beta-ptr-spoilers

[iron hare]

Question

Is there any notable questlines that involve noggenfogger and Reznik the shiv

I alrdy have battle for booty bay

[harsh mason]

The alliance as a whole is more "ordinary" and in the style of classic fantasy. The Horde is more charismatic and unique. This is normal, there has been such a division from the very beginning.

[deep pawn]

Noggenfogger hasn't done much outside of Tanaris so far.

He's a recent promotion to head his cartel.

[harsh mason]

This need to understand that the houses in ESO are a continuation of the house system from previous Bethesda games, and not something new for them. For blizzard, this is literally the newest system in the last 10 years, and you shouldn't think that the output will be the same, and they will spend all their resources only on houses, no

And they are not unlikely to work to the detriment of other systems. So everything has already been said in their post: the ecosystem will evolve over time.

[novel zodiac]

Hi, meaby not the place to ask this, but what does "no lottery" mean when talking about player housing?

[upper pasture]

no lottery means you don't have to be selected through a lottery system to have a house, like some games.

[novel zodiac]

woah

that's an actual thing?

sounds like fucking shit

thanks 🙂

[ember blaze]

yes, that's why ff14 sucks, besides their shit combat

[glass flicker]

I mean, FFXIV combat just wants you to look at the pretty animations they've worked really hard for.

Except for the Monk Dragon Kick.

Worst animation I've ever seen in any game.

[dense plover]

thats because they refuse to actually change anything

its getting old

[deep pawn]

That's Japanese culture in general

FF14 has a lot of coding limitations from the fact it originally played on the PS3.

They said they are jealous of WoW's collection system for transmog but it'd require a ton of work for them.

[last wren]

well we can talk that it'd be preem to just have one character to do all the classes

but bags management omg

[unique oracle]

Hello fellow ptrers, is there a way to make a character lvl 80 without having a char already lvl 80 on retail ?

[dense plover]

No

It’s ptr not beta

They want people testing the content who have been playing the existing content

Level a character

Then copy

[unique oracle]

Okay thank you, i have some 80 char but i wanted to test other classes, thanks for the info

[ionic terrace]

new build

music bild

RC too

[upper pasture]

well rip dinar mogs.

hopefully they are just moving them out of the renown track and putting them somewhere else.

[silent urchin]

I would expect that, yeah

bunch of new weapon mog items

all "Gallagio Raider's"

seem like they might be goblin cartel themed versions

Quite a few new encounter journal lines, not sure if it's changes to encounters or just finishing the journal

this ones also gone, not just the dinar

[clear apex]

Oh nice, i don't need to worry as much now about the love rocket. Get it from the goblins

[iron hare]

MUSIC

Guys the music is lit

What is this it's so fun

[deep pawn]

hah, they removed the dinars.

release candidate.

[warm topaz]

https://youtu.be/V5gntV49y54?si=5ihnwsaQgzxEZPX9

amazing

[deep pawn]

definitely fits the mob boss aesthetics.

Less zany than normal goblin stuff.

There is some of the Kezan motif still there

[dense plover]

not surprised they removed the dinars from the renown track

what a waste that wouldve been next expansion

renown stuff needs to, generally, be relevant long term, not just during that season

im guessing itll end up as a quest or something

[deep pawn]

Either tied to the Blackfuse rep or an 11.1.5 reward

[dense plover]

wont be tied to rep

dinars are meant to be bad luck protection

arent they?

[deep pawn]

Blackfuse are post raid rep, so it could be them. And they literally were connected to rep until this build.

[warm topaz]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K4jRHXndabQ

i love this one

the vibes are incredible

[tropic trail]

Goblin hotel, nice. 😹

[sullen dawn]

Isn't the hotel called "Incontinental"

[deep pawn]

No

[silent urchin]

In game yes, but in the original design notes it's quite possibly just generically intercontinental

[sullen dawn]

It is though

[sullen dawn]

Ah thanks

[ivory meadow]

<@&299347348847329281>

[sullen dawn]

What happened?

[thin warren]

Was a person spamming a link for a "free" Discord-sub

[austere gazelle]

Is there also a reference to john wick ? xD

[harsh mason]

I think it means that the hotel is literally located between continents

[sullen dawn]

Incontinent means you can't control your bowels

There's a joke about it game. The player character says "you mean intercontinental right?"

And the goblins just like "oh....."

It's also a John wick reference yeh

[upper pasture]

intercontinental hotels are just hotels that are "between" countries IE in multiple countries or another definition is they are hotels for when YOU are in-between countries. it may very well be a JW reference but it could be pure coincidence

[sullen dawn]

The hotel is called Incontinental which doesn't mean between continents

That's what the goblins intended but they got it wrong

[upper pasture]

oh, i see the music track isn't the actual name for the hotel. i wonder why they did this...

lol

IN-continent. i suppose i could see how a goblin would like at intercontinental and be like just remove "ter" too many letters.

not knowing what they actually just did by doing that lol

[austere gazelle]

I know that but one of the main place in John wick is the " Continental Hotel "

Any idea of the patch date since its now in RC ? in one weeks? two weeks ?

[granite flame]

I think it's because it's enclosed within the continent, as opposed to being "on" the surface

Intra-continental, not inter-continental

[deep pawn]

Likely 2 weeks from today. We should get season ending warnings today

[sullen dawn]

Confirmed for 25th

https://worldofwarcraft.blizzard.com/en-us/news/24178759

[dense plover]

I haven’t been paying a ton of attention to the ptr. Can you earn the existing reps renown in the new zone? I still haven’t finished (by quite a lot actually)

[zealous sedge]

Same here. That would be good to know. Kinda fell off on the weekly rotation. I’m guessing rewards for the delve journey season 1 will also be locked after season 2 launches 3/5. should probably tie that up.

[sullen dawn]

I don't believe so, but I could be wrong

But I'm sure future patches will have catchup

[zealous sedge]

The new Zekvir ?? Reward looks dope

But it’s the “Underpin” I guess

[sullen dawn]

I hope they've fixed the janky flying animations of the copters

[ember blaze]

thats cool

[zealous sedge]

Speaking of that, does anyone know if Let Me Solo Him will still be active for Zekvir even after season 1 ends?

[silent urchin]

I'm pretty sure zekvir is going away entirely

[upper pasture]

He will still be there to fight just the achievement and rewards for doing it “in season” go away

[upper pasture]

oh jk, they changed their minds lol

"Zekvir's Lair is no longer accessible. There is a new Nemesis, The Underpin, with his own challenge Delve."

[novel zodiac]

Anyone knows if Undercoin its going to get a reset when the new season arrives?

[upper pasture]

not sure i'd like to know too since i'm sitting on a bunch and there's been no word on them resetting like the key fragments/keys

[deep pawn]

likely will be reset since you can buy keys with them

[silent urchin]

I've been assuming they'll reset. Also they changed the keys from them to allow infinite purchases sometime in the last week or so, I've just been dumping into that

[deep pawn]

keys are almost certainly getting reset lol

they aren't repeating s1

I'd buy the trade mats

get enough ringing ingots and tinderboxes for the expansion

[rain cave]

it's a nice skin but imo it's unfortunate that it's tied to the same mount#

I'd like to see a transmog set or weapon maybbe

though he does have the backpack items, so maybe there'll be a new thing to fill that

[upper pasture]

yeah but you cannot buy keys until you are deep into the seasonal track

keys are 100% getting reset as they already confirmed that

[deep pawn]

not that deep if you play multiple chars, definitely faster than they'd like

[upper pasture]

wasn't that limited per week too?

oh i guess it was any bountiful and the weekly was once per warband per week.

still...being able to buy keys for bountifuls isn't really all that huge

since the bountifuls themselves are also limited too

and it is pretty deep considering by the time you get them unlocked your main likely doesn't need anything from them anyways. but that might change in s2

and i did alot of delving in s1 at the start

[deep pawn]

having 16 keys on my main week one broke gearing

[upper pasture]

there's no way you earned 16 keys in the first week of the expansion

[uncut vault]

I cant get over how lame a change this is still lol

[glass flicker]

I like how Chrome King Gallywix sounds as a title.

Finally, he graduated from Trade Prince.

[upper pasture]

yeah it's kinda lame since now you have to worry about having a piece to catalyst too.

[glass flicker]

Am I missing something?

[upper pasture]

even more so because there can be a cap on charges later in the season alts might just "waste" a charge when clearing content lol

[glass flicker]

I feel like it's an optional way to get a charge, not the way to unlock it.

[upper pasture]

no more free tier piece you just get a charge

[glass flicker]

Ok, I am missing something.

