#other-games

1 messages · Page 27 of 1

tranquil cove
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gaming is supposed to happen on the most elite system not on a console or phone for me

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so all my sound on PC, including when i voice chat or game is 5 system surround sound with subwoofer

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with dedicated sound card

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i hate the idea of headset because i can't hear my surroundings

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what if somebody breaks in

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to steal my expensive sound system

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though i heard they have special headsets now that let you hear around you or some crap

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but still wont be as good as nothing covering your ears at all

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the idea of walking looking down at a phone while crossing street or having ears plugged while crossing the street so you can't hear your surrounding triggers me

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i keep my phone in my bag when i go places

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not even in my pocket

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i like my pockets empty.

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meanwhile i see people walking around with their phones in their hand... like it's become an extension of their hand

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growing up everyone had like nintendo hand held and was playing pokemon, never saw the appeal

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i got to enjoy recess playing soccer and hunting for bugs

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not playing pokemon on my hand held

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another reason phone gaming seems wierd to me

tepid wadi
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Yeah, everyone does things differently, I think the general mobile integration trend is what while you and I may not use mobile gaming, it's by far the biggest gaming market.

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So it makes sense to target that audience specifically. I just wish it wasn't "remove 90% of the complexity from our game to make it mobile compatible"

tranquil cove
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phone gaming is only big because PCs are expensive, and people have adhd

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and get bored/lack imagination to do things and be present in the moment

paper jetty
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Is anyone here good at c++. I am having trouble with converting some pseudocode, I'm in college and I'll get dropped if I fail this class...

tranquil cove
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i bet half the billion dollars they made in phone gaming didn't happen while the person was gaming on their phone at home

tepid wadi
tranquil cove
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1/3rd of the phone gaming happens because parents give their kids a tablet/phone as a way to parent for 8 hours.

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and just buy whatever the kid wants because it's an easy way to shut them up

paper jetty
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@tepid wadi I tried but nodby knew what I was talking about and I had to pay to get serious help...

tranquil cove
paper jetty
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@tranquil cove Could you get me in touch with them by any chance?

tranquil cove
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you could look for C++ discord servers

paper jetty
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Thank you so much

tranquil cove
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no idea if they will be of any help, most coders don't really have time or want to do things for free lol

paper jetty
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@tranquil cove Yeah I've started to notice that. I gotta find a way tho cuz I've already failed once and I can't again. It's a regular 9-5 if I do

tranquil cove
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not really a fan of the game mechanics

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doesn't seem that easy to catch onto, no idea how to add speed to attacks

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directional attacks just mostly seem random to me

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not really able to get the attacks i want

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no idea how to pick up items to add to inventory

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character customization is bad

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they rng'ed the characters which is 90% of the time a bad mechanic

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they should have given us more freedom in choosing the name during character creation, rather than adding nicknames or rerolling the name after the character is created

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just let me type my own character name.. seriously.

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let me choose the starting gear.

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let me choose if my character has tatoos or not

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i don't care if their background is a slave, its my game, don't tell me how a slave should look like

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it's not like you're playing my game and will be bothered by how they look

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overall bad decisions in the character creation screen imo

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just because it's a rogue lite doesn't mean you need to rogue lite character creation

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currently at this development t's maybe a $10 game to me, not worth the $23

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they basically took the exanima arena combat system and reproduced it

timber prism
tranquil cove
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unless i had no house

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and my job involved moving locations between hotels every week

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even then a laptop is better

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why would i even want to play games like candycrush or some tower defense game mr beast plays

timber prism
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This is what makes you ignorant.

tranquil cove
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play real games, or do something else with my time that is 100% better than wasting time on those games

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there is 100 more fun things not related to gaming that surpasses a game like tower defense

timber prism
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15 million people alone daily commute via train in Japan

tranquil cove
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that involves putting your phone down and doing them

timber prism
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It gives them something to do on said commute

tranquil cove
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lol

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yeah adhd

timber prism
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Old man being old man again

tranquil cove
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people can't sit still or with their thoughts for an hour

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trains in japan are fast too

timber prism
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Its okay grandpa

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You just keep being old

tranquil cove
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they could do work on the train, read a book, think about something, observe other people, look out the window, etc. but they need to game on their phone 😆

timber prism
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They could do that all while at home too but you recommended PC gaming

tranquil cove
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you realize i am not attacking you specifically, just saying i think ADHD is involved in this situation with gaming and phones

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but you keep making everything about me personally

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hopefully the mods realize the distinction there

timber prism
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What needs to be modded???

tranquil cove
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i don't know, i'm not a mod

timber prism
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I'm just merely pointing out your way of thinking is old school

tranquil cove
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you're calling me grandpa lol

timber prism
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Okay and?

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You are

tranquil cove
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you're making it about me

timber prism
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????

tranquil cove
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if i was being a smart ass i might say the younger 14 year olds of today have no clue how to have discussions without making them personal, but i am more mature than that.

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as an example of this being the wrong thing to say ^

timber prism
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Okay

tranquil cove
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i'm no more a grandpa, than you are 14 years old

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lol

timber prism
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No you are def a grandpa

tranquil cove
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but i will be a grandpa, and you were 14 once

tranquil cove
# timber prism No you are def a grandpa

nah i am progressive, and younger than the younger generation in a lot of ways and know more about their latest trends and culture than 90% of the people my age because i live on the internet.

timber prism
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Lmao

tranquil cove
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see how you made it about me yet?

timber prism
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You are the opposite of progression

tranquil cove
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we can talk about me if you want

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in DMs

timber prism
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Its okay. You just old man thinking

tranquil cove
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age has nothing to do with it, don't be ageist

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unless you mean i am more intelligent with age

timber prism
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Def not

honest valley
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if only mobile phone gaming had any decent games that werent microtransaction hell

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and i feel a touchscreen is very limiting in your ability to play

tranquil cove
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i'd rather see virtual reality goggles and headsets take off

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than phone gaming

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this makes me not old as an example since VR is even better and newer and could be more mobile in the future

timber prism
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I don't see how you can call yourself progressive when you equate the rise of mobile gaming to bad parenting and adhd

honest valley
timber prism
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That is some egotistical behavior

tranquil cove
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i mean there is bad parenting with phones/tablets and kids getting their own phone at 8 years old

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though if you take this idea of gaming on the go because you're bored to sit in a train for 1 hour. imagine a future where you get on train by lying down, and you're taken into a virtual reality world where you play a game, and have no clue where your body is until the pod opens and you arrive at your destination. maybe you could call up a virtual map to see where the train is on the line.

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but ew what a crappy world imo

timber prism
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Thats another misconception

tranquil cove
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meanwhile they steal your brainwave data

timber prism
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That mobile gaming rose because of kids

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Its literally just convenience

tranquil cove
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i didn't say it rose because of kids, i just said a lot of the revenue comes from there

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kids are less likely to own consoles or desktop pcs

timber prism
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Its also reasons why the switch sells as well as it does

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Gaming on the go

tranquil cove
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games like roblox are majority played by 8-16 year olds or something and i doubt it's all on PC

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As of December 2023, gaming company Roblox Corporation reported that 80 percent of Roblox game users signed up on a mobile device.

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yeah and around 60% are kids

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or more

timber prism
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Revenue for mobile gaming comes from swiping

tranquil cove
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According to Roblox Corporation, 60 per cent of its 70 million active daily users are under the age of 16.

timber prism
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Most of the whales in China are not kids

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They are rich adults spending hundreds of thousands per person

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Like the games I play had people spending 50k USD a month

tranquil cove
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yeah sounds healthy

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my mistake they don't have a psychological problem like ADHD

timber prism
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Whatever... drop of water in a bucket

tranquil cove
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i can see gambling being big on the phone though

timber prism
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Well yeah. Gacha gaming

tranquil cove
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and maybe dating apps, but i don't agree with dating apps, i would never use one

timber prism
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Its literally been a thing for a long time XD

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Why wouldn't you use a dating app???

tranquil cove
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it's an ideal way to meet people if you are into meeting people that way

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lets put it that way

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but for me i would find the wrong type of person because i have different values

timber prism
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😅

candid quiver
tranquil cove
candid quiver
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It comes off really horrid imo.

tranquil cove
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and only some people

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not all

candid quiver
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Its clearly a dumb and insensitive take, and also shows a lack of understanding of both subjects (mobile, and mental health)

timber prism
honest valley
timber prism
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I believe you can use RetroidArch if you have an Android

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To accomplish that

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I don't really emulate games on mobile first hand

dusk bluff
dusk bluff
dusk bluff
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I play a lot of N64, all gens of Gameboy, Pokemon ROM hacks, PSP, PS1

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You could argue I am playing them on the best hardware too since my phone is way more powerful than any of the devices that were used to play the games I am emulating.

