beta-ptr-spoilers

[deep pawn]

They uncapped crests 3 months into S1

Which would be June 3rd this time

[dense plover]

March at the earliest. You don’t launch before March

[deep pawn]

I think June 3rd is a very likely date for Dinars too

[dense plover]

February is a bad month like January - money is typically still tight

[deep pawn]

I think prepatch is definitely in February at the latest.

[silent urchin]

I'm guessing may 27th for the dinars/crest unlock. Second week of visions is when all the power from that unlocks

[deep pawn]

maybe, but just saying in s1 it was exactly 3 months

[novel zodiac]

june is too late, nobody will care by that time

even may

[lavish raptor]

my alts will care

[deep pawn]

its still faster than the original schedule

was renown 17 originally or in 10 more weeks from now

so June 3rd is at least two weeks faster haha

[upper pasture]

idk, two slots of BiS raid gear is pretty huge no matter when we get it

[ember blaze]

last week of the season

[upper pasture]

still has value into the first few weeks of the next season

[ember blaze]

i havent seen a single trinket from raid

and by trinket i mean house of cards

or mugs

[deep pawn]

I have champ house of cards on my main

I'm actually passing on a champ eye of kezan cause I don't do any fights long enough

[glass fulcrum]

ill care, i have done heroic bandit every week and only seen my bis weapon drop once and its such a huge pool of who can roll on it as a 2h str agi int mace :)

[ember blaze]

clearly im not gonna see it by actually playing the game, not to mention i have to roll with 20 other people

and i didnt win the lottery by the lootbox from timewalking

[upper pasture]

wow, if only there was a system in a few weeks that lets you pick an item from raid AND level it to myth track

[ember blaze]

yeah, and the point is that it shouldnt arrive too late either

tired of the good trinkets being as rare as "very rare" items

i only saw spymasters for the entire last season because I got it off the timewalking lootbox 💀

[upper pasture]

i mean, the "best" trinkets are very rare, there are plently of "good" trinkets elsewhere

[ember blaze]

hmmm

[upper pasture]

i mean, it was YOUR statement first

[ember blaze]

they forgot to put spymasters down there too last season!

[upper pasture]

i was just making a point that of course there's gonna be everyone rolling on the BiS trinkets. especially when they are huge stat gains of pure main stat.

however there are a bunch of other trinkets that will do just fine

but everyone is slaves to the "meta/BiS lists" to just use what you get until you get better

[ember blaze]

when the dungeon trinkets were painfully awful? yeah

[deep pawn]

I'm petty enough to hope they make the raid trinkets next raid so strong no one wants the dungeon ones they voted for

screw Ara-kara and Priory coming back

[upper pasture]

i like priory /shrug it's probably my favorite dungeon this season

[pulsar minnow]

Priory is fun. I hated Ara Kara tho

[deep pawn]

priory has way too much trash

[glass flicker]

Thinking back, I kinda miss some WoD dungeons. Skyreach would be awesome in M+.

[little hound]

I don’t mind ara-kara or Priory. Stonevault can stay vaulted though. Nah fk that dungeon

[glass flicker]

I don't like Ara-Kara.

[sullen dawn]

Yep agree

[deep pawn]

come on news post haha

[silent urchin]

what news post are you expecting

[deep pawn]

Taliesin apparently is sure a housing post is coming.

[zealous sedge]

So what’s the point of getting horrific vision enchants if the DPS gain is so minimal? Obviously people are doing it for the rewards but it feels lack luster. But I guess they don’t want players too OP

[upper pasture]

i'm holding out hope that they will be tuned better closer to release.

[zealous sedge]

Agreed maybe a 3-5% boost would be wise so we actually feel something. One thing that caught my eye in the rewards section was the availability of gilded crests I think after Mask 4 difficulty which was nice.

[rain cave]

fun

it's satisfying to see the big void beam

[upper pasture]

yeah but "big void beam" doing 0.8% of your damage isn't nearly as fun as it was originally

[ember blaze]

big miss on their part imo...

theres the clear winner of the stat ones being the only good one

the other ones should not be garbage

[dense plover]

maybe they can have them be stronger while inside the visions at least?

[zealous sedge]

i would take that

[ember blaze]

or just let ppl have fun in pve

we already got an 18% dmg buff through raid that just nerfs the content a lot

we get the random mini patch ring item

why is the new one suddenly being kept trash

[dense plover]

they could make it bigger and then make it not work in instanced content except horrific visions

but if they make it a big buff for all pve content, it goes from optional to necessary for a lot of the people who play wow

[upper pasture]

i mean, just like all enchants and half patch items they become "necessary"

[deep pawn]

it'd only be for 11 weeks

[rain cave]

or maybe they could give us a trinket that buffs them

so you're basically trading the dps that would have been trinket and just funneling it into corruptions

[deep pawn]

WoW just feels really quiet for a patch 2 weeks away lol

[deep pawn]

when the hell can MoP classic drop? July?

[brittle pebble]

I'm particularly interested in how many people will be granted access to the MoP beta test. I applied for the Cata test previously but wasn’t selected. I’d really appreciate it if anyone who got in or has more insight into the process could share their experience.

[little hound]

I'm just hoping for anything rn, Nightfall launching with what..A world event faction and CD Manager, then having to wait 1 entire month for a repeatable vision? That's..Big F.

[silent urchin]

don't expect major content in a minor patch

being something that seems skippable seems to be the point. They're not trying to do the GAAS thing where any dip in player count is seen as a disaster. They're really just looking for the bump at the major patches then adding a little bit extra for those that stick around in the minors

[upper pasture]

I think it’s less expecting “major” content and not having each thing a whole month apart.

[warm topaz]

i would love to know the reasoning behind timegating the events

i understand that if you release all of them on 22 it would be too much

[upper pasture]

Some time inbetween them is good however I think 4 weeks is overkill

[warm topaz]

but 2 months its a bit too much imo

[upper pasture]

My guess is they are hoping the undermine goblin rep grinds will keep people busy enough

[pulsar minnow]

maybe im a minority but i have barely touched the undermine goblin rep grind :/

[upper pasture]

Personally up until that past two weeks nether did I. I was just picking the same cartel over and over but with the DMF buff I switched it up and focused chett cards. 6 more until I have 2/4 exalted and the other is revered nearly exalted.

The sooner I’m done in undermine the better. It’s a complete miss for me

[pulsar minnow]

Forgive me for asking but whats the DMF buff - ive been in like M+ world since the patch launched

[upper pasture]

Dark moon faire, they have a rep that increases all exp and rep by 10%

[pulsar minnow]

oh gotcha

ive just never seen it abbreviated lol

but yeah undermine was a miss for me too - not because its really bad, but i've just never really liked the goblin aesthetic much

[upper pasture]

Personally, I hate the car and the would zone feels too busy/cramped

[quartz pond]

Are there no class changes in 11.1.5 PTR?

[upper pasture]

There’s tuning coming next reset?

[quartz pond]

Oh LOL they just posted that

[deep pawn]

I don't think I can bring myself to care about the cartel paragon caches

The grind is just too much

So it's mounts I'll never get

[deep pawn]

Heh, the CMs are getting ready to post 11.1.7 notes soon

They typo'd today

Doubling the cartel rep is a good start

[zealous sedge]

Oh so good to see buffs to the enchants and even better the 100% buff on reputation gains for the cartels. I’m so far behind.

It would be nice to have a “reputation holiday” at the end of the xpac before prepatch to tie up any reps that people need. Like give me a 20% buff that lasts for a week after I complete a certain activity for that week.

[upper pasture]

We’ve had rep buffs in the past like in DF

[dense plover]

i mean, theres literally a rep event during 11.1.5

[zealous sedge]

Oh

Good to know

[dense plover]

pretty sure its 200% increased rep to all dragonflight and 100% to all War Within Factions

might not include the cartels, not 100% sure

and it wont include the new renown in 11.1.5 obviously

[zealous sedge]

Oh that’s dope I didn’t see that

[upper pasture]

it likely wont be the goblins too new but the 11.0 reps are likely

shows 6 are boosted by 100% so likely to be the 6 11.0 reps

[deep pawn]

it doesn't include the goblins.

[dense plover]

well the flat 100% perma-buff is arguably better

[deep pawn]

yeah

glad they realized it was too slow regardless

[thin warren]

True, but it might just also not be intended to get every reward

[deep pawn]

that's not how WoW works and you know it lol

[upper pasture]

Idk, I don’t think it’s too slow, I only had the top one started before the DMF started

But this is like the one time having alts has actually paid off this expansion lol

[thin warren]

If you don't mind grinding the same stuff 5 times each week and repeat each week for a few months...

