mangohud needed to use 2x (FFXIV, Steam Deck) | Lossless Scaling | Page 1

boreal chasm Jul 20, 2025, 2:26 AM

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2x doesn’t actually display in FFXIV unless mangohud is used, counters will report the doubled framerate and the thicc frametime graph but the FG frames won’t actually display. I’m using the decky plugin, dev is aware of the issue also

using:

mangohud ~/lsfg %command%

results in the FG frames displaying with zero issue

3x/4x still work as normal without mangohud

additionally if

MANGOHUD_CONFIG=alpha=0.01,background_alpha=0.01

is added, to make mangohud invisible to the naked eye, it still works, however if both numbers are changed to 0 it does not work and the FG frames once again do not display

boreal chasm Jul 20, 2025, 3:00 AM

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the same behaviour is apparent with Assault Android Cactus

boreal chasm Jul 20, 2025, 5:46 PM

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the deck’s QAM mangohud-based performance overlay does not also fix this however, only mangohud specifically in the launch options does

worn knot Jul 20, 2025, 5:51 PM

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I'm guessing, since, if you look at the separate overlay, it's completely different, even says (vk3d) instead of "GameScope" and shows base fps, lossless scaling itself is an overlay and based on the GitHub, since it's a vulkan layer instead of like windows, I assume the separate mangohud overlay is the vulkan layer then

Steam quick access menu mangohud is GameScope so it's separate from the real mangohud(aka the vulkan layer possibly)

boreal chasm Jul 20, 2025, 5:52 PM

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Makes sense, QAM is reporting gamescope performance statistics while mangohud is reporting the actual game - still no idea why mangohud specifically fixes 2x framegen

worn knot Jul 20, 2025, 5:53 PM

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Some games don't even work with mango hud only, and require 3x multiplier or above, days gone for example

boreal chasm Jul 20, 2025, 5:53 PM

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That’s the thing, that was the behaviour i saw with FFXIV until i added mangohud

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3x/4x worked as they should

worn knot Jul 20, 2025, 5:54 PM

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Yeah, but some games like days gone still don't work without the higher multiplier
It's not a issue of smoothness either, you can tell Lossless scaling is completely off due to no artifacting(And I'm using flow scale 0.25 performance mode, so there should be something)

boreal chasm Jul 20, 2025, 5:57 PM

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Yep, can tell that with FFXIV, if the mangohud fix isn’t deployed shaking a window results in 0 jello edge artifacting (and i’ve checked with a slow motion recording)

boreal chasm Jul 20, 2025, 6:18 PM

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This is also required in Dark Souls 3 to get 2x working

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bizarre issue

main bobcat Jul 20, 2025, 6:33 PM

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can you visually confirm this, or are you going off overlays?

harsh comet Jul 20, 2025, 6:51 PM

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I can visually confirm the "not having any effect unless I got 3x" issue in cemu

boreal chasm Jul 20, 2025, 6:52 PM

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visual, i’ve tested it with a slow motion camera and the difference is just obvious to be honest

harsh comet Jul 20, 2025, 6:52 PM

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but it doesn't get fixed with the second gamehud

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it gets fixed in desktop mode though

boreal chasm Jul 20, 2025, 6:53 PM

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yeah cemu is the outlier with the mangohud fix presumably because appimage

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but yeah if 2x isn’t visible but still reporting 2x in overlays, there’s no additional frames, there’s no artifacting and there’s no increase in input latency

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i can record a video with a capture card if it would help

harsh comet Jul 20, 2025, 6:54 PM

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there is a performance hit though

boreal chasm Jul 20, 2025, 6:55 PM

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yeah, the frames are being generated, just not displayed, and mangohud somehow fixes that

harsh comet Jul 20, 2025, 6:56 PM

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I think it might be some kind of race condition with mangohud

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idk how mangohud injects the overlay

boreal chasm Jul 20, 2025, 7:00 PM

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unsure, because adjusting mangohud alpha/bg alpha to 0 results in 2x not working again even though mangohud is injected

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it seems to go purely off whether mangohud is displaying anything

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even at 0.01 alpha/bg alpha it immediately works

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try it yourself, add
MANGOHUD_CONFIG=alpha=0,background_alpha=0
and test, then change to 0.01 and test

dark geyser Jul 20, 2025, 7:05 PM

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what if you toggle with shift+f12?

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oh its a steamdeck, nvm

boreal chasm Jul 20, 2025, 7:07 PM

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i mean i can map that and try lol

quasi abyss Jul 20, 2025, 7:11 PM

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main bobcat can you visually confirm this, or are you going off overlays?

I can confirm it visually in multiple games in Game Mode, which are resolved when playing the game with the same settings in Desktop Mode.

harsh comet Jul 20, 2025, 7:16 PM

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new development for me: it works if I set the resolution lower and use any scaling option but linear

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no need for gamehud either

boreal chasm Jul 20, 2025, 7:18 PM

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weirdly ds3 suddenly no longer launches if i use mangohud

quasi abyss Jul 20, 2025, 7:18 PM

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boreal chasm weirdly ds3 suddenly no longer launches if i use mangohud

Do you get an error popup?

boreal chasm Jul 20, 2025, 7:18 PM

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nope

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probably unrelated to fg though

quasi abyss Jul 20, 2025, 7:19 PM

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I've tried it with some games with only the mangohud command (so no fg) and it will launch only 1 in 10 times.

harsh comet Jul 20, 2025, 7:20 PM

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harsh comet new development for me: it works if I set the resolution lower and use any scali...

can someone else try to reproduce this?

boreal chasm Jul 20, 2025, 7:20 PM

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i wonder if it’s just that SOMETHING needs to be visually injected into the game that isn’t just running via proton, so mangohud and the scaler both do it?

will confirm rn theo

harsh comet Jul 20, 2025, 7:20 PM

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I selected the next lowest 16:10 resolution available in the game properties, then changed the "scaling filter" to "pixel" or "sharp"

harsh comet Jul 20, 2025, 7:21 PM

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boreal chasm i wonder if it’s just that SOMETHING needs to be visually injected into the game...

could be, and maybe that's why changing the scaling filter solves it for me?

boreal chasm Jul 20, 2025, 7:21 PM

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scaling change also works for me

