a desire, driving force, that he'll put out all the stops for
#beta-ptr-spoilers
rain cave
upper pasture
you clearly don't understand i'm not staying Iridikrond is stronger i'm saying we don't know. we don't know come 10.1 who is stronger i'm literally telling someone just because gravity can be stronger in RL doesn't make gravity wielding boss in game automatically stronger
and besides all that it's likely that Fyrakk will become stronger than Iridikrond in 10.1 but because he lacks the part of his brain that tells him to strategize because after all he is the incarnate of fire (and fire being an uncontrollable force of destruction) he will become uber powerful and thinking he is unbeatable will likely fall into a trap and be kill in one way or another
crystal pond
In cinematic he uses gravity to crash guardians into pieces
Gravity is not limited only to rocks and earth
crystal pond
Will see
rain cave
what about deepholm
crystal pond
Flying rocks thing
rain cave
?
crystal pond
harsh mason
In cinematic he uses gravity to crash guardians into pieces
As I understood it, this is because the guardians themselves were made of stone.
rain cave
also just because you can lift something doesn't mean you can manipulate gravity
I'd argue if he was going to have any kind of physics based power it would probably be magnetic stuff
but we already had polarities from raszageth fight
so
deep pawn
So if we go back to dual force stuff. Shadowflame, Lightice, would it be too hypocritical if he somehow became Arcane and Earth?
What if he is trying to twist order magics later
But might be too much like the wild magic dragon fight we already have
That said, actual arcane magic isn't very orderly
Nah, it'd have to be pure order magic. Who knows how that'd combine with his elemental nature. I don't think we've really seen that yet
rain cave
funnily enough, iridikron turning to order magic would probably be the 'deal' that the other primalists would find abhorrent
since we know fyrakk doesn't care about shadowflame, man uses it at some point (unless he's infused against his will)
but if iridikron started channeling order/arcane the other primalists would react like how the aspects probably would have upon learning neltharion used void magic
deep pawn
The more I think about it, there's no way Tyrhold isn't the final raid
I'll be a bit mad if corrupted Tyr is a boss
It's not like we've done that much plot there for it's size
rain cave
nah I reckon final raid will be something newish
that being said I can definetly see tyrhold being relevant to it
like unlocking the new area, or the final raid circling back to tyrhold for a final conflict
or being somehow relevant
cosmic beacon
The tabards look dope asf
deep pawn
like unlocking the new area, or the final raid circling back to tyrhold for a fi...
The throne room from the cinematic begs to be a boss fight arena
austere gazelle
The throne room from the cinematic begs to be a boss fight arena
Odyn's :p ?
crystal pond
You think we'll see odyn this expansion?
I hope in this or next expac we will kill him 
Well in this expac we have records about him and tyr
And we about bring back tyr so
deep pawn
I don't know why but I feel Odyn would be more in tune with a light expansion
For an order being his abilities are very light and fire themed
harsh mason
Forget about Iridikron, Fyrakk, Light and Void... We missed a character who could really become a new threat.:Decatriarch Wratheye.
And if it's serious, then I really wonder what will happen to her
She wasn't just left alive after the dungeon
deep pawn
She'll probably be a boss recruited by Iridikron in the last raid
He's already known for working with whatever forces he needs to destroy order.
Or she helps with the emerald dream plot
little hound
uncut lintel
oh ok so i have time to still valor farm then nice
deep pawn
yeah
little hound
Gladiator Mounts: Awesome flying mounts + Customizations.
M+: HAH GROUND
uncut lintel
wish i could have more than one catalyst tho this week so i can turn both boots and cloak into mythic color 
uncut lintel
Gladiator Mounts: Awesome flying mounts + Customizations.
M+: HAH GROUND
tbf i love this one
the firey brnoze shit
earth
soh yped to get this
little hound
If they had elemental skins for our Dragonriding mounts? Sure!
But to be given GROUND MOUNTS In an expansion we hardly ever touch the ground? No thanks.
uncut lintel
dragonriding elemental skins r way too cool remember
dense plover
If they had elemental skins for our Dragonriding mounts? Sure!
But to be given G...
they dont give dragonriding mounts because you cant go back and get them next patch
those mounts afaik are either going to be unavailable until next expac or unavailable forever
theyre not going to do that with dragonriding unlocks
uncut vault
Theyre rewards for Gladiator so that's not really applicable
dense plover
arent the glad mount skins available next expac or something though?
uncut vault
Mostly just a "thats always how it's been" deal, same with elite pvp sets
uncut vault
I def agree, they need to adopt the vicious mount system for both IMO
you grind to earn the current season's set/mount, and then grind more to get a token to buy a past one of your choice
upper pasture
That would indeed be nice but lead me down a road of more PvP
Which probably isn’t good for my overall health
deep pawn
I'm soon to work on the 1800 priest set haha
ember blaze
That would indeed be nice but lead me down a road of more PvP
they could always just let anyone get it. So someone could wait for comp stomp if they wanted to farm pvp stuff from years ago.
upper pasture
i mean if it's buyable with honor yeah but if it's conquest....i mean you could but like after the first win isn't it like 7 conquest per win lol
harsh mason
yea, this is the third phase
austere gazelle
do we know when m+ season 2 starts
when the 10.1 is released. Same time as Mythic raid which means when the raid will open. Usually on patch day.
subtle oar
Gladiator Mounts: Awesome flying mounts + Customizations.
M+: HAH GROUND
Gladiator and M+ are nowhere near eachother in skill. Gladiator is a much harder achievement than M+ by a mile. I'm with Blizz on this.
subtle oar
https://tenor.com/view/worldofwar-timeschange-change-garrosh-gif-13230689
100% agreed. Gib me the MoP armored Glad noodles!
rain cave
Perhaps they should put older time limited sets on the trading post?
uncut lintel
when the 10.1 is released. Same time as Mythic raid which means when the raid wi...
i meant actual date
cuz im still workin on farms in season 1
so idk if this is the last week or what
austere gazelle
Oh , no 10.0.7 is not the next tier of content so you'll have at least two more month before 10.1
( Or I think so )
uncut lintel
ok i hope so
i have to grind a bit more valor
and get more catalyst charges
like 2 more
harsh mason
cuz im still workin on farms in season 1
Season 2 will begin a week after the release of 10.1 (as usual). 10.0.7 is not the season 2, but an interim patch
uncut lintel
oh
austere gazelle
Season 2 will begin a week after the release of 10.1 (as usual). 10.0.7 is not t...
