth or progress

[ember blaze]

yes and that's boring for a cinematic you wait 2 years for

specially when the characters you see are few

league ones manage to show multiple characters at different points in time in the lore

not saying they gotta do all that, but comparing the two they can definitely do.. more.

[deep pawn]

I liked Legion, hell I love WoDs

MoP is one of the best

[ember blaze]

YEAH AND IT'S ALL ACTION

and actually shows off a unique race and class from wow

like my biggest gripe so far is the lack of magic in these too , or just generally not showing a class you play

and we at least got to see some elves and paladins now

[deep pawn]

For me it's Chen's narration and the scenery

[ember blaze]

yes and you can have both

ALSO actually try and match what u see in the game to the cinematic...

why the hell do the elves have human eyes

the concept art had glowing eyes

[deep pawn]

Too bright and emotionless apparently

[ember blaze]

why the hell would you remove one of the features that makes your elf race in WoW unique to other worlds???

big L

[deep pawn]

Only villains allowed to have glowing eyes in WoW

[crisp steeple]

night elf seems to wear new type of robe that flares out at the bottom

[deep pawn]

Custom NPC model probably

If it's Elise

[crisp steeple]

ah

[rustic cliff]

It’s official. I NEED that fiery cape for my DH

[clear apex]

That's a nice long cloak

[hard axle]

any word on when Legion Remix is coming to Live?

[clear apex]

The leak was October

So, we'll see

[hard axle]

Thank you

[deep pawn]

There's absolutely a chessboard world quest

Ion also said we'll have info on public alpha very soon

[ember blaze]

where is wowhead with the articles?

legit have no idea who is saying what

also, this is such a clean shot

[deep pawn]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cra-y1rZiB0&ab_channel=IGN 11:00 minutes in he speaks about alpha

[ember blaze]

wait a minute

[sullen dawn]

I was thinking

Theres likely a link between "void glass" and the glass tbe naarus are made from

[ember blaze]

theres gonna be something in that crystal isnt there 🤔

[austere gazelle]

anyone know if we can watch the " world of midnight " panel in livestream somewhere?

[tulip sun]

Not sure

I dont see anything

It should be starting now

[uncut vault]

We know they’ll be uploading the vod once it’s done

But I don’t know if it’s being livestreamed

[tulip sun]

Oh its not livestreamed?

Rip

[uncut vault]

God this gamescom situation sucks lol

Cannot wait for Blizzcon again next year

[tulip sun]

Same

Crazy that they dont show it to people not at the con

[misty jacinth]

Kinda weird how it played out, they advertised big reveals and panels during the event and yet the midnight gameplay video wasn't even shown during ONL, and now all those bits and pieces are scattered around Youtube shorts and tidbits in interviews throughout Creator Clash

They'd better make some kind of WoW Direct next time they can't do a full on Blizzcon

[austere gazelle]

if you search video on their official website, and filter by " mmo " there is nothing

it looks like WoW was patched in the event at the last minute

[misty jacinth]

Could also be Xbox taking their big licenses, WoW included, to be at gamescom because it's a big event but not thinking it through more

Yet it's been announced for a while now. Maybe Xbox didn't wanna commit more than having a booth I dunno

[untold fox]

So I am a bit behind

Is the panel that is happening right now about housing or just talk about the expansion as a whole ?

[austere gazelle]

those troll name... dafuq, sounds AI

[ember blaze]

he says with an ai profile picture

[little hound]

Where's that cloak from?

[ember blaze]

you need to play lemix for it

[austere gazelle]

my comment didn't say I disliked AI. Just that those name lacked creativity IMO

[little hound]

https://www.wowhead.com/news/sargerei-commander-sets-rewarded-from-achievements-in-legion-remix-378268

I need this

[austere gazelle]

yeah the requirement sounds insane but maybe it'll be easier on remix

[little hound]

Okay so..

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cra-y1rZiB0

11:18
"Working towards an EARLY RELEASE, 2026". So i'm 100% sure that JUNE Label was just a 'VERY AT LATEST' thing

[warm topaz]

after the Panel in Gamescom, they showed the points they'll touch next panel, and one of them is "new talents"

@deep pawn

[tropic trail]

Not gonna lie they could put her eyes into void elves in customization options.

[austere gazelle]

Silvermoon closed to alliance player is a stupid decision

[upper lantern]

Yeah, I'd love them (and blood elves too) to get tattoo options for their faces and bodies, and maybe share hairstyles between them (specially females)

[tropic trail]

Yea tattoos are also nice

[upper lantern]

Alliance main here, I'm actually ok with this decision. Makes sense since it's still a horde capital

[austere gazelle]

No it doesnt. They are attacked by the void, they call for help but deny the city entrance ? Its illogical.