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immediately kicks in 2x fg

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switching back to native res IMMEDIATELY stops it too

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so essentially if something from outside of proton is displaying or modifying the game display, 2x works

harsh comet Jul 20, 2025, 7:23 PM

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seems like so

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I wonder if there's anything that'll do the same thing but without changing anything lol

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like forcing pixel filter at native res

boreal chasm Jul 20, 2025, 7:33 PM

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maybe, extremely odd

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i’m trying to test more things but i cannot get DS3 to behave anymore lol

harsh comet Jul 20, 2025, 7:34 PM

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I'm just happy I got botw to work lol

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even if at a lower res, fsr is like 90% of the way there anyway.

boreal chasm Jul 20, 2025, 7:37 PM

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i’m glad, and glad we’ve found that it just needs something to be either overlaying from outside of proton or modifying the display in some way to kick in

harsh comet Jul 20, 2025, 7:37 PM

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pepehmm could you try if vkbasalt makes it work?

boreal chasm Jul 20, 2025, 7:37 PM

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hopefully that helps the devs

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hmmm

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probably

harsh comet Jul 20, 2025, 7:38 PM

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I don't wanna @ her but

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I want to invoke pancake

boreal chasm Jul 20, 2025, 7:43 PM

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VKBASALT ALSO FIXES IT

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widegladeline1 widegladeline2 widegladeline3

harsh comet Jul 20, 2025, 7:44 PM

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YES

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I JUST TESTED

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this makes me very happy

boreal chasm Jul 20, 2025, 7:45 PM

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i wonder if that fixes it in cemu

harsh comet Jul 20, 2025, 7:45 PM

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yes

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that's what I've been testing with

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botw

boreal chasm Jul 20, 2025, 7:49 PM

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you’re using the appimage?

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doesn’t for me weirdly

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but definitely works with DS3

harsh comet Jul 20, 2025, 7:51 PM

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boreal chasm you’re using the appimage?

yes

harsh comet Jul 20, 2025, 7:51 PM

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boreal chasm doesn’t for me weirdly

do you have vsync enabled?

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what about the fps+ patch?

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I got that one in unlimited

boreal chasm Jul 20, 2025, 7:53 PM

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vsync makes no difference, neither does FPS++, just gonna chalk this up to my install lol

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gonna test ffxiv

harsh comet Jul 20, 2025, 7:53 PM

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I enabled the cemu fps display to check and it runs at 30fps when I set multiplier to 2x, I can also see the artifacting

harsh comet Jul 20, 2025, 7:53 PM

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boreal chasm vsync makes no difference, neither does FPS++, just gonna chalk this up to my in...

how are you enabling vkbasalt?

boreal chasm Jul 20, 2025, 7:54 PM

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script on github that installs it, modified to not be system-wide, then just ENABLE_VKBASALT=1

harsh comet Jul 20, 2025, 7:55 PM

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weird

boreal chasm Jul 20, 2025, 7:56 PM

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vkbasalt fixes 2x with ffxiv too widegladeline1 widegladeline2 widegladeline3

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wait no it doesn’t

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it’s intermittent

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alright im getting a headache but good testing lol, hopefully pancake can do something with this info

harsh comet Jul 20, 2025, 7:59 PM

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indeed

main bobcat Jul 20, 2025, 8:09 PM

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in that case you probably have some other system issue

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vkbasalt is incompatible with lsfg-vk and just blackscreens it

boreal chasm Jul 20, 2025, 8:10 PM

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enabling vkbasalt with dark souls 3 only results in 2x working

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no other side effects

main bobcat Jul 20, 2025, 8:10 PM

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sounds like an off by one

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you enable anything else and it enables lsfg-vk

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if the workaround works for you that's nice, then I don't need to spend energy trying to replicate this

boreal chasm Jul 20, 2025, 8:11 PM

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sounds about right considering that’s 3 different things, one of which is built into the deck, that enables it

boreal chasm Jul 20, 2025, 8:11 PM

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main bobcat if the workaround works for you that's nice, then I don't need to spend energy t...

it doesn’t work consistently

main bobcat Jul 20, 2025, 8:11 PM

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shhh

boreal chasm Jul 20, 2025, 8:11 PM

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some games work with it, some don’t and will still only display 3x/4x lol

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(FFXIV using XIVLauncher via XLM, DS3 using ProtonGE10-9, if that helps somehow, both fixed by workaround but ds3 becomes unstable on launch)

main bobcat Jul 20, 2025, 8:13 PM

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which DS3 are we talking

boreal chasm Jul 20, 2025, 8:14 PM

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Dark Souls 3

main bobcat Jul 20, 2025, 8:14 PM

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gotcha if I find the time I'll take a look

boreal chasm Jul 20, 2025, 8:14 PM

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okie, if there’s any logs/video evidence that would help feel free to ping me

harsh comet Jul 20, 2025, 8:15 PM

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here's someone else who got it to work

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with the scaling filter thing

boreal chasm Jul 20, 2025, 8:16 PM

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so yeah i doubt it’s a system issue (outside of just a steam deck specific issue) lol

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as soon as the display gets modified in some way outside of proton it’s just works

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be it an overlay or scaling

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weird

worn knot Jul 20, 2025, 8:36 PM

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Nothing anything you guys recommended helps with days gone, still requires 3x+

harsh comet Jul 20, 2025, 8:36 PM

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does it work in desktop mode?

worn knot Jul 20, 2025, 8:37 PM

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I don't know, haven't tried it

harsh comet Jul 20, 2025, 8:37 PM

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if it does, it may be the same issue, but requires a different fix

quasi abyss Jul 20, 2025, 8:52 PM

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I'll have some time to check the scaling workaround with the games I'm having issues with tomorrow.

quasi abyss Jul 20, 2025, 8:53 PM

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boreal chasm so essentially if something from outside of proton is displaying or modifying th...

