PvE slowly dying

[nimble saffron]

So I am a time limited player like many others on this game and this recent update has further pushed players to be affiliated with a military faction or pirates as PvP seems to be almost a necessity at this point.

If you want to progress with PvE and play solo as many time limited people do. You are just wasting time at this point because there is so little you can do.

A fix for this would have been to just actually do the changes that were announced in the roadmap instead of this BS that wasn’t announced.

I could deal with the current changes if the PvP circle had been removed. Instead we got NPS to protect trade unions near trade routes. Which doesn’t add up to much since most of the time you’re gonna get ganked in those waters by at least 3 people if not 5.

A random NPS is not gonna make a bit of difference if you’re fighting 5 people solo.

Moral of this post: PvE players will be this games lifeblood for the long term so if you wanna incentivise PvP I’m all for it, however stop killing the PvE player base.

[last escarp]

Why PVP comes from restricting some PVE style but not from making it more interesting and profitable? Can you please think about new players when Los Catuano, Fiji and South Bastion being pirates owned? This will be a blast for new players for sure.

[sand hazel]

this is going to cause new players to quit. its almost got me out too. what a wierd way to put your own game down. they are doing a self inflicted gunshot to the leg with this

[main raptor]

I am debating even logging on today and I was having fun too.

They need to overhaul the restock system so that you don't have to wait irl days to continue to be a merchant

[lean sphinx]

I’d be curious to see if fort loot has increased with their enhanced difficulty or if it’s the same…

Regarding captives, I actually think it’s a good idea to have them require PVP flags for transport, but only if there’s a “legal” alternative (hiring sailors for a fraction of the manpower is not economically viable).

#1483956098657550366 message

[velvet jay]

Im honestly curious. I get all the points PVE players are making but just like any other MMO this game offers more for players who play in a guild and even in a faction.
I personally never really noticed PVE as any form of endgame. Sure you can sink NPCs, sure you can trade but whats the goal? Getting better ships to do the same? You essentially won't have any more content

I think this game has always been PVP oriented, but it wasn't pressuring players into PVP. Now we could argue about it that now it does, but you still have options to keep doing PVE

If you decide to join a military faction I think its reasonable to have your Peace Flags not working around hostile ports
For traders this is more questionable tho

And also, you can play as a flotilla or netrual alone you still have your Peace Flags available at any times (not in the middle zone ofc)

[nimble saffron]

The thing is. The devs themselves said they were gonna expand PvE content.

[velvet jay]

Thats right. I think the problem with the update is the lack of content
They just made changes to the existing systems

Simple, introduce more content for PVE AND PVP

[nimble saffron]

I’m in a trade union and I’m setting this game down for a while till something happens.

I just don’t have it in me to move everything from Gray Island just for the next port I go to be taken by pirates lol.

[nimble saffron]

Now if the middle circle had gone away like they said it would. I think these changes would be more manageable at least.

[velvet jay]

There's always the option for you to settle in those dedicated trader ports in the southwest tho?

[sand hazel]

hard to fill my mines when i got people camping them

[nimble saffron]

True, however guild missions rn are top left of the map.

[velvet jay]

What mines? The middle? You took the risk to start them for the extra bonus they give. Risk-reward

[sand hazel]

yea in the middle and no i dont own those

didnt get those for that exact reason. now i have the same problem outside of pvp zone

[velvet jay]

Then you can still peace-flag your way into any other mines or am I missing something?

[hidden trout]

all you pve players crying like crazy on a game called World of Sea Battle...

what do you mean my guy?

lool

[nimble saffron]

😭

[sand hazel]

you can camp personal islands now. you cant leave personal island with peace flags and captives if someone leaves the island with captives you can just fallow and gank. thats my problem. sure you can get captives under peace flag and go to mines with them without losing peace flag. but if thats the case why make me peace flag leaving island with them?