Amirdrassil and gilneas are opened to the Horde

[upper lantern]

The Alliance are allowed in the city, just not in some districts (and we don't know which districts yet)

[austere gazelle]

If it is horde only after why not but at this crucial moment its dumb

[austere gazelle]

Apparently thats not even that.

[tulip sun]

It makes sense. They are allowed in the city- but not free reign

[upper lantern]

It's like Horde going inside Stormwind but not being allowed in the SI7 building, or the Keep

[rain cave]

If you want to explore the city you're more than welcome to roll horde

XD

The reason is because after this expansion, silvermoon will still need to be the blood elf capital.

And just like other capitals, opposite faction players aren't allowed to just walk in

[ember blaze]

👀

man fuck this gamescom shit

[austere gazelle]

It can be changed back after the expansion though.

For now it doesnt make sense.

[rustic cliff]

Where can I find this panel to watch? 1300 their time is about an hour ago this time

[warm topaz]

will be posted on YT at some point

[austere gazelle]

The rift of aln is coming back. As I suspected its in the haronir place and where Azeroth's dream take shape and become real

[warm topaz]

today (hopefully?)

[obtuse vine]

They said it would be soon after, so hopefully

[little hound]

Yeeeah i can't see it either

This shows why Salhadaar will be a Voidspire Boss in Midnight.

[novel zodiac]

they're definetly going to be playable, right?, look how good they look

[lavish raptor]

they look like weird orcs

[tulip sun]

Will have to see after we see them in the files

[autumn dagger]

they have a very complex story with both factions, specially with the horde, idk how they would solve that

[novel zodiac]

if the alliance can welcome the eredar

nothing matters anymore

[tulip sun]

Also let's recognize that Forest Trolls are already members of the Horde

Via the Revantusk Tribe.

And the Zandalari apparently helped to rebuild Zul'Aman

[autumn dagger]

I mean the high elves genocided the amani, the amani genocided the high elves, hostility is still around to this day, thrall considers the amani bloodthirsty barbarians, the amani are hellbent on worshipping hakkar, which kinda goes against darkspear belief, the zandalari have a weird relationship with all troll tribes so

but who knows

[tulip sun]

points to above statement

Theyre already horde

[lavish raptor]

Wasn't it the gurubashi that worshipped hakkar

[rain cave]

Makes perfect sense

[autumn dagger]

forest trolls =/= amani

[tulip sun]

Playable forest trolls dont have to be Amani.

[rain cave]

I do think that there would be an alliance formed with the zulaman ones though. Sure the old ones there were antagonistic but who's to say we don't recruit them through a shared effort

Like the nightborne

[autumn dagger]

ah, that's something else entirely, sure

[rain cave]

The amani might be to midnight what the nightborne were for legion in a way

[autumn dagger]

we'll have to see how zuljin's grandchildren behave

[autumn dagger]

and they end up joining the alliance lol

[rain cave]

I'm predicting one evil one good or one horde one alliance

I could fully see a sect of the amani going "even if we're allies now we don't feel comfortable joining the side of our colonisers and other trolls that cast us aside"

And going alliance

[autumn dagger]

well we'll see in a couple months, that'd be interesting/funny

[rain cave]

The horde have the forsaken sure, but they didn't choose it. Meanwhile in terms of willingly choosing "evil" stuff and then being accepted, alliance has dark irons, manari eredar, void elves

So I could see the amani going "oh that's interesting"

[ember blaze]

damn that panel is not coming any time soon

[tulip sun]

@uncut vault Have you seen anything with Horde characters from the panel? All I've seen are Umbric, arator and his parents

[warm topaz]

Holly on Tali and Evi chat

[ember blaze]

what kinda name is that 💀

[tulip sun]

Hopefully soon

I hope people just didnt get pictures of them. Cause I hope we see some Horde elves lol

[warm topaz]

we have Liadrin

[tulip sun]

Ehhh

[warm topaz]

any chance of Elisande?

i hope so, she's cool

[tulip sun]

We her in the trailer but if shes not talked about as a main character in the panel

[elfin eagle]

Any videos to watch the developer panel

Ah, a vod later, never mind

[pulsar minnow]

Umbric finally got some style

Really interesting how they’re redoing the Void Elf Aesthetic

[little hound]

White/Silver with Void-Darkblue Crystals, so damn regal. Love the wings on his back too.

[pulsar minnow]

It looks so good

It was definitely needed. I ran into Umbric in Tazavesh and didn’t realize it was him bc I thought it was some random Velf npc

Also despite Arator’s unfortunate choice of haircut, I love how his model isn’t just the redone Judgement set with a custom chest piece and shoulders

It’s got a bunch of changes- and I love they removed the Templar cross from his chest piece because he’s a belf and not a human paladin

[austere gazelle]

Only for the Horde.