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Also the whole people are addicted and should read a book. What about reading on your phone? Lol it's the same thing.

tranquil cove
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if i'm insensitive maybe i learned from the community here lol there's nothing sensitive about your wording of things.

tranquil cove
finite saffron
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I feel like we should move on from this topic, doesn't seem particularly productive

dusk bluff
timber prism
tranquil cove
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i dont even like phones for cameras

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like probably because im spoiled on my actual camera

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something that is dedicated to taking photos is better to me than a cell phone camera

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same way a desktop PC dedicated toward gaming will be better than a mobile phone

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i was complaining my cell phone camera couldnt focus on an image and my friend was joking that i'm the only person they know whose upset with the fact that they have a tiny super computer in their hands. and i was like well... it's a bad computer it can't focus properly. they designed the software poorly.

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i'll stick to my brick of a canon camera any day, would rather carry 5lb camera around

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maybe i'll be impressed with cell phones in 2100 but i wont be alive then

timber prism
tranquil cove
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i mean you say its good, i say it's not

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nothing is ever accomplished that way need some sort of evidence based knowledge to back up both points

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in my experience they suck

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if your experience is that they are good, then i'm happy for you

timber prism
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Im saying if you can't get your camera to focus properly. That is user error

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DSLR and mirror less will still outperform smartphones but to say smart phones take bad pictures is just user error

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You can just look up numerous articles from professional photographers on the pros and cons

tranquil cove
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user error is funny comment to make

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for a device whose whole existence is about being easier to use for the user

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so it comes to manufacturing error now if thats the case, if it was user error

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they are doing bad a job of designing something thats easy to use

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it's not just me i've seen people who have been using phones their whole life having issues focusing on what they want to

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and struggling to take a picture for 2 minutes

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with my canon 10 seconds, and it focuses properly

tranquil cove
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they believe something and look it up to confirm what they believe

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i always google the opposite of what i believe

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so IF i should be googling how cell phone cameras are great, you should be googling how they are bad 😄

timber prism
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I'm not saying to look up if they are great. I'm stating there are numerous existing articles from professionals who weight the pros and cons

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Someone struggle bussing to get their phone to focus due to various factors which include understanding the limitations to their phone is user error.

tranquil cove
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yeah i mean the cell phone camera probably cant focus because some lame designer made them for selfies

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so true it's user error

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i thought it was a camera i could use for all things

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turns out it only recognizes people and their faces well

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and then it focuses

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bad programming like i said

timber prism
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Most phones have the ability to change modes

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And/or turn off the built it editing

tranquil cove
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it could not be the phone it could just be the software on the phone

timber prism
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Lighting is usually a factor too

tranquil cove
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yeah and lighting right now for cell phones they cant perform as well as a dedicated camera for lighting

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though they still do good

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but maybe that interferes with the focus too

timber prism
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Yes. They still can take good pictures

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This is all opposite of what you said. You say they suck

tranquil cove
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lol

timber prism
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Again. User error

tranquil cove
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they suck in comparison to a dedicated camera

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are they still good, sure

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they give tons of mega pixel quality today

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but so do dedicated cameras

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the only benefit is supposed to be user friendly and easier to travel with

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and user friendly fails since i'm having user error

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and i'd rather carry the bulky dedicated camera around

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so i dont even care about the other benefit

timber prism
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👍

dusk bluff
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NGL this conversation is hilarious

timber prism
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Agreed lmao

vague galleon
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debating if its worth trying to co-op Outward with my friend. neither of us are into it and i csnt play my old character with the definitive edition.
theres work arounds though. but neither us are really into it.
the game had some interesting ideas but is very lackluster.

charred flame
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It’s ok

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Felt like it’s the lite enshrouded at this point

dusk bluff
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Gave me more souls vibes

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I recommend it. It starts slow but is really fun later. It is a lot harder solo but I think it's meant to be played coop.

tame sundial
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Русские есть?

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Может кто подсказать может, просто сейчас взяли игру, я создал сервер.

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Мой друг ко мне зашёл на сервер, у меня все отлично, а у него пинг 300, мы живём в одном городе

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Кто сталкивался может с проблемой пинга уже, сервер когда создаешь у них хостинг в одном месте каком то или хостом сервера является человек который создал его

dusk bluff
tranquil cove
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enshrouded is one of the easiest games i played lol

dusk bluff
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Yeah not sure what he's talking about. It barely even has building. It was added later in a DLC but is blueprint only.

candid quiver
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Enshrouded is mostly like tetris combined with doom and kirbys star stacker ^^

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It also is inspired by moving forward, backwards and to the sides, taken straight from like dead space

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It also draws graphics on the screen, quite like mario did back in the day

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Dont get me started on how they stole the idea of having a world map,
Just like assasins creed invented!

dusk bluff
charred flame
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for me its the movement and nvm dunno how to explain it lel

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played it for abit, its fun but gets stale fast for me

image.png
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even in hardcore

candid quiver
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Movement in enshrouded more like botw and conan exiles, i don't feel outward has the same movement feel at all

tepid wadi
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Yeah Outward definitely has a very specific feel to it that isn't like any other game.

dusk bluff
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Honestly the only similarities I see between the 2 games is open world exploration.

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And that can be said about many games lol

candid quiver
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Like zelda 1 on nes ^^ precursor to botw ^^

tranquil cove
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enshrouded is a casual building game with exploration

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outward is punishing combat with exploration and survival mechanics that can kill you

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you dont die in enshrouded, you can afk in your house forever.

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which makes it a casual survival game at best

candid quiver
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It is not a building game with exploration.
Its an exploration game with building, the building part if neither needed nor the focus ^^

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The 'its so easy lol' is just a useless unimpressive qualifier to add to the statement tho ^^

tepid wadi
tranquil cove
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doesn't denote anything about the player

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it's just an easy game

candid quiver
tranquil cove
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if one assumes i'm a bad gamer, or even average, then my subjective experience of what is easy would also be similar to a greater population that plays the same game. you have some difficulty, adjust tactics, and win, and enshrouded offers lots of opportunity to learn and adjust tactics without much punishment.

candid quiver
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Furthermore i have noticed you disparaging othet people by laughing at them, while saying 'its easy'

That is the behaviour i find juvenile and silly

tranquil cove
candid quiver
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Different people will feel its either 'too hard' or easy,
But the tone you have is childish, the self insert boast is cringe

tranquil cove
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i don't like conversations about what you think i did, just paste the direct link where i did it. much less room for debate

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otherwise i'm changing topic

candid quiver
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You spend all your time in 'other games' making juvenile and boastful arguments with others,
Why are you even on the enshrouded discord?

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Its a really childish tone from you, all the time, on any topic.

tranquil cove
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i bought the game, and my understanding is even people who don't own the game can be here lol

candid quiver
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smh

tranquil cove
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but yeah i consider enshrouded a building game with exploration

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from my point of view that is what it is

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the big thing that stands out for me is the building system

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though i guess the glider stands out for the exploration part of it combined with the shroud and lore

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it's a unique combination of things that forms the game i guess

tranquil cove
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if i was going to boast in enshrouded

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it would be about building

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100% hands down, for example i think i'm an epic valheim builder

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but then i'd also be building a lot and have screenshots to back it up

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the whole fighting/combat aspect of the game isn't where my competitiveness is at

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i just said it was an easy game because i think it is

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not as a boast lol

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a game where i think i'm skilled is no more room in hell

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the fact that i am just playing enshrouded normally and able to enjoy myself and not struggle too much is why it's a casual or 'cozy' game to me

candid quiver
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I do not think we are having a conversation.

tranquil cove
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that's true, usually i'm just being attacked by you and forced to ignore you

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because then i'll get in trouble if i respond

candid quiver
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By attacked you mean being called out for often belittling other people during your rants

tranquil cove
# candid quiver By attacked you mean being called out for often belittling other people during y...

your interpretations are weird, and would probably be less bias if you got over me, 100% a point of view that is framed from prejudice toward me for some reason - and also if you didn't read too much into text - text online is infamous for misreading tone and for misunderstandings. and it's also the worst method to clear anything up because it requires essays of explanation. people would be happier if they didn't assume the worst about others or what they type. like when i said "enshrouded is the easiest game i ever played lol" that was not belittling anyone, i thought it was funny because anyone who plays outward automatically knows how difficult it is, especially if they tried fighting any of the bosses, the brand squire wiped the floor with me the first 10 times, took forever for me to figure out how to kill him even with wiki and guides, and he's not the most difficult boss. so hearing outward described as lite? and also assuming the meaning of that description... more evidence text is ripe for misunderstanding etc. just found it funny. there was no "putting down" of anyone.

and they corrected my assumption about outward being lite enshrouded having to do with difficulty. but if we were still on that assumption, it would basically only indicate they are extremely good at outward if it's enshrouded lite to them. and they feel no difference in difficulty between the two games. i personally feel huge difference. in outward i was crying, in enshrouded i was chilling.