[hidden trout]

sorry but if you want to be always protected by a flag and engage in 0 pvp, then why are you playing this game? genuine question

[sage ingot]

Do you want the game to die?

[hidden trout]

you understand that the majority of the game's content is pvp right?

late game*

[sand hazel]

i do plenty of pvp im in a guild and do port battles all the time. im in the endless sea and circle too. but when you take pve features away for people to just have a chill time and allow things to be camped by groups thats not good for anyone. sure you have fun camping that spot right. but no one will use that feature if that can happen

[sage ingot]

You do understand that this game's appeal is its balance between pvp and the pve players' choice to engage in pvp or not? Break this balance and the game dies

[sand hazel]

there is so many ways to pvp already. and this just added more ways. but no pve content was added it was just taken away

[hidden trout]

i honestly dont believe people would camp those spots because the likelyhood of finding someone is not very high and it would require some patience, but thats my opinion ofc

[sand hazel]

people do it now for lighthouses and ports in the circle already. why wouldnt they now?!

you can believe that but it already happens lol

[sage ingot]

The likelyhood of it happening is based on how much that island spot is used.

[velvet jay]

I personally never camped anything like that and never had the intention to do so. And im sure most people arent either

[sand hazel]

oh your just sure huh lol

[hidden trout]

i have to disagree on the word balencing there, because if there's something this game lacks is balancing between pvp and pve, considering that until this patch was released, pve players could use peace flag freely everywhere they went. I don't think that is balanced compared to pvp players (pirates in specific)

[velvet jay]

Yeah ive been playing as a pirate since release I know my way around

[nimble saffron]

So let’s look long term. What happens when other PvP ship games come out???? The PvP players will drift towards them while the PvE players remain on this game. PvE players will be here more long term than the PvP ones will. I’ve seen it time and time again.

[velvet jay]

But whats the long term? We dont have PVE endgame activity

How do you want to stick long term as a PVE if you have nothing to do

[hidden trout]

where in the world did you get this idea from?

I think it's precisely the opposite. PvP players will likely stay because they farmed for the ships, cannons, consumables etc and the endgame is the pvp battles, PBs, etc

[nimble saffron]

See that’s the thing.

The devs said they were going to expand PvE content, not restrict it further.

[hidden trout]

With this I agree, this patch is more like an adjustment to features and not new content

[nimble saffron]

They will get bored of it eventually. May take a year, may be 6 months, but it will happen.

[hidden trout]

and you honestly believe that PVE players will not? farming the same NPS over and over again? they will likely get mored way sooner I think

Also, what are the PVE players farming for exactly? Isn't it to get better ships and cannons etc for pvp? or to simply keep killing the same NPS but with stronger ships? You see my point?

[nimble saffron]

Well that’s where PvE expansion comes in. You can only do so much with PvP, but since this game does incorporate fantasy elements. PvE options for future expansion are far broader.

[velvet jay]

I think we can agree on that that this game currently lacks content but its for PVP too

[sage ingot]

That is the problem. It is balanced when pve players can sail around in peace flags. Take away too much of their choice, and they choose to quit the game.

[velvet jay]

We could rename this thread then cuz let me tell you PVP elements are slowly dying too

[hidden trout]

honestly i would love if they added mystical creatures, but i remember seeing someone (mod or dev don't remember) mention they don't want to go that path.
But adding big bosses would be hella cool

[nimble saffron]

This I agree with. I think more overall would be better and the state of the game as of now cannot support these haphazard changes.

Yeah it would be a neat feature. Plus there’s the whole lore behind the witnesses of the apocalypse they could expand on as well.

[hidden trout]

indeed

[main raptor]

The game is like the majority of PvEvP games on the market.

Majority of the game is PvE with PvP elements sprinkled in while levelling, and a more heavily orientated PvP at end game.

The issue is taking away people's choice during all stages of play. If you're farming resources and have your own island and mines, you now cant transport captives from your home port to increase production values and lessen your grind.

