i would prefer k'aresh, but i think its gonna be ethereal enemies in deepgrove setting
#beta-ptr-spoilers
pulsar minnow
Rootlands might just end up being a dungeon come to think of it
sullen dawn
would be nice
deep pawn
it'd be on the roadmap I think if we're getting a mega dungeon
uncut vault
Well, I recommend looking at the latest wowhead post for further discussion now haha
Safe to say it's likely this is a similar kind of tease as the Amirdrassil tease at the end of 10.1
pulsar minnow
upper pasture
yup so ethereal next and haranir later lol
deep pawn
Are they trying to use Azeroth to rebirth their world? I still think it's stupid to go there instead of Harronir.
Also, how the hell is their world soul still there at all.
upper pasture
the haranir have much more potential story to be told in TLT tho.
like roothome could be our 12.1 patch
deep pawn
the haranir have much more potential story to be told in TLT tho.
I disagree cause I really don't wanna be dealing with the black blood after this expansion lol.
upper pasture
doesn't mean BB tho, could be us helping them with the world literally being torn apart
deep pawn
so we kill the ethereals and Xal gets the heart back, woooo
silent urchin
The culmination of the saga still feels like it's gonna be all the cosmic forces battling for the world soul
glass flicker
Or, you know, Haranir minipatch, Ethereal big patch.
sullen dawn
Are they trying to use Azeroth to rebirth their world? I still think it's stupid...
Thay was my guess (has been for a while tbh)
warm topaz
so we kill the ethereals and Xal gets the heart back, woooo
I don't think that's what's gonna happen
silent urchin
roots are mostly just setting up the cosmic force of life having influence on part of the world soul
sullen dawn
That and regain their corporeal form
glass flicker
In a perfect world, they're both big patches. But we'd be begging.
lone mantle
I have awaited this day for eons. Bring them forth! 
deep pawn
Karesh just doesn't feel like it fits the theme of the war within.
glass flicker
Looks to me like a setup for a Midnight patch, actually. They did say Xal'atath won't be gone after TWW.
sullen dawn
Karesh just doesn't feel like it fits the theme of the war within.
disagree. the comparisons have been set up since prepatch
upper pasture
Looks to me like a setup for a Midnight patch, actually. They did say Xal'atath ...
i'd say this if we didn't have another big patch for TWW
pulsar minnow
Karesh just doesn't feel like it fits the theme of the war within.
Well keep in mind the devs see this as more of the world soul saga
sullen dawn
radiant song, voidguard etc..
pulsar minnow
Dimensius has been set up since the get-go
sullen dawn
almost the entire prepatch was hunting ethereals
glass flicker
i'd say this if we didn't have another big patch for TWW
Look, I get the "three raids per expansion" thing is becoming the norm, but let's hope we get something more to do at least this time around.
uncut vault
yup so ethereal next and haranir later lol
Not sure they're going to be later, I'm leaning more towards them being the 11.1.x stories
this is positioned in the same way Amirdrassil was in 10.1, as the next major patch location
deep pawn
I was just a lot more excited for Rootlands than I am Karesh which looks like a more barren Argus.
upper pasture
Not sure they're going to be later, I'm leaning more towards them being the 11.1...
i mean sure we will get more stories for them but like it would be completely underselling it if they were just another minor story in 11.1.X and say 11.2.X
deep pawn
And I really don't want those datamined ethereals as an allied race.
pulsar minnow
I think we’re getting rootlands in The Last Titan tbh. After all, what new zones are they gonnna add in patch content. They’re not gonna just prevent us from going to like Zul Drak or smth
upper pasture
we will likely see these and then possibly MORE later. possibly going to the place that they didn't want us in in the first place.
pulsar minnow
TLT will probably send us back through all the places we went before. Elun’ahir, Hallowfall, Abberus, Silithus, Icecrown. All places where each cosmic force made a big play at the world soul
deep pawn
Only thing I know for sure is our first raid in TLT is Iridikron's lair.
glass flicker
Alright. How about something else entirely?
We discover another Beledar-like crystal somewhere unexpected. We go there, but wait. It's always dark. It doesn't change phases like Beledar. Oh, and Ethereals are there too and are trying to move it to K'aresh.
Could be Rootlands.
deep pawn
I'm pretty sure Nightfall is gonna be Beledar going dark and staying dark.
uncut vault
I'm sure Orweyna will follow us further throughout the Worldsoul Saga, but I'm not positive the haranir themselves will be all that important
upper pasture
maybe what if say roothome bursts out of un'goro. gives blizzard a chance to redo/touch up a zone then we can fly down into roothome from there?
glass flicker
maybe what if say roothome bursts out of un'goro. gives blizzard a chance to red...
I like this idea.
uncut vault
Orweyna's connection to Azeroth and her turmoil over shirking traditions is the much more important part than the haranir's beliefs in what she is
silent urchin
Finding fragments of the world soul belonging to other cosmic forces than the light seems pretty inevitable
whether that's what's happening next, I dunno
feels like we completely ignored that plotline for now
glass flicker
...Holy mother of what is wrong with me. How didn't I consider Deepholm before?
It's literally the plane of Earth. You know, since someone said this expansion is all about the underground?
pulsar minnow
feels like we completely ignored that plotline for now
It’s probably being saved for TLT
When the whole Titan conspiracy gets discovered
deep pawn
Ethereals just felt more relevant to Midnight to me, so I'm just not overly excited for this detour when I felt the Earthen and Haranir threads felt more pressing.
glass flicker
Picture this. From Deepholm, we take a secret tunnel westwards and that's where the Rootlands really are. Between Kalimdor and the Maelstrom.
deep pawn
Undermine already feels like a complete side story only barely touching the main plot.
upper pasture
i feel like there will be portals/connections to and from each world tree location to roothome/rootlands/haranir homeland
deep pawn
i feel like there will be portals/connections to and from each world tree locati...
Dreamgrove already does that, I don't think they'd do that again
upper pasture
dreamgrove was also class locked and they were portals to known locations not the undiscovered zone
deep pawn
they did add a portal to Amirdrassil haha
pulsar minnow
My feeling is that Elun’ahir is more than just a simple world tree enhanced with life magic, but houses something powerful and precious to Elune herself. Maybe another one of her tears. Hell- maybe the tears of Elune are made of the same shit Beledar is made out of
upper pasture
or maybe only a living world tree can access roothome
and in roothome we will see areas that are destroyed from the old trees destructions
who knows /shrug
glass flicker
There's also the possibility of Vordrassil.
The world tree in Northrend that touched Yogg-Saron.
Maybe that's how voidies got into the Rootlands.
deep pawn
it's fine if this is where the story is going, they'll sell it as an internal struggle between Ethereal factions who accept they can't go back and those who will destroy another world to get theres (Hello FF14).
I just think it feels like they're deliberately avoiding other threads they've given us like Earthen, Manifold, Haranir, and Arathi.
Like if I was Champion actually inside Azeroth, I'd be all up in Jaina's face going "Heyyyyy, you know that memory spell, can you help us help the Arathi open a way home, massive empire that's anti void, you'd make your quasi nephew very happy that he can see a thriving human kingdom. Come on, it's one portal. I got a friend Oculeth who can help too."
sullen dawn
I'd be so relieved if it was karesh rather than deepgrove/rootlands
deep pawn
I guess Rootlands is where the wall of living titan rock is and that's where we'll fight the final battle in Midnight and the wild gods will die.
pulsar minnow
Like if I was Champion actually inside Azeroth, I'd be all up in Jaina's face go...
Isn’t that more of a midnight thing
warm topaz
Like if I was Champion actually inside Azeroth, I'd be all up in Jaina's face go...
can a mage make a portal to an unknown but concrete location?
upper pasture
wasn't there a whole quest chain that explored that in TWW?
pulsar minnow
Yep
deep pawn
can a mage make a portal to an unknown but concrete location?
Oculeth has absolutely done it off calculations alone.
pulsar minnow
He used a flower combined with his knowledge of where to go but then died
deep pawn
Jaina can likely do it from memory extraction.
pulsar minnow
And there’s no more Arathi mages left
warm topaz
He used a flower combined with his knowledge of where to go but then died
I did it yesterday with my alter yeah lol
deep pawn
But like the Lightforged ship, it's powers that exist, but aren't being used for "reasons"
upper pasture
what lightforged ship?
deep pawn
The one that skipped the entirety of BfA. 😄
dense plover
Is story mode this week or next week?
upper pasture
the one we used in legion?
deep pawn
next week.
upper pasture
next week
dense plover
Damn
warm topaz
the one we used in legion?
yes
deep pawn
the one we used in legion?