Quel Thalas is invaded by the void, but somehow all of Azeroth's champion are not welcome in the city.

The alliance allows the horde in dalaran, gilneas, bel'ameth, yet the horde is still picky even in the doom hours.

I understand why it's seen as a crappy faction, they always welcome the alliance in their capital when there is a tyrant to deposit and the situation is out of hand for them , so they ask for exterior help 🤡

It doesnt make sense regarding the story point and the giant void portal shitting demons everywhere and an army at the door of silvemoon city. Should have been neutral for the expansion.

[little hound]

I can't say that bothers me what so ever

There are so many other exciting things to see in this expansion, city borders however? I can't say i have a breadcrumb of fucks to give about it

[austere gazelle]

Na but its illogical regarding their recent change regarding faction
1- Guild interfaction
2- Group interfaction
3- Raid interfaction
There is a truce everywhere, but you'll have the horde player and the alliance separated once again 🤷 I think we'll better fair off in our guild neighbour housing then and the capital hub will be empty

[little hound]

You assume i'm social enough to care about limitations? I'll be Raiding, doing M+, and in my spare time? Hoarding furniture like a Demon from the IKEA Catalogue.

[clear apex]

Also letting horde into belameth... which never would have/ should have happened. It only exists bc teldrassil burned.

Helping lordaeron we had to be in disguise to help, but i don't recall horde needing disguises to help with gilneas

Being partly locked out from a main hub in an expac feels weird

[rain cave]

The US and Russia were allies in ww2. Do you think they'd let Russians walk into the whitehouse casually?

Also, Dalaran was a neutral city. It wasn't owned by either faction and has historically been made up of races from both

[ember blaze]

next week when theyre done editing it.

[deep pawn]

Windstalker has been a name for her going back to her EQ days

Notoriously there's a elf ranger in an early levelling zone named Holly Windstalker that starts out kill on sight to evil classes. Level 6, just leaving your first zone and this much higher NPC kills you out of nowhere lol.

[deep pawn]

Still stand by saying it should have been a blurb in the features trailer showing at least one new thing.

[austere gazelle]

heck it didnt even had " new level " xD

[deep pawn]

Yeah, that thing Blizzard says is core to the RPG experience lol

[sleek solar]

Damnnnn

[deep pawn]

I think Silvermoon is mostly blocked to the Alliance as a "the game has been very Alliance heavy lately, sorry" moment haha

[sleek solar]

Well it is a capital city

[deep pawn]

I mean one of the major chapters of the campaign is all focused on Arator, and another is lead by Arator and Turalyon

So Silvermoon situation feels like a "please don't me mad" offering

Hell I've watched people crash out over a blue banner.

[upper pasture]

I can speak on one of the surveys I did asked if leveling is important and if it’s a selling point, which could be they got enough information that people care about leveling but it’s not really a box feature, everyone should just assume now that each expansion comes with 10 levels and not to waste the 5 seconds on the trailer with it

I think if blizzard made SM fully unlocked for both factions there would be a lot more people complaining about “horde erasure” than what we are seeing now

[deep pawn]

Exactly

And as I pointed out, our campaign is very Alliance heavy.

At least once outside Eversong

I saw a shot of new model Lor'themar in what looked like old Tranquillien but I can't recall that happening

[warm topaz]

horde symbol in Silvermoon

[sleek solar]

Holy shit

[elfin eagle]

that was metzen lol

[autumn dagger]

This is how you serve elfhood in a horde-honoring way

I fucking love it

[pulsar minnow]

Fuck yeah

So many of the Horse being ignored in silvermoon worries are being dispelled.

[deep pawn]

Did blizzard forget that the nose is a key part of trolls?

[pulsar minnow]

I think this is the Amani’s biological variation they’re going for

Since they’ve always just been “buff trolls”

[rain cave]

they're so smelly they evolved smaller noses

[deep pawn]

They can be buff and have their troll nose haha

This is just a lazy orc reskin

[sullen dawn]

If anything they have BIGGER noses

Or should

[pulsar minnow]

Well there’s also multiple models for them

[rain cave]

if you're saying this over a damn nose then idk bro you're cooked

xD

I think they look pretty baller

better than base troll imo

[deep pawn]

I mean it overall feels lazy, take away the tusks and that guy is an orc.

[rain cave]

make a goblin bigger and you have an orc

make an ogre smaller you have an orc

[pulsar minnow]

As opposed to just giving them a big nose and making them look identical to every other troll?

[deep pawn]

I mean that's what trolls are? I dunno what to say lol.

[pulsar minnow]

And again

They don’t all have small noses

[rain cave]

these are the same as the amani noses bro 😭

maybe it's the darkspear that are the outliers in nose size

also

[obsidian karma]

Troll-orc mix

[rain cave]

female trolls would like to have a word

their noses are small

[deep pawn]

that's a wide flat nose, that's not the normal long troll nose.