[upper pasture]

yeah you used to get an item to buy one of the 5 main tier pieces now you'll just get a charge instead

(and it was a hero track piece too)

[glass flicker]

I don't see the issue. It's still a tier piece, and you can save it for when you get a particularly high item level piece of gear.

[glass flicker]

Ok this one is fair.

I did not know.

[upper pasture]

you used to only have to really worry about 3 of your tier pieces and could "fill in" with the token now you need 4 drops to get a good 4set

[silent urchin]

It seems like it's mostly to slow down the top gears doing splits, and potentially using the free tier piece on alts to guarantee slots for the mains

although I'm sure the top guilds will find some other way to abuse splits that uses even more characters

and it kinda just has a knock on effect of being a bit sucky for everyone else

[uncut vault]

It's also a reward that is essentially useless halfway through the season

because all alts will have 4 charges

[upper pasture]

which just means MORE rng

and if you're capped its literally a waste of a reward

[uncut vault]

whereas just last week, I decided I wanted a mythic transmog piece on my mage

so I went and did heroic ansurek, I immediately got a heroic tier piece and upgraded it to 623

[silent urchin]

They didn't reveal anything about the new dinari today, diid they?

[upper pasture]

nope

[deep pawn]

You realize there was early release, preseason, etc?

and then all the fragments from doing bountiful keys

I did a ton of delves that first week.

there won't be a preseason this time thankfully.

[upper pasture]

yeah, didn't bountifuls NOT open until after full release. you could only do up to t3 in preseason

[deep pawn]

Yeah, but you could earn keys in preseason.

What are you misisng

[upper pasture]

there were NO weeklies rewarding keys in preseason

[deep pawn]

Yes there was

[silent urchin]

There was a staggered thing. There were no weeklies in the pre-order period. There were some in the preseason, and a lot of people held onto them because I think the end of delve rewards were capped at t5 before mythic opened

[deep pawn]

yeah, I didn't spend any keys pre-season

[deep pawn]

there was one special assignment world quest that ended before the full launch that I did get.

[silent urchin]

oh you could do bountifuls at t3, https://www.wowhead.com/news/do-not-use-restored-coffer-keys-until-season-1-if-optimizing-gear-346077

[deep pawn]

not that one piece of champ gear breaks progression.

with launch the weekly events started for 4 keys a week. Okay, so I had 13 on season release before using any fragments.

[upper pasture]

ah so there was a few. but yeah there wasn't the weekies we have now

[deep pawn]

maybe 14, I can't remember if I did both special assignments

[deep pawn]

you could do theater and stuff...

It was a whole deal, people were whining that normal raid was made pointless cause everyone had a ton of keys.

[upper pasture]

either way the point of undercoins being reset because you can use them to buy keys is moot. noone is gonna grind or be able to grind the seasonal delve track to make it worthwhile.

[deep pawn]

you underestimate people.

[silent urchin]

normal raid has been "Pointless" for a while cause of M+

[deep pawn]

Undercoins also let you buy adventurer gear which is like the same ilvl as high heroic, low mythic is now.

[upper pasture]

the people who would do that would be better off spending it doing M+ 6s give hero track. why would someone spend 2 weeks farming delves to buy extra keys

to roll on a shitier loot table lol

[deep pawn]

Even more so as 12-16 pieces of champ loot just was a ton of loot for people coming from preseason gear.

it was literally faster to do 4 delves a day as a group, get 20 champ drops, vs doing m+ for 2.

[upper pasture]

yes, but you can also just buy a full set of 584 gear from siren isle with like 1.5k iron

[deep pawn]

undercoin gear next season should be like 615-620 I think.

[upper pasture]

and the undercoin set is the same i'm pretty sure on prtr

[deep pawn]

I think +8 delves are gonna drop 636 next season.

m0 splits are gonna be the way to get classes caught up though

[upper pasture]

M0s drop 636 champ

[novel zodiac]

its 623

[deep pawn]

yeah, they nerfed +8 delves to champ 1/8 I think and their vaults to hero 1/8 "to give more space for upgrading"

[upper pasture]

champ 1/8 is 636

[deep pawn]

yeah

Am I saying something wrong today...

[glass flicker]

Expecting item level 720 by the end of the expansion.

[upper pasture]

buyable delve gear is 623 vet 1/8 and still requires seasonal track unlock

which is the 3rd to last unlock

[deep pawn]

I think it'll cap at 717 with one more season.

[silent urchin]

new build btw

probably pretty small

[deep pawn]

surprised it's a build vs just hotfixes

[silent urchin]

oh wait that's only vendor, not ptr yet

I thought we already had the next vendor build

[upper pasture]

not that there wasn't but i'm pretty sure you couldn't earn the weekly chests from theater in the preseason too. i remember my buddy wanting to go do it cause it would always show there was a reward but it never gave us anything and i ALWAYS had to remind him of that every hour.

[deep pawn]

Then I dunno, I got keys from a bunch of stuff preseason.

[upper pasture]

i think 8 would be reasonable to have during the second week (the first week of full release) but i don't think 14-16 keys was doable.

[uncut vault]

They’re introducing a “weekly activities” log in the quest log that should help with this at least

[upper pasture]

of course assuming you had access during preseason/release but like you pointed out there isn't one this time.

[upper pasture]

i'm convinced my friend can't read. so.....it's not gonna help him 🤣

[deep pawn]

I was thinking of how many I had by the end of the first week of the season, so before m+ even opened. My mind is set that I had 14 on my main. 2 from early access, 4 from each pre season week, and then the 4 from the first week of the season. 10 keys is definitely a number I remember.

my later chars went in with 8

[upper pasture]

okay but that's STILL not from one week of play

that's like a 3/4 weeks

[deep pawn]

the point is having that many keys week 1 was massively warping to the season before m+ even opened haha. Thankfully we won't have it again, and part of why I'm pretty sure they'll reset undercoins.

I forget what the season progress cap is, but it's pretty damn high.

[upper pasture]

still it's a LONG grind to get to buying keys for S2. even if you focused the delve seasonal track, you would be much better apply your efforts else where. it's not like if they don't reset the coins people are going to be buying keys week 1. it will likely take 6-8 weeks to finish it at an accelerated rate/focusing on it. BUT MORE SO easier to do harder content to get better rewards.

all in all I just want a blizzard to actually confirm if undercoins are being reset or not. they clarify everything else why not undercoin

[sullen dawn]

For 11.1.5? Yeh it was like 10 days ago or so

8 days

[deep pawn]

11.1.5 should be announced shortly after the race finishes no?

Story mode comes out week 2.

[silent urchin]

no I mean I thought we got an 11.0 vendor build late last week

[dense plover]

story mode comes out with the raid this time

[silent urchin]

Week of March 11: Raid Finder Wing 2: Maniacal Machinist (Sprocketmonger Lockenstock; Stix Bunkjunker), Story Mode

Raid itself unlocks week of march 4

[dense plover]

huh - when did they change that?

i thought it came with raid launch

[upper pasture]

naw it was always staggered

just we don't have to wait for LFR final wing to get sttory mode this time

[dense plover]

ok so its still after mythic?

[upper pasture]

i don't think so?

[dense plover]

so that means it can still safely reward a crest or whatever from the quest

it is

i found the thingy

mythic launches with the raid launch, no delay

[upper pasture]

oh strange

[dense plover]

this was season 1

so story is still second week

😐

but mythic is now week 1 instead of 2

so its gonna be harder

since racers wont have normal/heroic raid gear

[upper pasture]

yeah either short race or really hard bosses in mythic lol

[dense plover]

i hope it makes the race more competitive since gear will play less of a role

theoretically

[upper pasture]

didn't S1 story mode get delayed?

[deep pawn]

nah, they'll just split like hell like in DF

So endless heroic splits, m+ grinding for missing slots, pray the delve map gods smile on them

They likely won't even enter mythic until Friday or Saturday

they should all be 636-639 so I can't see them doing m0s just to get a bunch of upgradeable champ gear since they won't have the crests.

unless there's a really good trinket or secondaries

[upper pasture]

sure they aren't gonna farm 0s but they will likely farm 10s

[silent urchin]

they'll do a bunch of it simply because they have 30 or more players and there's gonna be time when they have people not in a raid

lotta delves too on a lot of characters to get hero slots in the vault for more splits week 2, if necessary

[deep pawn]

delves are a given since the maps will be deterministic

[warm topaz]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o3TxCfhfYTY

[deep pawn]

We're getting a Locus-Walker short story eventually.

Makes sense since he's definitely connected to Xal'atath.