I forget the exact name, too many -dars
upper pasture
isn't it "in lore" gone?
deep pawn
No?
pulsar minnow
I’m gonna be honest I really don’t think the Vindicaar is this sort of insane nuclear silo that people hype it up to be
deep pawn
It's the home base of the Lightforged Army now on Azeroth
deep pawn
I’m gonna be honest I really don’t think the Vindicaar is this sort of insane nu...
it's still got an insanely powerful laser weapon
pulsar minnow
it's still got an insanely powerful laser weapon
Yes and the horde has a massive effing cannon
Jaina raised a boat in the air and launched all cannons at once
Like it’s ultimately not that special
deep pawn
That was also used as a "Why didn't the Alliance just stomp the Horde in BfA"
pulsar minnow
It wouldn’t have changed the outcome of the story
glass flicker
Hmm. Call me a spattering scatterbrain, but nobody checked Gallywix's body, did they? Gazlowe just went "let's get outta here"
Are we sure he's dead? He was lying next to his mech before we cut to good ol' ethereal man.
deep pawn
He's gone for good.
It's classic "hubris gets you in the end when the good guys were gonna let him live."
elfin eagle
Nah he he’s not dead imo
glass flicker
Didn't see any blood, either. Commonly, when you get crushed to death, you leave a pile of gore.
pulsar minnow
Well wow doesn’t tend to really show gore
deep pawn
But yeah, the fact we haven't opened a portal to the Arathi Empire yet feels like a "WHY, we need allies!"
glass flicker
He wasn't even under his mech by the end of the cinematic.
elfin eagle
That shot is too ambiguous at the end, it could reveal him coming back in the form of a certain dreadlord
deep pawn
He wasn't even under his mech by the end of the cinematic.
The explosion as the mech fell over killed him is the implication.
pulsar minnow
There’s not really a story left to tell with Gallywix. Why would they keep him alive
He’s dead yall
deep pawn
But yeah, WoW is rated T, not M. We're not gonna get a burned carcass for one shot.
glass flicker
I would've bought him being dead if his arm or legs were poking out from under the mech at the end.
But no, he's just lying next to it.
deep pawn
sucks that the skip requires you to kill Gallywix haha
Oh well next week all my alts get to craft a weapon
pulsar minnow
Had a thought about this
If that is K’aresh- it looks like the world soul is there but just corrupted
The Dark Heart has the ability to absorb and extract magic
Maybe the ethereals are looking to rip the void from their world soul and restore it
glass flicker
That's a good theory.
pulsar minnow
Not entirely sure why Dimensius never just ate the thing but that’s probably going to be figured out in 11.2.
As long as it means more Locus Walker I’m happy. I love the guy
glass flicker
Maybe he simply found the worldsoul of K'aresh and went "ok found a titan, gotta preserve it and corrupt it, no eating"
pulsar minnow
Well. If we’re going off the idea that World Souls aren’t inherently titans as has been suggested heavily in this expansion. He’s probably just making another void lord in K’aresh
Hell, maybe this is what Xal wants to use to create a new body for herself
upper pasture
She definitely didn’t want the ethereals to have it
deep pawn
which is interesting because Alleria could tell by voice alone that these Ethereals are void sworn
uncut vault
Ethereals just felt more relevant to Midnight to me, so I'm just not overly exci...
I have a feeling this is the result of the original plan for TWW as a standalone xpac like usual, before Metzen came back and roped it into the Worldsoul Saga
The story can be tweaked, but the art assets are made well in advance and can’t really be pivoted from
K’aresh as the finale of “the” void xpac in the pre-Metzen plan makes sense
Even if it feels awkward now that we know what comes next
sullen dawn
Even if it feels awkward now that we know what comes next
Imo it all always made a lot of sense tk have k'aresh before midnight. We dont really know much about the (non old god) void, all things considered. K'aresh is the opportunity to give us some context of what theyre about before we face off against them in midnight
Going into legion we knew significantly more about sargeras, demons etc..than we currently doing about the void. So seeing the result of what they did to a planet first hand will be significant in terms of building a serious sense of urgency when they come for azeroth in midnight
K'aresh could act as a major lore feeder. The ethereals likely have huge amounts of knowledge about the cosmos
And in terms of pacing/overlap with midnight, its not all that different to what happened between the end of WoD into legion
uncut vault
Imo it all always made a lot of sense tk have k'aresh before midnight. We dont r...
See, blizz has said that they typically want to avoid this haha
The big issue they had with MoP into WoD was orc fatigue, so they hard pivoted to demons
Which in turn set in demon fatigue, so they consolidated their plans for legion
sullen dawn
See, blizz has said that they typically want to *avoid* this haha
Not knowing much about the enemy? Ya I know haha, jailer was the big oopsie. Im just saying, I think karesh could help build ip the void kn a more detailed and meaningful way
Because right now, theyre just spooky shadow people. We know about the old gods sure, but in terms of void void, their motives and structure are completely unknown outside of "we want void titan"
deep pawn
See, blizz has said that they typically want to *avoid* this haha
Karesh also kills my dream of going inside the void I think for the final tier of midnight
Karesh being INSIDE the void would have been so much cooler as we jump through the Sunwell.
There's no way in hell we are gonna do purple end patches two expansions in a row so what the hell will be the midnight finale be then
Watch Midnight finale just be the Emperor
Which fine, I can see why it'd work, Light and fire after a year of darkness, but ugh, he's less exciting than sealing the void forever.
sullen dawn
Karesh also kills my dream of going inside the void I think for the final tier o...
I dont think so. Inside the void could be completely different than what we expect
deep pawn
eh, not as different as that though.
sullen dawn
Well karesh could be netherstorm on steroids
Void realm might not actually be purple, if that's more the representation of void in our material reality
They could go full "nightmare logic" for a void plane
Use more muted colours
lean yew
I’m excited to see how the visions of nzoth play into all of this.
She doesn’t have the dark heart but we’re getting them unless it’s not related to xalatath
deep pawn
Nightfall is likely related to Beledar.
Perhaps the Ethereals finish what she started as a distraction
tropic trail
I will one day laugh when people realize that void and light belong to literally the same cosmic being. 😌
I wait now. Next raid gonna be interesting. Hehe 😂
patent dragon
titans = bad 
warm topaz
thoughts on 11.1.5 info today?
sullen dawn
thoughts on 11.1.5 info today?
Probably tomorrow, but anythings possible
silent urchin
Thursday would be the more traditional day, but often it seems to just be "when its ready"
pulsar minnow
I really wonder if we’ll see Anduin in the next patch since he’s been completely sidelined in 11.1. K’aresh feels like it would be very Locus Walker/Alleria focused so I don’t really know how he’d fit in either.
I say this but then there’s also thrall who may as well just be that skeleton at the bottom of the pool meme
silent urchin
well there's the post
Seems a bit.. underwhelming? I guess there's gonna be more story too, that's not mentioned yet
more arathi/sureki stuff feels weird
pulsar minnow
Really excited to see what the cooldown manager is
Sounds almost like weakauras?
Bit disappointed they didn’t make new horrific visions in like Dornogal or Hallowfall
deep pawn
I had more hopes about the story in this patch lol
Nightfall sounded just a lot more important than just the Sureki
silent urchin
they never preview the story in these posts
So maybe there's more than just going back and doing a proper end to 11.0
tulip sun
Seems a bit.. underwhelming? I guess there's gonna be more story too, that's not...
I hope there's something
tulip sun
I really wonder if we’ll see Anduin in the next patch since he’s been completely...
Anduin already kind of went through a decent story arc.
pulsar minnow
Anduin already kind of went through a decent story arc.
He did, but he’s one of the main protagonists of the story. It’s just weird to not have him at least standing somewhere in the background
tulip sun
He did, but he’s one of the main protagonists of the story. It’s just weird to n...
He can take a back seat while others get their story.
Like Thrall.
pulsar minnow
I don’t think any character should be treated how thrall is right now 💀
Point is, it’s weird that you promote characters like Thrall, Alleria, Anduin, etc… and they just don’t show up in this patch at all (bar Alleria of course).