Don't think so, Mythic raid will be available with the other raid so it'll be patch day. It was week +1 when Mythic was delayed by one week
uncut lintel
o----o
cosmic beacon
Perhaps they should put older time limited sets on the trading post?
nah cause even if ur getting it much later its basically 0 effort to get it if u just wait
thats if ur meaning like elite sets for example
iron crown
how is ret paladin in 10.0.7?
rain cave
nah cause even if ur getting it much later its basically 0 effort to get it if u...
well same with mythic sets no?
mythic is hard to get current tier, and is a status symbo;
cosmic beacon
mythic sets are different
rain cave
but becomes easy to get later
could apply the same to PvP elite sets
since those are mythic equivalent tints for PvP
no harm in it imo, if the sets come quite later
like not current xpac later
just the idea that we have a precedent of things combing back eventually
since nobody likes having hardrive space taken up by things they can't use
harsh mason
Don't think so, Mythic raid will be available with the other raid so it'll be pa...
No, the seasons always started a week after the patch was released
Previously, the mythic raid opened in 2 weeks
There was always a week to prepare for the season
austere gazelle
Mmm usually the raid start on patch day, since everything is released at the same time now it''ll be weird to have the mythic+ starts one week after
What you reference is maybe the locking of the great vault which reward the new season max reward one week after release
harsh mason
Mmm usually the raid start on patch day, since everything is released at the sam...
No, the raid is always opened in a week, the mythic in 2
deep pawn
That doesn't say it all opens on patch day
uncut lintel
isnt that what simultaneiatoitaly means
deep pawn
There'll probably be a week delay still after the patch to make sure nothing is broken
austere gazelle
yes, as I said, " usually start on patch day " but the new season will defo launch when the raid will be released.
There is no more " one week delay "
deep pawn
No, there used to be two weeks from patch to mythic raid start
austere gazelle
I clarify, there is no more " one week delay between normal / Heroic and Mythic "
deep pawn
Okay, that's different than saying season two starts right when 10.1 drops
austere gazelle
yes, as I said, " usually start on patch day " does not means it always happens on patch day
sometime some raid required unlocking or lore aspect before going in
sometime they are directly available
harsh mason
potato screenshot, my bad 😄
What does it have to do with the simultaneous launch of all raid difficult ? I'm talking about the fact that raids were opened 1-2 weeks after the patch was released (even longer in the legion). On the day of the patch release, the raids were never opened, not once
You can see the release date of any patch and any raid in this patch, and it has never been on the same day
austere gazelle
It did happen on previous expack though. Those were locked behind story or campaign though, require attunment or unlocking that could be done the first week
But that was not the point of the discussion anyway, the new mythic season will start the day the raid will be available.
harsh mason
It did happen on previous expack though. Those were locked behind story or campa...
Well, moreover, according to the story, we get into the raid after the 5th chapter
uncut lintel
austere gazelle
I dont think the raid will be locked for whomever did not complete the story though
imagine locking a raid behind story
austere gazelle
they dropped this now, unfortunately
uncut lintel
💀
austere gazelle
<:OMEGALUL:757192537025806416> imagine locking a raid behind story
it did happen on earlier expack :p
rain cave
<:OMEGALUL:757192537025806416> imagine locking a raid behind story
they did before ye
rain cave
I mean it did make some sense when they did do it
austere gazelle
BC was the pinnacle of this shit
rain cave
like HFC
uncut lintel
💀
uncut lintel
and without renown u dont even get half the story
austere gazelle
Well, now you can be spoiled the end raid cinematic without even defeating the last boss by doing the story campagin though xD
uncut lintel
💀 no way
rain cave
shadowlands was the worst for this tbf
I had absolutely no idea when thestory was taking place related to the raid
esp in 9.2
obv you figure it out
austere gazelle
yeah, was crappy to have Denathrius "defeat " to be a plot point in the Venthyr campaign when you didn't even beat it in the raid yet xD
rain cave
but it was just
weird
there should just be a precedent of like
here is the campaign, it takes place before the raid
like the actual story campaign in the journal
but then still have the extra quests set after?
austere gazelle
Or an hollow step " Defeat Denathrius " " Defeat Sylvanas in the Sanctum" to progress the story
rain cave
just label it as a 'new' campaign
austere gazelle
since there is LFR, it's not a feat in itself and hard to do
silent urchin
there's a significant amount of people who don't even do LFR
they don't want to gate story behind it
rain cave
I also think the idea of a player character not being the people in all the raids funny
austere gazelle
true.
rain cave
like you come to the dragon isles, you help, you contribute to the effort
but you're not one of the main raiders who goes and actuallyfights
"yeah sure we're in aberrus to find stuff I'll help but bro I'm a blacksmith"
austere gazelle
if only they could follow that step. Because in the following quest they'll address you as the killer of the last Boss anyway
rain cave
I reckon just having clearly defined before and after campaigns is the solution
like legit just seperate them in journal
harsh mason
I dont think the raid will be locked for whomever did not complete the story tho...
Of course not, but it will open only when the 5th chapter is available.