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no idea how a convo about outward turned into one about me 😄

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i don't belittle people, i have low or high opinions of games and movies

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and there's nothing wrong with that, nobody should like the exact same things

tranquil cove
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i'm just going to ignore people from now on though, if they are off topic from an idea in relation to what the channel is about

vague galleon
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i got debug working in outward so i can restart in the definitive version (that i got for free???)
and see if my friend wants to play.
got muh cash. now i need to get some gear tonight.

timber prism
lilac adder
tranquil cove
finite saffron
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You can only do that if the mission you're playing says you can (because it can be pretty overpowered for making money)

I forget the name of the modifier, but it says something along the lines of you can keep whatever weapons you exit the arena with

tranquil cove
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huh then what is inventory for

vague galleon
finite saffron
tranquil cove
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how do i make sure i put it in inventory and not drop current weapon and pick up other one in hand?

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that just means i lose one weapon for another

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when i want to keep both

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i dont want to exchange weapons and then keep the weapon i grabbed after, i want to keep all weapons

finite saffron
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Oh yeah it's just whatever is in your hands, I think that's by design. If you want to make your way with free stuff without losing anything you have to play risky by going in with cheap stuff/no stuff

tranquil cove
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bleh

lilac adder
# vague galleon death scenarios?

you die and then something happens instead of game over...you get taken to a bandit camp and have to escape or you die and someone drags you to a safe place and gives you a potion or you die or you die and lose stuff / temp stat decrease, etc

tranquil cove
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do you play in third person or in the isometric view?

finite saffron
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R I think, it says in the tutorial

vague galleon
finite saffron
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I prefer third person just cause it's what I'm used to and I am generally good at aiming, but from watching youtube videos it seems like people like the other mode too

lilac adder
tranquil cove
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i prefer third person too

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but i just tried the other mode

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sooo much easier

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plus i was halfway decent at exanima arena combat

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and its similar

finite saffron
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I tried em both and still prefer third person, but yeah I think the other one would probably be technically better since you can see so much more

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I also just found third person more fun and that's what I care about lol

tranquil cove
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in third person all my attacks are 30% speed and low power for some reason

tranquil cove
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competitive no.. though i'm sure tons of people want that

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but coop, and some lions would be nice 😄

finite saffron
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The games attacks are physics based so actually moving your camera with attacks can make attacks more powerful and stuff. Probably easier with the top down view (especially if you have it set to be more sensitive)

tranquil cove
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in third person

tranquil cove
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lol this game

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gives me a spear in some wierd battle

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worst weapon

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especially with a shield

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had no idea how to hit anything

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still killed 5 guys and lost because my whole team was demolished somehow

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i think my team literally did nothing

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it also didnt let me pick up other weapons

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worst battle i ever saw

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suddenly my ability to use hands was disabled

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making it feel extra gamey

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and unrealistic

tranquil cove
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lol elite fight just demolished me

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talk about gear to win

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and probably insane stamina too

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note to self avoid most purple fights

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though i did win 1

marsh lagoon
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Hello.. Just wondering some other games people have played that are like Enshrouded. This is the first game I have played of this type most of the games I played are like WoW, GW2, Lost Ark and the Diablo's. I have run 3 guys thru this game each on their own worlds and I have one base that I have spent alot of time on. But I would like to check out some other games of this type... cant just build for the next few months waiting on the next patch. I know alot of people talk about Valheim are there any others I should check into? I also hear ARK but all I see when I check out videos are people fighting and destroying other people stuff. Building is alot of fun but not #1 thing on my must have list and I like to play solo most of the time... Thanks.

vague galleon
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there's a mass plethera of survival games, both from roughly 10 years ago and these days. kind of hard to reccomend one or another.

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a lot of them are.... not great.

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one I had been hopeful for was Planet Explorers, which is free now, and supposedly they're going to make a sequel, but I can't recommend it very hard, but it is free.

timber prism
candid quiver
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Conan Exiles, Breath of the Wild and Tears of the kingdom ^^

marsh lagoon
candid quiver
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Oh yeah, those are games similar to Enshrouded imo ^^

tranquil cove
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i don't think conan exiles as an MMO is very similar to enshrouded. it also has an entirely different build system that is more asset based since you place down full walls etc. there aren't many games like enshrouded, but lots of games in the exploration/building/survival genre. Conan exiles apparently also has some slavery system which isn't really optional, you need slaves as workers to get things manufactured faster. i don't find it very lore accurate because it presupposes that the whole conan world just had slavery and always used slaves, but it doesn't. there were free people, and communities....

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plus conan exiles has a huge focus on being a PVP game

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and all the griefing that comes with that

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another huge difference, in enshrouded there is epic terraforming so minimally a game comparison would require the existence of similar mechanics

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you can't terraform in conan exiles.

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the MMO aspect of conan adds to the open world feel, more areas to build in, less linear story experience etc.

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imo games share their tags but the similarities usually end there

marsh lagoon
tranquil cove
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couple of months ago

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deep north is maybe the last area left which might added by end of the year or next year

marsh lagoon
#

Cool ok thanks for the Info 🙂

candid quiver
#

Started working on a new map/adventure in TU. "The Chillaxie Octopunk"

#

Will be some sort of futuristic/space neon-like city

#

Built this small spawn area as a vibetest to begin with ^^

tranquil cove
#

some of the arenas in we who are about to die... lol just total garbage arena, walls everywhere, can't see anything because camera is blocked

#

forced to third person and it's still bad

#

need to make note now of which arenas to avoid

#

no room to fight in them either they mashed 20 guys in a tiny arena with walls everywhere

#

and shields

proud willow
misty arch
true condor
timber prism
#

Funcom did make a Conan MMO though which was called Age of Conan

candid quiver
#

Yeah conan exiles is not an mmo like valrant actually poses,
Quite like enshrouded i explore handcrafted pois and dungeons,
Combat is in a similar style, as is the exploration of places and story'ish progression

#

Having played both, solo, i am quite certain of the similar beats they share.
Enshrouded mixes it up a bit diff tho

#

The pace of combat and handcrafted map alone is what makes it much similar to conan exiles then rng flurry valheim

tranquil cove
#

people there write it's an MMO

#

likewise on steam it has the tag for massive multiplayer, and enshrouded doesn't

#

i can see how it's more of a small type open world multiplayer experience though, there's nothing massive about the server limits of 70-160 players

#

but also lots of MMOs can be played offline/single player so that wouldn't really be the criteria to base it off of, i think it's just server populations

timber prism
#

yeah.. it would be like calling Atlass a MMO

#

or Ark

#

its not XD

tranquil cove
#

yeah i see

#

thanks for pointing it out

timber prism
#

it doesn't help that Funcom advertised it as one

#

i think they are doing the same for their Dune game

tranquil cove
#

tbh in an online game i think 250 players that are active is a sweet spot

#

a sever with 3k people would be overwhelming

#

when i played ultima online back in the day we had a small server with like 400 max pop and about 250 active

#

so everyone knew everyone

#

lots of little clans and clashes and stuff

tepid wadi
timber prism
tranquil cove
#

for example rust has about that many players per server

timber prism
#

rust is also not a mmo XD

#

but yeah, smaller games are fine with a playerbase that small

tranquil cove
#

an MMO with 3k people on a server, is kind of pointless except to give the feeling of populated, you'll never need 3k active at once

timber prism
#

of course you would

tranquil cove
#

you wont even meet 50% of them

#

in 1 year

timber prism
#

????