[silent urchin]

build out

I imagine fairly small/hotfix rollup

[deep pawn]

yeah

just 197mb

they made a blue post that they're gonna try again on arms warrior animations

[silent urchin]

https://eu.forums.blizzard.com/en/wow/t/undermined-development-notes/553974/12 buncha class tuning it seems

👀

I think this is just the same one we already saw in cata beta client

Not really seeing anything notable. Just the tuning changes and some minor cleanup

[dense plover]

jack shit for brew tho

wtf happened

[silent urchin]

What do you mean? For the patch as a whole? I wouldn't expect massive changes at this stage, just tuning

I thought people were generally happy with brews playstyle, it's just the balance that sucks

[deep pawn]

Brew needs a lot of work but it's like expansion level stuff

[glass flicker]

Honestly, they should make some top tier picks be baseline, and rework the tree in a better way.

[ember blaze]

both suck.

[grim flint]

Are the beta servers down?

[vernal juniper]

yo

I see you can't use the teleport below lvl 80, but can you be summoned? and if you can be summoned (2 weeks ago was possible) is it a bug they forgot?

[terse anvil]

On the PTR are we still using vicious bloodstones to socket pvp gear for season 2?

[warm topaz]

https://www.amazon.es/World-Warcraft-Crossroads-Within-Anthology/dp/1956916660?__mk_es_ES=ÅMÅŽÕÑ&crid=3OOR898VUZFJO&dib=eyJ2IjoiMSJ9.iOK4hmQMMYPGzBVv8V__OA.j6WRLnlvCUy2pWOIJrR8aQfx9hdW7mZTYNoXZt_z-PA&dib_tag=se&keywords=World+of+Warcraft%3A+Crossroads%3A&qid=1739653977&sprefix=world+of+warcraft+crossroads+%2Caps%2C315&sr=8-1

a new book

After witnessing the fall of Dalaran and braving the depths
beneath Khaz Algar, the heroes of Azeroth face an uncertain future. Across the
world, old hatreds are rising and Xal'atath remains at large, at work on her
own machinations. But even amidst a tide
of chaos and fear, hope remains.
Join Thrall, Jaina Proudmoore, Renzik the Shiv, Faerin
Lothar, Alleria Windrunner, and the Locus-Walker in this new collection of
novellas and short stories that provide deeper insight into the powers at play
and the battles still to fight following The War Within. These tales serve as a
reminder that Azeroth's fate is shaped by the sacrifices and struggles of all,
and that even small, quiet actions can echo large throughout history.

[ember blaze]

locus walker 🤔

[clear apex]

Find it interesting they're not including anduin or turalyon.

[tulip sun]

I find it interesting that we got short stories for all of these people already except Locus Walker

^ Specifically in TWW

[deep pawn]

Locus Walker surely is the story that bridges 11.2 to 12.0

[ember blaze]

ethereal race confirmed

[deep pawn]

I doubt that, he's just gonna be very important in Midnight

[ember blaze]

idk, seen a theory about why establish khadgar turning into magic form or whatever to survive in the dark heart...

what better way to introduce ethereals as they help us do the same 🙊

harronir definitely coming and we got one NPC taking the stage

[pulsar minnow]

I don’t think it needs to be that complex

Dimensius is our bad guy- he blew up locus walkers planet. Locus Walker isn’t a fan

[ember blaze]

yeah so ally the ethereals

[rain cave]

tbf that is a pretty good hook

since khadhgar literally did what the ethereals did

you could even set up playable ethereals as victims of the dalaran tragedy

or other beings we save from the void

but who knows

[pulsar minnow]

Blizz would be stupid to not add playable ethereals now

(Blizz please don’t be stupid)

[elfin eagle]

question is anduin involved in 11.1 at all

[deep pawn]

He's probably 11.1.5 with the visions

We're overdue him having a chat with Wrathion

[elfin eagle]

so he snot really in the undermine 😭

boooooo

[deep pawn]

I don't think I've seen him datamined any. 11.1 is really all about the goblins and the new Haranir speaker.

[uncut vault]

He hasn't even been mentioned since the final 11.0 quest haha

[deep pawn]

Moira and Magni got put on a bus

[tulip sun]

Eh Anduin had a good storyline. Got his light back.

Meanwhile like Thrall hasn't had his personal story yet.

[elfin eagle]

It’s in heartlands

[tulip sun]

That's not really a personal story development...

[elfin eagle]

I know I was being sarcastic

His personal development is being on the loading screen

[sullen dawn]

I really hope Locus Walker IS dimensius

But I doubt they'll do it

[lone mantle]

That is highly unlikely.

[harsh mason]

That would be weird and would look like a plot twist for the sake of a plot twist.

[sullen dawn]

Not really given we have very little detail on what k'aresh

*what happened on

[upper pasture]

it would be kinda crazy if Locus Walker was actually Khadgar, so like some time travel nonsense thrown in but say the shifting his body into the void has permanent effects and his body is slowing turning into an ethereal. and the reason LW has been so secret with his true name is because he didn't want us focusing on a way to "save him" instead of stopping the BBEG.

[ember blaze]

doing quests on wrath for the first time and it's funny allying the taunka as horde and introducing them to the horde, but theyre not even a player option 🤔

which is funny when theyre just 1:1 tauren

the males just got a diff face, but the female ones are just straight up tauren 💀

feels like exactly what an allied race should be

[deep pawn]

Taunka don't play with helms so never got added as a customization

[pulsar minnow]

I mean we kinda do

They used the arcane bubbles to fend off the void from Dimensius

But it backfired and they all got transfigured into arcane

[pulsar minnow]

I don’t even need locus Walker to be khadgar tbh. Locus Walker just being a time traveler alone would be so cool. Especially since Aman’thul, aka time itself is supposedly our big villain

[sullen dawn]

I meant detail. The kind of detail you get exposed to in a patch or expansion that focuses on the topic. Going to argus recontextualized and added a whole lot more info when we went there in legion

We have a high level 2nd hand account of what happened. Plus it involves the void so likely not as simple as initially presented

[pulsar minnow]

Yeah but Locus Walker is an ethereal. And it’s also physically impossible for him to be dimensius anyways

[sullen dawn]

Im not saying he is dkmensius, he probably isn't, but there's a lot we don't know

[tulip sun]

They're quite different. I imagine we'll see the females have equivalent faces in the upcoming northrend expansion

[sullen dawn]

I do think he's responsible in some way at least

[pulsar minnow]

It takes immense amount of power to even manifest Dimensius in the mortal plane. Locus Walker is just walking around like he owns the place

[sullen dawn]

Like I said, it's probably not likely. It'd just be cool if done right

[pulsar minnow]

And besides I think it’d just be so lame to take what is a character who is just so damn cool and villain bat him for a twist

Also I just really love how they execute his voice and I can’t explain why

[sullen dawn]

If they did it randomly sure. What im suggesting would have good lead up

There's a few breadcrumbs they could use

Like him saying his real name would shatter our sanity

And obsession with our world soul. Seems like a lot to help alleria so much just because he doesnt want azeorth tk suffer same fate as karesh

But again, probably won't happen

[deep pawn]

I fully expect Umbric to be a baddie at some point.

[glass flicker]

I fully expect them to recycle Dar'Khan Drathir and raise him into a lich that uses pyromancy.

We've never really had a fire lich. Would be a great opportunity.

You know, Dar'Khan Drathir, the guy who single-handedly caused Arthas to be capable of invading Quel'thalas?

This lovely gentleman?

This JoJo character?

[tropic trail]

lol what’s that 😂

I’m watching this MrGM new raid content and I’m kinda not convinced lmao 😂 I need more cosmic feet 🦶 to actually sub

Guess I will be waiting a bit more till some actual plot twist happens in story

[glass flicker]

Cease.

[tropic trail]

😘

Nevar!

[elfin eagle]

That art is impeccable

[deep pawn]

Last we saw Darkhan was when we gave his head to Garrosh

[glass flicker]

When has death stopped Blizzard from recycling villains?

[upper pasture]

Liches aren’t exactly alive either so they would just need to uhhh…say they grabbed his soul from SLs or whatever

[glass flicker]

Or, you know, since he was undead back in the Ghostlands, and he was kind of an arse, they could say his spirit lingered there 'cause Kyrians couldn't find him.

And Xal'atath goes like "here's a bone body"

[rain cave]

in the fire mage artifact quest there was a fire mage undead

[glass flicker]

Still not a lich.

[rain cave]

so what makes you think darkhan would be a lich lmao

he just looks like a normal guy to me

kaelthas becoming a fire lich could be funny

they could explain it as him needing the binding soul vessel in order to exist in reality since he's bound to the shadowlands

but that's just spitballing for coolness factor, nothing serious

[upper pasture]

Honestly I would much rather darkhan than yet another recycled kael again

Like how many times do we have to fight kael?

[rain cave]

never said fight

he's a good guy now

so he'd probably just be on our side

[sullen dawn]

He looks like a reddit user :p

[glass flicker]

Do you... know his lore?