And it will not be 100% on the day of the patch release, since there was always time to prepare for the new season in 1-2 weeks (in the legion there were about 3 weeks)
But they can easily make it so that the 6th chapter will require kill of Sarkareth
As it was with the Wrathion quest, which required the killing of Azshara
ionic terrace
fyi crafting vendors are up
silent urchin
oh neat, did they hotfix those in?
ionic terrace
must of
silent urchin
in stormwind/org? or somewhere else
silent urchin
Neat, although last I saw the blacksmith stuff was.. not finished
silent urchin
Only a couple recipes in, some that don't do anything yet, and what looks like a whole missing new intermediate reagent
ionic terrace
ah
silent urchin
none of them get taught by the brain either
ionic terrace
yeah sadly
silent urchin
Despite being basically maxed on blacksmithing knowledge since launch apparently I still had to spend about 400 to mxa out
Guess it makes sense why they didn't add any more
Little bit surprised at no new gathering reagent
also that there's no more explicit knowledge catchup
... did they hotfix in more campaign quests too?
there's one for touring the city, post fyrakk burning it?
hmm I think just weird phasing meant I missed it before
deep pawn
hmm, what's the special Sarkaroth item?
uncut vault
most loot is PH right now so we dont know yet afaik
dense lichen
Hey guys, are the Zskera Vaults a solo activity?
silent urchin
yes
dense lichen
Alright, thanks!
rain cave
loving all these datamined armor sets that are themed around the dragonflights, but still have all the color schemes for the others
already know this is going to be a popular one
but you can easily see some amazing high elf/ alliance mogs with this
near flower
that grey color reminds me the maw items.
rain cave
that grey color reminds me the maw items.
do not mention that wretched name here
😂
I get what you mean though
it's funny actually, all the maw themed gear comes in weird shades of color that seem to always be 5% off of matching literally anything else other than itself
and the shoulders sit weirdly
dense plover
omg
catalyst changes are amazing
"First, we’re reverting the Weekly Quest system to get Catalyst Charges in favor of how it worked in Shadowlands Season 3. For those unaware, this is very simple - every week, all characters on your account will get a charge, no action required."
i dont have to do that stupid quest every week!
"The quick hits of how Dragonflight Season 2 will work are thus:
Upon the Catalyst opening, all players will receive a Charge for every one of their characters. These function the same as they always have - if your Main spends a few to convert items early in the season, it doesn’t impact your alt (or any alt characters you may make in the future).
unlike in Shadowlands Season 3, there will be no cost associated beyond the Charge spent. No Cosmic Flux, no Dragon Isles Supplies, no Apexis Crystals - if you’ve done the work of obtaining a convertible item, that’s enough for us."
I like the “Omni token” idea too
dense plover
someone was complaining about how theyre going to make tier set pieces less common drops later in the season and someone said "but what if i join late in the season?"
and im like - dude did you read what this post is about?
you use the fucking catalyst dummy
upper pasture
Yeah but all they see is “less tokens off raid bosses” and they get scared
dense plover
except with guaranteed charges, joining late in the season means you DONT want tier pieces to drop from bosses
because that couldve been a trinket drop instead
upper pasture
You could argue now with the upgradable raid tier raid bosses tier will be just as good as catalyst converted gear so either is just as good
But with trinkets it’s still gonna be a crap shoot
deep pawn
This whelms me. Woo so one piece of tier for hitting 2200
It's barely anything for non raiders
dense plover
It's barely anything for non raiders
raiding should still have its rewards
and theyre testing this
deep pawn
They get aotc mounts, the Raz skin and others on top of the best trinkets and faster tier acquisition
Raiders get the vast majority of new content over the course of an expansion too
uncut vault
I like the changes theyre doing, but I really dont get their insistence on keeping it at 6 weeks
this still kneecaps M+ players to a huge degree
Less so than past seasons, which is nice at least, but I don't get why after seeing that things are clearly fine and the community is eager for it to be earlier
upper pasture
It's barely anything for non raiders
final kill of raid gives free token aswell no?
i mean it's not great but it's a free tier piece
upper pasture
lfr/n/h/m
deep pawn
It's an extra piece of loot dropping for the raid, not the entire raid getting one each
deep pawn
Maybe it'll have whatever special item Evokers are gonna get from Sarkareth
upper pasture
i see not as crazy as i thought
deep pawn
Watch it just be those dragon mogs and them be evoker only
Since those mogs so far have only been shoulders and tabards right?
deep pawn
Hmm, then I wonder what Ion means. The cloak isn't evoker only right now at least
Screw them if they tie the third spec to killing Sark
uncut vault
110% wont do that lol
they might tie some of those datamining strings for void glyphs for evokers to him though
ember blaze
they might tie some of those datamining strings for void glyphs for evokers to h...
void glyphs? for evokers?
glass flicker
Evokers do be one of the most colorful classes. Limiting their visual effects to only void would make them somewhat easier to see. Not every class needs their abilities to be a jar of Skittles.
deep pawn
Literally only evoker is rainbow
uncut vault
void glyphs? for evokers?
there are some test spells in the 10.1 PTR data tied to spells like emerald blossom, that according to the names will use the cosmic void visuals from Sarkareth's fight
uncut lintel
i like to see gay colors on my evoker
glass flicker
Good. The glyph is optional.
glass flicker
All glyphs are optional.
uncut lintel
can we have a glyph for druids some more animals forms
skitterfly flight form lets go
glass flicker
I want the cheetah to be my actual cat form.
glass flicker
Switch seamlessly between travel form and cat form.
I want that.
Or how about furbolg form for bears?
Or Saberon cat?
Why was that even removed?
no idea i loved the saberon cat form
glass flicker
Oh, here's a good one.
uncut lintel
the spotted snw leopard was my fav
glass flicker
Why do they still restrict moonkin form appearances?
Why can't I have the elf or worgen one on a tauren, for example?
Maybe I want horns on my nelf boomkin.
uncut lintel
idk
glass flicker
Also agree that Glyph of Stars should have color options?
Boomkins use both sunlight and moonlight as visual motifs. Why not have an orange version?
Glyph of Sunlight.
I could go on for days about glyphs.
uncut lintel
that would be dope
glass flicker
And purple fire everywhere.
glass flicker
Or how about some more love for DKs?
How come Death and Decay is red for all specs?
glass flicker
Good night.
upper pasture
can't wait for all the people who can't read login info asking why it's down
upper pasture
ya
upper pasture
yeah i bet my priest will look good in the red one
glass flicker
Offbrand Whitemane mog?
upper pasture
naw, i just like the red robes
rain cave
How come Death and Decay is red for all specs?