So slow is relative. It is slow if you have one character

[thin warren]

I don't think 80% of the players are the completionists who want to grind months for a stupid mount

[upper pasture]

To each their own, I’d wager there’s a decent chunk of completionists

In willing to bet it’s not the completionists that are complaining about the grind either

[thin warren]

Of course, but where to draw the line for like giving everything for minimal effort or really needing to spend months to achieve something

(or have 10 alts and don't mind mindnumbing repeating everything)

[deep pawn]

I've done a fair number of chett lists and I'm not exalted with any, you're an exception here.

[upper pasture]

For the most part alts are completely useless for grinds nowadays seemingly except for the chett cards

[thin warren]

So how did you get that very very high reps allready

[upper pasture]

Chett cards

[deep pawn]

And I'm ahead of the curve for my guild and I know it lol

[upper pasture]

65 characters

[thin warren]

Darkfuse solutions is a pure grind on itself

[upper pasture]

DMF buff

[deep pawn]

65 chars doing chett lists is not normal lol

[upper pasture]

Dark fuse sucked for sure

[thin warren]

You just said alts are useless 😛

[upper pasture]

I can certainly say there was definitely others doing the same

I also never said it was normal

[thin warren]

Is that even still fun... I mean, the huge amount of repetition

[upper pasture]

And yes I said “outside of this one example alts have been useless”

[thin warren]

The cartels is by doing all WQs on alts I guess

[upper pasture]

You don’t get the rep when completing it a second time

Which it’s been like that since warbands became a thing

[thin warren]

So you completed 500 chettlists?

I can't grasp the amount of time you must have been putting into this 🥲

[upper pasture]

i've done 130 in the past two weeks

it was about 10-15 mins per alt for the each of their chett card

[thin warren]

So 13 hours of just grinding chettcards a week

[upper pasture]

probably

[thin warren]

What items on the list go so fast?

Fast is relative ofc

[upper pasture]

rares/scrap/races/cans/side gig are all preferred then the delves.

deliveries suck and will only do them as a last resort

[thin warren]

Doing four of those in 10 minutes? Sounds tight

But whatever, it's your time, lol

[upper pasture]

not really, scrap can be done under a min and the races and cans go hand in hand

[thin warren]

SCRAPevents?

[upper pasture]

delves can be done on T1 so you just pull everything to the end of the delve

[thin warren]

Each takes 2 minutes

[upper pasture]

you don't need to be there for the whole thing just the 100 scrap cans

[thin warren]

Ah, don't know the Todo by head, only did 4 of them 🙂

Whatever you want to waste all your free time on

[upper pasture]

...rightt

i hardly call doing what i want to be doing "wasting my time" but to each their own

[thin warren]

Do you had much fun doing 65 times the same things all over in a week?

While you said that you don't even like undermine if I'm not mistaken

[upper pasture]

sure. i'll be happy to be done with the grind and complete the undermine zone

yes, which is why ill be glad when it's over

[thin warren]

You seem like someone is forcing you to do it

"glad when that will be over"

[upper pasture]

you seem to THINK that

i play the game to collect things, i'm allowed to dislike a zone and still complete the check list

[thin warren]

You just said it. You don't enjoy it, your only reason is to fill up those bars so you can stop

[upper pasture]

disliking a zone isn't a reason to ignore content. i'll collect the items and move onto the next thing. it's not really that complex

[thin warren]

You talk about it like a chore, like cleaning your house, "glad when it will be done"

Sounds not like a passtime you are having fun with doing

Whatever floats your boat

[upper pasture]

you've said that quite a few times to me yet somehow you still act like it's so far fetched someone can do things and not be completely in love with what they are doing. so i guess i should try and explain (again). i LOVE playing WoW, i LOVE collecting things in all manners. filling up lists, 100% content, it's what drives me to play the game among other things. however, the undermine zone, i DO NOT like, i don't like the car, i DO NOT like how cramped the zone feels when driving said car. while i DON'T like the zone, it's not completely unplayable. it's just not my cupp of tea visually and mechanically. (which is fine for goblin enjoyers) which is why when i say i'll be glad when it's over because my drive to COMPLETE list is GREATER THAN my DISLIKE of the overall zone.

all in all i'm still having fun because if i wasn't i wouldn't be doing it. no one has a gun to my head forcing me to do chett cards

[thin warren]

Ahah

High completionist drive then 😄

[lone mantle]

The upcoming season appears to be significantly more appealing and worthwhile than the presence of a few goblins.

[thin warren]

Our quirky green friends

[deep pawn]

2.5 weeks to the next ptr, any predictions

[lavish raptor]

Dailies in the casino

[deep pawn]

I don't think we need catch-up gear this time since visions give hero gear

[lavish raptor]

there's always catch-up gear

[upper pasture]

yeah but we wont need another catch up gear system before S3 is all

HV is giving gear and that's a month after the patch release, we likely wont need another one until s3 which will be the delve gear system refresh

[deep pawn]

Doesn't the Nightfall stuff award veteran gear too?

[lavish raptor]

Do we not remember dreamsurges

[deep pawn]

So next patch has multiple catch ups already so we won't need something like the Siren Isle gear

[upper pasture]

i think so

[lavish raptor]

We literally had the Dreamsurges patch after the Fractures in Time patch

Both had catch-up gear

[deep pawn]

Well Dreamsurges were widely panned as useless content.

[upper pasture]

we have delve gear, nightfall, HV, WBuE drops, how many catch up systems do you think we need?

[deep pawn]

Plus 11.1.7 has the return of timeways yet again

6 weeks of random hero raid gear lol

It might be a small story patch more than anything. Roadmap was a bit sparse.

[lavish raptor]

You guys are thinking "useful content" not probable content

[pulsar minnow]

keep in mind warbands exist now so effectively any kind of content gives catchup gear, giving less incentive for them to develop something like dreamsurges

[lavish raptor]

If it's not "we opened the casino here are some dailies" id be surprised

Might be like the Big Dig Content

[deep pawn]

It does promise a system update of some sort.

[lavish raptor]

With cosmetics

[deep pawn]

System updates aren't always super big but usually refers to reward structures somehow

[lavish raptor]

Hopefully it's fixing item levels

[deep pawn]

Like the season 4 key squish was originally hinted as a systems update

[lavish raptor]

Maybe even fixing mage tower

[deep pawn]

What's wrong with item levels

[upper pasture]

i don't think we are revisiting the casino for a WHILE

[lavish raptor]

They had a whole questline about it's ownership

[pulsar minnow]

yeah and the questline had a finish

[upper pasture]

yeah and it's been concluded

[pulsar minnow]

like we're setting up K'aresh here I doubt their big headline feature is going to be the casino

the whole 11.1 patch is already themed around it

[lavish raptor]

Pretty sure next major patch is gonna be Orwenas home

[upper pasture]

k'aresh

[lavish raptor]

Karesh exploded

We aren't going there

[pulsar minnow]

so did argus

[lavish raptor]

No like it exploded exploded

[upper pasture]

okay the remains of k'aresh then

[lavish raptor]

Also at the end of the raid cutscene it has the guy looking at the zone you can fly up RIGHT NOW

IN THE SPIDER ZONE

it just teleports you out if you do

[pulsar minnow]

yeah no that's not where he was

and that was k'aresh

and it still exists

https://warcraft.wiki.gg/wiki/K'aresh

Back in BC there was still mention of the place existing

[deep pawn]

Karesh looks more ruined than even Argus was and there's no way it lives up to Argus so I'd rather not go there

[lavish raptor]

No it's more likely we go to a destroyed planet than the zone that we introduced an entirely new race of NPCs for

And have a potential entrance for currently in the game

That kicks you out if you get too close

[lavish raptor]

"According to the Adventure Guide for Pandemonius, K'aresh was destroyed.[7] However, at least one ethereal appears to still operate from K'aresh, which suggests that a portion of the planet may have survived the destruction.[8][9] Dimensius may have also abandoned the planet after the ethereals fled."

Maybe that portion but

It'd be more of a Midnight thing

Since like. That sounds like more of a Midnight thing.

Otherwise we have the BFA problem of "story moving too fast"

[deep pawn]

There's a dream area that kicks you out too

[upper pasture]

the way i see it is owenya or whatever her name is being built up to bring us back to azeroth because of "oh no the heart of azeroth needs xyz" after we get the void soul whatever thing back from the ethereals

[pulsar minnow]

yeah this horse has been kicked to death in this channel so I don't really think it's worth arguing about further. But I'll leave you with this: there is currently no narrative lead into the rootlands right now. Orweyna decided to leave. The dark heart - our macguffin, was taken by ethereals who are now in pursuit by our main villain who we've been chasing around all expansion.