[upper pasture]

Seems they already made him Lich-lite “A theory put forward after Blood of the Highborne may explain Dar'Khan's lich-like powers. After binding the Sunwell, Dar'Khan could not help but taste and gorge upon its energies directly, against Arthas' orders. When Arthas hurled Kel'Thuzad's remains into the well, its energies became dark and tainted, raising the former necromancer as a lich. However, Dar'Khan was also affected by this ritual, having directly consumed some of the Sunwell shortly beforehand -- Arthas informed him that the well was now contaminated, and having tasted it after its binding, so too was Dar'Khan, who could feel an alteration in the very "depths of his being." It may be that Dar'Khan was also imbued with similar lich-like properties to Kel'Thuzad after "surviving" this experience.”

Honestly after reading his page, he would make a great appearance in midnight, his research on the void is what eventually lead to the creation of the void elves. They could easily retcon some sort of connection with Xal

[glass flicker]

And that is why I brought him up!

[upper pasture]

And there’s already the fire theme there too

Honestly I’d be sad not to see him at some point considering

[glass flicker]

Pyromancy lich!

Give us this, Blizzy!

We've had so many frost mage liches, give us a fire one!

[rain cave]

honestly I think if they do more hero specs as like "every spec can access it" for the next round

lich could fit well

either lich, kirin tor themed, or a time mage probably imo

imagine a lich mage where instead of arcane barrages/charges, living bombs and fingers of frost we have shambling corpses that we send in

zombies with vfx for each spec

kelthuzad uses shambling ice zombies as his theme in HS, and fiery bomb zombies would fit as well imo

and even arcaney ones could be cool, like the withered from suramar in vibes

could also add flavour things like instead of alter time you put down your phylactery and can return to it whenever you want on a cooldown

and the phylactery takes damage as if you were standing there whilst you don't take damage wherevery you are standing

[deep pawn]

I don't want the new shiny thing for my class in Midnight to mean giving up what I enjoy now

I doubt they would go that route ever.

[glass flicker]

Yeah, I don't see them changing hero specs. I see them innovating on what is already there. Midnight might have another borrowed system, I'm thinking something we imbue with mana to give back to the Sunwell, but hero specs aren't gonna change much.

[molten niche]

They will just add more hero specs to classes

[glass flicker]

Why do you think so?

[harsh mason]

I don't think the barrowed system will ever appear at all.

I think that everything related to the character's power will be tied to the character, not to the expansion system.

[glass flicker]

That's possible, but I don't think they'll bloat the talent trees more.

[harsh mason]

To be honest, in my opinion, Artifacts in the Legion are Blizzard's worst mistake, but the artifacts themselves are connected with an attempt to make up for the severely curtailed talent system in Pandaria.

Therefore, in the current situation, the barrowed system makes no sense.

[glass flicker]

I disagree with this. The biggest mistake made in Legion was uncapped Artifact Power. Farming Maw of Souls was the worst experience I've ever had.

[harsh mason]

The artifacts created their own "power vacuum", coming out of which you felt a downgrade. I'm not talking about farming right now (although it seems to me that you've already forgotten how it was when it was difficult for you to even change spec at first, since you had to farm AP again). The artifacts would make sense if legion was the first and last expansion

The systems in Legion, bfa, and SL are ONLY good in a vacuum, for single-player games, and if it were, these would be the only expansions. But these systems don't work in the context of an mmorpg in which exp is released every 2 years.

[sullen dawn]

i think borrowed power is ok in the context of 'sagas' i.e. they can inflate stuff over three expansions, and then do an integration/rework/squish at the start of the next saga

it wouldnt feel bad losing something after 6 years vs 2

but i dont really care about that sort of thing too much, im more interested in the game world and rp stuff, housing etc..

[glass flicker]

Claiming I've forgotten how difficult changing specs was is kind of shallow. If I'd forgotten, I wouldn't bring the farm up. In any case, I have another idea that might work in Midnight. Do you remember Warlords of Draenor leveling perks? Every one or two levels, one of your abilities would change, gaining a new passive effect. I could see that being reused and improved.

[rain cave]

I didn't say that tbf

just adding more

[uncut vault]

I think the issue with artifacts were less their very existence, and more that they came in as spec-specific power boosts in an xpac where every spec got reworked

Legion classes were designed around artifacts, so their loss in BfA without equivalent reworks to make them work independently was a major pain point

Later borrowed power bits like Essences weren’t really an issue like that, they were just extra bonus power that people didn’t particularly mourn post-BfA because they fit the context and weren’t a painful grind

[upper pasture]

honestly i've got no issues with borrowed power things in a single expansion as long as they have a catchup mechanic so people don't feel forced to do everything in a week or miss out.

[dense plover]

as long as they have a catch up mechanic AND they dont design classes around them

class should be fun before the borrowed power

[deep pawn]

unless you mean having 2 active hero trees at once, on tww, one midnight, my complaint still stands.

[sullen dawn]

Especially it it's there for a whole saga rather than just one expansion

Like im all foe them to power creep hero specs until end of TLT then rework classes

Replied to wrong message

I was agreeing that it's ok for borrowed power

[rain cave]

no like if they add more hero talent trees

so there's more options

so instead of 3 there's 4 to choose from

[deep pawn]

yeah, no, eff that, wasted expansion dev time.

[rain cave]

hard disagree

otherwise why both adding hero talents or any power system in the first place

we should all just press damage button

[deep pawn]

If you're say a massive fan of Diabolist warlock, but they add something you have to choose INSTEAD of that to get something new in the expansion? Screw that.

[rain cave]

you never have to choose

they've done pretty good at balancing the hero talents to not feel forced

some were a bit imbalanced but they've tamed it to the point we don't hear it as a complaint nowadays

[deep pawn]

I said "if you want something new"

[rain cave]

I mean if you like the new thing, play it?

if you don't, don't

[deep pawn]

No, they are not gonna add a third hero spec per spec to choose from cause all that'll do is make people who already like their current fantasy mad.

[upper pasture]

if you're a fan of something and they add something else you'd like to try there's no harm in trying out the new hero talent. more choices as long as they all perform within a range of each other there shouldn't be a probelm

[rain cave]

or play both just save the talent layouts

[deep pawn]

Cause you know damn well the devs aren't gonna waste time adding something that people won't use for at least a season or tow.

[rain cave]

I mean, I disagree. you can't prove that

I would love them to just keep adding more hero specs

and that's what we get instead of classes going forward

completely fine with me that excites me

[deep pawn]

Nah, I want a new system divorced entirely from hero specs for Midnight.

Horizontal expansion of design is not what WoW is about ever.

[rain cave]

so you'd rather hero talents just rot there?

[rain cave]

yeah but it should be

[deep pawn]

They'll be iterated on like any other talents we have.

[rain cave]

they've been moving to horizontal progression slowly

because it's nice to have

a purely vertical game does not a sustainable game make

and they're trying to set up WoW to be sustainable and long term, more than ever

[upper pasture]

which is why we aren't level 180 right now

[rain cave]

if you want to talk about them adding things most people won't enjoy or play

lets remove pet battles next xpac!

and levelling!

[deep pawn]

Blizzard has conceded they can't do borrowed power becuase people hate losing things every expansion, so that's why they're just gonna layer and layer more stuff until the level squish after TLT.

[upper pasture]

dude, leveling is a core thing of any MMO they are NEVER gonna remove it

[rain cave]

I mean, I doubt they'll remove it as well, but I genuinely do see them capping it

or just changing its nature relative to the game

[clear apex]

You can do level removal if you make it into other things (like talent points) but that would need tp reworking + adding

[upper pasture]

there are a group of people who literally just play the leveling side of WoW and you just want to cut them right out lol

[rain cave]

no I don't

I'm saying it as a joke to kyle

since he says no to more hero talents because people won't play/enjoy it

my point being most people don't enjoy levelling

[upper pasture]

didn't we already have this convo before tho or was that someone else?

[rain cave]

similar ones

[upper pasture]

they couldn't cause then people would complain that they are "forced" to do it to get their talent points

[rain cave]

but it is true that most people just see levelling as a chore it's why they offer boosts, and why most levelling videos and events ingame revolve aroun XP boosts and doing it fast

some people enjoy that grind, more power to em

[upper pasture]

even tho they are already sorta forced into it. /shrug

[clear apex]

I understand that. I was only thinking about other mmos and eso in particular that has you get champion points and you stop 'leveling' at 50

[rain cave]

and levelling is core to WoW so it will never fully leave

[upper pasture]

it's not even core to WoW but core to the general type of game.