Because its a blood spell
Same reason frost bolt is blue
glass flicker
Next you're gonna tell me Anti-Magic Shell is unholy because it's green.
glass flicker
But it has glyphs.
rain cave
Cool
glass flicker
Just make more glyphs overall.
rain cave
Yes
Death and decay glyphs would be cool
Even though it's a pretty low visual spell Now
glass flicker
Could at least highlight the area better, especially with a frost rune
I don't want to squint at my screen every time I take my DK through Castle Nathria.
Or Firelands.
rain cave
Melee in general should get a review
Mortal strike uses a bad animation, doesn't feel as satisfying as it could be. Frost dks still use the wrong animation for frost strike
Paladins verdict thing is pretty poor
glass flicker
Mortal Strike should be a down swing imho.
glass flicker
Like the orc male default special attack.
glass flicker
I don't like the sound effect for mortal strike already. Even Overpower sounds better.
Just give Mortal Strike the Execute sound effect and bass boost it.
And find something new for Execute.
How about Bladestorm? It looks so cool in Heroes of the Storm 'cause Samuro isn't straight up spin2win.
And how come DKs don't have an ability that resembles Leoric's three strike combo? That'd be so cool.
ionic terrace
interesting
harsh mason
I wonder, there will be a new drop ptr today if a new patch is out?
silent urchin
it's possible
ionic terrace
yea
rain cave
yeah I just assumed green was a dominant trait
rain cave
and both of their children are brown
"tonight on warcraft lore that looks weird out of context"
ionic terrace
LOL
crystal pond
Taurens with dragon eyes are scary 
rain cave
I love how the human heritage armor doesn't actually have anything special to it
like if you look at say, vulpera, they have a cowl that fits their ears specific for the race
human don't even have a 3d chestpiece 💀
deep pawn
Do you need to be 70 for the heritage?
dense plover
emberthal has a fancy model
with lip syncing stuff
so does sarkareth
ebyssian still has his old model so it must be quest triggered
harsh mason
Something tells me that this is a trap, and Sarkareth has successfully fallen into it
dense plover
now ebyssian has his model
harsh mason
Something tells me that this is a trap, and Sarkareth has successfully fallen in...
He also a 10.1 will allegedly hear the voices of "Neltarion"
dense plover
this is a great cutscene btw
dense plover
Something tells me that this is a trap, and Sarkareth has successfully fallen in...
100%
sonic flame
2 questions
- when is 10.1 releasing ?
- do the recent cross faction changes allow for cross faction dungeon finder? :3
dense plover
Ebyssian didnt get new dragon model <:dracthyr_cry:1002363122448875612>
We knew he wouldnt
he still hasnt
it will only happen if its encrypted
silent urchin
so is the new model just higher def?
crystal pond
Yeah
crystal pond
We knew he wouldnt
His dragon model was encrypted lol
crystal pond
no it wasnt
It was .-.
dense plover
i think that mightve been a mistake then
uncut vault
that might have just ended up as this IGC model
it still has an NPC code of some kind
subtle oar
- when is 10.1 releasing ?
- do the recent cross faction changes allow for cross...
- No release date
- No, cross-faction Dungeon Finder yet
harsh mason
It looks interesting, but Sarkareth (this is the 1st stage of void consume) no longer has pupils of the eyes
uncut lintel
noooo dont become raid boss D :
harsh wedge
noooo dont become raid boss D :
Too late
uncut lintel
NOOO
harsh wedge
Sarkareth will literally be the last boss of the next raid, to add to your pain
glass flicker
Too blue.
clear parrot
So... Adamanthia is sealed with the black essence of all the dracthyr kind...?
This is a very good clue about the third spec, gets me a good hype
dense plover
So... Adamanthia is sealed with the black essence of all the dracthyr kind...?
no?
i dont think thats correct at all
where did you get that from?
its sealed using black dragon magic
aka NELTHARION
not the essence of the dracthyr
uncut vault
The main story reveals that she’s sealed using the essence drained from the dracthyr
crystal pond
Neltharion used his spell and it was powered by dracthyr's black dragon essence
dense plover
The main story reveals that she’s sealed using the essence drained from the drac...
it does?
dang
i guess i didnt pay enough attention?
crystal pond
Wich is like
What was her point to remove black dragon essence from dracthyrs when neltharion was able to do that through something like this already
I mean yes it was a command from neltharion, but like for what? 
Oh yeah btw did they fixed the book with 5 old gods or its 5 still?
silent blaze
I hope they do something with the ring we get, like I personally wouldn't mind it staying around all xpac but I think they should give us some stats with it or like you give up a slot of something
harsh mason
I hope they do something with the ring we get, like I personally wouldn't mind i...
This is the ring before the first visit to the heroic aberrus
Will you change this ring in the new season
ember blaze
Will you change this ring in the new season
They will nerf it if it’s too good by then
It’s just a mid patch thing for people to do
And it wouldn’t be good if you kept it all expansion
That’s another dead spot
And anyone joining later would have to go back and do first season content to get it
harsh mason
So, where's the new ptr build😡
warped fiber
this is a great cutscene btw
i want to find this cutscene in brazilian portuguese D:
it is so cool
dense plover
ptr servers are down
warped fiber
idk how to play on ptr server lol
dense plover
idk how to play on ptr server lol
i mean - this is the ptr/spoiler channel
you just select ptr in the launcher and download that version
but its buggy and for testing
warped fiber
i mean - this is the ptr/spoiler channel
yeah ik, but i dont have it installed
warped fiber
you just select ptr in the launcher and download that version
oohh ty!!
dense plover
i want to find this cutscene in brazilian portuguese D:
this cutscene is available on the live servers
warped fiber
this cutscene is available on the live servers
mhm, i saw it, but it was a little bit late to record the screen
:(
plain violet
Yeah, the idea of the black essence being taken from all dracthyrs...