We need some sort of narrative lead into midnight as these expansions are all interconnected and there is a reason for that

[lavish raptor]

Then why does the entry into the root lands exist

[pulsar minnow]

Could be a variety of reasons

I'd guess it's because either plans changed when metzen took over and decided to do the world soul saga. Or, as Orweyna says, the roots are apart of something much greater than we all know, and our actual rootlands isn't actually in the area. Hell, what that entrance you see is could very well be a dungeon

[upper pasture]

because blizzard plans to use it but not yet?

[pulsar minnow]

My personal guess? Rootlands are likely on the backburner until The Last Titan. Eonar was the one who planted the tree in the first place and she and the rest of her titan crew are coming back to azeroth in two expansions time

And seeing as how Northerend is a complete continent, Blizzard needs to add zones for patch content. We've already gone up from Northerend, now we go down to the world soul to finish the story.

[lavish raptor]

That sounds more convoluted then "we go up into root lands now and Karesh becomes a problem later after it gets reformed or something"

[deep pawn]

Karesh just doesn't belong in the "underground" expansion

Black blood is also a threat right now.

[elfin eagle]

Rootlands zone karesh raid

That’s what I think is best

[lavish raptor]

If every problem we faced rn was immediately addressed next patch, Iridikron would have been a raid boss by now

[pulsar minnow]

So that’s not exactly true

[deep pawn]

Iridikron is hiding beyond our reach and we know that.

[upper pasture]

the only thing is the problem is the dark heart, we need to reclaim that before it falls into the wrong hands.

[pulsar minnow]

Orweyna addresses the black blood in her stay a while and listen with Gazlowe

[pulsar minnow]

See that doesn’t really matter when the epilogue just shoved K’aresh in our face

Like if you wanted that to be a next expansion thing, make that our final cutscene in 11.2 not 11.1

Trust me I would prefer rootlands be handled now bc I want to play a Haranir but this is just the cards we’ve been served. Also I’m guessing rootlands and worldcore are our final zones of TLT

[deep pawn]

That just feels bad. You serve us an unground expansion focused entirely on Azeroth calling us down to sidestep it for a deader planet than Argud

I'd call it the biggest disappointment since Nyalotha

[upper pasture]

to you i guess

[elfin eagle]

It feels like these been a weird disconnect this xpac story wise

But I’m saying that’s prolly to do with the change in direction halfway through

I feel like rootlajds was the original idea but it switched to karesh

[upper pasture]

depending on how connected xal'atath is to K'aresh it might make sense, but we wont know until we get there

[elfin eagle]

I’m sure it’ll look dope

The ethereal side quests will go hard

[deep pawn]

I'm gonna remain praying we're going to the Rootlands cause the Ethereals are gonna try to steal the energy of our world soul and thus Karesh is just part of the raid.

I just can't see the current team delivering something that beats Argus and would prefer Karesh to be part of Midnight if anything

[lavish raptor]

my bet is ethereals invading rootlands

would take significantly more asset building to construct an entire new planet instead of something they have a lot of set-up resources for

[pulsar minnow]

See now if they go that route they have to be really careful about K’aresh

Because we pretty much know we’re getting an ethereal raid for certain. We also know the patch is ethereal themed because of the PvP tabard

So if they give us K’aresh for a raid now, would it stop there or would we go back again for a zone

Because if K’aresh is just a raid, now that’s ny’alotha levels of bad

[deep pawn]

I think K'aresh at all with the story we've been given will feel disjointed

People complained about Nyalotha after a faction war expansion

Going to another damn planet in the underground expansion would feel so nonsensical

If Orwenya isn't present in 11.1.7 as the speaker then I'll give up on Rootlands, even if she feels like the most likely Eyes of Green for the void prophecy.

Regardless I think I'm wary to begin with having a second void raid before Midnight where we beat the void for good lol

[pulsar minnow]

My hope is that midnight isn't all void raids and actually does what metzen made it sound like and includes the Light as well

Since it is the final clash of both forces

[zealous sedge]

I totally agree I think it would make the most sense if the ethereal’s determine they need more energy for the dark heart to restore Ka’resh. The rootlands is the obvious choice for this. Otherwise Orweyna’s story would literally be for nothing imo. I know there are some who want an entire ethereal patch or even expansion but I don’t think that’s realistic. Besides, the ethereals would have to be at the very least a major faction/ renown in Midnight.

With .5 on 4/22 I bet we see .7 details that same week? I imagine we see 11.2 reveal in June?

[deep pawn]

They've been pretty consistent with 7 week ptrs.

So they may wait til the week after 4/22 to reveal.

11.1.7 is likely a very small patch.

Based on that pattern, 11.2 reveal would be last week of June.

[upper pasture]

which is around the "midnight deep dive"?

[sullen dawn]

That's august

When 11.2 will release also

[sullen dawn]

Yeb tbh it's likely Amanai raid, light raid, renalash raid. Plenty of room for variety

[warm topaz]

that's Gamescom probably yeah

[sullen dawn]

Yup

D4 expansion 2 announcement and midnight deep dive are likely gamescom

[warm topaz]

like Legion, Midnight hype!

[warm topaz]

oh btw

the new book, coming on November 11

[silent urchin]

is that the one we already got a short from?

or was that the last one

[warm topaz]

i'm not really sure

[upper pasture]

Oh thrall? I wonder if he will get more story in game 🤣

[silent urchin]

ah yeah it's the one that includes https://worldofwarcraft.blizzard.com/en-gb/news/24177512

[harsh mason]

In fact, she was in one of the chapters. Actually, yes, the characters were divided into chapters. And the image from the loading screen is a moment from the final chapter of the main campaign.

In short, they tied his plot role to the revival of Stormguards

I'm not sure about the alliance, but that's why Stormguards visit Orgrimmar.

[deep pawn]

I think we get Locus Walker's story some time before 11.2 if it's K'aresh

regardless, it'll be the first time we've had anything from his perspective at all.

[upper pasture]

Oh right, it’s just a collection of the stories we’ve been given so far plus the locus walker one, rip thrall

[deep pawn]

are you sure? I thought the Thrall story we had was in the last book.

[upper pasture]

oh right, we already got one book last year, hmmm...

[thin warren]

hmmm, they don't speak about campaign or something in 0.5?

so no story-stuff

except the radiant thingy

[upper pasture]

just the nightfall stuff is the only real "story" content

[thin warren]

but that's just "hey we are fighting off the angry loyalists of Ansurek"

i see

[deep pawn]

there could be stuff hidden

[upper pasture]

yeah, of course there will be little stuff here and there with the HV/DD stuff and maybe a hidden story related quest but i wouldn't expect much from it since they aren't talking about it

or hinting at it

[thin warren]

we will see in 10 days

[upper pasture]

don't you mean 10 days then a month then another month? LOL

[deep pawn]

in 10 days we'll know the main story since the other stuff isn't story related.

and then 7-10 days after that we'll get the next patch preview.

[thin warren]

we will see, can't feel much motivation to start up wow nowadays

[upper pasture]

i feel like this is a personal problem especially when there's new stuff to do in the coming reset. however if you've completed all your S2 things then i supose so

[thin warren]

ofcourse, depends what your goals are, i'm not a completionist like you, so can't be bothered to grind rep or cosmetics

got 2 questchains left to do in Undermine

[upper pasture]

but youve reached your desired score in M+?

[thin warren]

i don't do M+

[upper pasture]

done raid at least once?

[thin warren]

i have reached max renown with the goblins, and did the raid once in LFR yeh 😛

i will just do the weeklies with reset wednesday

no rush

[uncut vault]

the promotional material mentions the "Nightfall campaign", but it's not really clear if that means some kind of encrypted questline or just the 'here's a new faction to do fill the bar dailies for' we already know about haha

[thin warren]

oh, maybe!

[ember blaze]

that's quite the art shift 🤔

[rain cave]

the text on the main title annoys me

it has artifacts on it

quick mockup I did myself to show them

those little jaggies

especially since software that lets you do that effect usually has a method to smooth it out lmao

like so

[upper pasture]

have you considered they didn't want it smoothed out?

[rain cave]

it's a literal digital artifact

it's like having fringing on a greenscreen, or bad compression on an image blurring things

it's a sideeffect of a digital bevelling method that is then further processed to try and remove unless you want that synthetic digital look

which considering WoW is a fantasy book and the text IS fantasy styled, I'd imagine they wouldn't want

[upper pasture]

yet here we are

[rain cave]

I know why it's probably happened though, and it's probably that their book department is not heavy funded and they haven't put as much care into the cover as a consequence

since historically WoW's fonts and covers have historically not had that

it's a small thing for sure and most people won't notice it but it's like a minor thing that annoys me as someone who literally uses the software lmao

[lavish raptor]

Pringles-ass text

[rain cave]

lmao

[deep pawn]

Most people won't look that closely lol

[rain cave]

I know I know, but it's so glaringly obvious to me

as a game/digital art person

and it makes me concerned that they don't have someone on hand who DID notice it, since WoW's font game has been pretty good historically

[upper pasture]

or on the other hand, this is a placeholder image or a design choice however bad of a design choice it was.