tranquil cove
#

they might run by at one point

#

you'd never interact with them all

timber prism
#

you have multiple guilds

#

running econ

#

you have guild wars between said guilds

tranquil cove
#

you wont remember interacting with them all

timber prism
#

if it was that small it would mean that when guilds were fighting then nothing else in the game world would be happening

#

but thats not how it works

tranquil cove
#

yeah even still max guilds 1 guild can fight is like a few dozen, unless you're guild is like 500 members

#

and then you're not even interacting with your whole guild

timber prism
#

you want people to be able to fight eachother and have other things for those not participating to be doing

#

guilds/ alliances etc

tranquil cove
#

and i'm talking about active in the server players, not people who joined and made a character, you can have 10k people who joined a game, but only 250 online at any given time for example

timber prism
#

and that is too small for a mmo

#

for the reasons i stated

#

imo

#

you can be fine with that XD

tranquil cove
#

if there's always 250 people online? i think it's fine, maybe even more fun cause you know everyone

#

but i guess for 250 always on you need 2k community size or something

#

and they all need to be pretty dedicated to that game

timber prism
#

if i knew every single person who played on a server

#

that would be a dead server XD

tranquil cove
#

why? you cant kill people you know? lol

timber prism
#

no.. i just find it extremely boring to recognize every single person in a MMO im playing

#

that is way too small

tranquil cove
#

well i guess new players add sense of discovery too

#

discovering new people is part of the mmo experience

timber prism
#

yeah

#

and pvp'ing against the same people over and over

#

where everyone knows eachother and strategies

#

is awful

#

it would be just as boring as joining an instanced battle and seeing the same premade every time

dusk bluff
#

250 is way too low. You would never find anyone to run dungeons with leveling up, or to do content with.

tepid wadi
#

Have you looked at the EQ1 servers population? I cant imagine they're much higher than 250 concurrent, but my buddies who like the game seem to enjoy it and find plenty of people to interact with.

I think it's actually a lot more about the style of game than the number of players that matters. If a game has mechanics that support and encourage players to interact, you probably have a much lower critical mass to make it playable and feel populated. Whereas a lot of games you can have thousands on the same server and it still feels lonely.

timber prism
#

Im look at pop counts and the daily player count average range is from 452 to 495

#

im looking*

#

but again.. im curious if those people are content with seeing like 10 other players to play with by all means.. good for them.. but that sounds dead to me XD

tranquil cove
#

i guess my point wasn't really a hard number like 250, it could range between 500-800, but i think after that something is lost or at least not gained

#

i concede to the point that if youre a hardcore pvper you always want new people to fight though

#

this is very true of pvpers and i've known many in different games

#

and yeah i just think there's a population sweet spot, where if the community is very active, it can be pretty nice, it allows for everyone to interact in a way that you wouldn't necessarily find in mega population games... because presumably a lower pop game will bring with it the more tight knit community that is striving to make the game fun and keep people playing so there is just a level of involvement from everyone to that end

#

but i've also witnessed the opposite of this, where a game is dying and all that's left is a toxic wasteland of players

#

depends on the type of people in the community lol

#

i've come far in we who are about to die

image.png
#

i've learned to fight better in third person which helped.

tepid wadi
# timber prism but again.. im curious if those people are content with seeing like 10 other pla...

They definitely see 10+ players to play with. One of the things about original EQ is that there's a lot of reasons that people interact directly with each other that aren't present in lots of modern games.
-Certain classes have high impact buffs, people seek them out to ask/tip for buffs to be applied
-Only one or two classes are capable of teleporting players across the map, again they are highly valued by the community
-Only certain classes can help you bind to a location which also is a valuable service, death runs are a huge thing
-There's no auction house, so you have to trade with people directly, there are a couple areas where community members gather to create a sort of marketplace
-Certain spells require monster drops as reagents, so people farm them to buy/sell
-Quest turn-in items can largely be traded, so people farm those to sell to other players as well
-The combat is challenging, so when there's another player farming in the same area as use, cooperation and partying is often dynamic

Valourant is right in that it helps that the community involved is largely nostalgic for the way the game used to be and so they tend to be super friendly in general. There's a lot of toxicity that isn't present because most people wouldn't jump through the hoops to even install the game. So even with a lower population, it feels more "alive" because people are willing to actually engage with each other. Pretty much all modern MMOs feel like a solo/group game in a massive world, where you only interact with your clique for the most part and any outside interaction is streamlined to the point of nothingness

timber prism
#

This whole alive thing is really dependent on the player... I still play modern mmos and they feel just as alive as older mmos

#

this whole only interacting with your clique you mention is self inflicted.. they made it easier for players in a lot of mmos to solo but nothing is stopping you from interacting with your community

tepid wadi
#

Yeah, there's also a lot that goes into the game design around how players interact with each other. Like, you can build systems that encourage players to have (positive) interactions, or you can discourage it. You could probably write a whole thesis on how the introduction of Auction Houses to MMOs fundamentally altered the way players interact with each other.

thick lily
finite saffron
#

Watched this on my lunch break today https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ia1AktdJhxI

YouTube
Isak Vik
a map that scares reading players (heat abnormal ezhd fc)

i was surprised to hear a couple very good reading players thought this map was unfun and a hellish grind. i thought it was very fun myself.

this should've been a liveplay, but my camera was giving me trouble. maybe reupload if i set a good HD only play

map: https://osu.ppy.sh/beatmapsets/2058976#osu/4303461
skin: https://gn.s-ul.eu/52Xc0zWw (...

▶ Play video
#

The brains of osu players need to be studied

tepid wadi
#

That looks like it'd be super frustrating until you got good at it, then it would be relaxing

finite saffron
#

It is (I used to play these sorts of maps when I used to play this game)

Was not even close to that good though. Also had to quit playing because the game was giving me repetitive strain injury lol

dusk bluff
#

They message you asking to group, they interact when you talk to them, they run their own content and have their own guilds

tepid wadi
#

Weird, definitely could be an interesting use case to see how well AI systems can simulate other players in an MMO

dusk bluff
#

It's scripted AI

#

Like there isn't an AI engine in the background. It's one dev making this all by himself.

tepid wadi
#

Ah, fair enough

dusk bluff
#

Basically rough key words will give you responses

#

I can private message a sim player and ask to group, they will sometimes tell me they are already in a party or they will say yes and come to me.

#

I like it a lot more than player MMO tbh

tranquil cove
#

https://store.steampowered.com/app/1486630/Intravenous/ free in the next 24 hours

Steam
Intravenous

A LOVE LETTER TO EARLY SPLINTER CELL GAMESYou just entered the warehouse through the vent shaft as you hear voices from outside. They know you’re here. Someone must have tipped them off. You continue to stay in the shadows. You shoot out lights, flip off circuit breakers and lockpick doors. You are a silent assassin. You distract the guards by t...

Price

$4.99

Recommendations

2092

▶ Play video
timber prism
#

OSU is pretty crazy

#

i like rhythm games but never played it but seen tons of vids onit

lilac adder
thick lily
dusk bluff
torpid hull
#

Looking for cool people to join in the new Valhiemer. This is my first playthrough.

misty arch
#

https://www.nomanssky.com/worlds-part-i-update/

No Man's Sky
Worlds Part I Update - No Man's Sky

Worlds Part I: Introducing Update 5.0 Update 5.0, WORLDS, transforms the universe into a richer, wilder, more varied and immersive place. Featuring huge leaps in water and cloud visuals, increased planetary diversity, new gameplay features, and more. Our journey continues. Buy now on More purchase options » Big hunt expedition: The Liquidators E...

tepid wadi
#

Oh shit that looks amazing.