It seem tied to "once we liberate her, black essence is no more punctionned, we will get back our powers"
It seem very strange to have commercialized as much the dracthyrs as "using the power of all flights" and insisting that's their lore, infused with each essence, to have now a quest saying "eeeeh, actually, minus black"
We also have a text from Adamanthia saying extracting the black dragonflight essence was done to dracthyrs in stasis, but that she feared the consequences on their abilities.
warped fiber
every scene with ebyssian and emberthal had my heart in pieces
plain violet
I really loved the dialogue.
plain violet
Yeah, we really leveled up!
dense plover
<:hmm:678400567231512577>
oh - so fates
ionic terrace
ye
dense plover
"Players will be rewarded each week based on the highest number of objectives they complete. Completing more objectives in later scenarios will garner higher item level and greater currency rewards, but helping each time will provide some compensation and a chance for more rewards."
sounds like fates meets wow style rewards
mossy meteor
dense plover
base WQ ilvl has been increased
think this is a public event
or its not
idk
this is new and veristrasz is here
other two entrances are on the flight map, which now works between the two
cant fly to them though
disconnection warning
silent urchin
Seem rather close to each other
dense plover
theres an item in renown thats like the flightwhistle but just for this zone
this is new i think
silent urchin
pretty sure that was there before
icons may be new
Do you ahve to unlock the other exits?
There's a lengthy tunnel for the south one from inside zaralek but it's still blocked at the end
dense plover
There's a lengthy tunnel for the south one from inside zaralek but it's still bl...
my guess is theyre not implemented
or are specifically active during a fyrakk assault maybe?
maybe tied to story?
silent urchin
similar tunnel for the south west, but has an invisible wall up
dense plover
this one is here
makes sense - this was where the miners could hear voices behind the wall
its blocked at the transition
silent urchin
Yeah, had what looked suspiciously like an entrance too
seems like gathering nodes are in
or at least more than there were before
dense plover
dont think they were in before
silent urchin
well, mining at least
there were like two for mining in the entire zone, now there's at least a bunch in the middle area
dense plover
wanderlings are in
silent urchin
some voice acting for wq/etc is in
silent urchin
final entrance is here, I think on live this is just a smallish cave
curious how this one is supposed to have been made
dense plover
oh
that one is the only one we dont know yet
rockslide maybe?
the three falls one is from mining exposing the tunnel for sure
testing out FPs
also i think they added a bunch of new decorations to the floors and ceilings throughout the cave
it looks more detailed and less barren
silent urchin
oh, new type of mining node, metamorphic
gave me a
gives a knowledge point and a journal entry and so on
no new spec stuff for it though
very high amount of rich nodes, and the rarer elemental nodes like primal
I did see seams here before as well, but not seeing any today
and it does only seem to be part of the map with nodes, all serevite
ember blaze
more things to fill up my bags 
silent urchin
hey at least you'll be able to trash all the reach stuff
I forgot to try overloading it :(
also I was wrong, that final cave entrance is pretty obviously there on live but blocked
Ok overloading makes a bunch of "Metamorphic spires" spawn which give you a whole bunch of the glowspores
dense plover
oh, new type of mining node, metamorphic
did you not see my posts right above?
dense plover
cool
silent urchin
no, thought I read them all but must have skipped some
upper pasture
wanderlings are in
Please say tameable. Even if I have to max somethings renown
dense plover
Please say tameable. Even if I have to max somethings renown
no idea - i dont have a hunter
silent urchin
haven't seen any mention of an unlock for them, but no reason why they wouldn't be from the start, I guess
upper pasture
Neat, I love them lol let’s hope they are tameable
silent urchin
seems to be new campaign steps
or I just missed that they continued at the top of valdrakken tower
silent urchin
stony tony has apparently had his speech/name encrypted?
oh apparently I only did up to the end of chapter 3 before, while 4 and 5 were available
weird I missed it
although there's so many phasing issues still possibly mine was screwed up
Was the Cause without a Rebel quest actually in before? I know the writings were
sidequest about stopping a plot by the dragonkin to blow up the valdrakken aqueduct
dense plover
Was the Cause without a Rebel quest actually in before? I know the writings were
no
its new
silent urchin
I wonder what happens if you choose the exceptionally racist options
dense plover
alexstrasza probably criticizes you
silent urchin
dense plover
she is the life warden afterall
silent urchin
first is good, second is bad, third is mix
might be more options as well, I had a couple that gave nothing
doesn't seem to change the outcome of the quest other than that
and you do indeed crack the code and end up going to the rebellious cliffs.. where you just came from and got the notes
well ok I guess you were at the caverns very slightly north
this chain started at the top of the tower, btw. Not sure what the requirements are, it involves maldra flametongue who was also part of the Misty Vale storyline in 10.0
Not entirely sure this is quite getting across the message they want, but I guess it's hard to be nuanced in less than a page of text
gives a title
ok there's a bit more which helps it come across better
I think it was ok but I feel like a lot of people aren't going to like it anyway
Feels like it was meant to be in 10.0 given the rebels were always there
subtle oar
Please say tameable. Even if I have to max somethings renown
Sadly no.
subtle oar
Petopia put out a tweet saying they are not tameable and not likely to be
dense plover
theyre too weird tbh
deep pawn
And Crawgs aren't?
dense plover
no i mean, the wanderlings are literally designed to be walking in liquid at all times
i dont know if their animations even work on land
and theyre too disproportionate
uncut vault
their attacks all use their legs, so that wouldnt logically be an issue anyways
not much different from devilsaurs moving all the way down to headbutt
blizz thought otherwise though, I guess
rain cave
anyone got any ideas on what kind of style that new silent star cloak is?
does it read as night-elven to anyone?
or just purple dragon style
dense plover
^
deep pawn
so that's 2203 secondaries, but that ilvl is likely wrong
no way it's not meant to be 450
I wonder what the uptime is
ember blaze
dragons are immortal? 🤔
harsh mason
dragons are immortal? 🤔
This is a term that is used to compare with ordinary races. Compared to them, yes
Alexstrasza is over 20,000 years old, so yes, they are closer to the immortals. And that is, dragons that are older than aspects
ember blaze
the aspect powers make them live forever right?
harsh mason
the aspect powers make them live forever right?