[rain cave]

could be placeholder I suppose

but it's no secret that art departments across the industry are being slashed

ik blizz have got a lot of them just brought on and they're all in the midnight/tlt mines grinding away

so it's no surprise that the books don't get as much attention

[lavish raptor]

Now that you pointed it out

I can't unsee it

[rain cave]

I'm sorry

you'll start seeing it in random places now

this also looks like the first book where the art on the cover looks very similar to just painted over ingame models, which is valid but indicates to me that they didn't have the resources to get a full bespoke piece of painted artwork like the other books

esp compared to the other war within book

does this matter to or indicate the quality of the text within? no,a not at all.
does this maybe indicate what blizz's priorities are at the moment? With a lot more of the marketing/art team probably being on midnight and last titan? probably

that's all I'm sayin :P

[rain cave]

oh my god it's on the text here as well

[lavish raptor]

The Crunch Within

[rain cave]

I mean yeah that's been pretty obvious to me that they are DRIVING those developers xD

especially with war within sort of playing a bit of catchup when it pivoted direction later in development

but they've been doing a really good job considering!

chris metzens really steered the mast into a clear direction and being a developer myself a strong direction and unified vision makes development so much easier and faster

[deep pawn]

maybe it's meant to look chiseled or welded.

[rain cave]

no no it is literally a digital artifact

[upper pasture]

¯_(ツ)_/¯

[rain cave]

idk why people jump to defend it like it's not deep they just used a digital bevel on the text that's all 😭

doesn't affect the books quality just something that I noticed

[upper pasture]

have you considered it's not as deep as you think it is?

[rain cave]

I never said it was deep

I literally opened a piece of software and replicated it in like 2 minutes, because that's all it was

[upper pasture]

which is why it was "artistic choice"

the person who made this or approved it like said "yes this is great" if they didn't like it they would have spoke up

[rain cave]

but then that is my point that they must not be putting as much resources into Quality control/ design decisions for the book covers

[upper pasture]

it's not "budget cuts" or "laziness" the most simple answer is "the person wanted it to be so"

[rain cave]

everything that comes out of a company has someone who looks at it and goes "yes that's ok", that doesn't make it unique

I never said it was lazinessss

I simply pointed out it's someobdy doing a shortcut, is that valid? depends on the context and probably doesn't even matter in this cirumstance much

it's just an indicator

[upper pasture]

implying that it took you 2 mins to "fix it" implies they were being lazy no?

[rain cave]

I said I took 2 minutes to replicate to do the text as is on the cover

took a lil bit longer to fix it

and who knows what software they are using at blizzard, mine won't be the same as theirs

but my point is that we didn't have this on other books, there is a distinct change here from bespoke painted covers with text that doesn't have digital artifacts on it, to paintovers of models with digital artifacts on the text

just shows their priorities are in a different place atm

[upper pasture]

but as you pointed out on the other TWW book, it's ALSO there

[rain cave]

and that's probably ok since not many people read the books anyways these days

[rain cave]

...yeah?

[upper pasture]

so it's likely a design choice

[rain cave]

it's not a design choice

[upper pasture]

¯_(ツ)_/¯

[rain cave]

it's like saying that audio peaking on badly mixed audio is a design choice. Could it be? Sure I suppose, if the design is leaning into thel imitations of digital media and the digital format, as a weird alt piece of music

but most of the time as you say, it's not the deep

and it's just an artifact from a digital method that slipped through

[upper pasture]

i somehow doubt it "slipped through". i'm willing to bet they left the embossed/chiseled look on purpose since whoever appproved it thought it looked good and make it stand out from the other text on the cover

seeing as it's right smack in the middle of the page i'd be hard pressed to say someone just "missed" it

[rain cave]

sigh

[upper pasture]

also music is definitely a different beast than art/digital art.

[rain cave]

guess my years of digital art experience mean nothing, might as well throw my degree out

[upper pasture]

probably should tbh.

[rain cave]

bit rude

[upper pasture]

you were the one who suggested it

[lavish raptor]

Might be a mockup

The Amazon listing doesn't have the photo yet

Would explain why it looks bad

[rain cave]

and that would make complete sense

[upper pasture]

there's literally NO WAY for us to know if this was the intended font type i'm just saying "IT COULD BE A DESIGN CHOICE" and you are over here fighting that ITS 100% not a design choice. like you were in the person's head who approved the image

[rain cave]

I'm not fighting for anything

[upper pasture]

sure man, enjoy your day

[rain cave]

lehr I've got absolutely no beef with you it just feels like whenever I start a conversation in good faith you or someobody else leeps in to just be contrarian to my point no matter what it is

if that's not the case, fair dues. It just feels like that.

all I'm doing is pointing out that the "chisel" look is a digital artifact that I myself have a lot of experience with, and that is what it is

[upper pasture]

brother, i just pointed out it could be a design choice, it's fucking art man, who's to say what the artist was thinking when they created it.

[rain cave]

I'm telling you that even if it is a design choice it's a digital artifact

[upper pasture]

they could have sent a mock up with the artifact NOT cleaned up and one with it cleaned up and the person who approves this said "naw i like the first one more" we simply don't know

no one is arguing that it is artifact or not, the choice is whether or not they cleaned it up or not.

[rain cave]

I'm not arguing anything to do with that though

[pulsar minnow]

Tbh I think the logo choice was intentional

Looks like brushed metal 🤷‍♂️

[upper pasture]

hey look, they mentioned dinars again. rejoice!

[silent urchin]

almost like a whole bunch of youtubers etc were making up clickbait for no reason

icy-veins did especially well playing both sides, putting out a post both on how they'll be coming later in the patch AND that blizz had forgotten about them

[upper pasture]

Gotta play both sides of the story man lol

Double the clicks lol

[ember blaze]

https://www.weststudio.com/project/world-of-warcraft-tww

so what do yall think of this?

theres some obvious old god stuff in there

then theres the stuff with the giant hands

like... azeroth? 🤨

[deep pawn]

Part of me would have loved to see a Hallowfall that used a lot more luminescent mushrooms.

https://cdn.prod.website-files.com/5c1bb997cb1dd611a0e6c8ce/66d0ca5999eb7348d89ae79f_WestStudio-WoW-TWW-106.jpg

TREEE

In general it doesn't feel like WoW.

damn, they did all this 3 years before release

I think the most interesting concept that wasn't carried forward was the air balloons using magical rocks, and the ability to use boats to travel floating rivers of rock.

[rain cave]

some of the stuff in here is wiiiild

it makes me think that maybe dragonflight and TWW were closer in the concepting phase

since there's some interesting lingering DF visuals in some of those

also the giant bones kinda give me kobyss vibes

[zealous sedge]

this one is my favourite. either frozen creatures or we are actually under the water?

[deep pawn]

I'm assuming that is either magically held up water a la Nazjatar, or it's ice at the bottom of the ocean we're walking under.

[zealous sedge]

yeah

some of the old god looking stuff looks like the Flood from halo lol

[ember blaze]

i love that one

i think frozen would be interesting

all the underground zones we've had so far feel very boring

and not very underground feel

i get we have to be able to fly and gameplay is better having it all wide open...

but it's just boring

[ember blaze]

maybe we need more of this

i want more weird looking trees/plants

make more stuff glow

maybe im dumb but it just feels too similar to every other place

[zealous sedge]

im actually very intrigued by the first one. i could totally see a vibe like this for the world soul chamber

[ember blaze]

i liked ardenweald more in that regard

bright glowingtrees

the giant seeds

[deep pawn]

I'm full on coping about Rootlands now cause of one pre-final concepts Tree art. 😄

[ember blaze]

tho some parts still feeling like regular old zones

[ember blaze]

i didnt even notice that lol

im a fan of this tho

i think i woulda preferred this for their airships

specially cause of all the focus there on crystals

wheres the fantasy blizzard!

[tropic trail]

What is this?

[ember blaze]

it's the art from the studio blizz hired to make concept art for TWW

https://www.weststudio.com/project/world-of-warcraft-tww here

[tropic trail]

Wow this is cool.

[harsh mason]

These are just general sketches that don't have a specific meaning, as it always happens in the early stages of development. And I'm sure it's not even close to Azeroth, because look, there's a huge suit of armor there. Most likely, the artists simply painted the corpses of giants.

[sullen dawn]

Weird, it feels very classic wow to me, certainly more than last couple expansions zones

[warm topaz]

it's been a month since the last Housing post

we need a new one

[lone mantle]

Yes.

[warm topaz]

i don't think it's happening, but the first housing post on february was published at 8pm, in 20 minutes

[lone mantle]

Soon™

[tropic trail]

Lmfao it’s better to get house then post about the house no?