[deep pawn]

Bigger than orc still.

[pulsar minnow]

It’s a big nose dawg

[rain cave]

who're you to define what's "normal" for troll biology though

like

they've shown the amani with these noses

so that means, amani have these noses

[deep pawn]

Yeah cause they're reskinning another model and adding tusks, thus me finding it lazy.

[rain cave]

welcome to half of our playable races then

by that standard, these are LESS lazy than other races

and they're not even playable

[deep pawn]

Looking like that hopefully they never are

[rain cave]

looking like that I hope we get em sooner

[deep pawn]

Maybe they're waiting for the lore fan outrage to go back in early alpha and give them longer noses.

[pulsar minnow]

The funny thing is they’re not even using the orc rig

The females yes

But the males are still using the darkspear rig

[deep pawn]

I don't get why they lifted the orc face then lol.

cause man its offputting

[pulsar minnow]

Idk still looks like a troll to me. Just looks different

[deep pawn]

On the grandson I can only see orc with big tusks.

[obsidian karma]

They do look like orc
Maybe they could spin it as orc-troll mix 🤣

[pulsar minnow]

On the plus side there are multiple variations in nose and stature seen in the trailer among the Amani

Quite literally the only reason they changed the nose was just to differentiate them from the other trolls. Their whole thing used to be “buff trolls” but… Zandalari exist

[deep pawn]

What, Zul'jin took an orc wife and had children? 😄

[deep pawn]

Meh, to me the nose is an important as the tusks and ears, but oh well.

[pulsar minnow]

Well they’re both still there

It’s just a nose- and besides Zandalari already had smaller noses than darkspear- once again to differentiate them

[deep pawn]

Already posted this its still pretty damn pointy

[tulip sun]

Yeah and we have seen multiple nose lengths. The nose is not what makes a warcraft troll a troll

[deep pawn]

The Grandson's nose looks flat

[tulip sun]

Zul'jarra doesnt look to have any smaller of a nose than Zandalari

And Zul'jan does have a sizeable nose there.

[deep pawn]

oh got the cloaked guys mixed up, I meant the first guy I posted haha

I'll have to see Zul'jan from profile.

[tulip sun]

Ok but that just shows nose variation. Some have bigger and smaller noses

[deep pawn]

long and pointy has been the standard for 25 years or so.

[little hound]

This "Nose" Argument is literally like saying: "OH, every human has the same nose". Nah

[little hound]

Zul'jarra looks like an Amani-Orc Halfbreed 😄

[tulip sun]

Different sized noses? THE HORROR 😐

[pulsar minnow]

There’s Zul’jarra at a profile view

[tulip sun]

Jan*

I think

[deep pawn]

maybe the guy with the dark hood is an orc hybrid from the second war lol.

[tulip sun]

I can see what your saying but theyre pretty distinct i think.

[little hound]

Yeeh.

[tulip sun]

I really like the models

[pulsar minnow]

From the same picture there’s the shorter nose variant

At least they have noses

Some aren’t as fortunate

[tulip sun]

They look so cool. Hoping they become playable

[little hound]

Would be cool.

[deep pawn]

Maybe I'll get used to it, but orc reskins just feel bad for a troll.

[pulsar minnow]

The fact that they have nose variation alone definitely feels like we’re getting them as a playable race

[tulip sun]

Calling it a reskin is so disingenuous

[deep pawn]

Vulpera feel more distinct from goblins to me

[tulip sun]

...what is even the relation

To the discussion currently

[tulip sun]

Yeah the customization and gear are two things that would suggest playability. Gotta wait and see for gear

Theyre definitely not gonna be customization options with how different they are to the playable OG trolls

[deep pawn]

Vulpera are a goblin reskin yet the faces are more distinct.

This face is an orc with more ear and tusk, wooo

[pulsar minnow]

Then per your definition Amani aren’t an orc reskin

They literally use the troll skeleton

[deep pawn]

then they did crap on the faces

[pulsar minnow]

Ok then that’s your complaint lol

But to say they’re an orc reskin is just incorrect

They’re a troll reskin

[tulip sun]

I think your misunderstanding what it all means.

Just cause they shared the base skeleton doesnt mean they'd look alike

They can model them however they want regardless

[deep pawn]

To me those faces are a failure as they stand

cause that guy I posted doesn't read as troll at all

[tulip sun]

You are focusing on one npc.