I find that even just having the QAM open makes the game run at 2X properly in the background.

boreal chasm Jul 20, 2025, 8:54 PM

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time to display a transparent png over the top at all times lmao

harsh comet Jul 20, 2025, 8:55 PM

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a single pixel in one corner

boreal chasm Jul 20, 2025, 8:55 PM

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that gives me an incredibly stupid idea

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okay no using the picture in picture plugin does not fix it lmao

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i did say it was incredibly stupid in my defense

harsh comet Jul 20, 2025, 8:58 PM

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lmao

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I don't think that modifies the render chain

quasi abyss Jul 21, 2025, 9:04 AM

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Okay I've been doing a lot of testing and can confirm that dropping the resolution and scaling up makes it run perfectly. I did wonder if it was because you're reducing the load on the GPU when you drop res, but with Death Stranding the game runs at 800p with a bordered 720p image. I dropped the Steam game properties to 720p to give me a true 720p image and then used the fill scaler in QAM and instantly 2X kicks in and is perfect. 🤔

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Update: Picking a higher res and scaling down also works.

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1600x900 gives me a perfect 16:9 image that lets me use the QAM scaler.

harsh comet Jul 21, 2025, 12:02 PM

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quasi abyss Okay I've been doing a lot of testing and can confirm that dropping the resoluti...

what scaling filter are you using?

quasi abyss Jul 21, 2025, 12:05 PM

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harsh comet what scaling filter are you using?

Pixel or Sharp. It doesn't activate the 2x properly with Linear scaling.

harsh comet Jul 21, 2025, 12:05 PM

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yeah, same workaround

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even scaling down works for you?

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when I tried, it was the same as doing nothing

quasi abyss Jul 21, 2025, 12:08 PM

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Yeah I'm scaling down from 900p (from the Steam settings not in game) in Death Stranding which gives me a 16:9 image and that makes the scalers able to work. I can tell because as I slide the sharpness up and down it's obviously doing its thing.

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Have been playing perfectly for a couple of hours now. Where as before in game mode it would work only for 10 seconds or so once the QAM was opened and closed.

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Fwiw I'm also like 20 odd hours into the game so well into the parts where the performance usually sucks

harsh comet Jul 21, 2025, 12:12 PM

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only game I got this on (cemu) didn't work with that for me

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I'll have to re test

slender ruin Jul 21, 2025, 12:28 PM

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I tried in FFXV with 2x lsfg, felt no difference between base 30 fps and lsfg 60 fps with just using lsfg launch command

harsh comet Jul 21, 2025, 12:28 PM

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have you tried any of the workarounds?

slender ruin Jul 21, 2025, 12:28 PM

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How do I tell lsfg is working?

harsh comet Jul 21, 2025, 12:28 PM

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visually

slender ruin Jul 21, 2025, 12:29 PM

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Will 2x to 60 always have some sort of artifact or warping

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on Steam Deck btw

quasi abyss Jul 21, 2025, 12:29 PM

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The game performs now as well as it does on Desktop Mode albeit downscaling from a higher resolution. Death Stranding is an odd one because it can scale a 720p image up to the native res reported by the device (in this instance we're telling it 900p). So Death Stranding is going from 720p to 900p and via QAM it's being scaled back down to 720p. There is some quality loss but not a huge amount.

(I did also try internally rendering Death Stranding at 900p to match the Steam property settings and that worked fine too)

harsh comet Jul 21, 2025, 12:29 PM

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it will look both smoother and be artifact-ey

slender ruin Jul 21, 2025, 12:29 PM

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when I do 3x lsfg, I can feel smoothness increase and weird artifacts

harsh comet Jul 21, 2025, 12:30 PM

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quasi abyss The game performs now as well as it does on Desktop Mode albeit downscaling from...

if you have vkbasalt installed, could you try enabling it at native res and checking if that fixes the issue?

slender ruin Jul 21, 2025, 12:30 PM

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so its kinda weird 2x does nothing but I see it working on 3x lsfg

harsh comet Jul 21, 2025, 12:30 PM

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that does it for me

harsh comet Jul 21, 2025, 12:30 PM

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slender ruin when I do 3x lsfg, I can feel smoothness increase and weird artifacts

yeah you're running into the same bug

slender ruin Jul 21, 2025, 12:30 PM

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harsh comet yeah you're running into the same bug

does this mean that 3x lsfg is actually acting as 2x lsfg?

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when this bug occurs

harsh comet Jul 21, 2025, 12:31 PM

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try either changing the resolution and using a different scaling filter or doing the weird manghud thing that you can find in this thread somewhere

quasi abyss Jul 21, 2025, 12:31 PM

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No, because you're getting more artifacts than you would at 2x

slender ruin Jul 21, 2025, 12:31 PM

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harsh comet if you have vkbasalt installed, could you try enabling it at native res and chec...

how do I go about doing this?

harsh comet Jul 21, 2025, 12:31 PM

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slender ruin does this mean that 3x lsfg is actually acting as 2x lsfg?

the frames are being generated at 2x, they are just not displayed

slender ruin Jul 21, 2025, 12:32 PM

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Can also confirm it is occruing in Persona 5 Royal 😦

harsh comet Jul 21, 2025, 12:32 PM

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slender ruin how do I go about doing this?

with vkbasalt installed, you just need to add ENABLE_VKBASALT=1 to the launch options

harsh comet Jul 21, 2025, 12:32 PM

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slender ruin Can also confirm it is occruing in Persona 5 Royal 😦

it seems to happen with a lot of games

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hopefully pancake realizes this lol

slender ruin Jul 21, 2025, 12:33 PM

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harsh comet it seems to happen with _a lot_ of games

Does this mean that all those video testing 2x lsfg in game is actually just their base fps??

harsh comet Jul 21, 2025, 12:33 PM

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when she was in this thread yesterday she seemed uninterested

harsh comet Jul 21, 2025, 12:33 PM

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slender ruin Does this mean that all those video testing 2x lsfg in game is actually just the...

not necessarily

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a lot of games work just fine

quasi abyss Jul 21, 2025, 12:33 PM

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Question. What deck does everyone have here? LCD or OLED

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I'm on an LCD. Wondering if the issue is device specific.

slender ruin Jul 21, 2025, 12:34 PM

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harsh comet a lot of games work just fine

So far all games I have tested aint working..

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ffxv, ps5r, exp 33, cyber punk 2077

quasi abyss Jul 21, 2025, 12:34 PM

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slender ruin So far all games I have tested aint working..