At least having thrall in this patch woulda been nice considering it’s about goblins and Gallywix - frankly one of his other big mistakes
uncut vault
I think Alleria's been used well
her initial arc is over, she's not in need of more development just yet
but she's still present, she sends us to investigate follow-up stories from the base xpac, she shows up when her skills are relevant to Undermine
More characters need to be used like that
ember blaze
where the hell is wrathion 😡
silent urchin
where the hell is whoevers going to translate our obsidian tome from like 10.0.7
patent dragon
hopefully Dagran, soon (tm)
silent urchin
huh, there's two stay a while and listens in the hotel lobby
I swear they weren't there yesterday
Definitely require raid/story completion but I did those and didn't see these
glass fulcrum
Definitely require raid/story completion but I did those and didn't see these
its after gallywix turnin iirc
silent urchin
maybe it just needed a relog or something, or I'm just blind
silent urchin
oh, first 11.1.7 vendor build
deep pawn
I think August too. No, the raid renown track puts a hard minimum to this season.
Like a minimum of 19 weeks
And I still don't see them ending the raid right after
warm topaz
May for 11.1.5 and July for 11.1.7
warm topaz
yeah I was about to say that
deep pawn
April, June, August is my guess
There's some people who swear 11.2 is in July though which feels weird
Gamescom is 8/20-24 which if they want us to see the end of the 11.2 raid before the reveal would require the patch to be 8/12
Which, is exactly 24 weeks from 11.1
8/5 if they want story mode out
ember blaze
WHERE IS TINKER/BARD
glass flicker
Never gonna happen.
deep pawn
Yeah, August patch and gamescom reveal can absolutely happen
sullen dawn
WHERE IS TINKER/BARD
TLT
I think they'll go with name Artificer, to make it more race agnostic. Even though id prefer it be called Tinker
deep pawn
So long as I get my radiant song bard.
ionic terrace
11.1.5 bild out
silent urchin
damn, seems late.
warm topaz
really late yeah
ionic terrace
lol
silent urchin
childrens week starts april 28th so I guess patch before that
horrific visions marked as one day on may 21st?
Maybe that's just when it starts
nightfall seems to be a once/hour event
seems active maybe
quest for the flame radiance outside the dornogal inn as well
warm topaz
Winds of Fortune and Season 2 Updates, curious about those
warm topaz
the notes said the event is still in development so keep that in mind
Nightfall I mean
upper pasture
isn't winds of fortune just the exp bonus?
deep pawn
oh nice, deaths don't matter in 2s and 3s now
deep pawn
oooo
deep pawn
40k mementos, I'm gonna have to check my BfA mains
deep pawn
booooo
silent urchin
can also get weapons, up to hero tier
I think those are rewards, one for killing mobs, elites, and then bosses
seems the same
deep pawn
only change would be the 3 new masks
deep pawn
the bluepost said 3 new masks
silent urchin
Ah, they are then
seemed the same, although with no upgrades I didn't see much
and this is a char taht had maxed them before
killed a few mobs then thrall
vet chestpiece
ionic terrace
deep pawn
we seirously gotta regrind that
silent urchin
somewhat simplified. Middle is sanity drain, left is damage and one time free res, right is max sanity
also timegated (although only week 2, maybe that's doing both org and stormwind)
costs scale like the previous version, 20, 100, 300 mementos
ionic terrace
silent urchin
arathi thing has champ gear and some cosmetic stuff
silent urchin
oh, khaz algar getting flame wardens for midsummer
ionic terrace
can use orb during combat but less effective
silent urchin
6 you say 🤔
wait
uhh
I meant to take a new screenshot, there's 8
follow up story I guess
warm topaz
warm topaz
https://www.wowhead.com/es/news/recolored-arathi-hallowfall-rewards-potential-ni...
love this colors
warm topaz
follow up story I guess
cool!
silent urchin
both are, actually
hold up, CUSTOMISABLE BATTLE PETS?
oh no new childrens week pets
silent urchin
quite likely
deep pawn
So the warrior icons must be part of their visuals rework
ionic terrace
silent urchin
quite a lot of new mounts
warm topaz
quite likely
have you tried the new CD tracke?
silent urchin
no
deep pawn
I guess the warlock icons is for Diabolist to track which is next.
silent urchin
I saw people talking about it though
oh the turtle shell back pieces are finally items
silent urchin
a non sha version of the transmog from the mop classic items?
oh my
they're all here :D
warm topaz
https://www.wowhead.com/es/news/bfa-corruption-effects-return-as-new-enchants-in-patch-11-1-5-375650
silent urchin
amazed we didn't have recruit yet
deep pawn
oh, I figured they'd be currency, crafted I guess works
silent urchin
seems like you get some pretty powerful buffs from the leveling bags
deep pawn
pity I've levelled everything
Still pricey
actually less dust depending on how common the residue is
silent urchin
guild renaming limited to once a year, but also has a refund period
also costs gold
not sure how much
deep pawn
so the weapons requiring the achieve likely is char bound
I need
waiting for the database to come up so I can see RPPM on the enchants
silent urchin
https://www.wowhead.com/ptr/item=237379/ensemble-stormstouts-collection yup, non-sha version of stormstouts gear, missing the hat tho
deep pawn
hat was from remix is maybe their thought
Dang it, the spell effect doesn't state it's proc rate
silent urchin
Given the sha version was cash shop, making the better version not cash shop would be a bit weird
4 colors
silent urchin
4 new orphans for children's week: Kitzy, Theadis, Destien and Skibbles
last one seems like a kobold but no idea about the rest
maybe a goblin
patent dragon
mereldar has an orphanage, maybe there too?
glass fulcrum
Looks great
glass fulcrum
Looks great
I really like the everforged plate (crafted gear from s1) since it’s black and red and the cloth version never had a black version
glass fulcrum
Ngl wouldn’t be surprised if it’s store based
deep pawn
I'm gonna guess Destien is Arathi, Theadis will be a weaverat
silent urchin
quite likely
because the pet is called Threadis
https://www.wowhead.com/ptr/item=241193/threadiss-survey-bot-2-0 cat is probably placeholder
deep pawn
EARS
glad i stockpiled tender
deep pawn
oh no
silent urchin
oh, there's also a currency for childrens week, but no idea what for
zealous sedge
Wow I can’t believe we are already seeing 11.1.5 updates
Or info I mean
Dastardly Duos sounds cool. I didn’t play BfA so horrific visions will be new for me but I’ve heard great things
I’m assuming this is trading post but still awesome either way. Not sure if this is a unique model or recolors?
dense plover
actually might be from the duos thing
if it was trading post, that wouldve been what wowhead said in the newspost
zealous sedge
Oh I didn’t see that post. Lots of news to sort through
deep pawn
they're a reskin of the WoD Wyvern skeleton.
I guess maybe new model, but I always go for skeleton/animations for that.
glass fulcrum
What duos thing?
glass fulcrum
Oh right right I remember
dense plover
I guess maybe new model, but I always go for skeleton/animations for that.
new skeletons are far less common
most of the recent mounts arent new skeletons
deep pawn
I had hoped a bit for a big surprise for 11.1.5 like 10.1.5 but I'll live this time.
Especially since they're on a strict timeline
ember blaze
I had hoped a bit for a big surprise for 11.1.5 like 10.1.5 but I'll live this t...
guess no mid expac class/spec this time around 🛌
glass fulcrum
I mean excluding evoker that doesn’t really happen lol
ember blaze
survival /s
silent urchin
I’m assuming this is trading post but still awesome either way. Not sure if this...
There's 4 colours of this mount. Currently PTR has two of them for 700 tender on the trading post, one that's trading post without a tender cost listed, and one that's "Promotion". This colour is https://www.wowhead.com/ptr/item=238967/lavaborn-ruby-chimaera which is one of the 700 tender ones. Although it's quite common for things that are datamined as trading post to change, so this may not be how it eventually releases
harsh mason
You met him on an empty street at night, yours actions?
glass flicker
Call it a hunk of junk, point and laugh, and proceed to get disintegrated.
deep pawn
So next patch is cool in terms of collecting appearances. I think the weapon rewards are a bit late cause even the most casual of player can craft a mythic weapon on alts by the time they 6 mask a vision
A 6 masking is not the easiest thing in the world I imagine.
clear apex
foxtail cloak!
im upset this isnt 3d
glass flicker
I just wonder if we'll need to pick up Asjhira'kamas from our banks again.