[rain cave]

but I could see them going "ok we're doing a squish, and from now on 80 is the cap, and all the content before (expansion after TLT) is "legacy" content that has no ilvl and is cosmetic purely for you to go back and farm or experience. Maybe they add timewalking difficulties to scale you to it at levelcap. Chromie time for levelling there ofc

[clear apex]

I wanna ask but also dont want to start a long convo about why/who hates leveling in wow aside from people who rush through just to raid
But I wont. I will say there are some people I know who think leveling could be better because it's too fast now

[rain cave]

but then they just keep adding more ilvl slowly at lvl 80 to slow number inflation and keep things simpleer

[deep pawn]

We'll squish down to 50 again in 14.0

[clear apex]

Was it cata they only added 5 levels? you go 80-85 or am i misremembering

[upper pasture]

honestly when SLs came out i thought they were just gonna squish us back down to 50 every prepatch and let us work back to 60. would make alot of stuff easier to balance and keep things from going out of control

[clear apex]

Wouldnt mind a squish by end of TWW just so we arent back to 100 by TLT

[upper pasture]

we are 100% getting squished (stats) in midnight/ end of TWW then levels after TLT

[deep pawn]

that's what they did no?

oh, you meant every expansion

yeah, level 100 for the end of the world soul saga and then squish to 50 works too well.

[uncut vault]

which in turn becomes the issue where you are forced to choose between the fantasies in the first place, so more hero talents would allow them to add some more fantasy-agnostic hero talents to let people feel less forced into choices

some kind of sniper/explosives hero talent would go a long way towards making hunter feel less like they're given a forced choice to cosplay as one of three WC3 heroes

[ember blaze]

i wish hero talents were primarily cosmetic than a big part of your power

[rain cave]

I feel they should have power in them because otherwise we don't get meaningful flavour for some of them

[ember blaze]

like I think that big node that changes something big like mass disintegrate or spawning an orb as voidweaver is cool

[rain cave]

like how you sort of need there to be a different skill available for some of them to work

[ember blaze]

but like maybe dont tie a ton of power on it

[rain cave]

however I do think they should actually do more with them from a flavour view

so you could do like

[ember blaze]

yeah like i feel you can do that without making it a big part of your power budget

[rain cave]

scale back the amount of throughput power

increase the number of flavour interactions

or sidegrades

[ember blaze]

yeah

[rain cave]

could even be as simple as sunfury instead of having an AOE circle target flamestrike, it turns into a unit target explosion around that person where a phoenix flies in and blows up or something

slightly different function, same scaling/power

or frostfire just affecting all those abilities

[ember blaze]

like flameshaper I always wanted my blue beam to turn red and maybe turning it into a dot

[rain cave]

or maybe affecting them all when you're at max frostfire buff

[sullen dawn]

That's like saying I'd they add a new class itll make people who like another class mad

More options are good. Plenty of games add more options. Its not like you can't swap between them

And if you're married to the fantasy, create a new character. Alting is easy these days

[deep pawn]

A different class is a different beast than adding a new spec inside a class.

[sullen dawn]

I for one, want more hero spec options

For my frost mage, none of the fantasies fit currently for me

As an example

[ember blaze]

what fantasies are there

[sullen dawn]

Pure frost mage is what I want. My arcane mage is spellslinger, my fire mage is sunfury

I don't wanna go frostfire as my frost mage, so I currently ain't playing thr character at all

[ember blaze]

whats the other frost option

[upper pasture]

Frost fire ? I think?

[ember blaze]

he said that

[sullen dawn]

You mean a new idea that doesnt exist?

[ember blaze]

nvm found it its spellslinger

[upper pasture]

Yes it’s frost fire/sunfury/spell slinger

[sullen dawn]

That's kinda for blizz to come up with. I just want something that I feel fits

[ember blaze]

isnt spellslinger pretty general

[deep pawn]

frost spellslinger is all frost themed.

it's frost splinters and all that

[sullen dawn]

Ish, but suits arcane most, and my arcane mage is already spellslinger

[ember blaze]

i never felt like it had some drastic unique fantasy

like theyre basically more icicles on top of your normal icicles

so i feel like thats kinda already full frost theme if anything

[sullen dawn]

I have a character for every spec, and don't wanna double up on hero specs, so for my personally, new hero specs would help a lot

[ember blaze]

well thats kinda weird if its just a fantasy thing

[sullen dawn]

Its close but again I dknt wanna use the same hero spec on two diff characters

[ember blaze]

if its just wanting the full frost fantasy why does it affect it

[sullen dawn]

Its just a personal preference, im not saying it's right or wrong. I like my characters tk be distinctive as possible

[ember blaze]

ok

[sullen dawn]

I don't wanna have two spellslkngers is all. If they add something like "scion" or "scholar" i could make my arcane mage that, and my frost mage spellslinger then

Or Illusionist

(What are you hiding)

On a more general perspective though, I think more fantasy options is always good and I'd like to see 2 more choices added to every class by the end of the saga

[rain cave]

would be nice to have like a BIG spell one

sunfury is like that

but frost's hero specs are a lot of little things being thrown or frostfire

they could do a 4th hero spec that is just pure overloading into any of the specs

could call it guardian or kirin tor, w/e

so frost maybe gets bigger shatters, deep freezes that stun instead of root, just bigger and better

a fire hero spec that adds a heat meter could be VERY cool, let the flames dynamically change colour as your heat meter changes

until you're burning blue at your peak

arcane could lean into the extremely volatile parts of the arcane, random procs and imbuement, maybe even some kiss/curse gameplay where they bring back some of that older fantasy of being just completely out of power for a bit

just throwing literally everything you have at someone like khadghar did with his big beam against xal, fuck it GIVE us the big beam for that

[upper pasture]

Honestly they should rework arcane surge to look like that Khadgar beam, similar feels, putting all your mana into one attack then basically being depleted until you recharge your mana

[rain cave]

perhaps make it a choice node?

playstyle choice between using arcane surge as a big final thing once you've buffed up and done touch of the magi vs channeling a giant beam into touch of the magi as your opener, after stacking buffs

[ember blaze]

the hell is this thing

[warm topaz]

https://www.wowhead.com/es/news/new-patch-11-1-twitch-drop-tock-the-clocker-spaniel-pet-372787

[clear apex]

It's a sha!

But like an extra cute one

I think it's called merriment?

[ember blaze]

hmm, does that thing even exist before they put it up on the shop

is that like a purified sha or what

[clear apex]

I think the idea is a purified sha

It didn't exist before

[ember blaze]

i wonder why theyre reluctant to add mounts like jetpacks or wings into the game

it's not like they dont add shit that has never been in the game before

like that diablo mount

[clear apex]

They don't seem to like adding "mounts" that aren't animal/ vehicle

[ember blaze]

which is dumb\

[clear apex]

I think they were pretty reluctant to give drathyr full flying

[ember blaze]

if the best they can do is a world item in ardenweald/mechagon... just take the easy W and add it to the game

[clear apex]

Making those trade post butterfly wings as mounts would be cool

[ember blaze]

ill take anything

[clear apex]

Or even give you double jump like demon hunter

[ember blaze]

ok lets not get carried away there 🤔

[clear apex]

Dracthyr got the better end of the deal

[ember blaze]

i wonder if they end up adding tinker and something in their kit involves a jetpack for a movement ability

i wonder if they would give them flight form with it

or a tank spec with a mech, surely it can also fly

[upper pasture]

It looks like if a sha ended up in D3’s cow level

[deep pawn]

There was literally people working on WoW who didn't open a single great vault until delves? 😮

[upper pasture]

Is that that hard to believe? People who solely play the single player experience and now delves have a way to get it solo

[clear apex]

I never opened the great vault until delves were a thing

[dense plover]

im one of those

last time i did M+ was legion when I had time

[sullen dawn]

I don't think tinker/artificer is coming until TLT

Not sure it needs a jetback. Maybe they can just make a lifting mount like that anyone can use

[ember blaze]

that sounds like raid utility.

Im talking about personal movement ability

like if they get a shaman like jump.... a jetpack would make sense

you could even throw in double jump

[sullen dawn]

Goblins have that atm

Its on a super long CD though

[ember blaze]

so what

zandalari got a 15 min cd glide, but my evoker can still glide 😂

[sullen dawn]

I'm not saying they can't do it, just saying it exists

[ember blaze]

guess that makes it a great point for its existence 🥂

[sullen dawn]

Its neither for against it

Depends on how the class is designed

[rain cave]

I mean yeah, have you ever tried gliding without wings? I'd need a 15 minute break as well

[deep pawn]

Oh my, shocker haha

[upper pasture]

glad they finally confirmed it /shrug

[deep pawn]

as minor as it seems they had power attached.

[thin warren]

Buy all the delve mats!

[final sigil]

Oh my, thanks for the heads up!