The other fix is to play the game from Desktop Mode. It'll be fine there.

harsh comet Jul 21, 2025, 12:34 PM

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I got an lcd too, but I'm fairly certain it's an issue with gamescope

slender ruin Jul 21, 2025, 12:34 PM

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quasi abyss Question. What deck does everyone have here? LCD or OLED

i am on oled

quasi abyss Jul 21, 2025, 12:35 PM

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Well that rules that theory out then.

harsh comet Jul 21, 2025, 12:35 PM

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next step would be testing on desktop

quasi abyss Jul 21, 2025, 12:35 PM

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But pop into Desktop Mode and play a game and it will be obviously smoother at 2x

slender ruin Jul 21, 2025, 12:35 PM

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For vkbasalt, can I use the discovery store version?

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and what is vkbasalt excatly? First time hearing it today

harsh comet Jul 21, 2025, 12:35 PM

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I think there's a decky plugin for it?

harsh comet Jul 21, 2025, 12:36 PM

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slender ruin and what is vkbasalt excatly? First time hearing it today

it's a bit like reshade

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but by default it does some almost-invisible sharpening lol

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which gives me an idea, wait

slender ruin Jul 21, 2025, 12:36 PM

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harsh comet I think there's a decky plugin for it?

Is it in the offcial store?

harsh comet Jul 21, 2025, 12:36 PM

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let me see

slender ruin Jul 21, 2025, 12:36 PM

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or I gotta install from zip?

quasi abyss Jul 21, 2025, 12:37 PM

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I thought pancake said that vkbasalt caused lsfg-vk to crash.

harsh comet Jul 21, 2025, 12:38 PM

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that's indeed what she said

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black screen

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not what happens in my device

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or holly's, I think

quasi abyss Jul 21, 2025, 12:39 PM

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I've been trying to see if there's a way to activate the gamescope scaling at native res, without luck so far.

harsh comet Jul 21, 2025, 12:40 PM

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there's this @slender ruin
https://github.com/simons-public/steam-deck-vkbasalt-install

harsh comet Jul 21, 2025, 12:40 PM

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quasi abyss I've been trying to see if there's a way to activate the gamescope scaling at na...

I had to use vkbasalt for that

quasi abyss Jul 21, 2025, 12:40 PM

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Ah

harsh comet Jul 21, 2025, 12:40 PM

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it's the letmereshade plugin

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that installs vkbasalt for you

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oh they removed that option

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doesn't seem like it removed vkbasalt from my system though lol

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ok, vkbasalt works as a workaround even if it's disabled

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you can toggle vkbasalt on and off with home

quasi abyss Jul 21, 2025, 12:51 PM

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And that makes 2x work and stop working?

harsh comet Jul 21, 2025, 12:54 PM

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no, it works even if vkbasalt isn't applying any effect

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there's also an option in the config file to start disabled

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so for me it works perfectly at native res, without actually changing anything

slender ruin Jul 21, 2025, 12:59 PM

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harsh comet you can toggle vkbasalt on and off with `home`

how I do this?

harsh comet Jul 21, 2025, 1:01 PM

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what part?

slender ruin Jul 21, 2025, 1:02 PM

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the toggle part

harsh comet Jul 21, 2025, 1:02 PM

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just map some button to "home" in the keyboard

slender ruin Jul 21, 2025, 1:09 PM

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Found a vid talking about the same issue
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LGJFkaR250U

quasi abyss Jul 21, 2025, 1:10 PM

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Interestingly I tried a game which has no trouble maintaining high frame rates (Forza Horizon 4) and with 2x enabled (and frame cap at 60fps in game) you can clearly see the generated frame artifacts all over the place. As soon as you lock the game to 30fps the 2x stops working completely. 🤷

harsh comet Jul 21, 2025, 1:29 PM

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lock where?

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in game?

quasi abyss Jul 21, 2025, 1:32 PM

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Yes.

harsh comet Jul 21, 2025, 1:34 PM

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do the workarounds make it work again?

quasi abyss Jul 21, 2025, 1:37 PM

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Yup.

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Although Ive not tried the vkbasalt method yet for anything.

harsh comet Jul 21, 2025, 1:52 PM

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the vkbasalt thind didn't work for cyberpunk for me, but the scaling method did

quasi abyss Jul 21, 2025, 6:57 PM

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Sounds like RPS had the same problem with 2x on Elden Ring. https://www.rockpapershotgun.com/you-can-now-try-frame-generation-in-any-steam-deck-game-with-all-the-thrilling-disclaimers-and-caveats-of-desktop-frame-gen

main bobcat Jul 22, 2025, 6:34 PM

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okay what games can I test this one

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not FFXIV because that's like 70 gigabytes

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don't own darksouls 3

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CEMU, I can try cmeu

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cmenunujkasd

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well

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what's a nice and small wii u game I can dump from my real wii u

harsh comet Jul 22, 2025, 6:44 PM

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I had to do something similar with cp2077

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the amazing frog too

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sleeping dogs

main bobcat Jul 22, 2025, 7:14 PM

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I can't replicate it

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it just

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works for me

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I'm gonna add it to the quirks page, I guess?

harsh comet Jul 22, 2025, 7:35 PM

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bruh

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let me replicate your setup then

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what did you do

quasi abyss Jul 22, 2025, 8:22 PM

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Would logs help Pancake?

main bobcat Jul 22, 2025, 8:57 PM

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harsh comet let me replicate your setup then

grabbed the cemu app image, added it as a steam game, added a config entry for it on 2x frame gen and it worked

harsh comet Jul 22, 2025, 8:58 PM

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interesting

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what game was it?