I think I spelled it right?
Nope. Nope, I didn't.
Ashjra'kamas*
glass flicker
:o
glass flicker
This'll work great with the BRF warrior set and the Blackrock plate set from the garrison.
wet lark
the blue version is going to look insane in priest shadow form
clear apex
I just ask why is the belt off center. Hope that gets fixed
warm topaz
the developer of CD manager is on fire, answering every question and feedback
i love when they do that, show how much they care and want the feature to be good
deep pawn
I think it's weird that it's even possible in the system to get an infinite number of coffer keys
I don't think you can get 1000 points in a memory though
silent urchin
Not sure how the 28th april is "earlier than expected" when 8 weeks from the 11.1 release date is the 22nd april, but I guess that's why I'm not writing clickbait headlines from wowhead
deep pawn
I dunno, some people just ran with season launch vs the fact the roadmap always had the children's week updates plus Blizzard's preference for the 8 week cadence.
I think it's cool that exactly 8 weeks gets you 1.5 weeks ahead of gamescom.
I don't think they planned the schedule around the final raid cinematic coming out just before that but maybe
silent urchin
there's a lot of buffs, some sort of in-combat vehicle, and a bunch of other stuff that can make it harder
but hard to know how any of it goes together yet
ember blaze
https://x.com/MrGMYT/status/1898466272121417809
finally
warped pagoda
my toon is in the wizards place in Stormwind
deep pawn
did you speak to Chromie? Which timeline did you pick?
pulsar minnow
hope to see more of the Rush Hour Lamplighters, really cool to see they actually made Leif a lamplighter (thats a recent change right?)
deep pawn
this patch, new delve story in Skittering Breach
silent urchin
https://x.com/Warcraft/status/1899490503722500244 blizzcon in 2026
X
deep pawn
September is a weird time frame.
We'd be mid 12.1 at that point I think.
There's no way Midnight only has 2 tiers does it?
upper pasture
weren't we mid DF 10.1 during the last blizzcon?
oh no we were previewing last patch there so we were 10.2?
no wait that was 10.1. sorry it's still early lol
upper pasture
yeah
although tbf the video they used to announce it is very WoW heavy. hopefully i get tickets again for this!
harsh mason
There's no way Midnight only has 2 tiers does it?
Tier 1 for 1.5 years
deep pawn
I'm assuming a February expansion launch and an August 12.1
sullen dawn
There's no way Midnight only has 2 tiers does it?
I would consider that timing wise to be the equivelant of the warcrsft direct
harsh mason
It seems to me that Blizzard just doesn't think like that. They don't build blizzcon just for wow. Moreover, nothing prevents them from announcing the chat at all. 13.0 before the announcement of 12.2.
sullen dawn
It'll show off TLT but not to the level gamwsckm this year will midnight
harsh mason
In short, they obviously don't think the way you do.
sullen dawn
Yeh
The cadence of marketing won't be identical every expansion
TLT is probably august 2027
Maybe slightly sooner
But they can still start markeitng blizzcon 26
sullen dawn
may well be new diablo 4 or whatever stuff
D4 expansion 2 is likely revealed this gamescom/august alongside midnight deep dive
deep pawn
It just feels wrong since we won't know exactly what we did in 12.2 to make TLT happen yet.
sullen dawn
Since k believe April 2026 ks the target for d4 exp 2
sullen dawn
It just feels wrong since we won't know exactly what we did in 12.2 to make TLT ...
Has happened before, will happen again
Marketing takes precedence over story cadence
zealous sedge
It’s interesting to me how far out it was announced. Either more time to build up hype or they are going for something bigger than they’ve done in the past?
upper pasture
Is a year and a half all that far out for stuff that a lot of people travel across the globe for?
zealous sedge
That’s a fair point. I feel like in the past they’ve announced it like 9-10 months out. Could be wrong about that though
Or maybe I’m just confusing that with ticket sale date
upper pasture
I could see digital always being short notice but in person event needs to be at least a year for something that people come from all over for
sullen dawn
That’s a fair point. I feel like in the past they’ve announced it like 9-10 mont...
I think the announcement does the next blizzcon uses to be as the show ended, so basically 12 months in advance
But that models obviously been scuffed since lockdown
zealous sedge
I think it might also help devs plan out their reveals. I bet in the past it’s like a second job trying to put together their decks. I work in hospitality/ events and even large conferences like this don’t get booked out 18 months ahead. Usually 9-12 months is standard.
deep pawn
A September Blizzcon is just unusual in general.
clear apex
arent they almost always in november?
warm topaz
arent they almost always in november?
yes
patent dragon
considering they skipped a year with no event held in the con center, they might have lost their contracted dates (a lot of cons cancelled during covid did too) and were forced to pick lesser desired dates 
deep pawn
nah, they literally just had a blizzcon in november for the world soul saga reveal.
patent dragon
nah, they literally just had a blizzcon in november for the world soul saga reve...
this year?
none this year would break contract
deep pawn
They've been alternating years since they didn't have enough to carry a Blizzcon every year.
patent dragon
then yea, they got stuck with whatever dates were leftover from larger term contracts
deep pawn
Guess they had no issues getting it in 2023
patent dragon
a lot of events lost their dates in 2021-2023
(my job revolves around conventions 
)
deep pawn
wikipedia is weird in saying that 2024 and 2025 blizzcons were "cancelled"
patent dragon
i havnt been following blizzcon dates for a hot minute, i thought only this years was being skipped for the anniv tour
oh
so they hardcore broke contract
might be sept for a few years in a row
not so bad as long as it doesnt overlap dragoncon, avoid the holiday price increase for travels
silent urchin
is that a 10k object limit 👀
although I imagine that's a dev thing and hasn't been fixed yet
upper pasture
Idk, if we’re placing individual books 10k seems reasonable
deep pawn
as someone who's tried ff14's housing placement stuff, WoW is gonna make the actual design work a lot easier, but will have less "hacks" than 14
actually, advanced has the hacks, my bad
This is actually... nuts. They definitely decided "We can do it better than our competitors"
zealous sedge
The customization UI and flexibility of the system seem awesome. Really like how they used videos to show that off.
I also really enjoyed when they were moving the window feature the light physics moved with it and reflected off the different textures. That may be limited to ray tracing but still a nice touch.
Also I think the Dye system is really important. Might be able to adapt it to future transmog later? Think it’s pretty hard to implement a dye system to all existing gear because of tech limitation/ sheer amount of rework, but new gear might be able to work with it.
deep pawn
I mean it's just preset colors but yeah
clear apex
Oh the housing is better than i expected. It uses the sims style plus how gw2/ ever quest 2 does with sizing
The dye system was unexpected but cool since sims 2-3 had similar
And being able to make rooms is fantastic
Advanced and basic mode was a good choice
zealous sedge
The note they made about exteriors is excitng too. You can have a small little house with 12 rooms or a big mansion with 1 room.
clear apex
The sizing objects i didn't really expect.
They took note from ESO and the parent object to move multiple items.
I love everything about this
Not having to pay for dyes like ff14 is a nice touch
zealous sedge
I thought the part where you can put objects through walls felt a little immersion breaking but at the same time you could do a lot of cool things with it. Have a portal themed mirror/ window on the wall and want half of the table to disappear into it? Sure, why not?
untold fox
You will definitely have people making giga cool stuff with it , it is awesome that they want to give us that feature as well
I think that the closest thing to that would be the same option in sims4 , where people combine many small objects to create an entire different thing , and there are people who are really skilled at that
zealous sedge
Oh yeah there will definitely be tons of guides and hacks to make some really cool stuff
untold fox
I wonder how many content creators will arise who focus primarily on building , this is already more than most of other games
yeah that is what I mean
zealous sedge
I would bet more than a handful will. Especially at the onset
Whether we see housing in Alpha or PTR people are gonna be all over it
clear apex
I think that the closest thing to that would be the same option in sims4 , where...