#

I saw something saying that they're bringing stuff back into NMS from LNF, which gives me a lot of hope for that game too

finite saffron
#

Yeah this might be what finally gets me to actually sink my teeth into NMS, looks cool

#

One of my biggest issues was how visually repetitive a lot of the worlds were

tepid wadi
#

Yeah, that was a thing that pushed me away too. I haven't played it since before the ship customization update too, so there's probably a lot of cool new stuff I haven't seen.

tranquil cove
#

ships can land on water

#

that will make ocean exploration slightly easier lol

tepid wadi
#

Neat

tranquil cove
#

it was bad 7 years ago though

#

my issue is still the base building

#

they need to revisit that big time

#

but who knows, if they plan to revisit the whole aesthetic of the universe then maybe qol for base building and base building improvements/additions are on their radar too

#

so maybe i will get my wish

#

btw despite my earlier criticisms which i still stand by to some extent, i am really enjoying we who are about to die now

#

whats funny is 8 years ago

#

and today

image.png
#

lol

#

guy really put in the work to make the game loved and into his vision

tepid wadi
#

Yeah, NMS is definitely one of the bigger turnaround stories of gaming. It's so much better than it used to be. Gives me a lot of hope for LNF as a new interesting game.

tranquil cove
#

but lots of people did, and were saying it was a rip off

#

and when the NMS team said they will do updates i believed them

#

and i was like cool, i can wait a couple of years i don't need to play this game immediately

#

but i also did play it back then for like 60 hours

#

it's basically the whole point of early access, and maybe people are more used to it today than they were back then

#

you buy the game, and the game progresses over the years

tepid wadi
#

Well, they definitely overpromised the release of the game and that's what most people were upset about. And there was no guarantee they were actually going to do the updates. They didn't advertise it as early access if I remember, but I could be misremembering that.

#

I'm just happy they did keep updating it, because so many games have a lot of promise and then fail to realize it.

tranquil cove
#

is what i remember lol

tranquil cove
tepid wadi
#

Brief googling says that it was advertised as a fully finished game

tranquil cove
#

oh maybe it wasnt early access

#

but weird i always felt it was or was under the impression even at release day

#

so i dunno

tepid wadi
#

To be fair, I think it released before "early access" was really a defined concept 😝

#

Or at least before it was common to anything other than super indie games

tranquil cove
#

im gonna get back into NMS

#

i was doing a catch up run when the ship customization released

#

then building a base made me cry and quit

#

lol

#

but i guess ill try and finish that under water base now

#

i'll just find a good power hotspot

#

and ignore having the gas/ore ones

#

gas/ore hot spot is only for valuable gasses and ores anyway and on the planet i am on its literally oxygen and some lame ore that doesn't matter

#

and i already have a gas hotspot at my other base anyway for O2

#

plus now i can land my ship on water heck yes, and so i can find the under water hot spot way easier now

#

no more driving a sub around and landing ship on tiny islands

misty arch
#

you can also take your main character save into Expeditions now. Along with taking items into and out of the Expeditions as well.

tranquil cove
#

never touched that side of the game yet

misty arch
#

basically their own type of seasonal events

tranquil cove
#

you still play solo?

misty arch
#

yes

#

used to be that they were separate saves and only way to get rewards from the Expeditions was at the end in the Anomoly off of a vendor, but that was just rewards for completion.

tranquil cove
#

oh i see

misty arch
#

Now you can take your main save into Expeditions, also done in the anomoly, and do them with that character. Expeditions stil have their own rule sets and items given but you can bring stuf from you main file into it to help make things go quicker

tranquil cove
# 

The Expedition is a short-term adventure away from your main save, during which you unlock cool stuff that you can then "redeem" or pickup or whatever on your main save.

So you create an Expedition save, and you'll have a series of objectives, organized into phases. You can do these in any order you wish, and completing each provides you with some rewards, which are typically helpful/needed for other objectives.

The rewards for fully completing each phase are then able to be collected back on your main save, through the Quicksilver merchant on the Anomaly.

The Expeditions are usually pretty short - I think the longest was ~16hours. It's a nice little diversion. I'd recommend that you give it a shot.
misty arch
#

that is a little old before the change allowing your 1 save to cross over into it

tranquil cove
#

or am i locked in for the 16 hours

misty arch
#

yes, but the expeditions do have time limits, the one that was just running i think ran for 6 weeks

tranquil cove
#

ahh i see

#

what was the reward?

#

cosmetic?

misty arch
#

some of it

#

so you can see you can get ships, weapons, pretty much anything you can get in the game normally can be a reward, including freighters

#

also twitch drops start tomorrow for NMS as well

tranquil cove
#

"Step into an empty universe, where you will find yourself surrounded by other Travellers… yet somehow still alone."

#

so No Mans Sky when it first released? thats the expedition 😄

#

LOL

#

but thanks ill check it out

misty arch
#

not really, expeditions are all different every season. Like one was more fauna based, so you searched planets for creatures. This last one was about an empty universe and you are finding out why. Which a ghost freighter was seen floating around after you at times.

tranquil cove
#

so you login to the expedition and find yourself playing 2013 version of nms

#

would be kinda funny

tepid wadi
timber prism
#

Hopefully Lost Skies turns out good!

tepid wadi
#

Seriously. I like co-op more than PvP at this point anyway. Too much dev time spent on grief protection

timber prism
#

Their Sky Whale looked cool!

red hull
#

did you guys tried Once Human yet?

tepid wadi
#

Yeah, it's pretty fun

#

It's a bit like The Ubisoft Sandbox meets The Secret World

red hull
#

i usually don't play this type but since it s shooter i thought why not

#

you can see it has unique features

#

i was surprised its not pay to win

tepid wadi
#

Yeah, they've been very adamant that it's not that. There's a battle pass, but the free track has a bunch of functional items where the paid track has cosmetics only

red hull
#

yeah

tepid wadi
#

There's lots of little details/quests in the game that keep it interesting, too

red hull
#

my only pain was the glass cosmetic for houses

#

that i want

#

kek

#

oh yeah and the bloody bosses

tepid wadi
#

That's fair, but also definitely not necessary.

red hull
#

yeah def not

tepid wadi
#

My one big gripe with the game is that the building can be VERY frustrating. Like very often I'll want to snap a sloped roof to a wall, but it just... won't snap in the way that I want it to.

red hull
#

pisses me off that the house gets destroyed instead of a blueprint remaining

red hull
#

i know what you say

#

i stayed 30 mins to figure it out

tepid wadi
#

That's only partially true. You can save a BP of your house, so if you do that right before you do an event, you should be able to reset your house to "full"

red hull
#

i might look into that

#

i m just lvl 27

#

i play other 2 games in the same time

#

not fully dedicated

#

i wonder whats after lvl 50

#

solidifying your gear/house and completion?

tepid wadi
#

Yeah, I'm not sure, I haven't gotten there either. I know there's hard modes of all the bosses

red hull
#

ah i see, damn

#

i like how the hive works tho

#

how u can give access to your friends for anything and do stuff

#

my bf is almost 40 and he came in my house and started placing all kinds of cosmetics around

#

i was like hell ya

#

😂

#

i find boring wiring to electricity and the solars

#

cable management ❌

tepid wadi
#

Yeah... the cable management isn't wonderful

#

The building bothers me the moth because I like building in those sorts of games, and there ARE a lot of good things about it, like how the deviants want certain things so you want to build in ways that make them happy, it's really good.

#

But like... clean up your snapping, yeesh

red hull
#

the deviants seem picky 😡

tepid wadi
#

Not as picky as they used to be. In the december beta, they had likes, but they also had dislikes and you had to do both. I actually kinda liked that because you couldn't cluster them all up too much

candid quiver
#

Once human feels a bit too mobile game to me, with a typical abstract randomness-"story" gameplay wise. Loading screens on PC telling that it wont affect your 'mobile data' when downloading files

tepid wadi
#

Lol yeah I saw that loading screen too

#

I definitely feel like the depth of gameplay is likely lower because of mobile.

candid quiver
#

^^

tepid wadi
#

Another thing that drives me crazy is all the menus

candid quiver
#

Biggest hurdle for me was sadly (which is common too), that they haven't sorted custom keybindings.
I can't play WASD, so i have a custom setup with arrow keys and other things,
but me and those in my situation can't properly rebind keys sadly. some are hardcoded,
and some, those that by default has many actions bound to the same key, can't be multi-bound
(it stops and says that key is already bound to key X), eventho thats how it works on the default bind

#

.
Oh yeah, the menus remind me of an old japanese PS1 game kinda, theyre a bit tacky

tepid wadi
#

Yeah, one of my friends has that same problem

candid quiver
#

As a non-wasd'er, that is usually my first test in a new game; will it bind ^^

tepid wadi
#

For me it's the sheer amount of menus. There are like 8 different menus with distinct keybinds to open and it's just a pain to navigate to which reward track you had a thing to redeem from or whatever.

candid quiver
#

I only played up to when you suddenly get to that cottage and meet the other meta human, think i was gonna be taught building next or such.
So ive not gone very far in it.

the first moments was a bit of a mess game-story wise tho, suddenly a portal there, suddenly we are there, and poof, now we are in a cottage "pocket dimension" or some such?