[rain cave]

I think it's the sort of thing where they wanted to keep the mystery for beledar, which has the knock on effect of making them unable to really have parts of it

concept art is literally throwing all the crazy ideas at a wall and seeing what sticks

[deep pawn]

I mean this was back in 2021.

What's fun is that means they literally have concept art for the expansion after TLT in the works meaning it's location is already set

[ember blaze]

avaloren 👀

[deep pawn]

Maybe

It could be the Light and Order saga next

[ember blaze]

huh, wouldnt that be over by TlT

although wouldnt all elements be in play if we're talking azeroth finally being born

since everyone wants her

[pulsar minnow]

Also Midnight is a Light expansion

People just keep forgetting this idk why

[deep pawn]

I'll have to go back and listen to Metzen but Midnight sounded mostly void

The expansion ends with us dealing with the void forever

[pulsar minnow]

https://youtu.be/F1pkwARaVAY?si=VV01119aX9UneYDv

21:47

[ember blaze]

forever? the heck

[deep pawn]

He said for good or forever. Forget which

[pulsar minnow]

He says midnight is us taking arms alongside the armies of the Light to banish the shadow forever

[ember blaze]

and then the light is the big bad 📝

[pulsar minnow]

It’s equally as much a light expansion as a void expansion

It is the ultimate clash between the two forces

[deep pawn]

That doesn't make Midnight the light expansion. Especially when we have Avaloren set up as Holy Fire Seanchan.

[pulsar minnow]

So dragonflight isn’t the dragonflight expansion because the flights were our allies?

The void is just the villain

It’s Light Vs Void

[deep pawn]

I'm saying the "light problem" won't be dealt with in Midnight

[pulsar minnow]

It’s not really a light problem that’s an Arathi problem

[deep pawn]

If anything the thing that happens in Midnight that gets the Titans attention is the Worldsoul balance tipping toward the light

[pulsar minnow]

Like they use the light sure, but if we’re talking cosmic forces like the legion, void, or titans- midnight is that cosmic light expansion as well as cosmic void

[ember blaze]

what about the other stuff

or does that cover everything minus elemental

like theres more forces that want her no?

or do they fall under sub magics under those

[deep pawn]

I just think it won't be as cosmic light as you're expecting. I wouldn't be shocked if we don't even see Yrel.

[pulsar minnow]

It’s light vs void. If they’re bringing in Dimensius I doubt they’re gonna leave out the light cosmology

Renilash speaks of the blood of literal gods pooling in the earth

[deep pawn]

You're setting yourself up for disappointment I feel given we have a 3 raid story coming and one raid is almost certainly going to be Zul aman.

It's elves, the wild gods are going to show up

Malorne is gonna die again

[uncut vault]

If nothing else, we can guarantee they’ll do the Anduin scene from Velen’s short story in Midnight

We even got the Dragonflight setup for it

[deep pawn]

I'm still pretty confident our 3 raid arc is Zul'Aman, Sunwell, then a raid inside the void through the Sunwell.

[pulsar minnow]

Yeah that sounds incredibly lame

Just make TBC classic+ at that point

[deep pawn]

You can go back to Legion to see the void wants to use the Sunwell as a portal.

[pulsar minnow]

There’s no point going back to the sunwell if you’re not gonna make something transformative out of it

Remastering the old thing is gonna lose its luster

[pulsar minnow]

When was that if I could ask? Just genuinely curious bc I’m praying for that moment to happen

[deep pawn]

My guess is the Sunwell gets the Dark Heart dropped in it and that's what turns the world to Midnight. After we secure Quelthalas, we siege the Sunwell to secure the voidwell portal.

[uncut vault]

From Velen’s Cata short story, he has it amidst Anduin’s first visit to the Exodar

And by Dragonflight set up I mean set up of the dragons being relevant haha

[pulsar minnow]

Oh yeah yeah

My hope is also that Anduin rides Wrathion into battle Eragon style

[uncut vault]

I mostly just hope it’s an effective moment, since they kinda blew their attempt at a big “Endgame” cinematic with 10.2 lol

[deep pawn]

I think my craziest prediction is the return of the Netherlight Crucible where we get to amplify our combat with void or light abilities

[pulsar minnow]

God it better be fully rendered and not a flappy gum igc

[deep pawn]

I think they'll save the fully rendered stuff for TLT lol

[ember blaze]

where does that one comic with anduin being a senior citizen fit into this

[deep pawn]

Blizzard spent a bunch of money in BfA on cinematics and got nothing from it

[pulsar minnow]

Oh no no

[ember blaze]

or is this that one part

[deep pawn]

That was just "a future"

[pulsar minnow]

I mean like this kinda cinematic

[ember blaze]

yeah but isnt that future the final fight against the void?

[deep pawn]

It's a future, we aren't going there anymore

[ember blaze]

or r u saying just "one of many"

[ember blaze]

why

[uncut vault]

Blizz declared it a “potential future”

[ember blaze]

i see

[uncut vault]

Which is basically code for “we’re not doing that” lol

[pulsar minnow]

Its also written by Metzen too so

[deep pawn]

Probably cause they don't want to lose hot Anduin

[ember blaze]

https://tenor.com/view/hmm-suspect-gif-22611582

[pulsar minnow]

The velen story**

Sorry I misread

The son of the wolf comic was someone else

[deep pawn]

There's a million prophecies regarding this final battle

I don't trust the lights anymore than I do the voids

We don't even know where this wall of living rock could be for Midnight

I do think the dead gods are wild gods on the elves' side

And we probably will see the moment where the Arathi Empire is shown to be something of a lie

4 months and we'll know the 4 launch zones and raid anyways

But yeah, I don't think we'll see a light raid in Midnight

[ember blaze]

thats funny, they changed the boss for this

[deep pawn]

Probably before they had full assets

[harsh mason]

I think this is just placeholder.

For example, like gronn in Nazmir in the BfA trailer

[warm topaz]

https://x.com/algalon_ghost/status/1912985531014668386

Algalon, Enigmatic Observer (@algalon_ghost) on X

New #Warcraft build found:
Internal 2 (wowdev2)🔐: 4.4.2.60192 --> 5.5.0.60367

Found at: 04-17-2025@09:44:26 UTC

X · Apr 17, 2025, 9:44 PM

[silent urchin]

we've had a few MoP vendor builds already

Internal presumably means the beta is closer, in more active testing rather than just technical validation

[deep pawn]

I mean MoP beta signups are up

[harsh mason]

I mean, 11.2 too

[deep pawn]

I better get a ptr next week

[silent urchin]

you mean tomorrow right

[deep pawn]

Ptrs last 7 weeks since Christmas

[warm topaz]

https://worldofwarcraft.blizzard.com/en-us/news/24195999

[upper pasture]

That’s, unfortunate about the dinar system. Considering I passed on a heroic best in slots last night

[deep pawn]

haha yeah

I've been minor upgrading hero track stuff cause I haven't had the spare myth crests yet

Like I have a House of Cards at 658, 665 wasn't gonna move the needle and I just presumed I'd get access to an "awakened" version later on.

[upper pasture]

Yup, oh well. I’ve been passing on weapons and house of cards cause those were likely my two dinar purchases and was gonna level past what the guild is clearing so… now I’m like “oops, guess I should be rolling on that to use my dinars elsewhere”

I wonder if the track extensions is gonna be on new drops or retroactive on all S2 gear

The recraft itmlevel boost is nice too

[deep pawn]

PTR looks like its coming up today

[silent urchin]

likely, not guaranteed though

sometimes the first build doesn't seem to work

[deep pawn]

better be some class changes

No way they go 6 whole months without any

[warm topaz]

without a what's next post?

[deep pawn]

the notes could come at any time

[warm topaz]

yeah but usually they post something earlier like: "hey, this are the features/content you can expect on this patch, PTR soon"

[upper pasture]

whos to say that isn't coming in 3-6 hours?

[warm topaz]

i hope so

[upper pasture]

i think tomorrow tho tbh

[deep pawn]

ptr up?

oh, the old post

I thought I looked at it already lol

new store pack

raven mounts

[silent urchin]

also a sale in general, with one of those mega pet packs

[ionic terrace]

in mop news, looks like we're getting the original vale in classic

[deep pawn]

of course we are

at least until the siege phase

[warm topaz]

https://us.forums.blizzard.com/en/wow/t/mists-of-pandaria-classic-development-notes-updated-april-24/2097329

[silent urchin]

Presumably it'll change when phase 4 or whatever happens

[warm topaz]

oh man that would be awesome

[ionic terrace]

i mean this is in the files so

[deep pawn]

Again, classic has always tried to do the zone changes as it progresses no?

So yeah, of course it'll start with original vale.

[ionic terrace]

i figured they would

[deep pawn]

no initial beta invite for me.