ESO has been doing this for years as well!
untold fox
I have no idea how servers work but if the limit on objects is high then I just hope that they find a way to prevent people from placing the maximum number of objects just to grief , and that those people will not cause them to reduce the maximum number
that is really my only concern , but hopefully they will deal with that
clear apex
House interiors in every mmo are instanced
The only worry and hard limit might be exteriors
untold fox
Yeah but I doubt that they would double the cost of servers just for player housing
clear apex
Think about how much stuff is inside a delve or dungeon
Delves and garrisons are single per player
I'm not trying to downplay your worry. I only think they got it figured out since WoD
deep pawn
wall clipping is a huge part of design
clear apex
multistory housing?
hard pagoda
few topics to discuss:
- Lumberjacking and Carpentry professions
- IDOC system (a house is In Danger of Collapsing so items inside would drop to ground for players to loot) for players with War Mode on
I also hoped for exterior custom designs, it could create totally new Transmog system
what Im very happy that they did a grid system there literally so the possibilities are literally endless now
and it should be also made somehow guild-wise the bigger the plots are, that would be so nice
different level access for members
I played Ultima Online back in days and the Housing system was so perfect in that
and from that news it looks like WoW has every possible element to make it happen
dense plover
I think they’re going to integrate existing professions, not make new ones
clear apex
In the forum somsone asked about maybe cooking able to create food items as decor, Id really like that.
little hound
few topics to discuss:
- Lumberjacking and Carpentry professions
- IDOC system (...
doubt housing will involve any form ov PvP
deep pawn
Oh I'm sure there'll be some trophy items that you can get from pvp
clear apex
Leatherworking could create leather items and some metal/scale (since they do mail armor)
JC for statues, delicate metal, gems
Metal items from BSing (candle holders, chandeliers, etc)
Cooking for food
Herb for flower decor
Inscription for books and scrolls
Leatherworking also deals in making guns/bows, so maybe they deal with some of the woodworked items
hard pagoda
doubt housing will involve any form ov PvP
could be possible though but ye true
housing would create pointless instances into server though if not used
clear apex
It's a neutral zone since opposing factions can be there
And the amount of people that would want a full loot pvp thing would likely be so low that they wouldnt bother
hard pagoda
And the amount of people that would want a full loot pvp thing would likely be s...
yeah but if he plot had very rare items in there, it would make world pvp great again
upper pasture
i doubt it
hard pagoda
although another issue would be at certain guilds making it so coordinated and few players would become so rich
but it was hectic fun in UO 😄
clear apex
You mean, you want to be able to fight someone over items they had crafted or found?
highly doubt that will happen, that would not work well for people who might not be able to play for a long time.
hard pagoda
You mean, you want to be able to fight someone over items they had crafted or fo...
yeah if the player is about to quit or such, IDOC phasing took like from several months to get into that IDOC phase
clear apex
Theyre not doing that
hard pagoda
ye
upper pasture
blizzard will never do that
hard pagoda
could be fun with War Mode on :d
clear apex
already said theyre not doing the ff14 thing of house demo
hard pagoda
roger that
in Ultima Online we had like +10 PvP guilds fighting over the loot and the world pvp got pretty hectic due to that
little hound
already said theyre not doing the ff14 thing of house demo
The small preview we just got is already 20 times better than FFXIV's housing offers 😄
clear apex
I agree entirely
I played a ton of Elder scrolls online and this is very similar, though more free with the dye system, windows, rooms
little hound
I sincerely HOPE That since we can dye Furnitures and other housing items, they'll allow to Dye armors soon. I somehow doubt due to many Raid/PvP Armors having recolors but yeah.
clear apex
the dye system is pretty much exactly like Sims 2 with choices of the wood color then bed color
oh me too
maybe the newer armors this expac have that ability just hasnt been shown yet?
or at least Midnight ones could
deep pawn
"Customizable armor colors" would be a massive selling point
even if it's just recolors
clear apex
if it were the metal/cloth/leather changes and even just 2-3 channels that would be cool
upper pasture
honestly i'd rather we lfr/normal set and a heroic/mythic set and have them all be dyeable. sorta like the legion sets were different for the higher difficulties so we can have like lfr/normal be the same then say a different set for heroic and mythic (and let mythic have a flair like it has now) then just let us dye them whatever colors
we can still unlock the flair for the other sets in M+/mythic raid.
clear apex
that would feel a little unfair for people who dont enjoy raiding
upper pasture
why? you can get the tier sets from delves and cata all in solo now?
clear apex
Could still limit cool effects to higher tier sets
upper pasture
you can just do T8s delves every week and get 3 chances at tier and catalyst loot all season
if anything getting the higher appearances are easier than ever before
plus T8 bountiful delve maps give a hero track piece too (AND gilded crests too)
hero 6/6 is obtainable by literally nearly all level of skill players
deep pawn
I plan to have at least one character that's all 675 loot except for tier and trinkets from delves alone
deep pawn
Absolutely can from gilded crests
upper pasture
max hero is 665
deep pawn
And crafted is 675
I'm counting the crests as delve loot cause some of my chars will only do delves haha
upper pasture
so crafted gear not delve gear
deep pawn
But I'm getting it from doing delves only
So it's technically delve loot to me haha
Being able to hit 670 ilvl completely solo will be fun to me.
Only issue is that the only grindable source of crests is m+
upper pasture
being able to get all the appearances completely solo is crazy good.
deep pawn
Well you already could, it's just faster now
upper pasture
didn't you need 15 gilded to reach the mythic color?
deep pawn
You could trade up crests
Getting 31 gilded a week though is like on par with 100+ runed so just faster
upper pasture
yeah which for most players was an insane ask. get all 4/6 hero gear THEN trade 45 into 15 gilded for one upgrade
deep pawn
I'm gonna craft so many 675 weapons next week
upper pasture
31 gilded from solo is crazy too. just do T11 delves each week. love it.
im just waiting for dinars
deep pawn
My dk got a quest bug and lost half a spark and GMs say they can't fix it
upper pasture
no reason not to have mythic BiS weapon in like 7ish weeks
deep pawn
I doubt there'll be any real fix sadly cause I'm sure there's no way to manually change the spark flags for chads the bug happens to I'm sure
I don't mythic raid and have no desire to do +10s for a while so for all my chars just crafting the 675 is by far the best thing to do next week
upper pasture
keys up to 6s are pretty much free
deep pawn
I just don't like other people
upper pasture
i'm pretty sure you bring that up anytime there is a discussion about group activities
deep pawn
I've just been soured so many times by people in this game. Me and 2 guildies pugged 2 people to do a +11 delve with, the tank decided to just run past a nemesis pack and pick up more and that wiped us cause we were trying to kill the well connected friend asap.
We just 3 manned it after but it just reinforced my dislike of other people when I can do something solo.
I've done a single key this season and we timed it but people still got snippy I didn't know the route for floodgate first go
ember blaze
I've done a single key this season and we timed it but people still got snippy I...
some people are psychos yeah, specially being like that first week
i had some warlock leave our 10 halfway through a damn ToP after calling the tank bad
deep pawn
it was my key and I was tanking so they didn't fuss too much, they just wanted the trinket and I got it.
ember blaze
like dude, we're here for vaults first week, stfu and finish the key
deep pawn
Losing all your lives to one wipe in delves while grouped is so stupid
warm topaz
new PTR build!
upper pasture
Yup, I’m hopeful it’s their testing bed for dye able armor in the future
silent urchin
it seems likely. There's also the whole crab colour stuff going on this patch
there's like 10 colours for crabs and 10 colours for bombs and then all the combinations can occur dynamically
Can't see anything really that notable in this PTR build. There's a bit of tidying up of rewards we already saw
deep pawn
Watch them also cull lfr or normal mode in midnight
silent urchin
new stuff from the orphans, I guess this is gonna be the pet items? Not entirely clear
dense plover
i mean, the animation updates might be neat
deep pawn
Warriors getting another visual rework when Hunters have nothing sucks
If armor is gonna be customizable it removes a need for 4 recolors to actually drop
silent urchin
the new void panther JC mount was updated to say components are from visions but that seems like it's just a clarification rather than a change
wait
Are we FINALLY getting these as appearances
dense plover
Warriors getting another visual rework when Hunters have nothing sucks
theyre fixing what they ruined
silent urchin
last mask got a description
deep pawn
theyre fixing what they ruined
Oh, all the new icons made me think warriors were getting a full visual rework again
silent urchin
different splash screen now
upper pasture
If armor is gonna be customizable it removes a need for 4 recolors to actually d...