Look at other ones

[deep pawn]

The others still look wrong to me too is what I'm saying

[tulip sun]

Hmk

[deep pawn]

that guy is just most blatant

[sleek solar]

I thought the exact same thing

I love trolls and they should get more screentime

Alliance troll = me not playing any other race again

@novel zodiac haters gotta hate🤣

[tropic trail]

Lmao I like them

They have nice ears

https://tenor.com/view/neytiri-avatar-pandora-gif-27335214

And look a bit like this

[clear apex]

I mean the amani are reskin orcs and haranir are nelves overall.

At least the female amani are orc bodies

Looks too orcish, they could have made more buff zandalari

And they have big noses not long noses. Wide v long

[clear apex]

I agree. He's just an orc head on troll body

[mighty wolf]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eHa5CDWYtXg

[clear apex]

Finally!

[tropic trail]

Wait is this haughty chicken?

[deep pawn]

arator taller than daddy

[little hound]

Elven genes kicking in 🙂

[little hound]

My first thought was to just shout: "EYWA SEES YOU, MA JAKE!"

[mighty wolf]

Dont stand in the void, champien (c)

[rain cave]

jake soooolyyy

surprised I haven't seen this posted yet

these are VERY cool

[deep pawn]

looks like our s1 delve gear

[novel zodiac]

but there's more than 4

[rain cave]

nah it reminds me of the normal clothing sets they added that you can use the earth encrusted gems on

I imagine that's what these are

[novel zodiac]

my gues its going to be sold like dornogal transmogs

[rain cave]

yee

which impliues colour versions

[novel zodiac]

i hope they come in various colors

[rain cave]

as aside from belf red and gold, maybe we see velf like umbric, perhaps a blue like the silver covenant

maybe a nice green one like allerias old armor

[novel zodiac]

i want them in black for dark ranger

[harsh mason]

Oh yes, the "son is taller than his parents" moment

[rain cave]

got his mums genes

[clear apex]

Oh nice, confirmed ghostland+eversong one zone

[rain cave]

it is kind of funny that alleria is almost taller than turalyon, atleast the same height

considering he's meant to be the big burly guy

[clear apex]

isnt this the belf start area?

dead scar has totally healed, nice nice

[novel zodiac]

looks like it

[rain cave]

I'm a bit mixed on that xD

I think it could have been used as a good storytelling moment for Calia

if we recruit the remaining undead in the ghostlands

[clear apex]

...alliance is still kill on site, awesome. wonder how many are going to accidently flag for pvp

[autumn dagger]

it's been a LONG time

and maybe we get something callia related in a patch or smth

[clear apex]

imagine kill on site for belameth or gilneas

[lavish raptor]

silvermoon pvp would be funny

[clear apex]

i plan to play out most this expac as my belf, for story reasons, so its fine. Just feels weird due to cross faction stuff opening up and this is like slamming a door

They could have gone with Dalaran thing and if you cross to horde/ally then you'd be zapped and stunned

[clear apex]

theyre so bad

they look like tmnt

but like the bad cgi michael bay ones

[little hound]

Cool Farstriders.

Looks like Paladins from every order. I see both Silver Hand, I see Lightforged, I see Blood Knights, even one in Ulduar tier.

[pulsar minnow]

Ok so they confirmed the proper naming of the blood elf zone

Ghostlands and Eversong are combined and called Quel Thalas

As expected but weird there was so much confusion

[clear apex]

Haranir move through roots, so they can go to any part of the world

seems like there might be portals to belameth, hyjal and other big trees

the rift of alm is where their dreaming goddess' nightmares and dreams come into being

is she some kinda emerald dream connection???

[warm topaz]

you mean the goddess?

[pulsar minnow]

Twilights Hammer Banner has changed to the Black Blade

[mighty wolf]

Xal loyalists

[clear apex]

Yeah, since it seems very green dragon to dream stuff into being

[warm topaz]

i think the goddess is Azeroth

[little hound]

Yep.

[clear apex]

Oh doi, lol my mind blanked

[harsh mason]

They exchanged Nzoth’s tentacles for Xal’s feet😭

[rain cave]

or is it

could be nzoth rearing his head

[clear apex]

sobbing i love them

[sullen dawn]

They do look good ngl

[clear apex]

None are showing off the bioluminescent paint though. Wonder if it will glow in the dark

[sullen dawn]

Guess ill make ANOTHER druid

[clear apex]

That's what I'm going to do.
Wolfish feral form, bat flight form, pangolin (tank?)