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wait, you added the whole emulator?

main bobcat Jul 22, 2025, 9:00 PM

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harsh comet wait, you added the whole emulator?

yeah?

main bobcat Jul 22, 2025, 9:00 PM

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harsh comet what game was it?

nsmbu, which was a poor choice lol but it worked

harsh comet Jul 22, 2025, 9:02 PM

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it doesn't work for me in nsmbu

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or botw

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@quasi abyss got an idea that it might be related to some steam setting

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but we don't know which, if that's the case

main bobcat Jul 22, 2025, 9:03 PM

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quasi abyss Would logs help Pancake?

i don't think so, but go give me all the logs you can. especially with validation layers (it's all on the wiki)

main bobcat Jul 22, 2025, 9:03 PM

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harsh comet <@386495433452814339> got an idea that it might be related to some steam setting

my performance settings are disable frame limit and allow tearing on

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everything else off

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well scaling mode on auto, but I was running in fullscreen... fullscreen

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oh

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i was technically downscaling with auto, isn't that like a workaround?

harsh comet Jul 22, 2025, 9:05 PM

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only if the scaling filter is anything other than linear

main bobcat Jul 22, 2025, 9:05 PM

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it sure felt like linear to me

harsh comet Jul 22, 2025, 9:06 PM

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but check if it is any different running in native res ig

main bobcat Jul 22, 2025, 9:06 PM

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yeah will do

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yep that actually totally does it

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turning off fullscreen stops generating frames even at 10x

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the moment I turn it on, either cemu crashes (lol), or it works

harsh comet Jul 22, 2025, 9:11 PM

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I can do framegen without fullscreen

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if I do the workaround

main bobcat Jul 22, 2025, 9:11 PM

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which was?

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mangohud?

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vkbasalt?

quasi abyss Jul 22, 2025, 9:11 PM

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main bobcat i was technically downscaling with auto, isn't that like a workaround?

This is the only way I can get it to actually work.

harsh comet Jul 22, 2025, 9:11 PM

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vkbasalt and scaling filter worked

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either of them

main bobcat Jul 22, 2025, 9:11 PM

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scaling filter to linear?

harsh comet Jul 22, 2025, 9:11 PM

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not necessarily together

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anything but linear

main bobcat Jul 22, 2025, 9:11 PM

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oh

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let me see if I can replicate this

quasi abyss Jul 22, 2025, 9:11 PM

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Scaling at auto but filter on pixel or sharp

harsh comet Jul 22, 2025, 9:12 PM

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in fullscreen it does generate frames but doesn't display, unless you got 3x+

quasi abyss Jul 22, 2025, 9:12 PM

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Although depending on the res I'm using I might have to use something other than auto.

harsh comet Jul 22, 2025, 9:12 PM

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(without the workaround)

main bobcat Jul 22, 2025, 9:14 PM

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well, changing it to integer scaling and enabling vkbasalt did not make it work in windowed lol

harsh comet Jul 22, 2025, 9:14 PM

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the vkbasalt thing seems to work for some people but not all

#

it's the same with mangohud

main bobcat Jul 22, 2025, 9:15 PM

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oh I didn't try mangohud, hang on

harsh comet Jul 22, 2025, 9:15 PM

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I think holly's game got fixed with mangohud but it didn't work for me

main bobcat Jul 22, 2025, 9:16 PM

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mangohud didn't do it either

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atm it only works in fullscreen and not in windowed

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without gamescope in desktop.. both work...

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weeeird

harsh comet Jul 22, 2025, 9:17 PM

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are you sure fullscreen works?

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it's a visual thing for us, the fps counter does display them

main bobcat Jul 22, 2025, 9:17 PM

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fullscreen works, I can see the artifacts yea

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and the silly creature walks at half the speed

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oh that's interesting

#

hang on

#

in windowed, creature walks slower but there's no artifacts.... on PC through gamescope's wayland backend

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what

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and omg

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the mangohud workaround makes it work

#

what

#

lmao

quasi abyss Jul 22, 2025, 9:20 PM

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Welcome to the problem. 😂

harsh comet Jul 22, 2025, 9:21 PM

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finally you can reproduce it

main bobcat Jul 22, 2025, 9:21 PM

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wait

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but only if validation layers are also enabled

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i also doesn't slow down the game for you right?

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hmm

harsh comet Jul 22, 2025, 9:23 PM

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it does for me but it's weird

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my botw isn't frame limited

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I do know it gets limited to 1/2 refresh rate when it is working

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but can't remember if it did it when it wasn't working

main bobcat Jul 22, 2025, 9:24 PM

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i was thinking about the actual game slowing down because physics depend on time

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like nsmbu slows down at 10x because the game is slowed to 24 fps and it's a 60 fps game

harsh comet Jul 22, 2025, 9:24 PM

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not all games are like that

main bobcat Jul 22, 2025, 9:25 PM

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yea i know

harsh comet Jul 22, 2025, 9:25 PM

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but yeah nsmbu did slow down even when the frames weren't displayed

main bobcat Jul 22, 2025, 9:26 PM

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not for me

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puppydead

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this is super weird

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why do I need both mangohud and validation layers enabvled??

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AHA

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I FOUND YOU

#

SILLY BUG

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> Validation Error: [ VUID-VkSwapchainPresentModesCreateInfoKHR-pPresentModes-07763 ] | MessageID = 0x2d90c7c0
> vkCreateSwapchainKHR(): pCreateInfo->pNext<VkSwapchainPresentModesCreateInfoKHR>.pPresentModes[0] VK_PRESENT_MODE_MAILBOX_KHR is a non-compatible presentMode.
> The Vulkan spec states: The entries in pPresentModes must be a subset of the present modes returned in VkSurfacePresentModeCompatibilityKHR::pPresentModes, given VkSwapchainCreateInfoKHR::presentMode in VkSurfacePresentModeKHR (https://docs.vulkan.org/spec/latest/chapters/VK_KHR_surface/wsi.html#VUID-VkSwapchainPresentModesCreateInfoKHR-pPresentModes-07763)
> 
> Validation Error: [ VUID-VkSwapchainPresentModesCreateInfoKHR-presentMode-07764 ] | MessageID = 0x6fc85283
> vkCreateSwapchainKHR(): pCreateInfo was called with a present mode (VK_PRESENT_MODE_FIFO_KHR) that was not included in the set of present modes specified in the vkSwapchainPresentModesCreateInfoKHR structure included in its pNext chain.
> The Vulkan spec states: VkSwapchainCreateInfoKHR::presentMode must be included in pPresentModes (https://docs.vulkan.org/spec/latest/chapters/VK_KHR_surface/wsi.html#VUID-VkSwapchainPresentModesCreateInfoKHR-presentMode-07764)

#

oh yeah

#

wontfix

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lol

#

this is cursed

#

this is just cursed

#

(i still don't know the cause)

#

doesn't help that cemu itself throws a billion validation errors

#

i found one issue

#

don't think it's the issue, but it is a issue

#

and oh god it's going to be a pain to fix

#

a- adding a system print broke the workaround

#

what in the fucking world is going on

#

i'm swearing again

#

istg

#

quantum computing happening right here

#

alright I'm not onto it

#

i lied

#

this is a qemu bug

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not my code

#

sorry i meant cemu

#

im losing it

#

here comes another allnighter

#

1000294000

#

nope that ain't it either

#

release build works, debug build does not

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end my suffering

#

WHY?

main bobcat Jul 22, 2025, 10:26 PM

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well

#

single stepping with a debugger shows that the frames are generating and they are displaying, but they seem to be displaying for less than a single nanosecond

harsh comet Jul 22, 2025, 10:30 PM

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oh so just skill issue?