#

its a bit typical of some asian game-stories i feel, its a bit allover the place

#

And i DO read all the dialogue, it just doesnt fully help ^^

tepid wadi
#

Yeah, it's definitely got a bit of a scattered feel.

candid quiver
#

The combat feels alright, passable.
But unless i can rebind to keys i am comfortable with it doesnt feel goodie.

Might look into in again in the future, like Nightingale, putting it on a shelf for now ^^

tranquil cove
tepid wadi
#

Once Human

tranquil cove
#

oh it has mixed reviews

#

but lets be honest the building in once human cant be worse than the forest

#

can it?

#

if it has snapping in the building it already passes a major milestone

#

if the snapping is glitchy it's basically like valheim to me

#

seems like nobody experienced this in valheim though because they either don't build the things i do, or the way that i do, or have 800 hours into building

#

but there is the most horrendous micro snap in that game that appears sometimes

#

so the block will be off by like a tiny nano millimeter or something

#

and it throws the whole build off, and misaligns all blocks and drives me flipping insane

#

its happened numerous times to me, so it's reproducable

#

and the devs will never fix it, its probably not on their radar even

tepid wadi
#

In my estimation, the snapping in Once Human is worse than Ark.

There's a problem with the snap points where when you snap pieces together, they align in specific ways. So if you snap a floor sideways, it will ONLY let you place a wall in specific orientations. And if you wall is placed "backwards", then the sloped roofs will only snap the opposite way that you want them to.

tranquil cove
#

owch

tepid wadi
#

So I've run into situations where I've had to tear down half my build so that I can re-place a foundation, so that my walls face the right way so that I can actually snap my roofs

tranquil cove
#

im surprised you all had time to try all these games though

#

i'm still trying to get through so many games i own

tepid wadi
#

But it took me like an hour of frustrated tweaking to figure out what was "wrong"

tranquil cove
#

i need to stop buying new crap

#

we who are about to die was unique and good enough that i made exception there

tranquil cove
#

i had to deconstruct my build in valheim for hours

#

before i could figure out what was causing the micro snap

tepid wadi
#

The good news about Once Human is that deconstructing/reconstructing is fairly quick, and they give you a fly cam you can use while building. So that's good at least.

#

But when your corner sloped roof just WILL NOT snap correctly no matter what you do, it's pretty disheartening.

tranquil cove
#

it was disheartening to build anything lol

#

tbh i dont think games should add building unless they go the level of enshrouded or valheim

#

and id argue without terraforming it's not worth it

#

make a different game.

#

i think the game devs wasting their time with building if they dont really try to make it the best experience possible

#

and for most that means terraforming is a must

#

this is why NMS should really revisit their whole base building content

#

i get they are limited by the engine i guess, but i think they could make something that currently feels like a B experience into an A one, even though it will never be S class 😛

#

lol

#

and i feel like so far their whole introduction of freighters was probably to offer a second option to people not too fond of the base building

#

so they know it's not the greatest ever

tepid wadi
#

Well, the thing about the building in Once Human is that it has some really good ideas in general. It's just that the core building system of actually placing foundations/walls and stuff feels like garbage.

They've got a reason to make certain types of builds, they made it easy to make a blueprint of a build so you can go back to it later, etc etc.

candid quiver
#

The 'building' also doesnt have the be the singular focus point in assesing games,
Builing is not the goal of everything.

#

Building, building, building, crafting, crafting, crafting. Pick your wood and rocks. ^^

tranquil cove
#

i didn't say it was

#

i just said its probably better not to have it unless you can deliver certain quality

#

the problem isn't me assessing the game

#

the problem is the dev thinking the game needs 10 genres in it and delivering sub par on all of them because of a lack of focus

#

make a different game if you can't deliver good building is my opinion, it would mean you can focus on the other great aspects of your game more

#

they want to try and draw in players who will be like "wow building cool" except if the building isn't good enough they will all complain

#

so it kind of backfires at that point

tepid wadi
#

I do kind of agree with that point. When a feature isn't fully fleshed out it ends up feeling kind of like an afterthought and players can wonder why it was even included if they were going to half-ass it.

But also, development pressure is real, so sometimes a feature has to be shipped in a "good enough" state and can either be improved later or not depending on priorities and perception.

#

I think overall Once Human is in a good place and it has a lot of pieces that make it a fun enough game to download and spend some hours on it. The fact that it's a free to play game in the state that it's in is really good, and as much as there are things that annoy me in it, overall I've had a lot of fun cruising through the map exploring and doing the little puzzles and stuff.

tranquil cove
#

cosmetics?

tepid wadi
#

There's a battle pass currently that you can buy that's all cosmetic. And there's more stuff in the shop you can buy I believe.

timber prism
#

Once Human feels very polished and was actually really surprising during testing on how solid of a foundation that it has

#

The biggest drawback for me is how unbalanced pvp is where someone at a higher tier will absolutely destroy a beginner but that is an issue with most games that offer tiered weapons/ammo/armor.

tepid wadi
#

Yeah... I did a PvP event in the first couple days and it was fun chaos, but just like any PvP game, the longer it's out, the more unbalanced things will become. One of my buddies tried to do one yesterday and just got annihilated by a level 50 character and he had zero chance.

timber prism
#

Yeah. Its like 3 tap someone in the chest when you can take multiple point blank headshots from a shotgun unbalanced XD

#

Whoa... my keycaps finally shipped after 3 years of waiting XD

tranquil cove
#

thats why i wanted to make a game where armor doesnt matter much

#

in fact we who are about to die is basically 50% of the combat i wanted

#

just the game is not RPG based

#

that game i wrote about where mobs are deadly, and armor only protects you from 1 hit vs a dragon and breaks

#

like it's a dragon, there's no way your armor survives

#

doesn't even exist in LOTR

#

i dunno i'm just tired of rpg mmos, where the pvp is unbalanced, and the pve is hack and slash 20 skelton warriors like you're rambo

#

1 skeleton which isn't even a boss should be like a battle for life and death, and really you're better off bringing 3 friends and maybe winning 3 vs 1

#

and that's a low tier mob

#

thats the game i want

#

meanwhile 90% of rpgs you start on a beach find a rusty dagger, and start pwning zombies

#

lol

#

we who are about to die with dodge roll but no i-frames, and aiming your strikes, with rainbow six 1 hit kills in some cases, and armor just preventing death and breaking

#

some sort of prep that goes into killing mobs, learning their weakness etc.

timber prism
#

Sounds like it would be very niche. Most people would not want to play something like that but it would probably be enjoyed by the people who do if you made it right

tranquil cove
#

i think it depends too, if it's still fun even to lose then it might be enjoyed regardless

#

if it's like iron man mode and perm death full loot loss, less fun lol, i think in a game like that it depends how tedious it would be to repair armor, to find it, to craft it, looting might not even be a thing since its a skill based game, pvpers wont really need your armor when its something easy to replenish and doesn't add much to winning combat etc.

#

so maybe armor wouldn't even be lootable

#

and this way people could have cosmetic changes to their armor and keep it

#

i think there is a challenging game, where its grindy and you pull your hair out and every loss is devastating

#

and there is the type of challenging game where the challenge is fun and when youre skilled you can manage, and there are tactics to use to win

#

so yeah it really depends on the whole atmosphere and feel of the game and how the mechanics are worked out in detail

#

in fact my belief is that pvpers don't really care about loot, most of them just want a good fun fight

#

looting falls more into griefing category, like a way to stick it to someone who was being an ass

#

but pvpers sometimes care about rewards

#

so i could see gold being lootable, or mechanics to make certain things lootable, or other types of rewards, grander scale rewards for winning a castle or territory from other players.

#

but the game we who are about to die, is executed really well for what it is, and it's probably niche too

#

even though i think its super fun and not niche due to being too challenging or anything

dusk bluff
#

Runescape for example I did pvp to get loot

#

It's like gambling

tranquil cove
#

nah, if that were truly true they would carry the most valuable stuff on them from their 2 years in game, but they hide that stuff in their house and bank, most pvpers are hoaders, banking on the win, so they can hoard more stuff that no one will ever touch but them.