That's a great combo

Gonna do campaign then use my boost for druid haranir

[upper pasture]

The body paints are the “bioluminescence”

[clear apex]

Yes but that means they glow

[upper pasture]

So the one under the one you posted is using it

[clear apex]

I want to see it glowing

They only showed off what it looks like in normal light

[pulsar minnow]

I love that they’re explaining how exactly Azeroth empowered the Dragonflights in Amirdrassil

The roots reached the rift of Aln - also now confirming the theory that the Emerald Dream was Azeroth’s dream and the Titans essentially ordered it

[elfin eagle]

Ok now that I’m getting more detail - this is better then I thought

[clear apex]

voidstorm sounds like a much better Maw

[upper pasture]

Do we have anymore details other than it’s “kill or be killed”

Void storm is giving MK but wow

[deep pawn]

this sounds familiar

[clear apex]

was that from a 'leak'

[sullen dawn]

Im failing to see how the void and fel/disorder are different

They both seem to be about survival of the fittest

[clear apex]

void = eat you, become stronger
fel = convert and enslave you

[sullen dawn]

(In terms of philosophy)

[elfin eagle]

Haranir and voidstorm extremely Alien, dope contrast with QT and ZA

[deep pawn]

nah summary of panel

[sullen dawn]

Void converts too though, frequently, and kind of enslaves through madness and such, or even directly with trolls and bug races

[elfin eagle]

Big feeling like primordial forces interacting with grounded world

[deep pawn]

it just sounds very similar to another story

[clear apex]

wonder what mount we'll get for the new delves. 3 coptors is enough

[elfin eagle]

I thought I heard information that the campaign is a bit different?

It will include other areas of the eastern kingdoms as well?

[sullen dawn]

1 chapter doesnt have a zone, it goes across old zones

So 5 chapters even though 4 zones

[elfin eagle]

Alright, so, all I wanted from midnight was one thing

They delivered, I’m happy

[sullen dawn]

Theyre slowly inching towards old world complete revamp :p

But anything is good

[elfin eagle]

They didn’t forget about the old stuff, this is going to be good. This campaign is actually gonna have an impact

[novel zodiac]

Expedition 33 isn't 1 year old and its already being riped off lmao

[deep pawn]

lol, I didn't mean that

[elfin eagle]

My biggest problem has been we just jump from place to place to place and we never hear from anything again (pandaria 😭😭)

[sullen dawn]

Tbf its probably more like cave paintings

[elfin eagle]

But we actually get some stakes, when I first heard that quel Thalas as 1/4 I got worried it was gonna be a Tww 2.0 but I’m now hyped

[sullen dawn]

Which is a standard trope for mystic tribal fantasy archetypes

[rain cave]

the burning legion was a legion, it was an army with rank and file, research and development. Campaign strategy, etc

[sullen dawn]

(And also reality :p)

[sullen dawn]

Thats only because sarg ordered it

[rain cave]

whereas from what we're seeing from the void, it's more that they're all just desperate for any chance to get power

and xal is the one commanding it

[sullen dawn]

The default state of disorder is belive it or not, not ordered

[rain cave]

aye

I agree

[sullen dawn]

Demons are basically warlords

Stronger dominate weaker

My point is thats very similar to how void is being portrayed

[rain cave]

i guess, but like a lot of antagonist factions are like that

like scourge, primalists, deathwing, the maw

[upper pasture]

I suspect the natural order of things is somewhat of an order

[sullen dawn]

Sure but the beauty of the 6 cosmic forces is that they represented different "ethos" for thr universe

[sullen dawn]

But many of these arent cosmic forces, theyre planetary ones, or sub forces within cosmic forces

[upper pasture]

Survival of the fittest even in the void

[rain cave]

yeah but what makes you think the burning legion is a cosmic force

[sullen dawn]

Im talking about the "big 6"

[sullen dawn]

I dont

[rain cave]

or xal for that matter

[sullen dawn]

Im talking about disorder/fel and void generally.

[deep pawn]

If the Haranir cave paintings reveal some massive secret about the Mother Crystal, (cough) sorry, Worldsoul, there'll be massive "they just copied" calls haha

[sullen dawn]

I understand xal isnt void incarnate. She has her own motives. However this is still the closest look we have ever gotten to "cosmic void" and it just seems very similar to demons

[rain cave]

they feel different enough to me

because demons don't want to devour things usually they just fight

it's chaos

[sullen dawn]

Both corrupt, both consume, both have infighting

[rain cave]

that goes for every force then

almost like... extremism leads to that in basically every case

[upper pasture]

The strong always take advantage of the weak

[sullen dawn]

Light doesnt reallt havr infighting. Order does a little (civil war inc), but its not inherent to them, likewise life has variance and selection (evolution) but its not quite the same

[deep pawn]

I swear if consuming another void entity merges their personalities or just hear them inside you happens.