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I should learn to see faster?

main bobcat Jul 22, 2025, 10:32 PM

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well

#

I fixed it

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not.. the bug

#

but my soul

#

and also I made it work by sleeping on the render thread

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so in other words, this is purely a frame pacing issue and I'm not going to be touching those until after 1.0

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which means, either gamescope fixes their faulty fifo implementation, or you'll have to keep doing your workaround :P

quasi abyss Jul 22, 2025, 10:44 PM

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Workaround - Upgrade eyes

harsh comet Jul 22, 2025, 10:45 PM

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main bobcat and also I made it work by sleeping on the render thread

just add a user-facing config value for this lol

#

now THAT is a workaround

main bobcat Jul 22, 2025, 10:47 PM

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I can't 😭

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it doesn't fix frame pacing

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it makes it better, but not comfortable to play

quasi abyss Jul 22, 2025, 10:51 PM

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Appreciate your time spent on this today.

main bobcat Jul 22, 2025, 10:52 PM

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no problem

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I don't mind losing a bit of my sanity if it makes my project work better

harsh comet Jul 22, 2025, 10:59 PM

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yeah, thanks for this all, not just this specific bug investigation but the whole software, I can now play botw on my deck for three and a half hours at 60 fps lol

verbal flint Jul 22, 2025, 11:29 PM

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main bobcat I don't mind losing a bit of my sanity if it makes my project work better

LOL 👏

harsh comet Jul 23, 2025, 1:38 AM

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oh

#

could you explain why it works when you use multipliers over 2x?

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if it's a framepacing issue, shouldn't it never work, no matter the multiplier?

main bobcat Jul 23, 2025, 1:56 AM

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that was some O3 issue, it shouldn't work at all

sonic bough Jul 23, 2025, 2:02 AM

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This is a bit tough for me to interpret lol. What’s the workaround?

harsh comet Jul 23, 2025, 2:03 AM

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I do not know what O3 is

sonic bough Jul 23, 2025, 2:10 AM

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Just turning on mangohud using a launch command? Or game modes performance overlay

slender ruin Jul 23, 2025, 2:17 AM

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sonic bough Just turning on mangohud using a launch command? Or game modes performance overl...

Mangohud or vkbasalt, steam built in game mode overlay doesn't enable 2x

boreal chasm Jul 23, 2025, 3:11 AM

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is this just not being fixed then?

#

it seems like a rather large amount of people run into this

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that’s a lil disappointing with the amount of time we’ve put into trying to figure it out

quasi abyss Jul 23, 2025, 4:29 AM

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sonic bough Just turning on mangohud using a launch command? Or game modes performance overl...

The other option is to set the game's resolution in Steam OS (under game properties) at 1600x1000. Inside the game set it to 1280x800. In the quick access menu set the scaling filter to Pixel or Sharp.

sonic bough Jul 23, 2025, 4:40 AM

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quasi abyss The other option is to set the game's resolution in Steam OS (under game propert...

Thank you. A lot of games struggle to run at higher resolutions than 800p, and when the best native fps possible is the ideal scenario for lsfg, it makes it a bit harder for it to look good

quasi abyss Jul 23, 2025, 6:48 AM

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When you set it as above it will perform the same, as you're just scaling up and back down from 800p but there is some quality loss.

#

The other option is to play the game via Desktop Mode.

boreal chasm Jul 23, 2025, 12:38 PM

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quasi abyss When you set it as above it will perform the same, as you're just scaling up and...

this is outright untrue, that's an increase in resolution, the scaling back down doesn't get you the performance back, it may be displaying 800p but it's still rendering at 1000p

quasi abyss Jul 23, 2025, 12:47 PM

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Thanks for clearing that up. I assumed if the game was set to render an 800p window via the game settings (on an 1000p display res set via Steam OS settings) that it would have the same performance as rendering it at 800p native.

#

Apologies if I made a mistake there.

boreal chasm Jul 23, 2025, 1:21 PM

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oh i didn't realise you were still rendering in-game at 800p

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yeah that's the same performance lol

#

i'd be surprised if it was actually using a 1600x1000 resolution though, steam doesn't force it via that dropdown, it only increases the maximum resolution selectable in-game to it

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i guess it's passing it as a resolution of the gamescope window

#

i'll have to try this

#

sorry for misreading lol

#

since the decky plugin now has vkbasalt/mangohud enablers in the plugin itself it should be a lot less annoying to workaround everything now at least

shell plover Jul 23, 2025, 4:19 PM

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harsh comet just add a user-facing config value for this lol

workshopping a funky workaround like suggested here

harsh comet Jul 23, 2025, 4:20 PM

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lol I wonder if it'd feel terrible

#

also, you could calculate the frame delay from the refresh rate, no?