[ionic terrace]

i was just worried they would do 5.4 vale from the start

[deep pawn]

they didn't start Hyjal from the firelands version right away

[deep pawn]

Ptr better have something interesting or Blizzard may lose people for the rest of this season

[silent urchin]

what do you mean by good

it's probably not gonna have anything to cater to the high end

cause they know those people are gonna play for the new seasons then taper off pretty quick

[deep pawn]

I said interesting. I actually haven't tried the new content for this season cause I don't need the gear and it was bugged on the day I wasn't raiding lol

In general people don't seem excited for visions

So people see a patch with 0 class changes and now feel like they got rug pulled on dinars

I still think weak corruptions are pointless

[silent urchin]

oh I wonder what dungeon is gonna be in S3 and drop housing stuff..

[sullen dawn]

https://www.wowhead.com/news/legacy-achievements-grants-player-housing-rewards-decoration-sources-revealed-376560?utm_source=discord-webhook

[sullen dawn]

Yeh just as expected

Let's gooooo karesh baby

[silent urchin]

there's a mention of separate horde and alliance houses at the end

Decorations are only placeable if you have enough of them, based on how many you’ve collected. If you want to place four chairs, you’ll need to collect four chairs. Furthermore, collected decorations are shared across your entire Battle.net account, so anything you collect on any character on any of your game accounts is shared across all of them. If you have four fountains and place three of them on the lawn of your Alliance house, your Horde house will have only one available to place.

[deep pawn]

Nice

Having one house per faction is great

[silent urchin]

Mention of fountains makes me suspect there's gonna be some sort of outdoor area too

You’ll note a mention of “housing-specific” activities earlier. That might be better worded as “neighborhood-specific” activities. . . neighbourhood dailies? Or group based goals?

oh wait, it specifically says "Place them on the lawn"

I should have read that closer

[sullen dawn]

I defo want multiple houses. Especially over time

Mostly one per character

[deep pawn]

Sadly I don't think you'll get that

Houses are definitely warbound things

Two is already more than I expected

Maybe they'll let us have one per area

[sullen dawn]

I dont mind if theyre warbound, as long as we dont have a limit on them, or its high

[sullen dawn]

I could deal with that if they add a decent amojnt of more areas

Like 6-7 over world soul saga. But sounded like they wouldn't

I guess belf and nelf minimum will come in midnight, maybe goblin too

[deep pawn]

Yeah, Silvermoon and Amirdrassil are givens

[sullen dawn]

Yep very obvious

I could see silvermoon unlocking by completing campaign at midnight launch

With orc and human in prepatch

Then maybe nelf and one other later in expansion

[deep pawn]

I still think we'll see housing in 11.2.7 as a preorder early access bonus

Like how Void Elves and others were BfA preorder

Craziest thing is them making old professions mandatory. That's kinda reversing their goals for the profession rework in Shadowlands or whenever it was

Like yeah I can dig out an old MoP main who has the old skills, but still

[silent urchin]

most are pretty trivial to level, tbh

[deep pawn]

Except the ones that need cool downs to level haha

[sullen dawn]

Yeh sure, I agree. Just think we could see silvernoon/eversgong housing at full launch of MN

[warm topaz]

Midnight hype!

(11.2.7 hype!)

[deep pawn]

The roadmap makes it definitely feel like housing it before prepatch

[sullen dawn]

Yep, either late part of 11.2.7 or prepwtch is split in two with housing pre new year

[deep pawn]

Which is a short timeframe cause I think I'm predicting a December 11.2.7

June, August, October, December

I still hope we get ptr tonight

[sullen dawn]

Yeh early December and the. Housing right before Xmas maybe

Midnight mid to late feb

[silent urchin]

11.1.7 vendor build, probably not also hitting PTR today, there's normally a gap

[ember blaze]

for now… maybe time to do it now before they get expensive

[deep pawn]

I have faith!

[ember blaze]

@silent urchinwhat zone did u take that pic at

[zealous sedge]

That pic was form the official blue post

[deep pawn]

It looks like Dreamgrove or Val'sharrah

Haven't been able to find the exact spot but it's the same assets.

I can't imagine they'd bring back Darkheart or Blackrook already

So it might not be a hint unless it's "Druid" which leans towards Roothome.

11.1.7 dropping druid race expansion out of nowhere would be lit.

[worn crown]

It is a hint that 11.2 will have ethereals, but the new zone will be Rootlands 😉

[deep pawn]

Someone also pointed out it's a druid looking at a legion dungeon in a class hall.

Legion remix is likely around the time we'd be able to start earning housing items

per calendar.

That actually might be a point away from Seat being a s3 m+ dungeon with remix happening that same season.

[upper pasture]

huh the gear from HV isn't gonna be a recolor? that's lame

[deep pawn]

HV?

oh, visions

[upper pasture]

horri..yeah

[deep pawn]

Yeah, I'm thinking that's an internal 11.2.7 legion remix screen shot

Just the first thing they had that shows housing items drop.

[ember blaze]

why

[deep pawn]

cause you'd be running it a lot.

4 months of it in m+ and then 2 months of it in Remix? Nah.

[lavish raptor]

how many times has mechagon workshop been m+

i dont think blizzard would refrain from making players do content for that long

[upper pasture]

yeah but it's basically the same content in two places, they might not want that

[deep pawn]

they also put gaps in it

BfA, SL s4, and TWW Season 2 is pretty decent gaps

[upper pasture]

same reason we will never see say remix legion and classic legion at the same time

[lavish raptor]

whos says we dont

outside of classic legion not being anytime soon. they mentioned they might reuse panda remix

but tbh i feel like seat m+ is more suitable for midnight anyway

[ember blaze]

but like

remix is end of expac shit

and it has more than just seat

[deep pawn]

classic legion is like a year away

[lavish raptor]

wod

[deep pawn]

sorry, that's wod

2 then

[lavish raptor]

😂

[deep pawn]

Still sooner than you'd expect

WoD classic will be short.

[lavish raptor]

wod really be that forgettable

[zealous sedge]

It looks like I need an alt to start up each profession all the way back to vanilla to dominate the AH. Muahahahaha

[deep pawn]

They'll make Highmaul it's own phase, but WoD is still only 3 tiers.

[upper pasture]

you realize there's likely people who already have this finished?

[lavish raptor]

unless they do what they did in WoD and made people sit in their garrisons for months on end

[zealous sedge]

Yes I know I was being semi facetious haha

[lavish raptor]

for the true wod classic experience

[ember blaze]

damn that sounds annoying

[zealous sedge]

Yeah it’s a collectors dream… or nightmare?

[upper pasture]

it's both

[ember blaze]

im sticking with what i already have

if theres a new class i like then ill start up another 2

[zealous sedge]

Do you think there is a reason they highlighted this? Is it just because they are quite large achievements to get?

[ember blaze]

i would have preferred a new profession tho, and they could have still done all current ones like they are doing...

[ember blaze]

man. some of those achieves are bullshit

[upper pasture]

prolly because they are the meta achievements and take a long time to get

[ember blaze]

i dont think ill ever do the BFA one

[zealous sedge]

Agreed. Not sure if I’m ever gonna go back to do them

[ember blaze]

i got like questlines scattered differently on different toons and idk where i left off the most in

then theres the whole needing to play both factions

[zealous sedge]

Yeah ain’t the mechagon achieve part of that?

[ember blaze]

and i cant remember which char i did some in

[ember blaze]

yes

[zealous sedge]

Ooof yeah screw that

[ember blaze]

i got like 80% of DF done though since i played DF a lot

the only stuff im missing is the annoying rng stuff

[zealous sedge]

I wonder if any of the legacy achievement house rewards include currently unobtainable. Im assuming yes.

[ember blaze]

that stupid walking tree every hour event...

[ember blaze]

most likely :/

fuck u for not playing then 😡

[deep pawn]

Hand of A'dal

[upper pasture]

nothing feels worse than seeing that title and knowing i was one quest away from getting it

[zealous sedge]

Yeah my worst personal issue in wow is the FOMO. I’ve gotten better to just turn off that part of my brain but the housing thing makes me want to get literally everything

[upper pasture]

i mean, they've gotten alot better about it lately

but i'm definitly the camp on "just never take anything out of the game"

[zealous sedge]

I agree.

[lavish raptor]

lowkey want to play MOP classic so id be able to experience OG vale

[zealous sedge]

Part of me thinks they’ll make WoD Classic a much shorter schedule to bring about Legion Classic quickly. Although at this rate they’ll catch up to retail and then they are screwed.

[upper pasture]

part of me thinks that's why they aren't gonna let SoD stop with classic

[zealous sedge]

I’ve always assumed they’ll eventually retire SoD and do a new “Season” but I think it’s too late for that. The player base would be pissed.