Cause that's exactly what happens with 14's voidsent

[rain cave]

we literally have seen a naaru go "yeah if I went back to my friends they'd kill me because they'd think I'm tainted"

[sullen dawn]

The ethos of the two forces just dont feel quite as distinctive as I thought they would

[sullen dawn]

But its not the same as demons killing eachother by instinct every day, or void creatures continuously devouring eachother to grow is my point

[upper pasture]

That’s likely because we’ve seen very little of the void and you are just making conclusions off of very little information

[sullen dawn]

Ofc any force can have individuals within they disavow

[rain cave]

I'd also like to point out that we have primarily seen the demons in a burning legion context

not in their native behaviour

[sullen dawn]

Or you can have wars etc... but its not the same natural "kill to grow" mentality

[rain cave]

and even in the legion they actually did use some void magic

[sullen dawn]

Ever seen the saga was announced ive wanted a whole saga on this

[rain cave]

but yeah I think the biggest distinction between void and fel in terms of consuming things is that the legion burn souls as fuel

and the void uses it as nourishment

[sullen dawn]

Whole saga off planetz various demon homeworlds, return of medivh

Maybe the saga after the saga after this one

[sullen dawn]

Yeh

[rain cave]

I mean I'd like to see what's going on with outland

[sullen dawn]

Pretty much all forces use souls to fuel their growth in some way

[rain cave]

if demons are moving in to the remains of it, what's happening

[autumn dagger]

I think it's good to remember the part each force plays into "the song"

[sullen dawn]

I wanna see imp homeworlds, and maiden homeworlds etc..

Complete alien hellscapes

[rain cave]

since outland is said to be on the border between space and the nether

demons don't die permanently when they go there

so it would be interesting to open up some level of diplomacy with some of the demons atleast attempted

stabilize outland so that demons can have a place to live without worrying about getting merced in their own realm

[sullen dawn]

Id also like to understand if theres even such a thing as a "natural demon" or if all demons are just races exposed to too much fel

[rain cave]

from what we've seen the first ones had blueprints for all the basic forms of life

[sullen dawn]

Because so far a lot of demons are turning out to be "not demons"

[rain cave]

so maybe every force is just "versions" of things

[sullen dawn]

Voidwalkers, dreadlords, eredar

[sullen dawn]

I dont like this but youre probably rigjt

[rain cave]

and the true original forms are just things from the prior state of the primoridal universe with thew first ones

[sullen dawn]

It makes things a little formulaic

[rain cave]

maybe that would eventually be an expansion or patch if we ever tackle first ones lore again

[sullen dawn]

Id prefer the forces had more unique properties

[deep pawn]

ah, so Tranquillien is healed entirely.

[rain cave]

here's what the first ones universe looked like, less cosmic power differences it was just prismatic order vs prismatic chaos

combining the sort of big 3 of each into one aesthetic (light, arcane, death and life, chaos, void)

[sullen dawn]

They would have to do it right (not super confident after SL) but if they did could provide a lot of context for existing lore

[rain cave]

I think their best bet is not time travel shenanigans but

finding some weird zereth thing that's outside the 6 forces

maybe there's one in azeroth somewhere at the core

like a center of the earth thing with that azeritey, diamond look

that represent multiple forces

[elfin eagle]

btw, the multiple raids, it makes sense now why tww raids were smaller

i assume alot of these bosses got moved around

[novel zodiac]

what do you mean?, even if there's 3 raids in 12.0 its still 9 bosses

[upper pasture]

And we’ve only been getting 8 bosses per raid so 12.0 is gonna have an extra raid boss

[deep pawn]

the dreamer sounds like the extra

[elfin eagle]

wasnt the spider raid only like 7

[upper pasture]

No it was 8

[novel zodiac]

all raids in TWW were 8 bosses

[elfin eagle]

huh, i thought they were smaller

either way, i love the variety of raids were getting, i hope they stick to this for the patches

[upper pasture]

probably not for the 12.X patches but launch patches for sure

[elfin eagle]

i would rather 2 4 boss raids then 1 8 boss raids

well actually maybe not for the final raid, i do hope the last raid of the last titan is double digit territory though

smaller raids dont have the same feeling

[upper pasture]

since the story can allow for more raids it's nice to see them spread across the smaller stories then as the focus of the expansion narrows we see 1 larger raid

[rustic cliff]

When was our last double digit raid?

[deep pawn]

I like smaller raids

8-9 feels perfect

[upper pasture]

SLs? I think?

I think DF was 9/9/8?

Or the other way around

Yeah DF was 8/9/9

SLs was 10/10/11

[rustic cliff]

Not gonna lie, I do miss the longer ones. I feel like the guild is don’t with AOTC too soon, then we just break for ages til the next one

[warm topaz]

@deep pawn

https://altertime.es/article/exclusiva-midnight-anadira-10-nuevos-puntos-de-talento

EXCLUSIVE: Midnight Will Add 10 New Talent Points

During the World of Warcraft community event at Gamescom 2025, AlterTime had the opportunity to speak with the game’s developers.