#

unless it just needs like a few ms and gamescope works then

main bobcat Jul 23, 2025, 4:22 PM

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shell plover workshopping a funky workaround like suggested here

don't that is disgusting

#

😭

#

at least implement it properly and wait for the fences

harsh comet Jul 23, 2025, 4:23 PM

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we like disgusting, if it means we can use the software lol

main bobcat Jul 23, 2025, 4:23 PM

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don't just do a usleep

harsh comet Jul 23, 2025, 4:23 PM

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but yeah I'd like to see if it actually feels terrible or what

main bobcat Jul 23, 2025, 4:23 PM

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it will massively depend on the game and engine again

#

DXVK games will be fine because they use fences everywhere anyways, but seeing how this issue mostly affects native Vulkan backends... urgh anything can happen

harsh comet Jul 23, 2025, 4:24 PM

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it doesn't seem like it mostly affects native stuff tho

#

for me it's… pretty much everything

#

I haven't tried any game that just works at 2x

#

sleeping dogs, amazing frog, gta iv

main bobcat Jul 23, 2025, 4:25 PM

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that sucks

harsh comet Jul 23, 2025, 4:25 PM

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yeah lmao

#

it's very weird because it just works on my desktop, running inside gamescope

shell plover Jul 23, 2025, 4:26 PM

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main bobcat don't that is disgusting

just since you said no plan to address till after 1.0, I figure theres an opportunity to temporarily give a tool in the plugin version so people can experiment with until an official fix is ready

harsh comet Jul 23, 2025, 4:27 PM

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seeming like a lot of people's games seem fine, maybe it's time to add an "advanced" toggle with these settings?

#

a bit like steam's own one

main bobcat Jul 23, 2025, 4:28 PM

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shell plover just since you said no plan to address till after 1.0, I figure theres an opport...

then implement it properly

#

i'll give you a general explanation of what you need to do

shell plover Jul 23, 2025, 4:31 PM

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sure, please do

main bobcat Jul 23, 2025, 4:35 PM

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in the framegen/ subproject, there's two files called context.cpp which have a method called "Context::present".
the comment indicating step 3, calls wait on a fence object. you need to move that entire section to the end of the method, just before frameIdx is increased.
that way, before returning, this code will WAIT until the frames are generated.

then, back where this is being called in the other context.cpp in the main project, you can get the system time via c++ high_resolution_clock before and after calling LSFG_3_1::presentContext. calculate the difference (just ask chatgpt if you don't know how any of this works lol), then see how much longer you need to wait according to whatever time the user selected. so for example if the user selected 25ms and generating took 5ms, then 20ms is what's left over.

then a bit lower in the for loop, right before the call to Layer::ovkQueuePresentKHR you sleep for those 20ms on the first iteration, and the usual 25ms for all following iterations. then you wait 25 ms again after the loop is done so it schedules the real frame properly as well.

that'll give basically perfect frame pacing, but has the chance to massively slow down the game. also change the present mode to immediate/mailbox, there's no need for fifo anymore

#

..it's extremely janky but it will work

#

cuz the approach you're doing above (assuming it's the one I suggested), will actually break at non-2x

shell plover Jul 23, 2025, 4:41 PM

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main bobcat cuz the approach you're doing above (assuming it's the one I suggested), will ac...

I figured as much, and with how I had it there only works if mul is 2. I like your suggestion though, will work on this, thanks for the KT

harsh comet Jul 23, 2025, 4:41 PM

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my issue continues with multipliers over 2 as well, it seems to "eat" the first multiplier

#

so 3x looks like 2x

main bobcat Jul 23, 2025, 4:42 PM

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yeah I noticed this

harsh comet Jul 23, 2025, 4:42 PM

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4x I wouldn't know because I have a 60hz lcd

main bobcat Jul 23, 2025, 4:42 PM

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and at some point when you get to 10x it's actually only 5x

harsh comet Jul 23, 2025, 4:42 PM

#

gotta love it

main bobcat Jul 23, 2025, 4:42 PM

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it's fine, i'll properly fix it in 1.1

harsh comet Jul 23, 2025, 4:42 PM

#

Ratge

#

soon™

main bobcat Jul 23, 2025, 4:43 PM

#

tehe

#

i mean you know me

#

if I'm in the right mindset, dual GPU, proper frame pacing, adaptive mode and fractional multipliers are dropping in the same day

shell plover Jul 23, 2025, 4:44 PM

#

oh fractional back on the table?

verbal flint Jul 23, 2025, 4:44 PM

#

O . O

harsh comet Jul 23, 2025, 4:44 PM

#

what can we do to help you get you get in that mindset?

shell plover Jul 23, 2025, 4:44 PM

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figured its hard to do adaptive properly without it

main bobcat Jul 23, 2025, 4:44 PM

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shell plover oh fractional back on the table?

i mean like I said it's gonna be a part of adaptive

harsh comet Jul 23, 2025, 4:44 PM

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cocaine?

main bobcat Jul 23, 2025, 4:44 PM

#

shell plover figured its hard to do adaptive properly without it

yea actually the wrong way around

main bobcat Jul 23, 2025, 4:44 PM

#

harsh comet cocaine?

well

#

i'm not opposed to the idea /j
a bunch of water

#

i don't drink any caffeine, i don't take any drugs, it's sheer willpower

#

how do you spell that word

#

caffeine

harsh comet Jul 23, 2025, 4:45 PM

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omw to make a gofundme to send undrinkable amounts of water to your house

main bobcat Jul 23, 2025, 4:45 PM

#

tehe

distant anchor Jul 23, 2025, 4:45 PM

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harsh comet cocaine?

vibe coding took a whole different meaning

main bobcat Jul 23, 2025, 4:46 PM

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oh nooo

harsh comet Jul 23, 2025, 4:46 PM

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main bobcat i don't drink any caffeine, i don't take any drugs, it's sheer willpower

kind of a redundant sentence lol

#

as caffeine is a drug too

main bobcat Jul 23, 2025, 4:47 PM

#

hmmm

distant anchor Jul 23, 2025, 4:47 PM

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i don't drink coffee just energy drinks

main bobcat Jul 23, 2025, 4:47 PM

#

whoever is catching up in this channel wondering about progress on this issue, I'm so sorry

#

let's move to #💬│linux-general

harsh comet Jul 23, 2025, 4:47 PM

#

ah yes, that's such a better fitting channel lol

shell plover Jul 23, 2025, 5:13 PM

#

ayy slightly less cursed

shell plover Jul 23, 2025, 6:55 PM

#

ok so after some back and forth on the plugin discord, actually isolated it down to just moving the fence wait to the end. Pancake this is likely stupid as hell and not what you wanna do upstream but sharing if at all useful:

https://github.com/PancakeTAS/lsfg-vk/compare/develop...xXJSONDeruloXx:lsfg-vk:wait-fence-move

main bobcat Jul 23, 2025, 6:57 PM

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ohh that helps narrow down the vsync bug actually

shell plover Jul 23, 2025, 6:59 PM

#

oh shit i helped?