[upper pasture]

sad day to be an enchanter

basically kills any hopes for enchanters to have WOs anymore

since people will just buy enchants off the AH and now they can get enchanted crests off the NPC

[silent urchin]

wasn't worth much anyway, other than the odd person who had no idea how much to tip

can throw them up for whatever the minimum price is and they get done instantly

[upper pasture]

i mean, i usually get around 5-10k per enchanted crest

then towards the end of the season people just post them for 1k

[silent urchin]

on public work orders?

[upper pasture]

yup

either way my point still stands of "now enchanters wont have public WOs"

i guess it's a good thing we have the NPC orders then lol

but i suppose the weekly enchanting quest is never "do X work orders" like tailoring

[deep pawn]

enchanting is a gathering profession

disenchant 10 things a week and be done

[upper pasture]

that's not the point, WOs for enchanter will be dead.

[deep pawn]

Already were dead if you weren't lucky. They were just a dust sink

[upper pasture]

i mean, it's going from needing an enchanter to make something for you to literally just being able to buy mostly everything from an NPC or the AH

[deep pawn]

Crests were an annoyance more than anything and so many players accidentally wasted good dust on them.

[upper pasture]

speak for yourself, i'm gonna miss making decent gold

[silent urchin]

your server really sounds like an exception. I rarely see any cause they get snagged instantly, and they're generally only a couple hundred gold

there was maybe some potential with the new tier if people were lazy about getting recipes

[deep pawn]

The people who get most of the work orders have the addon that they just press every time someone flags their keywords.

I don't care to fight those types so let work orders die. I craft on alts or for my guild

[molten niche]

honestly the workd ords are bad from the npcs anyways. they should provide all the mats like players have ot whne they place work oorders

[glass flicker]

I agree with this. Once in a lifetime occurrence.

[deep pawn]

Wait, didn't crests go gray with season launch in DF?

[dense plover]

pretty sure crests and valorstones both get wiped

[deep pawn]

the question is patch or season launch, sucks to have a week when you can't upgrade anything.

[upper pasture]

you can upgrade anything new you get

all s1 stuff becomes unupgradeable at reset

[deep pawn]

okay, went and upgraded stuff on my main and got the other tier set I cared about

Man s1 tier as a whole just wasn't as exciting for me as it could have been.

[glass fulcrum]

s2 tier bonuses (unless they got changed when I saw them) are even more boring, mostly just proc based

Like for frost mage it’s literally just “randomly volley 8 enemies lol”
Then the 4 piece is “icy veins makes you volley 3 times”

I hate warriors the most, it’s a stacking damage buff that has a 15% chance to remove itself on cast

Like why

[harsh mason]

You won't get the tier set so fast that you won't have time to upgrade it, don't worry.

You know, I think it's time for dev to somehow destroy any manifestation of minmaxing, meta, and so on. It's about time.

The line has been crossed for a long time, people cannot adequately perceive a game in which there are hints of character itemisation

[silent urchin]

Nah keep it, I'm always amused by the ridiculous stuff people get up to so they get renown a day earlier or whatever

jump through a million hoops and don't actually play the game til all the rep buffs line up and you can get an extra champ piece for 5 min before you replace it in M+

[upper pasture]

Visually I don’t like the new tier sets, sure a few look decent but overall meh.

[glass flicker]

I like the Rogue one a lot.

[upper pasture]

Yeah, I think that one is my fav on the tier this time around

[warm topaz]

really? probably my favourite ones in a while

[harsh mason]

I don't know, I really like DK, Hunt, Mage( the best in my opinion), rogue, pal, monk

[upper pasture]

tbf, i was also a fan of raid themed tier sets too so usually i am disappointed with the direction they've taken the sets

[silent urchin]

👀

I guess later this week for the build

[elfin eagle]

i would assume 3 weeks

let undermine soak in a bit

one week story next week raid/mythic + then ptr

[harsh mason]

||https://youtu.be/mVp17cB7HVI?si=-fRciIpigeOgHCh1||

I'm surprised it wasn't shown as a trailer, in Sl and DF they showed cinematics in patches for a week as a trailer.

[lone mantle]

[warm topaz]

really cool!

[harsh mason]

And yes, wowhead, you know that the patch hasn't been released yet, it's not on live servers, why are you doing this again?

I just don't understand this moment and the logic of why to do this.

[silent urchin]

I mean, someones gonna do it

you don't have to click their youtube

[deep pawn]

they're up early!

god damn that's actually terrifying.

Doctor Evil if he was actually Evil.

eww, I don't like the local stories being on the map

they did wipe all crests, lol

not even silver for them

[dense plover]

wowee what a sick intro cutscene

did you guys see the tentacles in the fog as Xal was leaving?

holy shit the events tab fucking rules!

is the crests new?

[upper pasture]

yes?

if you mean new as in the new crest, yes. if you mean new as in as a reward from WQ, also yes. they wanted to make crests easier to get for solo players

[dense plover]

the reward from the WQ is what i meant

new crest was expected

[dense plover]

sounds like the ethereals

[dense plover]

its so weird that renzik seems important but doesnt have a unique model OR voice acting

[upper pasture]

renzik? you mean the character that just got a short story?

[dense plover]

YES

thats exactly why its so weird

none of his lines have VO

wait can you not fly in undermine?

[ivory meadow]

no

[upper pasture]

nope only drive/ground

[dense plover]

wtf

didnt they say you would still be able to fly?

[upper pasture]

They actually stated quite the opposite

Currently as it stands they never plan to allow flying in undermine

[dense plover]

huh

its still easily one of the best zones ive seen so far

amazing and tonally varied music

enormous, detailed, and a FULL city zone

not half a zone

a whole zone

[glass fulcrum]

9/10 should've had the goblin music from bfa (as well as the new music)

[deep pawn]

I think WQs always gave weathered crests, they just finally show all rewards.

[dense plover]

do i need to seek out the DRIVE stuff or will it be introduced through the main quest?

[upper pasture]

Oh that coulda be it.

[deep pawn]

I don't like drive...

[upper pasture]

I’m nervous, I haven’t made it there but I have a sinking suspicion I’m not gonna like it either

[deep pawn]

at least I don't like the default.

I hate hitting something and bouncing back 50 yards

and it turns slow

[upper pasture]

Probably all things that get upgraded over time?

[deep pawn]

more "changed"

you can bounce less if you're willing to go slower and stuff

It's like go kart games

[dense plover]

worst case scenario - if its massively unpopular, theyll add back flying

[upper pasture]

or they leave it as ground only and leave drive behind in 11.2

[deep pawn]

they'll up ground mount speed in Undermine

I think some will like the mini game, but I find it annoying so far

I'm just using my regular mount

[dense plover]

i mean

it has drift

you can handbrake drift

so i can see myself liking this

if i can figure it out

i kinda wish it auto moved forward

[deep pawn]

travel doesn't need to be gameified.

[ember blaze]

it does 😄

specially when it made flying 100x better

i hope if theres a tinker spec it isnt just a third spec that just equips a shield and 1h

surely they do a mech u ride in right

cause yet another shield +1h is boring as hell

[deep pawn]

it made flying faster, I still find vigor annoying

drive shouldn't leave undermine in my opinion.

initial forum feedback doesn't seem keen either.

Lots of "I don't play driving games for a reason."

[ember blaze]

dumb. Same bullshit when new flying got released

"but i wanna afk in the air" 🙄

[upper pasture]

pretty much yeah, idk. people are always gonna be adverse to change. give it time people will like it or at least stop complaining

[uncut vault]

you also literally can just ride normally in Undermine anyways lol

[glass flicker]

I don't know how I feel about it yet, 'cause I'm in the EU and I won't get to play around with it for another nine hours. Work. 😭

[deep pawn]

yeah, and I am, but I'm scared they're gonna want this as a default

[glass flicker]

Friggin'

GUH HUH

I'm celebrating Christmas early, folks. I just got buffed.

[ember blaze]

as an aug player, im at a funeral

[upper pasture]

room for one more?

[deep pawn]

yay timegating

[uncut vault]

Is that really where they chose to end it lmao

[dense plover]

yes, but all of the rest unlocks next week

[deep pawn]

I mean its a fine point

The Dark Heart is gone until 11.2 probably and Gallywix is now full on side quest territory lol

[deep pawn]

Undermine is the first time we've had working interactable doors right? Housing prep I'm sure but cool

[thin warren]

? you mean doors you can click on that opens and closes?

[glass flicker]

False.

[deep pawn]

Yeah

[glass flicker]

Gilneas had them first.

You can go and check.

[deep pawn]

I remember a couple quest objects you could open but not a permanent door

[glass flicker]

Now, the opening animation is probably not as smooth, but Gilneas has houses you can open, probably for RP reasons. But they're all empty.