In our conversation with Paul Kubit, Associate Game Director, he shared how many new talent points will be introduced with the Midnight expansion, how they’ll be distributed across our talent trees, and revealed a new type of talent called “apex.”

Here’s how the talent points will be distributed:

• 3 points for the class tree, although no new talents will be added there.
• 3 points for hero talents, which will introduce a brand-new talent line.
• 4 points for the specialization tree, where the new “apex” talents will appear. Of these:
  • 2 will enhance existing abilities
  • 1 will modify an ability

More details will be revealed during the panel scheduled for Saturday at Gamescom.

[ember blaze]

oh that sounds cool

glad spec trees are getting more and not just shoved into hero trees

[zealous sedge]

I like the way they chose to approach talents

[pulsar minnow]

Oh that’s great

Good way to do it

[deep pawn]

that is gorgeous hair

They aren't gonna be as popular as they deserve

[zealous sedge]

I’ll definitely roll one

Probably druid obvi

[lavish raptor]

they're so pretty

[clear apex]

Bat trolls

The head quills are cool

[ember blaze]

i mean, for shaman lovers they might be

people cry they cant be a pretty race for it

and this one you can remove all the animal features and make it close to a night elf

curious about the racials

[novel zodiac]

there hasnt been a new race that got popular since belfs in TBC lmao

[ember blaze]

too high of a bar

but things like vulpera have been successful 🤔

mechagnomes and earthen on the other hand

should have never happened

[deep pawn]

do you count velves?

https://www.dataforazeroth.com/stats/races I don't know if you count any allied race beating an original race or not

[tropic trail]

Can you remove tusks completely?

[deep pawn]

I think I've heard yeah

[tropic trail]

Damn nice, and other classes than Druid?

Oh nice I found it

[sleek solar]

I want to make a warlike sadistic haranir warrior

Total opposite of what they seem to be

[ember blaze]

you can make them look very basic like a regular elf

[warm topaz]

a new shaman wowo

wonder how their totems will look

[glass fulcrum]

PTR is becoming less and less stable

Like, constantly entire party lagging out in dungeons

Also ran into someone with 1.2 million stamina on their artifact, they were doing M+ standing in mechanics tanking no damage lol

[sleek solar]

I really hope we will dive into their history, and if/ how they actually descended from trolls

And how their views are of elves and trolls XD

Like how Night elves hate being descended of trolls

[ember blaze]

only thing i care for is learning about orweyna and how she will teach us to sing 🎤 for bards

[tropic trail]

Hell yea

[warm topaz]

https://x.com/Kexman/status/1958844219239416300?t=7S7c4z7CC4qD6U44OktVLw&s=19

Kexman @ Gamescom (@Kexman)

🚨BOMBSHELL NEWS ALERT🚨

DPS meters and Boss Timers are coming to the base @Warcraft UI!

Find out more in my interview with Laura Sardinha & Toby Ragaini coming out soon! #warcraft #Midnight

X · Aug 22, 2025, 10:50 AM

[rain cave]

when's the wow panel tomorrow?

the one that goes over hero spec and talent stuff

[novel zodiac]

i dont count them cause they're practicaly the same as belfs, but yeah i was wrong, some races other than the originals got really popular more than i thought so lol

[novel zodiac]

man, that 14,4% will get to like 30 in Midnight lol

[ember blaze]

https://youtu.be/ZL846VrXkKU?si=SnQZb6Mk7EdfgSlc

[thin warren]

I wonder if we will get some lore and quests in the .5 and .7 patches

we will see

[clear apex]

Think .5 is "content" and .7 has story listed

[ember blaze]

hmm paul hinted at more race/class combos coming in the future

damn, a certain furry is gonna be mad

[clear apex]

We needed druids added in df

[sleek solar]

Bard would be so cool

I want to sing my enemies to death

[obtuse vine]

So nightborne DH confirmed possibly for the future? I doubt he could mean any other race

[tulip sun]

They could mean just an additional race-class combo

Doesnt need to be DH

[clear apex]

Hmm maybe more paladins

[tulip sun]

Or even Sin'dorei druids as a counter

[clear apex]

IDK what sense that would make?

I think a big reason they add velf dh is that all the animation and stuff there.

Think balancing would just be giving another race an existing class that makes sense.
Maybe troll paladin since zanda have it. Or another shaman

[rain cave]

I mean, it's there for nightborne as well

[ember blaze]

well it sounds like they want to wait to establish it first

[rain cave]

Though I would like to add that we know velf and belf share more than just a rig since you can use the same customisations on both

Like eyes and skin

[ember blaze]

so if they do nightborne, they will just do another side quest again first

[rain cave]

Whereas nightborne are a different model just in the same rig

[rain cave]

Watch thalyssra go sicko mode

[ember blaze]

theres already fel nightborne