This will either force people to the in game shop, or to quit.

Also, your PvE comments are entirely subjective and you need to stop stating them as fact. You may consider PvE nothing to do at end game, but what you consider nothing to do is other people's fun. You considering it nothing or not important does not detract that people enjoy it, even if thats only increasing their gold balance.

Just like the PvPers that sit and camp and hit empty ships because it's 'fun'

[velvet jay]

By using captives you essentially boost your production meaning higher reward. It makes sense to make it PVP and thus increase the risk I think.

There's always the option not to use captives too. And it will still make a lot of materials if you have high tier mines.

Again, noone is forced to take on PVP in this case

[main raptor]

Imo if they want to use lore reasons that captives are illegal, then they shouldn't police it with ganking and griefing PvP players. Spawn bounty hunters along the way if you have lots of captives or something.

[velvet jay]

Its not that its rather balancing decision imo
Captives boost your production by what, 300%? This meant that before you could just use peace flags and farm as much captives as you wanted. Then transfers these to boost your production and farm materials in your mines and just essentially have nothing to worry about.
This change so when you transfer captives you become PVPable introduces balance into the system in a way

[lean sphinx]

the fact that captives are so critical to the game economy is precisely why there needs to be a PVE alternative

[velvet jay]

Yeah and the fact you can use (or could've used before the patch) peace flag to infinitely grind and transport them for example to you Print Shops (BM farm) and farm thousands of Battle Marks relatively safely (yes, endless has free PVP but isnt that populated imo) is just not great for the economy too. Battle Marks are the main PVP currency, so why would you be able to farm them that easily without doing any or just barely some PVP?

Now same with any other material.
Again, captives boost production by 300%, its just hilarious too

[lean sphinx]

battle mark mines aren't particularly lucrative imo due to the time investment. I don't see how being able to grind in peace is a bad thing, but as you said, you're already PVP flagged when you go to those anyway, so why is that relevant to the peace flag topic?

Other than daily missions that call for you to risk pvp, the only other way for a PVE player to really earn battle marks in-game is those mines or to just buy them on the market

[terse wing]

The fishing mini game, is annoying.

and the peace flag thing, breaks any chance for trading being in a faction.

i've been playing this game since october, now im out.

[velvet jay]

You can easily gain over 1k every 2 days
Yes essentially Print Shops are PVP but the logic applies to any other mine too

[lean sphinx]

That's at the expense of doing other things. It's quite a trip to get to those mines and there's always a risk that you'll be hit on the way/on the way back

mines inside the main map don't require PVP flags to use unless they're in the Abyss

[velvet jay]

Exactly, thats why you could have high gains before with zero risk. Now that captives turn you into PVP mode you have high risk high reward

[lean sphinx]

The issue, imo, is that there's not a meaningful alternative for manpower on personal islands

[velvet jay]

If you dont want that just dont use captives, still free mats

[velvet jay]

Yeah I can agree with that, but this could be a different issue

[lean sphinx]

you can technically buy infinite musketeers at your dock (if you've built it) but that's not a viable alternative

[lean sphinx]

Well, I've said from the get-go that I like the change to have captives force PVP flags

I just don't like the lack of a PVE alternative

[lean sphinx]

#1483956098657550366 message

added a line to the tl;dr to clarify the removal of crew/manpower exchange

[velvet jay]

I understand

Well, regarding this feed "PVE slowly dying" isnt because of forced PVP or PVP overall, just the lack of content
Thats where this update went wrong

Many people were expecting new stuff, new content, spring event, and we mainly got changes (some werent even necessary)

[lean sphinx]

I think several of the changes were undercooked. Good ideas but missing the mark in execution

[velvet jay]

I like some ideas too but we got 6 new sails for some reason that are very specific and only change the way we play the content we've been playing since the release
Its still something new but its not really

[lean sphinx]

Bit unhappy with how some sails are so blatantly strong and expensive but I do like the idea of a bit more build specialization