[deep pawn]

In bed now but I'll have to go explore tomorrow I guess.

[glass flicker]

Sure. You can find most doors you can open in the town square. Exactly where you start as a worgen.

[thin warren]

ah, i was thinking, specifically doors, because interactable gates or other sorts of doors are ingame for ages

[deep pawn]

A lot of them were one time quest interactables

[deep pawn]

My memory of them was just being quest related and you couldn't even enter, guess my memory was wrong

[glass flicker]

The town square doors are pretty much all openable.

[glass flicker]

That was before the reclamation of Gilneas quests.

[thin warren]

i remember them in raids

[glass flicker]

I'm just disappointed that all of those houses you can open and enter in the town square are one-room coffins without any furniture.

I guess you can use toys to make it homey though.

[deep pawn]

They weren't designed to be used. Being able to enter them is clearly a newer addition.

[glass flicker]

Gilneas is the RP city of dreams, and somehow no one ever goes there.

I'm actually disappointed.

[thin warren]

schoulderpats

[deep pawn]

It's dark and dreary. But the castle got used a lot.

[sullen dawn]

dynamic ground mounts should become the new standard

[harsh mason]

This was literally the case in every patch, the questlines in which the tasks leading to the raid are given open along with the raid.

[austere gazelle]

ewww...
Separating money by season... why not, but then why all the S2 money are not into the S2 block ? 🤔

[silent urchin]

the cans? They're not seasonal, they're part of the zone that'll stick around

[thin warren]

seperation is only for the crests and valorstones, wich i like, since certainly the crests were a bit everywhere in the list

[deep pawn]

I know but I wanted the full world set

[harsh mason]

It’s Funni, the new area of ringing deeps is roughly the size of Korthia.

[sullen dawn]

11.2 hit a vendor 😮

[ember blaze]

moving fast

[deep pawn]

Before 11.1.7? Weird

11.2 likely has to have housing though

[sullen dawn]

1.1.7 is probs small

[sullen dawn]

Surely that's prepatch with hojskng. Roadmap implies so anywya

[deep pawn]

I don't think so. I'm pretty sure it's gonna be preorder bonus in 11.2.x somewhere

the housing item shows up before the start of Leigon remix or whatever it is

[sullen dawn]

Yeh but I dknt thjnk those thjngs are contradictory

It won't be there when 11.2 launches, as that's likely before gamescom

Which is when the midnight deep dive is

Housing in December makes sense to me

[deep pawn]

what I mean is it's a preorder bonus but it won't be tied to prepatch I feel.

The doors in Undermine feel like a first taste of the system they're testing

[sullen dawn]

Sure, but i can't see it coming earlier than October (housing)

Even if prepafth is dec or jan

Preorders could go up in September

If marketing kicks off at gamescom in august

[deep pawn]

housing is early winter so some time in December. I don't foresee prepatch before middle january.

[sullen dawn]

Yeh that's basically what I thought

Expansion in feb

Housing december

And don't know if preparch is with housing or slightly after

[deep pawn]

February expansion still feels a tad early but we'll see if they stick that landing

11.1.5 is almost certainly April 22.

that's exactly 8 weeks and before Children's Week

[warm topaz]

i thougt the same thing!!

[deep pawn]

so the doors in Gilneas were first, probably the very first time they tested the tech in an area where it likely wouldn't break anything.

I'm guessing they're coded as quest objectives that reset themselves

[silent urchin]

internal is quite different to vendor, it may be very, very feature incomplete or something like that

its used much less and at stranger parts of dev

as got mentioned, may be a focused test on housing or something but none of the other content

[deep pawn]

I do hope they find a way to let us close doors or leave them open.

Quest objective that resets is alright

[deep pawn]

April, June for next 2 patches, August, September, November for 11.2. 11.2.7 gets spicy cause Thanksgiving and they should be in full swing of beta at that point.

Prepatch should be January at that cadence but with Christmas who knows.

[glass fulcrum]

The symbol was replaced by housing.

[glass flicker]

Yeah, that was supposed to be how the player housing hearthstone looked. And the FBI took issue with that.

I'm not making this up btw.

[glass flicker]

Don't question mark emoji me. Look it up.

[upper pasture]

Naw, you made the claim and backed it up with “I’m not making this up” the burden of proof is on you lol

[pulsar minnow]

the EVIL hearthstone

[deep pawn]

by item I meant the banner, the icon change is irrelevant.

[glass flicker]

Apparently the triangular spiral (like a Hearthstone circling under a roof)... and that means.. something I'm too innocent to know of. Some group online apparently use it. I have no idea which and the video didn't say, just "everybody already knows what this is associated with" - so it flagged up the Feds and I'm just sat here Summer Childing like '???'.
Just like Blizzard, apparently.

[deep pawn]

It might look like a certain rune that's been coopted by nazi's.

[thin warren]

Lol, what are the chances

[tropic trail]

Na for me it looks like troll cave icon that evolved to a house with a advent of civilization lawl 😹

[sullen dawn]

You think prepatch will be 2 months after season 3 starts? That would be the shortest season of all time

11.2 is likely june or July

Or maybe im reading that wrong. It looks like you said 11.2 in November

[harsh mason]

After 11.2, there will be 2 patches, that is, at least 6 months.

So, at least 6 months between 11.2 and prepatch

[sullen dawn]

Yes exactly i agree

That's why I thought june/July for 11.2, and dec/jan for prepatch

[deep pawn]

I think August. June would be a 3 month season 2

June is where I'd expect 11.1.7

[warm topaz]

11.1.5 today??

it's crazy, season 2 isn''t event out yet and we're already thinking about 11.1.5 and 11.2

[deep pawn]

I mean we know the 11.1.5 ptr is coming up soon and goes live like April 22.

Saturday is March 1st

[silent urchin]

https://us.shop.battle.net/en-us/product/world-of-warcraft-marvelous-meeksi-pack

another one

[upper pasture]

Woah, mounts?!

[silent urchin]

5. They fly too.

[upper pasture]

My gold reserves are too low for this 😦

[deep pawn]

they're cute, but $65 is like buying Civ 7

you're getting 2.4 mounts for free at that price but still.

[sullen dawn]

I'd buy one for 15

But not 5 for 65

[clear apex]

a singular mount is usually 25$

[upper pasture]

they probably are gonna come later as solo purchases the bundle says it's only good until april 28th

[clear apex]

curious as to what the next 6 month mount might be. Id first gotten my hopes when i saw that.

[deep pawn]

green one is already on store for $25

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4Saa-UkuF2k Behind the scenes of the raid.

[harsh mason]

MugZee is a sick

In fact, the development of raid battles is a really difficult and time-consuming thing.

[warm topaz]

https://worldofwarcraft.blizzard.com/en-gb/news/24180344

[clear apex]

yay still no 2h swords

[deep pawn]

I am so ready for the butterfly sets

The mounts have such a cute grin

[silent urchin]

and, apparently, a spear?

[deep pawn]

Fae folk ain't nice

[glass flicker]

Look at this senior citizen.

[warm topaz]

https://x.com/algalon_ghost/status/1895330176285782055?t=5d6_908BH2NJ0Y4Q2hQ55g&s=33

Algalon, Enigmatic Observer (@algalon_ghost) on X

New #Warcraft build found:
Vendor 10 (wowv10)🔐: 0.0.0.00000 --> 3.4.4.59433

Found at: 02-28-2025@04:28:20 UTC

X · Feb 28, 2025, 4:28 AM

they keep working on WOTLK

[deep pawn]

Legion remix confirmed

Granted all the WoD remix folks were coping a bit.

[dense plover]

I mean - Legion is inevitable. Hopefully they take the opportunity to fix the parts that sucked

Even though it’s less “classic” then

And it’s not like anyone wants BfA or SLs classic so this is the last one

I would love season of discovery but for legion

[deep pawn]

No, Legion remix like MoP remox

We already knew that was likely what was coming but confirmation is always nice

[upper pasture]

with enough time i'm pretty sure we will see classic everything

[harsh mason]

I'm interested in how the artifacts will be implemented in the remix, because it's better not to return them in their original form.

[glass fulcrum]

Where?

[clear apex]

Maybe no wod remix(yet) due to garrisons

I'm hoping legion cuts out artifact stuff somewhat

[upper pasture]

Honestly, I want legion remix to go hard with the artifact weapons, I didn’t play during it and I’d like to power up my weapon. Albeit in a faster not limited by weekly progress

[clear apex]

Fast af or not at all!