[deep pawn]

do it, in like 2 months

SoD is never shutting down, they've already said that

[zealous sedge]

Oh

[upper pasture]

SoD should go into TBC and maybe WotLK too but idk after that but who knows. i love SoD

[uncut vault]

I feel like they'll probably make a properly separate "Classic+" with all of SoD's quests and improvements, and leave current SoD as-is

[zealous sedge]

That would be wild but I could see it. Classic feels so fragmented between all the versions but I guess there are enough players for all of it.

[warm topaz]

i have so many questions about the classic + project, how are they going to sell it? included on the sub as it is right now? perhaps monetize it like expansions, but at a lower price

first, we need to know how they define "classic +"

[zealous sedge]

I couldn’t see them monetize it more than just with the wow subscription. Also what exactly is the theory behind what Classic + would look like?

[warm topaz]

i think everyone have a different opinion on what is classic +

and what they want on it

[deep pawn]

for sure

Lots of people hate the SoD "retail" classes lol

[warm topaz]

Aggrend said (senior game producer of classic) that they are hiring designers and the team is growng

[zealous sedge]

For me if the leveling experience could be a little more forgiving but definitely not as easy as retail I’d give Classic + a shot.

[warm topaz]

i have the feeling that they'll announce classic + on blizzcon 2026

and till then, we'll get a new season or new something

[ember blaze]

really?

[warm topaz]

i've read people saying that SoD is basically retail

[ember blaze]

thos broken toy is great

[deep pawn]

Alrighty, so ptr is next week like I originally expected for a 7 week ptr. Still hoping for something fun.

[ember blaze]

https://tenor.com/view/copium-cat-gif-27161395

ive lost faith in blizzard

[glass flicker]

George is the one who willed it.

[glass fulcrum]

I feel like TBC didn’t have a mystery aspect, and any it did have was solved with WoD

same with wrath, and they probably don’t want to touch lick king story after the last time they tried

[elfin eagle]

They should wod so we can see the shattrath raid

[harsh mason]

Yes, because it takes a lot of time.

I would say that it is better to start doing this now.

[ember blaze]

L after L by blizz

they reverting back to shadowlands it seems

even seen people say they removed just being able to fish on zen flight 🤔

very pressing issue

reminds me of one of the reasons they had to nerf evoker old world flying was them getting to pet battles faster 🤔

[sullen dawn]

Heavens forbid

[deep pawn]

You'd think the types to do it would already work on them for the mounts

[warm topaz]

i would love to know the reasoning behind timegating 11.1.5

why spread the content that much

[ember blaze]

the usual player retention conspiracy or the content isnt rdy and they needed to buy time 🤔

[upper pasture]

Now that we’ve seen how buggy nightfall is id say the content was rushed and isn’t ready

[warm topaz]

i feel like everyone is working on 11.2 and Midnight

and this small patches are lead by a small group of devs

[silent urchin]

yes, that's literally how they work

nightfall worked fine when there weren't 300 people doing it at once

[warm topaz]

cuz 11.1 release was really clean, no bugs, great content, everything was fine

[silent urchin]

I mean the zone still shits itself everytime someone does the world boss

[warm topaz]

yeah but i mean, thats a wow thing, not a patch thing you know?

[silent urchin]

lost out on a bunch of stuff from a radiant echo the other day cause a raid group showed up and lagged the zone out

so are the nightfall bugs then I guess

[warm topaz]

i think that's just a bug

[silent urchin]

I think it's a side effect of an intentional change

there was a lot of stuff you could interact with while zen flying that was a bit odd

they disabled everything

[upper pasture]

I mean if only they had the tech to make sure they could limit the amount of people to a zone and create a new instance when possible

[lavish raptor]

why does zen flight still exist tbh

[upper pasture]

But I suppose raid groups showing up is sorta gonna mess it up regardless.

[lavish raptor]

its neat and all but every use case for it gets patched

[glass fulcrum]

Def should go 100% speed by now lol

[upper pasture]

yeah zen flight should be updated like evoker flying tbh not sure why they haven't done it yet

[lavish raptor]

zen flight being like skyriding ould be funny af

[glass fulcrum]

As an instant cast I don’t think it should be super fast but it’s def too slow rn

[upper pasture]

just give it a cast time and make it normal flying

[harsh mason]

By the way, there's a pit lord in one of the delves. I really wonder who it is.

Unfortunately, I don't have a screenshot, but there's a projection of it that the darkfuse cartel finds.

[deep pawn]

Monks are already Goku, give them fast nimbus

I don't think only druids need insta cast skyriding

I do think the live content team is over stressed and they aren't getting nearly the support they did in DF when they got spun off as their own team.

Or the lack of class changes makes their stuff more apparent

Makes me often wonder what the hell the class design team is working on. They kinda disappeared after 11.0.5

A half baked Marksmanship rework isn't a lot of work

[warm topaz]

i feel like they have done a lot of class changes this season

in terms of buff/nerf not design ofc

[harsh mason]

I think they simply have no reason to change classes every patch.

Like, it's an absolutely waste of time and resources on something that's interesting to a minimum number of people. Make a rework only if necessary (for example, when the same mm hunt has not changed literally since 8.0

[deep pawn]

I mean they rushed the MM rework and didn't iterate on any issue besides the pet

And multiple hero trees are still unusable

[harsh mason]

There, the rework dealt not only with peta, but mostly with how the synergy of abilities occurs. This is a good rework, mm Hunt has become much better than has been for 6 years.

Just because the mm hunt didn't even exist for the last 6 years.

[deep pawn]

I just disagree. It feels empty, the attack speed stuff feels like wasted space

And then to design an entire tier set around attack speed and an extremely rare proc?

Its strong, functional in a very bare bones way, but it feels like a level 50 spec, not 80

[sullen dawn]

Monkey king

[deep pawn]

I wanna like MM hunter so much because the archer fantasy is cool, but I just don't think MM delivers it

MM rework removed the "fluff" but didn't make the core rotation super engaging I feel. It just feels pruned.

[sullen dawn]

MM is my super casual alt, but I will likely use them for housing a lot if silvermoon/eversong available since is a high elf

[zealous sedge]

I think they just need to go to a 10-12 week cadence tbh. I know the executives would probably never allow that but I feel bad for the devs because they can’t really control the cadence at the end of the day because they report to higher powers or their pay/ bonus is ultimately decided by player retention. Maybe it’s also just growing pains and they’ll work through it. I don’t want TWW to be a failure because it has been a great expansion for me as a returning player.

[lavish raptor]

is that faster or slower than the current cadence? because id be okay with a slower cadence if it means they actually address bugs lmao

[upper pasture]

slower

the highers up would not like it tho

[zealous sedge]

Yeah that’s problem at the end of the day the higher ups can’t allow that because budgets and bonuses. That’s just corporate America for you. The only other option is to expand the team and actually make a real QA department

[upper pasture]

personally up until 11.1/11.1.5 i've never had an issue with cadence or gameplay. i don't think TWW will be marked as a failure because if this, there's plenty of the average gamer to do

(and i mean from like 10.0 too)

i think and thought this patch was gonna be bad when we found out the 3 main things are a month apart from each other

[zealous sedge]

I agree. 11.1 was a slight miss for me but in general I enjoy it. The cartel reps pretty much deflated my desire to get the rewards and thus not do the weekly rotation. Although I know they will be buffing it. But the raid is very fun and I like the raid rep where everyone is basically at the same level because there is a cap.

[upper pasture]

(it's been buffed)

[zealous sedge]

I definitely felt skeptical for 11.1.5 due to time gated stuff but I gave them the benefit of the doubt as to try something new which they haven’t really done before.

With the release though it honestly to me feels like that HV and Dastardly Duos just aren’t ready yet. Must be a skeleton crew for the mid season patches and everyone else is focused on 11.2

[upper pasture]

and while i like the raid renown, they need to uncap it at the mid point of the seas i don't want to have to raid for 11 more weeks to get all the rewards

[zealous sedge]

That’s fair. That is definitely one of those things they did to keep people subbed

It’s funny that they would try to accomplish retention with a reputation cap when people can just come back at the end of the season and slam LFR/ Normal/ Heroic fairly easily for 2-3 weeks to make back the renown they missed anyways. So it’s kind of a cheap move.

Their job performance metrics have got to be weighted so insanely far towards financial performance for decisions like this to be made. I blame Microsoft tbh.

Also isn’t the President of Blizzard formerly the GM for CoD? Speaks volume.

[deep pawn]

11.2 is actually probably done.

12.0 is done too probably and they're hard at work at later parts of 12.1 and 12.2

[deep pawn]

That's why I'm convinced Housing early access will be a pre-order bonus in Q4.

It'll drive pre-orders harder than Alliance Void Elves did.