main bobcat Jul 23, 2025, 7:00 PM

#

sort of? lol

#

definitely something I haven't investigated yet

shell plover Jul 23, 2025, 7:00 PM

#

you wouldnt want to do this upstream would you?

harsh comet Jul 23, 2025, 7:00 PM

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I don't know if there's anything that gets downgraded by doing this but it seems to work perfectly in game mode now

main bobcat Jul 23, 2025, 7:01 PM

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shell plover you wouldnt want to do this upstream would you?

no

#

it still blocks the render thread and I can't have that >:3

harsh comet Jul 23, 2025, 7:01 PM

#

what does that cause?

main bobcat Jul 23, 2025, 7:01 PM

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keep it as a workaround in your fork, seems to be gamescope only anyways

main bobcat Jul 23, 2025, 7:02 PM

#

harsh comet what does that cause?

tl;dr freezes the entire game while frames are being generated

shell plover Jul 23, 2025, 7:03 PM

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can do, and will be extra diligent to make plugin users aware the layer is fundamentally changed from yours and to purge and run your install script to test, before escalating them to LS discord for help

main bobcat Jul 23, 2025, 7:03 PM

#

oh yeah good idea

shell plover Jul 23, 2025, 7:03 PM

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team work dream work

harsh comet Jul 23, 2025, 7:08 PM

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main bobcat tl;dr freezes the entire game while frames are being generated

does that just translate to more latency?

main bobcat Jul 23, 2025, 7:08 PM

#

it translates to far more than that

shell plover Jul 24, 2025, 1:29 PM

#

@main bobcat FYI, after a build or two with my fork with the fence wait change, we found some hard crashes on steam deck.

Needless to say, I removed those plugin releases and will be pulling lsfg-vk from you directly going forward, no forking. This way even if some game-mode/gamescope issues exist currently, everyone is using the same layer under the hood.

main bobcat Jul 24, 2025, 1:30 PM

#

ooof

vague kelp Jul 24, 2025, 9:19 PM

#

I got my steam deck a few days ago, still trying to understand all this stuff

#

How do I make lossless scaling work on FF

#

Like I already have the command for the auto-login there in XIV launcher. I put the lossless scaling comand affter and it doesn't work

#

still 45/55 fps.. at 2x

vague kelp Jul 25, 2025, 3:54 PM

#

Can the newbie here get a bit of help?

harsh comet Jul 25, 2025, 4:03 PM

#

what's the issue specifically?

#

does it not do anything at all?

vague kelp Jul 25, 2025, 4:10 PM

#

No

#

Like I have the commaand there for the auto login laauncher

#

I put the lossless scaling command after

#

does nothing to my FPS

harsh comet Jul 25, 2025, 4:12 PM

#

you should jump into the plugin discord perhaps

vague kelp Jul 25, 2025, 4:14 PM

#

Puglin discord?

vague kelp Jul 25, 2025, 4:14 PM

#

harsh comet you should jump into the plugin discord perhaps

on the launcher options do you just have the lossless scaling command?

harsh comet Jul 25, 2025, 4:15 PM

#

~/lsfg %command% is how you use it

vague kelp Jul 25, 2025, 4:18 PM

#

it's how I have it

#

i basically have this on the launcher options

#

XL_SECRET_PROVIDER=FILE %command% run --branch=stable --arch=x86_64 --command=xivlauncher dev.goats.xivlauncher ~/lsfg %command%

vague kelp Jul 25, 2025, 4:21 PM

#

harsh comet `~/lsfg %command%` is how you use it

How many fps are you getting with 2x?

harsh comet Jul 25, 2025, 4:21 PM

#

that's one %command% too much

#

two too much, actually

#

try with XL_SECRET_PROVIDER=FILE ~/lsfg run --branch=stable --arch=x86_64 --command=xivlauncher dev.goats.xivlauncher

#

but I'm pretty sure flatpak is kinda borked rn, without patching them or something

vague kelp Jul 25, 2025, 4:22 PM

#

Will do now, thank you

vague kelp Jul 25, 2025, 4:37 PM

#

harsh comet but I'm pretty sure flatpak is kinda borked rn, without patching them or somethi...

it does not let me open the XIV launcher

#

Im using the fast launcher

harsh comet Jul 25, 2025, 4:38 PM

#

I've never played FFXIV so I don't know

vague kelp Jul 25, 2025, 4:39 PM

#

basically the command I showed you, it's for aa 3rd party launcher, not sure but I think it's the only way to play ff on the deck, it allows the save my password, and basicaally all I have to do is put the one-time password

#

Im just not sure how I incorporate the ~/lsfg %command% here

#

which is probably the problem and since I'm a complete newbie with this stuff

shell plover Jul 25, 2025, 11:28 PM

#

If using the plugin let’s take it over to that discord

vague kelp Jul 26, 2025, 12:04 AM

#

shell plover If using the plugin let’s take it over to that discord

what discord

shell plover Jul 26, 2025, 12:36 AM

#

vague kelp what discord

https://discord.gg/dQ5VV33w

boreal chasm Jul 26, 2025, 1:59 AM

#

vague kelp Can the newbie here get a bit of help?

you should be using XLM, not flatpak

#

once you’ve got that installed (it’s one line in konsole) and set as the compatibility tool there are no other launch arguments needed other than the plug-in’s ~/lsfg %command%

it will use your old XL settings, so no need to worry

#

https://github.com/Blooym/xlm

#

you’ll need the disable wsi toggle too in the plugin

#

hope this helps (sorry for doing it here but i couldn’t be bothered to hunt down the conversation in the other server lol)

vague kelp Jul 26, 2025, 9:23 AM

#

boreal chasm you should be using XLM, not flatpak

Thank you for the answer and help but let me see if I understand what you just said. Because XLM, flatpak mean nothing to me.

So that link you send me is a new launcher? I install that, put the ~/lsfg %command% and it just works?
set as the compatibility tool(not sure whats this also)

Got the deck few days ago.

#mangohud needed to use 2x (FFXIV, Steam Deck)