Yup, which is why early I pitched the idea of a lfr/normal set then a different set for heroic and mythic (with the flair) sorta like legion sets were
upper pasture
Give me the TL:DR
warm topaz
just open the link lol
upper pasture
(I know, I read it like 10 mins ago)
deep pawn
This patch feels kinda small but housing clearly is taking a massive amount of dev time.
I think housing will be worth it but I'm definitely feeling a little pain.
clear apex
Yup, which is why early I pitched the idea of a lfr/normal set then a *different...
Oh that's how you meant it
I think i got confused and thought you meant that that the more special an item the more you could dye it
I don't always comprehend how things get written
Dye parts like maybe lfr/ normal you could only dye small areas, etc with mythic being fully dyeable
I didn't compute the whole lower tier sets looked totally different sometimes
upper pasture
Naw, let them all be fully dyeable. Just make 2 different sets for the 4 difficulties
clear apex
Ye that sounds fine. My bad
upper pasture
Could even go with 2 sets one basic then one with a flair for each of them so set 1 (lfr) set 1 with flair (normal), set 2 (heroic) set 2 with flair (mythic)
deep pawn
Woo, blizzard confirmation of the enchants
Also, blizzard, you have an easy solution, helm or neck
Both have been traditional slots for weird effects
Gods I miss Satyr neck enchant
upper pasture
They could just let them be slapped on trinkets too
deep pawn
As in gear? Rather not
upper pasture
As an X.X.5 patch gimmick system, I’d feel it would be better to add that than choose between enchants or corruptions
deep pawn
We already have an answer, helm or neck enchants
Since it's supposed to be a mid season power spike
upper pasture
i mean sure, but what if they want us to have access to more than 3 corruptions at a single given time?
deep pawn
I have to imagine the intent was just one
upper pasture
"what if"
deep pawn
As in I would have absolutely supported a unique equip as a weapon enchant even
upper pasture
DKs say hello
deep pawn
These enchants seem pretty damn powerful, why even consider having 3
DKs are why this is moving off weapons to another slot or an embellishments
ember blaze
These enchants seem pretty damn powerful, why even consider having 3
because they were fun
it's also a way to nerf content
what sucks tho is the limited ones they chose
deep pawn
which one is missing that you want that wouldn't be balancing hell?
ember blaze
which one is missing that you want that wouldn't be balancing hell?
cdr
deep pawn
that's balancing hell
glass flicker
"Come on Twilight Devastation, please proc at least once on this AoE pull!" - me back in BfA.
rain cave
as goofy and terrible for balancing as corruptions were
they were also a LOT of fun
to the point where I think it would be funny if we had some area of the game we could use them
honestly if I was a designer at blizz I'd think about trying to implement a hero spec for a lot of classes to use corruptions
as like void versions of that class
but for midnight
or maybe even implementing some of the corruptions onto tier set bonuses in midnight lmao
I think the fun that I liked with corruptions is that it enabled builcrafting like we've not seen before
fire mages could stack tons of haste or mastery for very different playstyles
deep pawn
But yeah, Ineffable Truth should stay dead
ember blaze
100% those will be used in classic +
isnt sod literally classic+
warm topaz
i do think is classic + kinda
but they're working on something else which is probably more + than SoD
if that makes sense
they have said it multiple times
or maybe not more, but different
Aggrend talk about it two weeks ago, if anyone is curious
little hound
I wish i cared for SoD, sadly i have 0 motivation for it. I think its just my classic nostalgia thats died.
warm topaz
i'm actually so excited for the posibility of them adding new music to the Scarlet Cruzade raid
like brand new, not a not used one
deep pawn
I enjoyed the first two phases
Phase 3 was just not good though
They should have just stuck with 10m raiding
deep pawn
Oh how she dies eh?
glass fulcrum
Thats actually really cool
dense plover
like brand new, not a not used one
i dont see that happening
i could see them backporting something from newer wow
but composing also means recording and bringing in an orchestra
glass flicker
Lilian Voss as a SoD boss, right? I can't see her suddenly turning evil in Retail.
sullen dawn
Lilian Voss as a SoD boss, right? I can't see her suddenly turning evil in Retai...
Yes
I think she's still a human
tropic trail
Turning evil how? She is undead.
formal tangle
not until cataclysm when the zones were revamped
sullen dawn
Turning evil how? She is undead.
This is set pre-cataclysm. Im pretty sure she was introduced as an undead in the cataclysm undead starting zone
silent urchin
Yeah, she was freshly undead at the time, one of the ones you help understand what happened
was part of the scarlet crusade prior to that
tropic trail
This is set pre-cataclysm. Im pretty sure she was introduced as an undead in the...
Oh so she is still alive back then, nice.
glass flicker
Turning evil how? She is undead.
As far as the Undead are concerned, Lilian Voss and Calia Menethil are probably the most lawful good ones.
harsh mason
I mean, discovery season is vanilla's time, so she's not alive back, she's... just alive in her own time.
rain cave
As far as the Undead are concerned, Lilian Voss and Calia Menethil are probably ...
alonsus faol
hollow skiff
Is it known how many item we can buy with dinar with next patch? again 3?
upper pasture
i think it's 4?
there hasn't been any real information about it since it got pulled from the 11.1 patch
hollow skiff
okay thx 🙂
deep pawn
was 2 on the renown track and low low chance for more
upper lantern
Any guesses on when can we expect info on 11.2?
It's looking like an Ethereal patch
upper pasture
Probably in June?
upper lantern
Yeah I figured we could see PTR and stuff sooner but sounds about right
upper pasture
no. patch not in june likely ptr info in june lol
deep pawn
Late April for 11.1.5, Mid June for 11.1.7 and 11.2 ptr up around then.
I think 11.2 goes live mid August
sullen dawn
Yep then gamescom with midnight deep dive in august too and midnight alpha soon after
tropic trail
Ethereal allied race 😂
deep pawn
I still don't like getting ethereal after we were denied Kyrians and Fae.
tropic trail
Yea I wanted them too actually
But it’s understandable cause they are on the different side kinda
sullen dawn
I still don't like getting ethereal after we were denied Kyrians and Fae.
Those races are dumb tbh
There's huge demand for Ethereals
deep pawn
Unless they somehow get more normal bodies and faces, I'd rather not see them as playable. They don't feel mortal enough if Kyrian weren't.
Naga, Ogres, others that have actual stakes in the survival of Azeroth should come first.
I think we got some extra models just to fill out the next raid/delves/dungeons were gonna get in 11.2 more so than being playable.
deep pawn
I still think we get Haranir first then Naga in Midnight
rain cave
I think the reason we'd get ethereals is because we're tackling their story now. So if there was a time they would join us it is now
I'm curious what's going to happen to karesh next patch
Does the void ethereal want to try repairing the planet? Void against void, fight fire with fire?
If they become a playable things aren't looking good for what remains of their home
Since if it was repaired why would they join us
deep pawn
It is now or never, but I hope never. They feel too alien. They aren't even really alive anymore just energy barely held together. Draenei and Orcs are less alien.
warm topaz
It is now or never, but I hope never. They feel too alien. They aren't even real...
do people think that ethereals will be playable at some point?
deep pawn
Yeah
pulsar minnow
Well Ethereals have been around in WoW since TBC
At this point they’re not really “alien.” They’ve been around us in every single expansion in some shape and form every single time
(Mainly transmogrifiers) but they still have a presence
As someone who was a huge Kyrian fan and wanted to play as one so badly during Shadowlands, in retrospect it would not have been a good idea. The Kyrian and Fae have a conflict of interest with their whole duty to the shadowlands as well as just the negative connotation that comes with that
deep pawn
They are still an alien experience in a way no other race is
pulsar minnow
They’re made of magic
That’s their entire appeal
To revert them and give us whatever that race looks like is a really bad idea
Because it’s not what players asked for when they say “I want to play an ethereal”
I really don’t think they’re an outrageous ask especially when we have people made of rocks running around now
sullen dawn
It is now or never, but I hope never. They feel too alien. They aren't even real...
Most people want them
deep pawn
You're assuming. I doubt they'd win a poll over Ogres and Naga
deep pawn
I really don’t think they’re an outrageous ask especially when we have people ma...