After being reminded about Legion Remix I'm convinced the housing loot teaser yesterday is from ther 11.2.7 internal build for Legion Remix.

[upper pasture]

man, what if the reason told people who wanted to get all the housing stuff to work on the expansion meta achievements because housing plots would be attached to them

IE a world awoke gives DF housing plot c hoice

[deep pawn]

eh, I don't think it'll be plots

Maybe something big like full exteriors.

BfA meta giving a Boralus exterior.

or Zuldazar

we already know the first two zones are Org and Stormwind

Plus housing items in legion would massively drive remix engagement

Maybe a Legion meta achieve for Suramar housing exteriors.

[zealous sedge]

Agreed

[uncut vault]

The issue at the end of the day is that, while the changes over the last 7 years have been nice for refining the spec, it’s still fundamentally built on the BfA rework

Which has always been kind of a mess of a spec design

The extra clunkiness has been pruned but it’s still that same weird spender-into-spender kind of design at its heart

[deep pawn]

Aimed Shot sucks to watch

I don't know, it might be because of guns and bows, but MM feels meh with both

compared to say FF14 Bard and Machinist

[ember blaze]

hunter feels so unsatisfying to me in WoW

like in other games shooting your bow/gun feels good

even just basic attacks

[rain cave]

Bring back marked shot and sidewinders

That was my favorite playstyle

Or even small things like if they let the bouncing marked shots apply wyverns from the talent

[warm topaz]

i've always played BM, and i feel like is too slow

GCD hurt that spec a lot imo

[rain cave]

It's crazy to me that mm has half of a talent tree deducated to wind arrows, a proc that is just a bit of extra damage

[ember blaze]

i also just dont like the lack of animations

[rain cave]

Living bomb interacts with the abilities of fire mage

[ember blaze]

from u using the bow/gun

[rain cave]

Bring back the marked shot playstyle at least as an option

Make it replace arcane shot as an optional talent

[ember blaze]

like 20 years later, wheres the cool bow charging stuff

where is anything

wasting resources on a warrior spell like theyre a mage class

[rain cave]

So there's 4 distinct playstyles of pure marked, marked+ windarrows, pure arcane shot, arcane shot + windarrows

[rain cave]

Actually that gives me an idea

What if they gave hunters both focus AND energy

[ember blaze]

too many class got energy 🛌

[rain cave]

So instead of arcane shot proc charges, you have to build focus with energy spenders

And then some shots require focus instead of energy

[ember blaze]

personally ive never been a fan of energy

[rain cave]

It could space out the issue of feeling overwhelmed by focus and procs that mm sometimes has

[ember blaze]

idk how WW is now after changes, but making u feel slow with a limited resource is lame

[rain cave]

Like you don't want to spam aimed shot to overlap arcane shot procs

And they also have to cap aimed shot a bit because it's castable immediately, there's no buildup

[ember blaze]

i think thats fine for an archer

[rain cave]

I agree it should stay there

But maybe as a combat opener, so each fight you start with 100 focus

And need to rebuild it after spending in your opsner

[ember blaze]

u dont think they would be better as a cd class?

no resource

[rain cave]

I think focus can work

[ember blaze]

but personally i just want less build spender playstyles

[rain cave]

But I also think that it shouldn't be a energy style resource

I think reworking mm more comprehensively could actually free up survival to have more as well

Mm right now is simultaneously a builder spender, a proc class, it has resources AND procs to juggle, with pet utility, DoT, random procs, charge based abilities, comboing abilities for AOE and single target, etc

Considering that survival is the more DoT focused hunter, I think the first thing would be removing that to focus on other areas, and giving it to surv

Maybe they could incorporate the charge mechanics into part of a new MM playstyle

Hold down arcane shot to turn it into a multishot, target number scaling with how long you hold it

Idk

[deep pawn]

MM doesn't even have wind arrows right now does it?

Its got explosive shot stuff and auto attack stuff.

[rain cave]

Aren't there wind arrows on the right side?

Largely passive, no?

[deep pawn]

It might be one talent then lol

[zealous sedge]

They need to bring back arrows and bullets for hunters

Like make it fun

Like give them their own crafting tree for this stuff and special bonuses on loot drops that are used to empower ammo

Let hunters decide certain pieces of equipment for their pets

That’s included at certain level. Like a pet talent tree but more intuitive and better theming.

Idk I think Hunter suffers from an identity crisis.

[upper pasture]

I’d love for relics/librams/totems/special class items to return however I feel like we might be on the minority side of that one

[zealous sedge]

Yeah true. I just want more flavor

I know this would probably never happen because it would break the game and balancing but I think the game could really benefit from an itemization/ stat reformation.

Or at the very least give us interesting bonus stats. The Haste/ Mast/ Crit/ Vers has gotten a little stale because it’s just a numbers game at the end of the day.

[ember blaze]

that would have to be cosmetic tho lol

"oops forgot to buy arrows"

[zealous sedge]

Yes agreed. I think it would be cool to “attune” your ammo to make it more effective for certain fights. Poison/ fire/ frost/ slow. I know there are probably spells that already do that.

[deep pawn]

If anything we'll see versatility removed over any new stats being added

[uncut vault]

They had ammo like that back in WoD, was fairly passive but cool flavor

[silent urchin]

Was hoping for the trading post preview today but I guess not

maybe tomorrow

[deep pawn]

it's a pretty consistent number of days before no?

[silent urchin]

it varies a bit depending on when the weekend falls, but 3 days is pretty normal

last month (a 31 day month) it was out on the 27th, a thursday

[upper pasture]

Maybe a 2pm post today no? (EST, that is lol)

[thin warren]

No info about .7 yet!?

[silent urchin]

Nope. Likely this week sometime

I think those posts are less planned and tend to go live whenever PTR is actually ready

which sometimes seems like it can take a couple of attempts

[thin warren]

ok 😦

[remote shuttle]

Ptrs are usually the following week of a live release - be it a wednesday or thursday typically.

[upper lantern]

When should we expect a 11.2 announcement trailer or something?

[zealous sedge]

I’m betting June

Like 1st or 2nd week

[upper lantern]

that long? I want to see ethereal stuff 😦

Hopefully .7 will be interesting

[zealous sedge]

Based on 11.1.5 I’m not getting my hopes up. As long as it’s not another Siren Isle

11.1.5 isn’t bad per se it just feels a bit uninspired

[pulsar minnow]

They hinted that they’d be announcing some stuff at Pax East on May 9th

[sullen dawn]

Probably at xbox summer games show in early june

[sullen dawn]

Maybe pandaren heritage armour, black blood story close questline, and a bunch of collectible campsites added via achievements across different expansions

Plus turbulent time ways ofc

[deep pawn]

too soon, June 17th is 11.1.7 and they haven't been overlapping ptrs this expansion.

[silent urchin]

Another 11.1.7 vendor build, guessing we get PTR wednesday

[harsh mason]

Does anyone remember if they've been adding new storylines for children's weeks in past Expansion since the Cataclysm?

[silent urchin]

there was one in BFA

[silent urchin]

Damn, still no trading post preview

[zealous sedge]

Yeah that’s surprising. Maybe 2 PM. One can hope

[silent urchin]

https://x.com/Warcraft/status/1917292808706175452 https://x.com/Warcraft/status/1917292832458444892

World of Warcraft (@Warcraft) on X

Spring has sprung and so have critters of all kinds at the Trading Post in May!

🐶 Weechi customizable pet
🦔 Spring Harvesthog mount
🐢 Heroic Half Shell transmog
🦊 Attire of the Swift Fox transmog
🎉 And more!

X · Apr 29, 2025, 7:00 PM

World of Warcraft (@Warcraft) on X

X · Apr 29, 2025, 7:00 PM

https://worldofwarcraft.blizzard.com/en-us/news/24201672/welcome-to-critter-country-during-mays-trading-post

[zealous sedge]

Harvest hog is cool

[deep pawn]

Holy hell, who wants to bet those Drust weapons were from the scrapped Drust raid

[tropic trail]

Omg cute 🥰

Woof woof haha 🐕😆

[silent urchin]

👀

[tropic trail]

Even wow dev is Algalon must be the first ones 😌 enough of clues I know 100%

[deep pawn]

I mean there's been 11.2 vendor builds for a while no?

[lone mantle]

The forthcoming patch is imminent.

[deep pawn]

Blizzard has been internally developing faster

[lone mantle]

It is but a mere construct. I am the real deal — the culmination of purpose beyond calculation. 💫

[deep pawn]

Like they're already internally testing Legion Remix

We're probably still 2 months from 11.2 ptr

[tropic trail]

Legion remix? Nice

Best expac to make remix

[zealous sedge]

I guess we’re never getting a Drust raid

Is Kavar Taivan’s cousin?

[deep pawn]

oh no, I just realized next year we're gonna have to do every holiday again for house decorations.