#

at least my experience of pvpers is that way

timber prism
#

As a pvper, yes... loot is important. It is always fun to make loot groups where we would start naked and just kill people taking all their stuff

tranquil cove
#

i came from the most toxic pvp spaces, where people just wanted to steal your house and didn't care if you quit the game after

dusk bluff
tranquil cove
#

no 😦

dusk bluff
#

You both put up loot of the same value

#

And who ever wins gets it

tranquil cove
#

and would be fun

timber prism
#

Even just survival game pvp

dusk bluff
#

That's in runescape and is 100% gambling

#

Many are addicted to it and buy gold with real money to fuel it lol

timber prism
#

People loot bases and others just to take it from them

tranquil cove
#

there are different types of pvpers for sure

#

there are those who just enjoy the fights

#

and only want enough loot to maintain their pvping etc.

dusk bluff
#

Most pvpers who enjoy fights aren't playing full looters

timber prism
#

Pretty much

dusk bluff
#

They are playing specific pvp games so they don't have to keep regearing

tranquil cove
#

i just think looting gear itself is kinda dumb

#

because if everyone keeps the gear they bring, no loot required

#

no regearing

#

there can be other loot rewards

#

gear is more detrimental one

dusk bluff
#

I thinks it's way more fun. There is actual risk

#

Why do I care if I die in say Call of duty I just respawn and lose nothing

timber prism
#

The pvp type of player Val is making a game for is niche even among the niche

tranquil cove
#

it's a catch 22, risk, but then you're annoyed you need to regear, or farm mats to get the gear, if it's a gear based game especially, and then you're in a cycle where you need to loot 10, 20, 30 sets, so if you die 30 times you can regear faster.

#

i dunno if being in a sisyphian loop is fun

#

where the downside is just annoying

timber prism
#

The people playing that pvp game business mentioned isn't tho

dusk bluff
#

Yeah that's not annoying to me

timber prism
#

It actually attracts that crowd XD

tranquil cove
#

i could have been pvping instead of worrying about all of that imo

dusk bluff
#

That's boring in my mind

tranquil cove
#

well hey maybe the game i make isn't for you 😄

timber prism
#

Yeah same

tranquil cove
#

but i'll probably never make it so it doesn't matter

dusk bluff
#

Winning Russian roulette with no real bullets what's the point?

tranquil cove
#

if we take your argument to the extreme, then people should have perm death too

#

and have to make a new character

dusk bluff
#

There are games like that lol

tranquil cove
#

the logic of what is fun only works to a certain point imo, and therefore it's not good logic

dusk bluff
#

I forgot what it's called but there's a very popular pvp game where if I die you lose gear and your dude

tranquil cove
#

it's not gonna be fun when you're losing, only if you can win all the time

#

and then it creates toxic environment too

#

and stacking, and who knows what else

#

stacking teams

dusk bluff
#

Hard to stack in a no coms extractor

timber prism
#

I think there is a greater population of pvpers who enjoy risk reward over not

tranquil cove
#

probably gonna be more niche than the game i proprose

timber prism
#

Doubtful

dusk bluff
#

Hundreds of thousands of active players isn't niche

tranquil cove
#

what's it called?

dusk bluff
#

I'm trying to remember hold on

valid sable
#

Hello!!!! Going to play or thinking about playing the free game on PC Once Human? Then come to server PVP01-00020 and once you finish the tutorial and in the main map use Friend code yq150780314 to active this code the go to EVENTS then EVENT then GATHER FRIENDS this with unlock a legendary sniper gun at start. You can use this code on any server you like as well. MUST DO THIS BEFORE LEVEL 10

timber prism
#

Xd

#

I feel like other games in Enshrouded is a terrible choice for a recruitment post lmao

dusk bluff
tranquil cove
#

there are games where the combat has no full loot, like counter strike, chivalry etc.

#

just sort of combat pvp games i guess

#

but im proposing loot still

#

just likely not armor since the game is skill based anyway

#

why loot something that affects like 10% of pvp outcome

dusk bluff
#

Hunt showdown

tranquil cove
#

looting armor makes sense in a gear based game

#

so i think my approach is actually correct

#

for the type of game i would design anyway

dusk bluff
#

It's not only on steam

tranquil cove
#

yeah but hunt show down isn't an mmo

red hull
tranquil cove
#

thought you were saying that model wouldn't be niche for an mmo

#

for the game design, 12 players in a battle royale it probably works well

dusk bluff
tranquil cove
#

oh ok

dusk bluff
#

MMO is very vague now

#

People call anything an MMO

#

Technically it is massive, multiple player, and online

#

If 500k are playing at once wouldn't that qualify?

#

Not saying that's correct but it's technically correct

finite saffron
#

The label starts really getting funny if you compare games to each other lol, seem some games call themselves MMOs that only had 16 players max in an instance, and it's like... does that make call of duty an MMO then?

tranquil cove
#

lol

dusk bluff
finite saffron
#

The label kinda doesn't work anymore regardless, it used to be a fairly big technical achievement to have a game server host more than a couple dozen users, but that's just not really the case anymore. There are solo dev indie games with multi-hundred player servers all the time now

#

So at this point I feel like it needs to be retired, cause a lot of non-MMO centric games, like battle royales, now have more players than traditional MMORPGs do in a single instance.

dusk bluff
#

Actually all iron man has that in runescape

tranquil cove
dusk bluff
#

It's higher than 2k

tranquil cove
#

315 million people had the game

#

so the population of USA?

#

lol

dusk bluff
tranquil cove
#

runescape? and old skool runescape probably wont have more players?

finite saffron
#

I mean you can see the player counts on their site

dusk bluff
#

No one plays it on steam lol

tranquil cove
finite saffron
#

but yeah runescape throughout its entire lifespan is probably up there as one of the most played games ever

dusk bluff
#

That's pretty funny you think only 2k players it's a huge fan base

tranquil cove
#

if i was advertising my game on my site i might say it has players it doesn't have, or bots

dusk bluff
#

There are bots for sure

tranquil cove
#

why should i trust their site, where is a screenshot of their servers

dusk bluff
#

But it still has millions of players

finite saffron
#

I mean it probably counts bots, but no I don't think they're lying about player counts, its always lined up pretty well to their twitch numbers and stuff.

#

Also its Jagex, I don't think they'd be able to pull off a conspiracy for that long lol

tranquil cove
#

weird because the game seemed dead 10 years ago when i played

dusk bluff
tranquil cove
#

could never find a server with players

dusk bluff
#

You did something wrong then

tranquil cove
#

and 10 years ago before that it was popping full of people

finite saffron
#

runescape 3 has had a few periods of being fairly dead, but old school runescape is where the most players are

dusk bluff
#

I've been playing on and off since 2007. It's never been close to dead

tranquil cove
dusk bluff
#

2007

finite saffron
#

it initially released in 2007 I think yeah, and then re-released as "OSRS" in the early 2010s

#

now runescape 3 and that one exist side by side

tranquil cove
#

Old School RuneScape is a massively multiplayer online role-playing game developed and published by Jagex. The game was released on 22 February 2013. When Old School RuneScape launched, it began as an August 2007 version of the game RuneScape, which was highly popular prior to the launch of RuneScape 3.

dusk bluff
#

So yeah 10 years ago it was still out

finite saffron
#

I don't think the internet has some kind of runescape conspiracy tbh, it's always been one of the most popular MMOs

tranquil cove
#

i just remember runescape being packed, and then when i check it again it had players but nowhere near as much i dunno

dusk bluff
#

No one plays rs3

tranquil cove
#

maybe

finite saffron
#

The game doesn't have centralized servers either

#

like it's a bunch of different servers, the playerbase isn't all on one

#

so maybe you just chose a dead server

dusk bluff
#

Yes there are hundreds of servers

#

And people pop around servers all the time

tranquil cove
#

im surprised its still that active

#

400k people is a ton

dusk bluff
#

They are continually adding content

finite saffron
#

It's hard to say the "true" playercount because the games always had a botting problem, but yeah it has remained popular because there still aren't really any other MMOs on the market that fill the same niche

dusk bluff
#

And do polls for the players to decide what content they want

#

Alot of survival games copy it's basic mechanics too

finite saffron
#

Yeah a lot of modern day game devs grew up playing RS lol

dusk bluff
#

I'll trim your armor for free bro

#

Press 123 to be my gf

tranquil cove
#

the runescape experience

dusk bluff
#

I scammed so many teenagers as a 12 year old

#

It was pretty sad how easy it was to get free stuff by making a girl character and getting a online bf.