I still don't buy them having stakes saving Azeroth. I'd have bought the Shadowlands peoples joining up against the first ones more .
pulsar minnow
You're assuming. I doubt they'd win a poll over Ogres and Naga
They’re all in the same boat
These 3 are by far the most requested playable races behind high elves (which are basically in the game now)
pulsar minnow
I still don't buy them having stakes saving Azeroth. I'd have bought the Shadowl...
Ethereals don’t like Xal’Atath.
We don’t like Xal’Atath.
Join our ranks and stay if you want
deep pawn
Maybe we get them they just don't feel like they fit as a playable race in the current line up without massive lore and something to tie them to Azeroth directly like every other race.
Xal stops being a threat in 4 patches
pulsar minnow
Yeah and the legion stopped being a threat in 3 but we still have Demon Hunters
Like it is totally doable and we have an entire patch on K’aresh to make it work
deep pawn
And it's literally a plot point thread they feel aimless and adrift. They're still Azerothians
pulsar minnow
And vice versa the ethereals are aimless and adrift right now. Rallying behind the Prime World Soul after losing theirs to the void is a plenty good reason
deep pawn
I pray we don't go to Karesh cause there's no way it lives up to Argus now that we've seen it. I hope the zone is still Rootlands.
pulsar minnow
Also dealing with the Arcane/Titans is pretty relevant to them too
Considering their entire bodies are composed of it
deep pawn
Rootlands and Haranir just feels like a better place to go, let Ethereals be the enemy but not have us spend a patch in Karesh the way it looks now.
sullen dawn
You're assuming. I doubt they'd win a poll over Ogres and Naga
Its not an assumption, we've heard it demanded for years. Plus I never said theyre wanted more than ogres or nagas
sullen dawn
I pray we don't go to Karesh cause there's no way it lives up to Argus now that ...
Ewww thats a horrible taste imo. Rootlands would be such a disappointment. K'aresh would be peak
Since the expansion was revealed I was hoping for undermine and k'aresh, so I would be very happy if it was 2 for 2
Hopefully the harronir stuff is just cut content
rain cave
I pray we don't go to Karesh cause there's no way it lives up to Argus now that ...
I mean maybe they'll just leave us teased until midnight
And deal with the ethereals there
sullen dawn
Imo we need k'arssh lore to make the void feel like a bigger deal in midnight
We know next to nothing about (non old god) void
deep pawn
My dream was Karesh was in the void as a twisted version of its old self vs a deader Argus
sullen dawn
Imagine going into legion knowing the same amount about burning legion as we know about cosmic void rn
deep pawn
I could have sworn one interview or another said this expansion was focused underground exploring those stories which is why an Ethereal raid always felt weird
sullen dawn
War within not war in space
I know, but karesh serves a lot of purposes in terms of mirroring azeroths world soul, and showing us what happens if we lose in midnight
deep pawn
The teaser just disappointed me seeing Karesh. Only interesting this is the world soul isn't gone.
rain cave
The teaser just disappointed me seeing Karesh. Only interesting this is the worl...
Wdym
sullen dawn
Good point
The stuff in prepatch where locus walker talked about karesh havkng a similar "radiant song" as azeroth before it was destroyed is what made me think this way
There's still opportunity to do some harronir lore in 11.1.7, 11.2.5, or 11.2.7
rain cave
They could maybe fit them into midnight
Since trolls and elves are both relevant there
But I struggle to see them playable without a campaign setting up why they join us
pulsar minnow
Haranir are sort of like proto elves/trolls, and Metzen said that midnight would “be about uniting all the elf tribes”
sullen dawn
They could maybe fit them into midnight
For sure. They can help reconcile amani trolls and elves
rain cave
Yes
sullen dawn
Haranir are sort of like proto elves/trolls, and Metzen said that midnight would...
This
pulsar minnow
That or we might just have to wait to the Last Titan to see what’s going on in their corner of the world
sullen dawn
That or we might just have to wait to the Last Titan to see what’s going on in t...
Even though im hyped for midnight. Im supppppper hyped for TLT
pulsar minnow
There’s no way she doesn’t follow us throughout the saga, especially since she’s the new speaker. I would love to see more of her
rain cave
We riot
pulsar minnow
Even though im hyped for midnight. Im supppppper hyped for TLT
Agreed
I really want to see Renilash more than anything
sullen dawn
It could finally give us tinker/artificer
deep pawn
Naga almost certainly feature on Midnight if not being playable.
sullen dawn
Naga almost certainly feature on Midnight if not being playable.
Agreed
deep pawn
Azshara is literally waiting for Xal to pull her shot and fail.
sullen dawn
I had thought Azshara might end up being the last boss of midnight, but unsure now
pulsar minnow
I really want to see Renilash more than anything
Especially considering we might finally see a bit of the Light Pantheon in Midnight
deep pawn
My fanfic was always Azshara helps up beat the void to takeover and she promises to leave Azeroth alone while she consolidates power.
sullen dawn
Azshara has super strong links to both void story and elf unification story. Plus illidan story too if he's returning in TLT
sullen dawn
My fanfic was always Azshara helps up beat the void to takeover and she promises...
I hope we dont work with her
I have a feeling she's already consolidated a lot of power
Would be pretty cool seeing some sargeras/super azshara interactions in tlt
rain cave
I hope we dont work with her
My whole idea is that, the naga are her last link to us, they are her people and worship her. Anytime she's shown compassion it's for them
But azshara probably doesn't want that. She doesn't want to be compassionate
I see her working with us briefly and basically leaving the naga in our hands to ensure they have a future
And then leaving to follow her goals with nothing tethering her to mortals
sullen dawn
That's actually a pretty good way to take it
Because its not entirely selfless. It allows her to go "full evil" while also "saving" her people
Id expect a hardcore faction of naga to go with her tho
rain cave
Yeah probs
We've got an interesting void faction split going on though
Xal, ethereals, old gods, azshara
sullen dawn
I think the void are interintly split
Theyre pursuing so many different "paths" there's bound to be a lot more conflict
I always saw them as kind lf being like a corporate structure. Lots of deals, politics, backstabbing etc
While disorder/fel is pure lack of structure/survival of the fittest
Only sarg made that untrue for a while
rain cave
I've also had fun trying to predict what the renown tracks will be
Since we can expect 4, Yes?
Silvermoon
Amani
Naga
The undead remnants
I like the undead ones since that will give calia good room for story.
Calia would probably scare a lot of the blood elves AND undead. Seeing her react to that would be cool
And I'd hope she can end up getting the undead to join us, because her leading the undead through the scar her brother caused, to help the people he killed
Is a strong image
deep pawn
Can't let her heal it cause that would be... a choice lol.
worn crown
I DO hope next patch is Rootlands. I want to see more of the Haranir
I'm waaay more intrigued by them than by those "rule of cool" ethereals
Keep the War WITHIN, Blizz
Also, if we're going to space, give me a FULL xpac on space/another dimension like Shadowlands, which I loved and I say it out loud PROUDLY
The lore and a lot of chars from the covenants were sooo freaking great
About K'aresh, if some people thought "oh, Argus is all green" they will prob think "oh, K'aresh is all purple" 😅
dense plover
i think the ethereal stuff will come next expac
and theyre just continuing the build up
we need the rest of orweyna's story
otherwise she wouldnt be so prevalent
deep pawn
That's my feelings too, but we have the datamined ethereal raid icons
rain cave
tbf it was around this time that in DF we had iridikron leaving
and being teased for future stuff instead
deep pawn
Iridikron's fight was always against the titans though
He literally wasn't a pressing matter. Xal and the black blood is.
rain cave
yeah but the ethereals aren't then
black blood is pressing so we go help rootlands
with that
ethereals just chilling with the darkheart till midnight
deep pawn
It could be the Ethereals need Azeroth to save their world soul, and that's still a fight that can start in the Rootlands
I just feel like killing a world to try and rebirth an old world is gonna be accused of just stealing another game's story
One who absolutely will have done it better
pulsar minnow
black blood is pressing so we go help rootlands
see the problem with rootlands is that its kind of just not linked to the overall arc of TWW -> Midnight
We're in the last patch and we need to transition the story to the void invasion now
deep pawn
It is with the blood
uncut vault
tbf it was around this time that in DF we had iridikron leaving
The equivalent reveal in DF was the post-raid cinematic after Aberrus, where they celebrated having five Aspects again and then cut to “and here’s why we need it” with a big shot of Amirdrassil
deep pawn
The blood is the core of Xal's plans
uncut vault
This follows essentially the same format; happy goblins, happy ending, then a cut at the end to a big zone reveal for the next major story beat
pulsar minnow
Frankly the only thing we know about Xal's plans is that she's trying to usher in Dimensius to consume our world soul
deep pawn
Like I think Ethereals are next, I just don't want it to be Karesh
deep pawn
Frankly the only thing we know about Xal's plans is that she's trying to usher i...