[upper pasture]

I mean, that’s been the philosophy of remix so far

[glass fulcrum]

I still don’t know where this was confirmed, I don’t see anything on it

[silent urchin]

it's not been confirmed but holly loves hinting at it

it's the interview in https://www.wowhead.com/news/revisiting-legion-holly-longdale-and-ion-hazzikostas-look-beyond-30-years-of-375193

Holly: And players have been asking us, you know... Mists of Pandaria was my favorite expansion, and we've been going back there in modern and in Classic. Legion, my favorite expansion. We're going to be going back there and experiencing it in a new way. So we listen, and that's sort of the new mode and the new call for us is to listen to our players and take them back and experience this content that they may have experienced in the past, but in a new way, in a bit of a fresh look.

[glass fulcrum]

Ah awesome ty

[clear apex]

They had a big hint and even called it legion green on the roadmap

[dense plover]

No way they do warlords classic - it would just remind people it sucked

[worn crown]

I WANT SL Remix/Classic one day, please do not think everyone has the same opinion as you, even if it may be the opinion of a few fols

*folks

SL was the last time I was excited to play campaign, because DF and TWW (so far) are pretty much "everything old is new again boomer style" storytelling/lore. I want new toys, not rehash old ones.

[pulsar minnow]

I mean

TWW is majority new stuff

Dragonflight too. Yes we had some familiar faces like Tuskarr or centaur but the foundational concepts have been a lot of new stuff following the vein of shadowlands big reveals

Mainly the first ones existence has been heavily influencing the course of the world soul saga

[deep pawn]

WoD had 3 banger raids though

[clear apex]

At the time, i didn't like a lot of wod since it was lacking in updates but going back to do stuff i find i enjoy it.

But i also agree that df and tww are just fine.
I wish they'd retcon some SL stuff

Between wod and sl, only one made me quit the game and I'll give you a hint, it wasn't wod

[uncut vault]

I imagine the story quests will just give a custom version of them, and then all quests in Remix have unique quest rewards anyways

So they can skirt around having to re-activate all those old AP items

[glass fulcrum]

They don't even have to, its a different timeline 👻

[dense plover]

Then do the raids as timewalking

We don’t need classic warlords

Remix might be fine tbh

Same with shadowlands

[dense plover]

Also are you serious? The big bad being a robot is terrible

[clear apex]

I feel I've seen a lot of the opposite, people wanted old world to be relevant again. Midnight and tlt are doing that

[sullen dawn]

Remix wod would be awesome tbh because its short so content draught wouldn't be an issue, ans then could skip over the garrison

Classic wod I agree doesnt need to be done

But i think remixed wod would have a lot of potential

On the classic front, im just waiting for classic bfa haha. My fave expansion

[clear apex]

Since they don't use gold as a currency in remix, could make it stupid simple to upgrade a garrison, skip timed stuff, and there's no crafting so a lot of stuff would be irrelevant.
Thinking more, yeah don't need garrisons at all

Curious how they'll tackle player power and class hall in legion

[sullen dawn]

They could, but its probably a lot of engineering work. Garrisons seem bugged to high hell haha

I think if we did get wod remix it'd be smoother just to skip em

Wed likely have bronze dragon hubs or thr equivelant anyways

[silent urchin]

making it into a hub would be neat

skip all the building/customisation

could keep a lot of the quests and stuff but modified

[rain cave]

what if they did WoD AND legion as a sort of combined remix?

doubt it but

their events do connect pretty directly

and legendary ring + artifact stuff could be fun, allows us to do extra WoD stuff as well

[deep pawn]

My guess is each class will get legendary effects that work as meta gems for the helm

[dense plover]

too much content tbh - legion has a LOT, warlords doesnt

the only difference is that MoP had like 8 raids and legion had 4

but legion also had M+

so i imagine remix would do something with mythic dungeons or something

or maybe they would split the raids in half

so theyre shorter

[deep pawn]

that's only cause MoP had one tier split into 3.

if Siege wasn't too long, no raid is.

[harsh mason]

In pandaria, as in the legion (as in almost every expansion), there are 3 raid tiers. These 3 raid tiers can be divided into at least 20 raids, the essence will remain the same. So…

And there were 2 raid tier in WoD, but obviously the reason was something else altogether, because apart from raids and instas, there was essentially nothing in WoD.

And to be honest, I didn't quite understand about the 8 raids in Pandaria.…

[harsh mason]

Judging by the latest video, the Blizzards are hinting in plain text that Gallywix will have a secret phase.

[upper pasture]

They’ve basically confirmed it when whoever first asked about it. “We add them when it feels right” they’ve been saying a lot of this patch was fan service and “had to be done right” in every interview. I’d be shocked if he didn’t have a secret phase

[glass fulcrum]

secret phase ending : you just pay them gold cap and the fight ends instantly 🔥

[upper pasture]

I was laughing with a guildie and I said what if he didn’t have a mythic phase but rather a whole other encounter, like we get him to 1% the mech explodes he runs into another room and bam void corrupt or back at 100% for a new fight.

That gives very goblin vibes to me

[warm topaz]

the fight is kinda like that tbh

[upper pasture]

oh? i thought the fight was untested?

[uncut vault]

It is, but clever use of map viewer mechanics lets tyou see his arena, and we know he's got a final mech phase with the fully body mech

[warm topaz]

yeah, but you can see on the journal that the fight starts at p2 or p3 of HC

iirc

[upper pasture]

ah i see

[warm topaz]

also this, you can see the mech on the video they did about the raid

really cool video btw

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4Saa-UkuF2k

[silent urchin]

if there's anything I suspect it's a phase where gallywix goes full black blood

[pulsar minnow]

I love the reveal that the ethereals aren’t working with Xal

Maybe a dumb theory but since Ethereal 11.2 is basically confirmed at this point, I really wonder if we’re gonna head back to the dragon isles for the final patch

Specifically the void gateway in Abberus

[silent urchin]

second 11.1.5 vendor build this week, I'm pretty sure PTR thurs or fri

[glass flicker]

We might. Honestly, I imagine something with Netherstorm being split off from Outland and us returning there.

[sullen dawn]

It'd be sick if we got sent back to outland for some quests in 11.1.5

I think its one of the only expansions that hasn't been revisited

Although lore wise, isnt it mostly split apart now?

[glass flicker]

Exactly. So, how about a Netherstorm that is still full of leylines and Eredar constructions, but owned by Ethereals? Functionally floating through space like the DH or Warlock order halls.

[deep pawn]

I still expect Roothome.

[glass flicker]

But why?

[deep pawn]

cause this expansion is about underground and they said that

[pulsar minnow]

I mean rootlands is possible, but the Abberus portal is also deep underground and still unexplained

[sullen dawn]

deepgrove?

or rootlands?

roothome wasnt mentioned i dont believe

[upper pasture]

I think roothome will be more TLT focused?

[glass flicker]

I don't know where y'all are even getting these names from.

[pulsar minnow]

The hundreds of names given to the Haranir place in the war within

[upper pasture]

im just using what he's using for simplicity sake. but the home of the haranir

[pulsar minnow]

Some people dubbed it deep grove, root home, rootlands. It’s all the same

[glass flicker]

Roothome sounds right.

[uncut vault]

Rootlands was the PH name from blizzard's alpha map

[pulsar minnow]

It was datamined as Rootlands in the early ph name - nvm porter said it haha

[uncut vault]

I think Deepgrove just comes from herbalism?

[upper pasture]

but we've had ethereals poking around again since DF so i feel like we're gonna "deal" with that then the Haranir will need assistance in TLT (of course this is just speculation)

[glass flicker]

Alright. Then maybe Rootlands will be our next Siren Isle minipatch to give us content until the next big patch. Sounds right to me.

[uncut vault]

If I had to guess, the more immediate presence of Orweyna where she doesnt really do much in 11.1 makes me think she'll be the 11.1.5 megadungeon/subzone

[pulsar minnow]

I think we’re bound for an Ethereal Raid and potentially rootlands zone for 11.2 they didn’t announce any new zones til then

[sullen dawn]

well no. two of those are from either the game (deepgrove) or beta files (rootlands). roothome is just made up

[pulsar minnow]

We have Nightfall and Horrific Visions revisited coming up too. Probably gonna involve ethereals

[upper pasture]

this is why i think we're dealing with the ethereals first then the haranir later

[pulsar minnow]

Definitely possible. It just feels weird since Haranir are likely to be a playable race that they’d make people wait that long

[upper pasture]

maybe they will be both at the same time but that seems like that would be weird since they aren't really related(?)

[sullen dawn]

well ethereals are likely going to try suck up the world soul

to regain their corporeal forms

so they'll probably go to near where the harronir are from

[upper pasture]

i mean it could just be setting up story for 12.0 or something. we've had fresh ethereal stuff in DF and nothing really came of it until now

[pulsar minnow]

This all said, keep in mind this was datamined not too long ago