They live forever even without the power of aspects (as it is now). But I could be wrong
crystal pond
Aspects was actually immortal gods in terms due their power
In general dragons can die due old age
the aspects will also die of old age, but in fact they began to grow old not long ago, after deathwing's defeat
deep pawn
Sra'thik...
that's not a name for any type of Aqiri or Klaxxi I know?
oh, nevermind
They are mantid just not Klaxxi
So Neltharion at least knew of the Klaxxi before the sundering
hell, this entire room has Pandaria relics
Have we seen this statue elsewhere before?
silent urchin
tomb of sargeras, I think
deep pawn
Curious a Night Elf statue is mixed with Pandaria stuff though
deep pawn
in that room it's a personification of Elune no?
Because before it was a Tomb it was a Temple right
silent urchin
Yeah, that's the sisters of the moon boss
deep pawn
As far as I know there's been nothing to connect Elune to Pandaria
subtle oar
hell, this entire room has Pandaria relics
austere gazelle
There is also a drawing of the Guardian's tower of Dalaran somewhere in those room
which is ... weird
I can understand for the Highborne and stuff since the Dragon Isle were not " closed " before the Sundering
but for Dalaran though 🤔
plain violet
Dalaran is yeah... not understandable.
rain cave
just noticing that the darkmoon jester outfit shares a lot of coloring with shadowflame lmao
obv not directly tied to eachother but reinforces the suspicious connection between the fair and darker forces
plain violet
obv not directly tied to eachother but reinforces the suspicious connection betw...
Oh this, totally.
Darkmoon is really sus with many subquest hinting at old god.
I do like the idea however of old gods influence also being plain fun.
rain cave
Darkmoon is really sus with many subquest hinting at old god.
do we even know where the darkmoon island is?
plain violet
do we even know where the darkmoon island is?
Not for now, I think some theorized it would be near N'zoth.
uncut vault
silent urchin
you can get the hat?!
deep pawn
Wasn't sure the Darkmoon expansion in Hearthstone a ton of void?
rain cave
Wasn't sure the Darkmoon expansion in Hearthstone a ton of void?
old gods yeah
literally had all the old gods involved
but that's HS
that being said it would be funny if HS was lore relevant to old gods twice in a row being its only lore additions
since for some reason the WoW devs just went with the HS look for N'zoth
which, fair enough?
but I just found it surprising that the secretive n'zoth we just knew what he looked all along it turned out
austere gazelle
since for some reason the WoW devs just went with the HS look for N'zoth
For some reason? Main reason being that they wanted to put old gods into HS and they already had his look for the BFA expack in the work so they went with it.
I mean, it'd be kinda stupid to introduce a new old god nobody saw in a card game with a random look and have it introduced in wow with a totally different look in the end
silent urchin
oh apparently there's a lot more spells this build that strongly imply dracthyr is getting a tank spec
although could just be NPC stuff
rain cave
For some reason? Main reason being that they wanted to put old gods into HS and ...
The nzoth card got released ages before bfa
austere gazelle
Expansion are developed way before they released though, even on concept art
rain cave
Still, they could have been done like
A shadowy figure
Something that still represents him as a card
But kept his physical form masked
Like some glowing eyes and a vague shadow
rain cave
do we reckon evokers are actually getting a new spec?
saw the datamined stuff
but that could equally be abilities given for the questline
if they do add a 3rd spec I reckon that would just be a hint at them adding more to other classes instead of new classes going forward
since most of the remaining fantasies could be done via specs to existing classes
and if we assume they've planned a way to stop the same power creep that the old talent system had, where things just kept growing vertically
would only make sense to expand horizontally as well
austere gazelle
DH need a third spec ;p
rain cave
DH need a third spec ;p
they already had one cooking at some point
could be cool if they tied the fantasy of that third spec with the DH's also finding more purpose now the legions gone
adapting their power, finding new power sources, now that the legion is a non threat
austere gazelle
maybe its linked to this new reputation that popped up since last patch.
rain cave
e.g. a new spec that's more inquisitor themed with the 2H fantasy the 3rd spec was most likely going to have
and it's more controlled
the lore being they're a new sect dedicated to stamping out dreadlords and other internal treachery
since atm there is no frontline war if that makes sense
the biggest threat to the factions is the fact the denathrius and his dreadlords are still out there, and there's potential internal traitors or spies
even from other things such as the void
austere gazelle
Or a Warden orientated spec since in the lore the warden and the DH are often associated. The hunter becoming the hunted, etc
rain cave
combine them
3rd spec for DH focused on 2H, containment and soul manipulation like was originally teased
whilst the remaining DH's join the wardens as 'normal' wardens in the old spec
a new spec is created for a new purpose
using the soulscythe woman NPC as the head of that
austere gazelle
Warden weapon are indeed 2h
This could be linked with the return of Illidan and maybe an alliance Burning Legion faction
rain cave
illidan comes back with scars of order magic bet
austere gazelle
opening to Draenei Warlock and Eredar allied race
rain cave
3rd spec is a combination of ordered fel
since we're getting so many combined cosmic elements
shadowflame, life/death (ardenweald), light and order being kind of the same in places like zereth mortis
iron jungle
Hm
rain cave
if they're looking to add buffing specs as a new type as well
tyr could be the basis for a new paladin spec focused on buffing
as he is the one related to empowering the aspects, and infusing with order
but he is also tied to light obv
chronomancer mage, buff allies there
austere gazelle
imagine not a third spec... but a third talent tree based on buffing xD ( nightmare to balance though )
deep pawn
I wonder if he'd be chill with ordered fel. That combo of opposing forces hasn't been seen elsewhere besides I guess disc priests
Balance druids at one point balanced life and Death rather than astral and lunar
Man I'd kill to have a blessing paladin back again
I'm so tired of dps mains whining they don't care about their performance anymore because of things like infusion.