We don't even know that.
Xal has a lot of bitterness from her imprisonment
pulsar minnow
deep pawn
She did it before, we have no proof that's her current plan though.
rain cave
The equivalent reveal in DF was the post-raid cinematic after Aberrus, where the...
I suppose, but also abberus was a very weird raid narratively since it wasn't main story
whereas the megadungeon WAS more main story
uncut vault
My crack theory is still that Xal’atath is the world soul of K’aresh, and us heading to the planet’s hollowed out remnants is our opportunity to properly explore her motives before Midnight
rain cave
I'm kinda convinced that at some point dawn of infinites was the original raid
uncut vault
As-is, there’s no real reason to go to k’aresh other than “oh so sad, this is what Azeroth might become if we don’t stop her”
deep pawn
I mean Undermine is barely attached to the plot either. If Gallywix didn't have to fix the heart the entire zone wouldn't matter
dense plover
That's my feelings too, but we have the datamined ethereal raid icons
delve or dungeon
i could see the ethereals using the rootlands also
maybe getting orweyna out is exactly what they need
pulsar minnow
She did it before, we have no proof that's her current plan though.
I mean I really don't know what to tell you if the walking exposition dump in the form of a dude in bandages isn't enough for you
deep pawn
They made Undermine fit the story more than Undermine was natural to the story.
dense plover
undermine wouldnt fit anywhere else tbh
we are already underground, goblins were involved
deep pawn
I mean I really don't know what to tell you if the walking exposition dump in th...
Again, yeah that's what she did there, but that was before betrayal by other void beings, imprisoned for who knows how many 10s of thousands of years. Just as important was her being excited about being brought to the seat of the pantheon and it apparently creating a foothold
uncut vault
They definitely did a better job than Zaralek lol, the relevant main plot was all in the first three chapters, and even that was mostly just relevant in terms of Fyrakk being one massive distraction
pulsar minnow
Again, yeah that's what she did there, but that was before betrayal by other voi...
the void beings that betrayed her, if any, were the old gods. Their feelings do not align with those of the Void Lords she served
The Old Gods essentially went rogue
deep pawn
Basically all we have at this point is that Xal is the ultimate survivor no matter what.
She has her own plans right now and there's nothing to say it aligns with anyone else but her.
She wants the world soul.
deep pawn
we are already underground, goblins were involved
Yeah, and they definitely did their best to make it feel included, but it still is "we want goblins here" vs "goblins need to be here"
rain cave
people forget this isn't the void expansion though
war within is not about the void story specifically
it's about what's IN azeroth, things we don't know, truths we didn't know
and our casts inner and outer turmoils
the goblin plot links directly to that since it's something that both in an in universe and meta sense is a story that has been left to stew
gazlowe refusing to go back for a long time
goblins being stuck in their stereotype ways
and this patch was about changing and exploring that
dense plover
the ethereal stuff is 100% gonna be in midnight as a full thing
theyre just starting to build it up heavily
rain cave
yeah, I still think we're on for rootlands 11.2
dense plover
rootlands is a given b/c otherwise orweyna's story deadends
deep pawn
I mean they made the goblins work, but it took more effort than a natural flow of the story.
rain cave
because otherwise orweynas story is left blank, and the black blood isn't dealt with
rain cave
I mean they made the goblins work, but it took more effort than a natural flow o...
I disagree, since the darkheart was damaged xal wanted it repaired
dark heart is a early dragon soul prototype
goblins made the dragon soul
pulsar minnow
Rootlands could very well be a dungeon as much people probably don't want it to be. Also- it could still appear in TLT.
dense plover
Rootlands could very well be a dungeon as much people probably don't want it to ...
how would that tie in to orweyna's story tho
you cant just be like - hey these guys are a new race that exist and theres something weird going on with some kind of giant tree - but also, who gives a flying fuck?
we still know way too little about the harronir for them to not be 11.2
rain cave
the harranir NEED a whole campaign story/questline
dense plover
the ethereal stuff ties into the overarching story of the entire saga
theyre not going to blow it this early
rain cave
they're isolationists and potentially linked to a whisper from nzotha/illgynoth
pulsar minnow
The invasion could begin on k'aresh and head to azeroth
rain cave
I do agree that it is a bit weird to have "elfy nature tree in danger" as a plot point for the 3rd/4th time
but I think rootlands could be different
pulsar minnow
Metzen said we're going to see the full force of the light and void clash. Everyone assumes this means the ending happens on K'aresh. Why not have it be in a realm of the light?
deep pawn
This tree predates the elves
rain cave
you get what I mean though
dense plover
i think its going to look very alien compared to a normal tree tbh
rain cave
emerald dream is all nice and prissy, rootlands could be all thorny like the quillboars aesthetic
two sides of the same coin showing nature baring its fangs
would fit well
dense plover
i dont think it will look like surface plants at all
think about the other plants we have seen underground
deep pawn
Also, there's some sad real life irony about a story of people uniting against a boss and the only good guy who dies is the one who's VA is striking for workers rights
rain cave
💀
dense plover
as one of my friends pointed out, its very likely that once the strike is over and the issue resolved, theyll record and add voice lines
they did the right thing and didnt replace him and record lines anyway
deep pawn
Til then it looks like they punished the actor by writing off his character lol
dense plover
i think that was probably already planned before the strike
otherwise they wouldve just changed him out for a new goblin
its also unlikely thats their only character in WoW
deep pawn
think about the other plants we have seen underground
A lot will also be mutated by the blood like the flowers in the 11.0.7
deep pawn
The Rootlands will likely also have the lightless ocean the Leviathan and Kobyss are from.
sullen dawn
I hope there's lots of lore books in karesh
Give us a real nice deep dive into their 'pre-ethereal" culture
pulsar minnow
I really want to see what they looked like before they got vaporized
sullen dawn
One of the few shadowlands bits I enjoyed were the deep lore artefacts in korthia
deep pawn
I just feel like we have a lot more threads to go further down than off world.
hell they're still repairing the coreway too
pulsar minnow
I really don't think K'aresh will involve us all packing into another draenei space ship and blasting off again to another planet. Abberus is still an unresolved plotline from DF and that portal to the void has been left as a giant question mark. I think that's our way to K'aresh frankly
I personally think Rootlands will be integral to the story of the Last Titan. It's heavily linked to Elune and Eonar, and for all we know is likely reaching into the Worldcore. Would also likely play into the cosmic conspiracy plot thread
Besides, we've already explored Northerend. It's going to get revamped yes, but where are the patch zones going to take us? It's either up or down. I think it's going to be down to the world soul herself, that's the perfect place to introduce the rootlands and why Orweyna is the speaker
deep pawn
I've resigned to not seeing the Manifold this expansion, and that we may never see the Empire(despite there being multiple reasons why they should be immediately asking Horde and Alliance for a portal home), but the blood and the Rootlands are too important to the current plot.
rain cave
I personally think Rootlands will be integral to the story of the Last Titan. It...
I mean, maybe? But it feels so strange to have setup the harranir so comprehensively just to not have them become playable in the expansion where they are both introduced and FROM
the rootlands is literally somewhere right next to where we are currently playing
can even see bits of it poking into our zones
pulsar minnow
Well also keep in mind while the story of this expansion was decided prior to metzen, the world soul saga was not. There's a big possibility it was planned but then removed to be introduced at a later time
But also, the rootlands might not just be in Khaz Algar
rain cave
feels wrong to have the harranir not introduced by the time we get an expansion where a central part is going to likely involve elf/troll relations
and elune
rain cave
But also, the rootlands might not *just* be in Khaz Algar
I mean a theory is that the quillboar thorns are offshoots
and that they extend almost everywhere in bits
honestly seeing some prime quillboar in the rootlands could be very cool