#

I didn't even say anything special to them. I just gave them attention and was showered with gifts lol

#

The creator of runescape made a new game and it's coming out later this year

timber prism
#

Like no one ( at least in my crowd of gamers ) say MMO for survival, BR, shooters

tepid wadi
#

Yeah, there's an assumption with an MMO where there's a ton of people active on a persistent server at the same time and they can interact with each other (Runescape, WoW, EvE, etc)

Distinct from a Shared World game where there might be a ton of people online in a persistent world, but only a few of them will be "visible" at once (Destiny, Genshin, etc)

I feel like server based games like Survival games don't meet the "massive" quality when servers are limited to 30-60 people (especially given that it's rare for most of them to have more than like 5-10) And match based games like BRs don't meet the "persistent" expectation of an MMO

finite saffron
#

So yeah now it mostly refers to the traditional multiplayer RPGs, but even that is getting confusing with games like Diablo 4 existing lol

tepid wadi
#

Planetside 2 was absolutely rad

timber prism
#

I didn't even know PS2 was called a MMO

#

😅

finite saffron
#

Yeah back in the day everyone called it an MMOFPS

timber prism
#

Interesting

finite saffron
#

I remember a lot of non-RPG games getting called MMO, it was sorta a buzzword for a while that was used to market games because it was considered impressive. Struggling to think of more examples though because a lot of those games sucked

timber prism
#

I always thought it was just mmorpg since the 90s XD

#

But maybe its because it was what I played more

finite saffron
#

oh APB reloaded was another one that comes to mind

timber prism
#

I remember alpha testing APB

tranquil cove
#

been waiting for my 17gig download of NMS to finish so i can play lol 😦

timber prism
#

It was so awesome uploading your own mp3s

#

Also loved selling cosmetics

finite saffron
#

Wikipedia also notes the difference by having two pages as well, I'm not crazy lol
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_massively_multiplayer_online_games

It refers to what I'm talking about as "MMOGs" to avoid the obvious confusion the labels cause

History of massively multiplayer online games

The history of massively multiplayer online games spans over thirty years and hundreds of massively multiplayer online games (MMOG) titles. The origin and influence on MMO games stems from MUDs, Dungeons & Dragons (D&D) and earlier social games.

timber prism
#

XD

finite saffron
#

In general the whole label just needs to be done away with tbh, it's confusing in concept, but its kinda just tradition at this point

timber prism
#

I don't know how i missed all of this playing these games haha

finite saffron
#

Even MMORPG is also confusing, cause like... when does the multiplayer become "Massive"? lol

#

like how is Albion online and World of Warcraft technically the same genre? Very confusing for the consumer if you look at it literally

timber prism
#

I had this conversation in another server for that exact reason

#

Like how GW2 is considered massive

finite saffron
#

The only way to make it less confusing is to start slapping more stuff on top, which also gets funny. Because then you have labels like PVPVE MMORPG being an unironic way people are describing games

timber prism
#

And their engine couldn't even get every player to show up properly XD

#

Its even more funny as a singular word

finite saffron
#

Often by the time you know what all these labels mean you are already so familiar with the genre that you probably know about all the games in it anyway

timber prism
#

PVPVEMMORPG

tranquil cove
#

massive multiplayer refers to the experience of 1000's of players on one server

#

it's not about the "popularity" of the game or there being 1000 servers with 10 people each

#

or whatever

finite saffron
tranquil cove
#

a game that has 1000 player server is likely an MMO

tranquil cove
#

maybe runescape was an MMO at one point though

#

it did have 315 million users

#

so like if at one point the format was 1000 player servers, its still an MMO just a dead one

#

or under a new format

finite saffron
#

I think the best way to define them (if you actually want to attempt defining game genres, which I wouldn't advise tbh) is games with persistent worlds with substantial amounts of players dropping in and out of them, that never shut down or cycle (other than routine maintenance). It does exclude some MMORPGs still when you do that, but it at least captures the general spirit

#

Cause battle royales and stuff are temporary server instances, even if they are big

tranquil cove
#

yeah and some games reset the world after 2 weeks

#

MMO is persistent

tranquil cove
#

aww man no mans sky crashed

#

when loading my save, great, the update broke the game lol

tepid wadi
#

Thats okay, probably more fun to start from scratch anyway

tranquil cove
#

LOL

#

start like 2 year playthrough from scratch

#

this save was made back in 2013

#

and periodically played through and updated with the game

#

anyway lets see if updating graphic driver fixed it

#

works now

#

this whole planet is immediately different

#

lots of fauna

#

man they ruined the water on my planet

#

its red now

#

it was beautiful crystal blue before

#

the update ruined my planet

#

lol

#

crystal blue water to red hue all over wtf, i mean the water is still clear but because the sky is red i guess the water is always red

#

was literally the only thing i cared about in this planet and it's gone 😭

#

IM SO confused now when its night time the water is good

#

so is it the sun just making the water red?

#

oh well ill visit the planet base at night then

rapid ridge
#

what game ?

tranquil cove
#

the new update changed how the water looks in the day lol

rapid ridge
#

ah

tranquil cove
#

100% different

#

this is how it looked before, let me get a screenshot now

#

and this was night time

#

night time looks the same or close

#

now it's just red all over, pretty bad change and i'm not sure why, maybe they added more factors that affect how water looks, like sunlight?

#

or they changed the sun in my system?

#

i was planning to make a base here, and now not sure i want to lol

#

Water Color Variety – Discover oceans in a huge range of vibrant colors—from iron-rich red seas to algae-dense pools of green. Committed explorers may find some especially unusual colors on rare planets…

#

yeah they ruined my ocean

#

i gotta go to the other ocean i had i guess

rapid ridge
#

ah i see

tranquil cove
#

this murky green one, and see if they made it better

image.png
#

watch this one being untouched, i'll be pissed lol

#

the crappy ocean no change, and the good one turned red

dusk bluff
#

This is just entertaining how mad you are getting over the color of the game ocean 😂

tepid wadi
#

I mean I get it. Finding a suitable planet to live on in NMS is a HUGE pain. Most of them suck in one way or another.

tranquil cove
#

just stating a fact that they ruined my planet ocean with update 😄

#

plus the emoji i used was tears

#

there is an angry emoji 😡

#

never used it

tranquil cove
#

it's still good, just the red all over the place is not as nice as the blue it had before

#

somehow at night it looks exactly the same though

#

plus anyone could agree it's a HUGE change and it's not looking better

#

in a lot of ways the update improved the flora of the planet, adding some variety though

#

but do i care about waves on the ocean? no.

#

i care about the colour of the ocean, yes.

#

imo the update strength will be in finding planets all over again, because the changes it will make to existing planets might ruin some of their features

#

but if you find new planets you get all the features, and nothing changed from before, you're still looking for the ideal planet, but now you have some improved variables

#

or whatever

#

it's just not an ideal update if you had some cool planets already

timber prism
#

So much ocean complaining text XD

candid quiver
#

People that do not understand or can deal with procgen rehaul improvements,
Or do not grasp what a new seed in a proc-gen universe means are kinda a sore on the NMS community atm, those complaints are really confusion and misunderstanding smh

#

It would be a mess to 'keep x planets on old gen system, but use new seed for other planets', its just not workable or sane to expect.

tranquil cove
#

yeah but you expect the old planet that has blue water based on x y z, to retain the blue water and adapt the new system to those variables that already decided the water is blue

#

if i look at what they wrote about water colour it seems pretty arbitrary

#

"Water Color Variety – Discover oceans in a huge range of vibrant colors—from iron-rich red seas to algae-dense pools of green. Committed explorers may find some especially unusual colors on rare planets…"

#

iron rich red sea... nothing about my ocean before this update hinted at iron red sea.

#

there isn't even iron as a mineral in this game?

#

nothing about my planet indicates why the ocean looks like a red room unless the deciding factor is that the sky is red and so the ocean is red because the water is so clear

#

which imo is kind of a lame way to decide colour

#

the sky doesn't even look red tbh

#

the sky looks blue, the sun is yellow/white

#

i don't really get it

#

the water colour itself is not red

#

but somehow the lighting in the water is red

#

to me it actually feels like a broken aspect of the update than working as intended

#

yeah it was like the update decided 'the water is going to have this red lighting on this planet' and that was it, no reason why, no variable why

#

the sky isn't red

#

the water wasn't changed to red

#

it just seems random

#

it would have been better if they coloured the water red, then i could say, oh they changed the water colour on my planet

#

but they didn't do that

#

its some random lighting effect for no reason