rain cave
Man I'd kill to have a blessing paladin back again
I feel like a buffing spec would also be a great way to make lower ilvl players more viable
since they're more enabling somebody else to throughput
it kind of averages between the 2 players in terms of DPS
instead of one being just plain lower
ember blaze
holy priest has fit in well with what i envision a buff spec would look like
rain cave
holy priest has fit in well with what i envision a buff spec would look like
I mean discipline is the closest thing we have atm
so I would think them first
ember blaze
in what way
rain cave
disc are the closest thing we have to a kind of dps/healer hybrid and that to me feels closer to a buffer
esp because they have power infusion
and can do some weird buffing things
idk
ember blaze
i dont think a support class should be a dps character
also
Holy priest has had several things that kinda fit in wel
rain cave
the issue with making holy a support spec is that you're taking the default heal spec away
as in, holy priest is the most straightforward healing firehose spec
new players can just pick up holy priest and shart heals out by facerolling
they're meant to be that way by design
ember blaze
night fae ability, i know it's a general thing, but they were the only ones that used it well. Symbol of hope resetting defensive cd and restoring mana to healers. hymmn increasing healing taken
Guardian spirit increasing healing on an ally and providing a cheat death
im not talking about making them a support spec
im saying they are close to what I envision a support spec could look like
but going further
ember blaze
why does a support spec have to only be dps?
rain cave
but disc are best known for it
but power infusion is probs the closest thing to a support spec
that I envision
I remember back in legion enhance and ret had passives too
to increase allies damage
similarly
ember blaze
supportive buffs do not have to be purely damage buffs
rain cave
I know, but in reality most of them should be
because support would have to fit into a DPS slot
and make up for that lost DPS slot
ember blaze
you say that but i think they should stick to having it be a healer
ember blaze
i dont understand how that makes any sense
rain cave
because when people are talking about adding a new type of spec, specifically the new dracthyr one
ember blaze
a damage dealing spec should be a damage dealing spec
ember blaze
a healer would better much fit in a role where their own personal performance is not as relevant
rain cave
who relies on buffing their allies to do the damage for them
ember blaze
otherwise you have issues where the dps players cry about how they have a tax
rain cave
and giving utility
rain cave
yes
DPS players want to dps
so they play dps
healers want to heal
so they heal
buffers want to buff
so they buff
rain cave
but because buffing healing is just
healing
not buffing
and healing is a premium slot anyways#
making buffers a DPS standin
makes more sense logically
ember blaze
it doesnt
youre adding more problems there
and you have to tune damage provided even higher
rain cave
ok lets say you're in a dungeon
you can't have a buffer as your only healer
buffers need to be able to do dungeons
so they have to be DPS basically
unless it's a tank spec, that doesn't do much damage itself just tanks
but buffs the parties DPS
ember blaze
we're talking about different playstyles here
rain cave
I enjoy buffing allies to support them
ember blaze
maybe youre talkinga bout adding a fourth role
ember blaze
I enjoy buffing allies to support them
which is why i used holy priest as an example
rain cave
I'm talking about adding a new archetype
ember blaze
but a new healer could go further in that direction
rain cave
which is why i used holy priest as an example
but holy priest don't really buff allies
in dps wise
they just
heal
currently ret paladin and enhance are probs closest
ember blaze
youre kinda ignoring what im saying
rain cave
since they can still provide dps increases
to the group
if you're talking about general buffs
not dps
everyone can do that
everyone has some utility
ember blaze
everyone can do that
yeah theyve just slapped everything to everyone
we already have a bunch of buffs in this game
and it's kinda my takeaway
if they wanted to, they could probably just build a spec around that
upper pasture
yeah but if the "new buff spec" is a healer spec who's gonna heal when that healer is doing the buff spec
you'd just be creating a "new" healing type
ember blaze
sounds fine to me 
upper pasture
there would be no change to the meta it would still be tank/healer/3 dps
ember blaze
which is probably how it should stay
upper pasture
not the possible tank/healer/buff/2 dps
ember blaze
i dont think they should add a fourth role
rain cave
which is probably how it should stay
but then that's not what we're discussing
we're discussing how they would IF they did
ember blaze
unless they have plans to release multiple options for that fourth spec
upper pasture
i feel like it's likely isn't going to happen but it would be pretty neat
rain cave
unless they have plans to release multiple options for that fourth spec
that's what I was discussing earlier
ember blaze
they can easily just stick to the current roles
and just design a new playstyle
where personal performance isnt as important
rain cave
tyr based paladin buffing spec, monk vitalization spec, evokers buffer spec, mage chronomancer
that being said I'd prefer they added the new buffer specs to mostly classes that are triple DPS
so they they have an alternative playstyle
ember blaze
yeah i dont see that working out well
i expect healers being more inclined towards a buff spec, and less likely if theyre more dps oriented.
specially shadow being an example of players being salty of giving away a buff
and how important they want their dmg to be
upper pasture
yes but that's because its either A buff someone else and loss dps or the new spec would be B. this is your job to buff others to increase their dam
rain cave
I like B
upper pasture
it feels bad when you're all 3 dps competing for top dps but if you're there to buff others youll want to do that
rain cave
I remember the soulbinds that buffed others
like the crit kyrian one
I really enjoyed that
made my hunter kyrian just for it
doing a full crit build, and provided crit support
deep pawn
I'm pretty sure any buff spec would be like FF14 dancer which was balanced as a dps
rain cave
I'm pretty sure any buff spec would be like FF14 dancer which was balanced as a ...
no idea on anything ff14
from what I played though it felt pretty shite compared to WoW's combat xD
deep pawn
It does early
It has a longer gcd, but as you level you start getting a ton of off gcd skills you weave in to where it's as fast as WoW
deep pawn
Plus everyone's favorite shuffle casting where you can move in the last bit of a spell and it still goes off
There's parts of some dps rotations that are faster than combat rogues
rain cave
was expecting it to be a more impressive shiny looking game
deep pawn
I mean it's only a couple years younger than WoW.
They're doing a massive graphics upgrade heading into the next expansion
But that's secondary to the dancer class being 80% dps 20% buff and balanced that way
rain cave
it's strange with ff14
I did try to get into it but just felt such an aversion to it
since it's so opaque to get into
and feels just
wrong
launcher wouldn't be out of place on windows vista, thought I'd downloaded the wrong game for a sec
deep pawn
For whatever reason they don't like updating the launcher or how you buy sub time
rain cave
couldn't tell if I had a subscription, if it needed a subscription
deep pawn
But that's Japan for you
uncut vault
Dancer def is the best comparison for a modern MMO support, it's basically just a DPS but who has rotational abilities to also buff allies while they do damage
WoW would more than likely go that route too
upper pasture
that was my biggest complain so far with ff14 is adding and subbing/unsubbing is...like complex for no reason.
deep pawn
Early on you just start as a random adventurer for hire. It's a story start Japan loves. It's not that different than how classic WoW starts.
rain cave
no I get that
I just mean
there's no way I can take final fantasy serious as a franchise
because each game isn't even the same bloody universe
and there's no like constant stakes or tonality
uncut vault
I mean you're not supposed to do that lol
Final fantasy is a genre of its own more than a franchise
deep pawn
Why does it have to be? Are you mad if a writer finishes one story and starts another?
rain cave
Why does it have to be? Are you mad if a writer finishes one story and starts an...
no I'm fine with anthologies, but they're usually within the same universe of eachother
uncut vault
the connection between games are the enemies, the conventions, the artstyle, etc., not the story
rain cave
I guess it just feels
soulless
just there because it has to be
same publisher who puts them in a silly game with fucking disney characters
deep pawn
It's just my opinion but FF14 has one of the best rpg stories I've ever played and to have it in an MMO is mind blowing
ivory meadow
how far are you Saint?
upper pasture
eh to each their own
rain cave
was told to go to a bank
shop
or something
idk
then went outside killed some stuff
logged off
like a good hour or two of wandering around basically
uncut vault
so you literally just... havent played it lol
deep pawn
Oof, yeah, Uldah is like starting in Undercity
ivory meadow
so it's just the slow start getting you
upper pasture
i tried three times to get into FF14. it just doesn't do it for me. i love the single player FFs but an MMO FF just falls flat to me
upper pasture
yeah, i know
ivory meadow
not to you Daniel
glass flicker
FFXIV is good, but I prefer WoW combat and roleplay better.
rain cave
only other MMO's I could really get into were GW2 and Warframe if that counts
glass flicker
It's faster.
upper pasture
the thing that turned me off FF14 endgame was when i was explained it's less about skill and gear then it's about "knowing the dance" for the fight
deep pawn
Max level dps felt plenty fast to me but I mostly played dancer and bard.
rain cave
is there even talents?
ivory meadow
nope.
rain cave
ewwww
glass flicker
I just got to unlock monk for my pugilist and stopped playing. FF is not for me.
deep pawn
If the WoW top raiders had their way it'd be that way for WoW too. That hate any sort of randomness in mechanics
rain cave
how are you supposed to have build diversity
deep pawn
You don't. It's more about playing your job well and doing mechanics. It's not like WoW has build diversity either
glass flicker
What I love in FFXIV is the glamour system and the emote system.
rain cave
You don't. It's more about playing your job well and doing mechanics. It's not l...
bro WoW has loads of build diversity
look at the talent tree
deep pawn
You're either the right build for your content or you're inting
glass flicker
In retrospect, I enjoyed the game. But it's not what I'm looking for in an MMO.
deep pawn
A couple of flex points is not true diversity
rain cave
I think WoW has a lot of potential for build diversity
being able to skew fury in different directions for example
or destro lock either being chaos bolt spammy focused or just going fully incinerate fire based
each spec has atleast 2 viable playstyles from what I've seen
and those each have their own flexing within
ivory meadow
2 playstyles is not exactly "loads of build diversity"
rain cave
2 playstyles is not exactly "loads of build diversity"
I said atleast
I do wish we had more though
I'm glad they're adding more like unique proc based items and trinkets, items with slottable effects
upper pasture
i mean, there's M+ buiilds/PvP/raid builds.
ivory meadow
I agree on that
deep pawn
Most specs I've seen at best you have single target or AOE builds. In FF14 you just always have both
rain cave
ideally we can have a WoW retail that takes design cues from REDACTED
personally I'd love to see WoW have more glyph/talent things where you can equip more flavored abilities, and modifications to those
deep pawn
Art takes too much time plus won't you think of pvp clarity
rain cave
no I mean effects wise
like
interactions
mechanics
e.g. a unique weapon that converts a your nature damage to fire damage
and an assassination rogue picking up all the poison talents
and then finding another item that interacts with fire damage
upper pasture
thats soooooo much extra balancing
rain cave
it's fun though
and it wouldn't be a massive balance nightmare if they put more of an effort into quicker balance changes
if it's a lot of work to look at the chart and go "damn that rogue build is fucking overpowered" and tune its numbers, they've got a workflow problem
w/e
I just like sprawling cross system interaction, and interesting effects
allowing people to repurpose abilities for new builds
deep pawn
Sounds like you just want to play path of exile
rain cave
nah never played it I hate that grindy style of game
upper pasture
it's easy to sit here and say "just balance it"
ivory meadow
i mean, there's M+ buiilds/PvP/raid builds.
yes, but as Kyle said, you're taking those builds not out of any want to play how you want but only because it's sink or swim if you do or don't.
rain cave
not a huge fan of the RSI inducing top down camera
upper pasture
but in reality it doesn't work like that
rain cave
gives me PTSD of when I played through the diablo 3 campaign
upper pasture
yes, but as Kyle said, you're taking those builds not out of any want to play ho...
you don't have to play BiS specs to do content
rain cave
having to click on each individual enemy...
deep pawn
That's cause PoE was born as a Diablo clone and the isometric camera is a relic of that just like how it is in mobas cause of wc3
ivory meadow
you don't have to play BiS specs to do content
of course not no, that's not my point.
I never said anything about playing BiS
rain cave
I mean as someone who's played 3500 hours of dota
I'm acquainted with WC3 history and the top down camera
upper pasture
of course not no, that's not my point.
reread your last comment?
rain cave
I just dislike it in the diablo context where it feels like enemies hitboxes are smaller than their models
and mousing over them manually to attack in hordes is painful
ivory meadow
reread your last comment?
and where did I say anything about playing BiS?
rain cave
but yeah I'd love to have more creativity in build creation
upper pasture
"you're taking those builds not out of any want to play how you want but only because it's sink or swim if you do or don't."
you don't have to take those builds to do that content
deep pawn
It makes it harder and it comes at the cost of a ton of social friction
upper pasture
you can do whatever build you want it's just some perform better than others